Art Gallery in NYC 888-590-5470

From owner-extdom.ssm-interest@sj-msg-core-4.cisco.com Wed Sep 5 16:13:02 2001 Received: from sj-msg-core-4.cisco.com (sj-msg-core-4.cisco.com [171.71.163.10]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id QAA21118 for ; Wed, 5 Sep 2001 16:13:02 -0400 (EDT) Received: from sj-msg-av-3.cisco.com (sj-msg-av-3.cisco.com [171.69.2.19]) by sj-msg-core-4.cisco.com (8.11.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id f85ImFp08115 for ; Wed, 5 Sep 2001 11:48:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from proxy1.cisco.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by sj-msg-av-3.cisco.com (8.10.1/8.10.1) with ESMTP id f85Im4J08955 for ; Wed, 5 Sep 2001 11:48:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from inuribank.hanfile.co.kr ([203.234.249.129]) by proxy1.cisco.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id f85IloG22791 for ; Wed, 5 Sep 2001 11:47:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from 0-1pool254-136.nas8.dallas1.tx.us.da.qwest.net_[63.153.254.136] ([63.153.254.136]) by inuribank.hanfile.co.kr with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.2966); Wed, 5 Sep 2001 21:50:32 +0900 Received: from middletown.total.net by 0-1pool254-136.nas8.dallas1.tx.us.da.qwest.net with ESMTP; Wed, 05 Sep 2001 07:43:42 -0500 Message-ID: <00003571196d$00001ce2$0000071e@middletown.total.net> To: <4gaczddfzua@admiral.ru> From: j220@myself.com Subject: Collector's Choice Fine Art & Posters Credit 1822 Date: Wed, 05 Sep 2001 07:43:28 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Reply-To: j220@myself.com X-OriginalArrivalTime: 05 Sep 2001 12:50:33.0103 (UTC) FILETIME=[59B9A9F0:01C13609] Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Art Gallery in NYC 888-590-5470



Fine Art Gallery on the web. Your $15.00 credit is good for futu= re purchases from www.artnmore.com eBay name NYCARTGALLERY. As a Client of our 188 Lafayette Street NYC Gallery, we have reserve= d a $15.00 credit for you to use i= n the Gallery or with On-Line Orders. Please call Toll Free (888) 590-5470 or email sales@artnmore.com to obtain your Credit ID Number. With your Credit ID Number, you can apply your $15.00 credit towards purchases of $30.00 or more.

This credit does not apply to eBay winning bids.

Your credit is applied to our discounted retail prices of Fine Art o= r Posters.

For Fine Art Price Quotes, please call Joel Nash Toll Free (888) 590-5470.

We look forward to hearing from you.
Best Regards,
Joel Nash
Gallery Director
(888) 590-5470

This offer is good until Sept 30, 2001.

For removal from our email list please click here.

&cop= y;2001 A.N. Fine Art, Inc. (888) 590-5470

From owner-extdom.ssm-interest@sj-msg-core-2.cisco.com Sun Sep 9 00:01:23 2001 Received: from sj-msg-core-2.cisco.com (sj-msg-core-2.cisco.com [171.69.24.11]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id AAA05207 for ; Sun, 9 Sep 2001 00:01:23 -0400 (EDT) Received: from sj-msg-av-1.cisco.com (sj-msg-av-1.cisco.com [171.69.11.130]) by sj-msg-core-2.cisco.com (8.11.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id f893IHv07459 for ; Sat, 8 Sep 2001 20:18:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from proxy1.cisco.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by sj-msg-av-1.cisco.com (8.10.1/8.10.1) with ESMTP id f893ICl25785 for ; Sat, 8 Sep 2001 20:18:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: from deccanmail.deccanherald.co.in ([202.54.87.61]) by proxy1.cisco.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id f893Hf628262 for ; Sat, 8 Sep 2001 20:17:42 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <200109090317.f893Hf628262@proxy1.cisco.com> Received: from host (04-122.024.popsite.net [216.126.163.122]) by deccanmail.deccanherald.co.in with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.1960.3) id SC1KNKFN; Sun, 9 Sep 2001 08:33:02 +0530 From: "Sonny Barret" Subject: All the Contacts You Will Need # 29B To: some@cisco.com X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE VÐßD.1712.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Date: Sat, 08 Sep 2001 21:41:18 -0500 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_007F_01BDF6C7.FABAC1B0" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit This is a MIME Message ------=_NextPart_000_007F_01BDF6C7.FABAC1B0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0080_01BDF6C7.FABAC1B0" ------=_NextPart_001_0080_01BDF6C7.FABAC1B0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable ***** This is an HTML Message ! ***** ------=_NextPart_001_0080_01BDF6C7.FABAC1B0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Executive Guild Membership ApplicationResponse-O-Matic Form

Dear Candidate,=A0

You have been selected as a potential candidate for a free listing in=A0<= br> the 2001 Edition of the International Executive Guild Registry=2E=A0
=
Please accept our congratulations for this coveted honor=2E=A0

As this edition is so important in view of the new millennium, the=A0
= International Executive Guild Registry will be published in two different= =A0
formats; the searchable CD-ROM and the Online Registry=2E=A0

Since inclusion can be considered recognition of your career position=A0<= br> and professionalism, each candidate is evaluated in keeping with high=A0<= br> standards of individual achievement=2E In light of this, the Internationa= l Executive
Guild thinks that you may make an interesting biographical subject=2E=A0<= br>
We look forward to your inclusion and appearance in the International=A0<= br> Executive Guild's Registry=2E Best wishes for your continued success=2E=A0=

International Executive Guild=A0
Listing Dept=2E=A0

If you wish to be removed from our list, please submit your request
at the bottom of this email=2E



*International Executive Guild* Registration Form (US and Canada Only)
Please fill out this form if you would like to be included on The International Executive Guild, For accuracy and publication purposes, please complete and send this form at the earliest opportunity=2E There is no charge or obligation to be listed on The International Executive Guild=2E

Your Name
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ZIP/Postal Code
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TO HELP US IN CONSIDERING YOUR APPLICATION, PLEASE TELL US A LITTLE ABOUT YOURSELF=2E=2E=2E

Your Business	(Financial Svcs, Banking, Computer Hardware, Software, Professional Svcs, Chemicals, Apparel, Aerospace, Food, Government, Utility, etc=2E)
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at the bottom of this email=2E



*International Executive Guild* Registration Form (US and Canada Only)
Please fill out this form if you would like to be included on The International Executive Guild, For accuracy and publication purposes, please complete and send this form at the earliest opportunity=2E There is no charge or obligation to be listed on The International Executive Guild=2E

Your Name
Your Company
Title
Address
City
State or Province
Country
ZIP/Postal Code
Day Time Telephone
Home Phone	(Not To Be Published)
Email

TO HELP US IN CONSIDERING YOUR APPLICATION, PLEASE TELL US A LITTLE ABOUT YOURSELF=2E=2E=2E

Your Business	(Financial Svcs, Banking, Computer Hardware, Software, Professional Svcs, Chemicals, Apparel, Aerospace, Food, Government, Utility, etc=2E)
Type of Organization	(M= fg, Dist/Wholesaler, Retailer, Law Firm, Investment Bank, Commercial Bank, University, Financial Consultants, Ad Agency, Contractor, Broker, etc=2E)
Your Business Expertise	(Corp=2EMgmt, Marketing, Civil Engineering, Tax Law, Nuclear Physics, Database Development, Operations, Pathologist, Mortgage Banking, etc=2E)
Major Product Line	(Integrated Circuits, Commercial Aircraft, Adhesives, Cosmetics, Plastic Components, Snack Foods, etc=2E)

Note: Submitting this form= will be made by email, not by use of www=2E Confirmation of its de= livery is made by browsing your outgoing mail=2E

Thank you for filling in this form, we will contact you with more information=2E

List Removal
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Click Herem ------=_NextPart_001_0080_01BDF6C7.FABAC1B0-- ------=_NextPart_000_007F_01BDF6C7.FABAC1B0-- From owner-extdom.ssm-interest@sj-msg-core-3.cisco.com Tue Sep 18 05:39:22 2001 Received: from sj-msg-core-3.cisco.com (sj-msg-core-3.cisco.com [171.70.157.152]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id FAA17142 for ; Tue, 18 Sep 2001 05:39:17 -0400 (EDT) Received: from sj-msg-av-3.cisco.com (sj-msg-av-3.cisco.com [171.69.2.19]) by sj-msg-core-3.cisco.com (8.11.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id f8I8muO16135 for ; Tue, 18 Sep 2001 01:48:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from proxy1.cisco.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by sj-msg-av-3.cisco.com (8.10.1/8.10.1) with ESMTP id f8I8otN21360 for ; Tue, 18 Sep 2001 01:50:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from HKISRV06.teleware.fi (mail.teleware.fi [193.65.76.33]) by proxy1.cisco.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id f8I8oeW01882 for ; Tue, 18 Sep 2001 01:50:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from hkisrv08.teleware.fi ([10.204.2.28]) by HKISRV06.teleware.fi with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.1600); Tue, 18 Sep 2001 11:49:21 +0300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.4712.0 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Subject: Is the list quiet? Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2001 11:49:13 +0300 Message-ID: Thread-Topic: PIM-SSM Implementation for Linux Thread-Index: AcD95W4H/aMGGpFOQuif1Z3E1W+cYRCOUibQ From: "Anssi Porttikivi" To: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 18 Sep 2001 08:49:21.0487 (UTC) FILETIME=[CF570DF0:01C1401E] Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by ietf.org id FAA17142 Is the list just quiet, or am I missing something? This is the last message I've seen. -----Original Message----- From: Internet-Drafts@ietf.org [mailto:Internet-Drafts@ietf.org] Sent: 22. elokuuta 2001 14:01 Cc: ssm-interest@external.cisco.com Subject: I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-ssm-overview-01.txt ... From owner-extdom.ssm-interest@sj-msg-core-3.cisco.com Tue Sep 18 12:46:12 2001 Received: from sj-msg-core-3.cisco.com (sj-msg-core-3.cisco.com [171.70.157.152]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id MAA25549 for ; Tue, 18 Sep 2001 12:46:11 -0400 (EDT) Received: from sj-msg-av-2.cisco.com (sj-msg-av-2.cisco.com [171.69.24.12]) by sj-msg-core-3.cisco.com (8.11.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id f8IFPJO10716 for ; Tue, 18 Sep 2001 08:25:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from proxy2.cisco.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by sj-msg-av-2.cisco.com (8.10.1/8.10.1) with ESMTP id f8IFRHd25737 for ; Tue, 18 Sep 2001 08:27:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from itsmail.tutsys.com (mail.tutsys.com [63.210.206.10]) by proxy2.cisco.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id f8IFOEl17314 for ; Tue, 18 Sep 2001 08:24:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from zambui2.tutsys.com (ZAMBUI2 [10.241.3.234]) by itsmail.tutsys.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2653.13) id S75Q9S2V; Tue, 18 Sep 2001 08:14:50 -0700 Message-Id: <5.1.0.14.0.20010918082140.02b64d48@itsmail> X-Sender: siribarne@itsmail X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2001 08:23:34 -0700 To: "Anssi Porttikivi" , From: Steve Iribarne Subject: Re: Is the list quiet? In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed I think it is quiet. Which leads me to believe.... 1. Everyone is working so hard on this they don't have time to comment. 2. Everyone is working even harder on existing stuff and they don't have time to look at this. 3. There really aren't alot of people interested in this yet. -stv At 11:49 AM 9/18/2001 +0300, Anssi Porttikivi wrote: >Is the list just quiet, or am I missing something? This is the last >message I've seen. > >-----Original Message----- >From: Internet-Drafts@ietf.org [mailto:Internet-Drafts@ietf.org] >Sent: 22. elokuuta 2001 14:01 >Cc: ssm-interest@external.cisco.com >Subject: I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-ssm-overview-01.txt >... ++++++++++++++ Steve Iribarne Sr. Software Engineer Tut Systems, Inc 925-201-4350 http://www.tutsystems.com ++++++++++++++ From owner-extdom.ssm-interest@sj-msg-core-3.cisco.com Tue Sep 18 14:07:00 2001 Received: from sj-msg-core-3.cisco.com (sj-msg-core-3.cisco.com [171.70.157.152]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id OAA28077 for ; Tue, 18 Sep 2001 14:06:58 -0400 (EDT) Received: from sj-msg-av-2.cisco.com (sj-msg-av-2.cisco.com [171.69.24.12]) by sj-msg-core-3.cisco.com (8.11.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id f8IGtNO04169 for ; Tue, 18 Sep 2001 09:55:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from proxy1.cisco.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by sj-msg-av-2.cisco.com (8.10.1/8.10.1) with ESMTP id f8IGvMO12306 for ; Tue, 18 Sep 2001 09:57:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from typhoon.ocis.temple.edu (jmulik@typhoon.ocis.temple.edu [155.247.166.103]) by proxy1.cisco.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id f8IGv7T03582 for ; Tue, 18 Sep 2001 09:57:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (jmulik@localhost) by typhoon.ocis.temple.edu (8.11.0/8.11.0) with ESMTP id f8IGq0G03493; Tue, 18 Sep 2001 12:52:00 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2001 12:52:00 -0400 (EDT) From: Jaiwant Mulik X-X-Sender: To: Steve Iribarne cc: Anssi Porttikivi , Subject: Re: Is the list quiet? In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.0.20010918082140.02b64d48@itsmail> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII I hope that (3) below is not the case !! So let's see: Has anybody tried to get SSM working with on Linux ? I am assumng that since the latest Linux distributions (Kernel 2.4+) have IGMP v3 and PIM-SM support, SSM should already be in place, or am I seriously missing something ? regards, On Tue, 18 Sep 2001, Steve Iribarne wrote: > I think it is quiet. Which leads me to believe.... > > 1. Everyone is working so hard on this they don't have time to comment. > 2. Everyone is working even harder on existing stuff and they don't have > time to look at this. > 3. There really aren't alot of people interested in this yet. > > -stv > > At 11:49 AM 9/18/2001 +0300, Anssi Porttikivi wrote: > >Is the list just quiet, or am I missing something? This is the last > >message I've seen. > > > >-----Original Message----- > >From: Internet-Drafts@ietf.org [mailto:Internet-Drafts@ietf.org] > >Sent: 22. elokuuta 2001 14:01 > >Cc: ssm-interest@external.cisco.com > >Subject: I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-ssm-overview-01.txt > >... > > ++++++++++++++ > Steve Iribarne > Sr. Software Engineer > Tut Systems, Inc > 925-201-4350 > http://www.tutsystems.com > ++++++++++++++ > Jaiwant Mulik ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Email : jmulik@temple.edu (preferred), jmulik@acm.org Home page : http://unix.temple.edu/~jmulik Location : Netlab, Room 1043/1044, Wachman Hall. Phones : (215) 204-3197 (o), (215) 777-4828 (r) ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Lekin woh zindagi he kya, jisme koi namumkin sapna na ho ? I may climb perhaps to no great heights, but I will climb alone. - Cyrano De Bergerac From owner-extdom.ssm-interest@sj-msg-core-1.cisco.com Tue Sep 18 14:39:18 2001 Received: from sj-msg-core-1.cisco.com (sj-msg-core-1.cisco.com [171.71.163.11]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id OAA28826 for ; Tue, 18 Sep 2001 14:39:18 -0400 (EDT) Received: from holbrook-laptop.cisco.com (dhcp-10-34-3-111.cisco.com [10.34.3.111]) by sj-msg-core-1.cisco.com (8.11.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id f8IHaEx28538; Tue, 18 Sep 2001 10:36:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: by holbrook-laptop.cisco.com (Postfix, from userid 500) id 4A999C4BBE; Tue, 18 Sep 2001 10:35:24 -0700 (PDT) From: Hugh Holbrook To: Steve Iribarne Cc: "Anssi Porttikivi" , In-reply-to: <5.1.0.14.0.20010918082140.02b64d48@itsmail> Subject: Re: Re: Is the list quiet? Reply-To: holbrook@cisco.com Mime-Version: 1.0 (generated by tm-edit 1.7) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Message-Id: <20010918173524.4A999C4BBE@holbrook-laptop.cisco.com> Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2001 10:35:24 -0700 (PDT) The list is alive, but it has been fairly quiet. The SSM working has not yet completely finished its task. The main and most critical item on our charter is to shepherd the SSM drafts through the standards process. We did not meet in London because there was nothing left on our charter requiring a meeting. There were a few comments from the last IETF at which we met (Minneapolis) which I have been remiss in incorporating in the ssm draft. Brad and I will be submitting a revised version of draft-holbrook-ssm-arch back to the list in the next week or so, and I intend to start a working group last call on it shortly thereafter. We will very much appreciate your comments. I hope that multicast will get a lift as it becomes more and more routers and host OSes provide the necessary support for SSM. The coming release of Windows XP, with its IGMPv3 support, should really help things out. -Hugh > Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2001 08:23:34 -0700 > From: Steve Iribarne > > I think it is quiet. Which leads me to believe.... > > 1. Everyone is working so hard on this they don't have time to comment. > 2. Everyone is working even harder on existing stuff and they don't have > time to look at this. > 3. There really aren't alot of people interested in this yet. > > -stv > > At 11:49 AM 9/18/2001 +0300, Anssi Porttikivi wrote: > >Is the list just quiet, or am I missing something? This is the last > >message I've seen. > > > >-----Original Message----- > >From: Internet-Drafts@ietf.org [mailto:Internet-Drafts@ietf.org] > >Sent: 22. elokuuta 2001 14:01 > >Cc: ssm-interest@external.cisco.com > >Subject: I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-ssm-overview-01.txt > >... > > ++++++++++++++ > Steve Iribarne > Sr. Software Engineer > Tut Systems, Inc > 925-201-4350 > http://www.tutsystems.com > ++++++++++++++ > > From owner-extdom.ssm-interest@sj-msg-core-1.cisco.com Tue Sep 18 16:14:06 2001 Received: from sj-msg-core-1.cisco.com (sj-msg-core-1.cisco.com [171.71.163.11]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id QAA01377 for ; Tue, 18 Sep 2001 16:14:06 -0400 (EDT) Received: from sj-msg-av-3.cisco.com (sj-msg-av-3.cisco.com [171.69.2.19]) by sj-msg-core-1.cisco.com (8.11.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id f8IJHcx25637 for ; Tue, 18 Sep 2001 12:17:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from proxy2.cisco.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by sj-msg-av-3.cisco.com (8.10.1/8.10.1) with ESMTP id f8IJHbi28767 for ; Tue, 18 Sep 2001 12:17:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cs.uoregon.edu (root@vitalstatistix.cs.uoregon.edu [128.223.4.19]) by proxy2.cisco.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id f8IJEXl03240 for ; Tue, 18 Sep 2001 12:14:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from heron.cs.uoregon.edu (fabbri@heron.cs.uoregon.edu [128.223.4.155]) by cs.uoregon.edu (8.11.0/8.11.0) with SMTP id f8IJGEN15818 for ; Tue, 18 Sep 2001 12:16:15 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <200109181916.f8IJGEN15818@cs.uoregon.edu> Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2001 12:16:34 -0700 (PDT) From: Aaron J Fabbri Reply-To: Aaron J Fabbri Subject: SSM, IGMPv3 on Linux To: ssm-interest@external.cisco.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-MD5: KXR5gmsEvLNGSuQzk+OaUA== X-Mailer: dtmail 1.3.0 @(#)CDE Version 1.4.2 SunOS 5.8 sun4u sparc > >Has anybody tried to get SSM working with on Linux ? > By "working", you may mean one of two things: 1. SSM support for end-hosts Sprint labs has a IGMPv3 patch available for kernel 2.4.0, and 2.2.18 at: http://www.sprintlabs.com/Department/IP-Interworking/multicast/linux-igmpv3/ I had to make some minor modifications to the patch for my 2.4.2 kernel. When you have your kernel patched, you simply use the new API discussed in draft-ietf-idmr-msf-api-01.txt (try google) 2. Using Linux as a SSM router I've been using PIM-SM with application-layer source filters to do testing. I am not aware of a SSM-specific mrouted for linux yet, but the changes which need to be made to PIM-SM to realize the SSM model are fairly simple. For specifics, see: http://www.dante.net/mbone/refs/draft-bhattach-diot-pimso-00.txt Basically the PIM-SM router needs to be able to skip the shared tree and RP and go straight to source-specific trees, depending on which type of IGMPv3 join was received. >I am assuming that since the latest Linux distributions (Kernel 2.4+) have >IGMP v3 and PIM-SM support, SSM should already be in place, or am I >seriously missing something ? I don't believe IGMPv3 is a standard part of linux yet, unfortunately. Does anyone know what version this is going to be officially included in? Thanks, Aaron -------------------==============================------------------ Aaron Fabbri http://www.cs.uoregon.edu/~fabbri fabbri@cs.uoregon.edu -------------------==============================------------------ ------------- End Forwarded Message ------------- -------------------==============================------------------ Aaron Fabbri http://www.cs.uoregon.edu/~fabbri fabbri@cs.uoregon.edu -------------------==============================------------------ From owner-extdom.ssm-interest@sj-msg-core-3.cisco.com Wed Sep 19 04:06:38 2001 Received: from sj-msg-core-3.cisco.com (sj-msg-core-3.cisco.com [171.70.157.152]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id EAA26490 for ; Wed, 19 Sep 2001 04:06:38 -0400 (EDT) Received: from sj-msg-av-3.cisco.com (sj-msg-av-3.cisco.com [171.69.2.19]) by sj-msg-core-3.cisco.com (8.11.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id f8J72jO07477 for ; Wed, 19 Sep 2001 00:02:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from proxy3.cisco.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by sj-msg-av-3.cisco.com (8.10.1/8.10.1) with ESMTP id f8J74ij07486 for ; Wed, 19 Sep 2001 00:04:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from p-mail1.cnet.fr (p-mail1.rd.francetelecom.com [193.49.124.31]) by proxy3.cisco.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with SMTP id f8J75Ok18860 for ; Wed, 19 Sep 2001 00:05:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: by p-biset.rd.francetelecom.fr with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Wed, 19 Sep 2001 09:00:48 +0200 Message-ID: <91A311FF6A85D3118DDF0060080C3D820200726F@lat3721.rd.francetelecom.fr> From: JACQUENET Christian FTRD/DMI/CAE To: "'Jaiwant Mulik'" , Steve Iribarne Cc: Anssi Porttikivi , ssm-interest@external.cisco.com Subject: RE: Is the list quiet? Date: Wed, 19 Sep 2001 08:59:40 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Content-Type: text/plain Dear all, This is to let u know that we've deployed a VOD SSM-based service within our premises (FTR&D) for 8 months, based on: - Linux kernels, - vic/vat apps, - IGMPv3-capable (DR) routers. Cheers, Christian. > -----Message d'origine----- > De : Jaiwant Mulik [mailto:jmulik@unix.temple.edu] > Envoye : mardi 18 septembre 2001 18:52 > A : Steve Iribarne > Cc : Anssi Porttikivi; ssm-interest@external.cisco.com > Objet : Re: Is the list quiet? > > > > I hope that (3) below is not the case !! > > So let's see: > > Has anybody tried to get SSM working with on Linux ? > > I am assumng that since the latest Linux distributions > (Kernel 2.4+) have > IGMP v3 and PIM-SM support, SSM should already be in place, or am I > seriously missing something ? > > regards, > > On Tue, 18 Sep 2001, Steve Iribarne wrote: > > > I think it is quiet. Which leads me to believe.... > > > > 1. Everyone is working so hard on this they don't have > time to comment. > > 2. Everyone is working even harder on existing stuff and > they don't have > > time to look at this. > > 3. There really aren't alot of people interested in this yet. > > > > -stv > > > > At 11:49 AM 9/18/2001 +0300, Anssi Porttikivi wrote: > > >Is the list just quiet, or am I missing something? This is the last > > >message I've seen. > > > > > >-----Original Message----- > > >From: Internet-Drafts@ietf.org [mailto:Internet-Drafts@ietf.org] > > >Sent: 22. elokuuta 2001 14:01 > > >Cc: ssm-interest@external.cisco.com > > >Subject: I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-ssm-overview-01.txt > > >... > > > > ++++++++++++++ > > Steve Iribarne > > Sr. Software Engineer > > Tut Systems, Inc > > 925-201-4350 > > http://www.tutsystems.com > > ++++++++++++++ > > > > Jaiwant Mulik > -------------------------------------------------------------- > --------- > Email : jmulik@temple.edu (preferred), jmulik@acm.org > Home page : http://unix.temple.edu/~jmulik > Location : Netlab, Room 1043/1044, Wachman Hall. > Phones : (215) 204-3197 (o), (215) 777-4828 (r) > -------------------------------------------------------------- > --------- > Lekin woh zindagi he kya, jisme koi namumkin sapna na ho ? > > I may climb perhaps to no great heights, but I will climb alone. > - Cyrano De Bergerac > From owner-extdom.ssm-interest@sj-msg-core-3.cisco.com Wed Sep 19 04:08:35 2001 Received: from sj-msg-core-3.cisco.com (sj-msg-core-3.cisco.com [171.70.157.152]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id EAA26520 for ; Wed, 19 Sep 2001 04:08:34 -0400 (EDT) Received: from sj-msg-av-1.cisco.com (sj-msg-av-1.cisco.com [171.69.11.130]) by sj-msg-core-3.cisco.com (8.11.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id f8J727O07310 for ; Wed, 19 Sep 2001 00:02:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from proxy1.cisco.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by sj-msg-av-1.cisco.com (8.10.1/8.10.1) with ESMTP id f8J74NN28312 for ; Wed, 19 Sep 2001 00:04:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rose.man.poznan.pl (rose.man.poznan.pl [150.254.173.3]) by proxy1.cisco.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id f8J73pT17259 for ; Wed, 19 Sep 2001 00:03:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (tomeks@localhost) by rose.man.poznan.pl (8.11.0/8.11.0) with ESMTP id f8J6mTU27308; Wed, 19 Sep 2001 08:48:30 +0200 (MET DST) Date: Wed, 19 Sep 2001 08:48:29 +0200 (MET DST) From: Tomasz Szewczyk To: Jaiwant Mulik cc: Steve Iribarne , Anssi Porttikivi , ssm-interest@external.cisco.com Subject: Re: Is the list quiet? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Hi, i tried SSM with Linux. I used URD wih Cisco 7200 (IOS 12.2(5)T). Now I will try IGMPv3. Regards Tomek On Tue, 18 Sep 2001, Jaiwant Mulik wrote: > > I hope that (3) below is not the case !! > > So let's see: > > Has anybody tried to get SSM working with on Linux ? > > I am assumng that since the latest Linux distributions (Kernel 2.4+) have > IGMP v3 and PIM-SM support, SSM should already be in place, or am I > seriously missing something ? > > regards, > > On Tue, 18 Sep 2001, Steve Iribarne wrote: > > > I think it is quiet. Which leads me to believe.... > > > > 1. Everyone is working so hard on this they don't have time to comment. > > 2. Everyone is working even harder on existing stuff and they don't have > > time to look at this. > > 3. There really aren't alot of people interested in this yet. > > > > -stv > > > > At 11:49 AM 9/18/2001 +0300, Anssi Porttikivi wrote: > > >Is the list just quiet, or am I missing something? This is the last > > >message I've seen. > > > > > >-----Original Message----- > > >From: Internet-Drafts@ietf.org [mailto:Internet-Drafts@ietf.org] > > >Sent: 22. elokuuta 2001 14:01 > > >Cc: ssm-interest@external.cisco.com > > >Subject: I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-ssm-overview-01.txt > > >... > > > > ++++++++++++++ > > Steve Iribarne > > Sr. Software Engineer > > Tut Systems, Inc > > 925-201-4350 > > http://www.tutsystems.com > > ++++++++++++++ > > > > Jaiwant Mulik > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > Email : jmulik@temple.edu (preferred), jmulik@acm.org > Home page : http://unix.temple.edu/~jmulik > Location : Netlab, Room 1043/1044, Wachman Hall. > Phones : (215) 204-3197 (o), (215) 777-4828 (r) > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > Lekin woh zindagi he kya, jisme koi namumkin sapna na ho ? > > I may climb perhaps to no great heights, but I will climb alone. > - Cyrano De Bergerac > ---------------------------------------------------------- Tomasz Szewczyk Poznan Supercomputing and Networking Center e-mail: tomeks@man.poznan.pl phone: +48 61 6582021 http://multicast.man.poznan.pl From owner-extdom.ssm-interest@sj-msg-core-3.cisco.com Wed Sep 19 04:47:46 2001 Received: from sj-msg-core-3.cisco.com (sj-msg-core-3.cisco.com [171.70.157.152]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id EAA26980 for ; Wed, 19 Sep 2001 04:47:46 -0400 (EDT) Received: from sj-msg-av-3.cisco.com (sj-msg-av-3.cisco.com [171.69.2.19]) by sj-msg-core-3.cisco.com (8.11.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id f8J7ZnO16762 for ; Wed, 19 Sep 2001 00:35:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from proxy1.cisco.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by sj-msg-av-3.cisco.com (8.10.1/8.10.1) with ESMTP id f8J7bn321853 for ; Wed, 19 Sep 2001 00:37:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from bells.cs.ucl.ac.uk (bells.cs.ucl.ac.uk [128.16.5.31]) by proxy1.cisco.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with SMTP id f8J7bZT27506 for ; Wed, 19 Sep 2001 00:37:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sonic.cs.ucl.ac.uk by bells.cs.ucl.ac.uk with local SMTP id ; Wed, 19 Sep 2001 08:32:22 +0100 To: JACQUENET Christian FTRD/DMI/CAE cc: "'Jaiwant Mulik'" , Steve Iribarne , Anssi Porttikivi , ssm-interest@external.cisco.com, J.Crowcroft@cs.ucl.ac.uk Subject: Re: Is the list quiet? In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 19 Sep 2001 08:59:40 +0200." <91A311FF6A85D3118DDF0060080C3D820200726F@lat3721.rd.francetelecom.fr> Date: Wed, 19 Sep 2001 08:32:20 +0100 Message-ID: <12086.1000884740@cs.ucl.ac.uk> From: Jon Crowcroft out of interest: has anyone considered SSM with a mobile source? j. From owner-extdom.ssm-interest@sj-msg-core-1.cisco.com Wed Sep 19 05:21:31 2001 Received: from sj-msg-core-1.cisco.com (sj-msg-core-1.cisco.com [171.71.163.11]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id FAA27386 for ; Wed, 19 Sep 2001 05:21:29 -0400 (EDT) Received: from sj-msg-av-1.cisco.com (sj-msg-av-1.cisco.com [171.69.11.130]) by sj-msg-core-1.cisco.com (8.11.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id f8J8Orx29606 for ; Wed, 19 Sep 2001 01:24:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from proxy1.cisco.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by sj-msg-av-1.cisco.com (8.10.1/8.10.1) with ESMTP id f8J8P9004084 for ; Wed, 19 Sep 2001 01:25:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from bells.cs.ucl.ac.uk (bells.cs.ucl.ac.uk [128.16.5.31]) by proxy1.cisco.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with SMTP id f8J8OcT09769 for ; Wed, 19 Sep 2001 01:24:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sonic.cs.ucl.ac.uk by bells.cs.ucl.ac.uk with local SMTP id ; Wed, 19 Sep 2001 09:19:44 +0100 to: ssm-interest@external.cisco.com Subject: Re: Is the list quiet? In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 19 Sep 2001 08:32:20 BST." <12086.1000884740@cs.ucl.ac.uk> Date: Wed, 19 Sep 2001 09:19:42 +0100 Message-ID: <14606.1000887582@cs.ucl.ac.uk> From: Jon Crowcroft In message <12086.1000884740@cs.ucl.ac.uk>, Jon Crowcroft typed: >>out of interest: >>has anyone considered SSM with a mobile source? there's been a couple of papers kicking around on how to do multiple sender multicast with ssm here's a thought not original based on them given some of us actualyl have operational wide area nets with PIM SM running, fairly well, but our experience with wider area (interdomain) is just basically hopeless, how could we leverage SSM as an inter-domain protocol for multiple source multicast? seems quite simple really....esp. if you are prepared to aggregate traffic from all sources for a group (and possibly all sources for multiple groups) into an SSM tunnel, that sources all traffic from a domain as a multiplex, to all other domains that agree (subject to policy) they are interested so we still need the MSDP stuff, but it needs to be IGMPv3ized so to speak so that it can be used to manage filters for a bundle of SSM interdomain tunnels.... nice thing is that all sorts of interdomain traffic engineering then becomes quite cute too just a thort cheers jon From owner-extdom.ssm-interest@sj-msg-core-4.cisco.com Wed Sep 19 05:47:50 2001 Received: from sj-msg-core-4.cisco.com (sj-msg-core-4.cisco.com [171.71.163.10]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id FAA27909 for ; Wed, 19 Sep 2001 05:47:49 -0400 (EDT) Received: from sj-msg-av-3.cisco.com (sj-msg-av-3.cisco.com [171.69.2.19]) by sj-msg-core-4.cisco.com (8.11.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id f8J8foO26580 for ; Wed, 19 Sep 2001 01:41:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from proxy2.cisco.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by sj-msg-av-3.cisco.com (8.10.1/8.10.1) with ESMTP id f8J8fbD18092 for ; Wed, 19 Sep 2001 01:41:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mailer.berkom.de (mailer.berkom.de [141.39.13.2]) by proxy2.cisco.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id f8J8cWl14416 for ; Wed, 19 Sep 2001 01:38:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from Dunja (dunja.t33.berkom.de [141.39.27.107]) by mailer.berkom.de (1.1.1/0.0.0) with SMTP id f8J8Rf427210; Wed, 19 Sep 2001 10:27:41 +0200 (MET DST) Reply-To: From: "fleischhauer" To: "Aaron J Fabbri" , Subject: AW: SSM, IGMPv3 on Linux Date: Wed, 19 Sep 2001 10:28:01 +0200 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) In-Reply-To: <200109181916.f8IJGEN15818@cs.uoregon.edu> Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Hello, I tried to install the Sprintlabs Kernel patches in both versions. After this I had not an IGMP function on these hosts. But the FreeBSD implementations from Wilbert de Graaf works very well. KARSTEN Karsten Fleischhauer T-NOVA Berkom EB 11.15 IP-Technologien Goslarer Ufer 35 D-10589 Berlin Mail: fleischhauer@berkom.de Telefon: +49-(0)30-3497-2854 Fax: +49-(0)30-3497-3199 -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht----- Von: Aaron J Fabbri [mailto:fabbri@vital-4.cs.uoregon.edu] Gesendet: Dienstag, 18. September 2001 21:17 An: ssm-interest@external.cisco.com Betreff: SSM, IGMPv3 on Linux > >Has anybody tried to get SSM working with on Linux ? > By "working", you may mean one of two things: 1. SSM support for end-hosts Sprint labs has a IGMPv3 patch available for kernel 2.4.0, and 2.2.18 at: http://www.sprintlabs.com/Department/IP-Interworking/multicast/linux-igmpv3/ I had to make some minor modifications to the patch for my 2.4.2 kernel. When you have your kernel patched, you simply use the new API discussed in draft-ietf-idmr-msf-api-01.txt (try google) 2. Using Linux as a SSM router I've been using PIM-SM with application-layer source filters to do testing. I am not aware of a SSM-specific mrouted for linux yet, but the changes which need to be made to PIM-SM to realize the SSM model are fairly simple. For specifics, see: http://www.dante.net/mbone/refs/draft-bhattach-diot-pimso-00.txt Basically the PIM-SM router needs to be able to skip the shared tree and RP and go straight to source-specific trees, depending on which type of IGMPv3 join was received. >I am assuming that since the latest Linux distributions (Kernel 2.4+) have >IGMP v3 and PIM-SM support, SSM should already be in place, or am I >seriously missing something ? I don't believe IGMPv3 is a standard part of linux yet, unfortunately. Does anyone know what version this is going to be officially included in? Thanks, Aaron -------------------==============================------------------ Aaron Fabbri http://www.cs.uoregon.edu/~fabbri fabbri@cs.uoregon.edu -------------------==============================------------------ ------------- End Forwarded Message ------------- -------------------==============================------------------ Aaron Fabbri http://www.cs.uoregon.edu/~fabbri fabbri@cs.uoregon.edu -------------------==============================------------------ From owner-extdom.ssm-interest@sj-msg-core-2.cisco.com Wed Sep 19 08:41:47 2001 Received: from sj-msg-core-2.cisco.com (sj-msg-core-2.cisco.com [171.69.24.11]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id IAA00979 for ; Wed, 19 Sep 2001 08:41:47 -0400 (EDT) Received: from sj-msg-av-2.cisco.com (sj-msg-av-2.cisco.com [171.69.24.12]) by sj-msg-core-2.cisco.com (8.11.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id f8JBhAC18894 for ; Wed, 19 Sep 2001 04:43:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from proxy1.cisco.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by sj-msg-av-2.cisco.com (8.10.1/8.10.1) with ESMTP id f8JBh6V09685 for ; Wed, 19 Sep 2001 04:43:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ids2.idsonline.com (root@ids2.idsonline.com [205.177.236.32]) by proxy1.cisco.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id f8JBgrT29517 for ; Wed, 19 Sep 2001 04:42:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from idsonline.com (nobody@ids2.idsonline.com [205.177.236.32]) by ids2.idsonline.com (8.11.1/8.11.1) with SMTP id f8JBGMh23659; Wed, 19 Sep 2001 07:16:22 -0400 From: "Marshall Eubanks" Sender: tme@idsonline.com Reply-to: tme@21rst-century.com To: Jon Crowcroft , ssm-interest@external.cisco.com Date: Wed, 19 Sep 2001 07:16:22 -0400 Subject: Re: Is the list quiet? X-Mailer: DMailWeb Web to Mail Gateway 2.6k, http://netwinsite.com/top_mail.htm Message-id: <3ba87e86.5c64.0@idsonline.com> X-User-Info: 63.23.113.34 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > >In message <12086.1000884740@cs.ucl.ac.uk>, Jon Crowcroft typed: > > >>out of interest: > >>has anyone considered SSM with a mobile source? > > >there's been a couple of papers kicking around on how to do multiple >sender multicast with ssm > >here's a thought not original based on them > >given some of us actualyl have operational wide area nets with PIM SM >running, fairly well, but our experience with wider area >(interdomain) is just basically hopeless, >how could we leverage SSM as an inter-domain protocol for >multiple source multicast? I agree with this. Source discovery needs to be taken out of the transport layer for interdomain ASM IMHO. We do do interdomain multicast, and there are more problems with MSDP than anything else. The whole interdomain MSDP - RP system is also a big potential security problem as long as it is done by routers at the transport level. Regards Marshall > >seems quite simple really....esp. if you are prepared to aggregate >traffic from all sources for a group (and possibly all sources for >multiple groups) into an SSM tunnel, that sources all traffic from a >domain as a multiplex, to all other domains that agree (subject to >policy) they are interested > >so we still need the MSDP stuff, but it needs to be IGMPv3ized so to >speak so that it can be used to manage filters for a bundle of SSM >interdomain tunnels.... > >nice thing is that all sorts of interdomain traffic engineering then >becomes quite cute too > >just a thort > > > > cheers > > jon > > Marshall Eubanks tme@21rst-century.com From owner-extdom.ssm-interest@sj-msg-core-2.cisco.com Wed Sep 19 10:14:23 2001 Received: from sj-msg-core-2.cisco.com (sj-msg-core-2.cisco.com [171.69.24.11]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id KAA02731 for ; Wed, 19 Sep 2001 10:14:22 -0400 (EDT) Received: from sj-msg-av-1.cisco.com (sj-msg-av-1.cisco.com [171.69.11.130]) by sj-msg-core-2.cisco.com (8.11.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id f8JDVQC08645 for ; Wed, 19 Sep 2001 06:31:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from proxy2.cisco.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by sj-msg-av-1.cisco.com (8.10.1/8.10.1) with ESMTP id f8JDVhk10793 for ; Wed, 19 Sep 2001 06:31:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from socrates.thinkhost.com (socrates.thinkhost.com [209.61.189.124]) by proxy2.cisco.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id f8JDSLp29538 for ; Wed, 19 Sep 2001 06:28:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from c1545877a.lewisv1.tx.home.com (c1545877-a.lewisv1.tx.home.com [24.17.177.253]) by socrates.thinkhost.com (8.11.6/8.11.4) with SMTP id f8JDRbO94486 for ; Wed, 19 Sep 2001 13:27:38 GMT (envelope-from john@packeteers.com) From: "John McClelland" To: Subject: PacketTV & VOD w/ ssm ( Re: Is the list quiet?) Date: Wed, 19 Sep 2001 08:11:24 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 Importance: Normal Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello, I am working with SSM for IPTV and VOD/NVOD. We have 170+ channels. Just to let you know about the applcation. 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From owner-extdom.ssm-interest@sj-msg-core-4.cisco.com Wed Sep 19 20:56:24 2001 Received: from sj-msg-core-4.cisco.com (sj-msg-core-4.cisco.com [171.71.163.10]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id UAA13164 for ; Wed, 19 Sep 2001 20:56:23 -0400 (EDT) Received: from sj-msg-av-3.cisco.com (sj-msg-av-3.cisco.com [171.69.2.19]) by sj-msg-core-4.cisco.com (8.11.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id f8JNvIA25852 for ; Wed, 19 Sep 2001 16:57:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: from proxy2.cisco.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by sj-msg-av-3.cisco.com (8.10.1/8.10.1) with ESMTP id f8JNv5j01237 for ; Wed, 19 Sep 2001 16:57:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from bigfoot.com ([209.99.230.160]) by proxy2.cisco.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with SMTP id f8JNrsp08347 for ; Wed, 19 Sep 2001 16:53:55 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <200109192353.f8JNrsp08347@proxy2.cisco.com> From: "Jorge Damonte" To: Subject: Para vos ssm-interest@external.cisco.com Sender: "Jorge Damonte" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="ISO-8859-1" Date: Wed, 19 Sep 2001 21:00:34 -0300 X-Priority: 1 (Highest) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit

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From owner-extdom.ssm-interest@sj-msg-core-3.cisco.com Wed Sep 19 21:45:44 2001 Received: from sj-msg-core-3.cisco.com (sj-msg-core-3.cisco.com [171.70.157.152]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id VAA14624 for ; Wed, 19 Sep 2001 21:45:39 -0400 (EDT) Received: from sj-msg-av-1.cisco.com (sj-msg-av-1.cisco.com [171.69.11.130]) by sj-msg-core-3.cisco.com (8.11.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id f8JGeDO20234 for ; Wed, 19 Sep 2001 10:36:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from proxy2.cisco.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by sj-msg-av-1.cisco.com (8.10.1/8.10.1) with ESMTP id f8JGgS401650 for ; Wed, 19 Sep 2001 09:42:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from zax05.p.zax.nu ([211.5.119.37]) by proxy2.cisco.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id f8JGd5p21930 for ; Wed, 19 Sep 2001 09:39:06 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <200109191639.f8JGd5p21930@proxy2.cisco.com> Received: from html (slip-32-102-47-238.tx.us.prserv.net [32.102.47.238]) by zax05.p.zax.nu with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.1960.3) id SWTK7RM7; Thu, 20 Sep 2001 01:38:19 +0900 From: jimsrelaysdotnet@wherehasmyworldgone.com To: elkton@worldnet.att.net Subject: Take a look at this and tell me what you think Date: Wed, 19 Sep 2001 11:40:15 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="DEFAULT"

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From owner-extdom.ssm-interest@sj-msg-core-3.cisco.com Thu Sep 20 06:32:46 2001 Received: from sj-msg-core-3.cisco.com (sj-msg-core-3.cisco.com [171.70.157.152]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id GAA04838 for ; Thu, 20 Sep 2001 06:32:45 -0400 (EDT) Received: from sj-msg-av-2.cisco.com (sj-msg-av-2.cisco.com [171.69.24.12]) by sj-msg-core-3.cisco.com (8.11.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id f8K9clg21190 for ; Thu, 20 Sep 2001 02:38:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from proxy1.cisco.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by sj-msg-av-2.cisco.com (8.10.1/8.10.1) with ESMTP id f8K9ek529524 for ; Thu, 20 Sep 2001 02:40:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from isis.lip6.fr (IDENT:root@isis.lip6.fr [132.227.60.2]) by proxy1.cisco.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id f8K9eVl22843 for ; Thu, 20 Sep 2001 02:40:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tibre.lip6.fr (tibre.lip6.fr [132.227.74.2]) by isis.lip6.fr (8.12.0.Beta19/jtpda-5.3.2+victor) with ESMTP id f8K90MeZ020438 ; Thu, 20 Sep 2001 11:00:22 +0200 X-pt: isis.lip6.fr Received: from lip6.fr (otos.lip6.fr [132.227.61.47]) by tibre.lip6.fr (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f8K90DW09154; Thu, 20 Sep 2001 11:00:14 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <3BA9B023.F43BDE71@lip6.fr> Date: Thu, 20 Sep 2001 11:00:20 +0200 From: Rolland Vida Organization: Laboratoire Lip6 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.75 [fr] (WinNT; U) X-Accept-Language: fr MIME-Version: 1.0 To: magma@innovationslab.net, idmr@cs.ucl.ac.uk, ipng@sunroof.eng.sun.com, ssm-interest@external.cisco.com, wg-multicast@internet2.edu Subject: MLDv2 implementation Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------CEC8BFA98A27BF2765E316CA" --------------CEC8BFA98A27BF2765E316CA Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Dear all, We would like to announce the first implementation of the MLDv2(Multicast Listener Discovery version 2) protocol, jointly developed at LIP6 - Universite Pierre et Maris Curie, Paris and LSIIT - Universite Louis Pasteur, Strasbourg. The development was done on FreeBSD 4.3, using the integrated KAME code for IPv6. MLDv2 Host Implementation was done by Konstantin Kabassanov at LIP6. It is a kernel implementation based on Wilbert de Graaf's IGMPv3 Host Implementation for IPv4. MLDv2 Enabled PIM-SSM Router Implementation was done by Mickael Hoerdt at LSIIT. MLDv2 Router is not a kernel code, but implemented as a user process, fully integrated to PIM-SSM routing daemon. The MLDv2 Host implementation follows the MLDv2 Internet Draft (draft-vida-mld-v2-01.txt). The MLDv2 Router part is not fully compliant with the internet draft, as it fulfils Source Specific Multicast Routing requirements, limited to INCLUDE messages. All the information related to our MLDv2 Implementation can be found at: http://mldv2.lip6.fr. Please send comments, or report bugs to: - mldv2@lip6.fr (host part) - ssm@www-r2.u-strasbg.fr (router part) Best regards, LIP6 Team LSIIT Team Konstantin Kabassanov Mickael Hoerdt Rolland Vida Dominique Grad Luis Costa Jean-Jacques Pansiot Serge Fdida --------------CEC8BFA98A27BF2765E316CA Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Dear all,

We would like to announce the first implementation of the MLDv2(Multicast Listener Discovery version 2) protocol, jointly developed at LIP6 - Universite Pierre et Maris Curie, Paris and LSIIT - Universite Louis Pasteur, Strasbourg.

The development was done on FreeBSD 4.3, using the integrated KAME code for IPv6.

MLDv2 Host Implementation was done by Konstantin Kabassanov at LIP6. It is a kernel implementation based on Wilbert de Graaf's IGMPv3 Host Implementation for IPv4.

MLDv2 Enabled PIM-SSM Router Implementation was done by Mickael Hoerdt at LSIIT. MLDv2 Router is not a kernel code, but implemented as a user process, fully integrated to PIM-SSM routing daemon.

The MLDv2 Host implementation follows the MLDv2 Internet Draft (draft-vida-mld-v2-01.txt). The MLDv2 Router part is not fully compliant with the internet draft, as it fulfils Source Specific Multicast Routing requirements, limited to INCLUDE messages.

All the information related to our MLDv2 Implementation can be found at: http://mldv2.lip6.fr.
Please send comments, or report bugs to:
- mldv2@lip6.fr (host part)
- ssm@www-r2.u-strasbg.fr (router part)

Best regards,

LIP6 Team                         LSIIT Team
   Konstantin Kabassanov            Mickael Hoerdt
   Rolland Vida                     Dominique Grad
   Luis Costa                       Jean-Jacques Pansiot
   Serge Fdida
--------------CEC8BFA98A27BF2765E316CA-- From owner-extdom.ssm-interest@sj-msg-core-2.cisco.com Sat Sep 22 01:15:17 2001 Received: from sj-msg-core-2.cisco.com (sj-msg-core-2.cisco.com [171.69.24.11]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id BAA13989 for ; Sat, 22 Sep 2001 01:15:17 -0400 (EDT) Received: from sj-msg-av-3.cisco.com (sj-msg-av-3.cisco.com [171.69.17.42]) by sj-msg-core-2.cisco.com (8.11.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id f8M3Cxu06709; Fri, 21 Sep 2001 20:12:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: from proxy3.cisco.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by sj-msg-av-3.cisco.com (8.10.1/8.10.1) with ESMTP id f8M3CwO07873; Fri, 21 Sep 2001 20:12:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from paperart.nl (mail.paperart.nl [212.153.224.130]) by proxy3.cisco.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with SMTP id f8M3DaY17048; Fri, 21 Sep 2001 20:13:36 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <200109220313.f8M3DaY17048@proxy3.cisco.com> Received: from 12.64.198.31 ([12.64.198.31]) by paperart.nl; Fri, 21 Sep 2001 22:28:59 +0200 To: From: vbi6yvi9zs@hotmail.com Subject: SHY ABOUT YOUR PACAKGE? ADD INCHES FAST!!! Date: Mon, 24 Sep 2001 04:19:47 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Errors-To: ctcvvepva9in@intermega.com.br X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

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From owner-extdom.ssm-interest@sj-msg-core-4.cisco.com Wed Sep 26 23:10:40 2001 Received: from sj-msg-core-4.cisco.com (sj-msg-core-4.cisco.com [171.71.163.10]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id XAA04926 for ; Wed, 26 Sep 2001 23:10:39 -0400 (EDT) Received: from sj-msg-av-2.cisco.com (sj-msg-av-2.cisco.com [171.69.24.12]) by sj-msg-core-4.cisco.com (8.11.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id f8R2CPd05836 for ; Wed, 26 Sep 2001 19:12:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from proxy3.cisco.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by sj-msg-av-2.cisco.com (8.10.1/8.10.1) with ESMTP id f8R2CCC08736 for ; Wed, 26 Sep 2001 19:12:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: from WIN-INET-01.wingroup.windeploy.ntdev.microsoft.com ([131.107.3.118]) by proxy3.cisco.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id f8R2Cq517287 for ; Wed, 26 Sep 2001 19:12:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from win-hub-01.wingroup.windeploy.ntdev.microsoft.com ([157.54.5.229]) by WIN-INET-01.wingroup.windeploy.ntdev.microsoft.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.3651); Wed, 26 Sep 2001 19:05:04 -0700 Received: from 157.54.5.226 by win-hub-01.wingroup.windeploy.ntdev.microsoft.com (InterScan E-Mail VirusWall NT); Wed, 26 Sep 2001 19:05:04 -0700 Received: from win-msg-01.wingroup.windeploy.ntdev.microsoft.com ([157.54.0.52]) by win-hub-01.wingroup.windeploy.ntdev.microsoft.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.3651); Wed, 26 Sep 2001 19:05:04 -0700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.5716.0 Content-Class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Subject: Joining to SSM sources that are IPv6 mobile nodes Date: Wed, 26 Sep 2001 19:05:04 -0700 Message-ID: <2E33960095B58E40A4D3345AB9F65EC102DB7D6A@win-msg-01.wingroup.windeploy.ntdev.microsoft.com> Thread-Topic: Joining to SSM sources that are IPv6 mobile nodes thread-index: AcFG+L0zdxWOSEFrQS2r4c4TfpMGsQ== From: "Dave Thaler" To: , , X-OriginalArrivalTime: 27 Sep 2001 02:05:04.0686 (UTC) FILETIME=[D2E0B4E0:01C146F8] Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by ietf.org id XAA04926 Sorry for the cross-post, but this issue really does concern interactions between drafts in three different WGs: MobileIP: draft-ietf-mobileip-ipv6-14.txt, section 10.19 MAGMA: draft-vida-mld-v2-01.txt SSM: draft-ietf-ssm-overview-01.txt (Please trim the recipients when responding, if appropriate.) Starting from the Mobile IPv6 spec: > A mobile node that wishes to send packets to a multicast group > also has two options: (1) send directly on the foreign link being > visited; or (2) send via a tunnel to its home agent. Because > multicast routing in general depends upon the Source Address used in > the IPv6 header of the multicast packet, a mobile node that tunnels a > multicast packet to its home agent MUST use its home address as the > IPv6 Source Address of the inner multicast packet. The issue is how to continue getting data to receivers after a mobile node moves. Method (2) works fine for SSM, but has the obvious inefficiency. Method (1) does not work as is for SSM. I'll assume the sender has advertised (HA,G) in whatever method (e.g. a web page) he uses to announce the session, just like the session would advertise HA in any method used to get unicast clients to connect to him. (The sender could just as well use (COA,G) but the same issues arise if it subsequently moves, from my understanding.) In the SSM model, when receivers join (HA,G) via MLDv2, join state is constructed along the path to HA (i.e. hitting the home agent). Any data sent directly on the foreign link being visited will go nowhere, since there is no join state there. A bad answer would be "do nothing, we don't care if sourcing SSM is broken". A simple answer would be "an SSM source MUST use option (2), i.e. tunnel packets to the home agent". In this case, either option (1) would never be used for any multicast traffic, or else the host would have to know whether a receiver might want to use an include-mode list with MLDv2 and tunnel to the home agent if so. Personally, I don't like this answer, but if this is what the consensus turns out to be, then it should be documented in the Mobile IPv6 spec (no effect on the SSM or MAGMA WGs), and apis to inform the mobile node stack that it MUST tunnel to the home agent may be required. Another answer, which would require adding rules to both the Mobile IPv6 and MLDv2 specs (and probably mentioning it in the SSM overview doc), would be to make method (1) work for SSM sources. A potential solution here is twofold: 1) If an MLDv2 host is sending an include-mode report for a source X, and a binding cache entry exists for X with a care-of-address COA, then put both X and COA in the membership report. (This means that if you can somehow get a Binding Update to all the group members, then they'll be able to receive packets sourced from COA, since routers will construct join state back to the foreign link.) It needs to join to both addresses so that if the node moves again, it won't be stuck waiting for data from the old COA. 2) A mobile node sourcing traffic when away from home needs to get a Binding Update to all the group members. I believe this can be done by tunneling a packet via the home agent (and hence must have a source address of its home address) which contains a Binding Update with an Alternate Care-of Address of its current COA. This would need to be done periodically, so that new receivers get it. Comments? Am I missing anything? -Dave Thaler From owner-extdom.ssm-interest@sj-msg-core-3.cisco.com Wed Sep 26 23:10:56 2001 Received: from sj-msg-core-3.cisco.com (sj-msg-core-3.cisco.com [171.70.157.152]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id XAA04936 for ; Wed, 26 Sep 2001 23:10:56 -0400 (EDT) Received: from sj-msg-av-1.cisco.com (sj-msg-av-1.cisco.com [171.69.11.130]) by sj-msg-core-3.cisco.com (8.11.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id f8R28a405915 for ; Wed, 26 Sep 2001 19:08:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from proxy1.cisco.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by sj-msg-av-1.cisco.com (8.10.1/8.10.1) with ESMTP id f8R2Asv10191 for ; Wed, 26 Sep 2001 19:10:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from kitnt.imagetec.co.kr ([211.217.224.186]) by proxy1.cisco.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with SMTP id f8R2AMu08357 for ; Wed, 26 Sep 2001 19:10:22 -0700 (PDT) Date: Wed, 26 Sep 2001 19:10:22 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <200109270210.f8R2AMu08357@proxy1.cisco.com> Received: from ([63.210.121.60]) by kitnt.imagetec.co.kr (MERAK 3.00.120) with ESMTP id 061609B9; Thu, 27 Sep 2001 09:07:38 +0900 To: creditsource@mediaone.net From: Subject: GUARANTEED way to INSTANTLY have EXCELLENT CREDIT!! 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From owner-extdom.ssm-interest@sj-msg-core-4.cisco.com Thu Sep 27 07:57:03 2001 Received: from sj-msg-core-4.cisco.com (sj-msg-core-4.cisco.com [171.71.163.10]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id HAA27209 for ; Thu, 27 Sep 2001 07:57:02 -0400 (EDT) Received: from sj-msg-av-2.cisco.com (sj-msg-av-2.cisco.com [171.69.24.12]) by sj-msg-core-4.cisco.com (8.11.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id f8RAZbd06785 for ; Thu, 27 Sep 2001 03:35:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from proxy2.cisco.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by sj-msg-av-2.cisco.com (8.10.1/8.10.1) with ESMTP id f8RAZOC24535 for ; Thu, 27 Sep 2001 03:35:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from laposte.enst-bretagne.fr (laposte.enst-bretagne.fr [192.108.115.3]) by proxy2.cisco.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id f8RAW9Z03024 for ; Thu, 27 Sep 2001 03:32:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rsm.rennes.enst-bretagne.fr (rsm.rennes.enst-bretagne.fr [192.44.77.1]) by laposte.enst-bretagne.fr (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id f8RANW905330; Thu, 27 Sep 2001 12:23:32 +0200 Received: from givry.rennes.enst-bretagne.fr (givry.rennes.enst-bretagne.fr [193.52.74.194]) by rsm.rennes.enst-bretagne.fr (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id MAA15365; Thu, 27 Sep 2001 12:23:32 +0200 (MET DST) Received: from givry.rennes.enst-bretagne.fr (localhost.rennes.enst-bretagne.fr [127.0.0.1]) by givry.rennes.enst-bretagne.fr (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f8RANVl32696; Thu, 27 Sep 2001 12:23:31 +0200 (CEST) (envelope-from dupont@givry.rennes.enst-bretagne.fr) Message-Id: <200109271023.f8RANVl32696@givry.rennes.enst-bretagne.fr> From: Francis Dupont To: mobile-ip@sunroof.eng.sun.com cc: magma@innovationslab.net, ssm-interest@external.cisco.com Subject: Re: [mobile-ip] Joining to SSM sources that are IPv6 mobile nodes In-reply-to: Your message of Wed, 26 Sep 2001 19:05:04 PDT. <2E33960095B58E40A4D3345AB9F65EC102DB7D6A@win-msg-01.wingroup.windeploy.ntdev.microsoft.com> Date: Thu, 27 Sep 2001 12:23:31 +0200 Sender: Francis.Dupont@enst-bretagne.fr X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://www.amavis.org/) at enst-bretagne.fr In your previous mail you wrote: The issue is how to continue getting data to receivers after a mobile node moves. Method (2) works fine for SSM, but has the obvious inefficiency. Method (1) does not work as is for SSM. => IMHO only the method 2 (i.e. to use a bidirectional tunnel between the MN and the HA, and of course the home address as the source) is reasonnable. But I wait for folks who have worked with (traditional) multicast for mobile nodes. Regards Francis.Dupont@enst-bretagne.fr PS: method 2 is not always inefficient, but this is always simple (apply KISS principle? :-) From owner-extdom.ssm-interest@sj-msg-core-1.cisco.com Thu Sep 27 11:20:29 2001 Received: from sj-msg-core-1.cisco.com (sj-msg-core-1.cisco.com [171.71.163.11]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id LAA03552 for ; Thu, 27 Sep 2001 11:20:28 -0400 (EDT) Received: from sj-msg-av-3.cisco.com (sj-msg-av-3.cisco.com [171.69.17.42]) by sj-msg-core-1.cisco.com (8.11.6/8.9.1) with ESMTP id f8RDeYG05166 for ; Thu, 27 Sep 2001 06:40:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from proxy2.cisco.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by sj-msg-av-3.cisco.com (8.10.1/8.10.1) with ESMTP id f8RDeXS27008 for ; Thu, 27 Sep 2001 06:40:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from zcars0m9.ca.nortel.com (zcars0m9.nortelnetworks.com [47.129.242.157]) by proxy2.cisco.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id f8RDbHm27311 for ; Thu, 27 Sep 2001 06:37:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from zcars04f.ca.nortel.com (zcars04f.ca.nortel.com [47.129.242.57]) by zcars0m9.ca.nortel.com (8.11.0/8.11.0) with ESMTP id f8RDQPp24601 for ; Thu, 27 Sep 2001 09:26:25 -0400 (EDT) Received: from zcard00m.ca.nortel.com by zcars04f.ca.nortel.com; Thu, 27 Sep 2001 09:26:25 -0400 Received: from zbl6c000.corpeast.baynetworks.com ([132.245.205.50]) by zcard00m.ca.nortel.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2653.13) id TK5W4P1W; Thu, 27 Sep 2001 09:26:20 -0400 Received: from americasm06.nt.com (deathvalley.us.nortel.com [47.141.98.23]) by zbl6c000.corpeast.baynetworks.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2653.13) id RS87S1QF; Thu, 27 Sep 2001 09:26:19 -0400 Message-ID: <3BB32904.B2B0926D@americasm06.nt.com> Date: Thu, 27 Sep 2001 09:26:28 -0400 X-Sybari-Space: 00000000 00000000 00000000 From: "Brian Haberman" Reply-To: "Brian Haberman" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.77 [en] (Windows NT 5.0; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Dave Thaler CC: mobile-ip , magma , ssm-interest Subject: Re: Joining to SSM sources that are IPv6 mobile nodes References: <2E33960095B58E40A4D3345AB9F65EC102DB7D6A@win-msg-01.wingroup.windeploy.ntdev.microsoft.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Orig: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Dave, I prefer method 2. Trying to get BUs to all group members in order to make SSM work seems overly complicated. Let the group members think the MN is always at home sourcing the multicast data. Brian Dave Thaler wrote: > > Sorry for the cross-post, but this issue really does concern > interactions between drafts in three different WGs: > MobileIP: draft-ietf-mobileip-ipv6-14.txt, section 10.19 > MAGMA: draft-vida-mld-v2-01.txt > SSM: draft-ietf-ssm-overview-01.txt > (Please trim the recipients when responding, if appropriate.) > > Starting from the Mobile IPv6 spec: > > A mobile node that wishes to send packets to a multicast group > > also has two options: (1) send directly on the foreign link being > > visited; or (2) send via a tunnel to its home agent. Because > > multicast routing in general depends upon the Source Address used in > > the IPv6 header of the multicast packet, a mobile node that tunnels a > > multicast packet to its home agent MUST use its home address as the > > IPv6 Source Address of the inner multicast packet. > > The issue is how to continue getting data to receivers after a mobile > node moves. > Method (2) works fine for SSM, but has the obvious inefficiency. > Method (1) does not work as is for SSM. > > I'll assume the sender has advertised (HA,G) in whatever method (e.g. a > web page) he uses to announce the session, just like the session would > advertise HA in any method used to get unicast clients to connect to > him. (The sender could just as well use (COA,G) but the same issues > arise if it subsequently moves, from my understanding.) > > In the SSM model, when receivers join (HA,G) via MLDv2, join state is > constructed along the path to HA (i.e. hitting the home agent). Any > data sent directly on the foreign link being visited will go nowhere, > since there is no join state there. > > A bad answer would be "do nothing, we don't care if sourcing SSM is > broken". > > A simple answer would be "an SSM source MUST use option (2), i.e. > tunnel packets to the home agent". In this case, either option (1) > would never be used for any multicast traffic, or else the host would > have to know whether a receiver might want to use an include-mode list > with MLDv2 and tunnel to the home agent if so. Personally, I don't > like this answer, but if this is what the consensus turns out to be, > then it should be documented in the Mobile IPv6 spec (no effect on the > SSM or MAGMA WGs), and apis to inform the mobile node stack that it > MUST tunnel to the home agent may be required. > > Another answer, which would require adding rules to both the Mobile > IPv6 and MLDv2 specs (and probably mentioning it in the SSM overview > doc), would be to make method (1) work for SSM sources. A potential > solution here is twofold: > > 1) If an MLDv2 host is sending an include-mode report for a source X, > and a binding cache entry exists for X with a care-of-address COA, then > put both X and COA in the membership report. (This means that if you > can somehow get a Binding Update to all the group members, then they'll > be able to receive packets sourced from COA, since routers will > construct join state back to the foreign link.) It needs to join to > both addresses so that if the node moves again, it won't be stuck > waiting for data from the old COA. > > 2) A mobile node sourcing traffic when away from home needs to get a > Binding Update to all the group members. I believe this can be done by > tunneling a packet via the home agent (and hence must have a source > address of its home address) which contains a Binding Update with > an Alternate Care-of Address of its current COA. This would need to be > done periodically, so that new receivers get it. > > Comments? Am I missing anything? > > -Dave Thaler From owner-extdom.ssm-interest@sj-msg-core-4.cisco.com Thu Sep 27 14:11:30 2001 Received: from sj-msg-core-4.cisco.com (sj-msg-core-4.cisco.com [171.71.163.10]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id OAA09936 for ; Thu, 27 Sep 2001 14:11:29 -0400 (EDT) Received: from sj-msg-av-3.cisco.com (sj-msg-av-3.cisco.com [171.69.17.42]) by sj-msg-core-4.cisco.com (8.11.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id f8RGmYd06112 for ; Thu, 27 Sep 2001 09:48:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from proxy1.cisco.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by sj-msg-av-3.cisco.com (8.10.1/8.10.1) with ESMTP id f8RGmK609907 for ; Thu, 27 Sep 2001 09:48:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from isis.lip6.fr (IDENT:root@isis.lip6.fr [132.227.60.2]) by proxy1.cisco.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id f8RGm4N27740 for ; Thu, 27 Sep 2001 09:48:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tibre.lip6.fr (tibre.lip6.fr [132.227.74.2]) by isis.lip6.fr (8.12.0.Beta19/jtpda-5.3.2+victor) with ESMTP id f8RG8MeZ000709 ; Thu, 27 Sep 2001 18:08:23 +0200 X-pt: isis.lip6.fr Received: from lip6.fr (otos.lip6.fr [132.227.61.47]) by tibre.lip6.fr (8.11.3/8.11.3) with ESMTP id f8RG8AW29331; Thu, 27 Sep 2001 18:08:10 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <3BB34EF5.14CD184F@lip6.fr> Date: Thu, 27 Sep 2001 18:08:21 +0200 From: Rolland Vida Organization: Laboratoire Lip6 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.75 [fr] (WinNT; U) X-Accept-Language: fr MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Dave Thaler CC: mobile-ip@sunroof.eng.sun.com, magma@innovationslab.net, ssm-interest@external.cisco.com Subject: Re: [Magma] Joining to SSM sources that are IPv6 mobile nodes References: <2E33960095B58E40A4D3345AB9F65EC102DB7D6A@win-msg-01.wingroup.windeploy.ntdev.microsoft.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Dave et al., Solution 2 is obviously the simplest one. However, solution 1 might prove to be not as bad as it looks like. Brian said "Let the group members think the MN is always at home sourcing the multicast data." In fact, you could use your proposed solution 1 without the receivers being aware of the MN's address change. The MN should advertise its new CoA to the edge routers, and not to the receivers. Edge routers then will send a PIM-SSM join message to the CoA, and a second SSM tree is built. This will be done transparently for the receivers. There's of course the problem that even if data will arrive on the new CoA SSM tree, receivers will drop the packets as the source address is not OK for them. A possible solution for that is to do NAT in the edge routers, and change back the source address to the home address, before forwarding the data to their receivers. I agree however that this solution is a lot more complicated than a simple tunneling. > Either option (1) would never be used for any multicast traffic, or else > the host would > have to know whether a receiver might want to use an include-mode list > with MLDv2 and tunnel to the home agent if so. You can make the difference between an SSM and an SM connection by the group's address. There's a specific SSM address range, and it is supposed that you do not do PIM-SM in the SSM range. More generally, I think that the problem has a lot in common with the problem of reliability in an SSM environment. Imagine that you have an SSM source, and a potential repair server somewhere downstream. If data gets lost, only the source can send repair data. If you want to use the repair server, you should probably create a second SSM tree, rooted at the repair server. In addition, repair servers could move, or in fact could be activated or deactivated in certain conditions. There are some papers on this issue by people from UMASS. The point is that you will have to constantly join and leave different SSM repair trees, like the different CoA trees. Somehow similar, isn't it? Ok, I'm a bit far from the strating point. But it's an interesting issue I think Regards, Rolland Vida. From owner-extdom.ssm-interest@sj-msg-core-4.cisco.com Thu Sep 27 14:13:20 2001 Received: from sj-msg-core-4.cisco.com (sj-msg-core-4.cisco.com [171.71.163.10]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id OAA09983 for ; Thu, 27 Sep 2001 14:13:20 -0400 (EDT) Received: from sj-msg-av-2.cisco.com (sj-msg-av-2.cisco.com [171.69.24.12]) by sj-msg-core-4.cisco.com (8.11.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id f8RH0qd16454 for ; Thu, 27 Sep 2001 10:00:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from proxy2.cisco.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by sj-msg-av-2.cisco.com (8.10.1/8.10.1) with ESMTP id f8RH0cX16615 for ; Thu, 27 Sep 2001 10:00:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mx.webfountain.com (mx.digitalfountain.com [209.219.233.39]) by proxy2.cisco.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with SMTP id f8RGvMm18087 for ; Thu, 27 Sep 2001 09:57:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail 31646 invoked from network); 27 Sep 2001 16:56:30 -0000 Received: from mail.intranet (10.1.1.37) by mx.digitalfountain.com with SMTP; 27 Sep 2001 16:56:30 -0000 Received: from mikedell (pptp-10-1-129-55.intranet [10.1.129.55]) by mail.intranet (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id JAA06909; Thu, 27 Sep 2001 09:56:04 -0700 X-Authentication-Warning: mail.intranet: Host pptp-10-1-129-55.intranet [10.1.129.55] claimed to be mikedell From: "Michael Luby" To: "Dave Thaler" Cc: , , Subject: RE: Joining to SSM sources that are IPv6 mobile nodes Date: Thu, 27 Sep 2001 09:56:25 -0700 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <2E33960095B58E40A4D3345AB9F65EC102DB7D6A@win-msg-01.wingroup.windeploy.ntdev.microsoft.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Dave, I think that neither of these options is necessarily the right answer all the time, as this seems to me to be more of an application service issue rather than a networking service issue. For example, an application could implement the solution to 1 that you propose below at the application level in pretty much the same manner (without additional explicit network support). The idea would be for the roaming source to always send its current address to its permanent home address (at the application level), and then the home server would always send out the current address of the source through an application level SSM announcement channel. In this solution, the roaming source would send its data multicast packets using its local source address. As another example, at the application level, solution 2 could also be used, where the roaming source always tunnels its multicast packets back to its permanent home address, and then these are sent out using SSM from the home address. There are other ways of doing this as well, but I believe that they should be done at the application level specific to each application, and not at the network services level. I like the philosophy of building a simple but robust common denominator network service (like SSM), rather than trying to build too much of the complexity into this level (like MSDP) that could be done more efficiently and simply at the application level (because one doesn't have to provide a general implementation at the application level, only a much simpler implementation particular to the application). The problem with doing this at the network level is that it will either be too general (and thus hard to implement and scale) or else too restrictive. Mike -----Original Message----- From: Dave Thaler [mailto:dthaler@windows.microsoft.com] Sent: Wednesday, September 26, 2001 7:05 PM To: mobile-ip@sunroof.eng.sun.com; magma@innovationslab.net; ssm-interest@external.cisco.com Subject: Joining to SSM sources that are IPv6 mobile nodes Sorry for the cross-post, but this issue really does concern interactions between drafts in three different WGs: MobileIP: draft-ietf-mobileip-ipv6-14.txt, section 10.19 MAGMA: draft-vida-mld-v2-01.txt SSM: draft-ietf-ssm-overview-01.txt (Please trim the recipients when responding, if appropriate.) Starting from the Mobile IPv6 spec: > A mobile node that wishes to send packets to a multicast group > also has two options: (1) send directly on the foreign link being > visited; or (2) send via a tunnel to its home agent. Because > multicast routing in general depends upon the Source Address used in > the IPv6 header of the multicast packet, a mobile node that tunnels a > multicast packet to its home agent MUST use its home address as the > IPv6 Source Address of the inner multicast packet. The issue is how to continue getting data to receivers after a mobile node moves. Method (2) works fine for SSM, but has the obvious inefficiency. Method (1) does not work as is for SSM. I'll assume the sender has advertised (HA,G) in whatever method (e.g. a web page) he uses to announce the session, just like the session would advertise HA in any method used to get unicast clients to connect to him. (The sender could just as well use (COA,G) but the same issues arise if it subsequently moves, from my understanding.) In the SSM model, when receivers join (HA,G) via MLDv2, join state is constructed along the path to HA (i.e. hitting the home agent). Any data sent directly on the foreign link being visited will go nowhere, since there is no join state there. A bad answer would be "do nothing, we don't care if sourcing SSM is broken". A simple answer would be "an SSM source MUST use option (2), i.e. tunnel packets to the home agent". In this case, either option (1) would never be used for any multicast traffic, or else the host would have to know whether a receiver might want to use an include-mode list with MLDv2 and tunnel to the home agent if so. Personally, I don't like this answer, but if this is what the consensus turns out to be, then it should be documented in the Mobile IPv6 spec (no effect on the SSM or MAGMA WGs), and apis to inform the mobile node stack that it MUST tunnel to the home agent may be required. Another answer, which would require adding rules to both the Mobile IPv6 and MLDv2 specs (and probably mentioning it in the SSM overview doc), would be to make method (1) work for SSM sources. A potential solution here is twofold: 1) If an MLDv2 host is sending an include-mode report for a source X, and a binding cache entry exists for X with a care-of-address COA, then put both X and COA in the membership report. (This means that if you can somehow get a Binding Update to all the group members, then they'll be able to receive packets sourced from COA, since routers will construct join state back to the foreign link.) It needs to join to both addresses so that if the node moves again, it won't be stuck waiting for data from the old COA. 2) A mobile node sourcing traffic when away from home needs to get a Binding Update to all the group members. I believe this can be done by tunneling a packet via the home agent (and hence must have a source address of its home address) which contains a Binding Update with an Alternate Care-of Address of its current COA. This would need to be done periodically, so that new receivers get it. Comments? 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From owner-extdom.ssm-interest@sj-msg-core-4.cisco.com Fri Sep 28 14:56:28 2001 Received: from sj-msg-core-4.cisco.com (sj-msg-core-4.cisco.com [171.71.163.10]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id OAA22387 for ; Fri, 28 Sep 2001 14:56:27 -0400 (EDT) Received: from sj-msg-av-3.cisco.com (sj-msg-av-3.cisco.com [171.69.17.42]) by sj-msg-core-4.cisco.com (8.11.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id f8SI1nP26517 for ; Fri, 28 Sep 2001 11:01:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from proxy1.cisco.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by sj-msg-av-3.cisco.com (8.10.1/8.10.1) with ESMTP id f8SI1aK11350 for ; Fri, 28 Sep 2001 11:01:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from WIN-INET-01.wingroup.windeploy.ntdev.microsoft.com ([131.107.3.118]) by proxy1.cisco.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id f8SI1K018131 for ; Fri, 28 Sep 2001 11:01:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from win-hub-01.wingroup.windeploy.ntdev.microsoft.com ([157.54.5.229]) by WIN-INET-01.wingroup.windeploy.ntdev.microsoft.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.3651); Fri, 28 Sep 2001 10:53:03 -0700 Received: from 157.54.5.226 by win-hub-01.wingroup.windeploy.ntdev.microsoft.com (InterScan E-Mail VirusWall NT); Fri, 28 Sep 2001 10:53:03 -0700 Received: from win-msg-01.wingroup.windeploy.ntdev.microsoft.com ([157.54.0.52]) by win-hub-01.wingroup.windeploy.ntdev.microsoft.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.3651); Fri, 28 Sep 2001 10:53:03 -0700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.5716.0 Content-Class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Subject: RE: Joining to SSM sources that are IPv6 mobile nodes Date: Fri, 28 Sep 2001 10:53:00 -0700 Message-ID: <2E33960095B58E40A4D3345AB9F65EC102DB7D75@win-msg-01.wingroup.windeploy.ntdev.microsoft.com> Thread-Topic: Joining to SSM sources that are IPv6 mobile nodes thread-index: AcFHdEJyDC+htTC/STSdH+XWQl2H3AAz08gg From: "Dave Thaler" To: "Rolland Vida" , Cc: , X-OriginalArrivalTime: 28 Sep 2001 17:53:03.0329 (UTC) FILETIME=[6B9A9D10:01C14846] Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by ietf.org id OAA22387 Rolland Vida (Rolland.Vida@lip6.fr) writes: [...] > > Either option (1) would never be used for any multicast traffic, or else > > the host would > > have to know whether a receiver might want to use an include-mode list > > with MLDv2 and tunnel to the home agent if so. > > You can make the difference between an SSM and an SM connection by the > group's address. There's a specific SSM address range, and it is supposed > that you do not do PIM-SM in the SSM range. It's not that simple. Moving on to quote draft-ietf-ssm-overview-01.txt section 1: > Source-Filtered Multicast (SFM) : This is a variant of the multicast > service model defined in RFC 1112. A source transmits IP datagrams to > a host group address in the range of 224.0.0.0 to 239.255.255.255. [for now ignore the fact that the above sentence needs to be reworded to apply to IPv6 as well... hint to SSM WG...] > However, each "upper layer protocol module" can now request data sent > to a host group G by only a specific set of sources, or can request > data sent to host group G from all BUT a specific set of sources. > Such support for source filtering is provided by version 3 of the > Internet Group Management Protocol (or IGMPv3) [IGMPv3] for IPv4, and > version 2 of the Multicast Listener Discovery (or MLD) protocol for > IPv6 [MLDv2]. The point here is that the problem is not limited to the SSM address range for IPv6. It really applies to include-mode joins for any IPv6 multicast address. Today the multicast model does not require sources to know whether receivers might do this. As a result, without changing the model, you cannot use the address range to make any decision here. Based on the four people who have responded so far (Dupont, Haberman, Luby, and Vida) it sounds like the consensus will be to always tunnel via the home agent if you need network-layer mobility. If this consensus holds, then I think the Mobile IPv6 spec should say that any time the app sends multicast using the home address, the stack SHOULD/MUST tunnel it via the home agent, and also say that the Home Address Option SHOULD NOT/MUST NOT be used in multicast packets. The application can certainly choose whether to source from the Home Address (in which case receivers will continue to get data if it moves), or from the Care Of Address (where mobility must be handled by the application as Mike Luby suggested). There would then be no additional impact on APIs, or the MAGMA or SSM WGs. -Dave From owner-extdom.ssm-interest@sj-msg-core-1.cisco.com Sun Sep 30 19:05:11 2001 Received: from sj-msg-core-1.cisco.com (sj-msg-core-1.cisco.com [171.71.163.11]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id TAA29308 for ; Sun, 30 Sep 2001 19:05:11 -0400 (EDT) Received: from sj-msg-av-2.cisco.com (sj-msg-av-2.cisco.com [171.69.24.12]) by sj-msg-core-1.cisco.com (8.11.6/8.9.1) with ESMTP id f8UMFYG08377 for ; Sun, 30 Sep 2001 15:15:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from proxy2.cisco.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by sj-msg-av-2.cisco.com (8.10.1/8.10.1) with ESMTP id f8UMFXf22180 for ; Sun, 30 Sep 2001 15:15:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.silla.ac.kr ([211.206.202.14]) by proxy2.cisco.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) with ESMTP id f8UMB2A22744 for ; Sun, 30 Sep 2001 15:11:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from 209.208.31.178 ([209.208.31.178]) by mail.silla.ac.kr with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.3779); Mon, 1 Oct 2001 05:54:07 +0900 Message-ID: <000035e07fdd$000076a5$00003a9a@> To: From: lobshot694@earthlink.net Subject: Re: Registration Confirmation 15002 Date: Mon, 01 Oct 2001 01:50:43 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-OriginalArrivalTime: 30 Sep 2001 20:54:12.0046 (UTC) FILETIME=[0EB0B6E0:01C149F2] Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

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