From Roel-sextan@bahmanfinefoods.com Fri Nov 7 09:35:33 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id ED68C3A696D for ; Fri, 7 Nov 2008 09:35:33 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -13.696 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-13.696 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_80=2, GB_I_LETTER=-2, HELO_EQ_DYNAMIC=1.144, HELO_EQ_IT=0.635, HOST_EQ_IT=1.245, HTML_EXTRA_CLOSE=2.809, HTML_IMAGE_ONLY_20=1.546, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, HTML_SHORT_LINK_IMG_3=0.001, MIME_HTML_ONLY=1.457, RCVD_IN_BL_SPAMCOP_NET=1.96, RCVD_IN_PBL=0.905, RCVD_IN_SORBS_DUL=0.877, RCVD_IN_XBL=3.033, RDNS_DYNAMIC=0.1, SARE_UNI=0.591, URIBL_AB_SURBL=10, URIBL_BLACK=20, URIBL_JP_SURBL=10, URIBL_OB_SURBL=10, URIBL_SC_SURBL=10, URIBL_WS_SURBL=10, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id zQIFyrMtemZx for ; Fri, 7 Nov 2008 09:35:31 -0800 (PST) Received: from host157-230-dynamic.30-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it (host250-37-dynamic.7-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it [79.7.37.250]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E58483A67FD for ; Fri, 7 Nov 2008 09:35:30 -0800 (PST) To: Subject: order From: MIME-Version: 1.0 Importance: High Content-Type: text/html Message-Id: <20081107173530.E58483A67FD@core3.amsl.com> Date: Fri, 7 Nov 2008 09:35:30 -0800 (PST)
Click Here!
About this mailing:
You are receiving this e-mail because you subscribed to MSN Featured Offers. Microsoft respects your privacy. If you do not wish to receive this MSN Featured Offers e-mail, please click the "Unsubscribe" link below. This will not unsubscribe you from e-mail communications from third-party advertisers that may appear in MSN Feature Offers. This shall not constitute an offer by MSN. MSN shall not be responsible or liable for the advertisers' content nor any of the goods or service advertised. Prices and item availability subject to change without notice.

?2008 Microsoft | Unsubscribe | More Newsletters | Privacy

Microsoft Corporation, One Microsoft Way, Redmond, WA 98052
From Rigo-setuonit@bahmanfinefoods.com Fri Nov 7 09:35:38 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 733B53A696D for ; Fri, 7 Nov 2008 09:35:38 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -13.696 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-13.696 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_80=2, GB_I_LETTER=-2, HELO_EQ_DYNAMIC=1.144, HELO_EQ_IT=0.635, HOST_EQ_IT=1.245, HTML_EXTRA_CLOSE=2.809, HTML_IMAGE_ONLY_20=1.546, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, HTML_SHORT_LINK_IMG_3=0.001, MIME_HTML_ONLY=1.457, RCVD_IN_BL_SPAMCOP_NET=1.96, RCVD_IN_PBL=0.905, RCVD_IN_SORBS_DUL=0.877, RCVD_IN_XBL=3.033, RDNS_DYNAMIC=0.1, SARE_UNI=0.591, URIBL_AB_SURBL=10, URIBL_BLACK=20, URIBL_JP_SURBL=10, URIBL_OB_SURBL=10, URIBL_SC_SURBL=10, URIBL_WS_SURBL=10, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id n5AFeOjz+l4d for ; Fri, 7 Nov 2008 09:35:37 -0800 (PST) Received: from host157-230-dynamic.30-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it (host250-37-dynamic.7-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it [79.7.37.250]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B1BB13A67FD for ; Fri, 7 Nov 2008 09:35:34 -0800 (PST) To: Subject: confirm please From: MIME-Version: 1.0 Importance: High Content-Type: text/html Message-Id: <20081107173534.B1BB13A67FD@core3.amsl.com> Date: Fri, 7 Nov 2008 09:35:34 -0800 (PST)
Click Here!
About this mailing:
You are receiving this e-mail because you subscribed to MSN Featured Offers. Microsoft respects your privacy. If you do not wish to receive this MSN Featured Offers e-mail, please click the "Unsubscribe" link below. This will not unsubscribe you from e-mail communications from third-party advertisers that may appear in MSN Feature Offers. This shall not constitute an offer by MSN. MSN shall not be responsible or liable for the advertisers' content nor any of the goods or service advertised. Prices and item availability subject to change without notice.

?2008 Microsoft | Unsubscribe | More Newsletters | Privacy

Microsoft Corporation, One Microsoft Way, Redmond, WA 98052
From MAILER-DAEMON Thu Nov 13 11:27:00 2008 Return-Path: <> X-Original-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B515B3A69CB for ; Thu, 13 Nov 2008 11:27:00 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: 4.907 X-Spam-Level: **** X-Spam-Status: No, score=4.907 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_50=0.001, DATE_IN_PAST_96_XX=1.69, FUZZY_XPILL=1.746, HELO_EQ_RU=0.595, HOST_EQ_RU=0.875] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id gPStiJaqxgcO for ; Thu, 13 Nov 2008 11:26:59 -0800 (PST) Received: from www.e-guns.ru (d748.colo.hc.ru [79.174.68.4]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D3E8B3A69C5 for ; Thu, 13 Nov 2008 11:26:58 -0800 (PST) Received: from mailnull by www.e-guns.ru with local (Exim 4.63) id 1KWLPS-0002un-O7 for rserpool-archive@ietf.org; Fri, 22 Aug 2008 05:25:50 +0400 X-Failed-Recipients: ppbaikal@www.e-guns.ru Auto-Submitted: auto-replied From: Mail Delivery System To: rserpool-archive@ietf.org Subject: Mail delivery failed: returning message to sender Message-Id: Date: Fri, 22 Aug 2008 05:25:50 +0400 X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - www.e-guns.ru X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - ietf.org X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [47 12] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - This message was created automatically by mail delivery software. A message that you sent could not be delivered to one or more of its recipients. This is a permanent error. The following address(es) failed: ppbaikal@www.e-guns.ru (generated from yurin@baikal.udm.ru) retry timeout exceeded ------ This is a copy of the message, including all the headers. ------ Return-path: Received: from [210.102.205.22] by www.e-guns.ru with esmtp (Exim 4.63) (envelope-from ) id 1KWLPK-0002i7-2k for yurin@baikal.udm.ru; Fri, 22 Aug 2008 05:25:50 +0400 Received: from [210.102.205.22] by mail.ietf.org; Fri, 22 Aug 2008 10:25:42 +0900 Date: Fri, 22 Aug 2008 10:25:42 +0900 From: =?koi8-r?B?98/XwQ==?= X-Mailer: The Bat! (v3.0.1.33) Home Reply-To: rserpool-archive@ietf.org X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Message-ID: <132935788.20260333465242@ietf.org> To: yurin@baikal.udm.ru Subject: =?koi8-r?B?9drOwdTYINDPzc/WxdQgxsnOwc7Tz9fZyiDBzsHMydog?= MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----------6E6705348DAF2991" X-Spam-Status: No, score= X-Spam-Score: X-Spam-Bar: X-Spam-Flag: NO ------------6E6705348DAF2991 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=koi8-r Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Теория и практика финансового анализа для руководителей и специалистовг. Москва Дата проведения: 26-27.O8.O8 Продолжительность: 2 дняСеминар ориентирован на: Руководителей компаний, руководящий состав связанный или занимающийся планово-экономической деятельностью, специалистов ориентированных на управление финансами, частных предпринимателей, собственников, инвесторов, руководителей и менеджеров кредитных организаций, специалистов органов государственного управления. Специалистов и ТОП менеджеров, осуществляющих принятие решений, по краткосрочному долгосрочному кредитованию предприятий, инвестированию, поиском партнеров, сотрудников которые занимаются подготовкой внутренней и внешней финансовой документации, руководителей и сотрудников которые занимаются ежедневным планированием деятельности собственного предприятия.Краткая информация о предстоящем мероприятии: Назначение финансовой информации. Количественные методы. Коэффициентный метод финансового анализа. Относительные показатели рентабельности и прибыльности. Относительные показатели ликвидности. Анализ платежеспособности li> Относительные показатели оборачиваемости. Анализ структуры капитала. Анализ отчета о прибылях и убытках и баланса. Анализ денежных потоков: прямой и косвенный методы. Трехфакторный анализ финансовой устойчивости Отечественная система финансовых коэффициентов.В результате обучения группа приобретет знания и навыки: Умение использовать информационные возможности финансового анализа;Умение приложить его алгоритмы к повседневной практической деятельности; Осознанно применять основные методы количественного анализа к отчетности своей компании; Проводить как качественную, так и количественную оценку Оценивать существующую структуру активов и обязательств компании, отметить явные и скрытые тенденции их изменения;Корректно и сознательно рассчитывать все необходимые финансовые показатели;Осознанно рассматривать существующие и планируемые источники финансирования, оценивать достаточность собственных средств, потребность в заемных средствах и степень связанной с этим финансовой автономии - степень зависимости компании от заемных средств Осуществлять анализ рентабельности и прибыльности своей деятельности; Умение выделять и рассчитать основные показатели, характеризующие рентабельность проекта;Умение выяснить, являются ли обязательствами также и начисленные проценты? Рассчитывать показатели деловой активности, прогнозировать часть из них на предстоящий период и на основе прогноза оценить возможную в будущем краткосрочную платежеспособность; Оценивать деловую активность компании в цифрах;Сопоставить влияние различных факторов на рентабельность и прибыльность, платежеспособность и ликвидность компании;Квалифицированно осуществить учет внешних факторов; Красиво представлять характеристики своей компании - если вы не банкрот, то у вас есть что показать и есть чем гордиться! Провести, кстати, и экспресс-анализ возможности банкротства. Ведь это позволит ярче увидеть те аспекты, которые требуют особого вниманияУмение в выгодном свете представить показатели своей компании потенциальному кредитору, тендерному комитету или конкурсной комиссии. За более подробной информацuей обpащайтеcь по тел: (Ч95) 7Ч2-91-98, 967-68227B6WL2 ------------6E6705348DAF2991 Content-Type: text/html; charset=koi8-r Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit

Теория и практика финансового анализа для руководителей и специалистов

г. Москва
Дата проведения: 26-27.O8.O8
Продолжительность: 2 дня

Семинар ориентирован на:
Руководителей компаний, руководящий состав связанный или занимающийся планово-экономической деятельностью, специалистов ориентированных на управление финансами, частных предпринимателей, собственников, инвесторов, руководителей и менеджеров кредитных организаций, специалистов органов государственного управления. Специалистов и ТОП менеджеров, осуществляющих принятие решений, по краткосрочному долгосрочному кредитованию предприятий, инвестированию, поиском партнеров, сотрудников которые занимаются подготовкой внутренней и внешней финансовой документации, руководителей и сотрудников которые занимаются ежедневным планированием деятельности собственного предприятия.

Краткая информация о предстоящем мероприятии:

  • Назначение финансовой информации.
  • Количественные методы.
  • Коэффициентный метод финансового анализа.
  • Относительные показатели рентабельности и прибыльности.
  • Относительные показатели ликвидности. Анализ платежеспособности
    • li> Относительные показатели оборачиваемости.
  • Анализ структуры капитала.
  • Анализ отчета о прибылях и убытках и баланса.
  • Анализ денежных потоков: прямой и косвенный методы.
  • Трехфакторный анализ финансовой устойчивости
  • Отечественная система финансовых коэффициентов.

    • В результате обучения группа приобретет знания и навыки:

  • Умение использовать информационные возможности финансового анализа;
  • Умение приложить его алгоритмы к повседневной практической деятельности;
  • Осознанно применять основные методы количественного анализа к отчетности своей компании;
    Проводить как качественную, так и количественную оценку
  • Оценивать существующую структуру активов и обязательств компании, отметить явные и скрытые тенденции их изменения;
  • Корректно и сознательно рассчитывать все необходимые финансовые показатели;
  • Осознанно рассматривать существующие и планируемые источники финансирования, оценивать достаточность собственных средств, потребность в заемных средствах и степень связанной с этим финансовой автономии - степень зависимости компании от заемных средств
  • Осуществлять анализ рентабельности и прибыльности своей деятельности;
  • Умение выделять и рассчитать основные показатели, характеризующие рентабельность проекта;
  • Умение выяснить, являются ли обязательствами также и начисленные проценты?
  • Рассчитывать показатели деловой активности, прогнозировать часть из них на предстоящий период и на основе прогноза оценить возможную в будущем краткосрочную платежеспособность;
  • Оценивать деловую активность компании в цифрах;
  • Сопоставить влияние различных факторов на рентабельность и прибыльность, платежеспособность и ликвидность компании;
  • Квалифицированно осуществить учет внешних факторов;
  • Красиво представлять характеристики своей компании - если вы не банкрот, то у вас есть что показать и есть чем гордиться!
  • Провести, кстати, и экспресс-анализ возможности банкротства. Ведь это позволит ярче увидеть те аспекты, которые требуют особого внимания
  • Умение в выгодном свете представить показатели своей компании потенциальному кредитору, тендерному комитету или конкурсной комиссии.

    • За более подробной информацuей обpащайтеcь по тел: (Ч95) 7Ч2-91-98, 967-6822

    7B6WL2

    ------------6E6705348DAF2991-- From rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Fri Nov 14 13:15:07 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rserpool-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A161B3A6A35; Fri, 14 Nov 2008 13:15:07 -0800 (PST) X-Original-To: rserpool@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: rserpool@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4559E28C14A for ; Fri, 14 Nov 2008 13:15:06 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.138 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.138 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, MY_CID_AND_ARIAL2=1.46] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id qpozwOTGdtdd for ; Fri, 14 Nov 2008 13:15:05 -0800 (PST) Received: from hicks.ciena.com (hicks.ciena.com [63.118.34.22]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EB45E3A635F for ; Fri, 14 Nov 2008 13:15:04 -0800 (PST) X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: ApwEAPZ4HUk/dicV/2dsb2JhbACCcI8ovk2CeQ X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.3790.4325 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Fri, 14 Nov 2008 16:15:02 -0500 Message-ID: <0AFD1B67B949784DA087CDA9F0DD4AD94848B6@mdmxm03.ciena.com> In-Reply-To: <200810300850.42553.dreibh@iem.uni-due.de> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [Rserpool] WG Last Call on the Rserpool MIB draft thread-index: Ack6exNL4dmaJgxGTEuNrYiTWRPyfQMItR1A References: <0AFD1B67B949784DA087CDA9F0DD4AD9355F33@mdmxm03.ciena.com> <490898F1.9030004@ericsson.com> <042647A3-2E97-4F2B-BBF1-DD8811939479@lurchi.franken.de> <200810300850.42553.dreibh@iem.uni-due.de> Importance: normal Priority: normal From: "Ong, Lyndon" To: "Thomas Dreibholz" , Cc: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Michael_T=FCxen?= Subject: Re: [Rserpool] WG Last Call on the Rserpool MIB draft X-BeenThere: rserpool@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Reliable Server Pooling List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============0888177326==" Sender: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --===============0888177326== Content-class: urn:content-classes:message Content-Type: multipart/related; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_78839_01C94674.271BE520" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_78839_01C94674.271BE520 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C9469E.0FB1ACFB" ------_=_NextPart_001_01C9469E.0FB1ACFB Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Thomas, =20 When do you think you will have an updated draft of the MIB with the = missing parameter? I believe this was the only comment in WG Last Call. =20 Thanks, =20 Lyndon =20 ________________________________ From: Thomas Dreibholz [mailto:dreibh@iem.uni-due.de]=20 Sent: Thursday, October 30, 2008 12:51 AM To: rserpool@ietf.org Cc: Michael T=C3=BCxen; Magnus Westerlund; Ong, Lyndon Subject: Re: [Rserpool] WG Last Call on the Rserpool MIB draft =20 On Mittwoch, 29. Oktober 2008, Michael T=C3=BCxen wrote: > The document looks OK to me except for one thing: >=20 > It looks like poolElementEntry does not provide support > for the Opaque transport parameter. Dear all, this parameter is still missing. I will add it to the MIB. Best regards --=20 =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D Dr. Thomas Dreibholz University of Duisburg-Essen, Room ES210 Inst. for Experimental Mathematics Ellernstra=C3=9Fe 29 Computer Networking Technology Group D-45326 Essen/Germany ----------------------------------------------------------------------- E-Mail: dreibh@iem.uni-due.de Homepage: http://www.iem.uni-due.de/~dreibh =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D ------_=_NextPart_001_01C9469E.0FB1ACFB Content-Type: text/html; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

    Hi = Thomas,

     

    When do you think you will have an = updated draft of the MIB with the missing parameter?  I believe this was = the only comment in WG Last Call.

     

    Thanks,

    =

     

    Lyndon

     


    BORDER=3D"0"

    From: Thomas Dreibholz [mailto:dreibh@iem.uni-due.de]
    Sent: Thursday, October = 30, 2008 12:51 AM
    To: rserpool@ietf.org
    Cc: Michael T=C3=BCxen; = Magnus Westerlund; Ong, Lyndon
    Subject: Re: [Rserpool] = WG Last Call on the Rserpool MIB draft

     

    On = Mittwoch, 29. Oktober 2008, Michael T=C3=BCxen wrote:

    > The document looks OK to me except for one = thing:

    > 

    > It looks like poolElementEntry does not provide = support

    > for the Opaque transport parameter.

    Dear all,

    this parameter is still missing. I will add it = to the MIB.

    Best regards

    --

    =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D<= o:p>

    Dr. Thomas Dreibholz

    University of Duisburg-Essen, Room = ES210

    Inst. for Experimental Mathematics Ellernstra=C3=9Fe = 29

    Computer Networking Technology Group D-45326 = Essen/Germany

    -----------------------------------------------------------------= ------

    E-Mail: dreibh@iem.uni-due.de

    Homepage: http://www.iem.uni-due.de/~dreibh

    =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D<= o:p>


    ------_=_NextPart_001_01C9469E.0FB1ACFB-- ------=_NextPart_000_78839_01C94674.271BE520 Content-Type: image/gif Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Content-ID: R0lGODlh3AAeAPcAANINQfb29uiCnuqVq9AALPXb4vLBzCopFcsAGbOyq+dmc8nJxeJig8gAB/3/ //TS2/r2+Pr5+eydsuZ8mauqo++0w2JiVBgXAuVyke6qvGtqXdMSRru6s/z///np7dEIPtrZ1vG9 y4yLgfru8dXU0kxKOtEANfz5+kNCMdMQRNLRzuFVeu2htFpaTPfh6NAAMdw6ZfLE0fjl6umNps8A LeTk4tQUSVNSQzw7Kfr19u6luc4AKfTO2fC1xPGqspyblIWEeuHh3s0AJdoyWc7OytosWd5BbPLx 8ZaVjHZ1aXt6bvn39+FZfunq6dglU6alnuHh4MXGwds0YYKBdvz8/NIFPDUzIc8AMPGzus0AIOh+ mtAAA9IKQAMCAMLCvfTK1d5JcuFSdNUEF9orVeno5umFoPTM1pSUitgeUOqKpPry9u7u7L6+uPnx 8vXW36KhmXJxZSMiDn18cd7d2ubm5N9SedUNQt/f3Od5l/fe5Pfi5uNmiMTEvuNqidEAOO+jqvz+ /JKRiNUbR+JdgdMRRe3s65iXjtIUNaCfl9IEOueAnOVWZeRpivff5dcbTdckTdjX0/PI0+VvjdMO Q7e1sNYYTNIAOJGQhtrb2I+OhdQKQGZlWOzr6nh3a9YSQuqKo9ECOmBfUKWjneRpjP39/szMxjk5 J9ICOPT08/Dw7/Xz9eRwj4mJfz8+LcDAutMSRdMQRjIxH9MQQW5tX4iGe9DPy2loW0JAMP36/OBO dOqPp6ion6Sim/PM18jHwt09Z5mZj15dTtMUR9ICO9ACOVhXSNMEPEdFNh4dCcwAHy8uGzc2JcTD vvz19//9/4B/dNzb2ZSTidIBO/f39rCvqdYYQ1BPP++xwPv7/NQANueMo8/RzdfY1Ofo5Orn50lI OdEDO+yYr/C4xlBOP7i3sfz9/FdZSFpXR/Cuwf78/dAEMdIHNhAOAOLk4P7//uPj4NggUfDv7tkn V+qRqO6dpfv7+pOUi8jIxOZ3lN9IbqOjm+6uv8vKxudwhKmooP///yH5BAAAAAAALAAAAADcAB4A AAj/AP8JHEiw4MAObUgZXMiwocOHECNKnEixosWLGDO6YSRlRYyMIEOKHEmypEmLjdAkI5CsiriT MGPKnEkzpDtFLTcQQpDPQc2fQIMKJemuDoFXr2zsKAJhqNOnUKP+u4mgig1YCHL5lMq1q9eRMuQh GAvg49ezaNM+dIEnzJ5IauPKjeqg7taK7to84MHDxV2I7upCtOvA3dzDQiOEmMGI0Z49M67JmCpj RLMRMk4sjMHEBpdJmiaBMUDQRYwvZr4Y8PDPATp8DBjNK1DQHSAZPebh2zOKkRYWehALj+lAghQT O2hcoUFjBwJJ/x7Iq1QEnqMKBTvgeyHkhZ/vJrqH/xs4IZudFKcIXHO3gkByAkI0jReYLlw+eC+S X1nunhCepsMFGBI2gwixAzgATDJJCilMggAT//QCH3JCsECQA0xkYcIkGwhDyAYbyJKFHW4IhAEB JoDywgur1CGEHwpOAkByGQjkQiUImPBBggvKyAUNCPyihoBEWtQBEzl+COIkXHCRQjJ9RGeHHxt8 YEmNArmDRxangEgIOMpxUaUQihimhSWEpLmBDcN8kIIwOoEohDxDuiCPCQBwUUUibU4C5wbEIDBK kYRKJEEWoAjzygaTmHDFii80sIKUVFqJ5T8GmPDCoim8oMkKYFQxCSHJ1GEmmmoCoOkVfnxIiDCg mP8Qwj8u2JAMcx94AksiL4j5KgGy0FbosAudMIQQHm7wIzwT6KDDDGNA9wAAlV6ZJRNCpKATDWjM +g8DeJZ6apqEpGCCI3sw4sgLrnJxhS7/5FHEL5/sE8MDDxgArpgbVPGChcQGPFAMO8Dy4SQvMMHa QJf9w8OUVVqyj0AyVPMCiCac8pJA87C6QxnjEvKKH5WQ9k8kaJiQ5iQ0aPFPOY0wNAgNIAJAgACG CRzwADt4SMgVUkTAkBkQc2ECwNeYAA6jNICx1QnH0eCJsGeKDAANqxA0wQ5isqzIQA7EUAYDKzDw SS8CvMDhjDjrHPAeJix69QQNEU3lJASUIVAaBHD/IQwAV2Q9FSMvIKe3QFUrS8AABM3DNdNf/xMD DCvusIOB0mzA4AY2t+32sODK/QK8Q0/5yiRXHC7ADgCcvsOk/2BQuBAr3JU4FwTMkPM/aQjRNQ0C /POFMS8m+AIN8F2RbOe7w9T85yetcvHpNEBXuh+np87xFb6+4IQ4DBDwQhYwAIg4morrPlDvXef+ jxFZaEuIJVIoopsUxmjLPEYj/IFFOQypxSZqwRV+2OIeJinFEwJQEF50ggxe4MBEJICsD5nABl8o 3SnStAPrheAUidBJCmDxgUfRIBdtKMjtcrc79nGOBhIYgSbiRgg/yGNh/9DBDtZ2s+dJpB6L2MIW /+hBkHiIoBT/oEYXKCESciDBhxHxRxcQYZJNsIMEBQnGBXzxjVYohCBP8MdCeNA3nRDiBfDYh2am wpd/mEETrdqACYqQg38AoghXUFMKuGAMG2iDIF8AmQDQhzv17c13jLoCC3phDGmU6wV7IMge8si5 Hl4kD2LYQgMWcRdqsCMJ/2ADMngBgiYIZAnMIGARydAEftBBIJxgwxz+sYRxIKMUR4AGLv4BhRr8 IwCYEEgp+CC0I9BhDZj4ATIS8A9MQAMbA1lCFBaQDlV0owlReMdAVOCFIwxkAQtI4hSgyQ9XLOEf cDjAO/xhiKkwgx//IMMylgEJZxSkHDDIApweaf+CX/ShDwxQx6T0YAOVpckEdQjBPqSAPTPWEAYe 6IAHQqAFddDgBGkgJAvXh0jUseABxhjGK+ZXBBe0RgJ+WFolPVcRB/RjC2LwwUDucIw4KMMebDhA Kw5wA1TEwwKtwEE7ByKKW5TgANaYBhGsgYJvsEEfB4hDKEQQCwr8owQl+McZSgCCKcQBGcFYQwJu cYxxKOEWXkhAHH6QsxrYYhlW4AMFjvGNOJhiG/9AwjFuYQFUOGMWF0DGG5CggWkYogStCAUqgKCM d0QDCAFIZwmoAYSoctUgGcgCDWwQpw/QIAvJEEIDGPCPDsBgBx96BQAKlz/NyY9BhBCEEx6RiCv/ NOAQvDuF3Da6N64Jg2USyIEmXuAhczmBEXX4zgZ2GzyMUCESZiDINAJxAA2AwAsXSIISLiAKVrBD CSjogisGcokuaCAJyDDEJuLAijgcwBehiEUCIHGAYnDgqxz4hgUygYwpKFMOP+jCDdiAiFaYIxab WMNAdtEFFDxjGmfIrj6kSok4FGMWXWDFJdgxBWDUwhZxwIYontEJdlCDFVaYQwvGkQB2WEEENSDC LW5BgVQYxB0TQMAO3iSMHtvABpUQAmn/EY4ssKvHwvhAFT6Qnx184FV/MwENXnAFEzRgCA4oAyF3 YMh/fMLJL0zDP+qAgA/0+IzweZHmKqm3POgA/4cgaccy/8GHC2jTFEAIxQFYkQQckGMg9rhADZqA Alsc4xhIaMEN/kGLWwgECQfAgQVacAtTEGEWyxBIKMYRjVjMkhmxCCw0CNKNJBSjGFFAAg4K8Y9O WEEDB7AFEIoBBMQORAmtuAMQkiCCZeiDFqaAwixCEYBnWOMcEmzBJhriDgGoYyVKA0UiTmHlMBjG AYMI7aM0RQMhVCEXv8iCEFhVhSr4gTvrGMQD/iGJZOwAPg1orkAm0IBkXEG0GPiHHpygYxNUARQ7 yII88vlu0eLhH/gwAekmEgH//UUF7DgGCJR4D1RcgBW0YIcInpEJBgpEDl24QxDikIT1vqETT//4 hwa6YIgIkAEZXUhAILqgjH8Ygh1AQAIy5CACdnDjH0/gcAmUgUWBHOEHnehCC0SgDCVQIA4WuG8o gPEMMoigC0D4gQosYApDdCEJwGAHEpSADBLcwNG8wHAr/nEDZOiDEw2JxCAEkQ0/WMISeBrDpTow DynIQhMAEMQvJhADdzRDF373gwnMU4RVwEUg4ZCCEYwAgyLoYHc6kMcvjPCLIkjARgwQBLUtUQ0m NCIE86K85XNohI1J5AQKEOIfdneETXTBFuRQxj28YQUKTCMUprBCIAgSCGVAAwQoeMIdvoGDW0hw F4Hlwz82cQBO0LcT/4iABpBxgWAEwB/KwCv/NYjuiu8OpBTHwMEBKPEDK7QCGcpQgc1NkdhzWoAd 7EDEFG6ggmJ8QwPLsAuZcAvcAAebQALWEAuxQEU3Fwfyx2y44Sw6cA1uoAbPowYF8AV9YT4C0Qxu UAEskAEPMAIFcQJtAAFLkAMjsEsDcQIjkAMQAAEjsEatIQMGwAIVkAeG4Q4jgIIqqBmAMAJQ1BCY JEScRBCqsAAgQArtoBBBMA2/NE02NhBHEARTUQNQyAleoAJC4w4g4Auo8A/GJBA14HHlUAv8AIXT AAVU8A/TYIX/cAd38EXTQAJeMEuBEAscAA1w+A8kwAe+9A9UsABEMA2o0A1ieA930AT1oAqvL7QG hUAF3OAKsySIKsAPQgM9J+EAsRdTOkMLB0AEmjgsJ4AFITCERAIJlGBKThEQADs= ------=_NextPart_000_78839_01C94674.271BE520-- --===============0888177326== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ rserpool mailing list rserpool@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rserpool --===============0888177326==-- From rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Fri Nov 14 13:23:28 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rserpool-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3291C28C10D; Fri, 14 Nov 2008 13:23:28 -0800 (PST) X-Original-To: rserpool@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: rserpool@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A2A7428C10D for ; Fri, 14 Nov 2008 13:23:26 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.248 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.248 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_DE=0.35, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id pjU6H3zSP5Tu for ; Fri, 14 Nov 2008 13:23:25 -0800 (PST) Received: from mailout.uni-due.de (mailout.uni-due.de [132.252.185.19]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6C99D28C103 for ; Fri, 14 Nov 2008 13:23:25 -0800 (PST) Received: from lupo.localnet (p57BA4B0A.dip.t-dialin.net [87.186.75.10]) (authenticated bits=0) by mailout.uni-due.de (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id mAELNDg1032622 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT); Fri, 14 Nov 2008 22:23:14 +0100 From: Thomas Dreibholz Organization: University of Duisburg-Essen, Institute for Experimental Mathematics To: "Ong, Lyndon" Date: Fri, 14 Nov 2008 22:22:59 +0100 User-Agent: KMail/1.10.3 (Linux/2.6.27-7-generic; KDE/4.1.3; i686; ; ) References: <0AFD1B67B949784DA087CDA9F0DD4AD9355F33@mdmxm03.ciena.com> <200810300850.42553.dreibh@iem.uni-due.de> <0AFD1B67B949784DA087CDA9F0DD4AD94848B6@mdmxm03.ciena.com> In-Reply-To: <0AFD1B67B949784DA087CDA9F0DD4AD94848B6@mdmxm03.ciena.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <200811142223.06525.dreibh@iem.uni-due.de> X-Spam-Scanned: SpamAssassin: 3.002004 - http://www.spamassassin.org X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.57 on 132.252.185.19 Cc: Michael =?iso-8859-1?q?T=FCxen?= , rserpool@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Rserpool] WG Last Call on the Rserpool MIB draft X-BeenThere: rserpool@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Reliable Server Pooling List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============0980248409==" Sender: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org --===============0980248409== Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="nextPart1851269.LtFf4CxTgO"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; micalg=pgp-sha1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit --nextPart1851269.LtFf4CxTgO Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary-00=_2weHJ4hGvaGcJc6" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline --Boundary-00=_2weHJ4hGvaGcJc6 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-15" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Freitag, 14. November 2008, Ong, Lyndon wrote: > Hi Thomas, > > When do you think you will have an updated draft of the MIB with the > missing parameter? I believe this was the only comment in WG Last Call. Dear Lyndon, the draft is ready. The I-D submission tool will be reopened at midnight,=20 2008-11-17, so I can submit version 08 on Monday. Best regards =2D-=20 =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D Dr. Thomas Dreibholz University of Duisburg-Essen, Room ES210 Inst. for Experimental Mathematics Ellernstra=DFe 29 Computer Networking Technology Group D-45326 Essen/Germany =2D---------------------------------------------------------------------- E-Mail: dreibh@iem.uni-due.de Homepage: http://www.iem.uni-due.de/~dreibh =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D --Boundary-00=_2weHJ4hGvaGcJc6 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-15" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

    On Freitag,= 14. November 2008, Ong, Lyndon wrote:

    > Hi Tho= mas,

    >

    > When d= o you think you will have an updated draft of the MIB with the

    > missin= g parameter? I believe this was the only comment in WG Last Call.

    Dear Lyndon= ,

    the draft i= s ready. The I-D submission tool will b= e reopened at midnight, 2008-11-17, so I can submit version 08 on Monday.

    Best regard= s

    --

    =3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D

    Dr. Thomas= Dreibholz

    University= of Duisburg-Essen, Room ES210

    Inst. for = Experimental Mathematics Ellernstra=DFe 29

    Computer N= etworking Technology Group D-45326 Essen/Germany

    -----------= =2D-----------------------------------------------------------

    E-Mail: = dreibh@iem.uni-due.de

    Homepage: = http://www.iem.uni-due.de/~dreibh

    =3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D

    --Boundary-00=_2weHJ4hGvaGcJc6-- --nextPart1851269.LtFf4CxTgO Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name=signature.asc Content-Description: This is a digitally signed message part. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (GNU/Linux) iEYEABECAAYFAkkd7DYACgkQ32BbsHYPLWUE/ACgp6BmlNGlqUDSpieaklchNLgs 47AAoJKiUqzi/RHttlZcYH5dPE3zejtU =7o4h -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --nextPart1851269.LtFf4CxTgO-- --===============0980248409== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ rserpool mailing list rserpool@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rserpool --===============0980248409==-- From rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Tue Nov 18 07:15:04 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rserpool-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 62E0928C0EC; Tue, 18 Nov 2008 07:15:04 -0800 (PST) X-Original-To: rserpool@ietf.org Delivered-To: rserpool@core3.amsl.com Received: by core3.amsl.com (Postfix, from userid 0) id 1EBE53A6948; Tue, 18 Nov 2008 07:15:02 -0800 (PST) From: Internet-Drafts@ietf.org To: i-d-announce@ietf.org Content-Type: Multipart/Mixed; Boundary="NextPart" Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <20081118151502.1EBE53A6948@core3.amsl.com> Date: Tue, 18 Nov 2008 07:15:02 -0800 (PST) Cc: rserpool@ietf.org Subject: [Rserpool] I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-rserpool-mib-08.txt X-BeenThere: rserpool@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Reliable Server Pooling List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org --NextPart A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Reliable Server Pooling Working Group of the IETF. Title : Reliable Server Pooling: Management Information Base using SMIv2 Author(s) : T. Dreibholz, J. Mulik Filename : draft-ietf-rserpool-mib-08.txt Pages : 41 Date : 2008-11-18 RSerPool [RFC5351] is a framework to provide reliable server pooling. This document defines a SMIv2 compliant Management Information Base (MIB) providing access to managed objects in an RSerPool implementation. A URL for this Internet-Draft is: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-rserpool-mib-08.txt Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ Below is the data which will enable a MIME compliant mail reader implementation to automatically retrieve the ASCII version of the Internet-Draft. --NextPart Content-Type: Message/External-body; name="draft-ietf-rserpool-mib-08.txt"; site="ftp.ietf.org"; access-type="anon-ftp"; directory="internet-drafts" Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: <2008-11-18071408.I-D@ietf.org> --NextPart Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ rserpool mailing list rserpool@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rserpool --NextPart-- From rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Tue Nov 18 08:13:22 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rserpool-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BD77D3A6A66; Tue, 18 Nov 2008 08:13:22 -0800 (PST) X-Original-To: rserpool@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: rserpool@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 11A853A6A30 for ; Tue, 18 Nov 2008 08:13:20 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: 0.351 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.351 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_50=0.001, HELO_EQ_DE=0.35] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id oB3AxEd9b1o0 for ; Tue, 18 Nov 2008 08:13:18 -0800 (PST) Received: from mailout.uni-due.de (mailout.uni-due.de [132.252.185.19]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 222213A69CF for ; Tue, 18 Nov 2008 08:13:17 -0800 (PST) Received: from webmail.uni-duisburg-essen.de (lx11-hrz.uni-duisburg.de [134.91.4.52]) by mailout.uni-due.de (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id mAIGDEY0032431 for ; Tue, 18 Nov 2008 17:13:15 +0100 X-Squirrel-UserHash: BgxVQxBY X-Squirrel-FromHash: XF0DEEFcQUY= Message-ID: <1817.XF0DEEFcQUY=.1227024795.squirrel@webmail.uni-duisburg-essen.de> Date: Tue, 18 Nov 2008 17:13:15 +0100 (CET) From: "Thomas Dreibholz" To: rserpool@ietf.org User-Agent: SquirrelMail/1.4.8-4.0.1.el4 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Importance: Normal X-Spam-Scanned: SpamAssassin: 3.002004 - http://www.spamassassin.org X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.57 on 132.252.185.19 Subject: [Rserpool] Updated RSerPool MIB draft X-BeenThere: rserpool@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list Reply-To: dreibh@iem.uni-due.de List-Id: Reliable Server Pooling List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Sender: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org RGVhciBhbGwsCgp2ZXJzaW9uIDA4IG9mIHRoZSBNSUIgZHJhZnQgYWRkcyB0aGUgb3BhcXVlIHRy YW5zcG9ydCBwYXJhbWV0ZXIgdG8gdGhlClJTZXJQb29sIE1JQi4gRnVydGhlcm1vcmUsIHRoZSBy ZWZlcmVuY2VzIGhhdmUgYmVlbiB1cGRhdGVkLgoKQW55IGNvbW1lbnRzPwoKCkJlc3QgcmVnYXJk cwotLSAKPT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09 PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT0KIERyLiBUaG9tYXMgRHJlaWJob2x6CgogVW5pdmVyc2l0eSBv ZiBEdWlzYnVyZy1Fc3NlbiwgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgUm9vbSBFUzIxMAogSW5zdC4gZm9y IEV4cGVyaW1lbnRhbCBNYXRoZW1hdGljcyAgICAgICAgICAgICAgRWxsZXJuc3RyYcOfZSAyOQog Q29tcHV0ZXIgTmV0d29ya2luZyBUZWNobm9sb2d5IEdyb3VwICAgICAgICAgICAgRC00NTMyNiBF c3Nlbi9HZXJtYW55Ci0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0t LS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tCiBFLU1haWw6ICAgICBkcmVpYmhAZXhwLW1hdGgu dW5pLWVzc2VuLmRlCiBIb21lcGFnZTogICBodHRwOi8vd3d3LmV4cC1tYXRoLnVuaS1lc3Nlbi5k ZS9+ZHJlaWJoCj09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09 PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09PT09CgoKX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19f X19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX18KcnNlcnBvb2wgbWFpbGluZyBsaXN0CnJzZXJwb29sQGlldGYub3Jn Cmh0dHBzOi8vd3d3LmlldGYub3JnL21haWxtYW4vbGlzdGluZm8vcnNlcnBvb2wK From rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Wed Nov 19 03:04:35 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rserpool-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6C2743A684B; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 03:04:35 -0800 (PST) X-Original-To: rserpool@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: rserpool@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E088A3A684B for ; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 03:04:33 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: 0.351 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.351 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_50=0.001, HELO_EQ_DE=0.35] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id mS+QpK0q1VFE for ; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 03:04:33 -0800 (PST) Received: from moutng.kundenserver.de (moutng.kundenserver.de [212.227.126.177]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EC24D3A67B2 for ; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 03:04:32 -0800 (PST) Received: from [132.252.151.243] ([132.252.151.243]) by mrelayeu.kundenserver.de (node=mrelayeu8) with ESMTP (Nemesis) id 0ML31I-1L2krD1fKY-0001v8; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 12:04:30 +0100 Message-ID: <4923F2C1.6030506@dhdt.de> Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2008 12:04:33 +0100 From: Dirk Hoffstadt User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.17 (Windows/20080914) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rserpool@ietf.org X-Enigmail-Version: 0.95.7 X-Provags-ID: V01U2FsdGVkX18+k9FmNwPvkQSwjb2idcB2dpfQFic/tFIHEr4 V1uDz1BTqbA5YYzuOjKIAyZ9krLCTEpVZ8GeAMIJKj75I2JiLr s//dXPRGBz7xyGdDfwmnisMcoEPWUSZ Subject: Re: [Rserpool] Updated RSerPool MIB draft X-BeenThere: rserpool@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Reliable Server Pooling List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org >Dear all, > >version 08 of the MIB draft adds the opaque transport parameter to the >RSerPool MIB. Furthermore, the references have been updated. > >Any comments? Good work! I do not see any problems. Therefore, I suggest to move the document forward. -- Best regards, Dirk Hoffstadt ------------------------------------------------------------------ M.Sc. Dirk Hoffstadt DH Datentechnik 45219 Essen Germany E-Mail: hoffstadt@dhdt.de Internet: http://www.dhdt.de PGP-PublicKey: https://dhdt.de/private/dirkhoffstadt_pubpgp.asc ------------------------------------------------------------------ _______________________________________________ rserpool mailing list rserpool@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rserpool From rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Wed Nov 19 03:13:17 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rserpool-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E24D93A6999; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 03:13:17 -0800 (PST) X-Original-To: rserpool@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: rserpool@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A46C63A68FC for ; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 03:13:16 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.249 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.249 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_DE=0.35] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id go3T5ZXYRelo for ; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 03:13:16 -0800 (PST) Received: from mailout.uni-duisburg-essen.de (mailout.uni-duisburg-essen.de [132.252.185.20]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B37C23A6843 for ; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 03:13:15 -0800 (PST) Received: from [132.252.151.109] ([132.252.151.109]) (authenticated bits=0) by mailout.uni-duisburg-essen.de (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id mAJBD92S007547 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 12:13:12 +0100 From: Nihad Cosic To: rserpool@ietf.org In-Reply-To: <1817.XF0DEEFcQUY=.1227024795.squirrel@webmail.uni-duisburg-essen.de> References: <1817.XF0DEEFcQUY=.1227024795.squirrel@webmail.uni-duisburg-essen.de> Organization: Technik der Rechnernetze Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2008 12:13:10 +0100 Message-Id: <1227093190.7236.12.camel@samson> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Evolution 2.22.3.1 X-Spam-Scanned: SpamAssassin: 3.002004 - http://www.spamassassin.org X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.57 on 132.252.185.20 Subject: Re: [Rserpool] Updated RSerPool MIB draft X-BeenThere: rserpool@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list Reply-To: cosic@iem.uni-due.de List-Id: Reliable Server Pooling List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org On Di, 2008-11-18 at 17:13 +0100, Thomas Dreibholz wrote: > Dear all, > > version 08 of the MIB draft adds the opaque transport parameter to the > RSerPool MIB. Furthermore, the references have been updated. > > Any comments? I have checked the new draft and it seems to be okay for me now. Regards -- ----------------------------------------------------------------- Nihad Cosic Computer and Network Engineer University of Duisburg-Essen Institute for Computer Science and Business Information Systems (ICB) Ellernstr.29 45326 Essen, Germany Tel: +49 (0) 201 183-7651 Fax: +49 (0) 201 183-7673 Mail: cosic at iem.uni-due.de PGP-Key http://tdrwww.iem.uni-due.de/mitarbeiter/cosic/pubkey.asc ----------------------------------------------------------------- _______________________________________________ rserpool mailing list rserpool@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rserpool From rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Wed Nov 19 05:37:46 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rserpool-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7E44B28C11E; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 05:37:46 -0800 (PST) X-Original-To: rserpool@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: rserpool@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EBE2C28C11E for ; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 05:37:45 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.869 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.869 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.731, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id mXcFnHWZwg1V for ; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 05:37:45 -0800 (PST) Received: from hicks.ciena.com (hicks.ciena.com [63.118.34.22]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D7E8C28C11A for ; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 05:37:44 -0800 (PST) X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: ApoEAM2lI0k/dicV/2dsb2JhbADHSwmLJYF7fg X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.3790.4325 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2008 08:37:36 -0500 Message-ID: <0AFD1B67B949784DA087CDA9F0DD4AD9484C4D@mdmxm03.ciena.com> In-Reply-To: <1227093190.7236.12.camel@samson> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [Rserpool] Updated RSerPool MIB draft Thread-Index: AclKOBxM2xC6iZv2QaOA3115ug2TDQAE39xA References: <1817.XF0DEEFcQUY=.1227024795.squirrel@webmail.uni-duisburg-essen.de> <1227093190.7236.12.camel@samson> Importance: normal From: "Ong, Lyndon" Priority: normal To: , Subject: Re: [Rserpool] Updated RSerPool MIB draft X-BeenThere: rserpool@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Reliable Server Pooling List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Hi Folks, Thanks for checking over the updated MIB. To be thorough about it, let's consider this a 1 week Last Call on the updated draft and allow for any further comments until next Tuesday, November 25th. If the draft looks good to everyone I will inform our A-Ds that we believe it is ready for review. Cheers, Lyndon -----Original Message----- From: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:rserpool-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Nihad Cosic Sent: Wednesday, November 19, 2008 3:13 AM To: rserpool@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Rserpool] Updated RSerPool MIB draft On Di, 2008-11-18 at 17:13 +0100, Thomas Dreibholz wrote: > Dear all, > > version 08 of the MIB draft adds the opaque transport parameter to the > RSerPool MIB. Furthermore, the references have been updated. > > Any comments? I have checked the new draft and it seems to be okay for me now. Regards -- ----------------------------------------------------------------- Nihad Cosic Computer and Network Engineer University of Duisburg-Essen Institute for Computer Science and Business Information Systems (ICB) Ellernstr.29 45326 Essen, Germany Tel: +49 (0) 201 183-7651 Fax: +49 (0) 201 183-7673 Mail: cosic at iem.uni-due.de PGP-Key http://tdrwww.iem.uni-due.de/mitarbeiter/cosic/pubkey.asc ----------------------------------------------------------------- _______________________________________________ rserpool mailing list rserpool@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rserpool _______________________________________________ rserpool mailing list rserpool@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rserpool From rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Wed Nov 19 06:01:32 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rserpool-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EEDFB3A6B90; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 06:01:32 -0800 (PST) X-Original-To: rserpool@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: rserpool@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C509E3A6B90 for ; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 06:01:31 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.949 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.949 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=1.300, BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_DE=0.35] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id C6XM8RYeBzOM for ; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 06:01:31 -0800 (PST) Received: from moutng.kundenserver.de (moutng.kundenserver.de [212.227.126.188]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A3FC93A6B8B for ; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 06:01:30 -0800 (PST) Received: from [132.252.151.243] ([132.252.151.243]) by mrelayeu.kundenserver.de (node=mrelayeu8) with ESMTP (Nemesis) id 0ML31I-1L2ncX1an8-0001x9; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 15:01:29 +0100 Message-ID: <49241C3E.2060901@dhdt.de> Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2008 15:01:34 +0100 From: Dirk Hoffstadt User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.17 (Windows/20080914) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rserpool@ietf.org X-Enigmail-Version: 0.95.7 X-Provags-ID: V01U2FsdGVkX19cXdWyOXSO4KtxnA8Ed1M4DXkcANMYj+vS9bZ YKnYLTrPp8j502H42i9UzitWfCbXUK+aJLA4MDrhBqrvmevWfO GcSgvBy36ewpJD3BsUek9jNUr7WCkWJ Subject: [Rserpool] ASAP Handle Resolution Option X-BeenThere: rserpool@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Reliable Server Pooling List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Dear all, What about the draft draft-dreibholz-rserpool-asap-hropt-03 (http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-dreibholz-rserpool-asap-hropt-03) on the ASAP Handle Resolution option to specify the requested number of PE entries to be selected? I think this is a quite useful extension and should also be moved forward. In our deployed RSerPool pool for SimProcTC, we do not need the PU-side handle resolution cache. Therefore, on a handle resolution, the ENRP server should exactly select one PE entry for the SimProcTC PU. ASAP as defined in RFC 5352 lacks of the possibility to specify this. The handle resolution option allows the PU to exactly tell this information to the ENRP server. So, the ENRP server can exactly select the one PE entry for our SimProcPC PU -- while it can provide more entries to PUs actually making use of the PU-side cache. I see a clear need for standardization of such an option, since its functionality is IMHO mandatory for efficient handle resolution. - -- Best regards, Dirk Hoffstadt - ------------------------------------------------------------------ M.Sc. Dirk Hoffstadt DH Datentechnik 45219 Essen Germany E-Mail: hoffstadt@dhdt.de Internet: http://www.dhdt.de PGP-PublicKey: https://dhdt.de/private/dirkhoffstadt_pubpgp.asc - ------------------------------------------------------------------ -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (MingW32) iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJJJBw+AAoJEAl0PP0XKTexS1oH/0V820ZYdH+vLZA8KbaNNY/7 XgJBXwL4D1FGVZUbhUSQtQpBxOB1dV95Wa5eU/c2gRd+TupmUXQB7BpBC/VEGqi+ wCrxmUpIpubSuVZfaZ341ZDnotgsBoXszjaPQWDTzR6UhOG7k67dalBgN53j2B66 qvGuryvRacGVhYT9QM3D5mftNPcUP7dzAJn7ioDBkfVAFkFercPwC8SrPFU/6Dan XCEhVzvS394+vIGN0EohDjsqMIDjQKQZ8NBAYgmXnm70Znyo4sSogHDH9i0QvzDE jWtz7QeBlu7bHrzare2EMNElKiq/v0FX4jUe+TszD+dbP3BE0ijo+FWez0kpaas= =Xreh -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- _______________________________________________ rserpool mailing list rserpool@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rserpool From rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Wed Nov 19 06:17:48 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rserpool-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id AFF623A6B13; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 06:17:48 -0800 (PST) X-Original-To: rserpool@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: rserpool@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2970B3A6B13 for ; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 06:17:48 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.32 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.32 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.929, BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_DE=0.35] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 35RST6wsZjNU for ; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 06:17:47 -0800 (PST) Received: from mailout.uni-due.de (mailout.uni-due.de [132.252.185.19]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id AF6373A6868 for ; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 06:17:46 -0800 (PST) Received: from kappes.local ([132.252.151.151]) (authenticated bits=0) by mailout.uni-due.de (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id mAJEHg6T011274 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 15:17:43 +0100 From: Thomas Dreibholz Organization: University of Duisburg-Essen To: rserpool@ietf.org Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2008 15:17:37 +0100 User-Agent: KMail/1.9.6 (enterprise 0.20070907.709405) References: <49241C3E.2060901@dhdt.de> In-Reply-To: <49241C3E.2060901@dhdt.de> MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <200811191517.41828.dreibh@iem.uni-due.de> X-Spam-Scanned: SpamAssassin: 3.002004 - http://www.spamassassin.org X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.57 on 132.252.185.19 Subject: Re: [Rserpool] ASAP Handle Resolution Option X-BeenThere: rserpool@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Reliable Server Pooling List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============1717914621==" Sender: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org --===============1717914621== Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="nextPart2093286.l2gIzlP7cF"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; micalg=pgp-sha1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit --nextPart2093286.l2gIzlP7cF Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline On Mittwoch 19 November 2008, Dirk Hoffstadt wrote: > Dear all, > > What about the draft draft-dreibholz-rserpool-asap-hropt-03 > (http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-dreibholz-rserpool-asap-hropt-03) on > the ASAP Handle Resolution option to specify the requested number of PE > entries to be selected? I think this is a quite useful extension and > should also be moved forward. > > In our deployed RSerPool pool for SimProcTC, we do not need the PU-side > handle resolution cache. Therefore, on a handle resolution, the ENRP > server should exactly select one PE entry for the SimProcTC PU. ASAP as > defined in RFC 5352 lacks of the possibility to specify this. The handle > resolution option allows the PU to exactly tell this information to the > ENRP server. So, the ENRP server can exactly select the one PE entry > for our SimProcPC PU -- while it can provide more entries to PUs > actually making use of the PU-side cache. I see a clear need for > standardization of such an option, since its functionality is IMHO > mandatory for efficient handle resolution. Dear Dirk, yes, this option is indeed really useful and I also think it is mandatory f= or=20 efficient RSerPool deployment (and therefore, RSPLIB has it built-in, of=20 course). I did some intensive analysis and performance optimization research on the= =20 RSerPool handlespace management. The results of this work can be found in t= he=20 journal article "An Evalulation of the Pool Maintenance Overhead in Reliabl= e=20 Server Pooling Systems", which has been published in the International=20 Journal of Hybrid Information Technology (IJHIT), Volume 1, Number 2, April= =20 2008. This article is available online here:=20 http://www.sersc.org/journals/IJHIT/vol1_no2_2008/2%20pp%2017-32.pdf . In summary: if the ENRP server has no knowledge on how many PE entries to=20 select upon a PU's request, it will use an - usually - too high fixed=20 setting. In my experience, the PU-side cache is mostly not used (i.e. only = 1=20 PE entry is needed by the PU) to use the most accurate PE state for adaptiv= e=20 policies. But setting the default to 1, it would make the PU-cache useless.= =20 Therefore, if any of the PUs makes use of its cache, an ENRP server's setti= ng=20 must be larger than 1. This implies significant inefficiency for handle=20 resolutions by PUs needing only one entry (waste of ENRP server CPU time an= d=20 waste of bandwidth). This problem will be overcome by the usage of the hand= le=20 resolution option, which lets the PU specify its desired number of PE=20 entries. Best regards =2D-=20 =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D Dr. Thomas Dreibholz University of Duisburg-Essen, Room ES210 Inst. for Experimental Mathematics Ellernstra=DFe 29 Computer Networking Technology Group D-45326 Essen/Germany =2D---------------------------------------------------------------------- E-Mail: dreibh@iem.uni-due.de Homepage: http://www.iem.uni-due.de/~dreibh =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D --nextPart2093286.l2gIzlP7cF Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name=signature.asc Content-Description: This is a digitally signed message part. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQBJJCAF32BbsHYPLWURAjs2AJ9yq46znJ7ValwBcbgiYqoV+9t5ggCdFyLS wyGscj2bQS5ZGRePGibJM9E= =6PF6 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --nextPart2093286.l2gIzlP7cF-- --===============1717914621== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ rserpool mailing list rserpool@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rserpool --===============1717914621==-- From rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Wed Nov 19 06:33:36 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rserpool-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CAC3028C12E; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 06:33:36 -0800 (PST) X-Original-To: rserpool@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: rserpool@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9FFF428C12E for ; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 06:33:35 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.249 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.249 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_DE=0.35] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id y2iLsSImn7NX for ; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 06:33:34 -0800 (PST) Received: from mailout.uni-duisburg-essen.de (mailout.uni-duisburg-essen.de [132.252.185.20]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0EA1628C11E for ; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 06:33:33 -0800 (PST) Received: from [132.252.151.109] ([132.252.151.109]) (authenticated bits=0) by mailout.uni-duisburg-essen.de (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id mAJEXUHF009910 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT) for ; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 15:33:30 +0100 From: Nihad Cosic To: rserpool@ietf.org In-Reply-To: <49241C3E.2060901@dhdt.de> References: <49241C3E.2060901@dhdt.de> Organization: Technik der Rechnernetze Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2008 15:33:33 +0100 Message-Id: <1227105213.7236.20.camel@samson> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Evolution 2.22.3.1 X-Spam-Scanned: SpamAssassin: 3.002004 - http://www.spamassassin.org X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.57 on 132.252.185.20 Subject: Re: [Rserpool] ASAP Handle Resolution Option X-BeenThere: rserpool@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list Reply-To: cosic@iem.uni-due.de List-Id: Reliable Server Pooling List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Sender: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org T24gTWksIDIwMDgtMTEtMTkgYXQgMTU6MDEgKzAxMDAsIERpcmsgSG9mZnN0YWR0IHdyb3RlOgo+ IC0tLS0tQkVHSU4gUEdQIFNJR05FRCBNRVNTQUdFLS0tLS0KPiBIYXNoOiBTSEExCj4gCj4gRGVh ciBhbGwsCj4gCj4gV2hhdCBhYm91dCB0aGUgZHJhZnQgZHJhZnQtZHJlaWJob2x6LXJzZXJwb29s LWFzYXAtaHJvcHQtMDMKPiAoaHR0cDovL3Rvb2xzLmlldGYub3JnL2h0bWwvZHJhZnQtZHJlaWJo b2x6LXJzZXJwb29sLWFzYXAtaHJvcHQtMDMpIG9uCj4gdGhlIEFTQVAgSGFuZGxlIFJlc29sdXRp b24gb3B0aW9uIHRvIHNwZWNpZnkgdGhlIHJlcXVlc3RlZCBudW1iZXIgb2YgUEUKPiBlbnRyaWVz IHRvIGJlIHNlbGVjdGVkPyBJIHRoaW5rIHRoaXMgaXMgYSBxdWl0ZSB1c2VmdWwgZXh0ZW5zaW9u IGFuZAo+IHNob3VsZCBhbHNvIGJlIG1vdmVkIGZvcndhcmQuCj4gCj4gSW4gb3VyIGRlcGxveWVk IFJTZXJQb29sIHBvb2wgZm9yIFNpbVByb2NUQywgd2UgZG8gbm90IG5lZWQgdGhlIFBVLXNpZGUK PiBoYW5kbGUgcmVzb2x1dGlvbiBjYWNoZS4gVGhlcmVmb3JlLCBvbiBhIGhhbmRsZSByZXNvbHV0 aW9uLCB0aGUgRU5SUAo+IHNlcnZlciBzaG91bGQgZXhhY3RseSBzZWxlY3Qgb25lIFBFIGVudHJ5 IGZvciB0aGUgU2ltUHJvY1RDIFBVLiBBU0FQIGFzCj4gZGVmaW5lZCBpbiBSRkMgNTM1MiBsYWNr cyBvZiB0aGUgcG9zc2liaWxpdHkgdG8gc3BlY2lmeSB0aGlzLiBUaGUgaGFuZGxlCj4gcmVzb2x1 dGlvbiBvcHRpb24gYWxsb3dzIHRoZSBQVSB0byBleGFjdGx5IHRlbGwgdGhpcyBpbmZvcm1hdGlv biB0byB0aGUKPiBFTlJQIHNlcnZlci4gU28sIHRoZSBFTlJQICBzZXJ2ZXIgY2FuIGV4YWN0bHkg c2VsZWN0IHRoZSBvbmUgUEUgZW50cnkKPiBmb3Igb3VyIFNpbVByb2NQQyBQVSAtLSB3aGlsZSBp dCBjYW4gcHJvdmlkZSBtb3JlIGVudHJpZXMgdG8gUFVzCj4gYWN0dWFsbHkgbWFraW5nIHVzZSBv ZiB0aGUgUFUtc2lkZSBjYWNoZS4gSSBzZWUgYSBjbGVhciBuZWVkIGZvcgo+IHN0YW5kYXJkaXph dGlvbiBvZiBzdWNoIGFuIG9wdGlvbiwgc2luY2UgaXRzIGZ1bmN0aW9uYWxpdHkgaXMgSU1ITwo+ IG1hbmRhdG9yeSBmb3IgZWZmaWNpZW50IGhhbmRsZSByZXNvbHV0aW9uLgoKRGVhciBEaXJrLAoK ZHVyaW5nIG15IHdvcmsgd2l0aCB0aGUgUlNQTElCIGFuZCBGSCBNw7xuc3RlciBpbXBsZW1lbnRh dGlvbnMsIEkgaGF2ZQphbHNvIGRpc2NvdmVyZWQgdGhpcyBwcm9ibGVtLiBUaGVyZSBpcyBkZWZp bml0ZWx5IHRoZSBuZWVkIGZvciBzdWNoIGFuCm9wdGlvbi4gQW5kIHNpbmNlIHRoZXJlIGFyZSBt dWx0aXBsZSBpbXBsZW1lbnRhdGlvbnMsIEkgYWxzbyBzZWUgdGhlCnN0cm9uZyBuZWVkIHRvIGhh dmUgdGhpcyBvcHRpb24gc3RhbmRhcmRpemVkLiBPdGhlcndpc2UsIGVhY2ggdmVuZG9yCndvdWxk IG1ha2UgaXRzIG93biwgaW5jb21wYXRpYmxlIHJlYWxpemF0aW9uIG9mIHRoaXMgZnVuY3Rpb25h bGl0eS4gVGhpcwpzaXR1YXRpb24gbXVzdCBiZSBhdm9pZGVkLgoKCktpbmQgcmVnYXJkcwoKTmlo YWQgQ29zaWMgCkNvbXB1dGVyIGFuZCBOZXR3b3JrIEVuZ2luZWVyClVuaXZlcnNpdHkgb2YgRHVp c2J1cmctRXNzZW4KSW5zdGl0dXRlIGZvciBDb21wdXRlciBTY2llbmNlIGFuZCBCdXNpbmVzcyBJ bmZvcm1hdGlvbiBTeXN0ZW1zIChJQ0IpCkVsbGVybnN0ci4yOSAKNDUzMjYgRXNzZW4sIEdlcm1h bnkgClRlbDogKzQ5ICgwKSAyMDEgMTgzLTc2NTEgCkZheDogKzQ5ICgwKSAyMDEgMTgzLTc2NzMg Ck1haWw6IGNvc2ljIGF0IGllbS51bmktZHVlLmRlIApQR1AtS2V5IGh0dHA6Ly90ZHJ3d3cuaWVt LnVuaS1kdWUuZGUvbWl0YXJiZWl0ZXIvY29zaWMvcHVia2V5LmFzYwoKX19fX19fX19fX19fX19f X19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX18KcnNlcnBvb2wgbWFpbGluZyBsaXN0CnJz ZXJwb29sQGlldGYub3JnCmh0dHBzOi8vd3d3LmlldGYub3JnL21haWxtYW4vbGlzdGluZm8vcnNl cnBvb2wK From rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Wed Nov 19 06:52:22 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rserpool-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EE88628C113; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 06:52:22 -0800 (PST) X-Original-To: rserpool@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: rserpool@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2B53A28C0F1 for ; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 06:52:21 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.505 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.505 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.745, BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_DE=0.35] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id XlGKuwo+ihib for ; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 06:52:20 -0800 (PST) Received: from mailout.uni-due.de (mailout.uni-due.de [132.252.185.19]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 02C1C3A6BAA for ; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 06:52:19 -0800 (PST) Received: from Latitude ([132.252.151.134]) (authenticated bits=0) by mailout.uni-due.de (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id mAJEqGW2016738 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=NOT) for ; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 15:52:16 +0100 From: "Michael Kohnen" To: References: <1817.XF0DEEFcQUY=.1227024795.squirrel@webmail.uni-duisburg-essen.de> In-Reply-To: <1817.XF0DEEFcQUY=.1227024795.squirrel@webmail.uni-duisburg-essen.de> Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2008 15:52:07 +0100 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.0.6001.18049 Thread-Index: AclJmKNHLEikSUWYRcmqD2tOcOGYPwAvbMhg X-Spam-Scanned: SpamAssassin: 3.002004 - http://www.spamassassin.org X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.57 on 132.252.185.19 Subject: Re: [Rserpool] Updated RSerPool MIB draft X-BeenThere: rserpool@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Reliable Server Pooling List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Sender: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Dear all, I took a look at the MIB. It looks good and should be forwarded. Best regards Michael Kohnen -- = Dipl.-Wirt.-Inf. Michael Kohnen = Lehrstuhl f=FCr Technik der Rechnernetze Institut f=FCr Experimentelle Mathematik und Institut f=FCr Informatik und Wirtschaftsinformatik Universit=E4t Duisburg-Essen, Campus Essen Ellernstr. 29 45326 Essen = Telefon: +49 (201) 183-7636 Fax: +49 (201) 183-7673 E-Mail: Michael.Kohnen@iem.uni-due.de Homepage: http://www.uni-due.de/tdr/ -----Original Message----- From: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:rserpool-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Thomas Dreibholz Sent: Tuesday, November 18, 2008 5:13 PM To: rserpool@ietf.org Subject: [Rserpool] Updated RSerPool MIB draft Dear all, version 08 of the MIB draft adds the opaque transport parameter to the RSerPool MIB. Furthermore, the references have been updated. Any comments? Best regards -- =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D Dr. Thomas Dreibholz University of Duisburg-Essen, Room ES210 Inst. for Experimental Mathematics Ellernstra=DFe 29 Computer Networking Technology Group D-45326 Essen/Germany ----------------------------------------------------------------------- E-Mail: dreibh@exp-math.uni-essen.de Homepage: http://www.exp-math.uni-essen.de/~dreibh =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D _______________________________________________ rserpool mailing list rserpool@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rserpool _______________________________________________ rserpool mailing list rserpool@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rserpool From rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Wed Nov 19 06:58:59 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rserpool-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4BB253A6B9A; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 06:58:59 -0800 (PST) X-Original-To: rserpool@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: rserpool@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9C9B03A6B9A for ; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 06:58:57 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.234 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.234 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.365, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id PxEKU5M1kHz5 for ; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 06:58:56 -0800 (PST) Received: from hicks.ciena.com (hicks.ciena.com [63.118.34.22]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 71F883A6B57 for ; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 06:58:56 -0800 (PST) X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: ApoEAIO4I0k/dicV/2dsb2JhbADTB4J5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.3790.4325 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2008 09:58:52 -0500 Message-ID: <0AFD1B67B949784DA087CDA9F0DD4AD9484C7A@mdmxm03.ciena.com> In-Reply-To: <49241C3E.2060901@dhdt.de> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [Rserpool] ASAP Handle Resolution Option Thread-Index: AclKT1nyJh3I1sJeQKKpf0x8tDOriAAB61OA References: <49241C3E.2060901@dhdt.de> Importance: normal From: "Ong, Lyndon" Priority: normal To: "Dirk Hoffstadt" , Subject: Re: [Rserpool] ASAP Handle Resolution Option X-BeenThere: rserpool@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Reliable Server Pooling List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Hi Folks, Not to pass judgement one way or another on the handle resolution option, but I don't see our A-Ds favoring the creation of a new item on our charter. I believe the most likely direction forward on this is as an individual draft rather than a Working Group activity. I will check with Lars and Magnus, though. Best regards, Lyndon -----Original Message----- From: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:rserpool-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Dirk Hoffstadt Sent: Wednesday, November 19, 2008 6:02 AM To: rserpool@ietf.org Subject: [Rserpool] ASAP Handle Resolution Option -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Dear all, What about the draft draft-dreibholz-rserpool-asap-hropt-03 (http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-dreibholz-rserpool-asap-hropt-03) on the ASAP Handle Resolution option to specify the requested number of PE entries to be selected? I think this is a quite useful extension and should also be moved forward. In our deployed RSerPool pool for SimProcTC, we do not need the PU-side handle resolution cache. Therefore, on a handle resolution, the ENRP server should exactly select one PE entry for the SimProcTC PU. ASAP as defined in RFC 5352 lacks of the possibility to specify this. The handle resolution option allows the PU to exactly tell this information to the ENRP server. So, the ENRP server can exactly select the one PE entry for our SimProcPC PU -- while it can provide more entries to PUs actually making use of the PU-side cache. I see a clear need for standardization of such an option, since its functionality is IMHO mandatory for efficient handle resolution. - -- Best regards, Dirk Hoffstadt - ------------------------------------------------------------------ M.Sc. Dirk Hoffstadt DH Datentechnik 45219 Essen Germany E-Mail: hoffstadt@dhdt.de Internet: http://www.dhdt.de PGP-PublicKey: https://dhdt.de/private/dirkhoffstadt_pubpgp.asc - ------------------------------------------------------------------ -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (MingW32) iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJJJBw+AAoJEAl0PP0XKTexS1oH/0V820ZYdH+vLZA8KbaNNY/7 XgJBXwL4D1FGVZUbhUSQtQpBxOB1dV95Wa5eU/c2gRd+TupmUXQB7BpBC/VEGqi+ wCrxmUpIpubSuVZfaZ341ZDnotgsBoXszjaPQWDTzR6UhOG7k67dalBgN53j2B66 qvGuryvRacGVhYT9QM3D5mftNPcUP7dzAJn7ioDBkfVAFkFercPwC8SrPFU/6Dan XCEhVzvS394+vIGN0EohDjsqMIDjQKQZ8NBAYgmXnm70Znyo4sSogHDH9i0QvzDE jWtz7QeBlu7bHrzare2EMNElKiq/v0FX4jUe+TszD+dbP3BE0ijo+FWez0kpaas= =Xreh -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- _______________________________________________ rserpool mailing list rserpool@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rserpool _______________________________________________ rserpool mailing list rserpool@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rserpool From rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Wed Nov 19 09:03:16 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rserpool-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id ADBEC3A6972; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 09:03:16 -0800 (PST) X-Original-To: rserpool@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: rserpool@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9F92E3A6972 for ; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 09:03:15 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.249 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.249 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_SE=0.35, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id CMVEAn58kOdn for ; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 09:03:14 -0800 (PST) Received: from mailgw4.ericsson.se (mailgw4.ericsson.se [193.180.251.62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8F7A93A67AD for ; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 09:03:14 -0800 (PST) Received: from mailgw4.ericsson.se (unknown [127.0.0.1]) by mailgw4.ericsson.se (Symantec Mail Security) with ESMTP id 457AE20232; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 18:03:12 +0100 (CET) X-AuditID: c1b4fb3e-aff88bb00000537b-a8-492446d08e2f Received: from esealmw129.eemea.ericsson.se (unknown [153.88.254.124]) by mailgw4.ericsson.se (Symantec Mail Security) with ESMTP id 2FCF0204AE; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 18:03:12 +0100 (CET) Received: from esealmw129.eemea.ericsson.se ([153.88.254.177]) by esealmw129.eemea.ericsson.se with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Wed, 19 Nov 2008 18:03:11 +0100 Received: from [153.88.48.181] ([153.88.48.181]) by esealmw129.eemea.ericsson.se with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Wed, 19 Nov 2008 18:03:11 +0100 Message-ID: <492446CD.3050007@ericsson.com> Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2008 11:03:09 -0600 From: Magnus Westerlund User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.17 (Windows/20080914) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Ong, Lyndon" References: <49241C3E.2060901@dhdt.de> <0AFD1B67B949784DA087CDA9F0DD4AD9484C7A@mdmxm03.ciena.com> In-Reply-To: <0AFD1B67B949784DA087CDA9F0DD4AD9484C7A@mdmxm03.ciena.com> X-Enigmail-Version: 0.95.7 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 19 Nov 2008 17:03:11.0486 (UTC) FILETIME=[B41159E0:01C94A68] X-Brightmail-Tracker: AAAAAA== Cc: rserpool@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Rserpool] ASAP Handle Resolution Option X-BeenThere: rserpool@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Reliable Server Pooling List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Sender: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Ong, Lyndon skrev: > Hi Folks, > = > Not to pass judgement one way or another on the handle resolution > option, but I don't see our A-Ds favoring the creation of a new item on > our charter. I believe the most likely direction forward on this is as > an individual draft rather than a Working Group activity. > = > I will check with Lars and Magnus, though. > = Hi, The current plan is to shutdown the WG. It has been clear for quite some long time that the energy level is very low. I intended to keep with the plan to shutdown the WG. I was seriously considering closing the WG already before finishing the MIB. This doesn't prevent that some minor extensions are worked on. I can AD sponsor appropriate documents. But please remember that we one of the reasons for closing the WG is that we don't have a lot of support and we need to see if we get any significant usage before taking up update and extensions work again. So no WG item for this work. Cheers Magnus Westerlund IETF Transport Area Director & TSVWG Chair ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Multimedia Technologies, Ericsson Research EAB/TVM ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Ericsson AB | Phone +46 10 7148287 F=E4r=F6gatan 6 | Mobile +46 73 0949079 SE-164 80 Stockholm, Sweden| mailto: magnus.westerlund@ericsson.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- _______________________________________________ rserpool mailing list rserpool@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rserpool From rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Wed Nov 19 09:32:37 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rserpool-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 15E5D3A6972; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 09:32:37 -0800 (PST) X-Original-To: rserpool@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: rserpool@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0C0413A6972 for ; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 09:32:36 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id x-4Q9Hz0C7XN for ; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 09:32:35 -0800 (PST) Received: from lakerest.net (unknown [IPv6:2001:240:585:2:203:6dff:fe1a:4ddc]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8201A3A6902 for ; Wed, 19 Nov 2008 09:32:34 -0800 (PST) Received: from [130.129.95.183] ([130.129.95.183]) (authenticated bits=0) by lakerest.net (8.14.1/8.14.1) with ESMTP id mAJHUOS2018405 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=NOT); Wed, 19 Nov 2008 12:30:25 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from randall@lakerest.net) DKIM-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=simple/simple; d=lakerest.net; s=mail; t=1227115826; h=Cc:Message-Id:From:To:In-Reply-To:Content-Type: Content-Transfer-Encoding:Mime-Version:Subject:Date:References: X-Mailer; b=EfgIzsp6B6DzBH27Hi7OAgrgarIPPh4Smpu3Sp687v/LnYi/WBY9rL1 397Se95IQbtwKIbM+lm5lGpkNNIij7Q== Message-Id: <34325C6D-B6AF-4B6B-B798-C700899DDB96@lakerest.net> From: Randy Stewart To: Magnus Westerlund In-Reply-To: <492446CD.3050007@ericsson.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v929.2) Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2008 12:30:23 -0500 References: <49241C3E.2060901@dhdt.de> <0AFD1B67B949784DA087CDA9F0DD4AD9484C7A@mdmxm03.ciena.com> <492446CD.3050007@ericsson.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.929.2) Cc: Lyndon Ong , rserpool@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Rserpool] ASAP Handle Resolution Option X-BeenThere: rserpool@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Reliable Server Pooling List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"; Format="flowed"; DelSp="yes" Sender: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Magnus: I really don't understand the usefulness of this extension. What it does, in a nut shell, is allow the PU requester to limit the number of responses he is getting... This can easily be done by: - configuring the ENRP server to limit the number of responses or - configuring the requesting PU side to discard all but the number that he wants. Either way works without changes to the protocol.. R On Nov 19, 2008, at 12:03 PM, Magnus Westerlund wrote: > Ong, Lyndon skrev: >> Hi Folks, >> >> Not to pass judgement one way or another on the handle resolution >> option, but I don't see our A-Ds favoring the creation of a new = >> item on >> our charter. I believe the most likely direction forward on this = >> is as >> an individual draft rather than a Working Group activity. >> >> I will check with Lars and Magnus, though. >> > > Hi, > > The current plan is to shutdown the WG. It has been clear for quite = > some > long time that the energy level is very low. I intended to keep with = > the > plan to shutdown the WG. I was seriously considering closing the WG > already before finishing the MIB. > > This doesn't prevent that some minor extensions are worked on. I can = > AD > sponsor appropriate documents. But please remember that we one of the > reasons for closing the WG is that we don't have a lot of support = > and we > need to see if we get any significant usage before taking up update = > and > extensions work again. > > So no WG item for this work. > > Cheers > > Magnus Westerlund > > IETF Transport Area Director & TSVWG Chair > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > Multimedia Technologies, Ericsson Research EAB/TVM > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > Ericsson AB | Phone +46 10 7148287 > F=E4r=F6gatan 6 | Mobile +46 73 0949079 > SE-164 80 Stockholm, Sweden| mailto: magnus.westerlund@ericsson.com > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > _______________________________________________ > rserpool mailing list > rserpool@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rserpool > ----- Randall Stewart randall@lakerest.net _______________________________________________ rserpool mailing list rserpool@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rserpool From rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Thu Nov 20 00:41:03 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rserpool-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6904A3A6A0D; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 00:41:03 -0800 (PST) X-Original-To: rserpool@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: rserpool@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 769723A6A0D for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 00:41:02 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.249 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.249 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_DE=0.35] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id JchmgpVztSuG for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 00:41:01 -0800 (PST) Received: from mailout.uni-due.de (mailout.uni-due.de [132.252.185.19]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 09C0A3A682D for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 00:41:00 -0800 (PST) Received: from kappes.local ([132.252.151.151]) (authenticated bits=0) by mailout.uni-due.de (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id mAK8eqKL024334 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT); Thu, 20 Nov 2008 09:40:53 +0100 From: Thomas Dreibholz Organization: University of Duisburg-Essen To: rserpool@ietf.org Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2008 09:40:45 +0100 User-Agent: KMail/1.9.6 (enterprise 0.20070907.709405) References: <49241C3E.2060901@dhdt.de> <492446CD.3050007@ericsson.com> <34325C6D-B6AF-4B6B-B798-C700899DDB96@lakerest.net> In-Reply-To: <34325C6D-B6AF-4B6B-B798-C700899DDB96@lakerest.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <200811200940.51779.dreibh@iem.uni-due.de> X-Spam-Scanned: SpamAssassin: 3.002004 - http://www.spamassassin.org X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.57 on 132.252.185.19 Cc: Lyndon Ong Subject: Re: [Rserpool] ASAP Handle Resolution Option X-BeenThere: rserpool@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Reliable Server Pooling List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============1824144819==" Sender: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org --===============1824144819== Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="nextPart5231919.Ess5pXQa3c"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; micalg=pgp-sha1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit --nextPart5231919.Ess5pXQa3c Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline On Mittwoch 19 November 2008, Randy Stewart wrote: > Magnus: > > I really don't understand the usefulness of this extension. > > What it does, in a nut shell, is allow the PU requester to > limit the number of responses he is getting... > > This can easily be done by: > - configuring the ENRP server to limit the number of responses Dear Randy, this does not work for all pools. If there are PUs in the pool which requir= e=20 only 1 PE entry and other PUs in the pool requiring up to 100, the setting= =20 has to be 100. > - configuring the requesting PU side to discard all but the number > that he wants. Then, the ENRP has to unnecessarily select entries, which wastes a lot of=20 processing power and network bandwidth. In summary, it is very inefficient.= =20 =46or details, see the performance evaluation in the journal article "An=20 Evalulation of the Pool Maintenance Overhead in Reliable=20 Server Pooling Systems", which has been published in the International=20 Journal of Hybrid Information Technology (IJHIT), Volume 1, Number 2, April= =20 2008. This article is available online here:=20 http://www.sersc.org/journals/IJHIT/vol1_no2_2008/2%20pp%2017-32.pdf . > Either way works without changes to the protocol. It works, but it is very inefficient. For a useful deployment of RSerPool, = I=20 see this option as being absolutely necessary. Therefore, and since there a= re=20 multiple implementations and people are starting to actually use RSerPool, = I=20 see the need for this document to also become RFC. This will avoid=20 incompatibilities among implementations. Best regards =2D-=20 =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D Dr. Thomas Dreibholz University of Duisburg-Essen, Room ES210 Inst. for Experimental Mathematics Ellernstra=DFe 29 Computer Networking Technology Group D-45326 Essen/Germany =2D---------------------------------------------------------------------- E-Mail: dreibh@iem.uni-due.de Homepage: http://www.iem.uni-due.de/~dreibh =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D --nextPart5231919.Ess5pXQa3c Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name=signature.asc Content-Description: This is a digitally signed message part. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQBJJSKT32BbsHYPLWURApOOAKCbFNNmvRLx0079DluuntCqy9vG6QCgxlVZ DyEEc1lPJoGnMND9sG8/jgo= =x6GS -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --nextPart5231919.Ess5pXQa3c-- --===============1824144819== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ rserpool mailing list rserpool@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rserpool --===============1824144819==-- From rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Thu Nov 20 00:59:59 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rserpool-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E658F3A6979; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 00:59:59 -0800 (PST) X-Original-To: rserpool@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: rserpool@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 554A13A6979 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 00:59:58 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.249 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.249 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_DE=0.35] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id wv5vFMC3yZdr for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 00:59:57 -0800 (PST) Received: from moutng.kundenserver.de (moutng.kundenserver.de [212.227.126.187]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 49F453A6967 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 00:59:57 -0800 (PST) Received: from [132.252.151.243] ([132.252.151.243]) by mrelayeu.kundenserver.de (node=mrelayeu1) with ESMTP (Nemesis) id 0MKwpI-1L35OD2TkB-0003s5; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 09:59:55 +0100 Message-ID: <4925270F.5070509@dhdt.de> Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2008 09:59:59 +0100 From: Dirk Hoffstadt User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.18 (Windows/20081105) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rserpool@ietf.org References: <49241C3E.2060901@dhdt.de> <492446CD.3050007@ericsson.com> <34325C6D-B6AF-4B6B-B798-C700899DDB96@lakerest.net> <200811200940.51779.dreibh@iem.uni-due.de> In-Reply-To: <200811200940.51779.dreibh@iem.uni-due.de> X-Enigmail-Version: 0.95.7 X-Provags-ID: V01U2FsdGVkX1/S5SRfJMBCrBaZC4MJ6v9CbMwGt1f2nZyR6VV OxX8sag6DUAuAEXPfXegcNA7M4AOpDODyWZqCfJlFGCuWKQPOU Y9jqcioQ3Ju2LqZmPFF3xOydNTmpMR7 Subject: Re: [Rserpool] ASAP Handle Resolution Option X-BeenThere: rserpool@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Reliable Server Pooling List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Thomas Dreibholz schrieb: > On Mittwoch 19 November 2008, Randy Stewart wrote: >> Magnus: >> >> I really don't understand the usefulness of this extension. >> >> What it does, in a nut shell, is allow the PU requester to >> limit the number of responses he is getting... >> >> This can easily be done by: >> - configuring the ENRP server to limit the number of responses > > Dear Randy, > > this does not work for all pools. If there are PUs in the pool which require > only 1 PE entry and other PUs in the pool requiring up to 100, the setting > has to be 100. > > >> - configuring the requesting PU side to discard all but the number >> that he wants. > > Then, the ENRP has to unnecessarily select entries, which wastes a lot of > processing power and network bandwidth. In summary, it is very inefficient. > For details, see the performance evaluation in the journal article "An > Evalulation of the Pool Maintenance Overhead in Reliable > Server Pooling Systems", which has been published in the International > Journal of Hybrid Information Technology (IJHIT), Volume 1, Number 2, April > 2008. This article is available online here: > http://www.sersc.org/journals/IJHIT/vol1_no2_2008/2%20pp%2017-32.pdf . Dear Thomas, Randy, Yes, this is exactly the point I mentioned in my mail yesterday. Such an option is definitively necessary for efficient RSerPool deployment. >> Either way works without changes to the protocol. > > It works, but it is very inefficient. For a useful deployment of RSerPool, I > see this option as being absolutely necessary. Therefore, and since there are > multiple implementations and people are starting to actually use RSerPool, I > see the need for this document to also become RFC. This will avoid > incompatibilities among implementations. I fully agree to this point. Without a standardized definition of this option, each implementor/vendor will sooner or later add such a functionality to provide efficient PE selection. This will cause incompatibilities, which must be avoided. -- Best regards, Dirk Hoffstadt ------------------------------------------------------------------ M.Sc. Dirk Hoffstadt DH Datentechnik 45219 Essen Germany E-Mail: hoffstadt@dhdt.de Internet: http://www.dhdt.de PGP-PublicKey: https://dhdt.de/private/dirkhoffstadt_pubpgp.asc ------------------------------------------------------------------ _______________________________________________ rserpool mailing list rserpool@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rserpool From rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Thu Nov 20 01:33:05 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rserpool-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5CA7428C1AC; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 01:33:05 -0800 (PST) X-Original-To: rserpool@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: rserpool@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3851628C1AC for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 01:33:04 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.249 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.249 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_DE=0.35] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id cHnd-llDQiEQ for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 01:33:03 -0800 (PST) Received: from mailout.uni-duisburg-essen.de (mailout.uni-duisburg-essen.de [132.252.185.20]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 153B428C1A7 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 01:33:02 -0800 (PST) Received: from [132.252.151.109] ([132.252.151.109]) (authenticated bits=0) by mailout.uni-duisburg-essen.de (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id mAK9WtkD001747 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT); Thu, 20 Nov 2008 10:32:56 +0100 From: Nihad Cosic To: Randy Stewart In-Reply-To: <34325C6D-B6AF-4B6B-B798-C700899DDB96@lakerest.net> References: <49241C3E.2060901@dhdt.de> <0AFD1B67B949784DA087CDA9F0DD4AD9484C7A@mdmxm03.ciena.com> <492446CD.3050007@ericsson.com> <34325C6D-B6AF-4B6B-B798-C700899DDB96@lakerest.net> Organization: Technik der Rechnernetze Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2008 10:32:57 +0100 Message-Id: <1227173577.7102.22.camel@samson> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Evolution 2.22.3.1 X-Spam-Scanned: SpamAssassin: 3.002004 - http://www.spamassassin.org X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.57 on 132.252.185.20 Cc: rserpool@ietf.org, Lyndon Ong Subject: Re: [Rserpool] ASAP Handle Resolution Option X-BeenThere: rserpool@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list Reply-To: cosic@iem.uni-due.de List-Id: Reliable Server Pooling List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Sender: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org T24gTWksIDIwMDgtMTEtMTkgYXQgMTI6MzAgLTA1MDAsIFJhbmR5IFN0ZXdhcnQgd3JvdGU6Cj4g TWFnbnVzOgo+IAo+IEkgcmVhbGx5IGRvbid0IHVuZGVyc3RhbmQgdGhlIHVzZWZ1bG5lc3Mgb2Yg dGhpcyBleHRlbnNpb24uCj4gCj4gV2hhdCBpdCBkb2VzLCBpbiBhIG51dCBzaGVsbCwgaXMgYWxs b3cgdGhlIFBVIHJlcXVlc3RlciB0bwo+IGxpbWl0IHRoZSBudW1iZXIgb2YgcmVzcG9uc2VzIGhl IGlzIGdldHRpbmcuLi4KPiAKPiBUaGlzIGNhbiBlYXNpbHkgYmUgZG9uZSBieToKPiAgIC0gY29u ZmlndXJpbmcgdGhlIEVOUlAgc2VydmVyIHRvIGxpbWl0IHRoZSBudW1iZXIgb2YgcmVzcG9uc2Vz Cj4gICBvcgo+ICAgLSBjb25maWd1cmluZyB0aGUgcmVxdWVzdGluZyBQVSBzaWRlIHRvIGRpc2Nh cmQgYWxsIGJ1dCB0aGUgbnVtYmVyCj4gICAgIHRoYXQgaGUgd2FudHMuCj4gRWl0aGVyIHdheSB3 b3JrcyB3aXRob3V0IGNoYW5nZXMgdG8gdGhlIHByb3RvY29sLi4KCkRlYXIgUmFuZHksCgp0aGUg cHJvYmxlbSBpcyB0aGF0IGEgZml4ZWQgc2V0dGluZyB0byBsaW1pdCB0aGUgbnVtYmVyIG9mIHJl c3BvbnNlcwpkb2VzIG5vdCB3b3JrIHdlbGw6IHNvbWUgUFVzIG1heSBuZWVkIGEgbGFyZ2Ugc2V0 dGluZyAodG8gdXRpbGl6ZSB0aGUKUFUncyBjYWNoZSkgYW5kIHNvbWUgb3RoZXIgUFVzIG1heSBu ZWVkIGEgc21hbGwgc2V0dGluZyAodXN1YWxseSAxKS4gSWYKc3VjaCBwb29scyBhcmUgaW4gdGhl IHNhbWUgaGFuZGxlc3BhY2UsIHRoZSBtYXhpbXVtIHNldHRpbmcgZm9yIGFsbCBQVXMKaGFzIHRv IGJlIGNvbmZpZ3VyZWQuIFRoaXMgaXMgcmVhbGx5IGluZWZmaWNpZW50IGZvciBhbGwgb3RoZXJz LgoKSW4gdGhlIFJTZXJQb29sIGRlcGxveW1lbnQgc2V0dXAgSSBtYWludGFpbiwgdGhlcmUgaXMg YSBsYXJnZSBTaW1Qcm9jVEMKcG9vbCAocmVxdWlyaW5nIG9ubHkgMSBQRSB1cG9uIHNlbGVjdGlv biwgYnV0IGhhdmluZyBhIHF1aXRlIGhpZ2ggaGFuZGxlCnJlc29sdXRpb24gcmF0ZSkgYW5kIHNv bWUgb3RoZXIgcG9vbHMgKHdpdGggc29tZSBQVXMgdXNpbmcgdGhlaXIKY2FjaGVzKS4gVXNpbmcg YSBsYXJnZSBzZXR0aW5nIGZvciB0aGUgbnVtYmVyIG9mIFBFcyBpcyByZWFsbHkKaW5lZmZpY2ll bnQ6IGl0IHdhc3RlcyBDUFUgdGltZSBvbiB0aGUgRU5SUCBzZXJ2ZXJzIGFuZCBhbHNvIG5ldHdv cmsKYmFuZHdpZHRoLiBDdXJyZW50bHksIEkgYW0gd29ya2luZyBvbiBhIHJlcGxhY2VtZW50IG9m IHRoZSBFTlJQIHNlcnZlcgpQQ3MgYnkgbW92aW5nIHRoZSBFTlJQIHNlcnZlciBwcm9jZXNzZXMg dG8gb3VyIExpbnV4LWJhc2VkIFdSVDU0R0wKcm91dGVycy4gU3VjaCBkZXZpY2VzIG9ubHkgY29u dGFpbiBhIGxvdy1wZXJmb3JtYW5jZSBDUFUuIFRoZXJlZm9yZSwgSQpjYXJlIHByZXR0eSBtdWNo IGZvciBlZmZpY2llbmN5LiBUaGUgaGFuZGxlIHJlc29sdXRpb24gb3B0aW9uIGlzIHJlYWxseQpu ZWVkZWQgZm9yIGVmZmljaWVudCBSU2VyUG9vbCBvcGVyYXRpb24uCgpJIGFscmVhZHkgd29yayB3 aXRoIHR3byBpbXBsZW1lbnRhdGlvbnMgLSBSU1BMSUIgYW5kIHRoZSBGSCBNw7xuc3RlcgpwYWNr YWdlIC0gYW5kIHNlZSB0aGVyZWZvcmUgYSBzdHJvbmcgbmVlZCBmb3IgdGhpcyBvcHRpb24gZHJh ZnQgZG9jdW1lbnQKdG8gYXZvaWQgaW5jb21wYXRpYmlsaXRpZXMgYW1vbmcgaW1wbGVtZW50YXRp b25zLgoKCktpbmQgcmVnYXJkcwotLSAKTmloYWQgQ29zaWMgCkNvbXB1dGVyIGFuZCBOZXR3b3Jr IEVuZ2luZWVyClVuaXZlcnNpdHkgb2YgRHVpc2J1cmctRXNzZW4KSW5zdGl0dXRlIGZvciBDb21w dXRlciBTY2llbmNlIGFuZCBCdXNpbmVzcyBJbmZvcm1hdGlvbiBTeXN0ZW1zIChJQ0IpCkVsbGVy bnN0ci4yOSAKNDUzMjYgRXNzZW4sIEdlcm1hbnkgClRlbDogKzQ5ICgwKSAyMDEgMTgzLTc2NTEg CkZheDogKzQ5ICgwKSAyMDEgMTgzLTc2NzMgCk1haWw6IGNvc2ljIGF0IGllbS51bmktZHVlLmRl IApQR1AtS2V5IGh0dHA6Ly90ZHJ3d3cuaWVtLnVuaS1kdWUuZGUvbWl0YXJiZWl0ZXIvY29zaWMv cHVia2V5LmFzYwoKX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19f X18KcnNlcnBvb2wgbWFpbGluZyBsaXN0CnJzZXJwb29sQGlldGYub3JnCmh0dHBzOi8vd3d3Lmll dGYub3JnL21haWxtYW4vbGlzdGluZm8vcnNlcnBvb2wK From rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Thu Nov 20 04:27:49 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rserpool-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 268D83A684D; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 04:27:49 -0800 (PST) X-Original-To: rserpool@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: rserpool@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0DA3E3A684D for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 04:27:48 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ZOYPi6a+Gmnu for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 04:27:47 -0800 (PST) Received: from lakerest.net (unknown [IPv6:2001:240:585:2:203:6dff:fe1a:4ddc]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6A4F63A63D2 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 04:27:46 -0800 (PST) Received: from [130.129.75.226] ([130.129.75.226]) (authenticated bits=0) by lakerest.net (8.14.1/8.14.1) with ESMTP id mAKCRK2e029264 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=NOT); Thu, 20 Nov 2008 07:27:21 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from randall@lakerest.net) DKIM-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=simple/simple; d=lakerest.net; s=mail; t=1227184042; h=Cc:Message-Id:From:To:In-Reply-To:Content-Type: Content-Transfer-Encoding:Mime-Version:Subject:Date:References: X-Mailer; b=r+78yoTn55Y+ChyRtVdBKhWyAlLhw4goPJgPuA0SvD93rVmZaNlxrBy mW/T+whK4be3VUpkcm8NlFz/VCoQjhw== Message-Id: <097AA2EB-3244-40B9-ACAA-6A0ECC195C0B@lakerest.net> From: Randy Stewart To: Thomas Dreibholz In-Reply-To: <200811200940.51779.dreibh@iem.uni-due.de> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v929.2) Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2008 07:27:19 -0500 References: <49241C3E.2060901@dhdt.de> <492446CD.3050007@ericsson.com> <34325C6D-B6AF-4B6B-B798-C700899DDB96@lakerest.net> <200811200940.51779.dreibh@iem.uni-due.de> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.929.2) Cc: rserpool@ietf.org, Lyndon Ong Subject: Re: [Rserpool] ASAP Handle Resolution Option X-BeenThere: rserpool@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Reliable Server Pooling List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"; Format="flowed"; DelSp="yes" Sender: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org On Nov 20, 2008, at 3:40 AM, Thomas Dreibholz wrote: > On Mittwoch 19 November 2008, Randy Stewart wrote: >> Magnus: >> >> I really don't understand the usefulness of this extension. >> >> What it does, in a nut shell, is allow the PU requester to >> limit the number of responses he is getting... >> >> This can easily be done by: >> - configuring the ENRP server to limit the number of responses > > Dear Randy, > > this does not work for all pools. If there are PUs in the pool which = > require > only 1 PE entry and other PUs in the pool requiring up to 100, the = > setting > has to be 100. > In this case you can configure it on the PU... its not that big of deal. Besides if you only want one response, why are you even bothering to use RSERPOOL. Its just as easy to use either a configured host or DNS to lookup the single guy you wish to talk to. > >> - configuring the requesting PU side to discard all but the number >> that he wants. > > Then, the ENRP has to unnecessarily select entries, which wastes a = > lot of > processing power and network bandwidth. In summary, it is very = > inefficient. This is rather silly in my mind. B/W on a network where rserpool is running is not going to be that much of a problem IMO. Processing power is a moot point with multi-gig-hz machines and Gig's of memory being the common environment. If you are not in that environment your NOT going to have 100's of PE's so I see NO need for this. Also your argument here is in direct conflict to the argument above. > > For details, see the performance evaluation in the journal article "An > Evalulation of the Pool Maintenance Overhead in Reliable > Server Pooling Systems", which has been published in the International > Journal of Hybrid Information Technology (IJHIT), Volume 1, Number = > 2, April > 2008. This article is available online here: > http://www.sersc.org/journals/IJHIT/vol1_no2_2008/2%20pp%2017-32.pdf . > > >> Either way works without changes to the protocol. > > It works, but it is very inefficient. Here I strongly disagree with you. If you have large numbers of pools your network and processing capacity will always be greater than if you have a small rserpool deployment. Being one of the folks that have truly deployed rserpool back in 99 at Motorola I can tell you that we had NO problem with either network or bandwidth. And thats not theory but analysis of a true production system running rserpool.... We DO NOT need this IMO! IMO I STRONGLY think the WG needs to be closed. And from what I can see from Magnus's statement: ---- The current plan is to shutdown the WG. It has been clear for quite some long time that the energy level is very low. I intended to keep with the plan to shutdown the WG. I was seriously considering closing the WG already before finishing the MIB. ---- He agrees with me... I am all for this plan... finish the MIB and close the WG. IF problems arise and there is significant usage in REAL production = networks of rserpool that warrant updates to the documents, we can deal with that on a "as need" basis.... R > For a useful deployment of RSerPool, I > see this option as being absolutely necessary. Therefore, and since = > there are > multiple implementations and people are starting to actually use = > RSerPool, I > see the need for this document to also become RFC. This will avoid > incompatibilities among implementations. > > > Best regards > -- = > =3D = > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > Dr. Thomas Dreibholz > > University of Duisburg-Essen, Room ES210 > Inst. for Experimental Mathematics Ellernstra=DFe 29 > Computer Networking Technology Group D-45326 Essen/Germany > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > E-Mail: dreibh@iem.uni-due.de > Homepage: http://www.iem.uni-due.de/~dreibh > =3D = > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D ----- Randall Stewart randall@lakerest.net _______________________________________________ rserpool mailing list rserpool@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rserpool From rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Thu Nov 20 04:50:26 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rserpool-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 14F673A6A33; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 04:50:26 -0800 (PST) X-Original-To: rserpool@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: rserpool@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8CBEF3A6A33 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 04:50:25 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.249 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.249 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_DE=0.35] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id qA5tCxUA+YwF for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 04:50:24 -0800 (PST) Received: from mailout.uni-due.de (mailout.uni-due.de [132.252.185.19]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 65DF93A6A31 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 04:50:24 -0800 (PST) Received: from kappes.local ([132.252.151.151]) (authenticated bits=0) by mailout.uni-due.de (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id mAKCoHO7030144 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT); Thu, 20 Nov 2008 13:50:18 +0100 From: Thomas Dreibholz Organization: University of Duisburg-Essen To: rserpool@ietf.org Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2008 13:50:12 +0100 User-Agent: KMail/1.9.6 (enterprise 0.20070907.709405) References: <49241C3E.2060901@dhdt.de> <200811200940.51779.dreibh@iem.uni-due.de> <097AA2EB-3244-40B9-ACAA-6A0ECC195C0B@lakerest.net> In-Reply-To: <097AA2EB-3244-40B9-ACAA-6A0ECC195C0B@lakerest.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <200811201350.17212.dreibh@iem.uni-due.de> X-Spam-Scanned: SpamAssassin: 3.002004 - http://www.spamassassin.org X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.57 on 132.252.185.19 Cc: Lyndon Ong Subject: Re: [Rserpool] ASAP Handle Resolution Option X-BeenThere: rserpool@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Reliable Server Pooling List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============1952948120==" Sender: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org --===============1952948120== Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="nextPart13821230.KLLDdIuYfW"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; micalg=pgp-sha1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit --nextPart13821230.KLLDdIuYfW Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline On Donnerstag 20 November 2008, Randy Stewart wrote: > In this case you can configure it on the PU... its not that big of deal. > Besides if you only want one response, why are you even bothering > to use RSERPOOL. Its just as easy to use either a configured > host or DNS to lookup the single guy you wish to talk to. Dear Randy, the idea is to configure the number on the PU. But the PU has to tell the E= NRP=20 server how many PE entries it actually needs. > >> - configuring the requesting PU side to discard all but the number > >> that he wants. > > > > Then, the ENRP has to unnecessarily select entries, which wastes a > > lot of > > processing power and network bandwidth. In summary, it is very > > inefficient. > > This is rather silly in my mind. B/W on a network where rserpool > is running is not going to be that much of a problem IMO. Processing > power is a moot point with multi-gig-hz machines and Gig's of memory > being the common environment. If you are not in that environment > your NOT going to have 100's of PE's so I see NO need for this. Bandwidth it not really the problem. The actual problem is the unnecessary= =20 processing power it needs to select e.g. 100 PEs when e.g. actually only 1= =20 entry is really required. Why should the ENRP server need significantly mor= e=20 CPU resources than necessary when it is so easy to fix this problem? The=20 handle resolution option is really simple (just 8 bytes containing a single= =20 entry) and successfully fixes this problem. With a few lines of=20 implementation code, a significant performance gain can be achieved. Best regards =2D-=20 =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D Dr. Thomas Dreibholz University of Duisburg-Essen, Room ES210 Inst. for Experimental Mathematics Ellernstra=DFe 29 Computer Networking Technology Group D-45326 Essen/Germany =2D---------------------------------------------------------------------- E-Mail: dreibh@iem.uni-due.de Homepage: http://www.iem.uni-due.de/~dreibh =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D --nextPart13821230.KLLDdIuYfW Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name=signature.asc Content-Description: This is a digitally signed message part. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQBJJV0J32BbsHYPLWURAvehAJ9zGzX2J7n3xuU7CShirwKeZwnzHgCeKnMJ UnUPIhK3b8Xa3AUXiRt3DYc= =5USJ -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --nextPart13821230.KLLDdIuYfW-- --===============1952948120== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ rserpool mailing list rserpool@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rserpool --===============1952948120==-- From rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Thu Nov 20 05:46:25 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rserpool-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 69EDD3A6837; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 05:46:25 -0800 (PST) X-Original-To: rserpool@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: rserpool@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6F5193A6837 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 05:46:24 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.249 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.249 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_DE=0.35] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id mH+rZjpC4b14 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 05:46:23 -0800 (PST) Received: from mailout.uni-due.de (mailout.uni-due.de [132.252.185.19]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CD40B3A6801 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 05:46:22 -0800 (PST) Received: from Latitude ([132.252.151.134]) (authenticated bits=0) by mailout.uni-due.de (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id mAKDkIO1005587 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=NOT); Thu, 20 Nov 2008 14:46:18 +0100 From: "Michael Kohnen" To: "'Randy Stewart'" , "'Thomas Dreibholz'" References: <49241C3E.2060901@dhdt.de> <492446CD.3050007@ericsson.com><34325C6D-B6AF-4B6B-B798-C700899DDB96@lakerest.net><200811200940.51779.dreibh@iem.uni-due.de> <097AA2EB-3244-40B9-ACAA-6A0ECC195C0B@lakerest.net> In-Reply-To: <097AA2EB-3244-40B9-ACAA-6A0ECC195C0B@lakerest.net> Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2008 14:46:06 +0100 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.0.6001.18049 Thread-Index: AclLC26o0M898e/LQr2ZyAAk0zLfXgACQqdg X-Spam-Scanned: SpamAssassin: 3.002004 - http://www.spamassassin.org X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.57 on 132.252.185.19 Cc: 'Lyndon Ong' , rserpool@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Rserpool] ASAP Handle Resolution Option X-BeenThere: rserpool@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Reliable Server Pooling List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Sender: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Dear Randy, The point is that for many applications exactly one PE should be selected out of a pool (containing many PEs) by the pool policy. That is, there should be a way to tell the ENRP server to just select a single entry. For other applications, there should be the possibility to tell the PE to select more entries (e.g. to utilize the PU cache). If there is a fixed setting of how many PE entries to reply upon a Handle Resolution Request, this is not optimal for many applications while it is required for others. Since RSerPool is intended to be "lightweight", I see the need to take care of efficiency. Therefore, it is really useful to have this handle resolution option. Best regards Michael Kohnen -- = Dipl.-Wirt.-Inf. Michael Kohnen = Lehrstuhl f=FCr Technik der Rechnernetze Institut f=FCr Experimentelle Mathematik und Institut f=FCr Informatik und Wirtschaftsinformatik Universit=E4t Duisburg-Essen, Campus Essen Ellernstr. 29 45326 Essen = Telefon: +49 (201) 183-7636 Fax: +49 (201) 183-7673 E-Mail: Michael.Kohnen@iem.uni-due.de Homepage: http://www.uni-due.de/tdr/ -----Original Message----- From: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:rserpool-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Randy Stewart Sent: Thursday, November 20, 2008 1:27 PM To: Thomas Dreibholz Cc: rserpool@ietf.org; Lyndon Ong Subject: Re: [Rserpool] ASAP Handle Resolution Option On Nov 20, 2008, at 3:40 AM, Thomas Dreibholz wrote: > On Mittwoch 19 November 2008, Randy Stewart wrote: >> Magnus: >> >> I really don't understand the usefulness of this extension. >> >> What it does, in a nut shell, is allow the PU requester to limit the = >> number of responses he is getting... >> >> This can easily be done by: >> - configuring the ENRP server to limit the number of responses > > Dear Randy, > > this does not work for all pools. If there are PUs in the pool which = > require only 1 PE entry and other PUs in the pool requiring up to 100, = > the setting has to be 100. > In this case you can configure it on the PU... its not that big of deal. Besides if you only want one response, why are you even bothering to use RSERPOOL. Its just as easy to use either a configured host or DNS to lookup the single guy you wish to talk to. > >> - configuring the requesting PU side to discard all but the number >> that he wants. > > Then, the ENRP has to unnecessarily select entries, which wastes a lot = > of processing power and network bandwidth. In summary, it is very = > inefficient. This is rather silly in my mind. B/W on a network where rserpool is running is not going to be that much of a problem IMO. Processing power is a moot point with multi-gig-hz machines and Gig's of memory being the common environment. If you are not in that environment your NOT going to have 100's of PE's so I see NO need for this. Also your argument here is in direct conflict to the argument above. > > For details, see the performance evaluation in the journal article "An = > Evalulation of the Pool Maintenance Overhead in Reliable Server = > Pooling Systems", which has been published in the International = > Journal of Hybrid Information Technology (IJHIT), Volume 1, Number 2, = > April 2008. This article is available online here: > http://www.sersc.org/journals/IJHIT/vol1_no2_2008/2%20pp%2017-32.pdf . > > >> Either way works without changes to the protocol. > > It works, but it is very inefficient. Here I strongly disagree with you. If you have large numbers of pools your network and processing capacity will always be greater than if you have a small rserpool deployment. Being one of the folks that have truly deployed rserpool back in 99 at Motorola I can tell you that we had NO problem with either network or bandwidth. And thats not theory but analysis of a true production system running rserpool.... We DO NOT need this IMO! IMO I STRONGLY think the WG needs to be closed. And from what I can see from Magnus's statement: ---- The current plan is to shutdown the WG. It has been clear for quite some long time that the energy level is very low. I intended to keep with the plan to shutdown the WG. I was seriously considering closing the WG already before finishing the MIB. ---- He agrees with me... I am all for this plan... finish the MIB and close the WG. IF problems arise and there is significant usage in REAL production networks of rserpool that warrant updates to the documents, we can deal with that on a "as need" basis.... R > For a useful deployment of RSerPool, I see this option as being = > absolutely necessary. Therefore, and since there are multiple = > implementations and people are starting to actually use RSerPool, I = > see the need for this document to also become RFC. This will avoid = > incompatibilities among implementations. > > > Best regards > -- > =3D > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > Dr. Thomas Dreibholz > > University of Duisburg-Essen, Room ES210 > Inst. for Experimental Mathematics Ellernstra=DFe 29 > Computer Networking Technology Group D-45326 Essen/Germany > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > E-Mail: dreibh@iem.uni-due.de > Homepage: http://www.iem.uni-due.de/~dreibh > =3D > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D ----- Randall Stewart randall@lakerest.net _______________________________________________ rserpool mailing list rserpool@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rserpool _______________________________________________ rserpool mailing list rserpool@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rserpool From rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Thu Nov 20 06:03:42 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rserpool-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BD1153A689D; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 06:03:42 -0800 (PST) X-Original-To: rserpool@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: rserpool@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E99313A680A for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 06:03:41 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.249 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.249 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_DE=0.35] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id P81BYmZZ0Jle for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 06:03:41 -0800 (PST) Received: from moutng.kundenserver.de (moutng.kundenserver.de [212.227.126.187]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C17083A689D for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 06:03:40 -0800 (PST) Received: from [132.252.151.243] ([132.252.151.243]) by mrelayeu.kundenserver.de (node=mrelayeu4) with ESMTP (Nemesis) id 0ML21M-1L3A8A3mVi-0000Pc; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 15:03:38 +0100 Message-ID: <49256E40.40703@dhdt.de> Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2008 15:03:44 +0100 From: Dirk Hoffstadt User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.18 (Windows/20081105) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rserpool@ietf.org References: <49241C3E.2060901@dhdt.de> <200811200940.51779.dreibh@iem.uni-due.de> <097AA2EB-3244-40B9-ACAA-6A0ECC195C0B@lakerest.net> <200811201350.17212.dreibh@iem.uni-due.de> In-Reply-To: <200811201350.17212.dreibh@iem.uni-due.de> X-Enigmail-Version: 0.95.7 X-Provags-ID: V01U2FsdGVkX1/XF1+5mo675IxzrZ665mehh9b33JxM8FmCujw ZFOzrOqJTzl3rxarubWNpzqTnihw6mICYgAlFJ2B+VXAuC7EKB 1q48Zz4fd2xBA1W7S/i+kMEv/E1wisW Subject: Re: [Rserpool] ASAP Handle Resolution Option X-BeenThere: rserpool@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Reliable Server Pooling List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Thomas Dreibholz schrieb: > On Donnerstag 20 November 2008, Randy Stewart wrote: >> In this case you can configure it on the PU... its not that big of deal. >> Besides if you only want one response, why are you even bothering >> to use RSERPOOL. Its just as easy to use either a configured >> host or DNS to lookup the single guy you wish to talk to. > > Dear Randy, > > the idea is to configure the number on the PU. But the PU has to tell the ENRP > server how many PE entries it actually needs. > > >>>> - configuring the requesting PU side to discard all but the number >>>> that he wants. >>> Then, the ENRP has to unnecessarily select entries, which wastes a >>> lot of >>> processing power and network bandwidth. In summary, it is very >>> inefficient. >> This is rather silly in my mind. B/W on a network where rserpool >> is running is not going to be that much of a problem IMO. Processing >> power is a moot point with multi-gig-hz machines and Gig's of memory >> being the common environment. If you are not in that environment >> your NOT going to have 100's of PE's so I see NO need for this. > > Bandwidth it not really the problem. The actual problem is the unnecessary > processing power it needs to select e.g. 100 PEs when e.g. actually only 1 > entry is really required. Why should the ENRP server need significantly more > CPU resources than necessary when it is so easy to fix this problem? The > handle resolution option is really simple (just 8 bytes containing a single > entry) and successfully fixes this problem. With a few lines of > implementation code, a significant performance gain can be achieved. Yes, I fully agree to that. The solution to solve the "number of PE entries to be selected" problem by the handle resolution option is really simple. Wasting resources should really be avoided, since this reduces deployment costs. - -- Best regards, Dirk Hoffstadt - ------------------------------------------------------------------ M.Sc. Dirk Hoffstadt DH Datentechnik 45219 Essen Germany E-Mail: hoffstadt@dhdt.de Internet: http://www.dhdt.de PGP-PublicKey: https://dhdt.de/private/dirkhoffstadt_pubpgp.asc - ------------------------------------------------------------------ -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (MingW32) iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJJJW4/AAoJEAl0PP0XKTexStEIANm2uhUn0JHwHNg9xIBelyHV niqhi0zBOsiy36JtoanDLMgFLNd/uzGDBdViX/OLMJFSCuHmEXD3pjA6/avCzY0r qL6rHb5pr2yfq6ALqzpQ9yODUFdWH55XSWDQH3aIRhoD74n0L5NvuHHz7g9BNjv5 uWAiRAL1ljyWfsX6kbaE2iSpwVfg4RUPDCCcgsUcKoPxKR1Y9XFylc97ORWjYz7J hH2DkYApT5qIURnp7SU7FIeXRBb0ftXnZlqOdt6oQm4c9dTuojNeZr2XTpEnbQjz nMGBk7LmS/4beb2PdQPMl//VjCKh9FrzS4sZWYq0jEc9yCGuJQhg+R+/Qc3EM7g= =f1/2 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- _______________________________________________ rserpool mailing list rserpool@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rserpool From rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Thu Nov 20 06:52:54 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rserpool-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 597083A683E; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 06:52:54 -0800 (PST) X-Original-To: rserpool@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: rserpool@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 720253A683E for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 06:52:52 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: 0.371 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.371 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, HELO_EQ_IP_ADDR=1.119, MIME_8BIT_HEADER=0.3, RDNS_NONE=0.1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id m9ykO59CUmnI for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 06:52:51 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-n.franken.de (drew.ipv6.franken.de [IPv6:2001:638:a02:a001:20e:cff:fe4a:feaa]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 48A163A6836 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 06:52:51 -0800 (PST) Received: from [130.129.95.176] (unknown [130.129.95.176]) by mail-n.franken.de (Postfix) with ESMTP id DD42D1C0B460A; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 15:52:46 +0100 (CET) Message-Id: <05A4B541-2AC6-41E4-A658-F1AB662B126B@lurchi.franken.de> From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Michael_T=FCxen?= To: Thomas Dreibholz In-Reply-To: <200811201350.17212.dreibh@iem.uni-due.de> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v929.2) Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2008 08:52:45 -0600 References: <49241C3E.2060901@dhdt.de> <200811200940.51779.dreibh@iem.uni-due.de> <097AA2EB-3244-40B9-ACAA-6A0ECC195C0B@lakerest.net> <200811201350.17212.dreibh@iem.uni-due.de> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.929.2) Cc: Lyndon Ong , rserpool@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Rserpool] ASAP Handle Resolution Option X-BeenThere: rserpool@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Reliable Server Pooling List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"; Format="flowed"; DelSp="yes" Sender: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Hi Thomas, I do understand that the ID is simple, but I'm not sure if this is really necessary to have for the things that are done *NOW* using RSerPool. If you think you need this, you can integrate this in your implementation and choose the higher bits such that you can at least interoperate with implementation not supporting your extension. So I support Magnus position to close the WG. Best regards Michael On Nov 20, 2008, at 6:50 AM, Thomas Dreibholz wrote: > On Donnerstag 20 November 2008, Randy Stewart wrote: >> In this case you can configure it on the PU... its not that big of = >> deal. >> Besides if you only want one response, why are you even bothering >> to use RSERPOOL. Its just as easy to use either a configured >> host or DNS to lookup the single guy you wish to talk to. > > Dear Randy, > > the idea is to configure the number on the PU. But the PU has to = > tell the ENRP > server how many PE entries it actually needs. > > >>>> - configuring the requesting PU side to discard all but the number >>>> that he wants. >>> >>> Then, the ENRP has to unnecessarily select entries, which wastes a >>> lot of >>> processing power and network bandwidth. In summary, it is very >>> inefficient. >> >> This is rather silly in my mind. B/W on a network where rserpool >> is running is not going to be that much of a problem IMO. Processing >> power is a moot point with multi-gig-hz machines and Gig's of memory >> being the common environment. If you are not in that environment >> your NOT going to have 100's of PE's so I see NO need for this. > > Bandwidth it not really the problem. The actual problem is the = > unnecessary > processing power it needs to select e.g. 100 PEs when e.g. actually = > only 1 > entry is really required. Why should the ENRP server need = > significantly more > CPU resources than necessary when it is so easy to fix this problem? = > The > handle resolution option is really simple (just 8 bytes containing a = > single > entry) and successfully fixes this problem. With a few lines of > implementation code, a significant performance gain can be achieved. > > > Best regards > -- = > =3D = > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > Dr. Thomas Dreibholz > > University of Duisburg-Essen, Room ES210 > Inst. for Experimental Mathematics Ellernstra=DFe 29 > Computer Networking Technology Group D-45326 Essen/Germany > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > E-Mail: dreibh@iem.uni-due.de > Homepage: http://www.iem.uni-due.de/~dreibh > =3D = > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > _______________________________________________ > rserpool mailing list > rserpool@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rserpool _______________________________________________ rserpool mailing list rserpool@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rserpool From rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Thu Nov 20 07:04:10 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rserpool-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C8BBA3A6AAA; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 07:04:10 -0800 (PST) X-Original-To: rserpool@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: rserpool@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DE95E3A6AAA for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 07:04:09 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.099 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.099 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.150, BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_DE=0.35, MIME_8BIT_HEADER=0.3] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ANZiIa3SNfep for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 07:04:09 -0800 (PST) Received: from mailout.uni-due.de (mailout.uni-due.de [132.252.185.19]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CBD7C3A67FA for ; Thu, 20 Nov 2008 07:04:08 -0800 (PST) Received: from kappes.local ([132.252.151.151]) (authenticated bits=0) by mailout.uni-due.de (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id mAKF42xo017740 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT); Thu, 20 Nov 2008 16:04:03 +0100 From: Thomas Dreibholz Organization: University of Duisburg-Essen To: Michael =?iso-8859-1?q?T=FCxen?= Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2008 16:03:58 +0100 User-Agent: KMail/1.9.6 (enterprise 0.20070907.709405) References: <49241C3E.2060901@dhdt.de> <200811201350.17212.dreibh@iem.uni-due.de> <05A4B541-2AC6-41E4-A658-F1AB662B126B@lurchi.franken.de> In-Reply-To: <05A4B541-2AC6-41E4-A658-F1AB662B126B@lurchi.franken.de> MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <200811201604.02369.dreibh@iem.uni-due.de> X-Spam-Scanned: SpamAssassin: 3.002004 - http://www.spamassassin.org X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.57 on 132.252.185.19 Cc: Lyndon Ong , rserpool@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Rserpool] ASAP Handle Resolution Option X-BeenThere: rserpool@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Reliable Server Pooling List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============1038101356==" Sender: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org --===============1038101356== Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="nextPart5636253.oF6n6NNQlf"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; micalg=pgp-sha1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit --nextPart5636253.oF6n6NNQlf Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline On Donnerstag 20 November 2008, Michael T=FCxen wrote: > Hi Thomas, > > I do understand that the ID is simple, but I'm not sure if this > is really necessary to have for the things that are done *NOW* > using RSerPool. Dear Michael, it is indeed already needed for deployments *NOW*. > If you think you need this, you can integrate this in your > implementation and choose the higher bits such that you can > at least interoperate with implementation not supporting your > extension. This is not a good idea, it will only create unnecessary interoperability=20 issues. I think now is the time to define this option, before other people= =20 discover the same efficiency problem and implement it in a different way. A= =20 scenario in which multiple ENRP servers first have to figure out the=20 capabilities and incompatibilities of their peers should be avoided. This=20 makes everything very complicated. > So I support Magnus position to close the WG. May be this draft could simply be processed as individual submission. Best regards =2D-=20 =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D Dr. Thomas Dreibholz University of Duisburg-Essen, Room ES210 Inst. for Experimental Mathematics Ellernstra=DFe 29 Computer Networking Technology Group D-45326 Essen/Germany =2D---------------------------------------------------------------------- E-Mail: dreibh@iem.uni-due.de Homepage: http://www.iem.uni-due.de/~dreibh =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D --nextPart5636253.oF6n6NNQlf Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name=signature.asc Content-Description: This is a digitally signed message part. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQBJJXxi32BbsHYPLWURAjxWAJ9ll+bkrFt1tKo2MuVklCnz5aqZzQCfScvU OOuD4OdIYxijJKQGzKLdsgQ= =NhjG -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --nextPart5636253.oF6n6NNQlf-- --===============1038101356== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ rserpool mailing list rserpool@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rserpool --===============1038101356==-- From rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Fri Nov 21 01:46:12 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rserpool-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A71AF3A6867; Fri, 21 Nov 2008 01:46:12 -0800 (PST) X-Original-To: rserpool@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: rserpool@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 295A33A6867 for ; Fri, 21 Nov 2008 01:46:12 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.249 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.249 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_DE=0.35] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id IXmC3lC+Ypq6 for ; Fri, 21 Nov 2008 01:46:11 -0800 (PST) Received: from mout-xforward.kundenserver.de (mout-xforward.kundenserver.de [212.227.17.5]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E84DC3A67B3 for ; Fri, 21 Nov 2008 01:46:10 -0800 (PST) Received: from [132.252.151.243] ([132.252.151.243]) by mrelayeu.kundenserver.de (node=mrelayeu4) with ESMTP (Nemesis) id 0ML21M-1L3SaV10Nx-0000S1; Fri, 21 Nov 2008 10:46:07 +0100 Message-ID: <49268364.6050301@dhdt.de> Date: Fri, 21 Nov 2008 10:46:12 +0100 From: Dirk Hoffstadt User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.18 (Windows/20081105) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: rserpool@ietf.org References: <49241C3E.2060901@dhdt.de> <200811201350.17212.dreibh@iem.uni-due.de> <05A4B541-2AC6-41E4-A658-F1AB662B126B@lurchi.franken.de> <200811201604.02369.dreibh@iem.uni-due.de> In-Reply-To: <200811201604.02369.dreibh@iem.uni-due.de> X-Enigmail-Version: 0.95.7 X-Provags-ID: V01U2FsdGVkX19z0WaXHHZo5bWLuRTgXjDLyL9BdLyzTa7eV2o 6n7+pcMLlvVX+nsiNlR3Gv2qYn0cUl469ilZJpASM9xldXGphZ 7HVJiaUY4uwIe8tUr31hcAsk88AxUkT Subject: Re: [Rserpool] ASAP Handle Resolution Option X-BeenThere: rserpool@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Reliable Server Pooling List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-15" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Sender: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Thomas Dreibholz schrieb: > On Donnerstag 20 November 2008, Michael T=FCxen wrote: >> Hi Thomas, >> >> I do understand that the ID is simple, but I'm not sure if this >> is really necessary to have for the things that are done *NOW* >> using RSerPool. > = > Dear Michael, > = > it is indeed already needed for deployments *NOW*. Yes, there are already deployments now. It is not useful to wait until incompatible implementations are widely deployed. Then, it will already be too late. >> If you think you need this, you can integrate this in your >> implementation and choose the higher bits such that you can >> at least interoperate with implementation not supporting your >> extension. > = > This is not a good idea, it will only create unnecessary interoperability = > issues. I think now is the time to define this option, before other peopl= e = > discover the same efficiency problem and implement it in a different way.= A = > scenario in which multiple ENRP servers first have to figure out the = > capabilities and incompatibilities of their peers should be avoided. This = > makes everything very complicated. > = > = >> So I support Magnus position to close the WG. > = > May be this draft could simply be processed as individual submission. This is a good idea. The draft is already complete, so I do not see a use in re-submitting it as WG document. Instead, it can be moved forward as Individual Submission. -- = Best regards, Dirk Hoffstadt ------------------------------------------------------------------ M.Sc. Dirk Hoffstadt DH Datentechnik 45219 Essen Germany E-Mail: hoffstadt@dhdt.de Internet: http://www.dhdt.de PGP-PublicKey: https://dhdt.de/private/dirkhoffstadt_pubpgp.asc ------------------------------------------------------------------ _______________________________________________ rserpool mailing list rserpool@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rserpool From rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Fri Nov 21 04:26:19 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rserpool-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B0F443A6922; Fri, 21 Nov 2008 04:26:19 -0800 (PST) X-Original-To: rserpool@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: rserpool@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 079713A6922 for ; Fri, 21 Nov 2008 04:26:18 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.249 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.249 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_DE=0.35] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 0z9qkzaFtJJi for ; Fri, 21 Nov 2008 04:26:17 -0800 (PST) Received: from mailout.uni-duisburg-essen.de (mailout.uni-duisburg-essen.de [132.252.185.20]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D0D1B3A6826 for ; Fri, 21 Nov 2008 04:26:16 -0800 (PST) Received: from [132.252.151.240] ([132.252.151.240]) (authenticated bits=0) by mailout.uni-duisburg-essen.de (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id mALCPNBG014335 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT); Fri, 21 Nov 2008 13:25:32 +0100 From: Nihad Cosic To: Dirk Hoffstadt In-Reply-To: <49268364.6050301@dhdt.de> References: <49241C3E.2060901@dhdt.de> <200811201350.17212.dreibh@iem.uni-due.de> <05A4B541-2AC6-41E4-A658-F1AB662B126B@lurchi.franken.de> <200811201604.02369.dreibh@iem.uni-due.de> <49268364.6050301@dhdt.de> Organization: Technik der Rechnernetze Date: Fri, 21 Nov 2008 13:25:15 +0100 Message-Id: <1227270315.6641.3.camel@Samson> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Evolution 2.24.1 X-Spam-Scanned: SpamAssassin: 3.002004 - http://www.spamassassin.org X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.57 on 132.252.185.20 Cc: rserpool@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Rserpool] ASAP Handle Resolution Option X-BeenThere: rserpool@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list Reply-To: cosic@iem.uni-due.de List-Id: Reliable Server Pooling List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Sender: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org QW0gRnJlaXRhZywgZGVuIDIxLjExLjIwMDgsIDEwOjQ2ICswMTAwIHNjaHJpZWIgRGlyayBIb2Zm c3RhZHQ6Cj4gVGhvbWFzIERyZWliaG9seiBzY2hyaWViOgo+ID4gT24gRG9ubmVyc3RhZyAyMCBO b3ZlbWJlciAyMDA4LCBNaWNoYWVsIFTDvHhlbiB3cm90ZToKPiA+PiBIaSBUaG9tYXMsCj4gPj4K PiA+PiBJIGRvIHVuZGVyc3RhbmQgdGhhdCB0aGUgSUQgaXMgc2ltcGxlLCBidXQgSSdtIG5vdCBz dXJlIGlmIHRoaXMKPiA+PiBpcyByZWFsbHkgbmVjZXNzYXJ5IHRvIGhhdmUgZm9yIHRoZSB0aGlu Z3MgdGhhdCBhcmUgZG9uZSAqTk9XKgo+ID4+IHVzaW5nIFJTZXJQb29sLgo+ID4gCj4gPiBEZWFy IE1pY2hhZWwsCj4gPiAKPiA+IGl0IGlzIGluZGVlZCBhbHJlYWR5IG5lZWRlZCBmb3IgZGVwbG95 bWVudHMgKk5PVyouCj4gCj4gWWVzLCB0aGVyZSBhcmUgYWxyZWFkeSBkZXBsb3ltZW50cyBub3cu IEl0IGlzIG5vdCB1c2VmdWwgdG8gd2FpdCB1bnRpbAo+IGluY29tcGF0aWJsZSBpbXBsZW1lbnRh dGlvbnMgYXJlIHdpZGVseSBkZXBsb3llZC4gVGhlbiwgaXQgd2lsbCBhbHJlYWR5Cj4gYmUgdG9v IGxhdGUuCgpEZWFyIERpcmssCgpJIGZ1bGx5IGFncmVlIHRvIHRoaXMgYXJndW1lbnQuCgoKPiA+ PiBJZiB5b3UgdGhpbmsgeW91IG5lZWQgdGhpcywgeW91IGNhbiBpbnRlZ3JhdGUgdGhpcyBpbiB5 b3VyCj4gPj4gaW1wbGVtZW50YXRpb24gYW5kIGNob29zZSB0aGUgaGlnaGVyIGJpdHMgc3VjaCB0 aGF0IHlvdSBjYW4KPiA+PiBhdCBsZWFzdCBpbnRlcm9wZXJhdGUgd2l0aCBpbXBsZW1lbnRhdGlv biBub3Qgc3VwcG9ydGluZyB5b3VyCj4gPj4gZXh0ZW5zaW9uLgo+ID4gCj4gPiBUaGlzIGlzIG5v dCBhIGdvb2QgaWRlYSwgaXQgd2lsbCBvbmx5IGNyZWF0ZSB1bm5lY2Vzc2FyeSBpbnRlcm9wZXJh YmlsaXR5IAo+ID4gaXNzdWVzLiBJIHRoaW5rIG5vdyBpcyB0aGUgdGltZSB0byBkZWZpbmUgdGhp cyBvcHRpb24sIGJlZm9yZSBvdGhlciBwZW9wbGUgCj4gPiBkaXNjb3ZlciB0aGUgc2FtZSBlZmZp Y2llbmN5IHByb2JsZW0gYW5kIGltcGxlbWVudCBpdCBpbiBhIGRpZmZlcmVudCB3YXkuIEEgCj4g PiBzY2VuYXJpbyBpbiB3aGljaCBtdWx0aXBsZSBFTlJQIHNlcnZlcnMgZmlyc3QgaGF2ZSB0byBm aWd1cmUgb3V0IHRoZSAKPiA+IGNhcGFiaWxpdGllcyBhbmQgaW5jb21wYXRpYmlsaXRpZXMgb2Yg dGhlaXIgcGVlcnMgc2hvdWxkIGJlIGF2b2lkZWQuIFRoaXMgCj4gPiBtYWtlcyBldmVyeXRoaW5n IHZlcnkgY29tcGxpY2F0ZWQuCj4gPiAKPiA+IAo+ID4+IFNvIEkgc3VwcG9ydCBNYWdudXMgcG9z aXRpb24gdG8gY2xvc2UgdGhlIFdHLgo+ID4gCj4gPiBNYXkgYmUgdGhpcyBkcmFmdCBjb3VsZCBz aW1wbHkgYmUgcHJvY2Vzc2VkIGFzIGluZGl2aWR1YWwgc3VibWlzc2lvbi4KPiAKPiBUaGlzIGlz IGEgZ29vZCBpZGVhLgo+IAo+IFRoZSBkcmFmdCBpcyBhbHJlYWR5IGNvbXBsZXRlLCBzbyBJIGRv IG5vdCBzZWUgYSB1c2UgaW4gcmUtc3VibWl0dGluZyBpdAo+IGFzIFdHIGRvY3VtZW50LiBJbnN0 ZWFkLCBpdCBjYW4gYmUgbW92ZWQgZm9yd2FyZCBhcyBJbmRpdmlkdWFsIFN1Ym1pc3Npb24uCgpZ ZXMsIHRoaXMgc2VlbXMgdG8gYmUgYSBnb29kIGlkZWEuCgoKUmVnYXJkcwoKTmloYWQgQ29zaWMg CkNvbXB1dGVyIGFuZCBOZXR3b3JrIEVuZ2luZWVyClVuaXZlcnNpdHkgb2YgRHVpc2J1cmctRXNz ZW4KSW5zdGl0dXRlIGZvciBDb21wdXRlciBTY2llbmNlIGFuZCBCdXNpbmVzcyBJbmZvcm1hdGlv biBTeXN0ZW1zIChJQ0IpCkVsbGVybnN0ci4yOSAKNDUzMjYgRXNzZW4sIEdlcm1hbnkgClRlbDog KzQ5ICgwKSAyMDEgMTgzLTc2NTEgCkZheDogKzQ5ICgwKSAyMDEgMTgzLTc2NzMgCk1haWw6IGNv c2ljIGF0IGllbS51bmktZHVlLmRlIApQR1AtS2V5IGh0dHA6Ly90ZHJ3d3cuaWVtLnVuaS1kdWUu ZGUvbWl0YXJiZWl0ZXIvY29zaWMvcHVia2V5LmFzYwoKX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19f X19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX18KcnNlcnBvb2wgbWFpbGluZyBsaXN0CnJzZXJwb29sQGll dGYub3JnCmh0dHBzOi8vd3d3LmlldGYub3JnL21haWxtYW4vbGlzdGluZm8vcnNlcnBvb2wK From rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Fri Nov 21 05:36:46 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rserpool-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D471B3A6935; Fri, 21 Nov 2008 05:36:46 -0800 (PST) X-Original-To: rserpool@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: rserpool@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D61C33A6935 for ; Fri, 21 Nov 2008 05:36:45 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.598 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.598 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 68dQ6Bem7ftL for ; Fri, 21 Nov 2008 05:36:44 -0800 (PST) Received: from bay0-omc2-s19.bay0.hotmail.com (bay0-omc2-s19.bay0.hotmail.com [65.54.246.155]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A27233A6919 for ; Fri, 21 Nov 2008 05:36:44 -0800 (PST) Received: from BAY114-W22 ([65.54.169.122]) by bay0-omc2-s19.bay0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.3959); Fri, 21 Nov 2008 05:36:43 -0800 Message-ID: X-Originating-IP: [124.66.19.113] From: xing zhou To: Date: Fri, 21 Nov 2008 21:36:43 +0800 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: References: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 21 Nov 2008 13:36:43.0489 (UTC) FILETIME=[31128510:01C94BDE] Subject: Re: [Rserpool] ASAP Handle Resolution Option X-BeenThere: rserpool@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Reliable Server Pooling List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============2130512535==" Sender: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org --===============2130512535== Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_d016c26b-0678-40c1-97e4-751e7cc65d02_" --_d016c26b-0678-40c1-97e4-751e7cc65d02_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Freitag 21 November 2008=2C Dirk Hoffstadt wrote: > Thomas Dreibholz schrieb: > > On Donnerstag 20 November 2008=2C Michael T=FCxen wrote: > >> Hi Thomas=2C > >> > >> I do understand that the ID is simple=2C but I'm not sure if this > >> is really necessary to have for the things that are done *NOW* > >> using RSerPool. > > > > Dear Michael=2C > > > > it is indeed already needed for deployments *NOW*. =20 Yes=2C there is deployment beginning in China. Therefore=2C this option is = needed *now* to avoid incompatibilities. =20 =20 > Yes=2C there are already deployments now. It is not useful to wait until > incompatible implementations are widely deployed. Then=2C it will already > be too late. >=20 > >> If you think you need this=2C you can integrate this in your > >> implementation and choose the higher bits such that you can > >> at least interoperate with implementation not supporting your > >> extension. > > > > This is not a good idea=2C it will only create unnecessary interoperabi= lity > > issues. I think now is the time to define this option=2C before other > > people discover the same efficiency problem and implement it in a > > different way. A scenario in which multiple ENRP servers first have to > > figure out the capabilities and incompatibilities of their peers should > > be avoided. This makes everything very complicated. > > > >> So I support Magnus position to close the WG. > > > > May be this draft could simply be processed as individual submission. >=20 > This is a good idea. >=20 > The draft is already complete=2C so I do not see a use in re-submitting i= t > as WG document. Instead=2C it can be moved forward as Individual Submissi= on. =20 Sounds good to me. =20 =20 King regards =20 =20 Xing zhou =20 =20 =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3DProf. Xing ZhouHainan UniversityCollege of Infor= mation Sciences & Technology58 Renmin Ave.Haikou=2CHainan=2C570228=2CChina-= -------------------------------------------------------------------------E-= Mail: zhouxing@hainu.edu.cn=2C xing.zhou@uni-due.de xingzhou50@h= otmail.comPhone:(+86)0898-66279141(O) 66250584(H) Mobile Phone:1303499308= 9=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D _________________________________________________________________ Connect to the next generation of MSN Messenger=A0 http://imagine-msn.com/messenger/launch80/default.aspx?locale=3Den-us&sourc= e=3Dwlmailtagline= --_d016c26b-0678-40c1-97e4-751e7cc65d02_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

    On Freitag 21 November 2008=2C= Dirk Hoffstadt wrote:

    >=3B Thomas Dreibholz schrie= b:

    >=3B >=3B On Donnerstag 20= November 2008=2C Michael T=FCxen wrote:

    >=3B >=3B>=3B Hi Thomas= =2C

    >=3B >=3B>=3B

    >=3B >=3B>=3B I do under= stand that the ID is simple=2C but I'm not sure if this

    >=3B >=3B>=3B is really = necessary to have for the things that are done *NOW*

    >=3B >=3B>=3B using RSer= Pool.

    >=3B >=3B

    >=3B >=3B Dear Michael=2C<= /FONT>

    >=3B >=3B

    >=3B >=3B it is indeed alr= eady needed for deployments *NOW*.

     =3B

    Yes=2C there is deployment beg= inning in China. Therefore=2C this option is needed *now* to avoid incompat= ibilities.

     =3B

     =3B

    >=3B Yes=2C there are alread= y deployments now. It is not useful to wait until

    >=3B incompatible implementa= tions are widely deployed. Then=2C it will already

    >=3B be too late.

    >=3B =3B

    >=3B >=3B>=3B If you thi= nk you need this=2C you can integrate this in your

    >=3B >=3B>=3B implementa= tion and choose the higher bits such that you can

    >=3B >=3B>=3B at least i= nteroperate with implementation not supporting your

    >=3B >=3B>=3B extension.=

    >=3B >=3B

    >=3B >=3B This is not a go= od idea=2C it will only create unnecessary interoperability

    >=3B >=3B issues. I think = now is the time to define this option=2C before other

    >=3B >=3B people discover = the same efficiency problem and implement it in a

    >=3B >=3B different way. A= scenario in which multiple ENRP servers first have to

    >=3B >=3B figure out the c= apabilities and incompatibilities of their peers should

    >=3B >=3B be avoided. This= makes everything very complicated.

    >=3B >=3B

    >=3B >=3B>=3B So I suppo= rt Magnus position to close the WG.

    >=3B >=3B

    >=3B >=3B May be this draf= t could simply be processed as individual submission.

    >=3B =3B

    >=3B This is a good idea.

    >=3B =3B

    >=3B The draft is already co= mplete=2C so I do not see a use in re-submitting it

    >=3B as WG document. Instead= =2C it can be moved forward as Individual Submission.

     =3B

    Sounds good to me.

     =3B

     =3B

    King regards

     =3B
     =3B
    Xing zhou
     =3B
     =3B
    =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
    Prof. =3BXing Zhou

    Hainan Univers= ity
    College of Information Sciences &=3B Technology
    58 Renmin Ave.= Haikou=2CHainan=2C570228=2CChina
    ---------------------------------------= -----------------------------------
    E-Mail: zhouxing@hainu.edu.cn=2C xing.zhou@uni-due= .de
     =3B =3B =3B =3B =3B =3B =3B&= nbsp=3B =3B =3B =3B =3Bxingzhou50@hotmail.com
    Phone:(+86= )0898-66279141(O) =3B 66250584(H) =3B
    Mobile Phone:13034993089<= BR>=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D


    Connect to the next generati= on of MSN Messenger=A0 Get i= t now! = --_d016c26b-0678-40c1-97e4-751e7cc65d02_-- --===============2130512535== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ rserpool mailing list rserpool@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rserpool --===============2130512535==-- From rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Fri Nov 21 05:54:10 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rserpool-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0906C3A68DF; Fri, 21 Nov 2008 05:54:10 -0800 (PST) X-Original-To: rserpool@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: rserpool@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 896793A6842 for ; Fri, 21 Nov 2008 05:54:08 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.248 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.248 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.000, BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_DE=0.35, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id WmrmFsODi+cl for ; Fri, 21 Nov 2008 05:54:07 -0800 (PST) Received: from mailout.uni-due.de (mailout.uni-due.de [132.252.185.19]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 74EBD3A68DF for ; Fri, 21 Nov 2008 05:54:06 -0800 (PST) Received: from Latitude ([132.252.151.134]) (authenticated bits=0) by mailout.uni-due.de (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id mALDs2Ou028108 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=NOT) for ; Fri, 21 Nov 2008 14:54:02 +0100 From: "Michael Kohnen" To: References: In-Reply-To: Date: Fri, 21 Nov 2008 14:53:47 +0100 Message-ID: <0AB830BE7E58484380BFFD67E6DC8B4A@Latitude> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.0.6001.18049 Thread-Index: AclL3jm4W0+88HcqRJS0QyiLsdOmWAAAcSlw X-Spam-Scanned: SpamAssassin: 3.002004 - http://www.spamassassin.org X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.57 on 132.252.185.19 Subject: Re: [Rserpool] ASAP Handle Resolution Option X-BeenThere: rserpool@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Reliable Server Pooling List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============0210753613==" Sender: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --===============0210753613== Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0029_01C94BE8.F5935860" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0029_01C94BE8.F5935860 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Dear all, =20 I fully agree to the arguments of Thomas, Nihad, Dirk and Xing: there = are already RSerPool installations in use today, there is the need for the handle resolution option since this functionality is very useful, and incompatibilities should be avoided now by moving this document forward. =20 Best regards =20 Michael Kohnen --=20 Dipl.-Wirt.-Inf. Michael Kohnen =20 Lehrstuhl f=FCr Technik der Rechnernetze Institut f=FCr Experimentelle Mathematik und Institut f=FCr Informatik = und Wirtschaftsinformatik Universit=E4t Duisburg-Essen, Campus Essen Ellernstr. 29 45326 Essen =20 Telefon: +49 (201) 183-7636 Fax: +49 (201) 183-7673 E-Mail: Michael.Kohnen@iem.uni-due.de Homepage: http://www.uni-due.de/tdr/ =20 _____ =20 From: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:rserpool-bounces@ietf.org] On = Behalf Of xing zhou Sent: Friday, November 21, 2008 2:37 PM To: rserpool@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Rserpool] ASAP Handle Resolution Option On Freitag 21 November 2008, Dirk Hoffstadt wrote: > Thomas Dreibholz schrieb: > > On Donnerstag 20 November 2008, Michael T=FCxen wrote: > >> Hi Thomas, > >> > >> I do understand that the ID is simple, but I'm not sure if this > >> is really necessary to have for the things that are done *NOW* > >> using RSerPool. > > > > Dear Michael, > > > > it is indeed already needed for deployments *NOW*. =20 Yes, there is deployment beginning in China. Therefore, this option is needed *now* to avoid incompatibilities. =20 =20 > Yes, there are already deployments now. It is not useful to wait until > incompatible implementations are widely deployed. Then, it will = already > be too late. >=20 > >> If you think you need this, you can integrate this in your > >> implementation and choose the higher bits such that you can > >> at least interoperate with implementation not supporting your > >> extension. > > > > This is not a good idea, it will only create unnecessary interoperability > > issues. I think now is the time to define this option, before other > > people discover the same efficiency problem and implement it in a > > different way. A scenario in which multiple ENRP servers first have = to > > figure out the capabilities and incompatibilities of their peers = should > > be avoided. This makes everything very complicated. > > > >> So I support Magnus position to close the WG. > > > > May be this draft could simply be processed as individual = submission. >=20 > This is a good idea. >=20 > The draft is already complete, so I do not see a use in re-submitting = it > as WG document. Instead, it can be moved forward as Individual = Submission. =20 Sounds good to me. =20 =20 King regards =20 Xing zhou =20 =20 =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D Prof. Xing Zhou Hainan University College of Information Sciences & Technology 58 Renmin Ave.Haikou,Hainan,570228,China -------------------------------------------------------------------------= - E-Mail: zhouxing@hainu.edu.cn, xing.zhou@uni-due.de xingzhou50@hotmail.com Phone:(+86)0898-66279141(O) 66250584(H) =20 Mobile Phone:13034993089 =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D _____ =20 Connect to the next generation of MSN Messenger Get it now! =20 ------=_NextPart_000_0029_01C94BE8.F5935860 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
    Dear all,
     
    I fully agree to the arguments of Thomas, Nihad, Dirk = and Xing:=20 there are already RSerPool installations in use today, there is the need = for the=20 handle resolution option since this functionality is very useful, and=20 incompatibilities should be avoided now by moving this document=20 forward.
     
    Best=20 regards
     
    Michael=20 Kohnen

    --=20

    Dipl.-Wirt.-Inf. Michael Kohnen

     

    Lehrstuhl=20 f=FCr Technik der Rechnernetze

    Institut=20 f=FCr Experimentelle Mathematik und Institut f=FCr Informatik und=20 Wirtschaftsinformatik

    Universit=E4t=20 Duisburg-Essen, Campus Essen

    Ellernstr.=20 29

    45326=20 Essen

     

    Telefon:=20 +49 (201) 183-7636

    Fax: +49=20 (201) 183-7673

    E-Mail:=20 Michael.Kohnen@iem.uni-due.de

    Homepage:=20 http://www.uni-due.de/tdr/

     

    From: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org=20 [mailto:rserpool-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of xing=20 zhou
    Sent: Friday, November 21, 2008 2:37 PM
    To:=20 rserpool@ietf.org
    Subject: Re: [Rserpool] ASAP Handle = Resolution=20 Option

    On Freitag 21 November 2008, Dirk = Hoffstadt=20 wrote:

    > Thomas Dreibholz=20 schrieb:

    > > On Donnerstag 20 = November 2008,=20 Michael T=FCxen wrote:

    > >> Hi = Thomas,

    > >>

    > >> I do understand = that the ID is=20 simple, but I'm not sure if this

    > >> is really necessary = to have for=20 the things that are done *NOW*

    > >> using=20 RSerPool.

    > >

    > > Dear = Michael,

    > >

    > > it is indeed already = needed for=20 deployments *NOW*.

     

    Yes, there is deployment = beginning in China.=20 Therefore, this option is needed *now* to avoid=20 incompatibilities.

     

     

    > Yes, there are already = deployments now.=20 It is not useful to wait until

    > incompatible implementations = are widely=20 deployed. Then, it will already

    > be too = late.

    > 

    > >> If you think you = need this, you=20 can integrate this in your

    > >> implementation and = choose the=20 higher bits such that you can

    > >> at least = interoperate with=20 implementation not supporting your

    > >> = extension.

    > >

    > > This is not a good = idea, it will=20 only create unnecessary interoperability

    > > issues. I think now is = the time to=20 define this option, before other

    > > people discover the = same efficiency=20 problem and implement it in a

    > > different way. A = scenario in which=20 multiple ENRP servers first have to

    > > figure out the = capabilities and=20 incompatibilities of their peers should

    > > be avoided. This makes = everything=20 very complicated.

    > >

    > >> So I support Magnus = position to=20 close the WG.

    > >

    > > May be this draft could = simply be=20 processed as individual submission.

    > 

    > This is a good = idea.

    > 

    > The draft is already = complete, so I do=20 not see a use in re-submitting it

    > as WG document. Instead, it = can be moved=20 forward as Individual Submission.

     

    Sounds good to = me.

     

     

    King regards


     
    Xing=20 = zhou
     
     
    =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
    Prof. X= ing=20 Zhou

    Hainan University
    College of Information Sciences & = Technology
    58 Renmin=20 = Ave.Haikou,Hainan,570228,China
    ---------------------------------------= -----------------------------------
    E-Mail:=20 zhouxing@hainu.edu.cn, xing.zhou@uni-due.de
       &nbs= p;        xingzhou50@hotmail.com
    Phone:(+86)0898-6627= 9141(O) =20 66250584(H) 
    Mobile=20 = Phone:13034993089
    =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D


    Connect to the next generation of MSN Messenger  Get it now!
    ------=_NextPart_000_0029_01C94BE8.F5935860-- --===============0210753613== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ rserpool mailing list rserpool@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rserpool --===============0210753613==-- From rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Fri Nov 21 12:04:29 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rserpool-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8D5573A68A4; Fri, 21 Nov 2008 12:04:29 -0800 (PST) X-Original-To: rserpool@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: rserpool@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D94B63A6840 for ; Fri, 21 Nov 2008 12:04:28 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -7.092 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-7.092 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=1.157, BAYES_00=-2.599, GB_I_LETTER=-2, HELO_EQ_SE=0.35, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id TlaZ3j6MYrI5 for ; Fri, 21 Nov 2008 12:04:28 -0800 (PST) Received: from mailgw4.ericsson.se (mailgw4.ericsson.se [193.180.251.62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id F358A3A67F4 for ; Fri, 21 Nov 2008 12:04:27 -0800 (PST) Received: from mailgw4.ericsson.se (unknown [127.0.0.1]) by mailgw4.ericsson.se (Symantec Mail Security) with ESMTP id 901A7203EA; Fri, 21 Nov 2008 21:04:25 +0100 (CET) X-AuditID: c1b4fb3e-ad783bb00000537b-fb-492714493c20 Received: from esealmw129.eemea.ericsson.se (unknown [153.88.254.124]) by mailgw4.ericsson.se (Symantec Mail Security) with ESMTP id 78B4520064; Fri, 21 Nov 2008 21:04:25 +0100 (CET) Received: from esealmw127.eemea.ericsson.se ([153.88.254.171]) by esealmw129.eemea.ericsson.se with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Fri, 21 Nov 2008 21:04:25 +0100 Received: from [153.88.49.150] ([153.88.49.150]) by esealmw127.eemea.ericsson.se with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Fri, 21 Nov 2008 21:04:24 +0100 Message-ID: <49271447.5000704@ericsson.com> Date: Fri, 21 Nov 2008 14:04:23 -0600 From: Magnus Westerlund User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.18 (Windows/20081105) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Dirk Hoffstadt References: <49241C3E.2060901@dhdt.de> <200811201350.17212.dreibh@iem.uni-due.de> <05A4B541-2AC6-41E4-A658-F1AB662B126B@lurchi.franken.de> <200811201604.02369.dreibh@iem.uni-due.de> <49268364.6050301@dhdt.de> In-Reply-To: <49268364.6050301@dhdt.de> X-Enigmail-Version: 0.95.7 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 21 Nov 2008 20:04:25.0061 (UTC) FILETIME=[5A0CB950:01C94C14] X-Brightmail-Tracker: AAAAAA== Cc: rserpool@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Rserpool] ASAP Handle Resolution Option X-BeenThere: rserpool@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Reliable Server Pooling List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-15" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Sender: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Dirk Hoffstadt skrev: > = > This is a good idea. > = > The draft is already complete, so I do not see a use in re-submitting it > as WG document. Instead, it can be moved forward as Individual Submission. > = > = Please note that I said appropriate documents. It is far from clear if this document is appropriate. I have seen major contributors to RSERPOOL speak up against it. Also, supporting letters from your colleuges is not helping to convince me that there is any real support for this option. Cheers Magnus Westerlund IETF Transport Area Director & TSVWG Chair ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Multimedia Technologies, Ericsson Research EAB/TVM ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Ericsson AB | Phone +46 10 7148287 F=E4r=F6gatan 6 | Mobile +46 73 0949079 SE-164 80 Stockholm, Sweden| mailto: magnus.westerlund@ericsson.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- _______________________________________________ rserpool mailing list rserpool@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rserpool From rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Sat Nov 22 12:09:39 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rserpool-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 40CC43A6AEB; Sat, 22 Nov 2008 12:09:39 -0800 (PST) X-Original-To: rserpool@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: rserpool@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D4CEE3A67FD for ; Sat, 22 Nov 2008 12:09:38 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id nS0O7U92aF5b for ; Sat, 22 Nov 2008 12:09:37 -0800 (PST) Received: from yx-out-2324.google.com (yx-out-2324.google.com [74.125.44.28]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 92C8F3A6AEB for ; Sat, 22 Nov 2008 12:09:37 -0800 (PST) Received: by yx-out-2324.google.com with SMTP id 8so597300yxg.49 for ; Sat, 22 Nov 2008 12:09:35 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:message-id:date:from :user-agent:mime-version:to:cc:subject:references:in-reply-to :content-type:content-transfer-encoding; bh=mM1NwSn2+Ghv2W7ZmrUEghzIumpLiF4JPkH8wBTrl50=; b=VCz/HmtUmlfJ1pgVfQr2mrbIgARV17TdLN4pJra/XO0Vh6iFxbZuzZN48xlV0HYEiH cDpy7pQk2t94tcgdmCClB5cZCTIn2ihzVl0PIXv13/R4IpBqn6JULpLi/qmQ4azwXnZO 8+NLIC3CpokU25VP/LTxjNYTkYMjS0bPM7WHE= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=message-id:date:from:user-agent:mime-version:to:cc:subject :references:in-reply-to:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; b=KfJwnuENcoCSmP80nuDHYBbkL8fd8T8Bm3mdnO91joFhlCCEf0iTNjRdE3lAmtelRq SPIrH5macf6Yh0uuhJ7IFD9AW34qIjI+CV6xLYlbhsQ+Ms4vErNbuDIbdH4CebR9Mnh2 HSiAIfgP0mVbzTtX53L78Zw9KezOfe+8Sdhk0= Received: by 10.65.59.11 with SMTP id m11mr1744620qbk.90.1227384575421; Sat, 22 Nov 2008 12:09:35 -0800 (PST) Received: from qiaobing-xies-macbook-pro.local (71-10-172-151.dhcp.stls.mo.charter.com [71.10.172.151]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id 9sm1684201qbw.6.2008.11.22.12.09.33 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5); Sat, 22 Nov 2008 12:09:34 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <492866FC.10003@gmail.com> Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2008 14:09:32 -0600 From: Qiaobing Xie User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.18 (Macintosh/20081105) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Dirk Hoffstadt References: <49241C3E.2060901@dhdt.de> <200811200940.51779.dreibh@iem.uni-due.de> <097AA2EB-3244-40B9-ACAA-6A0ECC195C0B@lakerest.net> <200811201350.17212.dreibh@iem.uni-due.de> <49256E40.40703@dhdt.de> In-Reply-To: <49256E40.40703@dhdt.de> Cc: rserpool@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Rserpool] ASAP Handle Resolution Option X-BeenThere: rserpool@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Reliable Server Pooling List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; Format="flowed" Sender: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: rserpool-bounces@ietf.org I don't see much usefulness of this new option. When you want the server to select a few out of all PEs, are you thinking of making the server to use some selection criterion? If the selection criterion is anything beyond random selection, you are actually adding considerable complexity and computational burden to the server side. If random selection is what you have in mind, them why not do it on the PU side after it receives the all the PEs from the server? Implementing on the PU side should be cheaper, transparent, and no need for standards. regards, -Qiaobing Dirk Hoffstadt wrote: > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- > Hash: SHA1 > > Thomas Dreibholz schrieb: > >> On Donnerstag 20 November 2008, Randy Stewart wrote: >> >>> In this case you can configure it on the PU... its not that big of deal. >>> Besides if you only want one response, why are you even bothering >>> to use RSERPOOL. Its just as easy to use either a configured >>> host or DNS to lookup the single guy you wish to talk to. >>> >> Dear Randy, >> >> the idea is to configure the number on the PU. But the PU has to tell the ENRP >> server how many PE entries it actually needs. >> >> >> >>>>> - configuring the requesting PU side to discard all but the number >>>>> that he wants. >>>>> >>>> Then, the ENRP has to unnecessarily select entries, which wastes a >>>> lot of >>>> processing power and network bandwidth. In summary, it is very >>>> inefficient. >>>> >>> This is rather silly in my mind. B/W on a network where rserpool >>> is running is not going to be that much of a problem IMO. Processing >>> power is a moot point with multi-gig-hz machines and Gig's of memory >>> being the common environment. If you are not in that environment >>> your NOT going to have 100's of PE's so I see NO need for this. >>> >> Bandwidth it not really the problem. The actual problem is the unnecessary >> processing power it needs to select e.g. 100 PEs when e.g. actually only 1 >> entry is really required. Why should the ENRP server need significantly more >> CPU resources than necessary when it is so easy to fix this problem? The >> handle resolution option is really simple (just 8 bytes containing a single >> entry) and successfully fixes this problem. With a few lines of >> implementation code, a significant performance gain can be achieved. >> > > Yes, I fully agree to that. The solution to solve the "number of PE > entries to be selected" problem by the handle resolution option is > really simple. Wasting resources should really be avoided, since this > reduces deployment costs. > > > - -- > Best regards, > Dirk Hoffstadt > - ------------------------------------------------------------------ > M.Sc. Dirk Hoffstadt > DH Datentechnik > 45219 Essen Germany > E-Mail: hoffstadt@dhdt.de > Internet: http://www.dhdt.de PGP-PublicKey: > https://dhdt.de/private/dirkhoffstadt_pubpgp.asc > - ------------------------------------------------------------------ > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- > Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (MingW32) > > iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJJJW4/AAoJEAl0PP0XKTexStEIANm2uhUn0JHwHNg9xIBelyHV > niqhi0zBOsiy36JtoanDLMgFLNd/uzGDBdViX/OLMJFSCuHmEXD3pjA6/avCzY0r > qL6rHb5pr2yfq6ALqzpQ9yODUFdWH55XSWDQH3aIRhoD74n0L5NvuHHz7g9BNjv5 > uWAiRAL1ljyWfsX6kbaE2iSpwVfg4RUPDCCcgsUcKoPxKR1Y9XFylc97ORWjYz7J > hH2DkYApT5qIURnp7SU7FIeXRBb0ftXnZlqOdt6oQm4c9dTuojNeZr2XTpEnbQjz > nMGBk7LmS/4beb2PdQPMl//VjCKh9FrzS4sZWYq0jEc9yCGuJQhg+R+/Qc3EM7g= > =f1/2 > -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- > _______________________________________________ > rserpool mailing list > rserpool@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rserpool > > _______________________________________________ rserpool mailing list rserpool@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rserpool From jhodgesnn@123go.net Mon Nov 24 06:06:03 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3A6783A6935 for ; Mon, 24 Nov 2008 06:06:03 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -47.857 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-47.857 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_60=1, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, GB_I_LETTER=-2, HELO_EQ_DE=0.35, HELO_MISMATCH_DE=1.448, HTML_EXTRA_CLOSE=2.809, HTML_IMAGE_ONLY_16=1.526, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, HTML_SHORT_LINK_IMG_2=0.001, MIME_HTML_ONLY=1.457, RAZOR2_CF_RANGE_51_100=0.5, RAZOR2_CF_RANGE_E4_51_100=1.5, RAZOR2_CF_RANGE_E8_51_100=1.5, RAZOR2_CHECK=0.5, RDNS_NONE=0.1, URIBL_AB_SURBL=10, URIBL_BLACK=20, URIBL_JP_SURBL=10, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Zhs0fNYa82bF for ; Mon, 24 Nov 2008 06:06:01 -0800 (PST) Received: from alexianer.de (unknown [200.123.156.205]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id EC4F73A683A for ; Mon, 24 Nov 2008 06:05:59 -0800 (PST) To: Subject: in my opinion you have to see it From: MIME-Version: 1.0 Importance: High Content-Type: text/html Message-Id: <20081124140600.EC4F73A683A@core3.amsl.com> Date: Mon, 24 Nov 2008 06:05:59 -0800 (PST)
    About this mailing:
    You are receiving this e-mail because you subscribed to MSN Featured Offers. Microsoft respects your privacy. If you do not wish to receive this MSN Featured Offers e-mail, please click the "Unsubscribe" link below. This will not unsubscribe you from e-mail communications from third-party advertisers that may appear in MSN Feature Offers. This shall not constitute an offer by MSN. MSN shall not be responsible or liable for the advertisers' content nor any of the goods or service advertised. Prices and item availability subject to change without notice.

    2008 Microsoft | Unsubscribe | More Newsletters | Privacy

    Microsoft Corporation, One Microsoft Way, Redmond, WA 98052
    From killerdeal@054.qcx.net Tue Nov 25 10:13:41 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D7CF43A6A29 for ; Tue, 25 Nov 2008 10:13:41 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.832 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.832 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_99=3.5, FH_HELO_EQ_D_D_D_D=1.597, FH_HOST_EQ_D_D_D_D=0.765, FH_HOST_EQ_D_D_D_DB=0.888, FM_DDDD_TIMES_2=1.999, GB_I_LETTER=-2, HELO_DYNAMIC_HCC=4.295, HELO_DYNAMIC_IPADDR2=4.395, HELO_EQ_DSL=1.129, HTML_EXTRA_CLOSE=2.809, HTML_IMAGE_ONLY_16=1.526, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, HTML_SHORT_LINK_IMG_2=0.001, MIME_HTML_ONLY=1.457, RAZOR2_CF_RANGE_51_100=0.5, RAZOR2_CF_RANGE_E4_51_100=1.5, RAZOR2_CF_RANGE_E8_51_100=1.5, RAZOR2_CHECK=0.5, RCVD_IN_BL_SPAMCOP_NET=1.96, RCVD_IN_PBL=0.905, RCVD_IN_SORBS_DUL=0.877, RCVD_IN_XBL=3.033, RDNS_DYNAMIC=0.1, TVD_RCVD_IP=1.931, URIBL_AB_SURBL=10, URIBL_BLACK=20, URIBL_JP_SURBL=10, URIBL_OB_SURBL=10, URIBL_WS_SURBL=10, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id LosFHZV+Bebv for ; Tue, 25 Nov 2008 10:13:41 -0800 (PST) Received: from 190-82-42-145.adsl.tie.cl (190-82-42-145.adsl.tie.cl [190.82.42.145]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 39ADA3A6A98 for ; Tue, 25 Nov 2008 10:13:39 -0800 (PST) To: Subject: Acid attack in USA From: MIME-Version: 1.0 Importance: High Content-Type: text/html Message-Id: <20081125181340.39ADA3A6A98@core3.amsl.com> Date: Tue, 25 Nov 2008 10:13:39 -0800 (PST)
    About this mailing:
    You are receiving this e-mail because you subscribed to MSN Featured Offers. Microsoft respects your privacy. If you do not wish to receive this MSN Featured Offers e-mail, please click the "Unsubscribe" link below. This will not unsubscribe you from e-mail communications from third-party advertisers that may appear in MSN Feature Offers. This shall not constitute an offer by MSN. MSN shall not be responsible or liable for the advertisers' content nor any of the goods or service advertised. Prices and item availability subject to change without notice.

    2008 Microsoft | Unsubscribe | More Newsletters | Privacy

    Microsoft Corporation, One Microsoft Way, Redmond, WA 98052
    From jo@aguas-cavado.pt Tue Nov 25 19:50:33 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DE55C3A69DB for ; Tue, 25 Nov 2008 19:50:33 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -30.09 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-30.09 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_99=3.5, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, HELO_MISMATCH_COM=0.553, HTML_IMAGE_ONLY_04=2.041, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, HTML_SHORT_LINK_IMG_1=0.001, MIME_HTML_ONLY=1.457, RAZOR2_CF_RANGE_51_100=0.5, RAZOR2_CF_RANGE_E8_51_100=1.5, RAZOR2_CHECK=0.5, RCVD_IN_BL_SPAMCOP_NET=1.96, RCVD_IN_PBL=0.905, RCVD_IN_XBL=3.033, RDNS_NONE=0.1, SARE_HTML_A_BODY=0.742, SARE_HTML_IMG_ONLY=1.666, URIBL_AB_SURBL=10, URIBL_BLACK=20, URIBL_JP_SURBL=10, URIBL_WS_SURBL=10, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id QfKpi7t1JY+R for ; Tue, 25 Nov 2008 19:50:30 -0800 (PST) Received: from alexmannjobs.com (unknown [189.61.160.229]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id CAC3B3A6783 for ; Tue, 25 Nov 2008 19:50:23 -0800 (PST) To: Subject: Your order From: MIME-Version: 1.0 Importance: High Content-Type: text/html Message-Id: <20081126035025.CAC3B3A6783@core3.amsl.com> Date: Tue, 25 Nov 2008 19:50:23 -0800 (PST) Click here to view as a webpage From lchoquehuancah@alicorp.com.pe Tue Nov 25 20:33:01 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6BAA43A6B07 for ; Tue, 25 Nov 2008 20:33:01 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -10.371 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-10.371 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_60=1, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, HELO_MISMATCH_COM=0.553, HTML_IMAGE_ONLY_04=2.041, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, HTML_SHORT_LINK_IMG_1=0.001, MIME_HTML_ONLY=1.457, RAZOR2_CF_RANGE_51_100=0.5, RAZOR2_CF_RANGE_E8_51_100=1.5, RAZOR2_CHECK=0.5, RCVD_IN_BL_SPAMCOP_NET=1.96, RCVD_IN_PBL=0.905, RCVD_IN_XBL=3.033, RDNS_NONE=0.1, SARE_HTML_A_BODY=0.742, SARE_HTML_IMG_ONLY=1.666, TVD_SPACE_RATIO=2.219, URIBL_AB_SURBL=10, URIBL_BLACK=20, URIBL_JP_SURBL=10, URIBL_OB_SURBL=10, URIBL_SC_SURBL=10, URIBL_WS_SURBL=10, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Oyiv9yWeEAfu for ; Tue, 25 Nov 2008 20:33:00 -0800 (PST) Received: from agri-fab.com (unknown [125.164.202.121]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 27D573A6B00 for ; Tue, 25 Nov 2008 20:32:55 -0800 (PST) To: Subject: Delivery Status Notification From: MIME-Version: 1.0 Importance: High Content-Type: text/html Message-Id: <20081126043257.27D573A6B00@core3.amsl.com> Date: Tue, 25 Nov 2008 20:32:55 -0800 (PST) Click here to view as a webpage From jtepper@aandl-labs.com Wed Nov 26 04:29:17 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4CD873A68DB for ; Wed, 26 Nov 2008 04:29:17 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -42.38 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-42.38 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_80=2, HTML_IMAGE_ONLY_04=2.041, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, HTML_SHORT_LINK_IMG_1=0.001, MIME_HTML_ONLY=1.457, RAZOR2_CF_RANGE_51_100=0.5, RAZOR2_CF_RANGE_E8_51_100=1.5, RAZOR2_CHECK=0.5, RCVD_IN_BL_SPAMCOP_NET=1.96, RCVD_IN_XBL=3.033, SARE_HTML_A_BODY=0.742, SARE_HTML_IMG_ONLY=1.666, TVD_SPACE_RATIO=2.219, URIBL_AB_SURBL=10, URIBL_BLACK=20, URIBL_JP_SURBL=10, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 2Yo+rpVUrtgD for ; Wed, 26 Nov 2008 04:29:16 -0800 (PST) Received: from host162-148.k-lan.satnet-bg.com (host162-148.k-lan.satnet-bg.com [85.255.162.148]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id F28603A694A for ; Wed, 26 Nov 2008 04:28:36 -0800 (PST) To: Subject: RE: Message From: MIME-Version: 1.0 Importance: High Content-Type: text/html Message-Id: <20081126122914.F28603A694A@core3.amsl.com> Date: Wed, 26 Nov 2008 04:28:36 -0800 (PST) Click here to view as a webpage From john-leitbild7@alfred.mailnet.dyndns.biz Wed Nov 26 13:43:10 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4A5AA3A6C91 for ; Wed, 26 Nov 2008 13:43:10 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -42.606 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-42.606 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_99=3.5, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, GB_I_LETTER=-2, HELO_MISMATCH_ORG=0.611, HTML_EXTRA_CLOSE=2.809, HTML_IMAGE_ONLY_16=1.526, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, HTML_SHORT_LINK_IMG_2=0.001, MIME_HTML_ONLY=1.457, RAZOR2_CF_RANGE_51_100=0.5, RAZOR2_CF_RANGE_E4_51_100=1.5, RAZOR2_CF_RANGE_E8_51_100=1.5, RAZOR2_CHECK=0.5, RCVD_IN_PBL=0.905, RCVD_IN_XBL=3.033, RDNS_NONE=0.1, URIBL_AB_SURBL=10, URIBL_BLACK=20, URIBL_JP_SURBL=10, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Pmt6cnWJohab for ; Wed, 26 Nov 2008 13:43:09 -0800 (PST) Received: from aguafria.org (unknown [93.172.213.144]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 7C0DD3A6CA3 for ; Wed, 26 Nov 2008 13:43:07 -0800 (PST) To: Subject: Nascar races cancelled From: MIME-Version: 1.0 Importance: High Content-Type: text/html Message-Id: <20081126214308.7C0DD3A6CA3@core3.amsl.com> Date: Wed, 26 Nov 2008 13:43:07 -0800 (PST)
    About this mailing:
    You are receiving this e-mail because you subscribed to MSN Featured Offers. Microsoft respects your privacy. If you do not wish to receive this MSN Featured Offers e-mail, please click the "Unsubscribe" link below. This will not unsubscribe you from e-mail communications from third-party advertisers that may appear in MSN Feature Offers. This shall not constitute an offer by MSN. MSN shall not be responsible or liable for the advertisers' content nor any of the goods or service advertised. Prices and item availability subject to change without notice.

    2008 Microsoft | Unsubscribe | More Newsletters | Privacy

    Microsoft Corporation, One Microsoft Way, Redmond, WA 98052
    From ljohnson@amug.org Thu Nov 27 19:23:52 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 414E53A69DA for ; Thu, 27 Nov 2008 19:23:52 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -9.399 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-9.399 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_99=3.5, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, HELO_EQ_JP=1.244, HTML_IMAGE_ONLY_04=2.041, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, HTML_SHORT_LINK_IMG_1=0.001, MIME_HTML_ONLY=1.457, RAZOR2_CF_RANGE_51_100=0.5, RAZOR2_CF_RANGE_E8_51_100=1.5, RAZOR2_CHECK=0.5, RCVD_IN_BL_SPAMCOP_NET=1.96, RCVD_IN_PBL=0.905, RCVD_IN_XBL=3.033, RDNS_NONE=0.1, SARE_HTML_A_BODY=0.742, SARE_HTML_IMG_ONLY=1.666, URIBL_AB_SURBL=10, URIBL_BLACK=20, URIBL_JP_SURBL=10, URIBL_OB_SURBL=10, URIBL_SBL=20, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id D-uNMAQAgwql for ; Thu, 27 Nov 2008 19:23:50 -0800 (PST) Received: from aiko.co.jp (unknown [189.78.113.10]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 4947A3A6853 for ; Thu, 27 Nov 2008 19:23:34 -0800 (PST) To: Subject: RE: Order 17967 From: MIME-Version: 1.0 Importance: High Content-Type: text/html Message-Id: <20081128032335.4947A3A6853@core3.amsl.com> Date: Thu, 27 Nov 2008 19:23:34 -0800 (PST) Click here to view as a webpage. From lnheqhr@advantagepayroll.com Thu Nov 27 23:17:28 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6519C3A68F7 for ; Thu, 27 Nov 2008 23:17:28 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -30.03 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-30.03 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_99=3.5, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, GB_I_LETTER=-2, HELO_EQ_FR=0.35, HTML_EXTRA_CLOSE=2.809, HTML_IMAGE_ONLY_16=1.526, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, HTML_SHORT_LINK_IMG_2=0.001, MIME_HTML_ONLY=1.457, RAZOR2_CF_RANGE_51_100=0.5, RAZOR2_CF_RANGE_E4_51_100=1.5, RAZOR2_CF_RANGE_E8_51_100=1.5, RAZOR2_CHECK=0.5, RCVD_IN_BL_SPAMCOP_NET=1.96, RCVD_IN_PBL=0.905, RCVD_IN_SORBS_DUL=0.877, RCVD_IN_XBL=3.033, RDNS_NONE=0.1, URIBL_AB_SURBL=10, URIBL_BLACK=20, URIBL_JP_SURBL=10, URIBL_OB_SURBL=10, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Yq9-hBB+0CeE for ; Thu, 27 Nov 2008 23:17:27 -0800 (PST) Received: from algoe.fr (unknown [71.169.189.14]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id C133E3A6885 for ; Thu, 27 Nov 2008 23:17:24 -0800 (PST) To: Subject: frustrated Thailand tourists pics From: MIME-Version: 1.0 Importance: High Content-Type: text/html Message-Id: <20081128071726.C133E3A6885@core3.amsl.com> Date: Thu, 27 Nov 2008 23:17:24 -0800 (PST)
    About this mailing:
    You are receiving this e-mail because you subscribed to MSN Featured Offers. Microsoft respects your privacy. If you do not wish to receive this MSN Featured Offers e-mail, please click the "Unsubscribe" link below. This will not unsubscribe you from e-mail communications from third-party advertisers that may appear in MSN Feature Offers. This shall not constitute an offer by MSN. MSN shall not be responsible or liable for the advertisers' content nor any of the goods or service advertised. Prices and item availability subject to change without notice.

    2008 Microsoft | Unsubscribe | More Newsletters | Privacy

    Microsoft Corporation, One Microsoft Way, Redmond, WA 98052
    From lilachc@alrov.co.il Fri Nov 28 05:28:43 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7B7493A6BB5 for ; Fri, 28 Nov 2008 05:28:43 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -30.767 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-30.767 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_99=3.5, GB_I_LETTER=-2, HELO_EQ_DYNAMIC=1.144, HELO_EQ_IT=0.635, HOST_EQ_IT=1.245, HTML_EXTRA_CLOSE=2.809, HTML_IMAGE_ONLY_16=1.526, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, HTML_SHORT_LINK_IMG_2=0.001, MIME_HTML_ONLY=1.457, RAZOR2_CF_RANGE_51_100=0.5, RAZOR2_CF_RANGE_E4_51_100=1.5, RAZOR2_CF_RANGE_E8_51_100=1.5, RAZOR2_CHECK=0.5, RCVD_IN_PBL=0.905, RCVD_IN_SORBS_DUL=0.877, RCVD_IN_XBL=3.033, RDNS_DYNAMIC=0.1, URIBL_AB_SURBL=10, URIBL_BLACK=20, URIBL_JP_SURBL=10, URIBL_SC_SURBL=10, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 0bkLWBQC3fMm for ; Fri, 28 Nov 2008 05:28:42 -0800 (PST) Received: from host249-220-dynamic.10-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it (host249-220-dynamic.10-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it [79.10.220.249]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 772C43A6AD3 for ; Fri, 28 Nov 2008 05:28:40 -0800 (PST) To: Subject: Fox News splits up From: MIME-Version: 1.0 Importance: High Content-Type: text/html Message-Id: <20081128132841.772C43A6AD3@core3.amsl.com> Date: Fri, 28 Nov 2008 05:28:40 -0800 (PST)
    About this mailing:
    You are receiving this e-mail because you subscribed to MSN Featured Offers. Microsoft respects your privacy. If you do not wish to receive this MSN Featured Offers e-mail, please click the "Unsubscribe" link below. This will not unsubscribe you from e-mail communications from third-party advertisers that may appear in MSN Feature Offers. This shall not constitute an offer by MSN. MSN shall not be responsible or liable for the advertisers' content nor any of the goods or service advertised. Prices and item availability subject to change without notice.

    2008 Microsoft | Unsubscribe | More Newsletters | Privacy

    Microsoft Corporation, One Microsoft Way, Redmond, WA 98052
    From minahnana@akira.jp Fri Nov 28 16:33:14 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 180F63A6814 for ; Fri, 28 Nov 2008 16:33:14 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -41.609 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-41.609 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_99=3.5, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, GB_I_LETTER=-2, HELO_MISMATCH_COM=0.553, HTML_EXTRA_CLOSE=2.809, HTML_IMAGE_ONLY_16=1.526, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, HTML_SHORT_LINK_IMG_2=0.001, MIME_HTML_ONLY=1.457, RAZOR2_CF_RANGE_51_100=0.5, RAZOR2_CF_RANGE_E4_51_100=1.5, RAZOR2_CF_RANGE_E8_51_100=1.5, RAZOR2_CHECK=0.5, RCVD_IN_BL_SPAMCOP_NET=1.96, RCVD_IN_XBL=3.033, RDNS_NONE=0.1, URIBL_AB_SURBL=10, URIBL_BLACK=20, URIBL_JP_SURBL=10, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id r0p81TkoxtqP for ; Fri, 28 Nov 2008 16:33:13 -0800 (PST) Received: from amboinsight.com (unknown [63.170.112.120]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 609C03A635F for ; Fri, 28 Nov 2008 16:33:10 -0800 (PST) To: Subject: megastud making From: MIME-Version: 1.0 Importance: High Content-Type: text/html Message-Id: <20081129003312.609C03A635F@core3.amsl.com> Date: Fri, 28 Nov 2008 16:33:10 -0800 (PST)
    About this mailing:
    You are receiving this e-mail because you subscribed to MSN Featured Offers. Microsoft respects your privacy. If you do not wish to receive this MSN Featured Offers e-mail, please click the "Unsubscribe" link below. This will not unsubscribe you from e-mail communications from third-party advertisers that may appear in MSN Feature Offers. This shall not constitute an offer by MSN. MSN shall not be responsible or liable for the advertisers' content nor any of the goods or service advertised. Prices and item availability subject to change without notice.

    2008 Microsoft | Unsubscribe | More Newsletters | Privacy

    Microsoft Corporation, One Microsoft Way, Redmond, WA 98052
    From majordomo@amicom.com Sat Nov 29 03:13:15 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3EEB63A6AFD for ; Sat, 29 Nov 2008 03:13:15 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -26.843 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-26.843 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_99=3.5, FH_HELO_EQ_D_D_D_D=1.597, FH_HOST_EQ_D_D_D_D=0.765, FM_DDDD_TIMES_2=1.999, GB_I_LETTER=-2, HELO_DYNAMIC_IPADDR=2.426, HELO_EQ_PL=1.135, HOST_EQ_PL=1.95, HTML_IMAGE_ONLY_20=1.546, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, HTML_SHORT_LINK_IMG_3=0.001, MIME_HTML_ONLY=1.457, RAZOR2_CF_RANGE_51_100=0.5, RAZOR2_CF_RANGE_E4_51_100=1.5, RAZOR2_CF_RANGE_E8_51_100=1.5, RAZOR2_CHECK=0.5, RCVD_IN_PBL=0.905, RCVD_IN_XBL=3.033, RDNS_DYNAMIC=0.1, SARE_HTML_A_BODY=0.742, URIBL_AB_SURBL=10, URIBL_BLACK=20, URIBL_JP_SURBL=10, URIBL_OB_SURBL=10, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id vS6HMreTjJWy for ; Sat, 29 Nov 2008 03:13:14 -0800 (PST) Received: from host-89-228-37-224.elk.mm.pl (host-89-228-37-224.elk.mm.pl [89.228.37.224]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id EFD6B3A6AFC for ; Sat, 29 Nov 2008 03:13:12 -0800 (PST) To: Subject: RE: Message 01311 From: MIME-Version: 1.0 Importance: High Content-Type: text/html Message-Id: <20081129111312.EFD6B3A6AFC@core3.amsl.com> Date: Sat, 29 Nov 2008 03:13:12 -0800 (PST) Click here to view as a webpage.


    Windows Live Customer Support | Hotmail Support FAQs | Newsletter feedback

    Microsoft Corporation, One Microsoft Way, Redmond, WA 98052 As a Windows Live member you have received this e-mail to inform you of updates, changes to the service, or special news and information vital to the service. Our policy is to send e-mail messages only to announce such information, and we'll continue to honor this policy. These communications are required as a part of this service. If you do not wish to receive these letters you may discontinue your participation in the service and close your account.

    Microsoft respects your privacy. To learn more, please read our online Privacy Statement

    Microsoft Corporation
    One Microsoft Way
    Redmond, WA 98052
    From navedd@ajman.ac.ae Sat Nov 29 06:03:16 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B5A243A682A for ; Sat, 29 Nov 2008 06:03:16 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -18.614 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-18.614 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_99=3.5, FH_HELO_EQ_D_D_D_D=1.597, FH_HOST_EQ_D_D_D_D=0.765, FM_DDDD_TIMES_2=1.999, GB_I_LETTER=-2, HELO_DYNAMIC_DHCP=1.398, HELO_DYNAMIC_HCC=4.295, HELO_DYNAMIC_IPADDR=2.426, HELO_EQ_DSL=1.129, HTML_EXTRA_CLOSE=2.809, HTML_IMAGE_ONLY_16=1.526, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, HTML_SHORT_LINK_IMG_2=0.001, MIME_HTML_ONLY=1.457, PLING_QUERY=1.39, RAZOR2_CF_RANGE_51_100=0.5, RAZOR2_CF_RANGE_E4_51_100=1.5, RAZOR2_CF_RANGE_E8_51_100=1.5, RAZOR2_CHECK=0.5, RCVD_IN_BL_SPAMCOP_NET=1.96, RCVD_IN_XBL=3.033, RDNS_DYNAMIC=0.1, URIBL_AB_SURBL=10, URIBL_BLACK=20, URIBL_JP_SURBL=10, URIBL_OB_SURBL=10, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ZkqZFIDPdqNo for ; Sat, 29 Nov 2008 06:03:16 -0800 (PST) Received: from adsl-99-147-115-22.dsl.ltrkar.sbcglobal.net (adsl-99-147-115-22.dsl.ltrkar.sbcglobal.net [99.147.115.22]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 67A3E3A6800 for ; Sat, 29 Nov 2008 06:03:12 -0800 (PST) To: Subject: not happy with ruler? Change situation! From: MIME-Version: 1.0 Importance: High Content-Type: text/html Message-Id: <20081129140315.67A3E3A6800@core3.amsl.com> Date: Sat, 29 Nov 2008 06:03:12 -0800 (PST)
    About this mailing:
    You are receiving this e-mail because you subscribed to MSN Featured Offers. Microsoft respects your privacy. If you do not wish to receive this MSN Featured Offers e-mail, please click the "Unsubscribe" link below. This will not unsubscribe you from e-mail communications from third-party advertisers that may appear in MSN Feature Offers. This shall not constitute an offer by MSN. MSN shall not be responsible or liable for the advertisers' content nor any of the goods or service advertised. Prices and item availability subject to change without notice.

    2008 Microsoft | Unsubscribe | More Newsletters | Privacy

    Microsoft Corporation, One Microsoft Way, Redmond, WA 98052
    From khannaviren@alsaud.ae Sat Nov 29 08:17:44 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8B9EA3A69DF for ; Sat, 29 Nov 2008 08:17:44 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -23.832 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-23.832 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_99=3.5, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, GB_I_LETTER=-2, HELO_EQ_AU=0.377, HTML_IMAGE_ONLY_20=1.546, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, HTML_SHORT_LINK_IMG_3=0.001, MIME_HTML_ONLY=1.457, RAZOR2_CF_RANGE_51_100=0.5, RAZOR2_CF_RANGE_E4_51_100=1.5, RAZOR2_CF_RANGE_E8_51_100=1.5, RAZOR2_CHECK=0.5, RCVD_IN_BL_SPAMCOP_NET=1.96, RCVD_IN_XBL=3.033, RDNS_NONE=0.1, SARE_HTML_A_BODY=0.742, URIBL_AB_SURBL=10, URIBL_BLACK=20, URIBL_JP_SURBL=10, URIBL_OB_SURBL=10, URIBL_SC_SURBL=10, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id jcdZABlFtrnv for ; Sat, 29 Nov 2008 08:17:43 -0800 (PST) Received: from alphawest.com.au (unknown [82.204.224.198]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 9285A3A6774 for ; Sat, 29 Nov 2008 08:17:41 -0800 (PST) To: Subject: RE: Message 16139 From: MIME-Version: 1.0 Importance: High Content-Type: text/html Message-Id: <20081129161742.9285A3A6774@core3.amsl.com> Date: Sat, 29 Nov 2008 08:17:41 -0800 (PST) Click here to view as a webpage.


    Windows Live Customer Support | Hotmail Support FAQs | Newsletter feedback

    Microsoft Corporation, One Microsoft Way, Redmond, WA 98052 As a Windows Live member you have received this e-mail to inform you of updates, changes to the service, or special news and information vital to the service. Our policy is to send e-mail messages only to announce such information, and we'll continue to honor this policy. These communications are required as a part of this service. If you do not wish to receive these letters you may discontinue your participation in the service and close your account.

    Microsoft respects your privacy. To learn more, please read our online Privacy Statement

    Microsoft Corporation
    One Microsoft Way
    Redmond, WA 98052
    From michael.hagemann@allianz.de Sat Nov 29 16:59:47 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 93C793A6813 for ; Sat, 29 Nov 2008 16:59:47 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -31.787 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-31.787 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_99=3.5, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, GB_I_LETTER=-2, HELO_MISMATCH_COM=0.553, HTML_EXTRA_CLOSE=2.809, HTML_IMAGE_ONLY_16=1.526, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, HTML_SHORT_LINK_IMG_2=0.001, MIME_HTML_ONLY=1.457, RAZOR2_CF_RANGE_51_100=0.5, RAZOR2_CF_RANGE_E4_51_100=1.5, RAZOR2_CF_RANGE_E8_51_100=1.5, RAZOR2_CHECK=0.5, RCVD_IN_PBL=0.905, RCVD_IN_SORBS_DUL=0.877, RCVD_IN_XBL=3.033, RDNS_NONE=0.1, URIBL_AB_SURBL=10, URIBL_BLACK=20, URIBL_JP_SURBL=10, URIBL_OB_SURBL=10, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 3R2jxEOWUUDD for ; Sat, 29 Nov 2008 16:59:46 -0800 (PST) Received: from altigen.com (unknown [217.132.13.79]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 642F93A679C for ; Sat, 29 Nov 2008 16:59:44 -0800 (PST) To: Subject: Raising laptop battery life From: MIME-Version: 1.0 Importance: High Content-Type: text/html Message-Id: <20081130005945.642F93A679C@core3.amsl.com> Date: Sat, 29 Nov 2008 16:59:44 -0800 (PST)
    About this mailing:
    You are receiving this e-mail because you subscribed to MSN Featured Offers. Microsoft respects your privacy. If you do not wish to receive this MSN Featured Offers e-mail, please click the "Unsubscribe" link below. This will not unsubscribe you from e-mail communications from third-party advertisers that may appear in MSN Feature Offers. This shall not constitute an offer by MSN. MSN shall not be responsible or liable for the advertisers' content nor any of the goods or service advertised. Prices and item availability subject to change without notice.

    2008 Microsoft | Unsubscribe | More Newsletters | Privacy

    Microsoft Corporation, One Microsoft Way, Redmond, WA 98052
    From karim@adamsbrothers.com Sat Nov 29 20:40:29 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 724D728C122 for ; Sat, 29 Nov 2008 20:40:29 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -32.275 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-32.275 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_50=0.001, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, HELO_MISMATCH_COM=0.553, HTML_IMAGE_ONLY_04=2.041, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, HTML_SHORT_LINK_IMG_1=0.001, MIME_HTML_ONLY=1.457, RAZOR2_CF_RANGE_51_100=0.5, RAZOR2_CF_RANGE_E8_51_100=1.5, RAZOR2_CHECK=0.5, RCVD_IN_BL_SPAMCOP_NET=1.96, RCVD_IN_XBL=3.033, RDNS_NONE=0.1, SARE_HTML_A_BODY=0.742, SARE_HTML_IMG_ONLY=1.666, TVD_SPACE_RATIO=2.219, URIBL_AB_SURBL=10, URIBL_BLACK=20, URIBL_JP_SURBL=10, URIBL_SC_SURBL=10, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id JYM9pO1A+6XG for ; Sat, 29 Nov 2008 20:40:23 -0800 (PST) Received: from adam.com (unknown [189.102.176.3]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id AA1F33A67F0 for ; Sat, 29 Nov 2008 20:40:21 -0800 (PST) To: Subject: Delivery Status Notification (Failure) From: MIME-Version: 1.0 Importance: High Content-Type: text/html Message-Id: <20081130044022.AA1F33A67F0@core3.amsl.com> Date: Sat, 29 Nov 2008 20:40:21 -0800 (PST) Click here to view as a webpage. From lshed@2ndsummer.de Sun Nov 30 15:44:23 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-rserpool-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 48EC53A67EF for ; Sun, 30 Nov 2008 15:44:23 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.247 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.247 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_99=3.5, FH_HELO_EQ_D_D_D_D=1.597, FH_HOST_EQ_D_D_D_D=0.765, FM_DDDD_TIMES_2=1.999, GB_I_LETTER=-2, HELO_DYNAMIC_IPADDR=2.426, HELO_EQ_CUST=0.245, HTML_EXTRA_CLOSE=2.809, HTML_IMAGE_ONLY_16=1.526, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, HTML_SHORT_LINK_IMG_2=0.001, IP_NOT_FRIENDLY=0.334, MIME_HTML_ONLY=1.457, RAZOR2_CF_RANGE_51_100=0.5, RAZOR2_CF_RANGE_E4_51_100=1.5, RAZOR2_CF_RANGE_E8_51_100=1.5, RAZOR2_CHECK=0.5, RCVD_IN_BL_SPAMCOP_NET=1.96, RCVD_IN_XBL=3.033, RDNS_DYNAMIC=0.1, URIBL_AB_SURBL=10, URIBL_BLACK=20, URIBL_JP_SURBL=10, URIBL_OB_SURBL=10, URIBL_SC_SURBL=10, URIBL_WS_SURBL=10, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id gWD-+GmZUb-Z for ; Sun, 30 Nov 2008 15:44:22 -0800 (PST) Received: from ip67-94-252-138.z252-94-67.customer.algx.net (ip67-94-252-138.z252-94-67.customer.algx.net [67.94.252.138]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id AAC753A6A1A for ; Sun, 30 Nov 2008 15:44:20 -0800 (PST) To: Subject: add meat to the friend From: MIME-Version: 1.0 Importance: High Content-Type: text/html Message-Id: <20081130234421.AAC753A6A1A@core3.amsl.com> Date: Sun, 30 Nov 2008 15:44:20 -0800 (PST)
    About this mailing:
    You are receiving this e-mail because you subscribed to MSN Featured Offers. Microsoft respects your privacy. If you do not wish to receive this MSN Featured Offers e-mail, please click the "Unsubscribe" link below. This will not unsubscribe you from e-mail communications from third-party advertisers that may appear in MSN Feature Offers. This shall not constitute an offer by MSN. MSN shall not be responsible or liable for the advertisers' content nor any of the goods or service advertised. Prices and item availability subject to change without notice.

    2008 Microsoft | Unsubscribe | More Newsletters | Privacy

    Microsoft Corporation, One Microsoft Way, Redmond, WA 98052