From hrogge@googlemail.com Tue Feb 1 08:18:53 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: manet@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: manet@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5AD3C3A6D27 for ; Tue, 1 Feb 2011 08:18:53 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.633 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.633 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.965, BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id NbnxvdJbd5mA for ; Tue, 1 Feb 2011 08:18:52 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-ey0-f172.google.com (mail-ey0-f172.google.com [209.85.215.172]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A80DE3A6CCE for ; Tue, 1 Feb 2011 08:18:51 -0800 (PST) Received: by eyd10 with SMTP id 10so3604003eyd.31 for ; Tue, 01 Feb 2011 08:22:08 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlemail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:from:to:subject:date:user-agent:x-kmail-markup :mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:message-id; bh=ZIAcLXTbhfs0PYspJfZ/3Zlw8cUPceY4r1jX9xSW3EY=; b=ZE+c74/6BuUAA02XCvtZTU8BHiuRf4Zw1BaVQ6Us3sKLd/Uj0RDjyLYI0Ir7Ng08Ut 6ROdhwUPKXIe8TubrYN7zfxgsU+naapMqTLRH4xf0Vn7LuX9dqIvYccHe//6Hca5ibs/ ZwS47D7U+mB5kHwGD6Ky6zGpyaMDkht9OJPUM= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=googlemail.com; s=gamma; h=from:to:subject:date:user-agent:x-kmail-markup:mime-version :content-type:content-transfer-encoding:message-id; b=PT6JdgKpk4rk4eurHudRZkrpNa+AaTd81kuoPhJh2njzv0Gqd/O9zjZTvJAvhKDFTp hwisgyEqeC/nNjwuvp4CxZdP88U7PC/SJg9Dn3ITUJhgooDPl9u3+FIoOQGcHFISygco vYYuRCWdrcEZ8htriLfRrAo7p5EGmaEBufjMQ= Received: by 10.14.25.70 with SMTP id y46mr8583876eey.49.1296577328121; Tue, 01 Feb 2011 08:22:08 -0800 (PST) Received: from core2.localnet (static-87-79-93-195.netcologne.de [87.79.93.195]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id t5sm17405323eeh.14.2011.02.01.08.22.06 (version=SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5); Tue, 01 Feb 2011 08:22:06 -0800 (PST) From: Henning Rogge To: manet@ietf.org Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2011 17:21:59 +0100 User-Agent: KMail/1.13.6 (Linux/2.6.37-gentoo; KDE/4.5.5; x86_64; ; ) X-KMail-Markup: true MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="nextPart10132468.RynXVRNvdQ"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; micalg=pgp-sha1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <201102011722.05308.hrogge@googlemail.com> Subject: [manet] OLSR.org NHDP interop result X-BeenThere: manet@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Mobile Ad-hoc Networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 01 Feb 2011 16:18:53 -0000 --nextPart10132468.RynXVRNvdQ Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary-01=_nMDSNkNAqu0sEI1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit --Boundary-01=_nMDSNkNAqu0sEI1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Another year, another update... Today I pushed a number of changes to the OLSR.org NHDP implementation (and= a=20 small fix into the packetbb API). The result does work well together with the NRL NHDP implementation (as lon= g=20 as you switch on the originator IPs). Henning Rogge =2D-=20 1) You can't win. 2) You can't break even. 3) You can't leave the game. =E2=80=94 The Laws of Thermodynamics, summarized --Boundary-01=_nMDSNkNAqu0sEI1 Content-Type: text/html; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Another yea= r, another update...

Today I pus= hed a number of changes to the OLSR.org NHDP implementation (and a small fi= x into the packetbb API).

The result = does work well together with the NRL NHDP implementation (as long as you sw= itch on the originator IPs).

Henning Rog= ge

--

1) You can'= t win.

2) You can'= t break even.

3) You can'= t leave the game.

=E2=80=94 T= he Laws of Thermodynamics, summarized

--Boundary-01=_nMDSNkNAqu0sEI1-- --nextPart10132468.RynXVRNvdQ Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name=signature.asc Content-Description: This is a digitally signed message part. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.17 (GNU/Linux) iEYEABECAAYFAk1IMy0ACgkQcenvcwAcHWfErQCfaCHABvnzzw6AN1/8O+RroCyT xbUAn0so/vduAlwv/12lJkJCa0Gr+ZLE =UT1U -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --nextPart10132468.RynXVRNvdQ-- From henning.rogge@fkie.fraunhofer.de Wed Feb 2 03:44:40 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: manet@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: manet@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A144A3A6C14 for ; Wed, 2 Feb 2011 03:44:40 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.831 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.831 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.513, BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_DE=0.35, RCVD_IN_PBL=0.905] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id anvPvLJMdmis for ; Wed, 2 Feb 2011 03:44:39 -0800 (PST) Received: from a.mx.fkie.fraunhofer.de (mailguard.fkie.fraunhofer.de [IPv6:2001:638:401:102:1aa9:5ff:fe5f:7f22]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 849C73A6BBE for ; Wed, 2 Feb 2011 03:44:38 -0800 (PST) Received: from rufsun5.fkie.fgan.de ([128.7.2.5] helo=mailhost.fgan.de) by a.mx.fkie.fraunhofer.de with esmtps (TLS1.0:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1PkbBk-00026B-G1 for manet@ietf.org; Wed, 02 Feb 2011 12:47:56 +0100 Received: from mailserv1.fkie.fgan.de ([128.7.96.101] helo=mailserv1.lorien.fkie.fgan.de) by mailhost.fgan.de with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1PkbBk-0002lm-7o for manet@ietf.org; Wed, 02 Feb 2011 12:47:56 +0100 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2011 12:47:01 +0100 Content-Type: multipart/signed; protocol="application/x-pkcs7-signature"; micalg=SHA1; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0005_01CBC2D7.46B7F810" Message-ID: X-MS-Has-Attach: yes X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [OLSRv2] Variable validity times for TC addresses Thread-Index: AcvCzuSD9y0xHN9pR3ullWf6T8lvkA== From: "Rogge Henning" To: X-Virus-Scanned: yes (ClamAV 0.96.5/12609/Wed Feb 2 06:51:10 2011) by a.mx.fkie.fraunhofer.de X-Scan-Signature: 8318846d41f6f18a0ab4cdd00a4712ab Subject: [manet] [OLSRv2] Variable validity times for TC addresses X-BeenThere: manet@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Mobile Ad-hoc Networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 02 Feb 2011 11:44:40 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01CBC2D7.46B7F810 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi, We are planning our OLSR.org OLSRv2 implementation at the moment. While discussing some details of the necessary datastructures of the OLSRv2 = draft, we noticed something interesting. The datastructures in the OLSRv2 draft are designed to store a single validity time for each stored node-edge or node-attached_network pair, = it does not store the validity time per node. I think we could exploit this fact in OLSRv2. I propose we allow the usage of a VTIME TLV for the addresses inside a = TC message to overwrite the validity times defined in the message TLV for a address. An usecase for this would be attached network entries in TCs. In many = cases this attached networks are hardwired to the OLSR router, so their status should stay static for long times. By applying them a longer VTime we = could safe space in the rest of the TCs (where we don't need to mention the attached network) without needing to send the attached network addresses = in their own message fragment. Another usecase would be to allow a local link metric algorithm to = estimate the agility of links and set custom validity times for each of them. = This could be a way to reduce the network traffic in highly heterogeneous networks. The second usecase might require that OLSRv2 allow the usage of = VTIME-TLVs in OLSRv2 Hello messages, so that the validity time can be copied into = the TCs of their neighbors. Henning Rogge -- Diplom-Informatiker Henning Rogge , Fraunhofer-Institut f=FCr=20 Kommunikation, Informationsverarbeitung und Ergonomie FKIE=20 Kommunikationssysteme (KOM) Neuenahrer Stra=DFe 20, 53343 Wachtberg,=20 Germany Telefon +49 228 9435-961, =A0 Fax +49 228 9435 685=20 mailto:henning.rogge@fkie.fraunhofer.de http://www.fkie.fraunhofer.de GPG: E1C6 0914 490B 3909 D944 F80D 4487 C67C 55EC CFE0 ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01CBC2D7.46B7F810 Content-Type: application/x-pkcs7-signature; name="smime.p7s" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="smime.p7s" MIAGCSqGSIb3DQEHAqCAMIACAQExCzAJBgUrDgMCGgUAMIAGCSqGSIb3DQEHAQAAoIIYAzCCA58w ggKHoAMCAQICASYwDQYJKoZIhvcNAQEFBQAwcTELMAkGA1UEBhMCREUxHDAaBgNVBAoTE0RldXRz Y2hlIFRlbGVrb20gQUcxHzAdBgNVBAsTFlQtVGVsZVNlYyBUcnVzdCBDZW50ZXIxIzAhBgNVBAMT GkRldXRzY2hlIFRlbGVrb20gUm9vdCBDQSAyMB4XDTk5MDcwOTEyMTEwMFoXDTE5MDcwOTIzNTkw MFowcTELMAkGA1UEBhMCREUxHDAaBgNVBAoTE0RldXRzY2hlIFRlbGVrb20gQUcxHzAdBgNVBAsT 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core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DC34D3A690F for ; Wed, 2 Feb 2011 04:34:20 -0800 (PST) X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.60,413,1291593600"; d="scan'208";a="113648207" Received: from unknown (HELO baemasodc004.greenlnk.net) ([10.108.36.11]) by Baemasodc001ir.sharelnk.net with ESMTP; 02 Feb 2011 12:37:40 +0000 Received: from glkms1102.GREENLNK.NET (glkms1102.greenlnk.net [10.108.36.193]) by baemasodc004.greenlnk.net (Switch-3.4.3/Switch-3.4.3) with ESMTP id p12CbdLl017928; Wed, 2 Feb 2011 12:37:39 GMT Received: from GLKMS2100.GREENLNK.NET ([10.15.184.93]) by glkms1102.GREENLNK.NET with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.4675); Wed, 2 Feb 2011 12:37:39 +0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2011 12:37:38 -0000 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [manet] [OLSRv2] Variable validity times for TC addresses Thread-Index: AcvCzuSD9y0xHN9pR3ullWf6T8lvkAABeI+A References: From: "Dearlove, Christopher (UK)" To: "Rogge Henning" , X-OriginalArrivalTime: 02 Feb 2011 12:37:39.0425 (UTC) FILETIME=[FA5A8510:01CBC2D5] Subject: Re: [manet] [OLSRv2] Variable validity times for TC addresses X-BeenThere: manet@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Mobile Ad-hoc Networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 02 Feb 2011 12:34:22 -0000 We have considered allowing individual validity times, but there are some quite unpleasant consequences as I recall, but right now not the details. Note that NHDP is already published without such a capability, and NHDP supplies some of the links you are using. I'm not sure what "does not store the validity time per node" means. AR_time essentially does that job. However attached networks are, as you say, an interesting case, and the NHDP objection above doesn't apply to them, nor I think does whatever other issues there may be. That case may be worth further consideration - although right now more complications isn't high on my wish list. But the link metrics case I don't like, as those are going in HELLO messages, and teh NHDP objection applies in force. I also think there is a danger, even with the attached network case, of pushing further back an already overdue protocol. --=20 Christopher Dearlove Technology Leader, Communications Group Communications and Networks Capability BAE Systems Advanced Technology Centre West Hanningfield Road, Great Baddow, Chelmsford, CM2 8HN, UK Tel: +44 1245 242194 Fax: +44 1245 242124 BAE Systems (Operations) Limited Registered Office: Warwick House, PO Box 87, Farnborough Aerospace Centre, Farnborough, Hants, GU14 6YU, UK Registered in England & Wales No: 1996687 -----Original Message----- From: manet-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:manet-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of R= ogge Henning Sent: 02 February 2011 11:47 To: manet@ietf.org Subject: [manet] [OLSRv2] Variable validity times for TC addresses Hi, We are planning our OLSR.org OLSRv2 implementation at the moment. While discussing some details of the necessary datastructures of the OLSRv2 draft= , we noticed something interesting. The datastructures in the OLSRv2 draft are designed to store a single validity time for each stored node-edge or node-attached_network pair, it does not store the validity time per node. I think we could exploit this fact in OLSRv2. I propose we allow the usage of a VTIME TLV for the addresses inside a TC message to overwrite the validity times defined in the message TLV for a address. An usecase for this would be attached network entries in TCs. In many cases this attached networks are hardwired to the OLSR router, so their status should stay static for long times. By applying them a longer VTime we could safe space in the rest of the TCs (where we don't need to mention the attached network) without needing to send the attached network addresses in their own message fragment. Another usecase would be to allow a local link metric algorithm to estimate the agility of links and set custom validity times for each of them. This could be a way to reduce the network traffic in highly heterogeneous networks. The second usecase might require that OLSRv2 allow the usage of VTIME-TLVs in OLSRv2 Hello messages, so that the validity time can be copied into the TCs of their neighbors. Henning Rogge -- Diplom-Informatiker Henning Rogge , Fraunhofer-Institut f=FCr=20 Kommunikation, Informationsverarbeitung und Ergonomie FKIE=20 Kommunikationssysteme (KOM) Neuenahrer Stra=DFe 20, 53343 Wachtberg,=20 Germany Telefon +49 228 9435-961, =A0 Fax +49 228 9435 685=20 mailto:henning.rogge@fkie.fraunhofer.de http://www.fkie.fraunhofer.de GPG: E1C6 0914 490B 3909 D944 F80D 4487 C67C 55EC CFE0 ******************************************************************** This email and any attachments are confidential to the intended recipient and may also be privileged. If you are not the intended recipient please delete it from your system and notify the sender. You should not copy it or use it for any purpose nor disclose or distribute its contents to any other person. ******************************************************************** From henning.rogge@fkie.fraunhofer.de Wed Feb 2 05:22:56 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: manet@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: manet@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A9A7A3A6CEC for ; Wed, 2 Feb 2011 05:22:56 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.895 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.895 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.449, BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_DE=0.35, RCVD_IN_PBL=0.905] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 5RNHl0N5IOSJ for ; Wed, 2 Feb 2011 05:22:52 -0800 (PST) Received: from a.mx.fkie.fraunhofer.de (a.mx.fkie.fraunhofer.de [IPv6:2001:638:401:102:1aa9:5ff:fe5f:7f22]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1E8F13A6900 for ; Wed, 2 Feb 2011 05:22:51 -0800 (PST) Received: from rufsun5.fkie.fgan.de ([128.7.2.5] helo=mailhost.fgan.de) by a.mx.fkie.fraunhofer.de with esmtps (TLS1.0:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Pkcin-0000Dq-Kd; Wed, 02 Feb 2011 14:26:09 +0100 Received: from mailserv1.fkie.fgan.de ([128.7.96.101] helo=mailserv1.lorien.fkie.fgan.de) by mailhost.fgan.de with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1Pkcin-0003Ol-Cc; Wed, 02 Feb 2011 14:26:09 +0100 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2011 14:16:31 +0100 Content-Type: multipart/signed; protocol="application/x-pkcs7-signature"; micalg=SHA1; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000D_01CBC2E3.C93416F0" Message-ID: In-Reply-To: X-MS-Has-Attach: yes X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [manet] [OLSRv2] Variable validity times for TC addresses Thread-Index: AcvCzuSD9y0xHN9pR3ullWf6T8lvkAABeI+AAABrWCA= References: From: "Rogge Henning" To: "Dearlove, Christopher (UK)" , X-Virus-Scanned: yes (ClamAV 0.96.5/12609/Wed Feb 2 06:51:10 2011) by a.mx.fkie.fraunhofer.de X-Scan-Signature: 19439b9e9a75a9b48dc1623282e45f76 Subject: Re: [manet] [OLSRv2] Variable validity times for TC addresses X-BeenThere: manet@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Mobile Ad-hoc Networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 02 Feb 2011 13:22:56 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000D_01CBC2E3.C93416F0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > -----Urspr=FCngliche Nachricht----- > Von: Dearlove, Christopher (UK)=20 >=20 > We have considered allowing individual validity times, but=20 > there are some quite unpleasant consequences as I recall, but=20 > right now not the details. Note that NHDP is already=20 > published without such a capability, and NHDP supplies some=20 > of the links you are using. >=20 > I'm not sure what "does not store the validity time per node"=20 > means. AR_time essentially does that job. You mean AN_time ? As I read the section 9.4 of the draft, there is one AN_time value = stored for each tuple with a single attached network in it. So we might have tuples like this (originator, prefix, distance, = sequence number, vtime): (192.168.0.1, 10.0.0.0/16, x, y, 100 seconds) (192.168.0.1, 10.1.0.0/16, x, y, 50 seconds) > However attached networks are, as you say, an interesting=20 > case, and the NHDP objection above doesn't apply to them, nor=20 > I think does whatever other issues there may be. That case=20 > may be worth further consideration - although right now more=20 > complications isn't high on my wish list. > But the link=20 > metrics case I don't like, as those are going in HELLO=20 > messages, and teh NHDP objection applies in force. I am not completely sure it has to be included into the HELLOs (does = OLSRv2 handle asymmetric validity times for a link well ?). And OLSRv2 already adds TLVs to the Hellos, so as long as they don't conflict with the working of NHDP, adding another TLV to help the other = node with creating TCs might be okay. And as long as a node only decrease the validity time of a link (compared to the value from the Hello), it might work well. But the "attached network case" is definitely an easier target. Henning Rogge -- Diplom-Informatiker Henning Rogge , Fraunhofer-Institut f=FCr=20 Kommunikation, Informationsverarbeitung und Ergonomie FKIE=20 Kommunikationssysteme (KOM) Neuenahrer Stra=DFe 20, 53343 Wachtberg,=20 Germany Telefon +49 228 9435-961, =A0 Fax +49 228 9435 685=20 mailto:henning.rogge@fkie.fraunhofer.de http://www.fkie.fraunhofer.de GPG: E1C6 0914 490B 3909 D944 F80D 4487 C67C 55EC CFE0=20 ------=_NextPart_000_000D_01CBC2E3.C93416F0 Content-Type: application/x-pkcs7-signature; name="smime.p7s" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="smime.p7s" MIAGCSqGSIb3DQEHAqCAMIACAQExCzAJBgUrDgMCGgUAMIAGCSqGSIb3DQEHAQAAoIIYAzCCA58w ggKHoAMCAQICASYwDQYJKoZIhvcNAQEFBQAwcTELMAkGA1UEBhMCREUxHDAaBgNVBAoTE0RldXRz Y2hlIFRlbGVrb20gQUcxHzAdBgNVBAsTFlQtVGVsZVNlYyBUcnVzdCBDZW50ZXIxIzAhBgNVBAMT GkRldXRzY2hlIFRlbGVrb20gUm9vdCBDQSAyMB4XDTk5MDcwOTEyMTEwMFoXDTE5MDcwOTIzNTkw MFowcTELMAkGA1UEBhMCREUxHDAaBgNVBAoTE0RldXRzY2hlIFRlbGVrb20gQUcxHzAdBgNVBAsT 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61OuuayL83gSewfveyizNi+2H8KrEV2FOuex9taKotgCO3q8lACvx700wkTMRw586AAIH9xjPvoG CEBNpaQu7aQxKz2bF8OT9z4GQcEsebhTXlgksUd9BN/h/edF2LXKNBbnMBzpenetGpaM9ruK4Wey OXKbSGYLfwGLezbV7NEguCnq0/xOAAAAAAAA ------=_NextPart_000_000D_01CBC2E3.C93416F0-- From Chris.Dearlove@baesystems.com Wed Feb 2 05:43:11 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: manet@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: manet@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DCA283A6BAB for ; Wed, 2 Feb 2011 05:43:11 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.238 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.238 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.361, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id fE-uF0FRSIcY for ; Wed, 2 Feb 2011 05:43:10 -0800 (PST) Received: from ukmta3.baesystems.com (ukmta3.baesystems.com [20.133.40.55]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4A42A3A68EF for ; Wed, 2 Feb 2011 05:43:06 -0800 (PST) X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.60,413,1291593600"; d="scan'208";a="113672814" Received: from unknown (HELO baemasodc004.greenlnk.net) ([10.108.36.11]) by Baemasodc001ir.sharelnk.net with ESMTP; 02 Feb 2011 13:46:25 +0000 Received: from glkms1103.GREENLNK.NET (glkms1103.greenlnk.net [10.108.36.194]) by baemasodc004.greenlnk.net (Switch-3.4.3/Switch-3.4.3) with ESMTP id p12DkO7R002084; Wed, 2 Feb 2011 13:46:25 GMT Received: from GLKMS2100.GREENLNK.NET ([10.15.184.93]) by glkms1103.GREENLNK.NET with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.4675); Wed, 2 Feb 2011 13:46:24 +0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2011 13:46:23 -0000 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [manet] [OLSRv2] Variable validity times for TC addresses Thread-Index: AcvCzuSD9y0xHN9pR3ullWf6T8lvkAABeI+AAABrWCAAAZy1kA== References: From: "Dearlove, Christopher (UK)" To: "Rogge Henning" , X-OriginalArrivalTime: 02 Feb 2011 13:46:24.0590 (UTC) FILETIME=[9524BEE0:01CBC2DF] Subject: Re: [manet] [OLSRv2] Variable validity times for TC addresses X-BeenThere: manet@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Mobile Ad-hoc Networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 02 Feb 2011 13:43:11 -0000 I meant AR_time, as I said, which records the validity time of the node the network is attached to. TC message sending nodes only. I recall one of the issues with reducing a validity time in a message, let's consider a HELLO message for example. Default parameters, period 2 seconds (jittered, but we can ignore that for now), validity 6 seconds. If you put something in with a validity seconds (say) you are a lot less robust against message loss. If you put something in with a validity time of 1 second you are going to lose it before your next HELLO message. So now you have to reduce your HELLO interval to (say) 1/3 second. But now you could reduce other validity times as the longer time isn't actually winning you anything (we'll assume losing more than two in three messages is too bad to use anyway). So the net effect is that having a variable validity time doesn't help, except marginally in message size with a significantly greater complexity in the distinction between REFRESH_INTERVAL and HELLO_INTERVAL and partial messages. And for TC messags we don't have even that currently. I will note that the attached message case suffers from a related issue. Let's suppose we are sending TC messages at 5 second intervals, and you want to set an attached message's validity time to 1 hour rather than 15 seconds. What's that winning you? Nothing, if you report that attached network in every TC message. OK, you could (with suitable redefinitions, that one would have to get right) omit it from most TC messages. But now you've lost the capability for a new node to join the network and get quickly (small multiple of 5 seconds worst case) updated to complete network knowledge. Yes, you could now make reportng the network responsive (if a new node turns up in your routing table, make one or more of your next TC messages include attached networks). More complications - and for links rather than attached networks doesn't work (potential chicken and egg problem you may not see the new node without links). So I think it's a significant additional complication for a very limited win. --=20 Christopher Dearlove Technology Leader, Communications Group Communications and Networks Capability BAE Systems Advanced Technology Centre West Hanningfield Road, Great Baddow, Chelmsford, CM2 8HN, UK Tel: +44 1245 242194 Fax: +44 1245 242124 BAE Systems (Operations) Limited Registered Office: Warwick House, PO Box 87, Farnborough Aerospace Centre, Farnborough, Hants, GU14 6YU, UK Registered in England & Wales No: 1996687 -----Original Message----- From: Rogge Henning [mailto:henning.rogge@fkie.fraunhofer.de]=20 Sent: 02 February 2011 13:17 To: Dearlove, Christopher (UK); manet@ietf.org Subject: AW: [manet] [OLSRv2] Variable validity times for TC addresses > -----Urspr=FCngliche Nachricht----- > Von: Dearlove, Christopher (UK)=20 >=20 > We have considered allowing individual validity times, but=20 > there are some quite unpleasant consequences as I recall, but=20 > right now not the details. Note that NHDP is already=20 > published without such a capability, and NHDP supplies some=20 > of the links you are using. >=20 > I'm not sure what "does not store the validity time per node"=20 > means. AR_time essentially does that job. You mean AN_time ? As I read the section 9.4 of the draft, there is one AN_time value stored for each tuple with a single attached network in it. So we might have tuples like this (originator, prefix, distance, sequence number, vtime): (192.168.0.1, 10.0.0.0/16, x, y, 100 seconds) (192.168.0.1, 10.1.0.0/16, x, y, 50 seconds) > However attached networks are, as you say, an interesting=20 > case, and the NHDP objection above doesn't apply to them, nor=20 > I think does whatever other issues there may be. That case=20 > may be worth further consideration - although right now more=20 > complications isn't high on my wish list. > But the link=20 > metrics case I don't like, as those are going in HELLO=20 > messages, and teh NHDP objection applies in force. I am not completely sure it has to be included into the HELLOs (does OLSRv2 handle asymmetric validity times for a link well ?). And OLSRv2 already adds TLVs to the Hellos, so as long as they don't conflict with the working of NHDP, adding another TLV to help the other nod= e with creating TCs might be okay. And as long as a node only decrease the validity time of a link (compared to the value from the Hello), it might work well. But the "attached network case" is definitely an easier target. Henning Rogge -- Diplom-Informatiker Henning Rogge , Fraunhofer-Institut f=FCr=20 Kommunikation, Informationsverarbeitung und Ergonomie FKIE=20 Kommunikationssysteme (KOM) Neuenahrer Stra=DFe 20, 53343 Wachtberg,=20 Germany Telefon +49 228 9435-961, =A0 Fax +49 228 9435 685=20 mailto:henning.rogge@fkie.fraunhofer.de http://www.fkie.fraunhofer.de GPG: E1C6 0914 490B 3909 D944 F80D 4487 C67C 55EC CFE0=20 ******************************************************************** This email and any attachments are confidential to the intended recipient and may also be privileged. If you are not the intended recipient please delete it from your system and notify the sender. You should not copy it or use it for any purpose nor disclose or distribute its contents to any other person. ******************************************************************** From henning.rogge@fkie.fraunhofer.de Wed Feb 2 06:27:04 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: manet@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: manet@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8A8893A6CE7 for ; Wed, 2 Feb 2011 06:27:04 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.945 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.945 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.399, BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_DE=0.35, RCVD_IN_PBL=0.905] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id V-VjoNDQmCEz for ; Wed, 2 Feb 2011 06:27:03 -0800 (PST) Received: from a.mx.fkie.fraunhofer.de (mailguard.fkie.fraunhofer.de [IPv6:2001:638:401:102:1aa9:5ff:fe5f:7f22]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6BD303A6CE0 for ; Wed, 2 Feb 2011 06:27:02 -0800 (PST) Received: from rufsun5.fkie.fgan.de ([128.7.2.5] helo=mailhost.fgan.de) by a.mx.fkie.fraunhofer.de with esmtps (TLS1.0:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Pkdiu-0002F1-A6; Wed, 02 Feb 2011 15:30:20 +0100 Received: from mailserv1.fkie.fgan.de ([128.7.96.101] helo=mailserv1.lorien.fkie.fgan.de) by mailhost.fgan.de with esmtp (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from ) id 1Pkdit-0003kn-OO; Wed, 02 Feb 2011 15:30:19 +0100 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2011 15:23:36 +0100 Content-Type: multipart/signed; protocol="application/x-pkcs7-signature"; micalg=SHA1; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0011_01CBC2ED.28A21660" Message-ID: In-Reply-To: X-MS-Has-Attach: yes X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [manet] [OLSRv2] Variable validity times for TC addresses Thread-Index: AcvCzuSD9y0xHN9pR3ullWf6T8lvkAABeI+AAABrWCAAAZy1kAABIWyw References: From: "Rogge Henning" To: "Dearlove, Christopher (UK)" , X-Virus-Scanned: yes (ClamAV 0.96.5/12609/Wed Feb 2 06:51:10 2011) by a.mx.fkie.fraunhofer.de X-Scan-Signature: b83ddddaea9b835749172584385debc9 Subject: Re: [manet] [OLSRv2] Variable validity times for TC addresses X-BeenThere: manet@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Mobile Ad-hoc Networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 02 Feb 2011 14:27:04 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0011_01CBC2ED.28A21660 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > -----Urspr=FCngliche Nachricht----- > Von: Dearlove, Christopher (UK)=20 >=20 > I meant AR_time, as I said, which records the validity time=20 > of the node the network is attached to. TC message sending nodes only. Okay, but why is this a problem ? If the node vanishes from the net, it = can still take its HNAs with it.=20 =20 > I recall one of the issues with reducing a validity time in a=20 > message, let's consider a HELLO message for example. Default=20 > parameters, period 2 seconds (jittered, but we can ignore=20 > that for now), validity 6 seconds. If you put something in=20 > with a validity seconds (say) you are a lot less robust=20 > against message loss. If you put something in with a validity=20 > time of 1 second you are going to lose it before your next=20 > HELLO message. So now you have to reduce your HELLO interval to > (say) 1/3 second. But now you could reduce other validity=20 > times as the longer time isn't actually winning you anything=20 > (we'll assume losing more than two in three messages is too=20 > bad to use anyway). Consider other timings with higher differences between validity time and interval time. A typical freifunk/funkfeuer network (as an example) use HELLO timings = of 2/20 seconds or even 5/100 seconds. If you have a validity time of 100 seconds, there is lots of space to = choose your intervals and "reduced" intervals from. Considering a link broken just because two of three HELLOs are missing = will not work that well on many networks. Even with 10% multicast packet loss (which will be less than 1% unicast packet loss for WLAN) you will get a link drop (on average) every 40 minutes (with one HELLO every 2 = seconds). > So the net effect is that having a variable validity time=20 > doesn't help, except marginally in message size with a=20 > significantly greater complexity in the distinction between=20 > REFRESH_INTERVAL and HELLO_INTERVAL and partial messages. > And for TC messags we don't have even that currently. >=20 > I will note that the attached message case suffers from a=20 > related issue. Let's suppose we are sending TC messages at > 5 second intervals, and you want to set an attached message's=20 > validity time to 1 hour rather than 15 seconds. What's that=20 > winning you?=20 Typical VTime for our networks is hundreds of seconds because we have (mostly) stationary nodes. It would make sense to lessen the VTime of = links to (or between) mobile nodes to a much smaller value while keeping the = long VTime for the stationary nodes. > Nothing, if you report that attached network in=20 > every TC message. OK, you could (with suitable redefinitions,=20 > that one would have to get right) omit it from most TC=20 > messages. But now you've lost the capability for a new node=20 > to join the network and get quickly (small multiple of 5=20 > seconds worst case) updated to complete network knowledge. If you increase the interval between updates of static links from 5 to = 60 seconds for static/stable links (as an example) you still have a pretty = good working network while you can skip the IPs from 11 out of 12 TCs. > So I think it's a significant additional complication for a=20 > very limited win. I don't think it will make implementing the protocol according to the Draft/RFC much more difficult, but it allows us for increased = flexibility which can be useful in my oppinion. Henning Rogge -- Diplom-Informatiker Henning Rogge , Fraunhofer-Institut f=FCr=20 Kommunikation, Informationsverarbeitung und Ergonomie FKIE=20 Kommunikationssysteme (KOM) Neuenahrer Stra=DFe 20, 53343 Wachtberg,=20 Germany Telefon +49 228 9435-961, =A0 Fax +49 228 9435 685=20 mailto:henning.rogge@fkie.fraunhofer.de http://www.fkie.fraunhofer.de GPG: E1C6 0914 490B 3909 D944 F80D 4487 C67C 55EC CFE0=20 ------=_NextPart_000_0011_01CBC2ED.28A21660 Content-Type: application/x-pkcs7-signature; name="smime.p7s" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="smime.p7s" MIAGCSqGSIb3DQEHAqCAMIACAQExCzAJBgUrDgMCGgUAMIAGCSqGSIb3DQEHAQAAoIIYAzCCA58w ggKHoAMCAQICASYwDQYJKoZIhvcNAQEFBQAwcTELMAkGA1UEBhMCREUxHDAaBgNVBAoTE0RldXRz Y2hlIFRlbGVrb20gQUcxHzAdBgNVBAsTFlQtVGVsZVNlYyBUcnVzdCBDZW50ZXIxIzAhBgNVBAMT GkRldXRzY2hlIFRlbGVrb20gUm9vdCBDQSAyMB4XDTk5MDcwOTEyMTEwMFoXDTE5MDcwOTIzNTkw MFowcTELMAkGA1UEBhMCREUxHDAaBgNVBAoTE0RldXRzY2hlIFRlbGVrb20gQUcxHzAdBgNVBAsT 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core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 716D53A6D28 for ; Wed, 2 Feb 2011 06:37:44 -0800 (PST) X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.60,413,1291593600"; d="scan'208";a="113694396" Received: from unknown (HELO baemasodc004.greenlnk.net) ([10.108.36.11]) by Baemasodc001ir.sharelnk.net with ESMTP; 02 Feb 2011 14:41:03 +0000 Received: from glkms1102.GREENLNK.NET (glkms1102.greenlnk.net [10.108.36.193]) by baemasodc004.greenlnk.net (Switch-3.4.3/Switch-3.4.3) with ESMTP id p12Ef3oF008842; Wed, 2 Feb 2011 14:41:03 GMT Received: from GLKMS2100.GREENLNK.NET ([10.15.184.93]) by glkms1102.GREENLNK.NET with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.4675); Wed, 2 Feb 2011 14:41:03 +0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2011 14:41:02 -0000 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [manet] [OLSRv2] Variable validity times for TC addresses Thread-Index: AcvCzuSD9y0xHN9pR3ullWf6T8lvkAABeI+AAABrWCAAAZy1kAABIWywAAEYjzA= References: From: "Dearlove, Christopher (UK)" To: "Rogge Henning" , X-OriginalArrivalTime: 02 Feb 2011 14:41:03.0254 (UTC) FILETIME=[37612B60:01CBC2E7] Subject: Re: [manet] [OLSRv2] Variable validity times for TC addresses X-BeenThere: manet@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Mobile Ad-hoc Networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 02 Feb 2011 14:37:45 -0000 >> I meant AR_time, as I said, which records the validity time >> of the node the network is attached to. TC message sending nodes only. > Okay, but why is this a problem ? If the node vanishes from the net, it can > still take its HNAs with it. I was replying to you saying there was a problem, or to be more precise that there weren't any node times. I didn't suggest there was a problem. > A typical freifunk/funkfeuer network (as an example) use HELLO timings of > 2/20 seconds or even 5/100 seconds. Unimportant. all that matters is ratios, not absolute values. (Well, until we get down to very small values, but we're not talking about that here.) > If you have a validity time of 100 seconds, there is lots of space to choose > your intervals and "reduced" intervals from. No, same comment. > Considering a link broken just because two of three HELLOs are missing will > not work that well on many networks. So you up the ratio from x3 to x5 or whatever you want. Again, not the critical issue. > Typical VTime for our networks is hundreds of seconds because we have > (mostly) stationary nodes. It would make sense to lessen the VTime of links > to (or between) mobile nodes to a much smaller value while keeping the long > VTime for the stationary nodes. This is missing the point. Either you repeat the information in all HELLO messages, so longer times don't help, or you don't repeat the information, with a small overhead saving, increased complexity and reduced ability for new nodes to join the network (or increased complexity in an additional way to create TC messages responsive to adding routes in the routing table). > I don't think it will make implementing the protocol according to the > Draft/RFC much more difficult I think you are mistaken there. > but it allows us for increased flexibility which can be useful in my oppinion. And I think you are mistaken there too, unless running a system where responsiveness of new nodes isn't important. I'm going to apologise in advance now for not being able to contine this discussion right now, other things to do. ******************************************************************** This email and any attachments are confidential to the intended recipient and may also be privileged. If you are not the intended recipient please delete it from your system and notify the sender. You should not copy it or use it for any purpose nor disclose or distribute its contents to any other person. ******************************************************************** From abdussalambaryun@gmail.com Fri Feb 4 13:09:23 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: manet@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: manet@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 465C83A694A for ; Fri, 4 Feb 2011 13:09:23 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.598 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.598 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id YvAyFH0VeV4u for ; Fri, 4 Feb 2011 13:09:22 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-qw0-f44.google.com (mail-qw0-f44.google.com [209.85.216.44]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7DE0A3A67C1 for ; Fri, 4 Feb 2011 13:09:22 -0800 (PST) Received: by qwi2 with SMTP id 2so2259764qwi.31 for ; Fri, 04 Feb 2011 13:12:48 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:date:message-id:subject:from:to :content-type; bh=0dfj8//j7oTKx+3/RnaPHzG0cXVyZSSVXYC0RXwz3wE=; b=l/K41srw+aWIdDWp82tuA9SCykVq6o1/vc1k2nk4yfgBuzpJZ/YC4hk0SuKIQmBamk VAoCg43Xf6NMgGSVwLLG+2fSmrg1jcTC8AlqbOPMamE+vk72ANJyQDjtfaZv39E1JOXD FZISD9mEWU3RqLCsT9NR1tIlddsCo2pobyatA= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:date:message-id:subject:from:to:content-type; b=oNKkAgJ94E5puwD4LtynKXeTSb52SKnjblk6Sux9tEPUNqGXTJTBs27N5ZjvtVHl1k 9mL+WQLKokNThRGhfuEn1U6iHnnBf24Dk+BnCCxhtVWFQgQq4OYg3gROfrUOZGj7hteb WXEVuHiRDBeOwDspH/9u+hMjv5T7lH3xnvCRY= MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.229.183.199 with SMTP id ch7mr8780522qcb.238.1296853967940; Fri, 04 Feb 2011 13:12:47 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.229.95.7 with HTTP; Fri, 4 Feb 2011 13:12:47 -0800 (PST) Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2011 21:12:47 +0000 Message-ID: From: Abdussalam Baryun To: manet@ietf.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=0016e68cc10a15b62c049b7b580d X-Mailman-Approved-At: Sat, 05 Feb 2011 08:08:19 -0800 Subject: Re: [manet] ZRP X-BeenThere: manet@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Mobile Ad-hoc Networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 04 Feb 2011 21:12:24 -0000 --0016e68cc10a15b62c049b7b580d Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 What is ZRP? do you mean Zone Routing Protocol, --0016e68cc10a15b62c049b7b580d Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 What is ZRP? do you mean Zone Routing Protocol, --0016e68cc10a15b62c049b7b580d-- From charliep@computer.org Wed Feb 9 12:33:48 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: manet@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: manet@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 102523A683F for ; Wed, 9 Feb 2011 12:33:48 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ZaXAwFJ07Cs4 for ; Wed, 9 Feb 2011 12:33:47 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-mealy.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-mealy.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.69]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 184933A6811 for ; Wed, 9 Feb 2011 12:33:47 -0800 (PST) Received: from [138.111.58.2] (helo=[172.17.96.31]) by elasmtp-mealy.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpsa (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1PnGjc-0003AC-Qt for manet@ietf.org; Wed, 09 Feb 2011 15:33:56 -0500 Message-ID: <4D52FA32.2070800@computer.org> Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2011 12:33:54 -0800 From: "Charles E. Perkins" Organization: Wichorus Inc. User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 6.1; en-US; rv:1.9.2.13) Gecko/20101207 Lightning/1.0b2 Thunderbird/3.1.7 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Manet" Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-ELNK-Trace: 137d7d78656ed6919973fd6a8f21c4f2d780f4a490ca6956abb457f1b4332f521639b7d3a2907f11697e8f086768ea1d350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 138.111.58.2 Subject: [manet] Ad-hoc networking arrives? X-BeenThere: manet@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list Reply-To: charliep@computer.org List-Id: Mobile Ad-hoc Networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2011 20:33:48 -0000 Hello folks, Does anyone here happen to know what protocol they are using? http://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/qualcomm-to-demonstrate-new-peer-to-peer-technology-at-mobile-world-congress-115550929.html Regards, Charlie P. From emmanuel.baccelli@gmail.com Wed Feb 9 12:58:56 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: manet@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: manet@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9C0E73A6811 for ; Wed, 9 Feb 2011 12:58:56 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.976 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.976 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, FM_FORGED_GMAIL=0.622, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id w2PZj4TPZ4X0 for ; Wed, 9 Feb 2011 12:58:54 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-fx0-f44.google.com (mail-fx0-f44.google.com [209.85.161.44]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 80A483A67AE for ; Wed, 9 Feb 2011 12:58:54 -0800 (PST) Received: by fxm9 with SMTP id 9so664771fxm.31 for ; Wed, 09 Feb 2011 12:59:04 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:from :date:x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject:to:content-type; bh=+PTpNcc0CEoUfoucMpITigUJ27d3TI+INgcqlUMRalM=; b=iVNrZADnjHQ/W1gpxyVjjqEPL9EjJQMgBAYTZZgyqREuqICwFS/nkann/H1TvNPe5V bNxvq2BYKoEfPDJEjJCm+JWIib3tGZal5YfbMHdB8mhNd9GIqpO6GxxPHb0LgE8+65TF WopTL6CphjiaFE3CDtUP6f2EZw19k806W9/qU= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:from:date :x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject:to:content-type; b=JeKQYfkSCMPG7TxW9jDyapyeApEKYhF4ILW+eDNFtFNVe73SnvoO5O2ohTlw6IhgaS pBnzXG/yK4WQMT6fOIi+FNQ17stZXH+PJ/jPB/6TdXIV45qu954wo80bKa4RVA254ozq zosb10tEV11sNXqxJHFrTiuqSvhP2Up/Ax3nY= Received: by 10.223.83.142 with SMTP id f14mr16856915fal.0.1297285144313; Wed, 09 Feb 2011 12:59:04 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Sender: emmanuel.baccelli@gmail.com Received: by 10.223.56.218 with HTTP; Wed, 9 Feb 2011 12:58:44 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <4D52FA32.2070800@computer.org> References: <4D52FA32.2070800@computer.org> From: Emmanuel Baccelli Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2011 21:58:44 +0100 X-Google-Sender-Auth: eVYWptM7XtaGyUFbfspB4YJMI_g Message-ID: To: Manet Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=20cf3054acf1330627049bdfbca5 Subject: Re: [manet] Ad-hoc networking arrives? X-BeenThere: manet@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Mobile Ad-hoc Networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2011 20:58:56 -0000 --20cf3054acf1330627049bdfbca5 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Hi Charlie, I don't know what you mean by protocol, but it does seem like L2 stuff rather than anything else. See: http://www.cedt.iisc.ernet.in/people/kuri/Comsnets/Keynotes/Keynote-Rajiv-Laroia.pdf Emmanuel On Wed, Feb 9, 2011 at 9:33 PM, Charles E. Perkins wrote: > > Hello folks, > > Does anyone here happen to know what protocol > they are using? > > > http://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/qualcomm-to-demonstrate-new-peer-to-peer-technology-at-mobile-world-congress-115550929.html > > Regards, > Charlie P. > > _______________________________________________ > manet mailing list > manet@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/manet > --20cf3054acf1330627049bdfbca5 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Charlie,
I don't know what you mean by protocol, but it does see= m like L2 stuff rather than anything else. See: http://www.cedt.iisc.ernet.in/people/kuri/Comsnets/Keynotes/Ke= ynote-Rajiv-Laroia.pdf
Emmanuel

On Wed, Feb 9, 2011 at 9:33= PM, Charles E. Perkins <charliep@computer.org> wrote:

Hello folks,

Does anyone here happen to know what protocol
they are using?

http://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/qualcomm-to-demonstrate= -new-peer-to-peer-technology-at-mobile-world-congress-115550929.html
Regards,
Charlie P.

_______________________________________________
manet mailing list
manet@ietf.org
h= ttps://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/manet

--20cf3054acf1330627049bdfbca5-- From charles.perkins@earthlink.net Wed Feb 9 13:24:01 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: manet@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: manet@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A68923A6839 for ; Wed, 9 Feb 2011 13:24:01 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id odrvESqFg7pJ for ; Wed, 9 Feb 2011 13:24:00 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-galgo.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-galgo.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.61]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1038D3A6866 for ; Wed, 9 Feb 2011 13:24:00 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=earthlink.net; b=Cw93waOxZ5E9CYuI7LzsP4Dvt8TjHOmGW6zgtnqL/eZ/LKiPCcY+i5qezFdz6dqF; h=Received:Message-ID:Date:From:Organization:User-Agent:MIME-Version:To:CC:Subject:References:In-Reply-To:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [138.111.58.2] (helo=[172.17.96.31]) by elasmtp-galgo.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpsa (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1PnHWE-0003y0-8M; Wed, 09 Feb 2011 16:24:10 -0500 Message-ID: <4D5305F8.5030400@earthlink.net> Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2011 13:24:08 -0800 From: "Charles E. Perkins" Organization: Wichorus Inc. User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 6.1; en-US; rv:1.9.2.13) Gecko/20101207 Lightning/1.0b2 Thunderbird/3.1.7 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Emmanuel Baccelli References: <4D52FA32.2070800@computer.org> In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-ELNK-Trace: 137d7d78656ed6919973fd6a8f21c4f2d780f4a490ca6956abb457f1b4332f524fb88059966858286c1beb325924728c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 138.111.58.2 Cc: Manet Subject: Re: [manet] Ad-hoc networking arrives? X-BeenThere: manet@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Mobile Ad-hoc Networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2011 21:24:01 -0000 Hello Emmanuel, I did look at the presentation. Great slides! Not enough technical information! It could well be something similar to 802.11s, or ... what? Interestingly, slide 35 does NOT show multi-hop. One can hope that the advertisements do NOT have "service identifiers" at layer two :-) [e.g., see slide 30]. Regards, Charlie P. On 2/9/2011 12:58 PM, Emmanuel Baccelli wrote: > Hi Charlie, > I don't know what you mean by protocol, but it does seem like L2 stuff > rather than anything else. See: > http://www.cedt.iisc.ernet.in/people/kuri/Comsnets/Keynotes/Keynote-Rajiv-Laroia.pdf > Emmanuel > > On Wed, Feb 9, 2011 at 9:33 PM, Charles E. Perkins > > wrote: > > > Hello folks, > > Does anyone here happen to know what protocol > they are using? > > http://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/qualcomm-to-demonstrate-new-peer-to-peer-technology-at-mobile-world-congress-115550929.html > > Regards, > Charlie P. > > _______________________________________________ > manet mailing list > manet@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/manet > > > > > _______________________________________________ > manet mailing list > manet@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/manet From emmanuel.baccelli@gmail.com Wed Feb 9 13:52:29 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: manet@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: manet@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A9E1B3A6839 for ; Wed, 9 Feb 2011 13:52:29 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.976 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.976 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, FM_FORGED_GMAIL=0.622, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id UuM2KFVKwBQm for ; Wed, 9 Feb 2011 13:52:28 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-fx0-f44.google.com (mail-fx0-f44.google.com [209.85.161.44]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 013193A6823 for ; Wed, 9 Feb 2011 13:52:27 -0800 (PST) Received: by fxm9 with SMTP id 9so716259fxm.31 for ; Wed, 09 Feb 2011 13:52:38 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:from :date:x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject:to:content-type; bh=RdlU+VYchkJjJJ5M0T9WLvzTBaR+4Ybsf99q+XsGawo=; b=gTlWYipFKPzNLF/8QvU7DmjKRuKhZrfHcgBnlvAYlQt5Qf5PkNquFM0ie5ND4iJjQn S3gcJm4fF8xdQSbLjlogq5jRk4LTzyADZbz8YCJZpwkQ3mkZky8OLb9bwfs6hATBqV34 36mdkz5BJg7eTH355rulv6JudXdlC6/CS4euI= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:from:date :x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject:to:content-type; b=dhCiURdaaH38gRa7Fmne2S9gxCk3+J4WSJSwzPAOsKwdFttCNLODNZY1wFFwZtTkhV uof7bkHQPTI9Clz8mdDG5xRP5GizSvn58jEyVMs7p1rhToxmv+nP+RiaRDmKUATOwk4y AsimSUbKdEAP3GPurtNp09m9YfW3ugqn2CDnE= Received: by 10.223.83.142 with SMTP id f14mr16907781fal.0.1297288357865; Wed, 09 Feb 2011 13:52:37 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Sender: emmanuel.baccelli@gmail.com Received: by 10.223.56.218 with HTTP; Wed, 9 Feb 2011 13:52:17 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <4D5305F8.5030400@earthlink.net> References: <4D52FA32.2070800@computer.org> <4D5305F8.5030400@earthlink.net> From: Emmanuel Baccelli Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2011 22:52:17 +0100 X-Google-Sender-Auth: 7R3jSp3IoETmU-WMm1Q19y_CMB8 Message-ID: To: Manet Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=20cf3054acf1bdeb41049be07b12 Subject: Re: [manet] Ad-hoc networking arrives? X-BeenThere: manet@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Mobile Ad-hoc Networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2011 21:52:29 -0000 --20cf3054acf1bdeb41049be07b12 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Hi Charlie, yes I also noticed how the presentation does not mention any multi-hop... Maybe it's left out and our job to provide it ;) Emmanuel On Wed, Feb 9, 2011 at 10:24 PM, Charles E. Perkins < charles.perkins@earthlink.net> wrote: > > Hello Emmanuel, > > I did look at the presentation. Great slides! Not > enough technical information! It could well be > something similar to 802.11s, or ... what? > > Interestingly, slide 35 does NOT show multi-hop. > > One can hope that the advertisements do NOT have > "service identifiers" at layer two :-) [e.g., see > slide 30]. > > > Regards, > Charlie P. > > > > On 2/9/2011 12:58 PM, Emmanuel Baccelli wrote: > >> Hi Charlie, >> I don't know what you mean by protocol, but it does seem like L2 stuff >> rather than anything else. See: >> >> http://www.cedt.iisc.ernet.in/people/kuri/Comsnets/Keynotes/Keynote-Rajiv-Laroia.pdf >> Emmanuel >> >> On Wed, Feb 9, 2011 at 9:33 PM, Charles E. Perkins >> > wrote: >> >> >> Hello folks, >> >> Does anyone here happen to know what protocol >> they are using? >> >> >> http://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/qualcomm-to-demonstrate-new-peer-to-peer-technology-at-mobile-world-congress-115550929.html >> >> Regards, >> Charlie P. >> >> _______________________________________________ >> manet mailing list >> manet@ietf.org >> >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/manet >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> manet mailing list >> manet@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/manet >> > > _______________________________________________ > manet mailing list > manet@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/manet > --20cf3054acf1bdeb41049be07b12 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Charlie,
yes I also noticed how the presentation does not mention an= y multi-hop... Maybe it's left out and our job to provide it ;)
Emmanuel

On Wed, Feb 9, 2011 at 10:24 = PM, Charles E. Perkins <charles.perkins@earthlink.net> wrote:

Hello Emmanuel,

I did look at the presentation. =A0Great slides! =A0Not
enough technical information! =A0It could well be
something similar to 802.11s, or =A0... what?

Interestingly, slide 35 does NOT show multi-hop.

One can hope that the advertisements do NOT have
"service identifiers" at layer two :-) [e.g., see
slide 30].


Regards,
Charlie P.



On 2/9/2011 12:58 PM, Emmanuel Baccelli wrote:
Hi Charlie,
I don't know what you mean by protocol, but it does seem like L2 stuff<= br> rather than anything else. See:
http://www.cedt.iisc.ernet.in/peopl= e/kuri/Comsnets/Keynotes/Keynote-Rajiv-Laroia.pdf
Emmanuel

On Wed, Feb 9, 2011 at 9:33 PM, Charles E. Perkins
<charliep@com= puter.org <mailto:charliep@computer.org>> wrote:


=A0 =A0Hello folks,

=A0 =A0Does anyone here happen to know what protocol
=A0 =A0they are using?

=A0 =A0http://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/qualcomm-to-dem= onstrate-new-peer-to-peer-technology-at-mobile-world-congress-115550929.htm= l

=A0 =A0Regards,
=A0 =A0Charlie P.

=A0 =A0_______________________________________________
=A0 =A0manet mailing list
=A0 =A0manet@ietf.org<= /a> <mailto:manet@ie= tf.org>

=A0 =A0https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/manet




_______________________________________________
manet mailing list
manet@ietf.org
h= ttps://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/manet

_______________________________________________
manet mailing list
manet@ietf.org
h= ttps://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/manet

--20cf3054acf1bdeb41049be07b12-- From geoff.ietf@mulligan.com Wed Feb 9 14:28:09 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: manet@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: manet@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 155433A67D2 for ; Wed, 9 Feb 2011 14:28:09 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id lx-U1ASk43DK for ; Wed, 9 Feb 2011 14:28:07 -0800 (PST) Received: from server2.coslabs.com (server2.coslabs.com [64.111.18.234]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5A7E83A67CF for ; Wed, 9 Feb 2011 14:28:07 -0800 (PST) Received: from grab (mail.coslabs.com [199.233.92.34]) by server2.coslabs.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 10D1718293; Wed, 9 Feb 2011 15:28:23 -0700 (MST) Received: from [199.233.92.6] (unknown [199.233.92.6]) by grab (Postfix) with ESMTP id 65F037FCE1; Wed, 9 Feb 2011 15:28:14 -0700 (MST) From: Geoff Mulligan To: "Charles E. Perkins" In-Reply-To: <4D5305F8.5030400@earthlink.net> References: <4D52FA32.2070800@computer.org> <4D5305F8.5030400@earthlink.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2011 15:28:16 -0700 Message-ID: <1297290496.1808.587.camel@d430> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Evolution 2.28.3 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: Emmanuel Baccelli , Manet Subject: Re: [manet] Ad-hoc networking arrives? X-BeenThere: manet@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Mobile Ad-hoc Networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2011 22:28:09 -0000 I agree. It looks like lots of P2P links. Is it really direct P2P or really just IP through the central switch appearing to be P2P. geoff On Wed, 2011-02-09 at 13:24 -0800, Charles E. Perkins wrote: > Hello Emmanuel, > > I did look at the presentation. Great slides! Not > enough technical information! It could well be > something similar to 802.11s, or ... what? > > Interestingly, slide 35 does NOT show multi-hop. > > One can hope that the advertisements do NOT have > "service identifiers" at layer two :-) [e.g., see > slide 30]. > > > Regards, > Charlie P. > > > > On 2/9/2011 12:58 PM, Emmanuel Baccelli wrote: > > Hi Charlie, > > I don't know what you mean by protocol, but it does seem like L2 stuff > > rather than anything else. See: > > http://www.cedt.iisc.ernet.in/people/kuri/Comsnets/Keynotes/Keynote-Rajiv-Laroia.pdf > > Emmanuel > > > > On Wed, Feb 9, 2011 at 9:33 PM, Charles E. Perkins > > > wrote: > > > > > > Hello folks, > > > > Does anyone here happen to know what protocol > > they are using? > > > > http://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/qualcomm-to-demonstrate-new-peer-to-peer-technology-at-mobile-world-congress-115550929.html > > > > Regards, > > Charlie P. > > > > _______________________________________________ > > manet mailing list > > manet@ietf.org > > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/manet > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > manet mailing list > > manet@ietf.org > > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/manet > > _______________________________________________ > manet mailing list > manet@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/manet From yi.jiazi@gmail.com Wed Feb 9 14:01:47 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: manet@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: manet@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 865583A697C for ; Wed, 9 Feb 2011 14:01:47 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.598 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.598 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id szgGEyrg8ks0 for ; Wed, 9 Feb 2011 14:01:45 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-bw0-f44.google.com (mail-bw0-f44.google.com [209.85.214.44]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B25EB3A67F6 for ; Wed, 9 Feb 2011 14:01:42 -0800 (PST) Received: by bwz12 with SMTP id 12so1569597bwz.31 for ; Wed, 09 Feb 2011 14:01:52 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:message-id:date:from:user-agent:mime-version:to :subject:references:in-reply-to:content-type; bh=vvizMN6lZWEBgiM0dFk9pAtxjoQT67VK2PQrZ90L/OY=; b=bYOboJi2Va096k7HJQkpdRrQ/FDYHY0S44e/bUMG6lXpUAPwTsQfd6JYAH61lI/UJH nWesWetct1xRDjZJ/+CxI6QyCGxIufbwLy79fxGrLtHJs3EySOKXFYNhAGynGDHxbVZg l58xw9kl9DvwHBBra+Qpk9upAE7YdlJ83DT9Y= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=message-id:date:from:user-agent:mime-version:to:subject:references :in-reply-to:content-type; b=F3p5zSKHP1GW469BvfDoF+e6l3MM+QS5+NxzRbz+Db3sV+47gW0JyIKQVdnLPYLCfH 0yMZM+SdO3OJA5F4w0Zx4M/KTjlBTj1lqZllIH1Zznu17JxEJRGWwl4FoM/om/jk+z2v fy13xsTwC6gHLUxhsQhFap4pnQZyVHW/yBaoY= Received: by 10.204.46.134 with SMTP id j6mr20052940bkf.112.1297288912203; Wed, 09 Feb 2011 14:01:52 -0800 (PST) Received: from [127.0.0.1] (39.64.103-84.rev.gaoland.net [84.103.64.39]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id v25sm538572bkt.6.2011.02.09.14.01.49 (version=SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5); Wed, 09 Feb 2011 14:01:49 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <4D530ECC.8040404@gmail.com> Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2011 23:01:48 +0100 From: Jiazi YI User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 6.1; en-US; rv:1.9.2.13) Gecko/20101207 Lightning/1.0b2 Thunderbird/3.1.7 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: manet@ietf.org References: <4D52FA32.2070800@computer.org> <4D5305F8.5030400@earthlink.net> In-Reply-To: Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------040705000100030108010009" X-Mailman-Approved-At: Thu, 10 Feb 2011 08:19:49 -0800 Subject: Re: [manet] Ad-hoc networking arrives? X-BeenThere: manet@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Mobile Ad-hoc Networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2011 22:03:35 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------040705000100030108010009 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi Emmanuel It's actually something related to the Hipercom team :-P http://ralyx.inria.fr/2009/Raweb/hipercom/uid156.html On 2011/2/9 22:52, Emmanuel Baccelli wrote: > Hi Charlie, > yes I also noticed how the presentation does not mention any > multi-hop... Maybe it's left out and our job to provide it ;) > Emmanuel > > On Wed, Feb 9, 2011 at 10:24 PM, Charles E. Perkins > > > wrote: > > > Hello Emmanuel, > > I did look at the presentation. Great slides! Not > enough technical information! It could well be > something similar to 802.11s, or ... what? > > Interestingly, slide 35 does NOT show multi-hop. > > One can hope that the advertisements do NOT have > "service identifiers" at layer two :-) [e.g., see > slide 30]. > > > Regards, > Charlie P. > > > > On 2/9/2011 12:58 PM, Emmanuel Baccelli wrote: > > Hi Charlie, > I don't know what you mean by protocol, but it does seem like > L2 stuff > rather than anything else. See: > http://www.cedt.iisc.ernet.in/people/kuri/Comsnets/Keynotes/Keynote-Rajiv-Laroia.pdf > Emmanuel > > On Wed, Feb 9, 2011 at 9:33 PM, Charles E. Perkins > > >> > wrote: > > > Hello folks, > > Does anyone here happen to know what protocol > they are using? > > http://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/qualcomm-to-demonstrate-new-peer-to-peer-technology-at-mobile-world-congress-115550929.html > > Regards, > Charlie P. > > _______________________________________________ > manet mailing list > manet@ietf.org > > > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/manet > > > > > _______________________________________________ > manet mailing list > manet@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/manet > > > _______________________________________________ > manet mailing list > manet@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/manet > > > > _______________________________________________ > manet mailing list > manet@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/manet -- YI Jiazi Postdoc researcher Hipercom@LIX, Ecole Polytechnique 91128 Palaiseau Cedex France www.jiaziyi.com --------------040705000100030108010009 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi Emmanuel

It's actually something related to the Hipercom team :-P
http://ralyx.inria.fr/2009/Raweb/hipercom/uid156.html


On 2011/2/9 22:52, Emmanuel Baccelli wrote:
Hi Charlie,
yes I also noticed how the presentation does not mention any multi-hop... Maybe it's left out and our job to provide it ;)
Emmanuel

On Wed, Feb 9, 2011 at 10:24 PM, Charles E. Perkins <charles.perkins@earthlink.net> wrote:

Hello Emmanuel,

I did look at the presentation.  Great slides!  Not
enough technical information!  It could well be
something similar to 802.11s, or  ... what?

Interestingly, slide 35 does NOT show multi-hop.

One can hope that the advertisements do NOT have
"service identifiers" at layer two :-) [e.g., see
slide 30].


Regards,
Charlie P.



On 2/9/2011 12:58 PM, Emmanuel Baccelli wrote:
Hi Charlie,
I don't know what you mean by protocol, but it does seem like L2 stuff
rather than anything else. See:
http://www.cedt.iisc.ernet.in/people/kuri/Comsnets/Keynotes/Keynote-Rajiv-Laroia.pdf
Emmanuel

On Wed, Feb 9, 2011 at 9:33 PM, Charles E. Perkins
<charliep@computer.org <mailto:charliep@computer.org>> wrote:


   Hello folks,

   Does anyone here happen to know what protocol
   they are using?

   http://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/qualcomm-to-demonstrate-new-peer-to-peer-technology-at-mobile-world-congress-115550929.html

   Regards,
   Charlie P.

   _______________________________________________
   manet mailing list
   manet@ietf.org <mailto:manet@ietf.org>

   https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/manet




_______________________________________________
manet mailing list
manet@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/manet

_______________________________________________
manet mailing list
manet@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/manet


_______________________________________________
manet mailing list
manet@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/manet



-- 
YI Jiazi 

Postdoc researcher 
Hipercom@LIX, Ecole Polytechnique
91128 Palaiseau Cedex France
www.jiaziyi.com
--------------040705000100030108010009-- From prkumar@illinois.edu Wed Feb 9 12:37:42 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: manet@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: manet@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id ACCE33A67AE for ; Wed, 9 Feb 2011 12:37:42 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id eJuPYP+XP62w for ; Wed, 9 Feb 2011 12:37:41 -0800 (PST) Received: from dscas1.ad.uiuc.edu (dscas1.ad.uiuc.edu [128.174.68.119]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EE9F13A67AA for ; Wed, 9 Feb 2011 12:37:40 -0800 (PST) Received: from DSMAILBOX.ad.uiuc.edu ([128.174.68.11]) by DSCAS1.ad.uiuc.edu ([128.174.68.119]) with mapi; Wed, 9 Feb 2011 14:37:50 -0600 From: "Kumar, P R" To: "charliep@computer.org" Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2011 14:37:50 -0600 Thread-Topic: [manet] Ad-hoc networking arrives? Thread-Index: AcvImTfjdL+5OfaOTqu0TEIl/I2ljg== Message-ID: References: <4D52FA32.2070800@computer.org> In-Reply-To: <4D52FA32.2070800@computer.org> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: acceptlanguage: en-US Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailman-Approved-At: Thu, 10 Feb 2011 08:20:01 -0800 Cc: Manet Subject: Re: [manet] Ad-hoc networking arrives? X-BeenThere: manet@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Mobile Ad-hoc Networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2011 20:40:21 -0000 Dear Charlie, I believe this is their new FlashlinQ scheme. Please see http://www.cedt.iisc.ernet.in/people/kuri/Comsnets/Keynotes/Keynote-Rajiv-L= aroia.pdf Regards, Kumar -------------- P. R. Kumar Franklin Woeltge Professor of Electrical and Computer Engineering, and Research Professor, Coordinated Science Lab Office: Room 163, CSL Campus Mail Code: MC-228 Mailing Address: Office: 217-333-7476 Univ. of Illinois Secretary: 217-244-1654 CSL Fax: 217-244-2352 1308 West Main St WWW: https://netfiles.uiuc.edu/prkumar/www/index.html Urbana, IL 61801 Email: prkumar@illinois.edu On Feb 9, 2011, at 2:33 PM, Charles E. Perkins wrote: >=20 > Hello folks, >=20 > Does anyone here happen to know what protocol > they are using? >=20 > http://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/qualcomm-to-demonstrate-new-peer-= to-peer-technology-at-mobile-world-congress-115550929.html >=20 > Regards, > Charlie P. >=20 > _______________________________________________ > manet mailing list > manet@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/manet From joseph.macker@nrl.navy.mil Thu Feb 10 10:28:08 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: manet@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: manet@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1545E3A69DA for ; Thu, 10 Feb 2011 10:28:08 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -5.999 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-5.999 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, J_CHICKENPOX_23=0.6, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 5O0b9MxcpxP8 for ; Thu, 10 Feb 2011 10:28:06 -0800 (PST) Received: from s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3FDB03A67EE for ; Thu, 10 Feb 2011 10:28:05 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtp.itd.nrl.navy.mil (smtp.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.86.3]) by s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.13.8/8.13.8) with SMTP id p1AISF0o009202; Thu, 10 Feb 2011 13:28:15 -0500 Received: from vpn217206.nrl.navy.mil ([132.250.217.206]) by smtp.itd.nrl.navy.mil (SMSSMTP 4.1.16.48) with SMTP id M2011021013281514564 ; Thu, 10 Feb 2011 13:28:15 -0500 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v1082) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: Joe Macker In-Reply-To: Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2011 13:28:15 -0500 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <6DE80889-F357-4C01-900A-F84752F97CCA@nrl.navy.mil> References: <4D52FA32.2070800@computer.org> <4D5305F8.5030400@earthlink.net> To: Emmanuel Baccelli X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1082) Cc: Manet Subject: Re: [manet] Ad-hoc networking arrives? X-BeenThere: manet@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Mobile Ad-hoc Networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2011 18:28:08 -0000 The Ad hoc term never implied multi-hop and its not always needed. There is lot of interesting things that can be done at L2 to develop a = more robust ad hoc system. I dont think highly mobile, multi-hop is what they are initiially = targeting but rather ad hoc type edge networking,etc. As they say proximate networking. The integration of slot coordination = and ad hoc discovery etc as in the slides is pretty cool. Looks pretty cool to me but it may not be what you were expecting. I suggest Qualcomm (Scott Corson) is the place for more releasable = details since its more of a proximate (1 km,etc numbers) P2P system = approach. I am sure designs (backhaul interactions, overlays, etc) could continue = to evolve as well to complement such systems. -Joe On Feb 9, 2011, at 4:52 PM, Emmanuel Baccelli wrote: > Hi Charlie, > yes I also noticed how the presentation does not mention any = multi-hop... Maybe it's left out and our job to provide it ;) > Emmanuel >=20 > On Wed, Feb 9, 2011 at 10:24 PM, Charles E. Perkins = wrote: >=20 > Hello Emmanuel, >=20 > I did look at the presentation. Great slides! Not > enough technical information! It could well be > something similar to 802.11s, or ... what? >=20 > Interestingly, slide 35 does NOT show multi-hop. >=20 > One can hope that the advertisements do NOT have > "service identifiers" at layer two :-) [e.g., see > slide 30]. >=20 >=20 > Regards, > Charlie P. >=20 >=20 >=20 > On 2/9/2011 12:58 PM, Emmanuel Baccelli wrote: > Hi Charlie, > I don't know what you mean by protocol, but it does seem like L2 stuff > rather than anything else. See: > = http://www.cedt.iisc.ernet.in/people/kuri/Comsnets/Keynotes/Keynote-Rajiv-= Laroia.pdf > Emmanuel >=20 > On Wed, Feb 9, 2011 at 9:33 PM, Charles E. Perkins > > wrote: >=20 >=20 > Hello folks, >=20 > Does anyone here happen to know what protocol > they are using? >=20 > = http://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/qualcomm-to-demonstrate-new-peer-t= o-peer-technology-at-mobile-world-congress-115550929.html >=20 > Regards, > Charlie P. >=20 > _______________________________________________ > manet mailing list > manet@ietf.org >=20 > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/manet >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > _______________________________________________ > manet mailing list > manet@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/manet >=20 > _______________________________________________ > manet mailing list > manet@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/manet >=20 > _______________________________________________ > manet mailing list > manet@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/manet From jpmacker@gmail.com Thu Feb 10 23:42:39 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: manet@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: manet@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C483F3A6B0D for ; Thu, 10 Feb 2011 23:42:39 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.999 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.999 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, J_CHICKENPOX_63=0.6, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id O4MSfFhefpD8 for ; Thu, 10 Feb 2011 23:42:39 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-wy0-f172.google.com (mail-wy0-f172.google.com [74.125.82.172]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C23A33A685D for ; Thu, 10 Feb 2011 23:42:38 -0800 (PST) Received: by wyf23 with SMTP id 23so2330495wyf.31 for ; Thu, 10 Feb 2011 23:42:52 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:date:message-id:subject:from:to :content-type; bh=q/JMPRSirM08gu+ReqGQtSRxvEvGQPI6hPNvVfGARW0=; b=HPp7CF1c8Yrzz7LPEyEHxFSpGD1djDSGtj5DhVyMjzBFgDe16mDaJL9vRLOsNe/0lj MB4sunjWkxxCKVPdktRTYKBlggntRpOWHoxq2thAG/qImXbkvHMovCpvNMJ0PMmh309c SixRW/fJiIrAvB8UuGRY6oDanEUSHFUSF4SeA= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:date:message-id:subject:from:to:content-type; b=ejA2X66VaKzB5CMv5zKEMMKOx/VXgGBfTqcSxbEEvAn8HYlx8hYI6JLUHnQknR6oDH gE6PBCnlawdGwRqZbSlLJZiT88x75Ei4uMPeC5pAHvZJhizydHEALbb8cuh8h2JOl9Qg geZ7p0rCkuGmAupPZQfyCt5NyEtYz8jeSIqRk= MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.216.150.129 with SMTP id z1mr121410wej.113.1297410172253; Thu, 10 Feb 2011 23:42:52 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.216.56.70 with HTTP; Thu, 10 Feb 2011 23:42:52 -0800 (PST) Date: Fri, 11 Feb 2011 02:42:52 -0500 Message-ID: From: Joseph Macker To: manet@ietf.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Subject: [manet] Agenda Items for Upcoming Prague MANET Meeting X-BeenThere: manet@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Mobile Ad-hoc Networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 11 Feb 2011 07:42:39 -0000 Beginning to construct a draft agenda for manet WG in Prague. Please email any additional requests for topics,etc. The working group document status review and updates will take precedence. From Marc.Mosko@parc.com Thu Feb 10 11:01:08 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: manet@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: manet@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 94DC63A6987 for ; Thu, 10 Feb 2011 11:01:08 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.046 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.046 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_MISMATCH_COM=0.553, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id SD14HdtjwHZ6 for ; Thu, 10 Feb 2011 11:01:07 -0800 (PST) Received: from alpha.xerox.com (alpha.Xerox.COM [13.1.64.93]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 62B0F3A67A4 for ; Thu, 10 Feb 2011 11:01:07 -0800 (PST) Received: from exchangehub.parc.xerox.com ([13.2.12.22]) by alpha.xerox.com with SMTP id <154123(1)>; Thu, 10 Feb 2011 11:00:47 PST Received: from big.parc.xerox.com (13.2.116.104) by e2010hub1.corp.ad.parc.com (13.2.12.22) with Microsoft SMTP Server id 14.0.722.0; Thu, 10 Feb 2011 11:00:45 -0800 Message-ID: <4D5435DD.5090804@parc.com> Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2011 11:00:45 PST From: Marc Mosko User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; Intel Mac OS X 10.6; en-US; rv:1.9.2.13) Gecko/20101207 Thunderbird/3.1.7 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: References: <4D52FA32.2070800@computer.org> In-Reply-To: <4D52FA32.2070800@computer.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1"; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailman-Approved-At: Fri, 11 Feb 2011 08:16:37 -0800 Cc: Manet Subject: Re: [manet] Ad-hoc networking arrives? X-BeenThere: manet@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Mobile Ad-hoc Networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2011 19:01:08 -0000 Qualcomm has an SDK out already called Alljoyn: http://developer.qualcomm.com/dev/alljoyn-p2p Marc Mosko On 7/22/64 11:59 AM, Charles E. Perkins wrote: > > Hello folks, > > Does anyone here happen to know what protocol > they are using? > > http://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/qualcomm-to-demonstrate-new-peer-to-peer-technology-at-mobile-world-congress-115550929.html > > > Regards, > Charlie P. > > From robert.g.cole@us.army.mil Fri Feb 11 11:57:28 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: manet@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: manet@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9C8C13A6A01 for ; Fri, 11 Feb 2011 11:57:28 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -5.999 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-5.999 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, J_CHICKENPOX_63=0.6, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 2DH5vcHbOuoo for ; Fri, 11 Feb 2011 11:57:26 -0800 (PST) Received: from ddokavsgwhub006.conus.army.mil (ddokavsgwhub006.conus.army.mil [143.85.192.28]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B52AC3A698E for ; Fri, 11 Feb 2011 11:57:26 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple/simple; d=us.army.mil; i=Robert.G.Cole@us.army.mil; q=dns/txt; s=conusdkim; t=1297454262; x=1328990262; h=mime-version:content-transfer-encoding:subject:date: message-id:in-reply-to:references:from:to; z=MIME-Version:=201.0|Content-Transfer-Encoding:=20quoted- printable|Subject:=20RE:=20[manet]=20Agenda=20Items=20for =20Upcoming=20Prague=20MANET=20Meeting=20(UNCLASSIFIED) |Date:=20Fri,=2011=20Feb=202011=2014:56:13=20-0500 |Message-ID:=20<4B87393F999699419C0AB9CBF80CA3B6D475CB@DD COBE010HUB006.nae.ds.army.mil>|In-Reply-To:=20 |References:=20|From:=20"Cole,=20Robert=20G=20Dr =20CIV=20USA"=20|To:=20"Joseph =20Macker"=20,=0D=0A=09; bh=hlJqQojxUG+OiT09y21wn8FlLsMURMuTB0Kad/ZliKQ=; b=pjYZ6EXx4LIqtwDt0vn0R4h2OUs/I2UrFDqSfiMph5HDC6VPbGWR6S4z bbjDzJkJ3fZ+qzO2NF+66w5g8PRR1kyJbbRCl3iYq++5ECXuRrh7k0+zp qB4EtaRcIbBE2+TAuXr5eIaretdwOAQzR/D240CIQL7mIGYh+6hIFQevA U=; X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.60,457,1291593600"; d="scan'208";a="149620372" Received: from unknown (HELO DDOKBH100HUB003.nasw.ds.army.mil) ([143.82.0.34]) by ddokavsgwhub006.conus.army.mil with ESMTP; 11 Feb 2011 19:57:35 +0000 Received: from DDCOBH100HUB008.nasw.ds.army.mil ([143.82.246.15]) by DDOKBH100HUB003.nasw.ds.army.mil with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.4675); Fri, 11 Feb 2011 13:56:52 -0600 Received: from DDCOBE010HUB006.nae.ds.army.mil ([143.82.246.39]) by DDCOBH100HUB008.nasw.ds.army.mil with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.4675); Fri, 11 Feb 2011 14:56:51 -0500 x-mimeole: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Date: Fri, 11 Feb 2011 14:56:13 -0500 Message-ID: <4B87393F999699419C0AB9CBF80CA3B6D475CB@DDCOBE010HUB006.nae.ds.army.mil> In-Reply-To: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [manet] Agenda Items for Upcoming Prague MANET Meeting (UNCLASSIFIED) Thread-Index: AcvJv1uT39rDxqotQoypA8CnOUuU5QAZh/bQ References: From: "Cole, Robert G Dr CIV USA" To: "Joseph Macker" , X-OriginalArrivalTime: 11 Feb 2011 19:56:51.0808 (UTC) FILETIME=[D350CE00:01CBCA25] Subject: Re: [manet] Agenda Items for Upcoming Prague MANET Meeting (UNCLASSIFIED) X-BeenThere: manet@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Mobile Ad-hoc Networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 11 Feb 2011 19:57:28 -0000 Classification: UNCLASSIFIED Caveats: NONE Joe, Two items. + I assume that Ulrich would want to update on the NHDP and OLSRv2 MIBs. + I would like to update on the DYMO, SMF and REPORT MIBs. Thanks, Bob -----Original Message----- From: manet-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:manet-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Joseph Macker Sent: Friday, February 11, 2011 2:43 AM To: manet@ietf.org Subject: [manet] Agenda Items for Upcoming Prague MANET Meeting Beginning to construct a draft agenda for manet WG in Prague. Please email any additional requests for topics,etc. The working group document status review and updates will take precedence. _______________________________________________ manet mailing list manet@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/manet Classification: UNCLASSIFIED Caveats: NONE From zirrrrro@yahoo.fr Fri Feb 11 12:39:51 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: manet@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: manet@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DCC8B3A6A31 for ; Fri, 11 Feb 2011 12:39:51 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: 4.982 X-Spam-Level: **** X-Spam-Status: No, score=4.982 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_60=1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, MISSING_SUBJECT=1.762, TVD_SPACE_RATIO=2.219] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id gebcSUk60DWJ for ; Fri, 11 Feb 2011 12:39:50 -0800 (PST) Received: from nm10.bullet.mail.ukl.yahoo.com (nm10.bullet.mail.ukl.yahoo.com [217.146.182.251]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 024253A6A3C for ; Fri, 11 Feb 2011 12:39:49 -0800 (PST) Received: from [217.146.183.183] by nm10.bullet.mail.ukl.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Feb 2011 20:40:02 -0000 Received: from [217.146.183.41] by tm14.bullet.mail.ukl.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Feb 2011 20:40:02 -0000 Received: from [127.0.0.1] by omp1026.mail.ukl.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 11 Feb 2011 20:40:02 -0000 X-Yahoo-Newman-Property: ymail-3 X-Yahoo-Newman-Id: 176479.33297.bm@omp1026.mail.ukl.yahoo.com Received: (qmail 20880 invoked by uid 60001); 11 Feb 2011 20:40:01 -0000 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yahoo.fr; s=s1024; t=1297456801; bh=P44ArsGd+TfzPOESUp31aATnhJO1+uyNGvc3mlF6yic=; h=Message-ID:X-YMail-OSG:Received:X-Mailer:Date:From:To:MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=iQCW7mCEDrxWYdJHg+6M0Rld2yaOU+HchJ8VggNp6V1A/aN+RgMRlezuvRPyiMaMJFme9E7/xwfK7a4sY30pkXfYx8QTFT+qfrVnhbtogtlA5cGsfj4xZrHWX+UvdXndRInN0z4sXK088ObN1SXbBgEmJVzPs4cNFPox3XYF+pU= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.fr; h=Message-ID:X-YMail-OSG:Received:X-Mailer:Date:From:To:MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=v371QbX//cQ+Z9R2GgMgYVY/ay+kEfGXQyfF9vG8LreUl8M+Uvv0EjCndAGo751Uh1ohaW/T320Xe1j+DHTRlaqn1sr68fNMRaBBBlUe7M6Abt5i0lU8cuAhHwvX6Wv6ONIPOeTh1PU/Y+XFvuXD5orixx5Pd8k7scxXn+zU7PE=; Message-ID: <227704.20312.qm@web25703.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> X-YMail-OSG: pcNs41gVM1n2qv2RS0GU5XMEolqdctf8_OpqJ1WRDDgYRjJ vIoazchntLFbYm0qAU0AxDbNJ4PPMAgSfENjoBH2dhTgMyI.EYCO8B2Lf7mp viXVTS4aNp9LkA.JsVDCzFG9s3XRpP5dk8UfPwjMF5T_oYVlrXTaYzrCchy1 vGuSuf4s_uC1yHk_GaM4k3OrRRj2ikBJeWiwz91Bmbn68lvd5I_cZVoVuDu2 YKs3t.tX2UxBZg2q3xe7NMpo4.Gto3PsdabnYx8P0tCyeveWl8dK3nB8IZHE ytUkjuJW7NofE5r0EiRiEDzh_ZpH0wcAY6bsD8JWjyCCU Received: from [99.251.239.91] by web25703.mail.ukl.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 11 Feb 2011 20:40:00 GMT X-Mailer: YahooMailWebService/0.8.108.291010 Date: Fri, 11 Feb 2011 20:40:00 +0000 (GMT) From: amine elabidi To: hassen_elhouaidi@yahoo.fr, sympa@cru.fr, amine.Elabidi@aophia.inria.fr, frk.kamoun@planet.tn, dtn-interest-request@mailman.dtnrg.org, sophia-staff@lists.grid5000.fr, manetautoconf-request@ml.free.fr, ns-users@isi.edu, manet@ietf.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0-847027942-1297456800=:20312" Subject: [manet] (no subject) X-BeenThere: manet@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Mobile Ad-hoc Networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 11 Feb 2011 20:39:52 -0000 --0-847027942-1297456800=:20312 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable http://myfriendsbirthday.com/images/aaw.php=0A=0A=0A --0-847027942-1297456800=:20312 Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
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=0A=0A=0A=0A=0A --0-847027942-1297456800=:20312-- From ulrich@herberg.name Fri Feb 11 13:04:07 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: manet@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: manet@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 45CB03A69DA for ; Fri, 11 Feb 2011 13:04:07 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.977 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.977 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, FM_FORGED_GMAIL=0.622, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id h9qNbSVxsIYM for ; Fri, 11 Feb 2011 13:04:06 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-vw0-f44.google.com (mail-vw0-f44.google.com [209.85.212.44]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7E3E23A67B3 for ; Fri, 11 Feb 2011 13:04:06 -0800 (PST) Received: by vws7 with SMTP id 7so2051722vws.31 for ; Fri, 11 Feb 2011 13:04:22 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.220.181.69 with SMTP id bx5mr1199168vcb.171.1297458261664; Fri, 11 Feb 2011 13:04:21 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.220.117.12 with HTTP; Fri, 11 Feb 2011 13:04:21 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <4B87393F999699419C0AB9CBF80CA3B6D475CB@DDCOBE010HUB006.nae.ds.army.mil> References: <4B87393F999699419C0AB9CBF80CA3B6D475CB@DDCOBE010HUB006.nae.ds.army.mil> Date: Fri, 11 Feb 2011 22:04:21 +0100 Message-ID: From: Ulrich Herberg To: "Cole, Robert G Dr CIV USA" Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Cc: Joseph Macker , manet@ietf.org Subject: Re: [manet] Agenda Items for Upcoming Prague MANET Meeting (UNCLASSIFIED) X-BeenThere: manet@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Mobile Ad-hoc Networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 11 Feb 2011 21:04:07 -0000 Joe, Ian, On Fri, Feb 11, 2011 at 8:56 PM, Cole, Robert G Dr CIV USA wrote: > + I assume that Ulrich would want to update on the NHDP and OLSRv2 MIBs. I confirm that. I would also like to present updates on the security documents. I plan to revise and resubmit the NHDP-sec document, and then would like to ask the working group whether the document could be considered as WG I-D. Concerning the packetbb-sec document, my personal feeling is that it is ready for WG LC. Ulrich From jpmacker@gmail.com Sat Feb 12 19:06:40 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: manet@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: manet@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C02733A6A79 for ; Sat, 12 Feb 2011 19:06:40 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.999 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.999 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, J_CHICKENPOX_63=0.6, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id yK17BuXtz7MI for ; Sat, 12 Feb 2011 19:06:40 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-ww0-f42.google.com (mail-ww0-f42.google.com [74.125.82.42]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BCA2C3A6A76 for ; Sat, 12 Feb 2011 19:06:39 -0800 (PST) Received: by wwi17 with SMTP id 17so833971wwi.1 for ; Sat, 12 Feb 2011 19:06:58 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date :message-id:subject:from:to:cc:content-type; bh=xIx/YVpkbREy+93eJwsSdzd9fzpwN0GxjuJDM1Pou18=; b=vW6cxlzKouUHi2h38GybuaDRk2kHCGuJ3v92JddsF0vMZk/zDlUdErBBp6O3DD0GXY 3B0e5w3USKDutzXVq21ivxjM3Es824X9OaZHMJw6J0cM6GZC0sdJwEHvG5e60HvH9YZG Bsd4iwKCXGuKMJo/O0M4X0SIVLSg7tMqLtJms= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :cc:content-type; b=ezlWnjVgWYWPa4cLFxrPWZ0R3Wh2E0bRDv3x/UbF1HICZ9B2DwVWL/s8ZZ3lsWlIeO mj7oSXceQmScyyzrXJ+klm8wqGV+2GOR/lmXb7ZSuBjo0r2Erl4+aGHG4ljOEmmOmlGw qx6XzCNIucZyaD9oLpmGQu5wSWqoxwcPLMhQM= MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.216.150.129 with SMTP id z1mr1927823wej.113.1297566418154; Sat, 12 Feb 2011 19:06:58 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.216.56.70 with HTTP; Sat, 12 Feb 2011 19:06:58 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <4B87393F999699419C0AB9CBF80CA3B6D475CB@DDCOBE010HUB006.nae.ds.army.mil> References: <4B87393F999699419C0AB9CBF80CA3B6D475CB@DDCOBE010HUB006.nae.ds.army.mil> Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2011 22:06:58 -0500 Message-ID: From: Joseph Macker To: "Cole, Robert G Dr CIV USA" Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Cc: manet@ietf.org Subject: Re: [manet] Agenda Items for Upcoming Prague MANET Meeting (UNCLASSIFIED) X-BeenThere: manet@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Mobile Ad-hoc Networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 13 Feb 2011 03:06:41 -0000 Perfect. WG docs are the core of the agenda. On Fri, Feb 11, 2011 at 2:56 PM, Cole, Robert G Dr CIV USA wrote: > Classification: UNCLASSIFIED > Caveats: NONE > > Joe, > > Two items. > > + I assume that Ulrich would want to update on the NHDP and OLSRv2 MIBs. > > + I would like to update on the DYMO, SMF and REPORT MIBs. > > Thanks, > Bob > > -----Original Message----- > From: manet-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:manet-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf > Of Joseph Macker > Sent: Friday, February 11, 2011 2:43 AM > To: manet@ietf.org > Subject: [manet] Agenda Items for Upcoming Prague MANET Meeting > > Beginning to construct a draft agenda for manet WG in Prague. > Please email any additional requests for topics,etc. > > The working group document status review and updates will take > precedence. > _______________________________________________ > manet mailing list > manet@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/manet > Classification: UNCLASSIFIED > Caveats: NONE > > > From abdussalambaryun@gmail.com Wed Feb 16 08:33:25 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: manet@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: manet@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 038C83A6E74 for ; Wed, 16 Feb 2011 08:33:25 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.598 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.598 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id RtJvym5cMIzD for ; Wed, 16 Feb 2011 08:33:24 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-vx0-f172.google.com (mail-vx0-f172.google.com [209.85.220.172]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2F1CA3A6E6D for ; Wed, 16 Feb 2011 08:33:24 -0800 (PST) Received: by vxi40 with SMTP id 40so705409vxi.31 for ; Wed, 16 Feb 2011 08:33:52 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:date:message-id:subject:from:to :content-type; bh=sYZSIeT+XuYt0a2a4nhqfrf4Nam8u53jE5+t0STrZ3M=; b=r4TGDQtfkhCnCkrptyfAF1t1CgmU1dPA6kRVCQVDlD4VmrNsjv4O6f30Lg2YWIG8kU E/fyFuCkpaDVWGR+i8l86lvUqg7JES1UgQpQr25HgVFHcEy1xGA8Z0DSdc1nVRbkKPkj L2Y+OCWFYPvCkXtDuK6UkGDj1gI+N9WgchSsk= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:date:message-id:subject:from:to:content-type; b=tyzXU+rAdjZOewKDiN3ULcUA8DoTPM960NrFduz1gm6WvEDzMwdKmloxIMmCddf2Se jcYHPzVeWkBv8EqccvrrvjsIbOtD2A8F/Uv2YFUzbIddY1uctJB/1K125ePCgscVcoPo dGzqh6+jDR+AtSuR37ZSDd6ibJC0v7QiUFClw= MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.229.229.18 with SMTP id jg18mr903029qcb.276.1297874032330; Wed, 16 Feb 2011 08:33:52 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.229.95.7 with HTTP; Wed, 16 Feb 2011 08:33:52 -0800 (PST) Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2011 16:33:52 +0000 Message-ID: From: Abdussalam Baryun To: manet@ietf.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=00163630ed19a91794049c68d852 X-Mailman-Approved-At: Thu, 17 Feb 2011 08:19:25 -0800 Subject: Re: [manet] Ad-hoc networking arrives? X-BeenThere: manet@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Mobile Ad-hoc Networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2011 16:33:25 -0000 --00163630ed19a91794049c68d852 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Yes, I agree, the protocol looks similar to 802.11s, but it does not use multi-hop communication, without routing, and it is using smart antennas for the destination discovery. However, I agree that it is not clear yet, but it does not seem as a power efficient system, if it will cover to distance above 500m. Abdussalam --00163630ed19a91794049c68d852 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Yes, I agree, the protocol=A0looks similar to 802.11s, but it does= not use multi-hop communication, without routing, and it is=A0using smart = antennas for the destination discovery. However, I agree that it is not cle= ar yet, but it does not seem as a=A0power efficient system, if it will=A0co= ver to distance above 500m.
=A0
Abdussalam
--00163630ed19a91794049c68d852-- From Internet-Drafts@ietf.org Thu Feb 17 08:45:03 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: manet@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: manet@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 50E6D3A6C4F; Thu, 17 Feb 2011 08:45:03 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -102.512 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-102.512 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.087, BAYES_00=-2.599, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ZJDqT7tmrgk8; Thu, 17 Feb 2011 08:45:02 -0800 (PST) Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4DF143A6C3C; Thu, 17 Feb 2011 08:45:02 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Multipart/Mixed; Boundary="NextPart" From: Internet-Drafts@ietf.org To: i-d-announce@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 3.12 Message-ID: <20110217164502.27669.56214.idtracker@localhost> Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2011 08:45:02 -0800 Cc: manet@ietf.org Subject: [manet] I-D Action:draft-ietf-manet-report-mib-01.txt X-BeenThere: manet@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Mobile Ad-hoc Networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2011 16:45:03 -0000 --NextPart A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Mobile Ad-hoc Networks Working Group of the IETF. Title : Definition of Managed Objects for Performance Reporting Author(s) : R. Cole, et al. Filename : draft-ietf-manet-report-mib-01.txt Pages : 74 Date : 2011-02-17 This memo defines a portion of the Management Information Base (MIB) for use with network management protocols in the Internet community. In particular, it describes objects for configuring autonomous report generation on any device that supports MIBs containing counter and gauge objects for performance monitoring. This allows a management station to instruct a device to build off-line reports to be collected asynchronously by the management station. Further, this REPORT-MIB can be configured in a proxy configuration where the report generation is performed on a device in close network proximity to the device containing the referenced counter objects. Hence, this capability allows network operators to reduce the SNMP polling traffic burden on Mobile Ad-Hoc and Disruption Tolerant Networks which is typical of SNMP performance management applications. This capability also improves the accuracy of the performance reports by minimizing the delay variation between the reporting agent (this MIB) and the data monitor (the MIB containing the monitored counter objects). A URL for this Internet-Draft is: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-manet-report-mib-01.txt Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ Below is the data which will enable a MIME compliant mail reader implementation to automatically retrieve the ASCII version of the Internet-Draft. --NextPart Content-Type: Message/External-body; name="draft-ietf-manet-report-mib-01.txt"; site="ftp.ietf.org"; access-type="anon-ftp"; directory="internet-drafts" Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: <2011-02-17083547.I-D@ietf.org> --NextPart-- From robert.g.cole@us.army.mil Thu Feb 17 08:48:12 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: manet@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: manet@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D432E3A6C3C for ; Thu, 17 Feb 2011 08:48:12 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.299 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.299 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.300, BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id GM+6ioVyYWI1 for ; 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Thu, 17 Feb 2011 09:22:19 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 3S6Xw8hpMIeT for ; Thu, 17 Feb 2011 09:22:18 -0800 (PST) Received: from www.xplot.org (www.xplot.org [66.92.66.146]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4BE553A6CB8 for ; Thu, 17 Feb 2011 09:22:18 -0800 (PST) Received: from shep (helo=alva.home) by www.xplot.org with local-esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1 (Debian)) id 1Pq7Z1-0002HF-00; Thu, 17 Feb 2011 12:22:47 -0500 From: Tim Shepard To: Abdussalam Baryun In-reply-to: Your message of Wed, 16 Feb 2011 16:33:52 +0000. Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2011 12:22:47 -0500 Message-Id: Sender: Tim Shepard X-Mailman-Approved-At: Fri, 18 Feb 2011 08:01:46 -0800 Cc: manet@ietf.org Subject: Re: [manet] Ad-hoc networking arrives? X-BeenThere: manet@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Mobile Ad-hoc Networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2011 17:22:19 -0000 > Yes, I agree, the protocol looks similar to 802.11s, but it does not use > multi-hop communication, without routing, and it is using smart antennas for > the destination discovery. However, I agree that it is not clear yet, but it > does not seem as a power efficient system, if it will cover to distance > above 500m. Compared to what? Multihop? But multihop requires the deployment of intermediate nodes. If I'm here and you're there and we're going to want to communicate using this scheme and we want it to be multihop to improve its energy efficiency, then we would also have to somehow arrange for the deployment of intermediate nodes (which is not likely to happen). There doesn't seem to be much point in having multihop in this context. The energy saving gains from multihop are the same kind of gain you get from directionality. Omni antennas with a single ideally placed intermediate node saves you half the power (1/4 power on each of two transmissions, 1/4 times 2 is 1/2). You could also save half the power with a measely 3 dB of combined antenna gain at sender and receiver (e.g. could be 1.5 dB at the sender plus 1.5 dB at the receiver). If you look at system performance gain vs the increased system complexity costs for for both (1) multihop and (2) increased gain from directional antennas, it seems that in most likely scenarios you get a better payoff by putting the effort into antenna gain. And the antenna gain also lets you do things you otherwise would not be able to do when there are no intermediate nodes. Yes, you can do both. But if you were getting started and cannot do everything in version 1.0 and want to decide which to do first, directional gain from better antennas wins over multihop, and it is not even close. -Tim Shepard shep@alum.mit.edu From abdussalambaryun@gmail.com Fri Feb 18 11:37:19 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: manet@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: manet@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B79B63A6E4C for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2011 11:37:19 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.098 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.098 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.500, BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id C3Sys-JLvO+P for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2011 11:37:18 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-qy0-f172.google.com (mail-qy0-f172.google.com [209.85.216.172]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B50CA3A6E19 for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2011 11:37:18 -0800 (PST) Received: by qyk34 with SMTP id 34so666214qyk.10 for ; Fri, 18 Feb 2011 11:37:52 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:date:message-id:subject:from:to :content-type; bh=dNRRuvVIdCeyRsNdxjJjP/PCxdqDA6eUhYNWScV8BYo=; b=No4KFeonBPJUyxU1i5IFnjPjiAzwp6X5IAr9YMk2i3pZJ15VB9iaAOBeJngxpEFd/j MNH/cTQNKac+ItI1VDXtCOVlXV4/CQc69Kg0C6oe6+QyxIpnkRG4x4geoQcFC18+nmHR 9fCCcDSIt+gdWxmNMAQM3nRfHfgYxCTbm5RMA= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:date:message-id:subject:from:to:content-type; b=f85tAcRLsAB7qpEF3AyKMSi0qAsHSWTLFlLzCzFC3x/dL1EoLbQvYCq06EeGupj0uo Biv2l3m+dmM1+pWl8tGkmSVcnFvkKwrkgD1xOUv71F7y6Pj2T72QKLelJ1YfLLe+L52x zSdCUU4bm3m9TaE16DpaDoqdWrvkggO4q4q2Y= MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.229.229.18 with SMTP id jg18mr868947qcb.276.1298057872533; Fri, 18 Feb 2011 11:37:52 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.229.95.7 with HTTP; Fri, 18 Feb 2011 11:37:52 -0800 (PST) Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2011 19:37:52 +0000 Message-ID: From: Abdussalam Baryun To: manet@ietf.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=00163630ed1963ec06049c93a68d X-Mailman-Approved-At: Sat, 19 Feb 2011 08:06:20 -0800 Subject: Re: [manet] Ad-hoc networking arrives? X-BeenThere: manet@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Mobile Ad-hoc Networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2011 19:37:19 -0000 --00163630ed1963ec06049c93a68d Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 >Compared to what? Multihop? But multihop requires the deployment of >intermediate nodes. If I'm here and you're there and we're going to >want to communicate using this scheme and we want it to be multihop to >improve its energy efficiency, then we would also have to somehow >arrange for the deployment of intermediate nodes (which is not likely >to happen). There doesn't seem to be much point in having multihop in >this context. > If you look at system performance gain vs the increased >system complexity costs for for both (1) multihop and (2) increased >gain from directional antennas, it seems that in most likely scenarios >you get a better payoff by putting the effort into antenna gain. And >the antenna gain also lets you do things you otherwise would not be >able to do when there are no intermediate nodes. >Yes, you can do both. But if you were getting started and cannot do >everything in version 1.0 and want to decide which to do first, >directional gain from better antennas wins over multihop, and it is >not even close. Multihop is good in MANET, not very good in fixed nodes deployment, because I think that the discussed network has a neighbor discovery phase which will consumes source node energy until it identifies destination position, then there can be a point to point communication phase. In the presentation sent by Emmanual, it seems like a MANET to me, so I thought using multihop and routing discovering at layer_3 can be more efficient because of node mobility. Abdussalam, ICRC, UK --00163630ed1963ec06049c93a68d Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
>Compared to what?=A0 Multihop?=A0 But multihop requires the deploy= ment of
>intermediate nodes. If I'm here and you're there and= we're going to
>want to communicate using this scheme and we wan= t it to be multihop to
>improve its energy efficiency, then we would also have to somehow
&g= t;arrange for the deployment of intermediate nodes (which is not likely
= >to happen).=A0 There doesn't seem to be much point in having multih= op in
>this context.
>=A0If you look at system performance gain vs the i= ncreased
>system complexity costs for for both (1) multihop and (2) i= ncreased
>gain from directional antennas, it seems that in most likel= y scenarios
>you get a better payoff by putting the effort into antenna gain.=A0 And=
>the antenna gain also lets you do things you otherwise would not be=
>able to do when there are no intermediate nodes.
>Yes, you ca= n do both.=A0 But if you were getting started and cannot do
>everything in version 1.0 and want to decide which to do first,
>= directional gain from better antennas wins over multihop, and it is
>= not even close.
Multihop is good in MANET, not=A0very good in=A0fixed nodes deployment= , because I think=A0that the discussed network=A0has=A0a neighbor discovery= phase which will consumes source node energy until it identifies destinati= on position, then there can be a point to point communication phase. In the= presentation sent by Emmanual, it seems like a MANET to me, so I thought u= sing multihop and routing discovering at layer_3 can be more efficient beca= use of node=A0mobility.
=A0
Abdussalam,
ICRC, UK
--00163630ed1963ec06049c93a68d-- From gnawali@cs.stanford.edu Sat Feb 19 08:28:27 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: manet@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: manet@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 648C93A6F2F for ; Sat, 19 Feb 2011 08:28:27 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -5.977 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-5.977 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, FM_FORGED_GMAIL=0.622, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id SuG9+c4q4sUq for ; Sat, 19 Feb 2011 08:28:26 -0800 (PST) Received: from cs-smtp-2.Stanford.EDU (cs-smtp-2.Stanford.EDU [171.64.64.26]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 969DC3A6EE0 for ; Sat, 19 Feb 2011 08:28:26 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-iw0-f172.google.com ([209.85.214.172]) by cs-smtp-2.Stanford.EDU with esmtpsa (TLSv1:RC4-SHA:128) (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1Pqpg7-0003WK-4K for manet@ietf.org; Sat, 19 Feb 2011 08:29:03 -0800 Received: by iwl42 with SMTP id 42so1462614iwl.31 for ; Sat, 19 Feb 2011 08:29:02 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.42.218.6 with SMTP id ho6mr2544145icb.1.1298132942080; Sat, 19 Feb 2011 08:29:02 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.231.59.15 with HTTP; Sat, 19 Feb 2011 08:28:42 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: From: Omprakash Gnawali Date: Sat, 19 Feb 2011 08:28:42 -0800 Message-ID: To: Abdussalam Baryun Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Scan-Signature: 2d1a4fa5d0150c38835749a59b44c419 Cc: manet@ietf.org Subject: Re: [manet] Ad-hoc networking arrives? X-BeenThere: manet@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Mobile Ad-hoc Networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 19 Feb 2011 16:28:27 -0000 On Fri, Feb 18, 2011 at 11:37 AM, Abdussalam Baryun wrote: >>Compared to what?=A0 Multihop?=A0 But multihop requires the deployment of >>intermediate nodes. If I'm here and you're there and we're going to >>want to communicate using this scheme and we want it to be multihop to >>improve its energy efficiency, then we would also have to somehow >>arrange for the deployment of intermediate nodes (which is not likely >>to happen).=A0 There doesn't seem to be much point in having multihop in >>this context. >>=A0If you look at system performance gain vs the increased >>system complexity costs for for both (1) multihop and (2) increased >>gain from directional antennas, it seems that in most likely scenarios >>you get a better payoff by putting the effort into antenna gain.=A0 And >>the antenna gain also lets you do things you otherwise would not be >>able to do when there are no intermediate nodes. >>Yes, you can do both.=A0 But if you were getting started and cannot do >>everything in version 1.0 and want to decide which to do first, >>directional gain from better antennas wins over multihop, and it is >>not even close. > Multihop is good in MANET, not=A0very good in=A0fixed nodes deployment, b= ecause > I think=A0that the discussed network=A0has=A0a neighbor discovery phase w= hich will > consumes source node energy until it identifies destination position, the= n > there can be a point to point communication phase. In the presentation se= nt > by Emmanual, it seems like a MANET to me, so I thought using multihop and > routing discovering at layer_3 can be more efficient because of > node=A0mobility. Unless what you mean by "fixed nodes deployment" is a deployment where the link characteristics are static. There are many examples of network deployments where the nodes are physically fixed yet multihop is the right solution. - om_p From mscorson@gmail.com Mon Feb 28 10:53:45 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: manet@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: manet@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BA8813A6C47 for ; Mon, 28 Feb 2011 10:53:44 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 71-ilvw3DAKI for ; Mon, 28 Feb 2011 10:53:42 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-gy0-f172.google.com (mail-gy0-f172.google.com [209.85.160.172]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 119AF3A6A1D for ; Mon, 28 Feb 2011 10:53:41 -0800 (PST) Received: by gyc15 with SMTP id 15so1875680gyc.31 for ; Mon, 28 Feb 2011 10:54:42 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:date:message-id:subject:from:to :content-type; bh=I9ppEwBlSV6cY4rWuC3QcLXwBYP6g/W0toS+s6zGCsc=; b=Q1+xl0JeBMqbyXAxF6pRDmf94lCVSnNeUgCSi7kXJBeueAjyvv56aTa3Gx1Rv9VI74 akqXR3vnjj6FYysIlDwUNqfdUDxKW7QTpDDExbPzpNASThGsIxtCz14SXOC0lcw23OWP YQScqfoJPASveG90Sx47E0xHfBr5E+Qvf5qwU= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:date:message-id:subject:from:to:content-type; b=ozFPEcNU6P+J6yAyJudPDFtYQiLq1NOfWXcU6dTLqUFvTFnijIAPbrdPV/VNIA8cx2 AxqWxzGrIYy8dEKbKBlNjt0k+cFyJobjfBzTSeHSv7RZ07Q8WQE0l9xsxb/+gTpXIaon BDHgUyqwY8WU7Pp3tgEshUbgoA8xv6AjzXajM= MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.151.61.8 with SMTP id o8mr7458408ybk.360.1298919212694; Mon, 28 Feb 2011 10:53:32 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.147.124.19 with HTTP; Mon, 28 Feb 2011 10:53:32 -0800 (PST) Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2011 13:53:32 -0500 Message-ID: From: M Scott Corson To: manet@ietf.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Subject: [manet] FlashLinq X-BeenThere: manet@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Mobile Ad-hoc Networks List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2011 18:53:45 -0000 Hey everyone... I heard there was a little discussion about FlashLinq on this list, so I thought I'd clarify a few things: * It's not yet commercially available. :-( * It's designed to run synchronously in dedicated TDD spectrum. * It can support multi-hop networking, though it need not (and often would not) be used in that fashion. We publicly announced it at MWC in Barcelona. There's a video of a demo somewhere on enGadget. Here's a website with some details. http://www.qualcomm.com/research/flashlinq In particular, a recent IEEE Wireless Comms paper gives some insight into the thinking behind its design. http://www.qualcomm.com/documents/toward-proximity-aware-internetworking Cheers, -Scott & Vince