From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Fri Feb 1 01:12:25 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id BAA23812 for ; Fri, 1 Feb 2002 01:12:25 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id WAA13972 for manet-outgoing; Thu, 31 Jan 2002 22:12:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from patty.levels.unisa.edu.au (patty.levels.unisa.edu.au [130.220.36.156]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id WAA13964 for ; Thu, 31 Jan 2002 22:12:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from spri.levels.unisa.edu.au (gurami [172.17.0.68]) by patty.levels.unisa.edu.au (8.9.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id NAA27564; Fri, 1 Feb 2002 13:42:13 +1030 (CST) Message-ID: <3C5A078C.DBCDF0C3@spri.levels.unisa.edu.au> Date: Fri, 01 Feb 2002 13:42:13 +1030 From: Peter Pham X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.75 [en] (X11; U; SunOS 5.6 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: tns@SPRI.Levels.UniSA.Edu.Au, MANET Subject: Need help Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------FBCF441FC3DF625E4CF19139" Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------FBCF441FC3DF625E4CF19139 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------8D4E52C8726EFC3F59CC0850" --------------8D4E52C8726EFC3F59CC0850 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi all I am looking for the following reference material: A.F Veinott Jr. "Markov decision chains." eds. G.B Dantzig and B.C Eaves, MAA Studies in Optimization, 10:124-159, 1974 Anyone know about this and could give some hint of where to get this. Thank you very much. -- Best Regards. Peter Phuc Pham ========================================== The University of South Australia Institute for Telecommunications Research Mawson Lakes Campus SA5095 Office: 08-83023869 Email : ppham@spri.levels.unisa.edu.au WWW : http://www.itr.unisa.edu.au/~ppham ========================================== --------------8D4E52C8726EFC3F59CC0850 Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi all
I am looking for the following reference material:

A.F Veinott Jr. "Markov decision chains." eds. G.B Dantzig and B.C Eaves, MAA Studies in Optimization, 10:124-159, 1974

Anyone know about this and could give some hint of where to get this.

Thank you very much.

-- 
Best Regards.

Peter Phuc Pham
==========================================
The University of South Australia
Institute for Telecommunications Research
Mawson Lakes Campus SA5095
Office: 08-83023869
Email : ppham@spri.levels.unisa.edu.au
WWW   : http://www.itr.unisa.edu.au/~ppham
==========================================
  --------------8D4E52C8726EFC3F59CC0850-- --------------FBCF441FC3DF625E4CF19139 Content-Type: text/x-vcard; charset=us-ascii; name="ppham.vcf" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Description: Card for Peter Pham Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="ppham.vcf" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit begin:vcard n:Pham;Peter tel;work:83023869 x-mozilla-html:FALSE url:http://www.itr.unisa.edu.au/~ppham org:The University of South Australia;Institute for Telecommunications Research version:2.1 email;internet:ppham@spri.levels.unisa.edu.au adr;quoted-printable:;;Institute for Telecommunication Research =0D=0AThe University of South Australia ;Mawson Lakes;SA;5095;Australia x-mozilla-cpt:;-9064 fn:Peter Pham end:vcard --------------FBCF441FC3DF625E4CF19139-- From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Fri Feb 1 06:04:26 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id GAA15611 for ; Fri, 1 Feb 2002 06:04:26 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id DAA19570 for manet-outgoing; Fri, 1 Feb 2002 03:54:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from mephisto.inf.tu-dresden.de (mephisto.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.40.3] (may be forged)) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id DAA19565 for ; Fri, 1 Feb 2002 03:54:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from acer.ibdr.inf.tu-dresden.de (acer.inf.tu-dresden.de [141.76.40.88]) by mephisto.inf.tu-dresden.de (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA06114 for ; Fri, 1 Feb 2002 09:54:35 +0100 (MET) Message-Id: <5.1.0.14.0.20020201095251.00aca568@ibdr112.inf.tu-dresden.de> X-Sender: gikaru@ibdr112.inf.tu-dresden.de X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Fri, 01 Feb 2002 09:59:03 +0100 To: manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil From: Gikaru Subject: Any new materials Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Hei colleagues, Anybody with hot staff on "Topology discovery mechanisms in large scale Ad-hoc Networks"?, Just give me a hint for reference. It appears there is no much in this area ... Thanks in advance, Willy From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Fri Feb 1 17:10:29 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id RAA13063 for ; Fri, 1 Feb 2002 17:10:29 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id PAA10312 for manet-outgoing; Fri, 1 Feb 2002 15:00:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from ece.ufl.edu (dot.ece.ufl.edu [128.227.220.22]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id PAA10302 for ; Fri, 1 Feb 2002 15:00:11 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 12632 invoked from network); 1 Feb 2002 19:58:05 -0000 Received: from fang.ece.ufl.edu (128.227.80.157) by dot.ece.ufl.edu with SMTP; 1 Feb 2002 19:58:05 -0000 Received: (from fang@localhost) by fang.ece.ufl.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3) id OAA08321; Fri, 1 Feb 2002 14:57:59 -0500 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: fang.ece.ufl.edu: Processed from queue /home/faculty/fang/mqueue X-Authentication-Warning: fang.ece.ufl.edu: Processed by fang with -C /home/faculty/fang/bin/sendmail.cf Date: Fri, 1 Feb 2002 14:57:58 -0500 From: Yuguang Fang To: Yuguang Fang Cc: "Professor Mohammad S. Obaidat" Subject: SCS SPECTS'2002 paper submission deadline extended: 2/28/2002 Message-ID: <20020201145758.C8297@ece.ufl.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0pre4i Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by itd.nrl.navy.mil id PAA10305 Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit New Submission Deadline: February 28, 2002 %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% (We apologize for the inconvenience this message may cause if you receive multiple copies) Due to numerous requests, the conference organizing committee has decided to extend the paper submission deadline to February 28, 2002. Call For Papers 2002 International Symposium on Performance Evaluation of Computer and Telecommunication Systems SPECTS 2002 July 14-19, 2002 U. S. Grant Hotel San Diego, California, USA http://www.scs.org/confernc/spects02/ This annual international conference is a forum for professionals involved in performance evaluation of computer and telecommunication systems. Evaluation of computer systems and networks is needed at every stage in the life cycle of the product including design, manufacturing, sales/purchase, use, upgrade, tuning, etc. The discipline of performance evaluation has progressed rapidly in the past decade, and it has now begun to approach maturity. Significant progress has been made in analytic modeling, simulation, and measurement approaches for performance evaluation of computer and telecommunication systems. Topics of interest include, but are not limited to: Networking and Telecommunication Systems - Internet Technology - Quality of Service (QoS) - DiffServ/IntServ - TCP - Unicast and Multicast Routing - High-Speed Networking - ATM - Optical Networks - Switching Techniques - Teletraffic - Satellite Systems and Networks - Wireless Systems - UMTS/IMT-2000 - Mobile Networks/Computing - Multimedia Systems - Multimedia Communications - Adaptive Communications - Network Protocols - Network Management and Control - Network Capacity Planning - Network Architecture Evaluation - Service and QoS Pricing - Security and Authentication - World Wide Web (WWW) Technology - Electronic Commerce Computer Systems - Client/Server - Microprocessors/Microcomputers - Memory Systems - Interconnection Networks - Software Performance - Software Evaluation and Testing - Hardware and Software Monitors - High-Performance Computing - Workload and Traffic Characterization - Scientific Computing Algorithms - High Performance I/O - Reconfigurable Computing -Real-time Systems - Parallel and Distributed Computing - Distributed Systems and Agents - Massively Parallel Systems - Cluster Computing - Parallel Algorithms and Languages - Scheduling Schemes Tools, Methodologies and Applications - Parallel and Distributed Simulation - Verification and Validation - Performance Tools and Methodologies - Neural Networks and Fuzzy Logic Applications to High Performance Computing/Networking - Performance Optimization - Queueing Systems and Networks - Scalability Studies - Integrated Modeling and Measurement - On-Line Performance Adaptation and Tuning - Process Algebra-Based Models - Performance Bounds - Integrated Design and Performance - New Performance Models - Mathematical Aspects of Performance - New Performability Schemes and Models - Case Studies General Chair Mohammad S. Obaidat Dept. of Computer Science, Monmouth University W. Long Branch, NJ 07764, USA Tel +1-732-571-4482 Fax +1-732-263-5202 E-mail: obaidat@monmouth.edu Senior Program Chair Franco Davoli DIST-University of Genoa Via Opera Pia 13, I-16145 Genoa, Italy Tel +39-010-353-2732 Fax +39-010-353-2154 E-Mail: franco@dist.unige.it Program Co-Chairs Ibrahim Onyuksel Dept. of Computer Sciences, N. Illinois Univ., USA E-mail: onyuksel@cs.niu.edu Raffaele Bolla DIST-University of Genoa Via Opera Pia 13, I-16145 Genoa, Italy E-mail: lelus@dist.unige.it Vice Program Chair Erina Ferro CNUCE, Institute of National Research Council (C.N.R.) C.N.R. Pisa Research Area, Building B, Room 73 Via G. Moruzzi, 1 56124 Pisa, Italy E-mail: erina.ferro@cnuce.cnr.it Industrial Track Chair J. Fox, Motorola Inc., UK E-mail: fox.ijcs@btinternet.com Publicity Chair Yuguang (Michael) Fang, University of Florida, USA, E-mail: fang@ece.ufl.edu Web Master: Daniel Lee, University of Southern California, E-mail: dclee@rcf-fs.usc.edu Technical Program Committee Jagan P. Agrawal, University of Missouri - Kansas City, USA Ian Akyildiz, Georgia Tech., USA M. Atiquzzaman, University of Oklahoma, USA Harmen R. van As, Vienna University of Technology, Austria Louis G. Birta, University of Ottawa, Canada Noureddine Boudriga, University of Tunis, Tunisia Hasan Cam, Arizona State University, USA Andrew Campbell, Columbia University, USA Fabio M. Chiussi, Bell Laboratories, Lucent Technologies, USA Hassan B. Diab, American University of Beirut, Lebanon Gabor Fodor, Ericsson Radio Systems, Sweden John Fox, Motorola, UK Luigi Fratta, Politecnico di Milano, Italy Aura Ganz, University of Massachusetts, USA Erol Gelenbe, University of Central Florida, USA Mario Gerla, UCLA, USA Omar Hammami, ENSTA, France Jarmo Harju, Tampere University of Technology, Finland Herman Hughes, Michigan State University, USA Andrzej Jajszczyk, University of Mining and Metallurgy, Poland Ingemar Kaj, Uppsala University, Sweden Helen Karatza, Aristotle University of Thessalonica, Greece Demetrios Kazakos, University of Louisiana, USA Ulrich Killat, Tech Univ. of Hamburg, Germany Tag Gon Kim, KAIST, Korea Belka Kraimeche, Stevens Institute of Technology, USA Paul J. Kuehn, University of Stuttgart, Germany Kevin Kwiat, Air Force Research Laboratory, USA Veronica Lagrange M. Reis, Compaq Computers Corp., USA Axel Lehmann, Universität der Bundeswehr München, Germany Daniel C. Lee, USC, USA Mike T. Liu, Ohio State University, USA Imad Mahgoub, Florida Atlantic University, USA Sam Makki, Queensland University of Technology, Australia Krzysztof Malinowski, Warsaw Technical University, Poland Jose L. Marzo, Universitat de Girona, Spain Xiannong Meng, Bucknell University, USA Hussein Mouftah, Queen's University, Canada M. Ould-Khaoua, University of Glasgow, UK Sergio Palazzo, Università di Catania, Italy Georgios I. Papadimitriou, Aristotle University, Greece Achille Pattavina, Politecnico di Milano, Italy Krzysztof Pawlikowski, University of Canterbury, New Zealand Steven Pink, University of Arizona, USA George Polyzos, AUEB, Greece Ramon Puigjaner, Universitat de les Illes Balears, Spain Kaliappa Ravindran, CUNY, USA Gian Paolo Rossi, Università di Milano, Italy Izhak Rubin, UCLA, USA Donald Schilling, CUNY, USA Jens B. Schmitt, TU Darmstadt, Germany C. Tim Spracklen, Aberdeen University, UK Tatsuya Suda, UCI, USA Iwao Toda, Fujutsu Laboratories Ltd., Japan Phuoc Tran-Gia, University of Wuerzburg, Germany Kenneth S. Vastola, Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute, USA Manuel Villen-Altamirano, Telefonica, Spain Bernd E. Wolfinger, Hamburg University, Germany Michele Zorzi, Università di Ferrara, Italy International Liaisons B. Sadoun, Al-Balqa' Applied University, Jordan Bsadoun@go.com.jo M. Sawan, Montreal Poly, Canada Sawan@vlsi.polymtl.ca N. Tchamov, Tampere Univ. of Technology, Finland Nikolay@cs.tut.fi Publicity Committee: Hideki Tode, Osaka Univ., Japan, E-mail: Tode@ise.eng.osaka-u.ac.jp Nusseirat, Al-Isra University, Jordan, E-mail: anuseirat@firstnet.com.jo Paper Submission Submit your complete papers electronically to: http://scs.proceedingscentral.com/ All required instructions will be posted on this web site. Submissions should not exceed 25 double-spaced, 8.5x11 inch pages (including figures, tables, and references) in 10-12 point font. Include five to ten keywords, complete postal and e-mail addresses, and fax and phone numbers of corresponding author. If you have difficulty in electronic submission, contact the Web Master, Program Chairs or the Conference Coordinator, Mr. Steve Branch, The Society for Modeling and Simulation International, 4838 Ronson Court, Suite L, San Diego, CA 92111, USA, Tel 858-277-3888, Fax 858-277-3930, E-mail sbranch@scs.org sbranch@scs.org. Extended versions of accepted papers in SPECTS 2002 will be considered for possible publication in scholarly journals. Proposals for tutorials, special and panel sessions should be sent to the Conference Senior Program Chair. Proposals for industrial sessions should be submitted to the Industrial Track Chair. For more information regarding presentations or exhibitions at SPECTS 2002 contact: Mr. Steve Branch at the address shown above. Deadlines Submission of Papers: Extended to February 28, 2002. Notification of Acceptance - April 22, 2002 Final Camera-Ready Submission - May 22, 2002 Sponsored by The Society for Modeling and Simulation International. -- %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% Yuguang "Michael" Fang, Ph.D Assistant Professor Department of Electrical and Computer Engineering University of Florida 435 Engineering Building, P.O.Box 116130 Gainesville, FL 32611 Tel: (352) 846-3043, Fax: (352) 392-0044 Email: fang@ece.ufl.edu, http://www.fang.ece.ufl.edu %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Fri Feb 1 17:31:10 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id RAA13354 for ; Fri, 1 Feb 2002 17:31:10 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id PAA12039 for manet-outgoing; Fri, 1 Feb 2002 15:36:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from SEXTANT.itd.nrl.navy.mil (sextant.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.92.22]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id PAA12031; Fri, 1 Feb 2002 15:36:53 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <5.0.1.4.2.20020201153834.0310be38@pop.itd.nrl.navy.mil> X-Sender: macker@pop.itd.nrl.navy.mil X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.0.1 Date: Fri, 01 Feb 2002 15:45:46 -0500 To: ogier@erg.sri.com From: Joe Macker Subject: Re: Some follow-up OLSR/AODV results Cc: manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil In-Reply-To: <200202012010.MAA25819@pit.erg.sri.com> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk At 12:10 PM 2/1/2002 -0800, ogier@erg.sri.com wrote: >Joe, > >> > >> >in the sendPacket() function, which explained the bug. I changed the line to >> > >> > ch->size() = IP_HDR_LEN + p->datalen(); >> > >> >which seemed to fix the bug. Am I missing something? >> >> Richard: >> Good catch, I also believe this a bug. I checked prototype olsrv4 ns2 code we developed >> here and it does not have th is bug (it was independently developed from the INRIA code). > >> I will add your fix and doublecheck my previous snapshot scenarios with both pieces of code. > >I guess the Aalborg study posted a few days ago also needs to be redone. Yes, I just redid points for 100 nodes, 20 sources, 0 motion with your fix. Early results (with your fix) still show close to 100% delivery for 2, 4, 6 packets/sec loads. Perhaps that ported Linux code version your are using is breaking down at 100 nodes. The 2 other pieces of source code I am using seem not to have the same effect of 65% delivery bounding. We can take more of this discussion off-line, but some of it has been useful because the results were presented at the WG meeting. Just the scientific process in action. -joe >We are also running simulations for OLSR and TBRPF in ns-2.1b8. >Now that we have ns-2 code for OLSR from INRIA, I am perfectly >happy using this code and disregarding the results from our >port of the OLSR implementation code to ns-2. >Even though I believe those results are valid (and that we ported >the code correctly), INRIA stated that the implementation code was >not intended for simulations (after I presented our results in SLC). >It is understandable that the code may not have been optimized >(or even tested) for networks of 100 nodes. From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Fri Feb 1 18:09:51 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id RAA13062 for ; Fri, 1 Feb 2002 17:10:29 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id PAA10810 for manet-outgoing; Fri, 1 Feb 2002 15:11:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from pit.erg.sri.com (pit.erg.sri.com [128.18.100.28]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id PAA10801; Fri, 1 Feb 2002 15:11:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from pit.erg.sri.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pit.erg.sri.com (8.9.3+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id MAA25819; Fri, 1 Feb 2002 12:10:41 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <200202012010.MAA25819@pit.erg.sri.com> To: Joe Macker cc: ogier@erg.sri.com, manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Reply-To: ogier@erg.sri.com From: ogier@erg.sri.com Subject: Re: Some follow-up OLSR/AODV results In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 31 Jan 2002 19:21:16 EST." <5.0.1.4.2.20020131174924.02e6e100@pop.itd.nrl.navy.mil> Date: Fri, 01 Feb 2002 12:10:41 -0800 Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Joe, > > > >in the sendPacket() function, which explained the bug. I changed the line to > > > > ch->size() = IP_HDR_LEN + p->datalen(); > > > >which seemed to fix the bug. Am I missing something? > > Richard: > Good catch, I also believe this a bug. I checked prototype olsrv4 ns2 code we developed > here and it does not have th is bug (it was independently developed from the INRIA code). > I will add your fix and doublecheck my previous snapshot scenarios with both pieces of code. I guess the Aalborg study posted a few days ago also needs to be redone. We are also running simulations for OLSR and TBRPF in ns-2.1b8. Now that we have ns-2 code for OLSR from INRIA, I am perfectly happy using this code and disregarding the results from our port of the OLSR implementation code to ns-2. Even though I believe those results are valid (and that we ported the code correctly), INRIA stated that the implementation code was not intended for simulations (after I presented our results in SLC). It is understandable that the code may not have been optimized (or even tested) for networks of 100 nodes. ----------------------- Richard Ogier Sr. Research Engineer SRI International 333 Ravenswood Ave. Menlo Park, CA 94025 Tel: 650-859-4216 Fax: 650-859-4812 Email: ogier@erg.sri.com ------------------------ From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Sat Feb 2 15:07:21 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id PAA06831 for ; Sat, 2 Feb 2002 15:07:21 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id MAA24388 for manet-outgoing; Sat, 2 Feb 2002 12:48:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from web21001.mail.yahoo.com (web21001.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.227.55]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id MAA24383 for ; Sat, 2 Feb 2002 12:48:40 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <20020202174840.78045.qmail@web21001.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [12.72.226.133] by web21001.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Sat, 02 Feb 2002 09:48:40 PST Date: Sat, 2 Feb 2002 09:48:40 -0800 (PST) From: Yang Xiao Reply-To: YangXiao@ieee.org Subject: CFP: Modeling, Analysis, and Simulation of Wireless LANs and Mobile Ad Hoc Networks and QoS Issues To: manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Call for Papers Invited Session Title: Modeling, Analysis, and Simulation of Wireless LANs and Mobile Ad Hoc Networks and QoS Issues Invited Session in the 6th World Multi-Conference on Systemics, Cybernetics and Informatics, (SCI 2002) Orlando, Florida, USA, July 14 -18, 2002 Topics of Interest Wireless LANs & Mobile Ad Hoc Networks (not limited to) Simulation, Modeling and performance evaluation of Wireless LANs, such as IEEE 802.11, HIPERLAN, and Ad hoc Networks. Quality-of-service issues in Wireless LANs (IEEE 802.11e, HIPERLAN/2, etc.) and Ad Hoc Networks. Power Consumption issues Higher data rates 3G/4G-WLAN Differentiated Services for Wireless LANs Co-existence of the IEEE 802.11 and 802.15 Resource Management Analytical methods. Deadlines Submission of Extended Abstracts: February 05, 2002 Notification of Acceptance: March 05, 2002 Camera Ready Copies: April 03, 2002 Session Co-Organizers/co-chairs Dr. Yang Xiao, Micro Linear, USA Dr. Bin Wang, Wright State University, USA Instructions For Submission Submission should be in the form of extended abstracts up to 4 pages long. All submitted contributions will be subject to peer review on the basis of technical correctness, quality, relevance, originality, significance, and clarity. Abstracts should be in MS Word, PDF or PS format. Submissions should be sent to the session's co-organizers. Successful submissions will be asked to submit a full paper. Full papers must be formatted according to IEEE-CS guidelines Electronic Submission: Dr. Yang Xiao: xiao.yang@microlinear.com Dr. Bin Wang: bwang@cs.wright.edu For more details check at http://www.iiis.org/sci2002/ last updated 12/15/01 __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Great stuff seeking new owners in Yahoo! Auctions! http://auctions.yahoo.com From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Mon Feb 4 08:31:20 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id IAA21564 for ; Mon, 4 Feb 2002 08:31:20 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id GAA09190 for manet-outgoing; Mon, 4 Feb 2002 06:13:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailcity.com (fes3.whowhere.com [209.185.123.188]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id GAA09181 for ; Mon, 4 Feb 2002 06:13:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from Unknown/Local ([?.?.?.?]) by mailcity.com; Mon Feb 4 03:13:01 2002 To: manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Date: Mon, 04 Feb 2002 03:13:01 -0800 From: "Mukul Shukla" Message-ID: Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sent-Mail: off Reply-To: mukul.shukla@lycos.com X-Mailer: MailCity Service X-Priority: 3 Subject: Recent Papers on Routing Protocols X-Sender-Ip: 202.141.80.20 Organization: Lycos Mail (http://mail.lycos.com:80) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Language: en Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi, I want to know which are the latest papers which performs the Simulation Based Comparison of Ad Hoc routing Protocols or the Survey of the Ad Hoc Routing Protocols. Also, I want to know which are the latest protocols which have been considered by the MANETs for the standardization or for study. Kindly provide me this information. Thankyou. Mukul Shukla. mukul.s@mailcity.com From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Mon Feb 4 12:27:23 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id MAA00247 for ; Mon, 4 Feb 2002 12:27:22 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id KAA15527 for manet-outgoing; Mon, 4 Feb 2002 10:12:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailhost.cs.auc.dk ([130.225.194.6]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id KAA15519; Mon, 4 Feb 2002 10:12:13 -0500 (EST) From: T.Clausen@computer.org Received: from localhost (root@borg.cs.auc.dk [130.225.194.22]) by mailhost.cs.auc.dk (8.12.2/8.12.2) with ESMTP id g14F9ovU011190; Mon, 4 Feb 2002 16:09:51 +0100 (MET) Date: Mon, 4 Feb 2002 16:09:50 +0100 (CET) X-Sender: voop@armada To: manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil cc: Joe Macker , ogier@erg.sri.com Subject: Re: Some follow-up OLSR/AODV results Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8BIT X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.2 Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8BIT Richard, Thanks for looking at our simulation code for OLSR in detail. You are correct in pointing out the bug in the simulation code, and your proposed solution seems to solve the problem. Our belated reply is due to the fact that we wanted to investigate the impact of the bug before replying. We have been running a set of tests, similar to those presented earlier by Joe (http://protean.itd.nrl.navy.mil/manet/olsrstatic.pdf) of the simulation code "with the bug" and "without the bug". Exactly the same scenarios being used, our observations basically amount to the following: - the reported overhead (in bytes/sec) indeed is about 50% larger with the "bugfix" - the number of control packets is roughly the same (the differences being very small and due to the randomness introduced by the jitter) - more importantly: the delivery ratio is unaffected by the change. I.e. the same amount of packets are being delivered. So while we acknowledge that there indeed is a bug, the impacts seems to be only related to the rapported overhead, not to the functioning of the routing protocol. Thanks again for pointing out the bug in the code. --thomas > I think I found a bug in that code regarding packet size. (I don't know > whether the same bug is in Joe's code or in the code used for > simulations that others have done.) > When running simulations with that code, I noticed in the trace file > that every OLSR packet has length 20 bytes, including the 20-byte IP > header (i.e., ns-2 considers each OLSR message to have zero length not > including the IP header). > > So I looked in the file ns-olsragent.cc and noticed the line > > ch->size() = IP_HDR_LEN; > > in the sendPacket() function, which explained the bug. I changed the > line to > ch->size() = IP_HDR_LEN + p->datalen(); > > which seemed to fix the bug. Am I missing something? > > Richard -- ------------------------------------------- Thomas Heide Clausen Civilingeniør i Datateknik (cand.polyt) M.Sc in Computer Engineering E-Mail: T.Clausen@computer.org WWW: http://www.cs.auc.dk/~voop ------------------------------------------- From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Mon Feb 4 12:31:36 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id MAA00496 for ; Mon, 4 Feb 2002 12:31:35 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id KAA16177 for manet-outgoing; Mon, 4 Feb 2002 10:29:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from ece.rice.edu (ece.rice.edu [128.42.4.34]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id KAA16169 for ; Mon, 4 Feb 2002 10:29:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ece.rice.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3405168A5C; Mon, 4 Feb 2002 09:29:37 -0600 (CST) Received: from egress.ece.rice.edu (egress.ece.rice.edu [128.42.12.74]) by ece.rice.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5883768A5A; Mon, 4 Feb 2002 09:29:36 -0600 (CST) Received: from localhost (kanodia@localhost) by egress.ece.rice.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id JAA25666; Mon, 4 Feb 2002 09:29:36 -0600 X-Authentication-Warning: egress.ece.rice.edu: kanodia owned process doing -bs Date: Mon, 4 Feb 2002 09:29:36 -0600 (CST) From: Vikram Kanodia X-Sender: kanodia@egress.ece.rice.edu To: Ferenc Kubinszky Cc: manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Subject: Re: Multirate and 802.11 In-Reply-To: <3C57B0B0.6E490703@eth.ericsson.se> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII X-Virus-Scanned: by AMaViS snapshot-20010714 Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Well the necessity of RTS/CTS comes across because of the hidden terminal problem (in ad-hoc mode)....... -Vikram > Hello, > > > I had a couple of questions about multirate support of IEEE 802.11. I > > will be gratefuil if someone can provide pointers etc... > > > > (*) I know that the PHY preamble and headers are all sent at a basic rate > > (1Mbps?). Is the RTS/CTS exchange also done at the basic rate ? > > > > (*)....if not then how do other overhearing nodes latch onto the > > RTS/CTS.. ? > > Yes, they are. (or maybe at 2 Mbps, I can't remember exactly) > But as I know the some manufacturers sometimes break the standard, use > short preambles, and higher RTS/CTS bitrates to reduce the overhead, > which is really high in the basic case. > In that case older cards can't communicate, because they can't decode > the CCK "modulation". > Carrier detection still works in this case. > > With RTS/CTS mechanism the measured throughput between two nodes > communicating at 11Mbps is smaller by 20% than without RTS/CTS (1500byte > MTU). > Is there any simulation or measurement results that proove the necessity > of RTS/CTS ? > > Best regards, > Ferenc > -- Department of ECE, Rice University | 713 348 3786 (O)| 713 664 5650(H) WWW: http://www.ece.rice.edu/~kanodia From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Mon Feb 4 22:56:04 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id WAA13287 for ; Mon, 4 Feb 2002 22:56:03 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id UAA07180 for manet-outgoing; Mon, 4 Feb 2002 20:55:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailFA5.rediffmail.com ([202.54.124.150]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id UAA07172 for ; Mon, 4 Feb 2002 20:55:17 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 6292 invoked by uid 510); 5 Feb 2002 01:56:11 -0000 Date: 5 Feb 2002 01:56:11 -0000 Message-ID: <20020205015611.6291.qmail@mailFA5.rediffmail.com> Received: from unknown (128.205.25.75) by rediffmail.com via HTTP; 05 Feb 2002 01:56:11 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 From: "vikas p verma" Reply-To: "vikas p verma" To: manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Subject: OLSR in GloMoSim Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by itd.nrl.navy.mil id UAA07173 Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Hi All, Can anyone please clarify if OLSR has been simulated for Ad hoc n/w in GloMoSim as yet. Vikas From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Tue Feb 5 00:21:59 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id AAA14743 for ; Tue, 5 Feb 2002 00:21:59 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id WAA08431 for manet-outgoing; Mon, 4 Feb 2002 22:19:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from excore1.hns.com (excore.hns.com [139.85.52.104] (may be forged)) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id WAA08426 for ; Mon, 4 Feb 2002 22:19:10 -0500 (EST) From: pohanlon@hns.com Received: from atlas (atlas.hns.com [139.85.177.110]) by excore1.hns.com (Switch-2.2.0/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id g153J9Z12865 for ; Mon, 4 Feb 2002 22:19:09 -0500 (EST) Subject: Schemes for the Allocation of IP Addresses for Ad Noc Nodes To: manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Release 5.0.8 June 18, 2001 Message-ID: Date: Mon, 4 Feb 2002 19:24:41 -0800 X-MIMETrack: Serialize by Router on Atlas/HNS(Release 5.0.8 |June 18, 2001) at 02/04/2002 10:17:40 PM MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Hi there, Most of the routing schemes proposed for Ad Hoc networks seem to assume an IP address has already been allocated to each Ad Hoc node by some unspecified means. I am interested in potential schemes that enable the allocation / auto-configuration of IP addresses for Ad Hoc nodes (with a particular interest in distributed schemes). Currently I have found info on the following schemes : 1. IP Address Autoconfiguration for Ad Hoc Networks, proposed by Manet Working Group (draft-ietf-manet-autoconf-01.txt, Authors: Perkins, Belding-Royer et al) Area(s) of interest / requiring further development : - From Section 2. Applicability Statement : "The mechanisms described in this document do not guarantee uniqueness in disconnected networks. If a network is disconnected, the process for Duplicate Address Detection (DAD) would need to be performed again when the partition heals. This document does not specify any method for detecting when the partition heals, nor any procedure by which such detection would cause new attempts at DAD. Any such specification would have to ensure that network healing is not accompanied by a broadcast storm of DAD messages." 2. Standard DHCP Area(s) of interest / requiring further development : - requires development of DHCP Server / Relay election algorithm(s) - once DHCP server(s) / relay(s) have been elected, this model is really hierarchical as opposed to flat / fully distributed (could be advantageous / disadvantageous depending on the scale / topology of the network etc.) I am interested in comments or information from anyone regarding any of the following : - further information related to either of the above schemes - solutions to the "Area(s) of interest / requiring further development" for either of the above schemes - reasons why either of the above schemes may not be feasible / suitable for certain types or topologies of Ad Hoc Networks - details of (and sources of information for) other schemes that could be used for the allocation of IP addresses for Ad Hoc nodes (i.e. specifically for Ad Hoc networks, and preferably fully distributed) Thanks. - Piers. From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Tue Feb 5 05:55:07 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id FAA26865 for ; Tue, 5 Feb 2002 05:55:06 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id DAA12852 for manet-outgoing; Tue, 5 Feb 2002 03:26:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from iraun2.uka.de (iraun2.uka.de [129.13.10.91]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id DAA12844 for ; Tue, 5 Feb 2002 03:26:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from irams1.ira.uka.de ([129.13.10.5]) by iraun2.uka.de with esmtp (Exim 3.30 #7 (Debian)) id 16Y0w6-0003Dj-00; Tue, 05 Feb 2002 09:26:42 +0100 Received: from i72pc238.tm.uni-karlsruhe.de ([141.3.70.72] helo=i72pc238.tm.uka.de) by irams1.ira.uka.de with esmtp (Exim 3.30 #7 (Debian)) id 16Y0w5-00024L-00; Tue, 05 Feb 2002 09:26:41 +0100 Received: from localhost (weniger@localhost) by i72pc238.tm.uka.de (8.11.6/8.11.2) with ESMTP id g158Qfd03734; Tue, 5 Feb 2002 09:26:41 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: i72pc238.tm.uka.de: weniger owned process doing -bs Date: Tue, 5 Feb 2002 09:26:41 +0100 (CET) From: Kilian Weniger To: cc: Subject: Re: Schemes for the Allocation of IP Addresses for Ad Noc Nodes In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Hello Piers, This question already arose on the list about 2 weeks ago, but unfortunately there were only a few replies on that. In my opinion autoconfiguration in ad hoc networks is essential and should be more in discussion on the list. In our distributed approach, we modified the IPv6 Stateless Address Autoconfiguration protocol to work in potentially large ad hoc networks. Therefore, an hierarchical address space is build up. The protocol overhead during the Duplicate Address Detection is limited and is not directly dependend on the network size anymore (as it is in draft-ietf-manet-autoconf-01). Subsequently, we claim to achieve an improved scalability. Furthermore, unique addresses are also guaranteed in the case that two independently configured networks merge. The paper is called "IPv6 Stateless Address Autoconfiguration in large mobile ad hoc networks". You can download the paper from our IPonAir-project homepage: http://www.iponair.de/publications/Weniger-EuroWireless02.pdf Kilian Weniger On Mon, 4 Feb 2002 pohanlon@hns.com wrote: > Hi there, > > Most of the routing schemes proposed for Ad Hoc networks seem to assume an > IP address has already been allocated to each Ad Hoc node by some > unspecified means. I am interested in potential schemes that enable the > allocation / auto-configuration of IP addresses for Ad Hoc nodes (with a > particular interest in distributed schemes). > > Currently I have found info on the following schemes : > > 1. IP Address Autoconfiguration for Ad Hoc Networks, proposed by Manet > Working Group > (draft-ietf-manet-autoconf-01.txt, Authors: Perkins, Belding-Royer et > al) > > Area(s) of interest / requiring further development : > - From Section 2. Applicability Statement : "The mechanisms described in > this document do not guarantee uniqueness in disconnected networks. If a > network is disconnected, the process for Duplicate Address Detection (DAD) > would need to be performed again when the partition heals. This document > does not specify any method for detecting when the partition heals, nor any > procedure by which such detection would cause new attempts at DAD. Any > such specification would have to ensure that network healing is not > accompanied by a broadcast storm of DAD messages." > > > 2. Standard DHCP > > Area(s) of interest / requiring further development : > - requires development of DHCP Server / Relay election algorithm(s) > - once DHCP server(s) / relay(s) have been elected, this model is really > hierarchical as opposed to flat / fully distributed (could be advantageous > / disadvantageous depending on the scale / topology of the network etc.) > > > I am interested in comments or information from anyone regarding any of the > following : > > - further information related to either of the above schemes > - solutions to the "Area(s) of interest / requiring further development" > for either of the above schemes > - reasons why either of the above schemes may not be feasible / suitable > for certain types or topologies of Ad Hoc Networks > - details of (and sources of information for) other schemes that could be > used for the allocation of IP addresses for Ad Hoc nodes (i.e. specifically > for Ad Hoc networks, and preferably fully distributed) > > > Thanks. > > - Piers. > > > > > -- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Dipl.-Ing. Kilian Weniger phone: (+49)(0)721-608 6415 Institute of Telematics fax: (+49)(0)721-388097 Department of Computer Science email: weniger@tm.uni-karlsruhe.de University of Karlsruhe homepage: http://www.tm.uka.de/~weniger/ D-76128 Karlsruhe From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Tue Feb 5 08:58:58 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id IAA29903 for ; Tue, 5 Feb 2002 08:58:57 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id GAA15401 for manet-outgoing; Tue, 5 Feb 2002 06:45:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from i4mail.informatik.rwth-aachen.de (i4mail.Informatik.RWTH-Aachen.de [137.226.12.21]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id GAA15396 for ; Tue, 5 Feb 2002 06:45:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from yigit (yigit.informatik.rwth-aachen.de [137.226.12.208]) by i4mail.informatik.rwth-aachen.de (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7FEAB2840F; Tue, 5 Feb 2002 12:36:17 +0100 (CET) From: "Mesut Günes" To: , Subject: AW: Schemes for the Allocation of IP Addresses for Ad Noc Nodes Date: Tue, 5 Feb 2002 12:36:17 +0100 Organization: Lehrstuhl für Informatik 4, RWTH-Aachen Message-ID: <002101c1ae39$536d85a0$d00ce289@informatik.rwthaachen.de> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 In-reply-to: X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Importance: Normal Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by itd.nrl.navy.mil id GAA15397 Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Hi Piers, we have developped a distributed address allocation scheme, which is called 'Agent Based Addressing'. I will pesent an performance evaluation in AdHoc 2002, Paris. Our scheme also considers the splitting and joining of several ad-hoc networks. We are preparing a paper in which the scheme is described. Regards Mesut Günes ###-----Ursprüngliche Nachricht----- ###Von: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil ###[mailto:owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil] Im Auftrag von pohanlon@hns.com ###Gesendet: Dienstag, 5. Februar 2002 04:25 ###An: manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil ###Betreff: Schemes for the Allocation of IP Addresses for Ad Noc Nodes ### ### ###Hi there, ### ###Most of the routing schemes proposed for Ad Hoc networks ###seem to assume an IP address has already been allocated to ###each Ad Hoc node by some unspecified means. I am interested ###in potential schemes that enable the allocation / ###auto-configuration of IP addresses for Ad Hoc nodes (with a ###particular interest in distributed schemes). ### ###Currently I have found info on the following schemes : ### ###1. IP Address Autoconfiguration for Ad Hoc Networks, ###proposed by Manet Working Group ### (draft-ietf-manet-autoconf-01.txt, Authors: Perkins, ###Belding-Royer et ###al) ### ###Area(s) of interest / requiring further development : ###- From Section 2. Applicability Statement : "The mechanisms ###described in this document do not guarantee uniqueness in ###disconnected networks. If a network is disconnected, the ###process for Duplicate Address Detection (DAD) would need to ###be performed again when the partition heals. This document ###does not specify any method for detecting when the partition ###heals, nor any procedure by which such detection would cause ###new attempts at DAD. Any such specification would have to ###ensure that network healing is not accompanied by a ###broadcast storm of DAD messages." ### ### ###2. Standard DHCP ### ###Area(s) of interest / requiring further development : ###- requires development of DHCP Server / Relay election algorithm(s) ###- once DHCP server(s) / relay(s) have been elected, this ###model is really hierarchical as opposed to flat / fully ###distributed (could be advantageous / disadvantageous ###depending on the scale / topology of the network etc.) ### ### ###I am interested in comments or information from anyone ###regarding any of the following : ### ###- further information related to either of the above schemes ###- solutions to the "Area(s) of interest / requiring further ###development" for either of the above schemes ###- reasons why either of the above schemes may not be ###feasible / suitable for certain types or topologies of Ad ###Hoc Networks ###- details of (and sources of information for) other schemes ###that could be used for the allocation of IP addresses for Ad ###Hoc nodes (i.e. specifically for Ad Hoc networks, and ###preferably fully distributed) ### ### ###Thanks. ### ###- Piers. ### ### ### ### ### From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Tue Feb 5 09:22:57 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id JAA00676 for ; Tue, 5 Feb 2002 09:22:56 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id HAA16123 for manet-outgoing; Tue, 5 Feb 2002 07:20:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from gta.ufrj.br (recreio.gta.ufrj.br [146.164.69.2]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id HAA16118 for ; Tue, 5 Feb 2002 07:20:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost (bernardo@localhost) by gta.ufrj.br (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g15CJUL07859; Tue, 5 Feb 2002 10:19:31 -0200 Date: Tue, 5 Feb 2002 10:19:30 -0200 (BRST) From: Bernardo Antunes Maciel Villela To: cc: Subject: ns draft's version used for routing protocols Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Hi all, I am simulating the ad-hoc routing protocols (DSR, AODV, DSDV) with the ns-2.1b8a. I am using the extensions made by the MONARCH project. I'd like to know which is the version of these drafts (DSR, AODV and DSDV) implemented by MONARCH in NS? Does anyone have any version of these algorithms for ns (without bugs) more recent than that? Is exactly that implementation that everybody is using for simulations? Is there a page at Manet that points me to old versions of the drafts? And for OLSR, which is the good implementation in NS? Which version is that? Thanks a lot, Bernardo. From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Tue Feb 5 13:55:39 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id NAA13682 for ; Tue, 5 Feb 2002 13:55:39 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id LAA26257 for manet-outgoing; Tue, 5 Feb 2002 11:38:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from maild.telia.com (maild.telia.com [194.22.190.101]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id LAA26249 for ; Tue, 5 Feb 2002 11:38:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from d1o848.telia.com (d1o848.telia.com [213.66.32.241]) by maild.telia.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g15GcXW20783 for ; Tue, 5 Feb 2002 17:38:33 +0100 (CET) Received: from h179n2fls31o848.telia.com (h179n2fls31o848.telia.com [213.67.152.179]) by d1o848.telia.com (8.10.2/8.10.1) with ESMTP id g15GcXA20942 for ; Tue, 5 Feb 2002 17:38:33 +0100 (CET) Subject: AODV IP-address configuration and Internet gatewaying From: Erik =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Nordstr=F6m?= To: MANET LIST Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 X-Mailer: Evolution/1.0.2 Date: 05 Feb 2002 17:38:33 +0100 Message-Id: <1012927113.2228.72.camel@Replicator> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by itd.nrl.navy.mil id LAA26250 Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Hello. Could someone explain to me why AODV should allow any node with any IP-address to be a participant in the ad-hoc network (as suggested in section 7 of the AODV draft)? To me the idea of subnets is a good thing, and is the principle on wich IP-routing is based. Breaking subnetting would complicate interaction with the IP-layer and the mechanisms behind gatewaying (for connecting the ad-hoc network to the Internet). Why do AODV even use IP-addresses if creating subnets is not desirable? Subnets are sort of the whole idea behind IP, isn't it? Also, a draft issue: When using "blacklists" and expanding ring search, should BLACKLIST_TIMEOUT really be [(TTL_THRESHOLD - TTL_START)/TTL_INCREMENT] + 1 + RREQ_RETRIES = 6? This is clearly _much_ smaller than "standard" BLACKLIST_TIMEOUT which is RREQ_RETRIES * NET_TRAVERSAL_TIME = 4200. /Erik Nordström From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Tue Feb 5 15:12:07 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id PAA17343 for ; Tue, 5 Feb 2002 15:12:07 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id MAA29485 for manet-outgoing; Tue, 5 Feb 2002 12:56:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailhost2.malibunetworks.com ([63.150.98.26]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id MAA29480 for ; Tue, 5 Feb 2002 12:56:03 -0500 (EST) Received: by mailhost2.malibunet.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Tue, 5 Feb 2002 09:55:46 -0800 Message-ID: <337F6EC31C8FD3119A10009027D63D874AD638@mailhost2.malibunet.com> From: Ken Peirce To: manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Subject: RE: simulation tools survey Date: Tue, 5 Feb 2002 09:55:36 -0800 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Hi All, I will send out the results today or tomorrow. I am simply looking for a block of time to do it in. I have had hundreds of requests! Please don't send duplicate requests unless you don't get a copy by this Friday. Cheers, Ken From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Tue Feb 5 16:09:55 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id QAA19442 for ; Tue, 5 Feb 2002 16:09:54 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id OAA02786 for manet-outgoing; Tue, 5 Feb 2002 14:05:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from sfo.erg.sri.com (sfo.erg.sri.com [128.18.4.100] (may be forged)) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id OAA02768 for ; Tue, 5 Feb 2002 14:05:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from erg.sri.com (walleye.erg.sri.com [128.18.4.214]) by sfo.erg.sri.com (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id LAA13296; Tue, 5 Feb 2002 11:00:04 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <3C602CB1.9B4ECCD8@erg.sri.com> Date: Tue, 05 Feb 2002 11:04:17 -0800 From: "Fred L. Templin" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.76 [en] (WinNT; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: pohanlon@hns.com, manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil CC: templin@erg.sri.com Subject: Re: Schemes for the Allocation of IP Addresses for Ad Noc Nodes References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi, This is an interesting subject; we had discussion regarding MANET addressing some time back (see: "Challenges for the MANET addressing model" beginning 3/26/01 in the MANET archives) but did not get into much detail in terms of address allocation and duplicate address detection. The two primary means for IP address assignment in the existing IPv4 Internet are static configuration and stateful autoconfiguration (i.e., DHCP). IPv6 introduces new mechanisms for stateless address autoconfiguration, but with a number of issues for MANETs. Concensus from the addressing discussions last spring seemed to favor supporting peer-to-peer operation in MANETs regardless of the underlying mechanisms for address assignment and duplicate address detection. In particular, at the MANET level IP addresses are treated as node IDs regardless of any "subnet affiliation" implied. For example, two neighboring nodes in the MANET with disparate IPv4 address prefixes (e.g. 128.21.1.6/32 and 10.0.2.1/32) should be able to form a link and exchange messages directly w/o going through an intermediate gateway. (This is also a key enabling feature for integration with Mobile IP.) The main point is that nodes are free to move about; sometimes staying within their "home" MANETs and sometimes wandering into "foreign" MANETs. Therefore, the protocols need to support continued operation regardless of the underlying address allocation mechanisms, and the underlying address allocation mechanisms must provide a flexible framework to support mobility. Fred templin@erg.sri.com From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Tue Feb 5 19:00:16 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id TAA24911 for ; Tue, 5 Feb 2002 19:00:15 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id QAA09930 for manet-outgoing; Tue, 5 Feb 2002 16:55:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from sangam.sce.carleton.ca (sangam.sce.carleton.ca [134.117.4.4]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id QAA09925 for ; Tue, 5 Feb 2002 16:55:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from rmh01 (rmh-01.sce.carleton.ca [134.117.60.192]) by sangam.sce.carleton.ca (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id g15Lpbq02602 for ; Tue, 5 Feb 2002 16:51:37 -0500 (EST) From: "Hao Zhang" To: "MANET LIST" Subject: resource about the power optimization on ad hoc network Date: Tue, 5 Feb 2002 16:48:34 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <1012927113.2228.72.camel@Replicator> Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I am working on the study on optimizing the power/energy consumption of ad-hoc networking. Could someone tell me a link to find some papers or tech resource on it. Thanks in advance for your help. From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Tue Feb 5 20:55:20 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id UAA27520 for ; Tue, 5 Feb 2002 20:55:20 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id TAA13673 for manet-outgoing; Tue, 5 Feb 2002 19:01:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from boreas.isi.edu (boreas.isi.edu [128.9.160.161]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id TAA13667 for ; Tue, 5 Feb 2002 19:01:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from boreas.isi.edu (boreas.isi.edu [128.9.160.161]) by boreas.isi.edu (8.11.6/8.11.2) with SMTP id g1601jw03289; Tue, 5 Feb 2002 16:01:45 -0800 (PST) Date: Tue, 5 Feb 2002 16:01:45 -0800 (PST) From: Ya Xu To: Hao Zhang cc: MANET LIST Subject: Re: resource about the power optimization on ad hoc network In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Hao, You can check Mobicom'2001 where there is a section of 3 papers regarding energy consumption of ad hoc network. -Ya On Tue, 5 Feb 2002, Hao Zhang wrote: > I am working on the study on optimizing the power/energy consumption of > ad-hoc networking. Could someone tell me a link to find some papers or tech > resource on it. Thanks in advance for your help. > > From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Tue Feb 5 23:10:41 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id XAA02227 for ; Tue, 5 Feb 2002 23:10:40 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id VAA16033 for manet-outgoing; Tue, 5 Feb 2002 21:26:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from lennier.cc.vt.edu (lennier.cc.vt.edu [198.82.162.213]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id VAA16028 for ; Tue, 5 Feb 2002 21:26:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from zidane.cc.vt.edu (IDENT:mirapoint@zidane-lb.cc.vt.edu [10.1.1.13]) by lennier.cc.vt.edu (8.11.4/8.11.4) with ESMTP id g162Qeh138628 for ; Tue, 5 Feb 2002 21:26:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from TNT (h80ad3776.dhcp.vt.edu [128.173.55.118]) by zidane.cc.vt.edu (Mirapoint) with SMTP id AIO17104; Tue, 5 Feb 2002 21:26:39 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <002601c1aeb5$8a361bc0$7637ad80@workgroup> From: "Tao Lin" To: "MANET LIST" References: Subject: Question about simulation mobility with ns-2 Date: Tue, 5 Feb 2002 21:25:26 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I need some help on ns-2 mobility simulations. Sample files in ns-2 usually select a destination and move a node with a certain speed towards that postion. What should I do if I want to simulate wrappround movement? (In other words, if node moves to the edge of the map, how to reset its position to the other side?) Thanks! From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Tue Feb 5 23:14:51 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id XAA02281 for ; Tue, 5 Feb 2002 23:14:51 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id VAA15938 for manet-outgoing; Tue, 5 Feb 2002 21:20:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns0.utdallas.edu (ns0.utdallas.edu [129.110.10.1]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id VAA15933 for ; Tue, 5 Feb 2002 21:20:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from apache.utdallas.edu (apache.utdallas.edu [129.110.16.9]) by ns0.utdallas.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5777C1A0FB1; Tue, 5 Feb 2002 20:20:29 -0600 (CST) Received: by apache.utdallas.edu (Postfix, from userid 30546) id BE23522749; Tue, 5 Feb 2002 20:20:28 -0600 (CST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by apache.utdallas.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id B419622564; Tue, 5 Feb 2002 20:20:28 -0600 (CST) Date: Tue, 5 Feb 2002 20:20:28 -0600 (CST) From: Rajesh Bhairampally To: Hao Zhang Cc: MANET LIST Subject: Re: resource about the power optimization on ad hoc network In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Hi, I recently submitted a paper to mobihoc on the idea of energy complexity. Energy complexity - like time complexity of an algorithm - is a theory to analytically compute minimum energy consumption of ad hoc network protocol. I demonstrated how one can use this theory to optimize different protocol strategies to reduce energy consumption of a protocol. This paper is available on my webpage at http://www.utdallas.edu/~rajesh/resume/mobihoc02.pdf Currently i am working on an improved model of the same idea. I'll let you know once it is ready. sincerely, raesh On Tue, 5 Feb 2002, Hao Zhang wrote: > I am working on the study on optimizing the power/energy consumption of > ad-hoc networking. Could someone tell me a link to find some papers or tech > resource on it. Thanks in advance for your help. > > > Rajesh =============================================================================== Rajesh Bhairampally Graduate Research Assistant Scalable Network Engineering Techniques Lab (NET Lab) University of Texas at Dallas Richardson, TX 75080 Rajesh@utdallas.edu http://www.utdallas.edu/~rajesh =============================================================================== From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Tue Feb 5 23:53:02 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id XAA03277 for ; Tue, 5 Feb 2002 23:53:02 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id WAA17119 for manet-outgoing; Tue, 5 Feb 2002 22:12:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from web20107.mail.yahoo.com (web20107.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.226.44]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id WAA17114 for ; Tue, 5 Feb 2002 22:12:14 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <20020206031214.58212.qmail@web20107.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [128.97.89.248] by web20107.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Tue, 05 Feb 2002 19:12:14 PST Date: Tue, 5 Feb 2002 19:12:14 -0800 (PST) From: MANET AD HOC Subject: DCF / PCF To: manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk I suppose all 802.11-based wireless LAN products on the market today support DCF, but I'm not aware of any released product that supports PCF. Any comment? __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Send FREE Valentine eCards with Yahoo! Greetings! http://greetings.yahoo.com From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Wed Feb 6 01:45:03 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id BAA04684 for ; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 01:45:02 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id XAA19062 for manet-outgoing; Tue, 5 Feb 2002 23:50:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns0.utdallas.edu (ns0.utdallas.edu [129.110.10.1]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id XAA19057 for ; Tue, 5 Feb 2002 23:50:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from apache.utdallas.edu (apache.utdallas.edu [129.110.16.9]) by ns0.utdallas.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 416101A14B2; Tue, 5 Feb 2002 22:50:12 -0600 (CST) Received: by apache.utdallas.edu (Postfix, from userid 30546) id 70D6622749; Tue, 5 Feb 2002 22:50:11 -0600 (CST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by apache.utdallas.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 547F822564; Tue, 5 Feb 2002 22:50:11 -0600 (CST) Date: Tue, 5 Feb 2002 22:50:11 -0600 (CST) From: Rajesh Bhairampally To: Brahim BENSAOU Cc: MANET LIST Subject: Re: resource about the power optimization on ad hoc network In-Reply-To: <3C60A416.2417AE52@cs.ust.hk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk I am terribly sorry! i forgot about it! I'll put the link down immediately. My sincere apologies. rajesh On Wed, 6 Feb 2002, Brahim BENSAOU wrote: > Humm ... > > I thought MobiHOC'02 was using double blind reviewing > thus paper submissions were supposed to be "confidential" > or as confidential as possible?!! > > - B. > > > Rajesh Bhairampally wrote: > > > > Hi, > > > > I recently submitted a paper to mobihoc on the idea of energy > > complexity. Energy complexity - like time complexity of an algorithm - is > > a theory to analytically compute minimum energy consumption of ad hoc > > network protocol. I demonstrated how one can use this theory to optimize > > different protocol strategies to reduce energy consumption of a protocol. > > > > This paper is available on my webpage at > > http://www.utdallas.edu/~rajesh/resume/mobihoc02.pdf > > Currently i am working on an improved model of the same idea. I'll let you > > know once it is ready. > > > > sincerely, > > raesh > > > > On Tue, 5 Feb 2002, Hao Zhang wrote: > > > > > I am working on the study on optimizing the power/energy consumption of > > > ad-hoc networking. Could someone tell me a link to find some papers or tech > > > resource on it. Thanks in advance for your help. > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rajesh > > > > =============================================================================== > > > > Rajesh Bhairampally > > Graduate Research Assistant > > Scalable Network Engineering Techniques Lab (NET Lab) > > University of Texas at Dallas > > Richardson, TX 75080 > > > > Rajesh@utdallas.edu > > http://www.utdallas.edu/~rajesh > > =============================================================================== > > -- > Brahim Bensaou | Computer Science Department. > Assistant Professor | Hong Kong University of Science & > Technology > brahim@cs.ust.hk | Clear Water Bay, Kowloon, Hong Kong. > http://www.cs.ust.hk/~csbb | Ph: +852 23587014, Fax: +852 23581477 > Rajesh =============================================================================== Rajesh Bhairampally Graduate Research Assistant Scalable Network Engineering Techniques Lab (NET Lab) University of Texas at Dallas Richardson, TX 75080 Rajesh@utdallas.edu http://www.utdallas.edu/~rajesh =============================================================================== From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Wed Feb 6 03:10:41 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id DAA14084 for ; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 03:10:40 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id BAA20595 for manet-outgoing; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 01:12:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from cheetah.cs.ucla.edu (Cheetah.CS.UCLA.EDU [131.179.128.24]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id BAA20590 for ; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 01:11:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost (hxy@localhost) by cheetah.cs.ucla.edu (8.10.2+Sun/8.10.2/UCLACS-5.1) with ESMTP id g166Bol01316; Tue, 5 Feb 2002 22:11:50 -0800 (PST) Date: Tue, 5 Feb 2002 22:11:50 -0800 (PST) From: Xiaoyan Hong To: vikas p verma cc: Xiaoyan Hong , Subject: Re: OLSR in GloMoSim In-Reply-To: <20020205015611.6291.qmail@mailFA5.rediffmail.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Hi, Vikas, OLSR has been simulated in GloMoSim by UCLA. An ICC 2002 paper: "Scalable Ad Hoc Routing in Large, Dense Wireless Networks Using Clustering and Landmarks" contains some simulation results. Best, Xiaoyan On 5 Feb 2002, vikas p verma wrote: > > Hi All, > > > Can anyone please clarify if OLSR has been simulated for Ad hoc n/w in GloMoSim as yet. > > Vikas > From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Wed Feb 6 06:05:21 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id GAA16682 for ; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 06:05:21 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id EAA23129 for manet-outgoing; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 04:03:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.cit.ie ([157.190.14.15]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id EAA23124 for ; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 04:03:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from cit.ie ([157.190.41.59]) by mail.cit.ie (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 1006-70837U1100L100S0V35) with ESMTP id ie for ; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 08:49:48 +0000 Message-ID: <3C60F48F.DE90FD99@cit.ie> Date: Wed, 06 Feb 2002 09:17:04 +0000 From: srea@cit.ie (Susan Rea) X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.79 [en] (WinNT; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: MANET LIST Subject: possible research areas Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Recently I have begun studying the area of Ad hoc networks and I am interested in concentrating on routing protocols / topology discovery - what are the main areas of current research or existing problems ? Any comments? Susan From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Wed Feb 6 07:30:57 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id HAA18275 for ; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 07:30:57 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id FAA24341 for manet-outgoing; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 05:21:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailcity.com (fes3.whowhere.com [209.185.123.188]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id FAA24336 for ; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 05:21:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from Unknown/Local ([?.?.?.?]) by mailcity.com; Wed Feb 6 02:21:16 2002 To: manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Date: Wed, 06 Feb 2002 02:21:16 -0800 From: "Mukul Shukla" Message-ID: Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sent-Mail: off Reply-To: mukul.shukla@lycos.com X-Mailer: MailCity Service X-Priority: 3 Subject: Protocols -Mukul X-Sender-Ip: 202.141.80.20 Organization: Lycos Mail (http://mail.lycos.com:80) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Language: en Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi all, I am new to this mailing list. I want to simulate MANET Routing Protocols using GloMoSim. I want to know if somebody has simulated the TORA and OLSR in glomosim. Please somebody also tell me which are the recent papers which studies the simulation based comparisom of rcent MANET routing. Please help me. Thankyou all. mukul shukla mukul.s@mailcity.com From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Wed Feb 6 07:31:45 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id HAA18300 for ; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 07:31:45 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id FAA24083 for manet-outgoing; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 05:04:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailhost.cs.auc.dk (mailhost.cs.auc.dk [130.225.194.6]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id FAA24078 for ; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 05:04:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from athlon32.e.cs.auc.dk (root@athlon32.e.cs.auc.dk [130.225.195.42]) by mailhost.cs.auc.dk (8.12.2/8.12.2) with ESMTP id g16A41vT013444; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 11:04:01 +0100 (MET) Received: from cs.auc.dk (gitte@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by athlon32.e.cs.auc.dk (8.11.4/8.11.4) with ESMTP id g16A3w200953; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 11:03:59 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <3C60FF8E.B7E67A98@cs.auc.dk> Date: Wed, 06 Feb 2002 11:03:58 +0100 From: Gitte Hansen X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.78 [en] (X11; U; SunOS 5.8 i86pc) X-Accept-Language: en, da MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Xiaoyan Hong CC: vikas p verma , manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Subject: Re: OLSR in GloMoSim References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.2 Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi Xiaoyan Is this paper available from anywhere else than the proceedings, as I would like to read it? Regards, Gitte Hansen Xiaoyan Hong wrote: > > Hi, Vikas, > > OLSR has been simulated in GloMoSim by UCLA. An ICC 2002 paper: > "Scalable Ad Hoc Routing in Large, Dense Wireless > Networks Using Clustering and Landmarks" contains some simulation > results. > > Best, > > Xiaoyan > > On 5 Feb 2002, vikas p verma wrote: > > > > > Hi All, > > > > > > Can anyone please clarify if OLSR has been simulated for Ad hoc n/w in > GloMoSim as yet. > > > > Vikas > > From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Wed Feb 6 07:57:32 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id HAA18519 for ; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 07:57:32 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id GAA24995 for manet-outgoing; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 06:00:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailhost.cs.auc.dk (mailhost.cs.auc.dk [130.225.194.6]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id GAA24990 for ; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 06:00:16 -0500 (EST) From: T.Clausen@computer.org Received: from localhost (root@borg.cs.auc.dk [130.225.194.22]) by mailhost.cs.auc.dk (8.12.2/8.12.2) with ESMTP id g16B05vU019405; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 12:00:05 +0100 (MET) Date: Wed, 6 Feb 2002 12:00:04 +0100 (CET) X-Sender: voop@armada To: Bernardo Antunes Maciel Villela cc: manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil, bernardo_villela@yahoo.com.br Subject: Re: ns draft's version used for routing protocols In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8BIT X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.2 Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8BIT Hi Bernardo, On Tue, 5 Feb 2002, Bernardo Antunes Maciel Villela wrote: > Hi all, > Is there a page at Manet that points me to old versions of the drafts? In general, older ietf-drafts seems to be archived in several places. One of them is here: http://www.watersprings.org/pub/id/ > And for OLSR, which is the good implementation in NS? Which version is > that? Currently, we have version 3 of the OLSR draft implemented and tested in ns-2.1b7. It may be downloaded from the OLSR www-page: http://hipercom.inria.fr/olsr -- ------------------------------------------- Thomas Heide Clausen Civilingeniør i Datateknik (cand.polyt) M.Sc in Computer Engineering E-Mail: T.Clausen@computer.org WWW: http://www.cs.auc.dk/~voop ------------------------------------------- From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Wed Feb 6 10:39:50 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id KAA23679 for ; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 10:39:49 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id IAA28152 for manet-outgoing; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 08:14:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from memphis.ece.cornell.edu (memphis.ece.cornell.edu [128.84.81.8]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id IAA28138 for ; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 08:14:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from Sior_Panagakhs.cornell.edu (dhcp28-224.ece.cornell.edu [128.84.224.139]) by memphis.ece.cornell.edu (8.11.6/8.11.2) with ESMTP id g16D57X27013; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 08:05:07 -0500 Message-Id: <5.1.0.14.2.20020206074723.02c14cd8@postoffice.mail.cornell.edu> X-Sender: papadp@memphis.ece.cornell.edu X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1 Date: Wed, 06 Feb 2002 08:15:16 -0500 To: manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil From: Panos Papadimitratos Subject: NIST Manet Opnet models & 802.11 Cc: papadp@ece.cornell.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Dear All, I have the following problem with the 802.11 Opnet model -- as used for the above-mentioned DSR and AODV models: A change of the parameter values (wireless LAN attributes) makes all transmissions to fail. For example, by setting the rate to 2Mbps (default: 1Mbps) not a single packet is delivered! Other changes cause the same or similar problems as well. Unfortunately, a selection of settings according to the IEEE standard does not do the trick either. Is this one of the "minor" bugs that were discussed earlier (Dec/01) in the list? (:-) Or, am I doing something wrong? Could you please point out possible fixes, patches, or any workable selection of values? Thank you very much, Panos From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Wed Feb 6 11:42:40 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id LAA25435 for ; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 11:42:39 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id JAA00612 for manet-outgoing; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 09:24:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from ares.cs.Virginia.EDU (ares.cs.Virginia.EDU [128.143.137.19] (may be forged)) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id JAA00604 for ; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 09:24:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from atlas.cs.Virginia.EDU (atlas.cs.Virginia.EDU [128.143.136.29]) by ares.cs.Virginia.EDU (8.9.2/8.9.2/UVACS-2000040300) with ESMTP id JAA15787; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 09:24:28 -0500 (EST) Received: (from nobody@localhost) by atlas.cs.Virginia.EDU (8.9.3+Sun/8.9.2) id JAA11331; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 09:24:28 -0500 (EST) To: Hao Zhang Subject: Re: resource about the power optimization on ad hoc network Message-ID: <1013005468.3c613c9c21993@www.cs.virginia.edu> Date: Wed, 06 Feb 2002 09:24:28 -0500 (EST) From: Hridesh Rajan Cc: manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil References: In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit User-Agent: IMP/PHP IMAP webmail program 2.2.3 X-Originating-IP: 128.143.69.224 Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Hi Some publications on power/energy consumption: Rodoplu, V.; Meng, T.H., “Minimum energy mobile wireless networks” IEEE Journal on Selected Areas in Communications, Volume: 17 Issue: 8, Aug. 1999 Page(s): 1333 –1344 Javier Gomez, Andrew T. Campbell, Mahmoud Naghshineh, Chatschik Bisdikian, “Conserving Transmission Power in Wireless Ad Hoc Networks”, Proc. 9th International Conference on Network Protocols (ICNP 2001), Riverside, California, November 11 - 14, 2001. Javier Gomez, and Andrew T. Campbell, Mahmoud Naghshineh and C. Bisdikian "Power-Aware Routing in Wireless Packet Radio" , Proc. 6th IEEE International Workshop on Mobile Multimedia Communications (MOMUC99) , San Diego, 15-17 November 1999. J. Gomez, A.T. Campbell, M. Naghshineh, C. Bisdikian "PARO: A Power-Aware Routing Optimization Scheme for Mobile Ad hoc Networks", Internet Draft draft- gomez-paro-manet-00.txt IETF MANET Working Group, 50th IETF - Minneapolis, MN, March 2001. Ya Xu, John Heidemann, and Deborah Estrin. Geography-informed Energy Conservation for Ad Hoc Routing. In Proceedings of the ACM/IEEE International Conference on Mobile Computing and Networking, pp. 70-84. Rome, Italy, ACM. July 2001. I hope you will find them usefull. Hridesh Quoting Hao Zhang : > I am working on the study on optimizing the power/energy consumption of > ad-hoc networking. Could someone tell me a link to find some papers or > tech > resource on it. Thanks in advance for your help. > > > From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Wed Feb 6 11:42:42 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id LAA25447 for ; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 11:42:42 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id JAA00117 for manet-outgoing; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 09:10:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.rz.uni-ulm.de (gemini.rz.uni-ulm.de [134.60.246.16]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id JAA00108 for ; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 09:10:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from informatik.uni-ulm.de (seychelles.informatik.uni-ulm.de [134.60.70.20]) by mail.rz.uni-ulm.de (8.12.1/8.12.1) with ESMTP id g16EAQto018830 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5 bits=128 verify=NOT) for ; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 15:10:27 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <3C613945.6A8FC47F@informatik.uni-ulm.de> Date: Wed, 06 Feb 2002 15:10:13 +0100 From: Frank Kargl Organization: University of Ulm, Germany X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.77 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en,de MIME-Version: 1.0 To: manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Subject: Call for Participation: German Workshop on Mobile Ad-Hoc Networks Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit English version below. Please excuse if you receive multiple copies of this mail. --------------------- 1. Deutscher Workshop über Mobile Ad-Hoc Netzwerke (WMAN 2002) Universität Ulm, 25.-26. März 2002 Call for Participation Ziel des Workshops ------------------ Der Workshop über Mobile Ad-Hoc Netzwerke wird von der Gesellschaft für Informatik (GI)/Informationstechnische Gesellschaft im VDE (ITG) Fachgruppe 3.3.1 (Kommunikation und Verteilte Systeme), der GI Fachgruppe 4.9.2 Multimedia und der Universität Ulm veranstaltet. Ziel des Workshops ist es, auf diesem Gebiet tätige Forscher aus dem deutschsprachigen Raum zum Ideen- und Meinungsaustausch zusammenzubringen. Es soll eine Möglichkeit geschaffen werden, eigene Projekte vorzustellen und in Diskussionen Ideen für neue Forschungsvorhaben in diesem Gebiet zu entwickeln. Der Workshop umfaßt das gesamte Spektrum des Forschungsgebietes Mobile Ad-Hoc Netwerke. Themen sind unter anderem: * Basistechnologien (802.11, Bluetooth, etc.) * Routing Mechanismem * Skalierbarkeit und Simulationen * Automatische Addresszuweisung und Anbindung an das Internet * Sicherheit und Datenschutz in Ad-Hoc Netzwerken * Software Plattformen (Middleware) für Mobile Ad-Hoc Anwendungen * MANET-Anwendungen und Dienste-Bereitstellung Der Workshop ist in verschiedene thematische Schwerpunkte gegliedert, neben Vorträgen werden auch moderierte Diskussionsrunden und Workshops angeboten. Darüber hinaus werden genügend Freiräume für individuelle Gespräche eingeplant. Das genaue Programm finden Sie auf den Webseiten zum Workshop. Die Beiträge werden im Rahmen der Serie GI - Lecture Notes in Informatics zu veröffentlichen. Eine Anmeldung ist über die Webseiten des Workshops möglich. Projekt-Vorstellungen --------------------- Sie arbeiten an einem interessanten Projekt rund um Ad-Hoc Netzwerke? In diesem Fall besteht die Möglichkeit, Ihr Projekt am Anfang des Workshops kurz (max. 10 Minuten) vorzustellen. Eine Projekt-Präsentation ist dabei unabhängig von einer Einreichung eines "reviewed papers". Doch auch in diesem Fall mag es sinnvoll sein, das eigene Projekt in einem größeren Rahmen am Anfang des Workshops vorzustellen. Diese Projekt- Vorstellungen sind keinem Review unterworfen und erscheinen nicht im Tagungsband. Anmeldungen einer Projekt-Vorstellung bitte per E-Mail an wman@medien.informatik.uni-ulm.de. Bitte eine kurze Zusammenfassung zum Projekt beifügen. Die Zahl der Präsentations-Slots ist begrenzt. Es gilt First-Come-First-Serve. Programm Komitee ---------------- Chair: Michael Weber, Universität Ulm Reinhold Eberhardt, DaimlerChrysler AG Claudia Linnhoff-Popien, Ludwig-Maximilians-Universität München Frank Kargl, Universität Ulm Silvano Maffeis, Softwired AG Friedemann Mattern, ETH Zürich Kurt Rothermel, Universität Stuttgart Ralf Steinmetz, Technische Universität Darmstadt Martina Zitterbart, Universität Karlsruhe Wichtige Termine ---------------- * Start der Anmeldung: 31. Jan. 2002 * Ende der Frühbucher-Phase: 28. Feb. 2002 * Workshop: 25./26. März 2002 Ort --- Der Workshop wird an der Universität Ulm durchgeführt. Details zu Anfahrt, Übernachtung, Rahmenprogramm entnehmen Sie bitte den Webseiten zum Workshop. Webseiten --------- http://medien.informatik.uni-ulm.de/conferences/WMAN2002/ --------------------- 1. German Workshop on Mobile Ad-Hoc Networks (WMAN 2002) University of Ulm, Germany, 25.-26. March 2002 Call for Participation Aim of the workshop ------------------- The Workshop on Mobile Ad-Hoc Networks is organized by the German Informatics Society (GI)/ Information Technology Society (ITG) specialized group 3.3.1 ( Kommunikation und Verteilte Systeme), the GI specialized group 4.9.2 (Multimedia) and the University of Ulm. It is the aim of this workshop to bring together researchers of the german-speaking area working in the field of Mobile Ad-Hoc Networking to exchange ideas and visions. It offers them an oportunity to present their projects and discuss ideas for new research activities. Most of the presentations and discussions will be in german, but there will also be some events in english. The workshop is to cover the entire spectrum of the research area "Mobile Ad-Hoc Networks". Topics include: * Fundamental Technologies (802.11, Bluetooth, etc.) * Routing Mechanisms * Scalability and Simulations * Address Autoconfiguration * Security and Privacy in Ad-Hoc Networks * Software Platforms (Middleware) for Mobile Ad-Hoc Scenarios * MANET applications and service-provision The workshop will be divided into different subject; apart from lectures there will also be moderated discussions and workshops. Furthermore sufficient space for individual discussions will be provided. For details see the web pages of the workshop. The proceedings of the workshop will be published in the series "GI - Lecture Notes in Informatics". Use the webpages of the workshop to register for participation. Projekt-Presentations --------------------- You are working in an interesting project related to ad-hoc networks? In this case you have the possibility to briefly (max. 10 min) present your project at the beginning of the workshop. Note that you can also participate in the project-presentation if you haven't submitted a reviewed paper. But even authors of accepted papers may want to use the opportunity to present an larger overview over their whole project. The project presentations are not reviewed and will not appear in the proceedings. You can register for a project presentation via e-mail to wman@medien.informatik.uni-ulm.de. Please attach a short summary of the project you want to present. The number of presentation slots is limited and distributed on a first-come-first-serve base. Program Committee ----------------- Chair: Michael Weber, Universität Ulm Reinhold Eberhardt, DaimlerChrysler AG Claudia Linnhoff-Popien, Ludwig-Maximilians-Universität München Frank Kargl, Universität Ulm Silvano Maffeis, Softwired AG Friedemann Mattern, ETH Zürich Kurt Rothermel, Universität Stuttgart Ralf Steinmetz, Technische Universität Darmstadt Martina Zitterbart, Universität Karlsruhe Important Dates --------------- Begin of Registration: 31. Jan. 2002 Early-Registration Deadline: 28. Feb. 2002 Workshop: 25./26. March 2002 Location -------- The Workshop will be held at the University of Ulm, Germany. Details on transport, lodging, program, etc. are available on the web page. Webpages -------- http://medien.informatik.uni-ulm.de/conferences/WMAN2002/index.en.xml -- ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Frank Kargl Multimedia Computing, University of Ulm, Germany Mail:frank.kargl@informatik.uni-ulm.de http://www.uni-ulm.de/~fkargl/ ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Use the SOURCE, Luke ! I feel a great disturbance in the SOURCE. But beware of the Microsoft side of the SOURCE ! From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Wed Feb 6 12:47:46 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id MAA26825 for ; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 12:47:46 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id JAA02084 for manet-outgoing; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 09:57:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from snipe.prod.itd.earthlink.net (snipe.mail.pas.earthlink.net [207.217.120.62]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id JAA02078 for ; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 09:57:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from user-2injggs.dsl.mindspring.com ([165.121.194.28] helo=earthlink.net) by snipe.prod.itd.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 16YTVR-0004xX-00; Wed, 06 Feb 2002 06:57:05 -0800 Message-ID: <3C614469.8070202@earthlink.net> Date: Wed, 06 Feb 2002 09:57:45 -0500 From: Jason Ballah User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:0.9.4) Gecko/20011128 Netscape6/6.2.1 X-Accept-Language: en-us MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Panos Papadimitratos CC: manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Subject: Re: NIST Manet Opnet models & 802.11 References: <5.1.0.14.2.20020206074723.02c14cd8@postoffice.mail.cornell.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Panos, The primary problem there is that the packet streams from the wlan_mac process module to the transmitter and receiver modules are criss-crossed and not defined correctly for any data rate other than 1 Mbps. You will need to re-define the packet streams to the transmitter and from the receiver in the dsr node module to match the defined stream enumerations in the wlan_mac process module. (i.e., stream 0 is 1Mbps, stream 1 is 2Mbps etc). You can use the generic wireless lan workstation node provided by OPNET as a reference point. Let me know if you run into problems and I can provide more assistance. - Jason Ballah Panos Papadimitratos wrote: > Dear All, > > I have the following problem with the 802.11 Opnet model -- as used > for the above-mentioned DSR and AODV models: > > A change of the parameter values (wireless LAN attributes) makes all > transmissions to fail. > For example, by setting the rate to 2Mbps (default: 1Mbps) not a > single packet is delivered! > Other changes cause the same or similar problems as well. > Unfortunately, a selection of settings according to the IEEE standard > does not do the trick either. > > Is this one of the "minor" bugs that were discussed earlier (Dec/01) > in the list? (:-) > Or, am I doing something wrong? > > Could you please point out possible fixes, patches, or any workable > selection of values? > > Thank you very much, > > Panos > > > > From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Wed Feb 6 13:03:29 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id NAA27146 for ; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 13:03:28 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id JAA01160 for manet-outgoing; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 09:36:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from lennier.cc.vt.edu (lennier.cc.vt.edu [198.82.162.213]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id JAA01155 for ; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 09:36:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from zidane.cc.vt.edu (IDENT:mirapoint@zidane-lb.cc.vt.edu [10.1.1.13]) by lennier.cc.vt.edu (8.11.4/8.11.4) with ESMTP id g16Ea3h260169; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 09:36:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from TNT (h80ad3776.dhcp.vt.edu [128.173.55.118]) by zidane.cc.vt.edu (Mirapoint) with SMTP id AIO69836; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 09:36:02 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <001d01c1af1b$6e74a300$7637ad80@workgroup> From: "Tao Lin" To: Cc: References: Subject: Re: ns draft's version used for routing protocols Date: Wed, 6 Feb 2002 09:34:49 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Hi Thomas, I have difficulty when complie ns-2 with your OLSR patch. Error messages are list below. Could you check it? Thanks! Tao *********************************************** I use "./install" to compile and install ns. Problems occur when compiling olsr. Error messages are:" c++ -c -O2 -DTCP_DELAY_BIND_ALL -DNO_TK -DTCLCL_CLASSINSTVAR -DNDEBUG -DUSE _SHM -DHAVE_LIBTCLCL -DHAVE_TCLCL_H -DHAVE_LIBOTCL1_0A6 -DHAVE_OTCL_H -DHAVE _LIBTK8_3 -DHAVE_TK_H -DHAVE_LIBTCL8_3 -DHAVE_TCL_H -DHAVE_CONFIG_H -I. -I/ home/io/tlin/ns/ns-allinone-2.1b7a/tclcl-1.0b10 -I/home/io/tlin/ns/ns-allino ne-2.1b7a/otcl-1.0a6 -I/home/io/tlin/ns/ns-allinone-2.1b7a/include -I/home/i o/tlin/ns/ns-allinone-2.1b7a/include -o cmu-trace.o cmu-trace.cc cmu-trace.cc:52:34: olsr/packet.hh: No such file or directory make: *** [cmu-trace.o] Error 1 Ns make failed! See http://www-mash.CS.Berkeley.EDU/ns/ns-problems.html for problems " ----- Original Message ----- From: To: "Bernardo Antunes Maciel Villela" Cc: ; Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2002 6:00 AM Subject: Re: ns draft's version used for routing protocols > Hi Bernardo, > > On Tue, 5 Feb 2002, Bernardo Antunes Maciel Villela wrote: > > > Hi all, > > > > > Is there a page at Manet that points me to old versions of the drafts? > > In general, older ietf-drafts seems to be archived in several places. One > of them is here: http://www.watersprings.org/pub/id/ > > > And for OLSR, which is the good implementation in NS? Which version is > > that? > > Currently, we have version 3 of the OLSR draft implemented and tested in > ns-2.1b7. It may be downloaded from the OLSR www-page: http://hipercom.inria.fr/olsr > > -- > > ------------------------------------------- > Thomas Heide Clausen > Civilingeniør i Datateknik (cand.polyt) > M.Sc in Computer Engineering > > E-Mail: T.Clausen@computer.org > WWW: http://www.cs.auc.dk/~voop > ------------------------------------------- > From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Wed Feb 6 13:19:37 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id NAA27504 for ; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 13:19:37 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id LAA05385 for manet-outgoing; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 11:13:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from ponyexpress.ee.columbia.edu (ponyexpress.ee.columbia.edu [128.59.64.61]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id LAA05380 for ; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 11:13:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from SWEETPEA (sweetpea.comet.columbia.edu [128.59.65.202]) by ponyexpress.ee.columbia.edu (8.11.3/8.11.3) with SMTP id g16GD3M01934; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 11:13:03 -0500 From: "Andrew T. Campbell" To: "'Hridesh Rajan'" , "'Hao Zhang'" Cc: Subject: RE: resource about the power optimization on ad hoc network Date: Wed, 6 Feb 2002 10:31:59 -0500 Message-ID: <002b01c1af28$c1451fd0$ca413b80@SWEETPEA> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook CWS, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) In-Reply-To: <1013005468.3c613c9c21993@www.cs.virginia.edu> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Importance: Normal Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit For those interested in the Columbia papers Hao points to; they can be found at: http://comet.columbia.edu/armstrong/ --- Andrew http://comet.columbia.edu/~campbell > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil > [mailto:owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil]On Behalf Of Hridesh Rajan > Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2002 9:24 AM > To: Hao Zhang > Cc: manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil > Subject: Re: resource about the power optimization on ad hoc network > > > > Hi > > Some publications on power/energy consumption: > > Rodoplu, V.; Meng, T.H., “Minimum energy mobile wireless > networks” IEEE Journal > on Selected Areas in Communications, Volume: 17 Issue: 8, > Aug. 1999 Page(s): > 1333 –1344 > > Javier Gomez, Andrew T. Campbell, Mahmoud Naghshineh, Chatschik > Bisdikian, “Conserving Transmission Power in Wireless Ad Hoc > Networks”, Proc. > 9th International Conference on Network Protocols (ICNP > 2001), Riverside, > California, November 11 - 14, 2001. > > Javier Gomez, and Andrew T. Campbell, Mahmoud Naghshineh and C. > Bisdikian "Power-Aware Routing in Wireless Packet Radio" , > Proc. 6th IEEE > International Workshop on Mobile Multimedia Communications > (MOMUC99) , San > Diego, 15-17 November 1999. > > J. Gomez, A.T. Campbell, M. Naghshineh, C. Bisdikian "PARO: A > Power-Aware > Routing Optimization Scheme for Mobile Ad hoc Networks", > Internet Draft draft- > gomez-paro-manet-00.txt IETF MANET Working Group, 50th IETF - > Minneapolis, MN, > March 2001. > > Ya Xu, John Heidemann, and Deborah Estrin. Geography-informed Energy > Conservation for Ad Hoc Routing. In Proceedings of the > ACM/IEEE International > Conference on Mobile Computing and Networking, pp. 70-84. > Rome, Italy, ACM. > July 2001. > > I hope you will find them usefull. > > Hridesh > > Quoting Hao Zhang : > > > I am working on the study on optimizing the power/energy > consumption of > > ad-hoc networking. Could someone tell me a link to find > some papers or > > tech > > resource on it. Thanks in advance for your help. > > > > > > > From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Wed Feb 6 15:01:25 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id PAA00022 for ; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 15:01:25 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id MAA09567 for manet-outgoing; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 12:40:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailhost.cs.auc.dk (mailhost.cs.auc.dk [130.225.194.6]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id MAA09562 for ; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 12:40:51 -0500 (EST) From: T.Clausen@computer.org Received: from localhost (root@borg.cs.auc.dk [130.225.194.22]) by mailhost.cs.auc.dk (8.12.2/8.12.2) with ESMTP id g16HelvU003147; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 18:40:49 +0100 (MET) Date: Wed, 6 Feb 2002 18:40:47 +0100 (CET) X-Sender: voop@armada To: Tao Lin cc: manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Subject: Re: ns draft's version used for routing protocols In-Reply-To: <001d01c1af1b$6e74a300$7637ad80@workgroup> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8BIT X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.2 Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8BIT Tao, How do you go about applying the patch? I think that it's there you will find the source for the problem(s). --thomas (maybe we should keep this off-list? - it's hardly a manet-issue) On Wed, 6 Feb 2002, Tao Lin wrote: > Hi Thomas, > > I have difficulty when complie ns-2 with your OLSR patch. Error messages > are list below. Could you check it? Thanks! > > Tao > > *********************************************** > I use "./install" to compile and install ns. Problems occur when compiling > olsr. > Error messages are:" > c++ -c -O2 -DTCP_DELAY_BIND_ALL -DNO_TK -DTCLCL_CLASSINSTVAR -DNDEBUG -DUSE > _SHM -DHAVE_LIBTCLCL -DHAVE_TCLCL_H -DHAVE_LIBOTCL1_0A6 -DHAVE_OTCL_H -DHAVE > _LIBTK8_3 -DHAVE_TK_H -DHAVE_LIBTCL8_3 -DHAVE_TCL_H -DHAVE_CONFIG_H -I. -I/ > home/io/tlin/ns/ns-allinone-2.1b7a/tclcl-1.0b10 -I/home/io/tlin/ns/ns-allino > ne-2.1b7a/otcl-1.0a6 -I/home/io/tlin/ns/ns-allinone-2.1b7a/include -I/home/i > o/tlin/ns/ns-allinone-2.1b7a/include -o cmu-trace.o cmu-trace.cc > cmu-trace.cc:52:34: olsr/packet.hh: No such file or directory > make: *** [cmu-trace.o] Error 1 > Ns make failed! > See http://www-mash.CS.Berkeley.EDU/ns/ns-problems.html for problems > " > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > To: "Bernardo Antunes Maciel Villela" > Cc: ; > Sent: Wednesday, February 06, 2002 6:00 AM > Subject: Re: ns draft's version used for routing protocols > > > > Hi Bernardo, > > > > On Tue, 5 Feb 2002, Bernardo Antunes Maciel Villela wrote: > > > > > Hi all, > > > > > > > > > Is there a page at Manet that points me to old versions of the drafts? > > > > In general, older ietf-drafts seems to be archived in several places. One > > of them is here: http://www.watersprings.org/pub/id/ > > > > > And for OLSR, which is the good implementation in NS? Which version is > > > that? > > > > Currently, we have version 3 of the OLSR draft implemented and tested in > > ns-2.1b7. It may be downloaded from the OLSR www-page: > http://hipercom.inria.fr/olsr > > > > -- > > > > ------------------------------------------- > > Thomas Heide Clausen > > Civilingeniør i Datateknik (cand.polyt) > > M.Sc in Computer Engineering > > > > E-Mail: T.Clausen@computer.org > > WWW: http://www.cs.auc.dk/~voop > > ------------------------------------------- > > > -- ------------------------------------------- Thomas Heide Clausen Civilingeniør i Datateknik (cand.polyt) M.Sc in Computer Engineering E-Mail: T.Clausen@computer.org WWW: http://www.cs.auc.dk/~voop ------------------------------------------- From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Wed Feb 6 17:58:16 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id RAA04674 for ; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 17:58:15 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id QAA17951 for manet-outgoing; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 16:05:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from routh.csl.uiuc.edu (routh.csl.uiuc.edu [130.126.138.54]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id QAA17945 for ; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 16:04:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost (kawadia@localhost) by routh.csl.uiuc.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id PAA16647; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 15:04:59 -0600 X-Authentication-Warning: routh.csl.uiuc.edu: kawadia owned process doing -bs Date: Wed, 6 Feb 2002 15:04:59 -0600 (CST) From: Vikas Kawadia X-Sender: kawadia@routh.csl.uiuc.edu Reply-To: kawadia@uiuc.edu To: manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil cc: Hridesh Rajan , Hao Zhang Subject: Re: resource about the power optimization on ad hoc network In-Reply-To: <1013005468.3c613c9c21993@www.cs.virginia.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=X-UNKNOWN Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from QUOTED-PRINTABLE to 8bit by itd.nrl.navy.mil id QAA17947 Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit We have developed the COMPOW protocol for power control in ad hoc networks. It has also been implemented and tested in a Linux testbed. ``Power Control in Ad-Hoc Networks: Theory, Architecture, Algorithm and Implementation of the COMPOW protocol.'' * Swetha Narayanaswamy, Vikas Kawadia, R. S. Sreenivas and P. R. Kumar, To appear in European Wireless 2002. Next Generation Wireless Networks: Technologies, Protocols, Services and Applications, February 25-28, 2002. Florence, Italy. The paper can be found here. http://black1.csl.uiuc.edu/~prkumar/postscript_files.html#Wireless%20Networks There is also a farily comprehensive list of references. ..vikas On Wed, 6 Feb 2002, Hridesh Rajan wrote: > > Hi > > Some publications on power/energy consumption: > > Rodoplu, V.; Meng, T.H., “Minimum energy mobile wireless networks” IEEE Journal > on Selected Areas in Communications, Volume: 17 Issue: 8, Aug. 1999 Page(s): > 1333 –1344 > > Javier Gomez, Andrew T. Campbell, Mahmoud Naghshineh, Chatschik > Bisdikian, “Conserving Transmission Power in Wireless Ad Hoc Networks”, Proc. > 9th International Conference on Network Protocols (ICNP 2001), Riverside, > California, November 11 - 14, 2001. > > Javier Gomez, and Andrew T. Campbell, Mahmoud Naghshineh and C. > Bisdikian "Power-Aware Routing in Wireless Packet Radio" , Proc. 6th IEEE > International Workshop on Mobile Multimedia Communications (MOMUC99) , San > Diego, 15-17 November 1999. > > J. Gomez, A.T. Campbell, M. Naghshineh, C. Bisdikian "PARO: A Power-Aware > Routing Optimization Scheme for Mobile Ad hoc Networks", Internet Draft draft- > gomez-paro-manet-00.txt IETF MANET Working Group, 50th IETF - Minneapolis, MN, > March 2001. > > Ya Xu, John Heidemann, and Deborah Estrin. Geography-informed Energy > Conservation for Ad Hoc Routing. In Proceedings of the ACM/IEEE International > Conference on Mobile Computing and Networking, pp. 70-84. Rome, Italy, ACM. > July 2001. > > I hope you will find them usefull. > > Hridesh > > Quoting Hao Zhang : > > > I am working on the study on optimizing the power/energy consumption of > > ad-hoc networking. Could someone tell me a link to find some papers or > > tech > > resource on it. Thanks in advance for your help. > > > > > > > -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Vikas Kawadia ------------- http://www.uiuc.edu/~kawadia -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Wed Feb 6 18:35:15 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id SAA05059 for ; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 18:35:14 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id QAA18609 for manet-outgoing; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 16:23:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from crystal.bbn.com (crystal.bbn.com [128.89.80.29]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id QAA18604 for ; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 16:23:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from crystal.bbn.com (localhost.bbn.com [127.0.0.1]) by crystal.bbn.com (8.9.3/8.8.8) with ESMTP id QAA43627; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 16:29:15 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from ramanath@crystal.bbn.com) Message-Id: <200202062129.QAA43627@crystal.bbn.com> To: ogier@erg.sri.com cc: MEDDOUR Djamal Eddine thesard FTRD/DAC/LAN , Fred Baker , manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Subject: Re: performance comparaison between Ad Hoc routing protocols In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 06 Feb 2002 12:41:29 PST." <200202062041.MAA27993@pit.erg.sri.com> Date: Wed, 06 Feb 2002 16:29:15 -0500 From: Ram Ramanathan Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk > > - Although control traffic is not a quality-of-service measure, a protocol > that generates less control traffic: > > - uses less energy, > - is more likely to scale to a larger number of nodes, ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Why so? The "pure flooding" protocol (in which every data packet is flooded throughout the network) consumes zero overhead. Does that mean it scales to infinite number of nodes? :) The flippancy of the above example notwithstanding, one should really look at the TOTAL OVERHEAD (sum of control message overhead + sub-optimal route overhead (extra bandwidth wasted due to longer paths). There are many instances in my experience where a mechanism that takes more overhead ends up doing better in terms of user metrics. For a more formal treatment of TOTAL OVERHEAD, see Making Link State Routing Scale for Ad Hoc Networks, in Mobihoc 2001 by C. Santivanez et al On the Scalability of Routing for Ad Hoc Networks, to appear in Infocom 2002, by C. Santivanez et al > - is more likely to perform well in lower bandwidth radios such > as those used by the military. > > > ----------------------- > Richard Ogier > Sr. Research Engineer > SRI International > 333 Ravenswood Ave. > Menlo Park, CA 94025 > Tel: 650-859-4216 > Fax: 650-859-4812 > Email: ogier@erg.sri.com > ------------------------ > From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Wed Feb 6 18:55:34 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id RAA04673 for ; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 17:58:15 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id PAA17227 for manet-outgoing; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 15:42:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from pit.erg.sri.com (pit.erg.sri.com [128.18.100.28]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id PAA17212 for ; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 15:42:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from pit.erg.sri.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pit.erg.sri.com (8.9.3+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id MAA27993; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 12:41:29 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <200202062041.MAA27993@pit.erg.sri.com> To: MEDDOUR Djamal Eddine thesard FTRD/DAC/LAN cc: "'ogier@erg.sri.com'" , Fred Baker , manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Reply-To: ogier@erg.sri.com From: ogier@erg.sri.com Subject: Re: performance comparaison between Ad Hoc routing protocols In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 23 Jan 2002 15:24:15 +0100." <0489A7888F080B4BA73B53F7E145F29A022C9D@LANMHS20.rd.francetelecom.fr> Date: Wed, 06 Feb 2002 12:41:29 -0800 Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk > hi all body > is there any new studies wich made a comparaison between all routing > protocols (espicially AODV and OLSR) . > thank you > best regards I ran some ns-2 simulations comparing TBRPF to OLSR and AODV, using the corrected ns-2 code for OLSR. The simulation results can be found at the TBRPF web site: http://www.erg.sri.com/projects/tbrpf/ The results are summarized below. Comments are welcome. Protocols compared: - TBRPF code for ns-2.1b8 Available from http://www.erg.sri.com/projects/tbrpf/sourcecode.html Uses the same 'C' code as our Linux implementation - OLSR code for ns-2.1b7 Available from http://hipercom.inria.fr/olsr/ Bug affecting packet size was fixed. - AODV code for ns-2.1b8 Available from http://www.cs.ucsb.edu/~eroyer/aodv.html - Link-layer notification was not used for any of the protocols (it is available with the TBRPF and AODV code but not with the OLSR code). Simulation model: - ns-2 version 2.1b8 - WaveLAN IEEE 802.11 MAC with rate 2Mb/s and range 250m - 50 and 100 nodes - Two area sizes: 670m x 670m and 1500m x 300m - Mobility model: No mobility, and random waypoint model with 0 pause time and maximum speed 20 m/s. - 20 simultaneous CBR traffic streams: - Source and destination of each stream are selected randomly - Duration of each stream is 30 seconds - Size of each data packet is 512 bytes - Packet generation rate per stream is increased from 2 to 8 packets/s - Each simulation was run for 500 simulated seconds. Rationale for the simulation parameters: - We chose a wide range of characteristics to ensure that we did not use only scenarios that favor TBRPF or proactive protocols (no mobility and high mobility, square area and long rectangular area, 50 and 100 nodes). - We chose a stream duration of 30s to provide a moderate amount of traffic dynamics without giving too much advantage to proactive protocols. (Note that the Aalborg Univ. study used 10s for comparison of OLSR and AODV, which gives proactive protocols more advantage than 30s) Summary of results: - In every scenario, TBRPF achieved the highest delivery percentage of all three protocols: up to 15% more than OLSR and 23% more than AODV. - In every scenario, TBRPF generated significantly less routing control traffic than the other protocols: up to 60% less than OLSR and 36% less than AODV. This is true despite the fact that TBRPF sends HELLOs twice as frequently as OLSR. - TBRPF and OLSR achieved similar delay curves. When the network was congested, AODV tended to achieve smaller delays than the other protocols with mobility, and larger delays with no mobility. Remarks: - This study did not use link-layer notification. It is important to also compare the protocols with link-layer notification, since this allows one to achieve a delivery fraction close to 100%. (A comparison of TBRPF with AODV using link-layer notification can be also be found at the TBRPF web site.) - Although control traffic is not a quality-of-service measure, a protocol that generates less control traffic: - uses less energy, - is more likely to scale to a larger number of nodes, - is more likely to perform well in lower bandwidth radios such as those used by the military. ----------------------- Richard Ogier Sr. Research Engineer SRI International 333 Ravenswood Ave. Menlo Park, CA 94025 Tel: 650-859-4216 Fax: 650-859-4812 Email: ogier@erg.sri.com ------------------------ From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Wed Feb 6 20:13:49 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id UAA06033 for ; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 20:13:49 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id SAA22214 for manet-outgoing; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 18:11:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from [132.250.92.206] (jeffs-g4.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.92.206]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id SAA22206; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 18:11:36 -0500 (EST) Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Sender: wieselth@pop.itd.nrl.navy.mil Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: Date: Wed, 6 Feb 2002 18:11:38 -0500 To: "Hao Zhang" From: Jeff Wieselthier Subject: Re: resource about the power optimization on ad hoc network Cc: manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="============_-1199085396==_ma============" Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk --============_-1199085396==_ma============ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" >I am working on the study on optimizing the power/energy consumption of >ad-hoc networking. Could someone tell me a link to find some papers or tech >resource on it. Thanks in advance for your help. Here is the message I posted to the manet list on 11/28/01. I hope this is helpful. -- Jeff In response to the recent request for references on power-aware routing on the manet list, here is a listing of our publications in this area. We have recently published numerous papers on energy-aware broadcasting and multicasting. Most of our work addresses energy-efficient operation, in which the goal is to produce energy-efficient trees. We address the impact of finite transceiver and bandwidth resources. Papers [4], [13], [14] and [16] address the important case of energy-limited operation, in which a node dies when its energy is depleted. We show how network lifetime can be extended dramatically by appropriate changes to the cost function used in constructing the trees. These papers are not yet available on our website, although we hope to post them in the near future. In the meantime, we would be happy to email our papers to anyone who is interested. Best regards, Jeff Papers on Energy-Aware Broadcasting and Multicasting Naval Research Laboratory Journal Articles [1] J. E. Wieselthier, G. D. Nguyen, and A. Ephremides, "Algorithms for Energy-Efficient Multicasting in Static Ad Hoc Wireless Networks," Journal on Special Topics in Mobile Networking and Applications (MONET), 6-3, pp. 251-263, June 2001. [2] J. E. Wieselthier, G. D. Nguyen, and A. Ephremides, "Energy-Efficient Broadcast and Multicast Trees in Wireless Networks," to appear in the Journal on Special Topics in Mobile Networking and Applications (MONET). [3] J. E. Wieselthier, G. D. Nguyen, and A. Ephremides, "Energy-Efficient Multicasting of Session Traffic in Bandwidth- and Transceiver-Limited Wireless Networks," to appear in Journal of Cluster Computing. [4] J. E. Wieselthier, G. D. Nguyen, and A. Ephremides, "Resource Management in Energy-Limited, Bandwidth-Limited, Transceiver Limited Wireless Networks for Session-Based Multicasting," to appear in Computer Networks. Conference Papers [5] J. E. Wieselthier, G. D. Nguyen, and A. Ephremides, "Multicasting in Energy-Limited Ad-Hoc Wireless Networks," Proceedings of IEEE MILCOM'98, Bedford, MA, pp. 723-729, October 1998. [6] J. E. Wieselthier, G. D. Nguyen, and A. Ephremides, "Energy-Efficient Wireless Networking Techniques: Fundamental Issues and an Application to Multicasting in Ad Hoc Networks," Proceedings of the NATO RTO Information Systems Technology (IST) Symposium on Tactical Mobile Communications (RTO-MP-26), Lillehammer, Norway, pp. 5-1-5-13, June 1999. [7] J. E. Wieselthier, G. D. Nguyen, and A. Ephremides, "Algorithms for Energy-Efficient Multicasting in Ad Hoc Wireless Networks," Proceedings of MILCOM'99, Atlantic City, NJ, October/November 1999. [8] J. E. Wieselthier, G. D. Nguyen, and A. Ephremides, "On the Construction of Energy-Efficient Broadcast and Multicast Trees in Wireless Networks," Proceedings of IEEE INFOCOM 2000, Tel Aviv, Israel, pp. 585-594, March 2000. [9] G. D. Nguyen, J. E. Wieselthier, and A. Ephremides, "The Effect of Bandwidth Limitations on Wireless Broadcasting and Multicasting," 2000 Conference on Information Sciences and Systems, Princeton University, pp. TA7a-7-TA7a-12, March 2000. [10] J. E. Wieselthier, G. D. Nguyen, and A. Ephremides, "Algorithms for Bandwidth-Limited Energy-Efficient Wireless Broadcasting and Multicasting," Proceedings of IEEE MILCOM 2000, Los Angeles, CA, October 2000. [11] J. E. Wieselthier, G. D. Nguyen, and A. Ephremides, "Energy Efficiency, Energy Constraints, and Admission Control in Wireless Networks: A Case Study in Session Multicasting," Proceedings of the 38th Annual Allerton Conference on Communication, Control, and Computing, pp. 103-112, October 2000. [12] J. E. Wieselthier, G. D. Nguyen, and A. Ephremides, "Resource-Limited Energy-Efficient Wireless Multicast of Session Traffic," Proceedings of Hawaii International Conference on System Sciences (HICSS-34), Maui, Hawaii, January 2001. [13] J. E. Wieselthier, G. D. Nguyen, and A. Ephremides, "Energy Efficiency in Energy-Limited Wireless Networks for Session-Based Multicasting," Proceedings of the 2001 Spring Vehicular Technology Conference, May 2001. [14] G. D. Nguyen, J. E. Wieselthier, and A. Ephremides, "The Effects of Multicast Group Size and Antenna Directivity on Energy-Constrained Multicasting," Proceedings of the 2001 Conference on Information Sciences and Systems, Johns Hopkins University, Baltimore, MD, March 2001. [15] J. E. Wieselthier, G. D. Nguyen, and A. Ephremides, "The Impact of Directional Antennas on Energy-Aware, Session-Based Multicasting in Ad Hoc Wireless Networks," Proceedings of IEEE MILCOM 2001, 2001. [16] J. E. Wieselthier, G. D. Nguyen, and A. Ephremides, "Energy-Limited Wireless Networking with Directional Antennas: The Case of Session-Based Multicasting," to appear in Proceedings of IEEE INFOCOM 2002, New York, NY, to take place June 2002. --============_-1199085396==_ma============ Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Re: resource about the power optimization on ad hoc ne
I am working on the study on optimizing the power/energy consumption of
ad-hoc networking. Could someone tell me a link to find some papers or tech
resource on it.  Thanks in advance for your help.

Here is the message I posted to the manet list on 11/28/01.
I hope this is helpful.

   -- Jeff






In response to the recent request for references on power-aware routing on the manet list, here is a listing of our publications in this area.

We have recently published numerous papers on energy-aware broadcasting and multicasting.

Most of our work addresses energy-efficient operation, in which the goal is to produce energy-efficient trees.

We address the impact of finite transceiver and bandwidth resources.

Papers [4], [13], [14] and [16] address the important case of energy-limited operation, in which a node dies when its energy is depleted.  We show how network lifetime can be extended dramatically by appropriate changes to the cost function used in constructing the trees.

These papers are not yet available on our website, although we hope to post them in the near future.

In the meantime, we would be happy to email our papers to anyone who is interested.

     Best regards,
     Jeff 


  Papers on Energy-Aware Broadcasting and Multicasting
  Naval Research Laboratory

Journal Articles

[1]  J. E. Wieselthier, G. D. Nguyen, and A. Ephremides, "Algorithms for Energy-Efficient Multicasting in Static Ad Hoc Wireless Networks," Journal on Special Topics in Mobile Networking and Applications (MONET), 6-3, pp. 251-263, June 2001.

[2]  J. E. Wieselthier, G. D. Nguyen, and A. Ephremides, "Energy-Efficient Broadcast and Multicast Trees in Wireless Networks," to appear in the Journal on Special Topics in Mobile Networking and Applications (MONET).

[3]  J. E. Wieselthier, G. D. Nguyen, and A. Ephremides, "Energy-Efficient Multicasting of Session Traffic in Bandwidth- and Transceiver-Limited Wireless Networks," to appear in Journal of Cluster Computing.

[4]  J. E. Wieselthier, G. D. Nguyen, and A. Ephremides, "Resource Management in Energy-Limited, Bandwidth-Limited, Transceiver Limited Wireless Networks for Session-Based Multicasting," to appear in Computer Networks.


Conference Papers

[5]  J. E. Wieselthier, G. D. Nguyen, and A. Ephremides, "Multicasting in Energy-Limited Ad-Hoc Wireless Networks," Proceedings of IEEE MILCOM'98, Bedford, MA, pp. 723-729, October 1998.

[6]  J. E. Wieselthier, G. D. Nguyen, and A. Ephremides, "Energy-Efficient Wireless Networking Techniques: Fundamental Issues and an Application to Multicasting in Ad Hoc Networks," Proceedings of the NATO RTO Information Systems Technology (IST) Symposium on Tactical Mobile Communications (RTO-MP-26), Lillehammer, Norway, pp. 5-1-5-13, June 1999.

[7]  J. E. Wieselthier, G. D. Nguyen, and A. Ephremides, "Algorithms for Energy-Efficient Multicasting in Ad Hoc Wireless Networks," Proceedings of MILCOM'99, Atlantic City, NJ, October/November 1999.

[8]  J. E. Wieselthier, G. D. Nguyen, and A. Ephremides, "On the Construction of Energy-Efficient Broadcast and Multicast Trees in Wireless Networks," Proceedings of IEEE INFOCOM 2000, Tel Aviv, Israel, pp. 585-594, March 2000.

[9]  G. D. Nguyen, J. E. Wieselthier, and A. Ephremides, "The Effect of Bandwidth Limitations on Wireless Broadcasting and Multicasting," 2000 Conference on Information Sciences and Systems, Princeton University, pp. TA7a-7-TA7a-12, March 2000.

[10]  J. E. Wieselthier, G. D. Nguyen, and A. Ephremides, "Algorithms for Bandwidth-Limited Energy-Efficient Wireless Broadcasting and Multicasting," Proceedings of IEEE MILCOM 2000, Los Angeles, CA, October 2000.

[11]  J. E. Wieselthier, G. D. Nguyen, and A. Ephremides, "Energy Efficiency, Energy Constraints, and Admission Control in Wireless Networks: A Case Study in Session Multicasting," Proceedings of the 38th Annual Allerton Conference on Communication, Control, and Computing, pp. 103-112, October 2000.

[12]  J. E. Wieselthier, G. D. Nguyen, and A. Ephremides, "Resource-Limited Energy-Efficient Wireless Multicast of Session Traffic," Proceedings of Hawaii International Conference on System Sciences (HICSS-34), Maui, Hawaii, January 2001.

[13]  J. E. Wieselthier, G. D. Nguyen, and A. Ephremides, "Energy Efficiency in Energy-Limited Wireless Networks for Session-Based Multicasting," Proceedings of the 2001 Spring Vehicular Technology Conference, May 2001.

[14]  G. D. Nguyen, J. E. Wieselthier, and A. Ephremides, "The Effects of Multicast Group Size and Antenna Directivity on Energy-Constrained Multicasting," Proceedings of the 2001 Conference on Information Sciences and Systems, Johns Hopkins University, Baltimore, MD, March 2001.

[15]  J. E. Wieselthier, G. D. Nguyen, and A. Ephremides, "The Impact of Directional Antennas on Energy-Aware, Session-Based Multicasting in Ad Hoc Wireless Networks," Proceedings of IEEE MILCOM 2001, 2001.

[16]  J. E. Wieselthier, G. D. Nguyen, and A. Ephremides, "Energy-Limited Wireless Networking with Directional Antennas: The Case of Session-Based Multicasting," to appear in Proceedings of IEEE INFOCOM 2002, New York, NY, to take place June 2002.
--============_-1199085396==_ma============-- From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Wed Feb 6 23:45:00 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id XAA11692 for ; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 23:44:59 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id VAA26147 for manet-outgoing; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 21:30:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from os.korea.ac.kr ([163.152.39.64]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id VAA26142 for ; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 21:30:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from skylove ([163.152.39.54]) by os.korea.ac.kr (8.12.1/8.12.1) with SMTP id g172OUQ8027220 for ; Thu, 7 Feb 2002 11:24:30 +0900 (KST) From: "Kim, JinUg" To: Subject: Research area Date: Thu, 7 Feb 2002 11:30:09 +0900 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ks_c_5601-1987" X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Importance: Normal Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from base64 to 8bit by itd.nrl.navy.mil id VAA26143 Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Recently I have begun studying the area of Ad hoc networks and I am interested in concentrating on tcp performance or autoconfiguration. what are the main areas of current research or existing problems ? Any comments? Jade ----------------------------------------------------- Kim, JinUg (Jade) Don't be constrained by today's technology Operating System Lab. Dept. of CSE, Korea University 5-Ka Anam-Dong, SungBuk-Gu, SEOUL, 136-701, KOREA E-mail jukim@os.korea.ac.kr ICQ 75693268 Cell Phone 82-11-9119-0024 ----------------------------------------------------- From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Thu Feb 7 01:17:53 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id BAA12787 for ; Thu, 7 Feb 2002 01:17:52 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id WAA26750 for manet-outgoing; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 22:03:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from den.erg.sri.com (den.erg.sri.com [128.18.100.23]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id WAA26742 for ; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 22:03:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from den.erg.sri.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by den.erg.sri.com (8.9.3+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id TAA16858; Wed, 6 Feb 2002 19:02:54 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <200202070302.TAA16858@den.erg.sri.com> To: Ram Ramanathan cc: ogier@erg.sri.com, manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Reply-To: ogier@erg.sri.com From: ogier@erg.sri.com Subject: Re: performance comparaison between Ad Hoc routing protocols In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 06 Feb 2002 16:29:15 EST." <200202062129.QAA43627@crystal.bbn.com> Date: Wed, 06 Feb 2002 19:02:53 -0800 Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Hi Ram, > > - Although control traffic is not a quality-of-service measure, a protocol > > that generates less control traffic: > > > > - uses less energy, > > - is more likely to scale to a larger number of nodes, > ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > > Why so? > > The "pure flooding" protocol (in which every data packet is flooded > throughout the network) consumes zero overhead. Does that mean it > scales to infinite number of nodes? :) > > The flippancy of the above example notwithstanding, one should really > look at the TOTAL OVERHEAD (sum of control message overhead + sub-optimal > route overhead (extra bandwidth wasted due to longer paths). I agree that overhead due to suboptimal routes should be considered. Our simulation results at the TBRPF web site include graphs that show the average hop count. TBRPF and OLSR usually use shorter paths than AODV, and in our simulations with link-layer notification, TBRPF typically uses paths that are 10-15% shorter than AODV. One problem with total overhead is that it is highly dependent on the amount of data traffic sent, whereas routing control traffic is often fairly independent of this. > There are many instances in my experience where a mechanism that takes more > overhead ends up doing better in terms of user metrics. I'm not sure if you mean "total overhead" here. But since the min-hop path is not always the best path, it is certainly possible for a protocol to perform better by using longer paths (and thus more total overhead). Full flooding also achieves better reliability by using more total overhead than other flooding mechanisms. And the following example, in which neither of the two disjoint paths from 1 to 4 uses a min-hop path, shows that sometimes throughput can be increased by using more total overhead: 5-6 / \ / \ 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 \ / \ / 6-7 Richard > For a more formal treatment of TOTAL OVERHEAD, see > > Making Link State Routing Scale for Ad Hoc Networks, in Mobihoc 2001 by > C. Santivanez et al > > On the Scalability of Routing for Ad Hoc Networks, to appear in Infocom 2002, > by C. Santivanez et al > > > > - is more likely to perform well in lower bandwidth radios such > > as those used by the military. > > > > > > ----------------------- > > Richard Ogier > > Sr. Research Engineer > > SRI International > > 333 Ravenswood Ave. > > Menlo Park, CA 94025 > > Tel: 650-859-4216 > > Fax: 650-859-4812 > > Email: ogier@erg.sri.com > > ------------------------ > > > From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Thu Feb 7 13:18:08 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id NAA04413 for ; Thu, 7 Feb 2002 13:18:08 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id KAA10068 for manet-outgoing; Thu, 7 Feb 2002 10:27:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from fep7.cogeco.net (smtp.cogeco.net [216.221.81.25]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id KAA10063 for ; Thu, 7 Feb 2002 10:27:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from karthiki8508uy (d141-115-154.home.cgocable.net [24.141.115.154]) by fep7.cogeco.net (Postfix) with SMTP id DED2C651A for ; Thu, 7 Feb 2002 10:27:06 -0500 (EST) From: "Karthik Ramakrishnan" To: Subject: Archive Date: Thu, 7 Feb 2002 10:33:41 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello, I just wanted to know if there is an archive for this mailing list and if so where I can I access it? Thank You Karthik. From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Fri Feb 8 01:05:05 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id BAA21076 for ; Fri, 8 Feb 2002 01:05:05 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id WAA00379 for manet-outgoing; Thu, 7 Feb 2002 22:52:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from hotmail.com (f247.law12.hotmail.com [64.4.19.247]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id WAA00374 for ; Thu, 7 Feb 2002 22:52:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Thu, 7 Feb 2002 19:52:02 -0800 Received: from 61.155.176.74 by lw12fd.law12.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Fri, 08 Feb 2002 03:52:02 GMT X-Originating-IP: [61.155.176.74] From: "Zhou Bosheng" To: manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Subject: Re: Archive Date: Fri, 08 Feb 2002 11:52:02 +0800 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=gb2312; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 08 Feb 2002 03:52:02.0456 (UTC) FILETIME=[F7853180:01C1B053] Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk You can try to visit http://www.cs.hut.fi/~mart/mail/manet/ enjoy it! B.S. Zhou >From: "Karthik Ramakrishnan" >To: >Subject: Archive >Date: Thu, 7 Feb 2002 10:33:41 -0500 > >Hello, > > I just wanted to know if there is an archive for this mailing list and >if so where I can I access it? >Thank You >Karthik. > _________________________________________________________________ ÏíÓÃÊÀ½çÉÏ×î´óµÄ Web µç×ÓÓʼþϵͳ ¡ª¡ª MSN Hotmail¡£ http://www.hotmail.com/cn From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Fri Feb 8 22:56:07 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id WAA02475 for ; Fri, 8 Feb 2002 22:56:07 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id UAA00413 for manet-outgoing; Fri, 8 Feb 2002 20:34:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from camars.kaist.ac.kr (camars.kaist.ac.kr [143.248.137.2]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id UAA00408 for ; Fri, 8 Feb 2002 20:34:40 -0500 (EST) Received: (from sykang@localhost) by camars.kaist.ac.kr (8.9.3/8.9.3) id KAA05456 for manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil; Sat, 9 Feb 2002 10:24:56 +0900 (KST) From: Seung-Hak Lee Message-Id: <200202090124.KAA05456@camars.kaist.ac.kr> Subject: CFP for International Workshop on Ad Hoc Networking (IWAN2002) To: manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Date: Sat, 9 Feb 2002 10:24:56 +0900 (KST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL21-h4] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=EUC-KR Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit CALL FOR PAPERS International Workshop on Ad Hoc Networking (IWAN2002) to be held in conjunction with ICPP-2002 August 18-21, 2002 Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada http://calab.kaist.ac.kr/Conf/IWAN2002/ This workshop provides a forum for engineers and scientists in academia, industry and government to present their latest research findings in any aspect of ad hoc networking. Topics of interest include, but are not limited to: - Ad Hoc Routing Protocols - Ad Hoc Multicasting - Ad Hoc Transport Layer Issues - Ad Hoc Networking over Bluetooth - Quality of Service Issues - Ad Hoc Network Architectures - Sensor and Data Fusion Ad Hoc Networks - Media Access Techniques - Applications for Ad Hoc Networks - Peer-to-Peer Networking - Distributed Algorithms for Ad Hoc Networks - Mobile IP with Ad Hoc - Low Power and Energy-Efficient Algorithm and Protocol Designs - Security and Fault-Tolerance Issues for Ad Hoc Networks Paper Submission : Authors are invited to submit research contributions representing original, previously unpublished work. Submitted papers will be carefully evaluated based on originality, significance, technical soundness, and clarity of exposition. All papers will be refereed by at least two members of the program committee. Accepted papers will be published as proceedings of ICPP-2002 workshops. All submitted papers MUST be formatted according to the author guidelines provided by ICPP-2002 and MUST NOT be longer than 6 pages. Submission Deadline April 1, 2002 Author Notification May 1, 2002 Final Manuscript Due June 1, 2002 Electronic Submission : Please e-mail one PDF or PostScript version of your paper to the Workshop Program Chair at hyoon@calab.kaist.ac.kr Workshop Co-Chairs : Professor Hyunsoo Yoon Dept. of Electrical Engineering and Computer Science Korea Advanced Institute of Science and Technology 373-1 Kusong-dong, Yusong-ku, Daejon, Korea E-mail: hyoon@calab.kaist.ac.kr Tel: +82-42-869-3529 Fax: +82-42-869-5569 Professor Joong-Soo Ma Mobile Multimedia Research Center Information and Communication University (ICU) 58-4, Hwaam-Dong Yusong-Gu Daejon Korea E-mail: jsma@icu.ac.kr Tel: +82-42-866-6124 Program Committee Members : Charles E. Perkins, Nokia Research Center David B. Johnson, Department of Computer Science Rice University Elizabeth M. Royer, University of California at Santa Barbara Zygmunt J. Hass, Cornell University Stefano Basagni, UT-Dallas Young-Bae Ko, IBM T.J. Watson Research Songwu Lu, UCLA Sung-Ju Lee, Hewlett-Packard Labs Andrew Campbell, Columbia University Ram Ramanathan, BBN Tech. Ramesh Govindan, ICSI, The University of California at Berkeley David Maltz, AON Networks Jean-Pierre Hubaux, Swiss Federal Institute of Technology Ting-Chao Hou, National Chung Cheng University, Taiwan Gunter Hommel, Technical University of Berlin, Germany Christian Bonnet, Institut Eurecom, France Gerald Q. Maguire, Royal Institute of Technology, Sweden W. C. Wong, National University of Singapore Brahim Bensaou, Hong Kong University of Science and Technology Pravin Bhagwat, University of Maryland Aoyama Tomonori, Osaka University, Japan Takahiro HARA, Osaka University, Japan KAWAI, Makoto, Kyoto University, Japan Sungbae Eun, Hannam University, Korea Ikjoon Yeom, KAIST, Korea Chongkwon Kim, Seoul National University, Korea Joonwon Lee, KAIST, Korea From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Sat Feb 9 02:43:35 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id CAA12704 for ; Sat, 9 Feb 2002 02:43:34 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id AAA02488 for manet-outgoing; Sat, 9 Feb 2002 00:32:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from hotmail.com (f20.law10.hotmail.com [64.4.15.20]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id AAA02483 for ; Sat, 9 Feb 2002 00:32:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Fri, 8 Feb 2002 21:32:13 -0800 Received: from 143.248.117.4 by lw10fd.law10.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Sat, 09 Feb 2002 05:32:13 GMT X-Originating-IP: [143.248.117.4] From: "=?ks_c_5601-1987?B?wMwgvcLH0A==?=" To: manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Subject: CFP for IWAN2002 Date: Sat, 09 Feb 2002 05:32:13 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ks_c_5601-1987; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 09 Feb 2002 05:32:13.0755 (UTC) FILETIME=[20F260B0:01C1B12B] Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk CALL FOR PAPERS International Workshop on Ad Hoc Networking (IWAN2002) to be held in conjunction with ICPP-2002 August 18-21, 2002 Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada http://calab.kaist.ac.kr/Conf/IWAN2002/ This workshop provides a forum for engineers and scientists in academia, industry and government to present their latest research findings in any aspect of ad hoc networking. Topics of interest include, but are not limited to: - Ad Hoc Routing Protocols - Ad Hoc Multicasting - Ad Hoc Transport Layer Issues - Ad Hoc Networking over Bluetooth - Quality of Service Issues - Ad Hoc Network Architectures - Sensor and Data Fusion Ad Hoc Networks - Media Access Techniques - Applications for Ad Hoc Networks - Peer-to-Peer Networking - Distributed Algorithms for Ad Hoc Networks - Mobile IP with Ad Hoc - Low Power and Energy-Efficient Algorithm and Protocol Designs - Security and Fault-Tolerance Issues for Ad Hoc Networks Paper Submission : Authors are invited to submit research contributions representing original, previously unpublished work. Submitted papers will be carefully evaluated based on originality, significance, technical soundness, and clarity of exposition. All papers will be refereed by at least two members of the program committee. Accepted papers will be published as proceedings of ICPP-2002 workshops. All submitted papers MUST be formatted according to the author guidelines provided by ICPP-2002 and MUST NOT be longer than 6 pages. Submission Deadline April 1, 2002 Author Notification May 1, 2002 Final Manuscript Due June 1, 2002 Electronic Submission : Please e-mail one PDF or PostScript version of your paper to the Workshop Program Chair at hyoon@calab.kaist.ac.kr Workshop Co-Chairs : Professor Hyunsoo Yoon Dept. of Electrical Engineering and Computer Science Korea Advanced Institute of Science and Technology 373-1 Kusong-dong, Yusong-ku, Daejon, Korea E-mail: hyoon@calab.kaist.ac.kr Tel: +82-42-869-3529 Fax: +82-42-869-5569 Professor Joong-Soo Ma Mobile Multimedia Research Center Information and Communication University (ICU) 58-4, Hwaam-Dong Yusong-Gu Daejon Korea E-mail: jsma@icu.ac.kr Tel: +82-42-866-6124 Program Committee Members : Charles E. Perkins, Nokia Research Center David B. Johnson, Department of Computer Science Rice University Elizabeth M. Royer, University of California at Santa Barbara Zygmunt J. Hass, Cornell University Stefano Basagni, UT-Dallas Young-Bae Ko, IBM T.J. Watson Research Songwu Lu, UCLA Sung-Ju Lee, Hewlett-Packard Labs Andrew Campbell, Columbia University Ram Ramanathan, BBN Tech. Ramesh Govindan, ICSI, The University of California at Berkeley David Maltz, AON Networks Jean-Pierre Hubaux, Swiss Federal Institute of Technology Ting-Chao Hou, National Chung Cheng University, Taiwan Gunter Hommel, Technical University of Berlin, Germany Christian Bonnet, Institut Eurecom, France Gerald Q. Maguire, Royal Institute of Technology, Sweden W. C. Wong, National University of Singapore Brahim Bensaou, Hong Kong University of Science and Technology Pravin Bhagwat, University of Maryland Aoyama Tomonori, Osaka University, Japan Takahiro HARA, Osaka University, Japan KAWAI, Makoto, Kyoto University, Japan Sungbae Eun, Hannam University, Korea Ikjoon Yeom, KAIST, Korea Chongkwon Kim, Seoul National University, Korea Joonwon Lee, KAIST, Korea _________________________________________________________________ http://messenger.msn.co.kr/ ¿¡¼­ MSN Messenger¸¦ ´Ù¿î·ÎµåÇÏ¿© ¿Â¶óÀÎ »ó¿¡ ÀÖ ´Â Ä£±¸¿Í ´ëÈ­¸¦ ³ª´©¼¼¿ä. From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Sat Feb 9 14:45:25 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id OAA19182 for ; Sat, 9 Feb 2002 14:45:24 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id LAA06472 for manet-outgoing; Sat, 9 Feb 2002 11:23:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from ece.ufl.edu (dot.ece.ufl.edu [128.227.220.22]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id LAA06462 for ; Sat, 9 Feb 2002 11:23:30 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 4547 invoked from network); 9 Feb 2002 16:21:25 -0000 Received: from fang.ece.ufl.edu (128.227.80.157) by dot.ece.ufl.edu with SMTP; 9 Feb 2002 16:21:25 -0000 Received: (from fang@localhost) by fang.ece.ufl.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3) id LAA10679; Sat, 9 Feb 2002 11:21:19 -0500 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: fang.ece.ufl.edu: Processed from queue /home/faculty/fang/mqueue X-Authentication-Warning: fang.ece.ufl.edu: Processed by fang with -C /home/faculty/fang/bin/sendmail.cf Date: Sat, 9 Feb 2002 11:21:19 -0500 From: Yuguang Fang To: Yuguang Fang Subject: SPECTS'2002 in San Diego Message-ID: <20020209112119.B10667@ece.ufl.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0pre4i Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by itd.nrl.navy.mil id LAA06465 Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit New Submission Deadline: February 28, 2002 %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% (We apologize for the inconvenience this message may cause if you receive multiple copies) Due to numerous requests, the conference organizing committee has decided to extend the paper submission deadline to February 28, 2002. Call For Papers 2002 International Symposium on Performance Evaluation of Computer and Telecommunication Systems SPECTS 2002 July 14-19, 2002 U. S. Grant Hotel San Diego, California, USA http://www.scs.org/confernc/spects02/ This annual international conference is a forum for professionals involved in performance evaluation of computer and telecommunication systems. Evaluation of computer systems and networks is needed at every stage in the life cycle of the product including design, manufacturing, sales/purchase, use, upgrade, tuning, etc. The discipline of performance evaluation has progressed rapidly in the past decade, and it has now begun to approach maturity. Significant progress has been made in analytic modeling, simulation, and measurement approaches for performance evaluation of computer and telecommunication systems. Topics of interest include, but are not limited to: Networking and Telecommunication Systems - Internet Technology - Quality of Service (QoS) - DiffServ/IntServ - TCP - Unicast and Multicast Routing - High-Speed Networking - ATM - Optical Networks - Switching Techniques - Teletraffic - Satellite Systems and Networks - Wireless Systems - UMTS/IMT-2000 - Mobile Networks/Computing - Multimedia Systems - Multimedia Communications - Adaptive Communications - Network Protocols - Network Management and Control - Network Capacity Planning - Network Architecture Evaluation - Service and QoS Pricing - Security and Authentication - World Wide Web (WWW) Technology - Electronic Commerce Computer Systems - Client/Server - Microprocessors/Microcomputers - Memory Systems - Interconnection Networks - Software Performance - Software Evaluation and Testing - Hardware and Software Monitors - High-Performance Computing - Workload and Traffic Characterization - Scientific Computing Algorithms - High Performance I/O - Reconfigurable Computing -Real-time Systems - Parallel and Distributed Computing - Distributed Systems and Agents - Massively Parallel Systems - Cluster Computing - Parallel Algorithms and Languages - Scheduling Schemes Tools, Methodologies and Applications - Parallel and Distributed Simulation - Verification and Validation - Performance Tools and Methodologies - Neural Networks and Fuzzy Logic Applications to High Performance Computing/Networking - Performance Optimization - Queueing Systems and Networks - Scalability Studies - Integrated Modeling and Measurement - On-Line Performance Adaptation and Tuning - Process Algebra-Based Models - Performance Bounds - Integrated Design and Performance - New Performance Models - Mathematical Aspects of Performance - New Performability Schemes and Models - Case Studies General Chair Mohammad S. Obaidat Dept. of Computer Science, Monmouth University W. Long Branch, NJ 07764, USA Tel +1-732-571-4482 Fax +1-732-263-5202 E-mail: obaidat@monmouth.edu Senior Program Chair Franco Davoli DIST-University of Genoa Via Opera Pia 13, I-16145 Genoa, Italy Tel +39-010-353-2732 Fax +39-010-353-2154 E-Mail: franco@dist.unige.it Program Co-Chairs Ibrahim Onyuksel Dept. of Computer Sciences, N. Illinois Univ., USA E-mail: onyuksel@cs.niu.edu Raffaele Bolla DIST-University of Genoa Via Opera Pia 13, I-16145 Genoa, Italy E-mail: lelus@dist.unige.it Vice Program Chair Erina Ferro CNUCE, Institute of National Research Council (C.N.R.) C.N.R. Pisa Research Area, Building B, Room 73 Via G. Moruzzi, 1 56124 Pisa, Italy E-mail: erina.ferro@cnuce.cnr.it Industrial Track Chair J. Fox, Motorola Inc., UK E-mail: fox.ijcs@btinternet.com Publicity Chair Yuguang (Michael) Fang, University of Florida, USA, E-mail: fang@ece.ufl.edu Web Master: Daniel Lee, University of Southern California, E-mail: dclee@rcf-fs.usc.edu Technical Program Committee Jagan P. Agrawal, University of Missouri - Kansas City, USA Ian Akyildiz, Georgia Tech., USA M. Atiquzzaman, University of Oklahoma, USA Harmen R. van As, Vienna University of Technology, Austria Louis G. Birta, University of Ottawa, Canada Noureddine Boudriga, University of Tunis, Tunisia Hasan Cam, Arizona State University, USA Andrew Campbell, Columbia University, USA Fabio M. Chiussi, Bell Laboratories, Lucent Technologies, USA Hassan B. Diab, American University of Beirut, Lebanon Gabor Fodor, Ericsson Radio Systems, Sweden John Fox, Motorola, UK Luigi Fratta, Politecnico di Milano, Italy Aura Ganz, University of Massachusetts, USA Erol Gelenbe, University of Central Florida, USA Mario Gerla, UCLA, USA Omar Hammami, ENSTA, France Jarmo Harju, Tampere University of Technology, Finland Herman Hughes, Michigan State University, USA Andrzej Jajszczyk, University of Mining and Metallurgy, Poland Ingemar Kaj, Uppsala University, Sweden Helen Karatza, Aristotle University of Thessalonica, Greece Demetrios Kazakos, University of Louisiana, USA Ulrich Killat, Tech Univ. of Hamburg, Germany Tag Gon Kim, KAIST, Korea Belka Kraimeche, Stevens Institute of Technology, USA Paul J. Kuehn, University of Stuttgart, Germany Kevin Kwiat, Air Force Research Laboratory, USA Veronica Lagrange M. Reis, Compaq Computers Corp., USA Axel Lehmann, Universität der Bundeswehr München, Germany Daniel C. Lee, USC, USA Mike T. Liu, Ohio State University, USA Imad Mahgoub, Florida Atlantic University, USA Sam Makki, Queensland University of Technology, Australia Krzysztof Malinowski, Warsaw Technical University, Poland Jose L. Marzo, Universitat de Girona, Spain Xiannong Meng, Bucknell University, USA Hussein Mouftah, Queen's University, Canada M. Ould-Khaoua, University of Glasgow, UK Sergio Palazzo, Università di Catania, Italy Georgios I. Papadimitriou, Aristotle University, Greece Achille Pattavina, Politecnico di Milano, Italy Krzysztof Pawlikowski, University of Canterbury, New Zealand Steven Pink, University of Arizona, USA George Polyzos, AUEB, Greece Ramon Puigjaner, Universitat de les Illes Balears, Spain Kaliappa Ravindran, CUNY, USA Gian Paolo Rossi, Università di Milano, Italy Izhak Rubin, UCLA, USA Donald Schilling, CUNY, USA Jens B. Schmitt, TU Darmstadt, Germany C. Tim Spracklen, Aberdeen University, UK Tatsuya Suda, UCI, USA Iwao Toda, Fujutsu Laboratories Ltd., Japan Phuoc Tran-Gia, University of Wuerzburg, Germany Kenneth S. Vastola, Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute, USA Manuel Villen-Altamirano, Telefonica, Spain Bernd E. Wolfinger, Hamburg University, Germany Michele Zorzi, Università di Ferrara, Italy International Liaisons B. Sadoun, Al-Balqa' Applied University, Jordan Bsadoun@go.com.jo M. Sawan, Montreal Poly, Canada Sawan@vlsi.polymtl.ca N. Tchamov, Tampere Univ. of Technology, Finland Nikolay@cs.tut.fi Publicity Committee: Hideki Tode, Osaka Univ., Japan, E-mail: Tode@ise.eng.osaka-u.ac.jp Nusseirat, Al-Isra University, Jordan, E-mail: anuseirat@firstnet.com.jo Paper Submission Submit your complete papers electronically to: http://scs.proceedingscentral.com/ All required instructions will be posted on this web site. Submissions should not exceed 25 double-spaced, 8.5x11 inch pages (including figures, tables, and references) in 10-12 point font. Include five to ten keywords, complete postal and e-mail addresses, and fax and phone numbers of corresponding author. If you have difficulty in electronic submission, contact the Web Master, Program Chairs or the Conference Coordinator, Mr. Steve Branch, The Society for Modeling and Simulation International, 4838 Ronson Court, Suite L, San Diego, CA 92111, USA, Tel 858-277-3888, Fax 858-277-3930, E-mail sbranch@scs.org sbranch@scs.org. Extended versions of accepted papers in SPECTS 2002 will be considered for possible publication in scholarly journals. Proposals for tutorials, special and panel sessions should be sent to the Conference Senior Program Chair. Proposals for industrial sessions should be submitted to the Industrial Track Chair. For more information regarding presentations or exhibitions at SPECTS 2002 contact: Mr. Steve Branch at the address shown above. Deadlines Submission of Papers: Extended to February 28, 2002. Notification of Acceptance - April 22, 2002 Final Camera-Ready Submission - May 22, 2002 Sponsored by The Society for Modeling and Simulation International. -- %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% Yuguang "Michael" Fang, Ph.D Assistant Professor Department of Electrical and Computer Engineering University of Florida 435 Engineering Building, P.O.Box 116130 Gainesville, FL 32611 Tel: (352) 846-3043, Fax: (352) 392-0044 Email: fang@ece.ufl.edu, http://www.fang.ece.ufl.edu %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Mon Feb 11 15:58:55 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id PAA16975 for ; Mon, 11 Feb 2002 15:58:55 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id LAA00961 for manet-outgoing; Mon, 11 Feb 2002 11:44:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from web21006.mail.yahoo.com (web21006.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.227.60]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id LAA00939 for ; Mon, 11 Feb 2002 11:44:27 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <20020211164427.72812.qmail@web21006.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [65.88.242.115] by web21006.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 11 Feb 2002 08:44:27 PST Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2002 08:44:27 -0800 (PST) From: Yang Xiao Reply-To: YangXiao@ieee.org Subject: CFP: Modeling, Analysis, and Simulation of Wireless LANs and Mobile Ad Hoc Networks and QoS Issues To: manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Cc: YangXiao@ieee.org, bwang@cs.wright.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk My apologies if you receive this CFP duplicated. ------------------- Call for Papers- Deadline extented Invited Session Title: Modeling, Analysis, and Simulation of Wireless LANs and Mobile Ad Hoc Networks and QoS Issues Invited Session in the 6th World Multi-Conference on Systemics, Cybernetics and Informatics, (SCI 2002) Orlando, Florida, USA, July 14 -18, 2002 Topics of Interest Wireless LANs & Mobile Ad Hoc Networks (not limited to) Simulation, Modeling and performance evaluation of Wireless LANs, such as IEEE 802.11, HIPERLAN, and Ad hoc Networks. Quality-of-service issues in Wireless LANs (IEEE 802.11e, HIPERLAN/2, etc.) and Ad Hoc Networks. Power Consumption issues Higher data rates 3G/4G-WLAN Differentiated Services for Wireless LANs Co-existence of the IEEE 802.11 and 802.15 Resource Management Analytical methods. Deadlines Submission of Extended Abstracts: February 25, 2002 Notification of Acceptance: March 15, 2002 Camera Ready Copies: April 03, 2002 Session Co-Organizers/co-chairs Dr. Yang Xiao, Micro Linear, USA Dr. Bin Wang, Wright State University, USA Instructions For Submission Submission should be in the form of extended abstracts up to 4 pages long. All submitted contributions will be subject to peer review on the basis of technical correctness, quality, relevance, originality, significance, and clarity. Abstracts should be in MS Word, PDF or PS format. Submissions should be sent to the session's co-organizers. Successful submissions will be asked to submit a full paper. Full papers must be formatted according to IEEE-CS guidelines Electronic Submission: Dr. Yang Xiao: YangXiao@IEEE.ORG Dr. Bin Wang: bwang@cs.wright.edu For more details check at http://www.iiis.org/sci2002/ last updated 02/11/02 __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Send FREE Valentine eCards with Yahoo! Greetings! http://greetings.yahoo.com From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Tue Feb 12 06:48:17 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id GAA08180 for ; Tue, 12 Feb 2002 06:48:17 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id DAA24657 for manet-outgoing; Tue, 12 Feb 2002 03:41:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from p-mail2.rd.francetelecom.com (p-mail2.rd.francetelecom.com [193.49.124.32]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id DAA24652 for ; Tue, 12 Feb 2002 03:41:23 -0500 (EST) Received: by p-voyageur.rd.francetelecom.fr with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id <1M41856R>; Tue, 12 Feb 2002 09:41:06 +0100 Message-ID: <0489A7888F080B4BA73B53F7E145F29A03C047@LANMHS20.rd.francetelecom.fr> From: MEDDOUR Djamal Eddine thesard FTRD/DAC/LAN To: "'Kilian Weniger'" Cc: manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil, CARLINET Yannick FTRD/DAC/LAN Subject: Address Allocation with IPV6 Date: Tue, 12 Feb 2002 09:41:13 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----=_NextPartTM-000-89d7f6e1-1ed7-11d6-b1e5-00508b69ab48" Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. ------=_NextPartTM-000-89d7f6e1-1ed7-11d6-b1e5-00508b69ab48 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C1B3A1.071DE686" ------_=_NextPart_001_01C1B3A1.071DE686 Content-Type: text/plain hi all I am reading a paper which talk about Address Allocation with IPV6 (IPv6 Autoconfiguration in Large Scale Mobile Ad Hoc Networks). do you think really that a same scheme is needed?. in IPV6 we have a huge number of IP address, we can attribute statically one adresse by node (when we buy a terminal we can buy an IP address with it). any comments ? ------_=_NextPart_001_01C1B3A1.071DE686 Content-Type: text/html Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Address Allocation with IPV6

hi all
I am reading a paper which talk about Address = Allocation with IPV6 (IPv6 Autoconfiguration in Large Scale Mobile Ad = Hoc Networks). do you think really that a same scheme is needed?. in = IPV6 we have a huge number of IP address, we can attribute statically = one adresse by node (when we buy a terminal we can buy an IP address = with it).

any comments ?
 

------_=_NextPart_001_01C1B3A1.071DE686-- ------=_NextPartTM-000-89d7f6e1-1ed7-11d6-b1e5-00508b69ab48-- From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Tue Feb 12 08:28:49 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id IAA10615 for ; Tue, 12 Feb 2002 08:28:44 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id FAA25931 for manet-outgoing; Tue, 12 Feb 2002 05:26:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from iraun2.uka.de (iraun2.uka.de [129.13.10.91]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id FAA25926 for ; Tue, 12 Feb 2002 05:26:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from irams1.ira.uka.de ([129.13.10.5]) by iraun2.uka.de with esmtp (Exim 3.30 #7 (Debian)) id 16aa99-0001w3-00; Tue, 12 Feb 2002 11:26:47 +0100 Received: from i72pc238.tm.uni-karlsruhe.de ([141.3.70.72] helo=i72pc238.tm.uka.de) by irams1.ira.uka.de with esmtp (Exim 3.30 #7 (Debian)) id 16aa99-0007WN-00; Tue, 12 Feb 2002 11:26:47 +0100 Received: from localhost (weniger@localhost) by i72pc238.tm.uka.de (8.11.6/8.11.2) with ESMTP id g1CAQjL21727; Tue, 12 Feb 2002 11:26:47 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: i72pc238.tm.uka.de: weniger owned process doing -bs Date: Tue, 12 Feb 2002 11:26:45 +0100 (CET) From: Kilian Weniger To: MEDDOUR Djamal Eddine thesard FTRD/DAC/LAN cc: , CARLINET Yannick FTRD/DAC/LAN Subject: Re: Address Allocation with IPV6 In-Reply-To: <0489A7888F080B4BA73B53F7E145F29A03C047@LANMHS20.rd.francetelecom.fr> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Hello Djamal, I have two comments on that: Firstly, in your scenario routing would only work if every existing device has an unique IPv6 address assigned by the manufacturer. This is not the case today and even if EVERY manufacturer would start doing so at some point of time in the future (I don't see any such effort, yet), there are still thousands of devices without addresses, that were sold before. Furthermore, you would need some sort of central registration, as there is for IEEE MAC-addresses. And even the MAC-addresses are not unique today (some manufacturers sell devices with unregistered MAC-addresses; you can change the MAC-address of some devices,...). So even in the case you would have this central registry, you probably want to have a backup solution to guarantee unique addresses. By the way, if you argue against IPv6 SAA in ad hoc networks, you could also argue against IPv6 SAA in general (in wired LANs). You wouldn't need that, too, if all (wired) network devices would have unique, pre-assigned IPv6 addresses. Secondly, a hierarchy is established by the architecture described in the paper, which can be used by routing protocols to achieve an improved scalability (route aggregation...). You wouldn't have this with preassigned addresses. Kilian Weniger On Tue, 12 Feb 2002, MEDDOUR Djamal Eddine thesard FTRD/DAC/LAN wrote: > hi all > I am reading a paper which talk about Address Allocation with IPV6 (IPv6 > Autoconfiguration in Large Scale Mobile Ad Hoc Networks). do you think > really that a same scheme is needed?. in IPV6 we have a huge number of IP > address, we can attribute statically one adresse by node (when we buy a > terminal we can buy an IP address with it). > any comments ? > > -- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Dipl.-Ing. Kilian Weniger phone: (+49)(0)721-608 6415 Institute of Telematics fax: (+49)(0)721-388097 Department of Computer Science email: weniger@tm.uni-karlsruhe.de University of Karlsruhe homepage: http://www.tm.uka.de/~weniger/ D-76128 Karlsruhe From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Tue Feb 12 11:45:05 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id LAA17911 for ; Tue, 12 Feb 2002 11:45:05 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id JAA02100 for manet-outgoing; Tue, 12 Feb 2002 09:23:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from hugin.diku.dk (hugin.diku.dk [130.225.96.144]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id JAA02082 for ; Tue, 12 Feb 2002 09:23:37 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 370 invoked from network); 12 Feb 2002 14:23:35 -0000 Received: from gefion.diku.dk (jonasn@130.225.96.168) by hugin.diku.dk with QMQP; 12 Feb 2002 14:23:35 -0000 To: manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Subject: Asymmetric links From: Jonas Nielsen Date: 12 Feb 2002 15:23:35 +0100 Message-ID: Lines: 4 User-Agent: Gnus/5.0808 (Gnus v5.8.8) XEmacs/21.4 (Civil Service) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk In some ways DSR is said to be superior to AODV because it supports asymmetric links. But in what scenarios are asymmetric links used. I can only see that either a system is (almost) symmetric or highly assymetric (e.g sattelite communications). From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Tue Feb 12 20:15:33 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id UAA02377 for ; Tue, 12 Feb 2002 20:15:32 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id RAA25677 for manet-outgoing; Tue, 12 Feb 2002 17:51:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from cheetah.cs.ucla.edu (Cheetah.CS.UCLA.EDU [131.179.128.24]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id RAA25672 for ; Tue, 12 Feb 2002 17:51:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost (hxy@localhost) by cheetah.cs.ucla.edu (8.10.2+Sun/8.10.2/UCLACS-5.1) with ESMTP id g1CMos426022; Tue, 12 Feb 2002 14:50:54 -0800 (PST) Date: Tue, 12 Feb 2002 14:50:54 -0800 (PST) From: Xiaoyan Hong To: Gitte Hansen cc: vikas p verma , Subject: Re: OLSR in GloMoSim In-Reply-To: <3C60FF8E.B7E67A98@cs.auc.dk> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Hi, Gitte, You can find the paper at URL: http://www.cs.ucla.edu/NRL/wireless/papers.html best, Xiaoyan On Wed, 6 Feb 2002, Gitte Hansen wrote: > Hi Xiaoyan > > Is this paper available from anywhere else than the proceedings, as I > would like to read it? > > Regards, > Gitte Hansen > > Xiaoyan Hong wrote: > > > > Hi, Vikas, > > > > OLSR has been simulated in GloMoSim by UCLA. An ICC 2002 paper: > > "Scalable Ad Hoc Routing in Large, Dense Wireless > > Networks Using Clustering and Landmarks" contains some simulation > > results. > > > > Best, > > > > Xiaoyan > > > > On 5 Feb 2002, vikas p verma wrote: > > > > > > > > Hi All, > > > > > > > > > Can anyone please clarify if OLSR has been simulated for Ad hoc n/w in > > GloMoSim as yet. > > > > > > Vikas > > > > From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Tue Feb 12 20:46:49 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id UAA03173 for ; Tue, 12 Feb 2002 20:46:49 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id SAA27160 for manet-outgoing; Tue, 12 Feb 2002 18:58:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from ux6.sp.cs.cmu.edu (UX6.SP.CS.CMU.EDU [128.2.181.250]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id SAA27154; Tue, 12 Feb 2002 18:58:30 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 12 Feb 2002 18:58:09 -0500 (EST) From: Yih-Chun Hu X-Sender: yihchun@ux6.sp.cs.cmu.edu To: Joe Macker cc: manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Subject: Re: AODV WG Last Call for Comments In-Reply-To: <5.0.1.4.2.20020125182737.076da8b8@pop.itd.nrl.navy.mil> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Sorry these comments are late. These comments are for the WG last call of aodv-10. This draft appears to be a substantial improvement in the definition of AODV, as it is more clearly and precisely specifies the protocol. I did find a few problems with the draft as it stands, and would like to raise a couple points previously brought up on the list. As was mentioned on the list before by Erik Nordstrom (in Message-ID on December 13, 2001), Hello messages don't work with unidirectional links, since Hello messages can propogate over such links, but packets can't flow in the reverse direction. Because of the use of NODE_TRAVERSAL_TIME, it seems inconsistent to allow any node to hold a packet beyond NODE_TRAVERSAL_TIME (ie a node buffering a packet for NODE_TRAVERSAL_TIME MUST drop the packet), and NODE_TRAVERSAL_TIME should not be a configurable parameter at any node (needs to be consistant network-wide). Any cycle in the network which has aggregate latency PATH_TRAVERSAL_TIME could cause the infinite looping of RREQ packets, and each time the RREQ goes around this cycle, it would cause another flood of the entire network, subject to TTL constraints. PATH_TRAVERSAL_TIME therefore should be conservatively set to NETWORK_NODES * NODE_TRAVERSAL_TIME. The definition of PATH_DISCOVERY_TIME in Section 10 is unparsable. This draft does not seem to define a default RREQ_RETRIES, nor does it provide any guidance on how one might set that particular parameter. There may be a node X which has a very dynamic network on one side of it and a very static network on the other side of it. It may be possible for X to issue 2^31 sequence numbers on the active side between new sequence numbers on the static side. This would cause the static side to believe that all new sequence numbers were stale for quite a long period of time, and possibly preclude routing to X. A more aggressive mechanism for dealing with wraparound is needed. Suppose some node Y has a route to X and sends packets over that route once per ACTIVE_ROUTE_TIMEOUT. If X reboots, and K sequential data packets or corresponding RERRs are lost over the entire path from X to Y, Y will be unable to find routes to X until the newly chosen sequence number becomes greater than Y's current sequence number. The draft should give some guidance about the types of networks for which AODV is a suitable routing protocol. The precursor list is only set in response to RREPs, but RREQs serve as a form of RREP in that they create routing state. As a result, precursor lists SHOULD be set in the sender when an RREQ it propogates is received. In Section 10, the draft allows a node to "possibly [reconfigure] the HELLO_INTERVAL." This is too vague to be in a specification. Allowing arbitrary changes to HELLO_INTERVAL is also problematic if a node does not always boot to a consistant HELLO_INTERVAL. For example, if a node X sets HELLO_INTERVAL to 10s, and advertises it, upstream neighbors only require one HELLO within 30s. X reboots and need only wait 5 seconds before it starts participating in the protocol again. Nodes would no longer be able to reach X. In Sec 6.2, the draft allows the receipt of AODV control packets to confirm that a neighbor is still there. Not only does this suffer the same problem with unidirectional links as Hello packets, it also is ill-specified. The language in the draft can be interpreted to allow an RREQ that has traversed multiple hops could be used to renew the neighbor status of the source of the RREQ. From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Wed Feb 13 01:23:12 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id BAA11990 for ; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 01:23:12 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id XAA02123 for manet-outgoing; Tue, 12 Feb 2002 23:11:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from ns0.utdallas.edu (ns0.utdallas.edu [129.110.10.1]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id XAA02118 for ; Tue, 12 Feb 2002 23:11:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from apache.utdallas.edu (apache.utdallas.edu [129.110.16.9]) by ns0.utdallas.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 01C1B1A0B42; Tue, 12 Feb 2002 22:11:21 -0600 (CST) Received: by apache.utdallas.edu (Postfix, from userid 30546) id 305852274B; Tue, 12 Feb 2002 22:11:19 -0600 (CST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by apache.utdallas.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0AECD2274A; Tue, 12 Feb 2002 22:11:19 -0600 (CST) Date: Tue, 12 Feb 2002 22:11:18 -0600 (CST) From: Rajesh Bhairampally To: Jonas Nielsen Cc: manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Subject: Re: Asymmetric links In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk I guess asymetry comes with the time; i mean, as the time passes, nodes loose energy; different nodes may have different energy losses. so, there can be a situation where a node can receive data from another node, but it doesn't has sufficient energy levels to send its data to the other node. such situations create unidirectional links in the network which originally started with bidirectional links. rajesh On 12 Feb 2002, Jonas Nielsen wrote: > In some ways DSR is said to be superior to AODV because it supports > asymmetric links. But in what scenarios are asymmetric links used. I > can only see that either a system is (almost) symmetric or highly > assymetric (e.g sattelite communications). > Rajesh From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Wed Feb 13 10:28:36 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id KAA07478 for ; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 10:28:35 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id IAA09239 for manet-outgoing; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 08:06:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from iraun2.uka.de (iraun2.uka.de [129.13.10.91]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id IAA09234 for ; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 08:06:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from irams1.ira.uka.de ([129.13.10.5]) by iraun2.uka.de with esmtp (Exim 3.30 #7 (Debian)) id 16az7G-0001bQ-00; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 14:06:30 +0100 Received: from i72pc238.tm.uni-karlsruhe.de ([141.3.70.72] helo=i72pc238.tm.uka.de) by irams1.ira.uka.de with esmtp (Exim 3.30 #7 (Debian)) id 16az7F-00045U-00; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 14:06:29 +0100 Received: from localhost (weniger@localhost) by i72pc238.tm.uka.de (8.11.6/8.11.2) with ESMTP id g1DD6TA24972; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 14:06:29 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: i72pc238.tm.uka.de: weniger owned process doing -bs Date: Wed, 13 Feb 2002 14:06:29 +0100 (CET) From: Kilian Weniger To: Rajesh Bhairampally cc: Jonas Nielsen , Subject: Re: Asymmetric links In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk You can have unidirectional links even if you have enough battery power: Firstly, if you use power control alogrithms. This is obvious. Secondly, interference leads to a decrease of the SNR at the receiver. If the interference is much higher at one of both receivers, the link may be unidirectional. I guess there are even more examples of situation, which result in unidirectional links. Kilian On Tue, 12 Feb 2002, Rajesh Bhairampally wrote: > I guess asymetry comes with the time; i mean, as the time passes, nodes > loose energy; different nodes may have different energy losses. so, there > can be a situation where a node can receive data from another node, but > it doesn't has sufficient energy levels to send its data to the other > node. such situations create unidirectional links in the network which > originally started with bidirectional links. > > rajesh > > > On 12 Feb 2002, Jonas Nielsen wrote: > > > In some ways DSR is said to be superior to AODV because it supports > > asymmetric links. But in what scenarios are asymmetric links used. I > > can only see that either a system is (almost) symmetric or highly > > assymetric (e.g sattelite communications). > > > > Rajesh > -- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Dipl.-Ing. Kilian Weniger phone: (+49)(0)721-608 6415 Institute of Telematics fax: (+49)(0)721-388097 Department of Computer Science email: weniger@tm.uni-karlsruhe.de University of Karlsruhe homepage: http://www.tm.uka.de/~weniger/ D-76128 Karlsruhe From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Wed Feb 13 10:28:37 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id KAA07489 for ; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 10:28:37 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id IAA09118 for manet-outgoing; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 08:00:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from p-mail2.rd.francetelecom.com (p-mail2.rd.francetelecom.com [193.49.124.32]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id IAA09110 for ; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 08:00:22 -0500 (EST) Received: by p-voyageur.rd.francetelecom.fr with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id <1M419QXN>; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 14:00:05 +0100 Message-ID: <0489A7888F080B4BA73B53F7E145F29A022D62@LANMHS20.rd.francetelecom.fr> From: MEDDOUR Djamal Eddine thesard FTRD/DAC/LAN To: manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Subject: definition of large ad hoc networks Date: Wed, 13 Feb 2002 14:00:17 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----=_NextPartTM-000-3052971a-2016-11d6-b1e5-00508b69ab48" Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. ------=_NextPartTM-000-3052971a-2016-11d6-b1e5-00508b69ab48 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C1B48E.62D9F1C2" ------_=_NextPart_001_01C1B48E.62D9F1C2 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable any comments ? -----Message d'origine----- De : Kilian Weniger [mailto:weniger@tm.uka.de] Envoy=E9 : mercredi 13 f=E9vrier 2002 13:58 =C0 : Bruno Husson Cc : MEDDOUR Djamal Eddine thesard FTRD/DAC/LAN; CARLINET Yannick FTRD/DAC/LAN Objet : Re: Address Allocation with IPV6 From my point of view a large network is a couple of hundred nodes. You might have as many nodes in conferences, at exhibitions, on highways = etc. For example kids in the back of a car want to play multiplayer-games = with other kids in another car, or you want to exchange files with other people in a train.... This would be too expensive und not free from interruptions (tunnels,...), if you would use cellular networks. Kilian On Wed, 13 Feb 2002, Bruno Husson wrote: > Hello Kilian, > > What are the use cases of large ad-hoc networks you consider as = possible ? > Large ad-hoc networks for which kind of community : > - Companies ? > - public sites like airports, railway stations, hospitals ? > - public networks ? > Have you some example where large ad-hoc networks would be an = interesting solution compared to > cellular based networks ? > > > Kilian Weniger a =E9crit : > > > Hi Bruno, > > > > yes, we are also interested in large networks. We want a system, = that > > scales to a large number of nodes. > > > > We claim, that our system can do that. Of course it also works for = small > > networks. E.g. If the network is so small, that it has the radius = equal > > or less to the radius of a scope, there is only one subnet with one leader node. > > This is equivalent to a simple, flat address scheme. > > > > If nodes also would have unique IPv6 address, this could be used as global > > routable address in conjunction with Mobile IP to connect the ad = hoc > > network to the internet. The site-local addresses constructed by = the IPv6 > > SAA could than be used for the communication within the ad hoc = network > > (with the benefit of route aggregation). > > > > regards, > > > > Kilian Weniger > > > > On Tue, 12 Feb 2002, Bruno Husson wrote: > > > > > Hello Kilian and Djamal, > > > > > > Kilian Weniger a =E9crit : > > > > > > > Hello Djamal, > > > > > > > > I have two comments on that: > > > > > > > > Firstly, in your scenario routing would only work if every = existing > > > > device has an unique IPv6 address assigned by the manufacturer. > > > > > > IPv6 shall not be defined by the manufacturer. It should be auto-configured or configured by > > > administrator of the network. > > > > > > > This is not the case today and even > > > > if EVERY manufacturer would start doing so at some point of = time in the > > > > future (I don't see any such effort, yet), there are still > > > > thousands of devices without addresses, that were sold before. > > > > Furthermore, you would need some sort of central registration, = as there is > > > > for IEEE MAC-addresses. And even the MAC-addresses are not = unique today > > > > (some manufacturers sell devices with unregistered = MAC-addresses; you can change > > > > the MAC-address of some devices,...). So even in the case you = would have > > > > this central registry, you probably want to have a backup = solution to > > > > guarantee unique addresses. > > > > > > Yes. IPv6 adress may be built based on MAC address (EUI-64 = solution). In that case it has a > > > good probability to be unique, except that some devices may have = non unique MAC adress for > > > the reasons you indicate. > > > So, some detection of duplicate address (DAD) should be = recommanded, except if you work in a > > > closed environment where your are sure it is unnecessary (this is = not the IETF philosophy). > > > > > > > > > > > By the way, if you argue against IPv6 SAA in ad hoc networks, = you > > > > could also argue against IPv6 SAA in general (in wired LANs). = You > > > > wouldn't need that, too, if all (wired) network devices would = have unique, > > > > pre-assigned IPv6 addresses. > > > > > > This is not the solely objctive of SAA. > > > > > > > > > > > Secondly, a hierarchy is established by the architecture = described in the > > > > paper, which can be used by routing protocols to achieve an = improved > > > > scalability (route aggregation...). You wouldn't have this with > > > > preassigned addresses. > > > > > > > > > > That's the point. The site local or global IPv6 address is built = to be unique but also to > > > enable integration of the node in a hierarchical address scheme. > > > In a flat address scheme, a unique EUI-64 address would be = sufficient (except that we are > > > not totally sure it is a unique address). However a flat address = space would imply great > > > complexity in routing tables! So hierarchy in the adress space = is needed and networs are > > > pertitioned in subnetworks. > > > > > > Now, the problem is to define the notion of hierarchy and of subnetwork in ad-hoc networks. > > > There are several proposal but no unique answer to that question. = In a theoretical world, > > > the mechanism proposed in the document seems interesting = (hierarchy depends on topology and > > > may evolve with it). It answers large networks needs. > > > Possibly there are more simple solutions that would answer = smaller topology cases where an > > > a-dhoc network is a falt subnetwork to be integrated in a larger network and adressing plan. > > > > > > Are you more interested in large scale networks ? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Kilian Weniger > > > > > > > > On Tue, 12 Feb 2002, MEDDOUR Djamal Eddine thesard FTRD/DAC/LAN wrote: > > > > > > > > > hi all > > > > > I am reading a paper which talk about Address Allocation with = IPV6 (IPv6 > > > > > Autoconfiguration in Large Scale Mobile Ad Hoc Networks). do = you think > > > > > really that a same scheme is needed?. in IPV6 we have a huge number of IP > > > > > address, we can attribute statically one adresse by node = (when we buy a > > > > > terminal we can buy an IP address with it). > > > > > any comments ? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------= ---- ------------ > > > > Dipl.-Ing. Kilian Weniger phone: (+49)(0)721-608 6415 > > > > Institute of Telematics fax: (+49)(0)721-388097 > > > > Department of Computer Science email: weniger@tm.uni-karlsruhe.de > > > > University of Karlsruhe homepage: http://www.tm.uka.de/~weniger/ > > > > D-76128 Karlsruhe > > > > > > -- > > > Bruno HUSSON > > > Tel : +33 1 46 08 61 92 > > > Fax : +33 1 46 08 61 10 > > > Standard : +33 1 46 08 61 00 > > > e-mail:bruno.husson@sycomore.fr > > > ----------------- > > > SYCOMORE - Groupe EADS > > > Immeuble l'Etendard > > > 63 ter, Avenue Edouard VAILLANT > > > 92517 BOULOGNE-BILLANCOURT > > > http://www.sycomore.fr > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > > > > > > > > > > -- > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------= ---- ------------ > > Dipl.-Ing. Kilian Weniger phone: (+49)(0)721-608 6415 > > Institute of Telematics fax: (+49)(0)721-388097 > > Department of Computer Science email: = weniger@tm.uni-karlsruhe.de > > University of Karlsruhe homepage: http://www.tm.uka.de/~weniger/ > > D-76128 Karlsruhe > > -- > Bruno HUSSON > Tel : +33 1 46 08 61 92 > Fax : +33 1 46 08 61 10 > Standard : +33 1 46 08 61 00 > e-mail:bruno.husson@sycomore.fr > ----------------- > SYCOMORE - Groupe EADS > Immeuble l'Etendard > 63 ter, Avenue Edouard VAILLANT > 92517 BOULOGNE-BILLANCOURT > http://www.sycomore.fr > ------------------------------------------------------ > > --=20 ------------------------------------------------------------------------= ---- ------------ Dipl.-Ing. Kilian Weniger phone: (+49)(0)721-608 6415 Institute of Telematics fax: (+49)(0)721-388097 Department of Computer Science email: weniger@tm.uni-karlsruhe.de University of Karlsruhe homepage: http://www.tm.uka.de/~weniger/ D-76128 Karlsruhe ------_=_NextPart_001_01C1B48E.62D9F1C2 Content-Type: text/html; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable definition of large ad hoc networks

any comments ?


-----Message d'origine-----
De : Kilian Weniger [mailto:weniger@tm.uka.de]
Envoy=E9 : mercredi 13 f=E9vrier 2002 13:58
=C0 : Bruno Husson
Cc : MEDDOUR Djamal Eddine thesard FTRD/DAC/LAN; = CARLINET Yannick
FTRD/DAC/LAN
Objet : Re: Address Allocation with IPV6



From my point of view a large network is a couple of = hundred nodes. You
might have as many nodes in conferences, at = exhibitions, on highways etc.

For example kids in the back of a car want to play = multiplayer-games with
other kids in another car, or you want to exchange = files with other
people in a train.... This would be too expensive = und not free from
interruptions (tunnels,...), if you would use = cellular networks.


Kilian


On Wed, 13 Feb 2002, Bruno Husson wrote:

> Hello Kilian,
>
> What are the use cases of large ad-hoc = networks  you consider as possible ?
> Large ad-hoc networks for which kind of = community :
> - Companies ?
> - public sites like airports, railway stations, = hospitals ?
> - public networks ?
> Have you some example where large ad-hoc = networks would be an interesting solution compared to
> cellular based networks ?
>
>
> Kilian Weniger a =E9crit :
>
> > Hi Bruno,
> >
> > yes, we are also interested in large = networks. We want a system, that
> > scales to a large number of nodes.
> >
> > We claim, that our system can do that. Of = course it also works for small
> > networks. E.g. If the network is so small, = that it has the radius equal
> > or less to the radius of a scope, there is = only one subnet with one leader node.
> > This is equivalent to a simple, flat = address scheme.
> >
> > If nodes also would have unique IPv6 = address, this could be used as global
> > routable address in conjunction with = Mobile IP to connect the ad hoc
> > network to the internet. The site-local = addresses constructed by the IPv6
> > SAA could than be used for the = communication within the ad hoc network
> > (with the benefit of route = aggregation).
> >
> > regards,
> >
> > Kilian Weniger
> >
> > On Tue, 12 Feb 2002, Bruno Husson = wrote:
> >
> > > Hello Kilian and Djamal,
> > >
> > > Kilian Weniger a =E9crit :
> > >
> > > > Hello Djamal,
> > > >
> > > > I have two comments on = that:
> > > >
> > > > Firstly, in your scenario = routing would only work if every existing
> > > > device has an unique IPv6 = address assigned by the manufacturer.
> > >
> > > IPv6 shall not be defined by the = manufacturer. It should be auto-configured or configured by
> > > administrator of the network.
> > >
> > > > This is not the case today and = even
> > > > if EVERY manufacturer would = start doing so at some point of time in the
> > > > future (I don't see any such = effort, yet), there are still
> > > > thousands of devices without = addresses, that were sold before.
> > > > Furthermore, you would need some = sort of central registration, as there is
> > > > for IEEE MAC-addresses. And even = the MAC-addresses are not unique today
> > > > (some manufacturers sell devices = with unregistered MAC-addresses; you can change
> > > > the MAC-address of some = devices,...). So even in the case you would have
> > > > this central registry, you = probably want to have a backup solution to
> > > > guarantee unique = addresses.
> > >
> > > Yes. IPv6 adress may be built based = on MAC address (EUI-64 solution). In that case it has a
> > > good probability to be unique, except = that some devices may have non unique MAC adress for
> > > the reasons you indicate.
> > > So, some detection of duplicate = address (DAD) should be recommanded, except if you work in a
> > > closed environment where your are = sure it is unnecessary (this is not the IETF philosophy).
> > >
> > > >
> > > > By the way, if you argue against = IPv6 SAA in ad hoc networks, you
> > > > could also argue against IPv6 = SAA in general (in wired LANs). You
> > > > wouldn't need that, too, if all = (wired) network devices would have unique,
> > > > pre-assigned IPv6 = addresses.
> > >
> > > This is not the solely objctive of = SAA.
> > >
> > > >
> > > > Secondly, a hierarchy is = established by the architecture described in the
> > > > paper, which can be used by = routing protocols to achieve an improved
> > > > scalability (route = aggregation...). You wouldn't have this with
> > > > preassigned addresses.
> > > >
> > >
> > > That's the point. The site local or = global IPv6 address is built to be unique but also to
> > > enable integration of the node in a = hierarchical address scheme.
> > > In a flat address scheme, a unique = EUI-64 address would be sufficient (except that we are
> > > not totally sure it is a unique = address). However a flat address space would imply great
> > > complexity in routing tables!  = So hierarchy in the adress space is needed and networs are
> > > pertitioned in subnetworks.
> > >
> > > Now, the problem is to define the = notion of hierarchy and of subnetwork in ad-hoc networks.
> > > There are several proposal but no = unique answer to that question. In a theoretical world,
> > > the mechanism proposed in the = document seems interesting (hierarchy depends on topology and
> > > may evolve with it). It answers large = networks needs.
> > > Possibly there are more simple = solutions that would answer smaller topology cases where an
> > > a-dhoc network is a falt subnetwork = to be integrated in a larger network and adressing plan.
> > >
> > > Are you more interested in large = scale networks ?
> > >
> > >
> > > >
> > > > Kilian Weniger
> > > >
> > > > On Tue, 12 Feb 2002, MEDDOUR = Djamal Eddine thesard FTRD/DAC/LAN wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > hi all
> > > > > I am reading a paper which = talk about Address Allocation with IPV6 (IPv6
> > > > > Autoconfiguration in Large = Scale Mobile Ad Hoc Networks). do you think
> > > > > really that a same scheme = is needed?. in IPV6 we have a huge number of IP
> > > > > address, we can attribute = statically one adresse by node (when we buy a
> > > > > terminal we can buy an IP = address with it).
> > > > > any comments ?
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > = ------------------------------------------------------------------------= ----------------
> > > > Dipl.-Ing. Kilian = Weniger           = phone: (+49)(0)721-608 6415
> > > > Institute of = Telematics          &n= bsp;  fax:   (+49)(0)721-388097
> > > > Department of Computer = Science      email: = weniger@tm.uni-karlsruhe.de
> > > > University of = Karlsruhe          &nb= sp;  homepage: http://www.tm.uka.de/~weniger/
> > > > D-76128 Karlsruhe
> > >
> > > --
> > > Bruno HUSSON
> > > Tel : +33 1 46 08 61 92
> > > Fax : +33 1 46 08 61 10
> > > Standard : +33 1 46 08 61 00
> > > = e-mail:bruno.husson@sycomore.fr
> > > -----------------
> > > SYCOMORE - Groupe EADS
> > > Immeuble l'Etendard
> > > 63 ter, Avenue Edouard = VAILLANT
> > > 92517 BOULOGNE-BILLANCOURT
> > > http://www.sycomore.fr
> > > = ------------------------------------------------------
> > >
> > >
> >
> > --
> > = ------------------------------------------------------------------------= ----------------
> > Dipl.-Ing. Kilian = Weniger           = phone: (+49)(0)721-608 6415
> > Institute of = Telematics          &n= bsp;  fax:   (+49)(0)721-388097
> > Department of Computer = Science      email: = weniger@tm.uni-karlsruhe.de
> > University of = Karlsruhe          &nb= sp;  homepage: http://www.tm.uka.de/~weniger/
> > D-76128 Karlsruhe
>
> --
> Bruno HUSSON
> Tel : +33 1 46 08 61 92
> Fax : +33 1 46 08 61 10
> Standard : +33 1 46 08 61 00
> e-mail:bruno.husson@sycomore.fr
> -----------------
> SYCOMORE - Groupe EADS
> Immeuble l'Etendard
> 63 ter, Avenue Edouard VAILLANT
> 92517 BOULOGNE-BILLANCOURT
> http://www.sycomore.fr
> = ------------------------------------------------------
>
>

--
---------------------------------------------------------------= -------------------------
Dipl.-Ing. Kilian = Weniger           = phone: (+49)(0)721-608 6415
Institute of = Telematics          &n= bsp;  fax:   (+49)(0)721-388097
Department of Computer = Science      email: = weniger@tm.uni-karlsruhe.de
University of Karlsruhe =             homepage: = http://www.tm.uka.de/~weniger/
D-76128 Karlsruhe

------_=_NextPart_001_01C1B48E.62D9F1C2-- ------=_NextPartTM-000-3052971a-2016-11d6-b1e5-00508b69ab48-- From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Wed Feb 13 10:36:56 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id KAA07751 for ; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 10:36:56 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id IAA10680 for manet-outgoing; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 08:48:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from gto-mailer1.bbn.com (cam-mailer1.bbn.com [128.33.0.36]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id IAA10668 for ; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 08:48:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from chip.bbn.com (dhcp069-168.bbn.com [128.89.69.168]) by gto-mailer1.bbn.com (8.9.3+Sun/8.9.3) with ESMTP id IAA29163; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 08:48:18 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <5.0.2.1.2.20020213083337.00ab11d0@pop3.norton.antivirus> X-Sender: celliott/po1.bbn.com@pop3.norton.antivirus X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.0.2 Date: Wed, 13 Feb 2002 08:47:10 -0500 To: Kilian Weniger , Rajesh Bhairampally From: Chip Elliott Subject: Re: Asymmetric links Cc: Jonas Nielsen , In-Reply-To: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk It's probably worth worrying about asymmetric links, especially when using spread spectrum radios. Many years ago, an interesting paper described simulations of spread spectrum packet radio networks, in which a surprisingly large number of simplex links were found. For example, using assumptions that seemed plausible to me, the authors calculated that 1/4 to 1/3 of all possible links were simplex, in a few more or less random laydowns. I'm not competent to judge their findings, but I'd be most interested in hearing from anyone that is! "Computer-Aided Modeling of Spread Spectrum Packet Radio Networks," E. Sousa, J. Silvester, T. Papavassiliou, IEEE JSAC, 9-1, January 1991. -- Chip Chip Elliott Principal Engineer, BBN At 08:06 AM 2/13/02, Kilian Weniger wrote: >You can have unidirectional links even if you have enough battery power: > >Firstly, if you use power control alogrithms. This is obvious. >Secondly, interference leads to a decrease of the SNR at the receiver. If >the interference is much higher at one of both receivers, the link >may be unidirectional. > >I guess there are even more examples of situation, which result in >unidirectional links. > > >Kilian > > >On Tue, 12 Feb 2002, Rajesh Bhairampally wrote: > > > I guess asymetry comes with the time; i mean, as the time passes, nodes > > loose energy; different nodes may have different energy losses. so, there > > can be a situation where a node can receive data from another node, but > > it doesn't has sufficient energy levels to send its data to the other > > node. such situations create unidirectional links in the network which > > originally started with bidirectional links. > > > > rajesh > > > > > > On 12 Feb 2002, Jonas Nielsen wrote: > > > > > In some ways DSR is said to be superior to AODV because it supports > > > asymmetric links. But in what scenarios are asymmetric links used. I > > > can only see that either a system is (almost) symmetric or highly > > > assymetric (e.g sattelite communications). > > > > > > > Rajesh > > > >-- >---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >Dipl.-Ing. Kilian Weniger phone: (+49)(0)721-608 6415 >Institute of Telematics fax: (+49)(0)721-388097 >Department of Computer Science email: weniger@tm.uni-karlsruhe.de >University of Karlsruhe homepage: http://www.tm.uka.de/~weniger/ >D-76128 Karlsruhe From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Wed Feb 13 11:07:14 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id LAA09118 for ; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 11:07:14 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id JAA11733 for manet-outgoing; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 09:13:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from hugin.diku.dk (hugin.diku.dk [130.225.96.144]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id JAA11722 for ; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 09:13:07 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 4815 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2002 14:13:05 -0000 Received: from sjofn.diku.dk (jonasn@130.225.96.195) by hugin.diku.dk with QMQP; 13 Feb 2002 14:13:05 -0000 To: Chip Elliott Cc: Kilian Weniger , Rajesh Bhairampally , Subject: Re: Asymmetric links References: <5.0.2.1.2.20020213083337.00ab11d0@pop3.norton.antivirus> From: Jonas Nielsen Date: 13 Feb 2002 15:13:04 +0100 In-Reply-To: <5.0.2.1.2.20020213083337.00ab11d0@pop3.norton.antivirus> Message-ID: Lines: 6 User-Agent: Gnus/5.0808 (Gnus v5.8.8) XEmacs/21.4 (Civil Service) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Thanks for all the answers. What I really want to know is how often simplex links is found in todays "personal" wireless network standards. I'm particulary thinking of 802.11-based networks, but also other technologies like Bluetooth. Any thougts ? From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Wed Feb 13 11:26:11 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id LAA10570 for ; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 11:26:10 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id JAA12830 for manet-outgoing; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 09:31:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from RRMAIL01.RADIOROUTER_NT ([63.103.94.23]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id JAA12822; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 09:31:41 -0500 (EST) Received: by planetajeans.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id <1LTW8C84>; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 09:31:39 -0500 Message-ID: <8C92E23A3E87FB479988285F9E22BE469940D4@ftmail> From: Scott Corson To: "'Yih-Chun Hu'" , Joe Macker Cc: manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Subject: RE: AODV WG Last Call for Comments Date: Wed, 13 Feb 2002 09:31:39 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Yih-Chun, The comments are late. The WG last call closed last Friday and the draft is with the IESG at this time. Still thanks for the input and I will forward these to the ADs for their consideration during IESG review. Thanks, -Scott > -----Original Message----- > From: Yih-Chun Hu [mailto:yihchun@cs.cmu.edu] > Sent: Tuesday, February 12, 2002 6:58 PM > To: Joe Macker > Cc: manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil > Subject: Re: AODV WG Last Call for Comments > > > > Sorry these comments are late. These comments are for the WG > last call of > aodv-10. This draft appears to be a substantial improvement in the > definition of AODV, as it is more clearly and precisely specifies the > protocol. I did find a few problems with the draft as it > stands, and would > like to raise a couple points previously brought up on the list. > > As was mentioned on the list before by Erik Nordstrom (in Message-ID > > on December > 13, 2001), Hello messages don't work with unidirectional links, since > Hello messages can propogate over such links, but packets > can't flow in > the reverse direction. > > Because of the use of NODE_TRAVERSAL_TIME, it seems > inconsistent to allow > any node to hold a packet beyond NODE_TRAVERSAL_TIME (ie a > node buffering > a packet for NODE_TRAVERSAL_TIME MUST drop the packet), and > NODE_TRAVERSAL_TIME should not be a configurable parameter at any node > (needs to be consistant network-wide). > > Any cycle in the network which has aggregate latency > PATH_TRAVERSAL_TIME > could cause the infinite looping of RREQ packets, and each > time the RREQ > goes around this cycle, it would cause another flood of the entire > network, subject to TTL constraints. PATH_TRAVERSAL_TIME > therefore should > be conservatively set to NETWORK_NODES * NODE_TRAVERSAL_TIME. > > The definition of PATH_DISCOVERY_TIME in Section 10 is unparsable. > > This draft does not seem to define a default RREQ_RETRIES, nor does it > provide any guidance on how one might set that particular parameter. > > There may be a node X which has a very dynamic network on one > side of it > and a very static network on the other side of it. It may be > possible for > X to issue 2^31 sequence numbers on the active side between > new sequence > numbers on the static side. This would cause the static side > to believe > that all new sequence numbers were stale for quite a long > period of time, > and possibly preclude routing to X. A more aggressive mechanism for > dealing with wraparound is needed. > > Suppose some node Y has a route to X and sends packets over that route > once per ACTIVE_ROUTE_TIMEOUT. If X reboots, and K sequential > data packets > or corresponding RERRs are lost over the entire path from X > to Y, Y will > be unable to find routes to X until the newly chosen sequence number > becomes greater than Y's current sequence number. > > The draft should give some guidance about the types of > networks for which > AODV is a suitable routing protocol. > > The precursor list is only set in response to RREPs, but > RREQs serve as a > form of RREP in that they create routing state. As a result, precursor > lists SHOULD be set in the sender when an RREQ it propogates > is received. > > In Section 10, the draft allows a node to "possibly [reconfigure] the > HELLO_INTERVAL." This is too vague to be in a specification. Allowing > arbitrary changes to HELLO_INTERVAL is also problematic if a > node does not > always boot to a consistant HELLO_INTERVAL. For example, if a > node X sets > HELLO_INTERVAL to 10s, and advertises it, upstream neighbors > only require > one HELLO within 30s. X reboots and need only wait 5 seconds before it > starts participating in the protocol again. Nodes would no > longer be able > to reach X. > > In Sec 6.2, the draft allows the receipt of AODV control packets to > confirm that a neighbor is still there. Not only does this > suffer the same > problem with unidirectional links as Hello packets, it also is > ill-specified. The language in the draft can be interpreted > to allow an > RREQ that has traversed multiple hops could be used to renew > the neighbor > status of the source of the RREQ. > > From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Wed Feb 13 13:19:11 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id NAA16074 for ; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 13:19:10 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id LAA18672 for manet-outgoing; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 11:14:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from engc.bu.edu (ENGC.BU.EDU [128.197.185.241]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id LAA18667 for ; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 11:13:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost (pbasu@localhost) by engc.bu.edu ((8.9.3.buoit.v1.0)/8.9.3/(BU-W-05/17/2000-v1.1)) with ESMTP id LAA08736; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 11:13:47 -0500 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: engc.bu.edu: pbasu owned process doing -bs Date: Wed, 13 Feb 2002 11:13:47 -0500 (EST) From: Prithwish Basu To: Jonas Nielsen cc: Chip Elliott , Kilian Weniger , Rajesh Bhairampally , Subject: Re: Asymmetric links In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk In our lab environment (and dept corridors) with 802.11 radios (cisco aironet 350 series), we have observed occasional unidirectional links between nodes which are on battery power (with APMD running) and those which are on AC power. This happens at the lowest configurable power level (1mW) usually. This is not a systematic observation but just something which we have observed sometimes.. I wonder if other people have experienced similar behavior. -Prithwish On 13 Feb 2002, Jonas Nielsen wrote: > > Thanks for all the answers. What I really want to know is how often > simplex links is found in todays "personal" wireless network > standards. I'm particulary thinking of 802.11-based networks, but also > other technologies like Bluetooth. Any thougts ? > > From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Wed Feb 13 13:39:18 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id NAA16741 for ; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 13:39:18 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id LAA19821 for manet-outgoing; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 11:31:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from hotmail.com (f232.law14.hotmail.com [64.4.21.232]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id LAA19815 for ; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 11:31:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 08:31:42 -0800 Received: from 131.220.6.172 by lw14fd.law14.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 16:31:42 GMT X-Originating-IP: [131.220.6.172] From: "Richard Miller" To: manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Subject: Re: Address Allocation with IPV6 Date: Wed, 13 Feb 2002 16:31:42 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 13 Feb 2002 16:31:42.0965 (UTC) FILETIME=[EBAFAA50:01C1B4AB] Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Hello list, hello Kilian, would it really be necessary to tie the IPv6 address to the hardware? Rather you could buy your IP address from your (Mobile IP) Service Provider and assign it to whatever device you are currently using. For IP addresses there is already a central registration, namely the IANA. Wouldn't this be the straightforward solution? Related to wired IPv6 SAA, it would still not be obsolete, because it is a convenient means for companies to configure their infrastructure network in a plug and play manner. regards, Richard --- Original Message --- Hello Djamal, I have two comments on that: Firstly, in your scenario routing would only work if every existing device has an unique IPv6 address assigned by the manufacturer. This is not the case today and even if EVERY manufacturer would start doing so at some point of time in the future (I don't see any such effort, yet), there are still thousands of devices without addresses, that were sold before. Furthermore, you would need some sort of central registration, as there is for IEEE MAC-addresses. And even the MAC-addresses are not unique today (some manufacturers sell devices with unregistered MAC-addresses; you can change the MAC-address of some devices,...). So even in the case you would have this central registry, you probably want to have a backup solution to guarantee unique addresses. By the way, if you argue against IPv6 SAA in ad hoc networks, you could also argue against IPv6 SAA in general (in wired LANs). You wouldn't need that, too, if all (wired) network devices would have unique, pre-assigned IPv6 addresses. Secondly, a hierarchy is established by the architecture described in the paper, which can be used by routing protocols to achieve an improved scalability (route aggregation...). You wouldn't have this with preassigned addresses. Kilian Weniger On Tue, 12 Feb 2002, MEDDOUR Djamal Eddine thesard FTRD/DAC/LAN wrote: >hi all >I am reading a paper which talk about Address Allocation with IPV6 (IPv6 >Autoconfiguration in Large Scale Mobile Ad Hoc Networks). do you think >really that a same scheme is needed?. in IPV6 we have a huge number of IP >address, we can attribute statically one adresse by node (when we buy a >terminal we can buy an IP address with it). >any comments ? > > -- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Dipl.-Ing. Kilian Weniger phone: (+49)(0)721-608 6415 Institute of Telematics fax: (+49)(0)721-388097 Department of Computer Science email: weniger@tm.uni-karlsruhe.de University of Karlsruhe homepage: http://www.tm.uka.de/~weniger/ D-76128 Karlsruhe _________________________________________________________________ Join the world’s largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. http://www.hotmail.com From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Wed Feb 13 13:48:34 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id NAA17067 for ; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 13:48:34 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id LAA21322 for manet-outgoing; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 11:54:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from aspen.cs.ucla.edu (Aspen.CS.UCLA.EDU [131.179.120.35]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id LAA21314 for ; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 11:54:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from cs.ucla.edu (ts15-7.dialup.bol.ucla.edu [164.67.25.16]) by aspen.cs.ucla.edu (8.11.2/UCLACS-5.0) with ESMTP id g1DGkju12530; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 08:46:45 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <3C6A9B9F.6296EC47@cs.ucla.edu> Date: Wed, 13 Feb 2002 09:00:15 -0800 From: Mineo Takai X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.79 [en] (WinNT; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jonas Nielsen CC: Chip Elliott , Kilian Weniger , Rajesh Bhairampally , manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Subject: Re: Asymmetric links References: <5.0.2.1.2.20020213083337.00ab11d0@pop3.norton.antivirus> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-2022-jp Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello Jonas, For unicast communication, there should not be a simplex link in 802.11-based networks, because the MAC protocol requires the receiver to transmit ACK back to the sender upon successful data reception. This is regardless of the RTS/CTS option. Mineo Jonas Nielsen wrote: > > Thanks for all the answers. What I really want to know is how often > simplex links is found in todays "personal" wireless network > standards. I'm particulary thinking of 802.11-based networks, but also > other technologies like Bluetooth. Any thougts ? From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Wed Feb 13 14:37:48 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id OAA18646 for ; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 14:37:47 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id MAA22975 for manet-outgoing; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 12:20:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from i4mail.informatik.rwth-aachen.de (i4mail.Informatik.RWTH-Aachen.de [137.226.12.21]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id MAA22967 for ; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 12:20:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from yigit (yigit.informatik.rwth-aachen.de [137.226.12.208]) by i4mail.informatik.rwth-aachen.de (Postfix) with ESMTP id C546228420 for ; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 20:21:16 +0100 (CET) From: "Mesut Günes" To: Subject: Video/Multimedia transmission over ad-hoc networks Date: Wed, 13 Feb 2002 18:20:45 +0100 Organization: Lehrstuhl für Informatik 4, RWTH-Aachen Message-ID: <000001c1b4b2$c5883160$d00ce289@informatik.rwthaachen.de> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Importance: Normal Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by itd.nrl.navy.mil id MAA22971 Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Hello Group, I am searching for material about transmitting video over mobile multihop ad-hoc networks. Can someone help me with advice or papers? With best regards Mesut Günes ----------------------------------------------------------------- __ /\_\ __ __\/_//\ \ /\_\ /::\ \ /:/ / /:/\:\ \ Dipl.-Inform. Mesut Günes /:/ / /:/ /\:\_\ /:/ / /:/ / _\/_/ Chair of Computer Science 4 /:/ / /:/ / /\_\ RWTH Aachen _\/_/ /:/ / /:/ / Office: 4108A /\ \ /:/ / /:/ / \:\ \/:/ / /:/ / Phone: +49 241 8021416 \:\/:/ / /:/ / _ Fax: +49 241 8888220 \::/ / \:\ \/\_\ \/_/ \:\/:/ / email: guenes@informatik.rwth-aachen.de \::/ / http://www-i4.informatik.rwth-aachen.de /::\ \ /:/\:\_\ \/_/\/_/ ----------------------------------------------------------------- From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Wed Feb 13 15:16:27 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id PAA19623 for ; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 15:16:27 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id NAA25970 for manet-outgoing; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 13:15:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from excore1.hns.com (excore.hns.com [139.85.52.104] (may be forged)) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id NAA25963 for ; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 13:15:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from sys8.hns.com (root@sys8.hns.com [139.85.196.4]) by excore1.hns.com (Switch-2.2.0/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id g1DIFYF11399; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 13:15:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from sds14.hns.com (mread@sds14.hns.com [139.85.196.114]) by sys8.hns.com (8.9.3 (PHNE_22672)/8.9.3) with ESMTP id KAA17424; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 10:15:33 -0800 (PST) Received: (from mread@localhost) by sds14.hns.com (8.8.6 (PHNE_17135)/8.8.6) id KAA16435; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 10:15:33 -0800 (PST) From: mread@hns.com (Matt Read) Message-Id: <020213101533.ZM16432@sds14.hns.com> Date: Wed, 13 Feb 2002 10:15:32 -0800 In-Reply-To: Prithwish Basu "Re: Asymmetric links" (Feb 13, 11:13) References: X-generation-compliance: whatever X-Mailer: Z-Mail (5.0.1 04Feb2000) To: Subject: Re: Asymmetric links MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Prithwish, Your description is so familiar that I had to check to make sure you don't work here were I work. :-) We run at 1mW or 5mW, Cisco 350's, "hallway" network, usually AC but sometimes battery, and we occasionally see unidirectional links. It seems random, i.e. not always reproducible, but once it happens the condition usually persists until we move the node. This confirms the idea that it's due to asymmetrical radio propagation/interference. Everyone, AODV breaks when this happens. As a relative newcomer to AODV, please pardon me if this has already been considered, but could the HELLO message include a list of the Neighbors from which the sender has recently heard HELLO's? Then if a node hears a HELLO in which it does not find itself listed, it could assume there is no link and not try to send directly to that node (sending RREQ's instead). (There will be scalability and other issues, of course.) - Matt On Feb 13, 11:13, Prithwish Basu wrote: > Subject: Re: Asymmetric links > > In our lab environment (and dept corridors) with 802.11 radios (cisco > aironet 350 series), we have observed occasional unidirectional links > between nodes which are on battery power (with APMD running) and those > which are on AC power. This happens at the lowest configurable power level > (1mW) usually. > > This is not a systematic observation but just something which we have > observed sometimes.. I wonder if other people have experienced similar > behavior. > > -Prithwish > ________________________________________________________________________ MattRead mread@hns.com 858/452-4608 HughesNetworkSystems SanDiego,CA From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Wed Feb 13 16:07:56 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id QAA20733 for ; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 16:07:55 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id NAA28710 for manet-outgoing; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 13:59:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from mgw-x3.nokia.com (mgw-x3.nokia.com [131.228.20.26]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id NAA28704; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 13:59:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from esvir01nok.ntc.nokia.com (esvir01nokt.ntc.nokia.com [172.21.143.33]) by mgw-x3.nokia.com (Switch-2.1.0/Switch-2.1.0) with ESMTP id g1DJ0Gi28015; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 21:00:16 +0200 (EET) Received: from esebh003.NOE.Nokia.com (unverified) by esvir01nok.ntc.nokia.com (Content Technologies SMTPRS 4.2.5) with ESMTP id ; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 20:59:51 +0200 Received: from mgw.research.nokia.com ([172.21.33.76]) by esebh003.NOE.Nokia.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.3779); Wed, 13 Feb 2002 20:59:28 +0200 Received: from nokia.com (hed058-192.research.nokia.com [172.21.58.192]) by mgw.research.nokia.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id UAA00706; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 20:59:27 +0200 (EET) X-Authentication-Warning: mgw.research.nokia.com: Host hed058-192.research.nokia.com [172.21.58.192] claimed to be nokia.com Message-ID: <3C6AB7DF.90802@nokia.com> Date: Wed, 13 Feb 2002 21:00:47 +0200 From: Manel Guerrero Zapata User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:0.9.5) Gecko/20011023 X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ext Scott Corson CC: "'Yih-Chun Hu'" , Joe Macker , manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Subject: Re: AODV WG Last Call for Comments References: <8C92E23A3E87FB479988285F9E22BE469940D4@ftmail> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-OriginalArrivalTime: 13 Feb 2002 18:59:28.0263 (UTC) FILETIME=[8FD0C970:01C1B4C0] Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi :) I know... I know... I'm also late. :( But, if you are interested in more. Here it comes a couple of comments: COMPARING SEQUENCE NUMBERS ========================== In 6.1 (Maintaining Sequence Numbers), there is a new paragraph about how sequence numbers should be compared. The main idea behind this is that if a sequence number overflows, rounds back to zero. So sequence numbers might be 'reused'. It is like the big hand of a clock. Therefore, to check if a destination sequence number received in an AODV message is stale or not, it checks if it is in the half after or in the half before of the clock's hand. The very same concept that makes that if you know that it's 5 o'clock and your watch says that it is 4 o'clock, you will think you watch is one hour late (but you never think that it is 11 hours advanced). That is not a very bad assumption, until somebody wants to send a packet to us. If it does not have an active route and does not know no sequence number it will use '0' (acording to 6.3 (Generating Route Requests)). It is bad because when we receive it, we have to do the following (from 6.1): "Immediately before a destination node originates a RREP in response to a RREQ, it MUST update its own sequence number to the maximum of its current sequence number and the destination sequence number in the RREQ packet." In the example of the watch, zero would be 12 o'clock. In the new paragraph 'maximum' should be adapted to the watch concept (so we would check if the sdn in the RREQ is stale compared with our own sequence number). But that also means that if it is 7 o'clock and the RREQ comes with 12 o'clock I'll update to 12 o'clock (thinking that my clock is 5 hours late). Which, of course, makes no sense. The problem comes, not from the 'clock alike' system, but from the fact that nobody should tell me which is my sequence number. Especially when I could easely keep track of it. My proposed solution would be (again): 8<-------------------------------------------------- * Every time you modify your sequence number, you store it somewhere. * When you reboot you read the value, and start to operate (who wants to wait for DELETE_PERIOD (15 seconds) ! ) * You increment your own sequence number in the following situations: - Before generating a RREP (being you the final destination) - Before sending a Hello (this can be considered as a specific case of the previos situation) - Before originating a RREQ flood (as it is said in 8.1) * You don't update your destination sequence number believing in what others say. You _know_ which is your sequence number. -------------------------------------------------->8 DELETE PERIOD ============= The default value has changed: "DELETE_PERIOD = K * max (ACTIVE_ROUTE_TIMEOUT, HELLO_INTERVAL) (K = 5 is recommended)." But then, the rest of the text about delete period seems quite contradictory: K seems to play the role of ALLOWED_HELLO_LOSS (although it has a bigger value). But then it should be: max(A_R_T, K * H_I) to make sense with: "If Hello messages are used, then the ACTIVE_ROUTE_TIMEOUT parameter value MUST be more than the value (ALLOWED_HELLO_LOSS * HELLO_INTERVAL)." Best regards, Manel Guerrero Zapata ext Scott Corson wrote: > Yih-Chun, > > The comments are late. The WG last call closed last Friday and the draft is > with the IESG at this time. > > Still thanks for the input and I will forward these to the ADs for their > consideration during IESG review. > > Thanks, > > -Scott From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Wed Feb 13 16:12:33 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id QAA20822 for ; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 16:12:32 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id OAA29132 for manet-outgoing; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 14:06:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from engc.bu.edu (ENGC.BU.EDU [128.197.185.241]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id OAA29120 for ; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 14:06:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost (pbasu@localhost) by engc.bu.edu ((8.9.3.buoit.v1.0)/8.9.3/(BU-W-05/17/2000-v1.1)) with ESMTP id OAA18982; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 14:06:44 -0500 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: engc.bu.edu: pbasu owned process doing -bs Date: Wed, 13 Feb 2002 14:06:44 -0500 (EST) From: Prithwish Basu To: Matt Read cc: Subject: Re: Asymmetric links In-Reply-To: <020213101533.ZM16432@sds14.hns.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Matt, Since 802.11 needs an ACK at the MAC layer for a *unicast* pkt, a unidirectional link won't show up at a higher layer. However, it is indeed possible (as both of us have observed) for broadcast HELLO messages. (A always hears B's broadcast but B never hears A's broadcast when A and B are at certain fixed positions in space) And yes, the condition does persist at times until one moves the node. -Prithwish On Wed, 13 Feb 2002, Matt Read wrote: > Prithwish, > > Your description is so familiar that I had to check to make sure you > don't work here were I work. :-) > > We run at 1mW or 5mW, Cisco 350's, "hallway" network, usually AC but > sometimes battery, and we occasionally see unidirectional links. It > seems random, i.e. not always reproducible, but once it happens the > condition usually persists until we move the node. This confirms the > idea that it's due to asymmetrical radio propagation/interference. > > Everyone, > > AODV breaks when this happens. As a relative newcomer to AODV, > please pardon me if this has already been considered, but could the > HELLO message include a list of the Neighbors from which the sender > has recently heard HELLO's? Then if a node hears a HELLO in which > it does not find itself listed, it could assume there is no link and > not try to send directly to that node (sending RREQ's instead). > (There will be scalability and other issues, of course.) > > - Matt > > > On Feb 13, 11:13, Prithwish Basu wrote: > > Subject: Re: Asymmetric links > > > > In our lab environment (and dept corridors) with 802.11 radios (cisco > > aironet 350 series), we have observed occasional unidirectional links > > between nodes which are on battery power (with APMD running) and those > > which are on AC power. This happens at the lowest configurable power level > > (1mW) usually. > > > > This is not a systematic observation but just something which we have > > observed sometimes.. I wonder if other people have experienced similar > > behavior. > > > > -Prithwish > > > > ________________________________________________________________________ > MattRead mread@hns.com 858/452-4608 HughesNetworkSystems SanDiego,CA > From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Wed Feb 13 16:26:18 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id QAA21740 for ; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 16:26:18 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id OAA00573 for manet-outgoing; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 14:29:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from pit.erg.sri.com (pit.erg.sri.com [128.18.100.28]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id OAA00563 for ; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 14:29:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from pit.erg.sri.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pit.erg.sri.com (8.9.3+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id LAA14509; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 11:28:04 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <200202131928.LAA14509@pit.erg.sri.com> To: Mahesh Marina cc: "'ogier@erg.sri.com'" , "Samir R. Das" , manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Reply-To: ogier@erg.sri.com From: ogier@erg.sri.com Subject: Re: performance comparaison between Ad Hoc routing protocols In-reply-to: Your message of "Thu, 07 Feb 2002 11:41:19 EST." Date: Wed, 13 Feb 2002 11:28:04 -0800 Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk On Thu, 7 Feb 2002 Mahesh Marina wrote: > Your simulation results for AODV somehow were way off from what I have > observed in the past. I was one of the people involved in the development > of AODV code for ns2. > > You mention that the link-layer notification was turned off in your > evaluations. I assumed that HELLOs were instead used for link > detection/failure in AODV as well and looked at the piece of code for > handling HELLOs. > I found that neighbor deletion (and therefore, link failure > detection) was commented out inadvertently, perhaps during > debugging. As most of our performance studies used link-layer feedback, > this bug didn't show up. So, I was wondering whether AODV results would be > same without this bug. I reran the ns-2 simulations for AODV with the above fix, which improved the performance of AODV substantially in the mobile scenarios (but not in the non-mobile scenarios). To ensure fairness with TBRPF and OLSR, I also commented out the following code in AODV so that no protocol is allowed to retrieve packets from the interface queue (ifqueue): // Not sure whether this is the right thing to do Packet *pkt; while((pkt = ifqueue->filter(ih->saddr()))) { drop(pkt, DROP_RTR_MAC_CALLBACK); (The above comment is by one of the AODV programmers, not me.) The simulation results can be found at the TBRPF web site: http://www.erg.sri.com/projects/tbrpf/ The results are summarized below. Comments are welcome. Note that TBRPF code for ns-2.1b8 is now available. Protocols compared: - AODV code for ns-2.1b8 Available from http://www.cs.ucsb.edu/~eroyer/aodv.html - TBRPF code for ns-2.1b8 Available from http://www.erg.sri.com/projects/tbrpf/sourcecode.html Uses the same 'C' code as our Linux implementation - OLSR code for ns-2.1b7 Available from http://hipercom.inria.fr/olsr/ Bug affecting packet size was fixed. - In all protocols, link-layer failure notification was NOT used, and packets could not be retrieved from the link layer (interface queue). Simulation model: - ns-2 version 2.1b8 - WaveLAN IEEE 802.11 MAC with rate 2Mb/s and range 250m - 50 and 100 nodes - Two area sizes: 670m x 670m and 1500m x 300m - Mobility model: No mobility, and random waypoint model with 0 pause time and maximum speed 20 m/s. - 20 simultaneous CBR traffic streams: - Source and destination of each stream are selected randomly - Duration of each stream is 30 seconds - Size of each data packet is 512 bytes - Packet generation rate per stream is increased from 2 to 8 packets/s - Each simulation was run for 500 simulated seconds. Summary of results: - In every scenario, TBRPF achieved a higher delivery percentage (up to 15% higher) than OLSR. TBRPF also achieved a higher delivery percentage (up to 15% higher) than AODV in all scenarios with no mobility, and in all scenarios using the square area (670x670) with the lower packet rates (2 and 4 packets/s). For the long rectangular area (1500x300), AODV achieved a higher delivery percentage (up to 5% higher) than TBRPF. - In every scenario, TBRPF generated less routing control traffic than the other protocols: up to 60% less than OLSR and up to 48% less than AODV. This is despite the fact that TBRPF sends HELLOs twice as frequently as OLSR. - In every scenario, TBRPF used the shortest paths (except nearly shortest in some cases with the higher packet rates). In every scenario, AODV used paths that were 12-20% longer on average than TBRPF. - TBRPF usually had the best or nearly best delay. Remarks: - This study did not use link-layer failure notification. It is important to also compare the protocols with link-layer notification, since this allows one to achieve a delivery fraction close to 100%. - A comparison of TBRPF with AODV using link-layer notification can also be found at the TBRPF web site. That comparison also compares the protocols with 40 sources (which gives TBRPF more advantage). - A routing protocol that generates less control traffic and uses shorter paths: - uses less energy, - is more likely to scale to a larger number of nodes, - is more likely to perform well in lower bandwidth radios such as those used by the military. ----------------------- Richard Ogier Sr. Research Engineer SRI International 333 Ravenswood Ave. Menlo Park, CA 94025 Tel: 650-859-4216 Fax: 650-859-4812 Email: ogier@erg.sri.com ------------------------ From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Wed Feb 13 17:41:25 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id RAA23239 for ; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 17:41:25 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id PAA05526 for manet-outgoing; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 15:54:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from koa.erg.sri.com (koa.erg.sri.com [128.18.100.14]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id PAA05492 for ; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 15:54:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from koa.erg.sri.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by koa.erg.sri.com (8.9.3+Sun/8.9.0) with ESMTP id MAA25942; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 12:50:23 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <200202132050.MAA25942@koa.erg.sri.com> To: mread@hns.com (Matt Read) cc: manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil, ogier@erg.sri.com Reply-To: ogier@erg.sri.com From: ogier@erg.sri.com Subject: Re: Asymmetric links In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 13 Feb 2002 10:15:32 PST." <020213101533.ZM16432@sds14.hns.com> Date: Wed, 13 Feb 2002 12:50:23 -0800 Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Matt, > Everyone, > > AODV breaks when this happens. As a relative newcomer to AODV, > please pardon me if this has already been considered, but could the > HELLO message include a list of the Neighbors from which the sender > has recently heard HELLO's? Then if a node hears a HELLO in which > it does not find itself listed, it could assume there is no link and > not try to send directly to that node (sending RREQ's instead). > (There will be scalability and other issues, of course.) > > - Matt Yes, by including a list of all neighbors in each HELLO, a node can detect when a bidirectional link has become unidirectional. This is what OSPF and OLSR do. But a more efficient way is to use differential HELLOs (as in TBRPF), so that each HELLO contains only the neighbors whose states have recently changed. Perhaps AODV should also use differential HELLOs. Richard From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Wed Feb 13 19:29:49 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id TAA24846 for ; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 19:29:49 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id RAA09362 for manet-outgoing; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 17:23:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailg.telia.com (mailg.telia.com [194.22.194.26]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id RAA09357 for ; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 17:23:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from d1o848.telia.com (d1o848.telia.com [213.66.32.241]) by mailg.telia.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g1DMN4m25653; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 23:23:04 +0100 (CET) Received: from h144n2fls31o848.telia.com (h144n2fls31o848.telia.com [213.67.152.144]) by d1o848.telia.com (8.10.2/8.10.1) with ESMTP id g1DMN3A14735; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 23:23:04 +0100 (CET) Subject: Re: Asymmetric links (+AODV-UU 0.2) From: Erik =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Nordstr=F6m?= To: Matt Read Cc: MANET LIST In-Reply-To: <020213101533.ZM16432@sds14.hns.com> References: <020213101533.ZM16432@sds14.hns.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 X-Mailer: Evolution/1.0.2 Date: 13 Feb 2002 23:23:03 +0100 Message-Id: <1013638984.3982.54.camel@Replicator> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by itd.nrl.navy.mil id RAA09358 Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Hi Matt + others. Comments below. On Wed, 2002-02-13 at 19:15, Matt Read wrote: > Prithwish, > > Your description is so familiar that I had to check to make sure you > don't work here were I work. :-) > > We run at 1mW or 5mW, Cisco 350's, "hallway" network, usually AC but > sometimes battery, and we occasionally see unidirectional links. It > seems random, i.e. not always reproducible, but once it happens the > condition usually persists until we move the node. This confirms the > idea that it's due to asymmetrical radio propagation/interference. > > Everyone, > > AODV breaks when this happens. As a relative newcomer to AODV, > please pardon me if this has already been considered, but could the > HELLO message include a list of the Neighbors from which the sender > has recently heard HELLO's? Then if a node hears a HELLO in which > it does not find itself listed, it could assume there is no link and > not try to send directly to that node (sending RREQ's instead). > (There will be scalability and other issues, of course.) > I have also experienced unidirectional links during testing of my AODV implementation. My implementation already include the feature/idea you are requesting. The code, which just has been released in version 0.2, can be downloaded from http://www.docs.uu.se/~henrikl/aodv/. /Erik Nordström From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Wed Feb 13 19:56:42 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id TAA25090 for ; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 19:56:42 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id SAA10703 for manet-outgoing; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 18:01:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from excore1.hns.com (excore.hns.com [139.85.52.104] (may be forged)) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id SAA10698 for ; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 18:01:12 -0500 (EST) From: pohanlon@hns.com Received: from atlas (atlas.hns.com [139.85.177.110]) by excore1.hns.com (Switch-2.2.0/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id g1DN1BP09083 for ; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 18:01:11 -0500 (EST) Subject: Difficulty implementing a gateway node for a peer-to-peer ad hoc network using AODV routing To: manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Release 5.0.8 June 18, 2001 Message-ID: Date: Wed, 13 Feb 2002 15:06:46 -0800 X-MIMETrack: Serialize by Router on Atlas/HNS(Release 5.0.8 |June 18, 2001) at 02/13/2002 05:59:42 PM MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Hi all, I am trying to connect a network of ad hoc nodes (running in peer-to-peer mode using AODV routing) to our company intranet using a 'gateway node'. This 'gateway node' contains 2 network interfaces : - 1 wireless (802.11) for speaking to the ad hoc nodes (hereafter referred to as GN-eth-802.11), and - 1 wired (802.3 i.e. regular ethernet) for speaking to the company intranet (hereafter referred to as GN-eth-802.3). Below is a rough ASCII sketch of the arrangement : 'gateway node' ----------- 802.11 ---------------------------------------------------- 802.3 -------------------------------- | Client | <----------> | GN-eth-802.11 | GN -eth-802.3 | <----------> | Company Intranet | ----------- ---------------------------------------------------- -------------------------------- After booting the gateway node and a client node (but before enabling the AODV routing), I can ping from the client node to all of the following successfully i.e. Client ---------------------> GN-eth-802.11 (successful) Client -------------------------------------------------> GN-eth-802.3 (successful) Client -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------> Company intranet (successful) However, after starting up AODV, the client node can still reach the wireless interface of the gateway node (GN-eth-802.11), but can no longer reach the wired interface of the gateway node (GN-eth-802.3) or the company intranet i.e. Client ---------------------> GN-eth-802.11 (successful) Client -------------------------------------XXX---------> GN-eth-802.3 (NOTsuccessful) Client -------------------------------------XXX----------------------------------------------------> Company intranet (NOT successful) It seems that as soon as I 'insmod' the AODV routing module, it breaks the connection to the wired segment fo the network. I looked at the kernel IP routing table (using the 'route' command) and can see that the AODV module has updated the kernel IP routing table (which is to be expected for the wireless 802.11 ethX interface). However, after 'insmod'ing the AODV routing module, some of the routing entries for the wired 802.3 ethX interface also seem to have been modified / deleted. I have tried looking at the differences and manually adding some of the desired route entries using the 'route add' command, but have so far been unsuccessful in reconnecting the wired part of the network once AODV is running. So finally ;-) , my questions are : - has anyone successfully configured a 'gateway node' with both wired and wireless network interfaces, and where AODV routing is used for the ad hoc nodes running in peer-to peer mode ? - is this a configuration issue, or does installing the AODV module change something else in addition to modifying the kernel IP routing table ? - is there another (better or easier) way of implementing a gateway node for connecting a wired network to a wireless network running AODV, OPERATING IN PEER-TO-PEER MODE (since the ad hoc nodes are running in peer-to-peer mode, I can't just use a COTS wireless router operating in infrastructure mode) ? Any advice / information much appreciated. Thanks. - Piers. From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Thu Feb 14 00:22:05 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id AAA03551 for ; Thu, 14 Feb 2002 00:22:05 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id WAA15918 for manet-outgoing; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 22:18:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from ubik.vipul.net (munitions2.xs4all.nl [194.109.217.74]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id WAA15899 for ; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 22:18:48 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <8C92E23A3E87FB479988285F9E22BE464BB3AD@ftmail> From: Scott Corson To: "'Phil Neumiller'" , manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil, seamoby@ietf.org Date: Mon, 21 Jan 2002 10:05:46 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Subject: [Seamoby] RE: Terminology Draft Needed X-Mailman-Version: 1.0 List-Id: Context Transfer, Handoff Candidate Discovery, and Dormant Mode Host Alerting X-BeenThere: seamoby@ietf.org Status: RO X-UID: 816 Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk > I have seen Charlie pull out the terminology draft at least a > few times! :-) Why can't > some WG chair in SeaMoby or MANET adopt it as WG draft? I cannot see this being a MANET draft, far too many non-MANET concepts involved. As far as Seamoby effectively bridging between MIP and MANET, it seems reasonable. IMO the best-baked architectural notion within Seamoby is the notion of an AR, its discovery and possible subsequent CT between ARs. The AR stands at the edge of a domain, and mobile hosts (MIP) or routers (MANET or MONET?) seeking access to the domain do so via an AR...the AR and consequently Seamoby forms a natural bridge. As for the terminology draft, if included in Seamoby, IMO it needs to be simplified and clarified big time. For example, it needs deletion of irrelevant/unclear IP architectural elements (e.g. APs, ANs, ANRs, ANGs) and all references thereto/implications thereof. * APs are layer 2 elements (need I say more?) * Access Network Routers (ANR) are IP routers (presumably fixed)...Are these notably different from non-access network routers? Perhaps they run a different routing algorithm, but what of it? Perhaps they do not! * Moreover, what is an Access Network?...the doc says it's an IP network full of ANRs? This is a bit circular! If the ANRs are normal IP routers (and they well could be), then the definition of the AN is completely and suddenly vacuous...POOF!!! ;-) * Access Network Gateway (ANG) is just another name for a gateway router. To my way of thinking, at IP such an "access network" is just a routed domain, accessed at the edge via access routers and interfaced to the core thru some gateway router functionality. No new terms are (yet) needed. If you think differently, either you have truly invented something new and I'd love to hear about it, or you are probably too buried in L2 specifics to see clearly. ;-) My 2 cents...for starters, just delete the whole notion of an Access Network until this can be meaningfully defined at IP layer and differentiated from existing IP terminology. Presently, whereever the text addresses the issue of an "access network", the related definitions (e.g. relating to handoff) break down as they implicitly assume certain L2 architectures and capabilities. These assumptions do not apply in the general case of IP mobility or hold for all L2 technologies. There's plenty more that could be said as well. But, without wasting more time, on the whole I think this document is mostly a waste of time. Whilst specific terminology drafts may be of value (such as the recently suggested MIP/Security Terminology harmonization draft), IMO these all-things-to-all-people drafts try to overreach and are generally not worth bother. -Scott _______________________________________________ Seamoby mailing list Seamoby@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/seamoby From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Thu Feb 14 00:22:06 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id AAA03563 for ; Thu, 14 Feb 2002 00:22:05 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id WAA15897 for manet-outgoing; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 22:18:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from ubik.vipul.net (munitions2.xs4all.nl [194.109.217.74]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id WAA15878 for ; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 22:18:44 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <003f01c19e9b$91d4b3c0$6200000a@meshnetworks.com> From: "Phil Neumiller" To: , Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2002 09:39:14 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Seamoby] Terminology Draft Needed X-Mailman-Version: 1.0 List-Id: Context Transfer, Handoff Candidate Discovery, and Dormant Mode Host Alerting X-BeenThere: seamoby@ietf.org Status: RO X-UID: 602 Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi, I have seen Charlie pull out the terminology draft at least a few times! :-) Why can't some WG chair in SeaMoby or MANET adopt it as WG draft? http://people.nokia.net/~charliep/txt/seamoby/term.txt It seems that many times arguments are over terminology. IMO, I would like to the SeaMoby WG become a bridge between MANET and MIP technologies, especially with respect to AR discovery and CT. This terminology draft would make a very nice addition to the SeaMoby WG draft list. Best regards, Phil _______________________________________________ Seamoby mailing list Seamoby@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/seamoby From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Thu Feb 14 00:22:09 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id AAA03575 for ; Thu, 14 Feb 2002 00:22:09 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id WAA15908 for manet-outgoing; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 22:18:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from ubik.vipul.net (munitions2.xs4all.nl [194.109.217.74]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id WAA15884 for ; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 22:18:45 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <3C46817A.16871520@informatik.uni-ulm.de> Date: Thu, 17 Jan 2002 08:47:06 +0100 From: Frank Kargl Organization: University of Ulm, Germany X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.77 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en,de MIME-Version: 1.0 To: manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil, seamoby@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Seamoby] Terminology Draft Needed References: <3C45C3D0.8D24D969@iprg.nokia.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailman-Version: 1.0 List-Id: Context Transfer, Handoff Candidate Discovery, and Dormant Mode Host Alerting X-BeenThere: seamoby@ietf.org Status: RO X-UID: 628 Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi Charlie, "Charles E. Perkins" wrote: > This is a good idea. Where can we find a list of the acceptable > security terminology to incorporate into the terminology draft? There are many such compilations in the web, e.g.: http://www.securitypanel.org/glossary.html http://www.certmag.com/issues/jul01/securityterms.cfm http://www.setsolutions.com/security.htm As MANET and Security is one of my focal points of interest, I would gladly volunteer to compile such a security glossary. The important point is how extensive such a glossary should be. Either we focus on terms that are directly related to MANETs/Mobility or we try to compile a glossary on everything that relates to security in general. I think that only the first approach makes sense. Ciao ... Frank -- ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Frank Kargl Multimedia Computing, University of Ulm, Germany Mail:frank.kargl@informatik.uni-ulm.de http://www.uni-ulm.de/~fkargl/ ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Use the SOURCE, Luke ! I feel a great disturbance in the SOURCE. But beware of the Microsoft side of the SOURCE ! _______________________________________________ Seamoby mailing list Seamoby@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/seamoby From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Thu Feb 14 00:22:14 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id AAA03588 for ; Thu, 14 Feb 2002 00:22:14 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id WAA15873 for manet-outgoing; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 22:18:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from ubik.vipul.net (munitions2.xs4all.nl [194.109.217.74]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id WAA15868 for ; Wed, 13 Feb 2002 22:18:33 -0500 (EST) X-mProtect: Wed, 16 Jan 2002 10:17:53 -0800 Nokia Silicon Valley Messaging Protection Message-ID: <3C45C3D0.8D24D969@iprg.nokia.com> Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2002 10:17:52 -0800 From: "Charles E. Perkins" Organization: Nokia Research Center X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; FreeBSD 3.4-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Pat R. Calhoun" CC: "'Phil Neumiller'" , manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil, seamoby@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Seamoby] Terminology Draft Needed References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailman-Version: 1.0 List-Id: Context Transfer, Handoff Candidate Discovery, and Dormant Mode Host Alerting X-BeenThere: seamoby@ietf.org Status: RO X-UID: 611 Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello folks, This is a good idea. Where can we find a list of the acceptable security terminology to incorporate into the terminology draft? Regards, Charlie P. > "Pat R. Calhoun" wrote: > > > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- > Hash: SHA1 > > I brought this topic up with the ADs again yesterday, and there seems > to be agreement that such a document is necessary. However, it would > be useful if this document also included the security terminology > that we use, since it conflicts with some of the terms used WGs in > other areas (e.g. IPSec). > > PatC > > - -----Original Message----- > From: Phil Neumiller [mailto:pneumiller@meshnetworks.com] > Sent: Wednesday, January 16, 2002 6:39 AM > To: manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil; seamoby@ietf.org > Subject: [Seamoby] Terminology Draft Needed > > Hi, > > I have seen Charlie pull out the terminology draft at least a few > times! :-) Why can't > some WG chair in SeaMoby or MANET adopt it as WG draft? > > http://people.nokia.net/~charliep/txt/seamoby/term.txt > > It seems that many times arguments are over terminology. IMO, I > would like to > the SeaMoby WG become a bridge between MANET and MIP technologies, > especially with respect to AR discovery and CT. This terminology > draft would make a very nice addition to the SeaMoby WG draft list. > > Best regards, > > Phil > > _______________________________________________ > Seamoby mailing list > Seamoby@ietf.org > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/seamoby > > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- > Version: PGPfreeware 7.0.3 for non-commercial use > > iQA/AwUBPEWp+DN1fXKoxmisEQKpKwCgsuQlnVlOxREcl5hKPmD76ZrjI74AoLNh > bL1hxFHUR1waVYM8pGeJbZW/ > =JrHd > -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- _______________________________________________ Seamoby mailing list Seamoby@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/seamoby From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Thu Feb 14 06:45:48 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id GAA15409 for ; Thu, 14 Feb 2002 06:45:47 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id EAA23249 for manet-outgoing; Thu, 14 Feb 2002 04:39:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from iraun2.uka.de (iraun2.uka.de [129.13.10.91]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id EAA23244 for ; Thu, 14 Feb 2002 04:39:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from irams1.ira.uka.de ([129.13.10.5]) by iraun2.uka.de with esmtp (Exim 3.30 #7 (Debian)) id 16bIMF-0006NA-00; Thu, 14 Feb 2002 10:39:15 +0100 Received: from i72pc238.tm.uni-karlsruhe.de ([141.3.70.72] helo=i72pc238.tm.uka.de) by irams1.ira.uka.de with esmtp (Exim 3.30 #7 (Debian)) id 16bIMF-0001NE-00; Thu, 14 Feb 2002 10:39:15 +0100 Received: from localhost (weniger@localhost) by i72pc238.tm.uka.de (8.11.6/8.11.2) with ESMTP id g1E9dF827278; Thu, 14 Feb 2002 10:39:15 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: i72pc238.tm.uka.de: weniger owned process doing -bs Date: Thu, 14 Feb 2002 10:39:15 +0100 (CET) From: Kilian Weniger To: Richard Miller cc: Subject: Re: Address Allocation with IPV6 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Hello Richard, even if you would have this possiblity of buying a permanent IP address, you probably also want a independent plug-and-play solution for spontaneous networking scenarios without internet connection. (Independent in terms of being able to communicate in an ad hoc network even if you don't have a contract with a Service Provider.) By the way, I don't think that it's a good solution, that users have to reconfigure the IP stack each time they change their devices. At least they should have an seperate IP address for each device, which would be quite expensive and you would have to remember several IP addresses. And you also don't have the possiblity of hierarchical routing within the ad hoc network with pre-assigned addresses. I would prefer a self-organizing, autoconfiguring and independent (from any commercial organizations) ad hoc network. If I want to access the internet via Mobile IP, I get a routable address assigned by the FA (e.g. as described in draft-wakikawa-manet-globalv6-00.txt) and, potentially, use the IP address bought from a Mobile IP Service Provider as Home Address. This would be a device-independent plug-and-play solution for internet access. regards, Kilian On Wed, 13 Feb 2002, Richard Miller wrote: > Hello list, hello Kilian, > > would it really be necessary to tie the IPv6 address to the hardware? > Rather you could buy your IP address from your (Mobile IP) Service Provider > and assign it to whatever device you are currently using. For IP addresses > there is already a central registration, namely the IANA. Wouldn't this be > the straightforward solution? > > Related to wired IPv6 SAA, it would still not be obsolete, because it is > a convenient means for companies to configure their infrastructure network > in a plug and play manner. > > regards, > Richard > > --- Original Message --- > > Hello Djamal, > > I have two comments on that: > > Firstly, in your scenario routing would only work if every existing > device has an unique IPv6 address assigned by the manufacturer. > This is not the case today and even > if EVERY manufacturer would start doing so at some point of time in the > future (I don't see any such effort, yet), there are still > thousands of devices without addresses, that were sold before. > Furthermore, you would need some sort of central registration, as there is > for IEEE MAC-addresses. And even the MAC-addresses are not unique today > (some manufacturers sell devices with unregistered MAC-addresses; you can > change > the MAC-address of some devices,...). So even in the case you would have > this central registry, you probably want to have a backup solution to > guarantee unique addresses. > > By the way, if you argue against IPv6 SAA in ad hoc networks, you > could also argue against IPv6 SAA in general (in wired LANs). You > wouldn't need that, too, if all (wired) network devices would have unique, > pre-assigned IPv6 addresses. > > Secondly, a hierarchy is established by the architecture described in the > paper, which can be used by routing protocols to achieve an improved > scalability (route aggregation...). You wouldn't have this with > preassigned addresses. > > > Kilian Weniger > > > On Tue, 12 Feb 2002, MEDDOUR Djamal Eddine thesard FTRD/DAC/LAN wrote: > > > >hi all > >I am reading a paper which talk about Address Allocation with IPV6 (IPv6 > >Autoconfiguration in Large Scale Mobile Ad Hoc Networks). do you think > >really that a same scheme is needed?. in IPV6 we have a huge number of IP > >address, we can attribute statically one adresse by node (when we buy a > >terminal we can buy an IP address with it). > >any comments ? > > > > > > > -- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Dipl.-Ing. Kilian Weniger phone: (+49)(0)721-608 6415 Institute of Telematics fax: (+49)(0)721-388097 Department of Computer Science email: weniger@tm.uni-karlsruhe.de University of Karlsruhe homepage: http://www.tm.uka.de/~weniger/ D-76128 Karlsruhe From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Thu Feb 14 06:45:57 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id GAA15420 for ; Thu, 14 Feb 2002 06:45:57 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id EAA23294 for manet-outgoing; Thu, 14 Feb 2002 04:41:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from iraun2.uka.de (iraun2.uka.de [129.13.10.91]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id EAA23289 for ; Thu, 14 Feb 2002 04:41:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from irams1.ira.uka.de ([129.13.10.5]) by iraun2.uka.de with esmtp (Exim 3.30 #7 (Debian)) id 16bIO5-0006Nh-00 for ; Thu, 14 Feb 2002 10:41:10 +0100 Received: from i72pc238.tm.uni-karlsruhe.de ([141.3.70.72] helo=i72pc238.tm.uka.de) by irams1.ira.uka.de with esmtp (Exim 3.30 #7 (Debian)) id 16bIO5-0001PS-00 for ; Thu, 14 Feb 2002 10:41:09 +0100 Received: from localhost (weniger@localhost) by i72pc238.tm.uka.de (8.11.6/8.11.2) with ESMTP id g1E9f9327294 for ; Thu, 14 Feb 2002 10:41:09 +0100 X-Authentication-Warning: i72pc238.tm.uka.de: weniger owned process doing -bs Date: Thu, 14 Feb 2002 10:41:09 +0100 (CET) From: Kilian Weniger To: Subject: Minutes of 52nd IETF MANET WG meeting? Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Hi all, Why are there no minutes and/or slides available of the last (52nd) IETF MANET meeting? http://www.ietf.org/proceedings/01dec/index.html Kilian Weniger -- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Dipl.-Ing. Kilian Weniger phone: (+49)(0)721-608 6415 Institute of Telematics fax: (+49)(0)721-388097 Department of Computer Science email: weniger@tm.uni-karlsruhe.de University of Karlsruhe homepage: http://www.tm.uka.de/~weniger/ D-76128 Karlsruhe From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Thu Feb 14 06:48:42 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id GAA15477 for ; Thu, 14 Feb 2002 06:48:42 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id EAA23509 for manet-outgoing; Thu, 14 Feb 2002 04:56:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from givenchy ([212.234.238.114]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id EAA23504 for ; Thu, 14 Feb 2002 04:56:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from intranet.6wind.com (intranet.6wind.com [10.0.0.113]) by givenchy (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0E3B386F for ; Thu, 14 Feb 2002 12:04:50 +0100 (CET) Received: from 6wind.com (faberge [10.16.0.79]) by intranet.6wind.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0AC7FB502 for ; Thu, 14 Feb 2002 04:01:12 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <3C6B8A3D.231A0CF@6wind.com> Date: Thu, 14 Feb 2002 10:58:21 +0100 From: JMG Organization: 6WIND X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.75 [en] (Windows NT 5.0; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Subject: Re: Difficulty implementing a gateway node for a peer-to-peer ad hoc networkusing AODV routing References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Hello, It seems that the problem is how to inject a defaut route for ad hoc nodes to reach a fixed network. Is this question has already been discussed in the working group ? In Piers's case, is there a way to configure AODV on the gateway node to advertise "I'm the default gateway" ? Is it specific to on-demand routing protocols or is it the same for proactive protocols like OLSR ? thanks Jean-Mickaël pohanlon@hns.com wrote: > Hi all, > > I am trying to connect a network of ad hoc nodes (running in peer-to-peer > mode using AODV routing) to our company intranet using a 'gateway node'. > This 'gateway node' contains 2 network interfaces : > - 1 wireless (802.11) for speaking to the ad hoc nodes (hereafter referred > to as GN-eth-802.11), and > - 1 wired (802.3 i.e. regular ethernet) for speaking to the company > intranet (hereafter referred to as GN-eth-802.3). > > Below is a rough ASCII sketch of the arrangement : > > 'gateway > node' > ----------- 802.11 > ---------------------------------------------------- 802.3 > -------------------------------- > | Client | <----------> | GN-eth-802.11 | GN -eth-802.3 | > <----------> | Company Intranet | > ----------- > ---------------------------------------------------- > -------------------------------- > > After booting the gateway node and a client node (but before enabling the > AODV routing), I can ping from the client node to all of the following > successfully i.e. > > Client ---------------------> GN-eth-802.11 > (successful) > Client -------------------------------------------------> GN-eth-802.3 > (successful) > Client > -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------> > > Company intranet (successful) > > However, after starting up AODV, the client node can still reach the > wireless interface of the gateway node (GN-eth-802.11), but can no longer > reach the wired interface of the gateway node (GN-eth-802.3) or the company > intranet i.e. > > Client ---------------------> GN-eth-802.11 > (successful) > Client -------------------------------------XXX---------> GN-eth-802.3 > (NOTsuccessful) > Client > -------------------------------------XXX----------------------------------------------------> > > Company intranet (NOT successful) > > It seems that as soon as I 'insmod' the AODV routing module, it breaks the > connection to the wired segment fo the network. I looked at the kernel IP > routing table (using the 'route' command) and can see that the AODV module > has updated the kernel IP routing table (which is to be expected for the > wireless 802.11 ethX interface). However, after 'insmod'ing the AODV > routing module, some of the routing entries for the wired 802.3 ethX > interface also seem to have been modified / deleted. I have tried looking > at the differences and manually adding some of the desired route entries > using the 'route add' command, but have so far been unsuccessful in > reconnecting the wired part of the network once AODV is running. > > So finally ;-) , my questions are : > > - has anyone successfully configured a 'gateway node' with both wired and > wireless network interfaces, and where AODV routing is used for the ad hoc > nodes running in peer-to peer mode ? > > - is this a configuration issue, or does installing the AODV module change > something else in addition to modifying the kernel IP routing table ? > > - is there another (better or easier) way of implementing a gateway node > for connecting a wired network to a wireless network running AODV, > OPERATING IN PEER-TO-PEER MODE (since the ad hoc nodes are running in > peer-to-peer mode, I can't just use a COTS wireless router operating in > infrastructure mode) ? > > Any advice / information much appreciated. > > Thanks. > > - Piers. From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Thu Feb 14 07:11:58 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id HAA16151 for ; Thu, 14 Feb 2002 07:11:58 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id FAA24075 for manet-outgoing; Thu, 14 Feb 2002 05:21:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from maild.telia.com (maild.telia.com [194.22.190.101]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id FAA24070 for ; Thu, 14 Feb 2002 05:21:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from d1o848.telia.com (d1o848.telia.com [213.66.32.241]) by maild.telia.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g1EALE605730; Thu, 14 Feb 2002 11:21:14 +0100 (CET) Received: from h144n2fls31o848.telia.com (h144n2fls31o848.telia.com [213.67.152.144]) by d1o848.telia.com (8.10.2/8.10.1) with ESMTP id g1EALDA12139; Thu, 14 Feb 2002 11:21:14 +0100 (CET) Subject: Re: Difficulty implementing a gateway node for a peer-to-peer ad hoc network using AODV routing From: Erik =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Nordstr=F6m?= To: pohanlon@hns.com Cc: MANET LIST In-Reply-To: References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 X-Mailer: Evolution/1.0.2 Date: 14 Feb 2002 11:21:13 +0100 Message-Id: <1013682074.1506.17.camel@Replicator> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by itd.nrl.navy.mil id FAA24071 Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Hello Piers. AODV currently does not define a way to do "Internet gatewaying". The main problem has to do with the way subnets should be handled in an ad-hoc network. The AODV draft says that nodes should be able to have IP addresses belonging to different subnets, but they should still be able to communicate directly. This clearly breaks the subnet idea of "traditional" IP routing and makes Internet gatewaying impossible. Apparently, the way to do this is a MANET problem, something not decided on yet. However, there exists a few drafts on how to connect an ad-hoc network to the Internet. I don't know which implementation of AODV you are using, but it sounds like "kernel-aodv". I don't think that implementation has any Internet gateway support. If you want to experiment, you could try the AODV-UU implementation (version 0.2) which has experimental Internet gateway support. This feature is implemented with the restriction that nodes should be configured with IP-addresses on the same subnet. http://www.docs.uu.se/~henrikl/aodv/ Otherwise I would recommend using LUNAR, which is a bit more robust, but are created for smaller networks of up to around 10 nodes. http://www.docs.uu.se/docs/research/projects/selnet/lunar/ I hope this answers your questions. /Erik Nordström, Uppsala University. On Thu, 2002-02-14 at 00:06, pohanlon@hns.com wrote: > Hi all, > > I am trying to connect a network of ad hoc nodes (running in peer-to-peer > mode using AODV routing) to our company intranet using a 'gateway node'. > This 'gateway node' contains 2 network interfaces : > - 1 wireless (802.11) for speaking to the ad hoc nodes (hereafter referred > to as GN-eth-802.11), and > - 1 wired (802.3 i.e. regular ethernet) for speaking to the company > intranet (hereafter referred to as GN-eth-802.3). > > Below is a rough ASCII sketch of the arrangement : > > 'gateway > node' > ----------- 802.11 > ---------------------------------------------------- 802.3 > -------------------------------- > | Client | <----------> | GN-eth-802.11 | GN -eth-802.3 | > <----------> | Company Intranet | > ----------- > ---------------------------------------------------- > -------------------------------- > > After booting the gateway node and a client node (but before enabling the > AODV routing), I can ping from the client node to all of the following > successfully i.e. > > Client ---------------------> GN-eth-802.11 > (successful) > Client -------------------------------------------------> GN-eth-802.3 > (successful) > Client > -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------> > > Company intranet (successful) > > > However, after starting up AODV, the client node can still reach the > wireless interface of the gateway node (GN-eth-802.11), but can no longer > reach the wired interface of the gateway node (GN-eth-802.3) or the company > intranet i.e. > > Client ---------------------> GN-eth-802.11 > (successful) > Client -------------------------------------XXX---------> GN-eth-802.3 > (NOTsuccessful) > Client > -------------------------------------XXX----------------------------------------------------> > > Company intranet (NOT successful) > > > It seems that as soon as I 'insmod' the AODV routing module, it breaks the > connection to the wired segment fo the network. I looked at the kernel IP > routing table (using the 'route' command) and can see that the AODV module > has updated the kernel IP routing table (which is to be expected for the > wireless 802.11 ethX interface). However, after 'insmod'ing the AODV > routing module, some of the routing entries for the wired 802.3 ethX > interface also seem to have been modified / deleted. I have tried looking > at the differences and manually adding some of the desired route entries > using the 'route add' command, but have so far been unsuccessful in > reconnecting the wired part of the network once AODV is running. > > So finally ;-) , my questions are : > > - has anyone successfully configured a 'gateway node' with both wired and > wireless network interfaces, and where AODV routing is used for the ad hoc > nodes running in peer-to peer mode ? > > - is this a configuration issue, or does installing the AODV module change > something else in addition to modifying the kernel IP routing table ? > > - is there another (better or easier) way of implementing a gateway node > for connecting a wired network to a wireless network running AODV, > OPERATING IN PEER-TO-PEER MODE (since the ad hoc nodes are running in > peer-to-peer mode, I can't just use a COTS wireless router operating in > infrastructure mode) ? > > Any advice / information much appreciated. > > Thanks. > > - Piers. > > > > > > > > > From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Thu Feb 14 12:05:06 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id MAA27796 for ; Thu, 14 Feb 2002 12:05:06 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id KAA03179 for manet-outgoing; Thu, 14 Feb 2002 10:02:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from p-mail2.rd.francetelecom.com (p-mail2.rd.francetelecom.com [193.49.124.32]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id KAA03164 for ; Thu, 14 Feb 2002 10:02:53 -0500 (EST) Received: by p-voyageur.rd.francetelecom.fr with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id <1M41019F>; Thu, 14 Feb 2002 16:02:32 +0100 Message-ID: <0489A7888F080B4BA73B53F7E145F29A022D7C@LANMHS20.rd.francetelecom.fr> From: MEDDOUR Djamal Eddine thesard FTRD/DAC/LAN To: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?=27Erik_Nordstr=F6m=27?= , pohanlon@hns.com Cc: MANET LIST Subject: RE: Difficulty implementing a gateway node for a peer-to-peer ad hoc network using AODV routing Date: Thu, 14 Feb 2002 16:02:43 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----=_NextPartTM-000-3052b1cd-2016-11d6-b1e5-00508b69ab48" Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. ------=_NextPartTM-000-3052b1cd-2016-11d6-b1e5-00508b69ab48 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C1B568.A7C5EE4A" ------_=_NextPart_001_01C1B568.A7C5EE4A Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable hi all I think that we must define a communicationinterface between your = gateway and internet independently of the routing protocol which we use. there = is some studies which talk about this problem.=20 we can find perhaps some indication in :=20 or : http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-wakikawa-manet-globalv6-00.txt= www.public.iastate.edu/~magico/Files_Pubs/LCN-ClusterGateway.pdf=20 best regards djamal eddine -----Message d'origine----- De : Erik Nordstr=F6m [mailto:erno3431@student.uu.se] Envoy=E9 : jeudi 14 f=E9vrier 2002 11:21 =C0 : pohanlon@hns.com Cc : MANET LIST Objet : Re: Difficulty implementing a gateway node for a peer-to-peer = ad hoc network using AODV routing Hello Piers. AODV currently does not define a way to do "Internet gatewaying". The main problem has to do with the way subnets should be handled in an ad-hoc network. The AODV draft says that nodes should be able to have = IP addresses belonging to different subnets, but they should still be able to communicate directly. This clearly breaks the subnet idea of "traditional" IP routing and makes Internet gatewaying impossible. Apparently, the way to do this is a MANET problem, something not = decided on yet. However, there exists a few drafts on how to connect an ad-hoc network to the Internet. I don't know which implementation of AODV you are using, but it sounds like "kernel-aodv". I don't think that implementation has any Internet gateway support. If you want to experiment, you could try the AODV-UU implementation (version 0.2) which has experimental Internet gateway support. This feature is implemented with the restriction that nodes should be configured with IP-addresses on the same subnet. http://www.docs.uu.se/~henrikl/aodv/ Otherwise I would recommend using LUNAR, which is a bit more robust, = but are created for smaller networks of up to around 10 nodes. http://www.docs.uu.se/docs/research/projects/selnet/lunar/ I hope this answers your questions. /Erik Nordstr=F6m,=20 Uppsala University. On Thu, 2002-02-14 at 00:06, pohanlon@hns.com wrote: > Hi all, >=20 > I am trying to connect a network of ad hoc nodes (running in = peer-to-peer > mode using AODV routing) to our company intranet using a 'gateway = node'. > This 'gateway node' contains 2 network interfaces : > - 1 wireless (802.11) for speaking to the ad hoc nodes (hereafter = referred > to as GN-eth-802.11), and > - 1 wired (802.3 i.e. regular ethernet) for speaking to the company > intranet (hereafter referred to as GN-eth-802.3). >=20 > Below is a rough ASCII sketch of the arrangement : >=20 > = 'gateway > node' > ----------- 802.11 > ---------------------------------------------------- 802.3 > -------------------------------- > | Client | <----------> | GN-eth-802.11 | GN = -eth-802.3 | > <----------> | Company Intranet | > ----------- > ---------------------------------------------------- > -------------------------------- >=20 > After booting the gateway node and a client node (but before enabling = the > AODV routing), I can ping from the client node to all of the = following > successfully i.e. >=20 > Client ---------------------> GN-eth-802.11 > (successful) > Client -------------------------------------------------> = GN-eth-802.3 > (successful) > Client > ------------------------------------------------------------------------= ---- -------------------> >=20 > Company intranet (successful) >=20 >=20 > However, after starting up AODV, the client node can still reach the > wireless interface of the gateway node (GN-eth-802.11), but can no = longer > reach the wired interface of the gateway node (GN-eth-802.3) or the company > intranet i.e. >=20 > Client ---------------------> GN-eth-802.11 > (successful) > Client -------------------------------------XXX---------> = GN-eth-802.3 > (NOTsuccessful) > Client > -------------------------------------XXX--------------------------------= ---- ----------------> >=20 > Company intranet (NOT successful) >=20 >=20 > It seems that as soon as I 'insmod' the AODV routing module, it = breaks the > connection to the wired segment fo the network. I looked at the = kernel IP > routing table (using the 'route' command) and can see that the AODV = module > has updated the kernel IP routing table (which is to be expected for = the > wireless 802.11 ethX interface). However, after 'insmod'ing the AODV > routing module, some of the routing entries for the wired 802.3 ethX > interface also seem to have been modified / deleted. I have tried = looking > at the differences and manually adding some of the desired route = entries > using the 'route add' command, but have so far been unsuccessful in > reconnecting the wired part of the network once AODV is running. >=20 > So finally ;-) , my questions are : >=20 > - has anyone successfully configured a 'gateway node' with both wired = and > wireless network interfaces, and where AODV routing is used for the = ad hoc > nodes running in peer-to peer mode ? >=20 > - is this a configuration issue, or does installing the AODV module = change > something else in addition to modifying the kernel IP routing table ? >=20 > - is there another (better or easier) way of implementing a gateway = node > for connecting a wired network to a wireless network running AODV, > OPERATING IN PEER-TO-PEER MODE (since the ad hoc nodes are running in > peer-to-peer mode, I can't just use a COTS wireless router operating = in > infrastructure mode) ? >=20 > Any advice / information much appreciated. >=20 > Thanks. >=20 > - Piers. >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 ------_=_NextPart_001_01C1B568.A7C5EE4A Content-Type: text/html; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable RE: Difficulty implementing a gateway node for a peer-to-peer ad = hoc network using AODV routing

hi all
I think that we must define a communicationinterface = between your gateway and internet independently of the routing protocol = which we use. there is some studies which talk about this problem. =

we can find perhaps some indication in :
or : http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-wakikawa-man= et-globalv6-00.txt
     = www.public.iastate.edu/~magico/Files_Pubs/LCN-ClusterGateway.pdf =

best regards
djamal eddine


-----Message d'origine-----
De : Erik Nordstr=F6m [mailto:erno3431@student.uu.se= ]
Envoy=E9 : jeudi 14 f=E9vrier 2002 11:21
=C0 : pohanlon@hns.com
Cc : MANET LIST
Objet : Re: Difficulty implementing a gateway node = for a peer-to-peer ad
hoc network using AODV routing


Hello Piers.

AODV currently does not define a way to do = "Internet gatewaying". The
main problem has to do with the way subnets should = be handled in an
ad-hoc network. The AODV draft says that nodes = should be able to have IP
addresses belonging to different subnets, but they = should still be able
to communicate directly. This clearly breaks the = subnet idea of
"traditional" IP routing and makes = Internet gatewaying impossible.
Apparently, the way to do this is a MANET problem, = something not decided
on yet. However, there exists a few drafts on how to = connect an ad-hoc
network to the Internet.

I don't know which implementation of AODV you are = using, but it sounds
like "kernel-aodv". I don't think that = implementation has any Internet
gateway support.

If you want to experiment, you could try the AODV-UU = implementation
(version 0.2) which has experimental Internet = gateway support. This
feature is implemented with the restriction that = nodes should be
configured with IP-addresses on the same = subnet.

http://www.docs.uu.se/~henrikl/aodv/

Otherwise I would recommend using LUNAR, which is a = bit more robust, but
are created for smaller networks of up to around 10 = nodes.

http://www.docs.uu.se/docs/research/projects/selnet/lu= nar/

I hope this answers your questions.

/Erik Nordstr=F6m,

Uppsala University.



On Thu, 2002-02-14 at 00:06, pohanlon@hns.com = wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> I am trying to connect a network of ad hoc = nodes (running in peer-to-peer
> mode using AODV routing) to our company = intranet using a 'gateway node'.
> This 'gateway node' contains 2 network = interfaces :
> - 1 wireless (802.11) for speaking to the ad = hoc nodes (hereafter referred
> to as GN-eth-802.11), and
> - 1 wired (802.3 i.e. regular ethernet) for = speaking to the company
> intranet (hereafter referred to as = GN-eth-802.3).
>
> Below is a rough ASCII sketch of the = arrangement :
>
>          = ;            = ;            = ;            = ;            = ;        'gateway
> node'
>      = -----------       802.11
> = ----------------------------------------------------   &n= bsp;      802.3
> --------------------------------
>      | Client = |    <---------->   |  = GN-eth-802.11   |   GN -eth-802.3   = |
> <---------->   |  Company = Intranet   |
>      = -----------
> = ----------------------------------------------------
> --------------------------------
>
> After booting the gateway node and a client = node (but before enabling the
> AODV routing), I can ping from the client node = to all of the following
> successfully i.e.
>
> Client   = --------------------->  GN-eth-802.11
> (successful)
> Client   = ------------------------------------------------->  = GN-eth-802.3
> (successful)
> Client
> = ------------------------------------------------------------------------= ----------------------->
>
> Company intranet    = (successful)
>
>
> However, after starting up AODV, the client = node can still reach the
> wireless interface of the gateway node = (GN-eth-802.11), but can no longer
> reach the wired interface of the gateway node = (GN-eth-802.3) or the company
> intranet i.e.
>
> Client   = --------------------->  GN-eth-802.11
> (successful)
> Client   = -------------------------------------XXX--------->  = GN-eth-802.3
> (NOTsuccessful)
> Client
> = -------------------------------------XXX--------------------------------= -------------------->
>
> Company intranet    (NOT = successful)
>
>
> It seems that as soon as I 'insmod' the AODV = routing module, it breaks the
> connection to the wired segment fo the = network.  I looked at the kernel IP
> routing table (using the 'route' command) and = can see that the AODV module
> has updated the kernel IP routing table (which = is to be expected for the
> wireless 802.11 ethX interface).  However, = after 'insmod'ing the AODV
> routing module, some of the routing entries for = the wired 802.3 ethX
> interface also seem to have been modified / = deleted.  I have tried looking
> at the differences and manually adding some of = the desired route entries
> using the 'route add' command, but have so far = been unsuccessful in
> reconnecting the wired part of the network once = AODV is running.
>
> So finally ;-) , my questions are :
>
> - has anyone successfully configured a 'gateway = node' with both wired and
> wireless network interfaces, and where AODV = routing is used for the ad hoc
> nodes running in peer-to peer mode ?
>
> - is this a configuration issue, or does = installing the AODV module change
> something else in addition to modifying the = kernel IP routing table ?
>
> - is there another (better or easier) way of = implementing a gateway node
> for connecting a wired network to a wireless = network running AODV,
> OPERATING IN PEER-TO-PEER MODE (since the ad = hoc nodes are running in
> peer-to-peer mode, I can't just use a COTS = wireless router operating in
> infrastructure mode) ?
>
> Any advice / information much = appreciated.
>
> Thanks.
>
> - Piers.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

------_=_NextPart_001_01C1B568.A7C5EE4A-- ------=_NextPartTM-000-3052b1cd-2016-11d6-b1e5-00508b69ab48-- From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Thu Feb 14 12:06:25 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id MAA27835 for ; Thu, 14 Feb 2002 12:06:25 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id JAA02121 for manet-outgoing; Thu, 14 Feb 2002 09:43:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp2.cluster.oleane.net (smtp2.cluster.oleane.net [195.25.12.17]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id JAA02113 for ; Thu, 14 Feb 2002 09:43:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from oleane (AMontsouris-103-2-1-199.abo.wanadoo.fr [193.252.199.199]) by smtp2.cluster.oleane.net with SMTP id g1EEh2T09074 for ; Thu, 14 Feb 2002 15:43:02 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <00a201c1b565$80a054c0$2a01a8c0@oleane.com> From: "Peter Lewis" To: Subject: Mobile Ad Hoc Networks '02 Date: Thu, 14 Feb 2002 15:38:48 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0099_01C1B56D.B1C7AB40" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0099_01C1B56D.B1C7AB40 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Mobile Ad Hoc Networks '02, to take place in Paris, France, from March 5 = to 8, 2002, will bring answers and enlightenment to all these questions = through the presentations of leading-edge researchers in the domain.=20 http://www.upperside.fr/adhoc/adhocintro.htm ------=_NextPart_000_0099_01C1B56D.B1C7AB40 Content-Type: text/html; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Mobile Ad Hoc Networks '02, to take place in = Paris, France, from March 5 = to 8,=20 2002, will bring answers and enlightenment to all these questions = through=20 the presentations of leading-edge researchers in the domain. =
http://www.uppersid= e.fr/adhoc/adhocintro.htm
 
 
------=_NextPart_000_0099_01C1B56D.B1C7AB40-- From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Thu Feb 14 14:12:47 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id OAA06790 for ; Thu, 14 Feb 2002 14:12:47 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id LAA08325 for manet-outgoing; Thu, 14 Feb 2002 11:44:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from web21007.mail.yahoo.com (web21007.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.227.61]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id LAA08320 for ; Thu, 14 Feb 2002 11:43:57 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <20020214164353.75508.qmail@web21007.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [65.88.242.115] by web21007.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Thu, 14 Feb 2002 08:43:53 PST Date: Thu, 14 Feb 2002 08:43:53 -0800 (PST) From: Yang Xiao Reply-To: YangXiao@ieee.org Subject: CFP-Deadline correction To: YangXiao@ieee.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk My apologies if you receive this CFP duplicated. ------------------- Call for Papers- Deadline correction Invited Session Title: Modeling, Analysis, and Simulation of Wireless LANs and Mobile Ad Hoc Networks and QoS Issues Invited Session in the 6th World Multi-Conference on Systemics, Cybernetics and Informatics, (SCI 2002) Orlando, Florida, USA, July 14 -18, 2002 Topics of Interest Wireless LANs & Mobile Ad Hoc Networks (not limited to) Simulation, Modeling and performance evaluation of Wireless LANs, such as IEEE 802.11, HIPERLAN, and Ad hoc Networks. Quality-of-service issues in Wireless LANs (IEEE 802.11e, HIPERLAN/2, etc.) and Ad Hoc Networks. Power Consumption issues Higher data rates 3G/4G-WLAN Differentiated Services for Wireless LANs Co-existence of the IEEE 802.11 and 802.15 Resource Management Analytical methods. Deadlines Submission of Extended Abstracts: February 17, 2002 Notification of Acceptance: March 10, 2002 Camera Ready Copies: April 03, 2002 Session Co-Organizers/co-chairs Dr. Yang Xiao, Micro Linear, USA Dr. Bin Wang, Wright State University, USA Instructions For Submission Submission should be in the form of extended abstracts up to 4 pages long. All submitted contributions will be subject to peer review on the basis of technical correctness, quality, relevance, originality, significance, and clarity. Abstracts should be in MS Word, PDF or PS format. Submissions should be sent to the session's co-organizers. Successful submissions will be asked to submit a full paper. Full papers must be formatted according to IEEE-CS guidelines Electronic Submission: Dr. Yang Xiao: YangXiao@IEEE.ORG Dr. Bin Wang: bwang@cs.wright.edu For more details check at http://www.iiis.org/sci2002/ last updated 02/11/02 __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Send FREE Valentine eCards with Yahoo! Greetings! http://greetings.yahoo.com From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Thu Feb 14 22:18:40 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id WAA16508 for ; Thu, 14 Feb 2002 22:18:40 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id TAA26529 for manet-outgoing; Thu, 14 Feb 2002 19:57:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from raisin.bbn.com (raisin.bbn.com [128.89.80.35]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id TAA26524 for ; Thu, 14 Feb 2002 19:57:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from bbn.com (localhost.bbn.com [127.0.0.1]) by raisin.bbn.com (8.11.1/8.11.1) with ESMTP id g1F0qX149009 for ; Thu, 14 Feb 2002 19:52:33 -0500 (EST) (envelope-from csantiva@bbn.com) Message-ID: <3C6C5BD1.5BC4ED0E@bbn.com> Date: Thu, 14 Feb 2002 19:52:33 -0500 From: Cesar Santivanez Organization: BBN Technologies (a Verizon's unit) X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.76 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 4.2-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: manet Subject: [Fwd: performance comparaison between Ad Hoc routing protocols] Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------8D43B08AD0541A306FEDC759" Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------8D43B08AD0541A306FEDC759 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I am resending this e-mail, since for some reason it did not get posted ... Cesar --------------8D43B08AD0541A306FEDC759 Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline X-Mozilla-Status2: 00000000 Message-ID: <3C62930A.EA3DD0DB@bbn.com> Date: Thu, 07 Feb 2002 09:45:30 -0500 From: Cesar Santivanez Organization: BBN Technologies (a Verizon's unit) X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.76 [en] (X11; U; FreeBSD 4.2-RELEASE i386) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ogier@erg.sri.com CC: manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Subject: Re: performance comparaison between Ad Hoc routing protocols References: <200202070302.TAA16858@den.erg.sri.com> Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------5A1E9F96CEEF78A8B6E43B71" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------5A1E9F96CEEF78A8B6E43B71 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi Richard, ogier@erg.sri.com wrote: > One problem with total overhead is that it is highly dependent on the > amount of data traffic sent, whereas routing control traffic is often > fairly independent of this. That is the whole point .... Routing protocols should be mobility and traffic sensitive ... As the bandwidth and data traffic increase, the `relative cost' of the control overhead decreases... There is an inherent trade off between control overhead and sub-optimal routng cost. Scalability analysis has shown that best peformance can be achieved when these two sources of overhead (or cost) are kept balanced. This means that if we allow data traffic demands to increase, then we should also let the `control overhead' to increase accordingly ... Now, dynamic adaptation to mobility and traffic may sound far fetch now, but it is something to explore in the future... For the time being, I would suggest to tune protocols to minimize the `total overhead' at the maximum expected traffic load ... This way your protocol will work efficiently when you need this efficiency the most, while under light load -- in most cases -- we may not care about expending extra control overhead bits since we have bandwidth to spare ... > > There are many instances in my experience where a mechanism that takes more > > overhead ends up doing better in terms of user metrics. > > I'm not sure if you mean "total overhead" here. I think Ram was referring to `control overhead' here ... > But since the min-hop path is not always the best path, it is certainly > possible for a protocol to perform better by using longer paths > (and thus more total overhead). Yeap.. Specially since `better' may mean less delay, less jitter, etc. What the `total overhead' metric gives you is an indication of the amount of capacity left for data traffic. So, gives you the `potencial' for data transmission. > Full flooding also achieves better > reliability by using more total overhead than other flooding mechanisms. Well, the `total overhead' framework assumes that the network layer provides reliable transmissions, that is, that never gives up until a packet reaches its destination. Thus, for efficient flooding techniques's total overhead's computation you would have to consider all the retransmissions required until getting the data packet to its intended destination. So, the total overhead assumes the `reliable' version (e.g. using network layer ACKs) of the protocols. > And the following example, in which neither of the two disjoint paths > from 1 to 4 uses a min-hop path, shows that sometimes throughput can be > increased by using more total overhead: > > 5-6 > / \ > / \ > 1 - 2 - 3 - 4 > \ / > \ / > 6-7 > Well, this is not the whole history ... Total overhead relates to remaining capacity, but for ALL the possible flows. You are assuming that only flow 1 --> 4 has traffic to sent, and I agree that in such a particular scenario you'll be better off with load balancing over least interfering paths. But if you consider the maximum combined rates of all the flows ( 1->6, 1 -> 7, 2 ->6, 2->7, etc.) you will see that the protocol with less total overhead is the one that achieves greater total throughput (granted, there are fairness issues -- specially in the presence of bottleneck links -- so we are not maximazing the minimum flow throughput here). So, if you are sure what traffic pattern you have, to may beat the total overhead design criteria. But if you are assuming that all flows are potentially possible, a better desing criteria would be to minimize the expected total overhead ... The total overhead metric allow for tractable models to be derived. It is not perfect since it ignores fairness issues (as well as the effect of bottleneck links) by assigning the same cost to all transmissions as oppose to assigning a smaller cost to transmission over `unused' areas of the network (due to the inherent assumption that the network load is high and diverse -- several flows -- and all areas of the network are going to be used). I'll be more than happy to discuss/explore better metrics that addresses the `total overhead' shortcomings while still allowing for meaningful tractable models to be developed... Regards Cesar > Richard > > > For a more formal treatment of TOTAL OVERHEAD, see > > > > Making Link State Routing Scale for Ad Hoc Networks, in Mobihoc 2001 by > > C. Santivanez et al > > > > On the Scalability of Routing for Ad Hoc Networks, to appear in Infocom 2002, > > by C. Santivanez et al > > > > > > > - is more likely to perform well in lower bandwidth radios such > > > as those used by the military. > > > > > > > > > ----------------------- > > > Richard Ogier > > > Sr. Research Engineer > > > SRI International > > > 333 Ravenswood Ave. > > > Menlo Park, CA 94025 > > > Tel: 650-859-4216 > > > Fax: 650-859-4812 > > > Email: ogier@erg.sri.com > > > ------------------------ > > > > > --------------5A1E9F96CEEF78A8B6E43B71 Content-Type: text/x-vcard; charset=us-ascii; name="csantiva.vcf" Content-Description: Card for Cesar Santivanez Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="csantiva.vcf" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit begin:vcard n:Santivanez;Cesar x-mozilla-html:FALSE org:BBN Technologies (A Verizon's unit);Internetwork research adr:;;;;;; version:2.1 email;internet:csantiva@bbn.com title:Network Scientist x-mozilla-cpt:;0 fn:Cesar Santivanez end:vcard --------------5A1E9F96CEEF78A8B6E43B71-- --------------8D43B08AD0541A306FEDC759 Content-Type: text/x-vcard; charset=us-ascii; name="csantiva.vcf" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Description: Card for Cesar Santivanez Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="csantiva.vcf" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit begin:vcard n:Santivanez;Cesar x-mozilla-html:FALSE org:BBN Technologies (A Verizon's unit);Internetwork research adr:;;;;;; version:2.1 email;internet:csantiva@bbn.com title:Network Scientist x-mozilla-cpt:;-29376 fn:Cesar Santivanez end:vcard --------------8D43B08AD0541A306FEDC759-- From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Fri Feb 15 05:16:40 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id FAA01411 for ; Fri, 15 Feb 2002 05:16:40 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id CAA02372 for manet-outgoing; Fri, 15 Feb 2002 02:53:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from imc21.ex.nus.edu.sg (imc21.ex.nus.edu.sg [137.132.14.62]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id CAA02367; Fri, 15 Feb 2002 02:53:07 -0500 (EST) Received: by imc21.ex.nus.edu.sg with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Fri, 15 Feb 2002 15:53:06 +0800 Message-ID: <9C4C56CDF89E0440A6BD571E76D2387F01484325@exs23.ex.nus.edu.sg> From: Marwaha Shivanajay To: manet , manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Subject: Sending rate in wireless Date: Fri, 15 Feb 2002 15:53:06 +0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk I have a query that the data rate using 802.11 & 802.11b are 2Mbps & 11Mbps respectively, but what is the packet size and sending rate (that is packets sent per second) to achieve the above rates. Also, can someone guide me as to how to implement 802.11b using NS2, cuz presently it has only 802.11 Thanking you. Yours sincerely, Shivanajay Marwaha ~-~~-~~-~~-~-~-~-~ RS, ECE Dept, NUS. www.nus.edu.sg ~-~~-~~-~~-~-~-~-~ From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Fri Feb 15 14:24:40 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id OAA16618 for ; Fri, 15 Feb 2002 14:24:40 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id MAA16993 for manet-outgoing; Fri, 15 Feb 2002 12:03:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from motgate3.mot.com (motgate3.mot.com [144.189.100.103]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id MAA16985 for ; Fri, 15 Feb 2002 12:02:59 -0500 (EST) Received: [from mothost.mot.com (mothost.mot.com [129.188.137.101]) by motgate3.mot.com (motgate3 2.1) with ESMTP id JAA08166 for ; Fri, 15 Feb 2002 09:52:10 -0700 (MST)] Received: [from brc9exm01.ipsg.mot.com (brc9exm01.ipsg.mot.com [138.242.16.16]) by mothost.mot.com (MOT-mothost 2.0) with ESMTP id KAA10456; Fri, 15 Feb 2002 10:02:48 -0700 (MST)] Received: by brc9exm01.ipsg.mot.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2654.52) id <1KCHG6KL>; Fri, 15 Feb 2002 09:02:48 -0800 Message-ID: From: Brown Warren-YMDI110 To: "'Marwaha Shivanajay'" , manet , manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Subject: RE: Sending rate in wireless Date: Fri, 15 Feb 2002 09:02:41 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2654.52) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk I believe this refers to the raw bit transfer rate at the physical layer. eg similar to 100 Mbps for 802.3 Ethernet. Warren Brown -----Original Message----- From: Marwaha Shivanajay [mailto:engp1609@nus.edu.sg] Sent: Thursday, February 14, 2002 11:53 PM To: manet; manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Subject: Sending rate in wireless I have a query that the data rate using 802.11 & 802.11b are 2Mbps & 11Mbps respectively, but what is the packet size and sending rate (that is packets sent per second) to achieve the above rates. Also, can someone guide me as to how to implement 802.11b using NS2, cuz presently it has only 802.11 Thanking you. Yours sincerely, Shivanajay Marwaha ~-~~-~~-~~-~-~-~-~ RS, ECE Dept, NUS. www.nus.edu.sg ~-~~-~~-~~-~-~-~-~ From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Fri Feb 15 16:48:39 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id QAA20774 for ; Fri, 15 Feb 2002 16:48:39 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id OAA24788 for manet-outgoing; Fri, 15 Feb 2002 14:46:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from SEXTANT.itd.nrl.navy.mil (sextant.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.92.22]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id OAA24782; Fri, 15 Feb 2002 14:46:03 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <5.0.1.4.2.20020215145309.0392bf48@pop.itd.nrl.navy.mil> X-Sender: macker@pop.itd.nrl.navy.mil X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.0.1 Date: Fri, 15 Feb 2002 14:55:23 -0500 To: Brown Warren-YMDI110 , "'Marwaha Shivanajay'" , manet , manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil From: Joe Macker Subject: RE: Sending rate in wireless In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Please move this and similar discussion/replies to the ns-user mailing list. -Joe At 09:02 AM 2/15/2002 -0800, Brown Warren-YMDI110 wrote: >I believe this refers to the raw bit transfer rate at the physical layer. eg similar to 100 Mbps for 802.3 Ethernet. > >Warren Brown > > >-----Original Message----- >From: Marwaha Shivanajay [mailto:engp1609@nus.edu.sg] >Sent: Thursday, February 14, 2002 11:53 PM >To: manet; manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil >Subject: Sending rate in wireless > > > >I have a query that the data rate using 802.11 & 802.11b are 2Mbps & 11Mbps >respectively, but what is the packet size and sending rate (that is packets >sent per second) to achieve the above rates. >Also, can someone guide me as to how to implement 802.11b using NS2, cuz >presently it has only 802.11 > >Thanking you. > >Yours sincerely, >Shivanajay Marwaha From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Fri Feb 15 16:48:43 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id QAA20787 for ; Fri, 15 Feb 2002 16:48:43 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id OAA25139 for manet-outgoing; Fri, 15 Feb 2002 14:54:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from sfo.erg.sri.com (sfo.erg.sri.com [128.18.4.100] (may be forged)) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id OAA25132 for ; Fri, 15 Feb 2002 14:54:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from erg.sri.com (walleye.erg.sri.com [128.18.4.214]) by sfo.erg.sri.com (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id LAA12965; Fri, 15 Feb 2002 11:48:20 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <3C6D674B.90231DB2@erg.sri.com> Date: Fri, 15 Feb 2002 11:53:47 -0800 From: "Fred L. Templin" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.76 [en] (WinNT; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: manet CC: templin@erg.sri.com Subject: Intra-Site Automatic Tunnel Addressing Protocol (ISATAP) References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello, I would like to announce the following draft that proposes an IPv6 transition mechanism which may be of general interest to MANET. This draft is currently a working group item in the IETF NGTRANS WG, and specifies mechanisms for dealing with NBMA link layers that draw parallels to certain architectural considerations for MANET. Please note that I am cross-posting this from the IETF NGTRANS mailing list where the draft is currently undergoing active discussion. Please direct any comments you may have to both lists. Fred Templin templin@erg.sri.com "Intra-Site Automatic Tunnel Addressing Protocol (ISATAP)", F. Templin, et.al., 01/30/2002 http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-ngtrans-isatap-03.txt This document specifies the Intra-Site Automatic Tunnel Addressing Protocol (ISATAP) that connects IPv6 hosts and routers (nodes) within IPv4 sites. ISATAP is a transition mechanism that enables incremental deployment of IPv6 by treating the site's IPv4 infrastructure as a Non-Broadcast Multiple Access (NBMA) link layer. From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Fri Feb 15 16:51:39 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id QAA20840 for ; Fri, 15 Feb 2002 16:51:39 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id PAA25368 for manet-outgoing; Fri, 15 Feb 2002 15:00:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from sfo.erg.sri.com (sfo.erg.sri.com [128.18.4.100] (may be forged)) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id OAA25356 for ; Fri, 15 Feb 2002 14:59:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from erg.sri.com (walleye.erg.sri.com [128.18.4.214]) by sfo.erg.sri.com (8.9.1/8.9.1) with ESMTP id LAA13009; Fri, 15 Feb 2002 11:53:39 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <3C6D688A.99BF07C6@erg.sri.com> Date: Fri, 15 Feb 2002 11:59:06 -0800 From: "Fred L. Templin" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.76 [en] (WinNT; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: manet CC: templin@erg.sri.com Subject: Fast Convergence Extension for ISATAP Router Discovery References: <3C6D674B.90231DB2@erg.sri.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello, I would like to announce the following personal draft that proposes an optional extension for ISATAP which may be of specific interest to MANET. The optional extension may provide benefits for ISATAP when used in MANET environments. The draft is concise and to-the-point, and the subject matter can be grasped by a quick read of the abstract. At this time, my purpose in making this announcement is only to seek feedback from the community on what is being proposed. Thanks in advance for any comments you may have. Fred Templin templin@erg.sri.com "Fast Convergence Extension for ISATAP Router Discovery", Fred Templin, 02/01/2002 http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-templin-ngtrans-isatapext-00.txt This document specifies an optional extension for [ISATAP] that supports fast convergence (i.e, fast discovery of on-link routers). The extension employs a subset of the multicast mechanisms specified by [6OVER4] to augment the NBMA mechanisms specified by [ISATAP]. From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Fri Feb 15 20:52:50 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id UAA24668 for ; Fri, 15 Feb 2002 20:52:50 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id SAA02108 for manet-outgoing; Fri, 15 Feb 2002 18:19:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from RRMAIL01.RADIOROUTER_NT ([63.103.94.23]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id SAA02099 for ; Fri, 15 Feb 2002 18:19:41 -0500 (EST) Received: by planetajeans.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id <1LTW8JPS>; Fri, 15 Feb 2002 18:19:40 -0500 Message-ID: <8C92E23A3E87FB479988285F9E22BE46994130@ftmail> From: Scott Corson To: "'Kilian Weniger'" , manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Subject: RE: Minutes of 52nd IETF MANET WG meeting? Date: Fri, 15 Feb 2002 18:19:33 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Folks, Sorry for the lapse this time...we had this ready and never submitted it. -Scott n Joe **************************************************************************** *** Minutes of Dec 2001 MANET MTG The IETF manet WG held a recent meeting on December 11, 2001 in Salt Lake City, Utah, USA. The meeting began with a brief introduction by the WG chairmen, Joe Macker and Scott Corson and the customary agenda bashing session. WG Scope Discussion Scott Corson then led a discussion on WG scope and direction. With the recent change in Routing Area Directorship, the WG's scope and charter are under review, and there is a desire on the part of the Routing AD and the WG chairs to keep the group focused and working on near-term practical problems. It was reiterated by the co-chairs that work on multicast, QoS and address auto-configuration in manets is currently out of scope. Also, it was strongly suggested that work specifically oriented towards larger scale manets (TORA, ZRP-related drafts, LANMAR) be removed as WG work items due to the apparent lack of WG interest, but this was agreed to be taken to the list for discussion and consensus assessment. There was specific discussion on whether to still advance both AODV and DSR as Experimental RFCs as was previously agreed, or to try to come to WG consensus now on which of the two protocols should advance towards Proposed Standard status. The rough consensus of the WG seemed to favor continuing with both drafts moving to Experimental status, due to minimal operational experience and third party experimentation with the protocols. The short term goal would be to encourage further implementation and experimentation and for a "WG process" to be developed by which future reactive protocol decisions could be made. The suggestion was also put forth by the chairs to include work on manet "flooding" as a WG item; the thought being that flooding is a generic feature useful in manets for a variety of algorithms such as multicast and address auto-configuration mechanisms. Also the group has some experience with flooding mechanisms already as every unicast protocol makes use of a flooding mechanism to some degree. The conclusion of the discussion on WG scope was that focused work on reactive and proactive unicast routing protocols for manet should continue, and that flooding should be added as well. The rationale was that these pieces of work are relatively technically mature and that further experimentation and closure on specifics is needed before moving on to more complicated design areas. Further discussion of future scope will be taken to the list. Protocol Discussions A sequence of presentations then followed, not all of which are described here, so please see the meeting minutes for more information [1]. Richard Ogier briefly outlined recent changes to TBRPF, and then presented simulation results comparing the relative performances of TBRPF, OLSR and AODV. The discussion of these results was lively and the validity and effectiveness of the models developed for OLSR experimentation was openly questioned. Joe Macker raised the issue that the results presented for OLSR should not be taken as representative of the performance due to potential design issues with the Linux code based on version 3 of the draft specification. This earlier protocol implementation source code was used to develop the simulation results presented. The WG chairs encouraged further third party experimentation with newer simulation models under development as a further independent comparison of protocol performance and issues. Thomas Clausen followed with a summary of activity and progress regarding the work of the proactive protocol design team. The proactive routing design team activity was established within the WG to explore the potential for a compromise core protocol for proactive routing. A short term goal of this team was to explore the possibility of a design merge of the best aspects of approaches being proposed to further simplify and scope WG activity. The active membership has mostly consisted of work between TBRPF and OLSR authors. While progress was made in identifying common algorithm components and obtaining a shared understanding of the similarities and differences in the two approaches, the design team membership failed to close some of the gaps that existed between the designs of respective proposed algorithms. The conclusion of the early exploratory design team effort is that a merged protocol design was not likely without technical compromising existing proposals. Due to this outcome, respective proactive routing protocol groups have decided to continue to progress work on their respective individual protocols. Along with reactive protocols, the manet WG feels that the development of proactive protocols for manet is important for a number of mobile routing application areas and scenarios. This work is also reaching maturity rather quickly in terms of implementation and experimental experience. Now that the proactive routing design team has reached its initial conclusions, that a single protocol consensus design is unlikely, a WG decision process and timeline for progressing forward respective proposals needs to be established. References [1] Proceedings of the Fifty-Second Internet Engineering Task Force, Current Meeting Report for the manet WG, Salt Lake City, December 2001. From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Sat Feb 16 18:07:12 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id SAA17635 for ; Sat, 16 Feb 2002 18:07:12 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id PAA11003 for manet-outgoing; Sat, 16 Feb 2002 15:11:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from mx01.x263.net ([211.157.130.62]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id PAA10998 for ; Sat, 16 Feb 2002 15:11:32 -0500 (EST) From: berniejoe@x263.net Received: by mx01.x263.net (Postfix, from userid 500) id 0C85EA6869; Sun, 17 Feb 2002 04:14:14 +0800 (CST) To: manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Subject: both in Ad-hoc mode and Infrastructure mode? Date: Sun, 17 Feb 2002 04:15:44 +0800 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: XMail-1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="gb2312" Message-Id: <20020216201414.0C85EA6869@mx01.x263.net> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from base64 to 8bit by itd.nrl.navy.mil id PAA10999 Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Hello all, We're conducting research on ad-hoc routing. I'd like to know if the wireless cards now available could work in both Ad-hoc mode and Infrastructure mode. I mean, you needn't switch the card between these two modes, and it could communicate with the Access Point and another wireless card at the same time. I'm not quite familiar about 802.11 standard, and I know it can't in Windows. But I heard that it works in Linux. Is that true? Thanks for any comments Bernie Joe »¶Ó­Ê¹ÓÃ263ÌìÏÂÓÊÃâ·ÑÐÅÏä http://freemail.x263.net welcome to enjoy 263 Freemail http://freemail.x263.net _____________________________________________________ 263ÔÚÏß_ÖйúÈ˵ÄÍøÉϼÒÔ° Tel:010-64262631 Fax:010-64240295 (c)1998-2001°æÈ¨ËùÓÐ 263·þÎñÈÈÏß 263@263.net.cn From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Mon Feb 18 00:31:49 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id AAA18843 for ; Mon, 18 Feb 2002 00:31:49 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id WAA21786 for manet-outgoing; Sun, 17 Feb 2002 22:03:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from camars.kaist.ac.kr (camars.kaist.ac.kr [143.248.137.2]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id WAA21781 for ; Sun, 17 Feb 2002 22:03:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from capictor (capictor.kaist.ac.kr [143.248.150.112]) by camars.kaist.ac.kr (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id LAA25067 for ; Mon, 18 Feb 2002 11:53:42 +0900 (KST) Message-ID: <06ea01c1b828$d1f39a10$7096f88f@capictor> From: "Seung-hak Lee" To: Subject: The acronym of "International Workshop on Ad Hoc Networking 2002" has been changed. Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2002 12:03:19 +0900 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_06E7_01C1B874.4188B540" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_06E7_01C1B874.4188B540 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ks_c_5601-1987" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 TXkgYXBvbG9naWVzIGlmIHlvdSByZWNlaXZlIHRoaXMgZS1tYWlsIGR1cGxpY2F0ZWQuDQotLS0t LS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0NCg0KVGhlIGFjcm9u eW0gIklXQU4yMDAyIiBoYXMgYmVlbiBjaGFuZ2VkIHRvICJJV0FITjIwMDIiLg0KDQpUaGVyZSBp cyBhIG5hbWUgY2xhY2ggYmV0d2VlbiBvdXIgd29ya3Nob3AsIElXQU4yMDAyIGFuZCB0aGUgSW50 ZXJuYWlvbmFsDQoNCldvcmtpbmcgQ29uZmVyZW5jZSBvbiBBY3RpdmUgTmV0d29ya3MgKGFsc28g SVdBTjIwMDIpLCB0byBiZSBoZWxkIGluIFp1cmljaCANCg0KaW4gRGVjZW1iZXIgMjAwMiwgc28g d2UgY2Fubm90IHVzZSB0aGUgIklXQU4yMDAyIg0KDQoNClRoZSBhZGRyZXNzIG9mIGhvbWUgcGFn ZSBhbHNvIGhhcyBiZWVuIGNoYW5nZWQgYXMgZm9sbG93cw0KDQpodHRwOi8vY2FsYWIua2Fpc3Qu YWMua3IvQ29uZi9JV0FITjIwMDIvDQoNCg0K ------=_NextPart_000_06E7_01C1B874.4188B540 Content-Type: text/html; charset="ks_c_5601-1987" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 PCFET0NUWVBFIEhUTUwgUFVCTElDICItLy9XM0MvL0RURCBIVE1MIDQuMCBUcmFuc2l0aW9uYWwv L0VOIj4NCjxIVE1MPjxIRUFEPg0KPE1FVEEgaHR0cC1lcXVpdj1Db250ZW50LVR5cGUgY29udGVu dD0idGV4dC9odG1sOyBjaGFyc2V0PWtzX2NfNTYwMS0xOTg3Ij4NCjxNRVRBIGNvbnRlbnQ9Ik1T SFRNTCA2LjAwLjI3MTIuMzAwIiBuYW1lPUdFTkVSQVRPUj4NCjxTVFlMRT48L1NUWUxFPg0KPC9I RUFEPg0KPEJPRFkgYmdDb2xvcj0jZmZmZmZmPg0KPERJVj48Rk9OVCBzaXplPTI+TXkgYXBvbG9n aWVzIGlmIHlvdSByZWNlaXZlIHRoaXMgZS1tYWlsIA0KZHVwbGljYXRlZC48QlI+LS0tLS0tLS0t LS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tLS0tPC9GT05UPjwvRElWPg0KPERJ Vj4mbmJzcDs8L0RJVj4NCjxESVY+PEZPTlQgc2l6ZT0yPlRoZSBhY3JvbnltICJJV0FOMjAwMiIg aGFzIGJlZW4gY2hhbmdlZCB0byANCiJJV0FITjIwMDIiLjwvRk9OVD48L0RJVj4NCjxESVY+Jm5i c3A7PC9ESVY+DQo8RElWPjxGT05UIHNpemU9Mj5UaGVyZSBpcyBhIG5hbWUgY2xhY2ggYmV0d2Vl biBvdXIgd29ya3Nob3AsIElXQU4yMDAyIGFuZCB0aGUgDQpJbnRlcm5haW9uYWw8L0ZPTlQ+PC9E SVY+DQo8RElWPiZuYnNwOzwvRElWPg0KPERJVj48Rk9OVCBzaXplPTI+V29ya2luZyBDb25mZXJl bmNlIG9uIEFjdGl2ZSBOZXR3b3JrcyAoYWxzbyBJV0FOMjAwMiksIHRvIGJlIA0KaGVsZCBpbiBa dXJpY2ggPC9GT05UPjwvRElWPg0KPERJVj4mbmJzcDs8L0RJVj4NCjxESVY+PEZPTlQgc2l6ZT0y PmluIERlY2VtYmVyIDIwMDIsIHNvIHdlIGNhbm5vdCB1c2UgdGhlICJJV0FOMjAwMiI8L0ZPTlQ+ PC9ESVY+DQo8RElWPiZuYnNwOzwvRElWPjxGT05UIHNpemU9Mj4NCjxESVY+PEJSPlRoZSBhZGRy ZXNzIG9mIGhvbWUgcGFnZSBhbHNvIGhhcyBiZWVuIGNoYW5nZWQgYXMgZm9sbG93czwvRElWPg0K PERJVj4mbmJzcDs8L0RJVj4NCjxESVY+PEEgDQpocmVmPSJodHRwOi8vY2FsYWIua2Fpc3QuYWMu a3IvQ29uZi9JV0FITjIwMDIvIj5odHRwOi8vY2FsYWIua2Fpc3QuYWMua3IvQ29uZi9JV0FITjIw MDIvPC9BPjwvRElWPg0KPERJVj4mbmJzcDs8L0RJVj4NCjxESVY+PC9GT05UPiZuYnNwOzwvRElW PjwvQk9EWT48L0hUTUw+DQo= ------=_NextPart_000_06E7_01C1B874.4188B540-- From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Mon Feb 18 16:03:45 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id QAA18202 for ; Mon, 18 Feb 2002 16:03:45 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id NAA00040 for manet-outgoing; Mon, 18 Feb 2002 13:42:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from concorde.inria.fr (concorde.inria.fr [192.93.2.39]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id NAA00032 for ; Mon, 18 Feb 2002 13:41:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from zephyrin (zephyrin-wi.inria.fr [193.51.192.58]) by concorde.inria.fr (8.11.1/8.11.1) with SMTP id g1IIfr505170; Mon, 18 Feb 2002 19:41:53 +0100 (MET) Message-ID: <013f01c1b8ae$91292e60$3ac033c1@inria.fr> From: "Philippe Jacquet" To: , "Matt Read" Cc: References: <200202132050.MAA25942@koa.erg.sri.com> Subject: Re: Asymmetric links Date: Mon, 18 Feb 2002 20:00:43 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Richard, You must be careful with your definition of symmetric/asymmetric links. In your draft you assume that a link is bidirectional even when it is made of two unidirectional interfaces. This may fail with IEEE 802.11 ACK feedback process. Please look at OLSR draft. Indeed you may meet weird situations (the most uncomfortable one is when a node receives the same interface from another node but on two different interfaces, among them one is asymmetric). Philippe ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Matt Read Cc: ; Sent: Wednesday, February 13, 2002 9:50 PM Subject: Re: Asymmetric links > > Matt, > > > Everyone, > > > > AODV breaks when this happens. As a relative newcomer to AODV, > > please pardon me if this has already been considered, but could the > > HELLO message include a list of the Neighbors from which the sender > > has recently heard HELLO's? Then if a node hears a HELLO in which > > it does not find itself listed, it could assume there is no link and > > not try to send directly to that node (sending RREQ's instead). > > (There will be scalability and other issues, of course.) > > > > - Matt > > Yes, by including a list of all neighbors in each HELLO, a node > can detect when a bidirectional link has become unidirectional. > This is what OSPF and OLSR do. But a more efficient way is to > use differential HELLOs (as in TBRPF), so that each HELLO contains > only the neighbors whose states have recently changed. > Perhaps AODV should also use differential HELLOs. > > Richard > > From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Tue Feb 19 06:37:55 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id GAA14449 for ; Tue, 19 Feb 2002 06:37:54 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id DAA08481 for manet-outgoing; Tue, 19 Feb 2002 03:57:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from p-mail2.rd.francetelecom.com (p-mail2.rd.francetelecom.com [193.49.124.32]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id DAA08476 for ; Tue, 19 Feb 2002 03:57:32 -0500 (EST) Received: by p-voyageur.rd.francetelecom.fr with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id <1M4FAPWN>; Tue, 19 Feb 2002 09:57:19 +0100 Message-ID: <0489A7888F080B4BA73B53F7E145F29A03C054@LANMHS20.rd.francetelecom.fr> From: MEDDOUR Djamal Eddine thesard FTRD/DAC/LAN To: manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Subject: others cretaria in MANET routing protocol Date: Tue, 19 Feb 2002 09:57:27 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----=_NextPartTM-000-41c6dc48-246b-11d6-b1e5-00508b69ab48" Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. ------=_NextPartTM-000-41c6dc48-246b-11d6-b1e5-00508b69ab48 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C1B923.74DE28EA" ------_=_NextPart_001_01C1B923.74DE28EA Content-Type: text/plain; charset="x-user-defined" Hi all The criteria of the choice of the optimal route is the number of hops, do you think that it's sufficient? Why don't take in consideration some other criteria like traffic load around node, node energy, node capacity, ... Any comments ------_=_NextPart_001_01C1B923.74DE28EA Content-Type: text/html; charset="x-user-defined" Energy-aware broadcasting and multicasting
Hi all

The criteria of the choice of the optimal route is the number of hops, do you think that it's sufficient? Why don't take in consideration some other criteria like traffic load around nodenode energy, node capacity, ...

Any comments

------_=_NextPart_001_01C1B923.74DE28EA-- ------=_NextPartTM-000-41c6dc48-246b-11d6-b1e5-00508b69ab48-- From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Wed Feb 20 07:48:42 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id HAA28865 for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2002 07:48:42 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id FAA15511 for manet-outgoing; Wed, 20 Feb 2002 05:20:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailhost.cs.auc.dk (mailhost.cs.auc.dk [130.225.194.6]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id FAA15506 for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2002 05:20:26 -0500 (EST) From: T.Clausen@computer.org Received: from localhost (root@micro.cs.auc.dk [130.225.194.68]) by mailhost.cs.auc.dk (8.12.2/8.12.2) with ESMTP id g1KAK9vU024503; Wed, 20 Feb 2002 11:20:18 +0100 (MET) Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2002 11:20:08 +0100 (CET) X-Sender: voop@armada To: "'ogier@erg.sri.com'" cc: manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Subject: Re: performance comparaison between Ad Hoc routing protocols In-Reply-To: <200202131928.LAA14509@pit.erg.sri.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8BIT X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.2 Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8BIT Richard, I am not quite sure what to make from your simulations. It seems to me that they are from a network in overload condition - in which case buffer management has a critical impact on performance. We've been simulating OLSR in conditions, similar to those you've been showing, and our results differ significantly. We experience that a large abmount of (data and control) traffic in these situations are rejected from the various buffers. Dropping control-traffic in the various buffers due to overload should in fact result in (and, indeed, does in our simulations) *less* control traffic being sent on the medium, not more - as suggested by your results. A solution, obviously, is to use priority queues and to prioritize control traffic. However this is approaching an implementation issue, and is not something included in our code. So I am puzzled how you get the figures showing an increasing control traffic overhead when increasing the overload condition. Also, I notice that we obtain much less overhead for OLSR when counting MAC/IP overhead. Have you alterated the ns2 code to make it output more detailed information (e.g. physical overhead etc.) ? Please keep in mind that the ns2-code (version 3) of OLSR does not include features such as link hysteresis and loss link management for mobility conditions. I thins this is the case for AODV (version 2) as well (features not fully implemented, new features not present). Finally, I've been looking at your graphs, and I think that achieving optimal performance (for either of the manet protocols) is largely a matter of tuning protocol parameters. I noticed, for example, that the paraeters you used for tbrpf in the simulations differ from those specifyed in the draft. --thomas On Wed, 13 Feb 2002 ogier@erg.sri.com wrote: > > On Thu, 7 Feb 2002 Mahesh Marina wrote: > > > Your simulation results for AODV somehow were way off from what I have > > observed in the past. I was one of the people involved in the development > > of AODV code for ns2. > > > > You mention that the link-layer notification was turned off in your > > evaluations. I assumed that HELLOs were instead used for link > > detection/failure in AODV as well and looked at the piece of code for > > handling HELLOs. > > > I found that neighbor deletion (and therefore, link failure > > detection) was commented out inadvertently, perhaps during > > debugging. As most of our performance studies used link-layer feedback, > > this bug didn't show up. So, I was wondering whether AODV results would be > > same without this bug. > > I reran the ns-2 simulations for AODV with the above fix, > which improved the performance of AODV substantially in the > mobile scenarios (but not in the non-mobile scenarios). > To ensure fairness with TBRPF and OLSR, I also commented out > the following code in AODV so that no protocol is allowed > to retrieve packets from the interface queue (ifqueue): > > // Not sure whether this is the right thing to do > Packet *pkt; > while((pkt = ifqueue->filter(ih->saddr()))) { > drop(pkt, DROP_RTR_MAC_CALLBACK); > > (The above comment is by one of the AODV programmers, not me.) > > The simulation results can be found at the TBRPF web site: > http://www.erg.sri.com/projects/tbrpf/ > > The results are summarized below. Comments are welcome. > Note that TBRPF code for ns-2.1b8 is now available. > > Protocols compared: > > - AODV code for ns-2.1b8 > Available from http://www.cs.ucsb.edu/~eroyer/aodv.html > > - TBRPF code for ns-2.1b8 > Available from http://www.erg.sri.com/projects/tbrpf/sourcecode.html > Uses the same 'C' code as our Linux implementation > > - OLSR code for ns-2.1b7 > Available from http://hipercom.inria.fr/olsr/ > Bug affecting packet size was fixed. > > - In all protocols, link-layer failure notification was NOT used, and > packets could not be retrieved from the link layer (interface queue). > > Simulation model: > > - ns-2 version 2.1b8 > - WaveLAN IEEE 802.11 MAC with rate 2Mb/s and range 250m > - 50 and 100 nodes > - Two area sizes: 670m x 670m and 1500m x 300m > - Mobility model: No mobility, and random waypoint model with 0 pause > time and maximum speed 20 m/s. > - 20 simultaneous CBR traffic streams: > - Source and destination of each stream are selected randomly > - Duration of each stream is 30 seconds > - Size of each data packet is 512 bytes > - Packet generation rate per stream is increased from 2 to 8 packets/s > - Each simulation was run for 500 simulated seconds. > > Summary of results: > > - In every scenario, TBRPF achieved a higher delivery percentage (up to > 15% higher) than OLSR. TBRPF also achieved a higher delivery percentage > (up to 15% higher) than AODV in all scenarios with no mobility, and in > all scenarios using the square area (670x670) with the lower packet rates > (2 and 4 packets/s). For the long rectangular area (1500x300), AODV > achieved a higher delivery percentage (up to 5% higher) than TBRPF. > > - In every scenario, TBRPF generated less routing control traffic > than the other protocols: up to 60% less than OLSR and up to 48% > less than AODV. This is despite the fact that TBRPF sends > HELLOs twice as frequently as OLSR. > > - In every scenario, TBRPF used the shortest paths (except nearly shortest > in some cases with the higher packet rates). In every scenario, AODV > used paths that were 12-20% longer on average than TBRPF. > > - TBRPF usually had the best or nearly best delay. > > Remarks: > > - This study did not use link-layer failure notification. It is important > to also compare the protocols with link-layer notification, since this > allows one to achieve a delivery fraction close to 100%. > > - A comparison of TBRPF with AODV using link-layer notification can > also be found at the TBRPF web site. That comparison also compares > the protocols with 40 sources (which gives TBRPF more advantage). > > - A routing protocol that generates less control traffic and uses > shorter paths: > > - uses less energy, > - is more likely to scale to a larger number of nodes, > - is more likely to perform well in lower bandwidth radios such > as those used by the military. > > > ----------------------- > Richard Ogier > Sr. Research Engineer > SRI International > 333 Ravenswood Ave. > Menlo Park, CA 94025 > Tel: 650-859-4216 > Fax: 650-859-4812 > Email: ogier@erg.sri.com > ------------------------ > -- ------------------------------------------- Thomas Heide Clausen Civilingeniør i Datateknik (cand.polyt) M.Sc in Computer Engineering E-Mail: T.Clausen@computer.org WWW: http://www.cs.auc.dk/~voop ------------------------------------------- From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Wed Feb 20 12:24:14 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id MAA08737 for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2002 12:24:14 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id KAA24499 for manet-outgoing; Wed, 20 Feb 2002 10:03:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from enterprise.atl.lmco.com (mail.atl.external.lmco.com [192.35.37.50]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id KAA24491 for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2002 10:03:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from misty.atl.lmco.com (misty [166.17.242.243]) by enterprise.atl.lmco.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 20690C1CED for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2002 10:03:45 -0500 (EST) Received: (from cwinters@localhost) by misty.atl.lmco.com (8.11.2/8.11.2) id g1KF3j615287 for manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil; Wed, 20 Feb 2002 10:03:45 -0500 Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2002 10:03:45 -0500 From: Chuck Winters To: manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Subject: Ad-Hoc Analysis Message-ID: <20020220150345.GC15039@atl.lmco.com> Mail-Followup-To: manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.27i Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Hello All, I was wondering if someone could point me to some information on network performance analysis in Ad-Hoc networks? I am not looking for simulation, but for real testing. Thanks, Chuck -- Chuck Winters | Email: cwinters@atl.lmco.com Distributed Processing Laboratory | Phone: 856-338-3987 Lockheed Martin Advanced Technology Labs | 1 Federal St - A&E-3W | Camden, NJ 08102 | From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Wed Feb 20 16:34:39 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id QAA21074 for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2002 16:34:38 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id OAA06908 for manet-outgoing; Wed, 20 Feb 2002 14:10:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from den.erg.sri.com (den.erg.sri.com [128.18.100.23]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id OAA06900 for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2002 14:10:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from den.erg.sri.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by den.erg.sri.com (8.9.3+Sun/8.9.1) with ESMTP id LAA07614; Wed, 20 Feb 2002 11:09:50 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <200202201909.LAA07614@den.erg.sri.com> To: T.Clausen@computer.org cc: "'ogier@erg.sri.com'" , manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Reply-To: ogier@erg.sri.com From: ogier@erg.sri.com Subject: Re: performance comparaison between Ad Hoc routing protocols In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 20 Feb 2002 11:20:08 +0100." Date: Wed, 20 Feb 2002 11:09:50 -0800 Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Thomas, > Richard, > > I am not quite sure what to make from your simulations. It seems to me > that they are from a network in overload condition - in which case buffer > management has a critical impact on performance. We've been simulating > OLSR in conditions, similar to those you've been showing, and our results > differ significantly. We experience that a large abmount of (data and > control) traffic in these situations are rejected from the various > buffers. I considered four packet rates: 2, 4, 6, and 8 packets/s. The latter two are indeed usually an overload condition (except that TBRPF sometimes did very well with 6 packets/s), but 2 packets/s is certainly NOT. > Dropping control-traffic in the various buffers due to overload should in > fact result in (and, indeed, does in our simulations) *less* control > traffic being sent on the medium, not more - as suggested by your results. > A solution, obviously, is to use priority queues and to prioritize control > traffic. However this is approaching an implementation issue, and is not > something included in our code. So I am puzzled how you get the figures > showing an increasing control traffic overhead when increasing the > overload condition. To ensure that the protocols were compared on a fair basis, since AODV and TBRPF gave control traffic higher priority than data traffic, we did the same for OLSR. It has long been considered a good idea to give control traffic higher priority. This could explain why your results differ from mine. You can do this simply by adding the line case PT_OLSR: to the function PriQueue::recv() in priqueue.cc. > Also, I notice that we obtain much less overhead for OLSR when counting > MAC/IP overhead. Have you alterated the ns2 code to make it output more > detailed information (e.g. physical overhead etc.) ? No we did not. In addition to the 20-byte IP header, ns2 adds 52 bytes at the MAC layer. > Please keep in mind that the ns2-code (version 3) of OLSR does not include > features such as link hysteresis and loss link management for mobility > conditions. I thins this is the case for AODV (version 2) as well > (features not fully implemented, new features not present). Yes. Please let me know when OLSR code is available that has these new features. Regarding hysteresis, this is a feature that can be used by either OLSR or TBRPF. For example, TBRPF can use the same EWMA hysteresis technique used by OLSR if it helps performance. > Finally, I've been looking at your graphs, and I think that achieving > optimal performance (for either of the manet protocols) is largely a > matter of tuning protocol parameters. I noticed, for example, that the > paraeters you used for tbrpf in the simulations differ from those > specifyed in the draft. We also tried using the parameter values in the draft, but the difference in performance was only slight. Note that we used the same parameter values for all scenarios, so we did not tune the parameters to each scenario. Richard From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Wed Feb 20 16:34:42 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id QAA21087 for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2002 16:34:42 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id OAA07319 for manet-outgoing; Wed, 20 Feb 2002 14:18:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from mmlab.snu.ac.kr (mmlab.snu.ac.kr [147.46.114.112]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id OAA07309 for ; Wed, 20 Feb 2002 14:17:57 -0500 (EST) Received: (from pretty@localhost) by mmlab.snu.ac.kr (8.11.6/8.11.6) id g1KJKKO26945 for manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil; Thu, 21 Feb 2002 04:20:20 +0900 (KST) (envelope-from pretty) From: pretty Message-Id: <200202201920.g1KJKKO26945@mmlab.snu.ac.kr> Subject: Extended Submission Deadline (IEEE SAWN 2002) : March 18 To: manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Date: Thu, 21 Feb 102 04:20:20 +0900 (KST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25-h4.1] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=EUC-KR Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Extended Submission Deadline !!! : March 18, 2002 * Apologize if you receive multiple copies of this announcement ! Please feel free to distribute a copy of this CFP to those who might be interested. ======================================================================= The Second Symposium on Ad Hoc Wireless Networks (SAWN2002) in conjunction with IEEE GLOBECOM 2002. November 17 - 21, 2002. Taipei, Taiwan, R.O.C. http://mmlab.snu.ac.kr/~pretty/sawn/sawn02.html ----------------------------------------------------------- CALL FOR PAPERS Objectives The IEEE Symposium on Ad-Hoc Wireless Networks (SAWN2002) is a new and high quality technical meeting (to be held as part of IEEE GLOBECOM 2002) for researchers to present their latest research work related to the fast evolving field of ad hoc (multihop, adaptive, and self-organizing) wireless networks and pervasive communications. Such networks could have strong potential impact on our daily lives (for example at home and on-the-road) and the way we work. They are also particularly attractive for military and emergency operations due to their fast deployable and self-organizing characteristics. Future ad hoc networks are also capable of supporting multimedia. High quality papers are invited from researchers in academia and industries who are involved in this area of work. Submissions Submissions are welcomed in any area related ad hoc wireless networks. The topics os interest include, but are not limited to : * Ad Hoc Routing Protocols/Algorithms * Ad Hoc Multicasting Protocols/Algorithms * Ad Hoc Transport Issues * Service Discovery Algorithms * Media Access Techniques/Protocols * Low Power Algorithms and Protocols * Sensor & Data Fusion Ad Hoc Networks * Quality of Service Issues * Ad Hoc Network Architectures * Mobile IP with Ad Hoc * Error & Link Control Techniques * Performance of Bluetooth Networks * Access & Session Support * Integration Issues Technical papers should be submitted to the Globecom Committee following the general Globecom submission process and instructions. In order to ensure that your paper is properly routed to this Symposium, it is VERY IMPORTANT that you explicitly identify "Symposium on Ad Hoc Wireless Networks" as the intended symposium to which you are submitting the paper. Failure to do so may result in your paper being forwarded to another symposium. All submissions will be made electronically and accepted papers will be published with GLOBECOM proceedings. Papers of particular merit may be considered for journal publications. Important Dates =============== Extended Submission Deadline : March 18, 2002 Acceptance Notification : June 30, 2002 Camera Ready Paper Due : August 15, 2002 All inquires should be directed to the symposium chairman at dkkim@jade.snu.ac.kr or pretty@mmlab.snu.ac.kr Paper that are more than 5 pages are allowed but once they are accepted for publication, the author/s must be prepared to pay for additional page charges. SAWN 2002 Technical Program Chair Dr. Dongkyun Kim Seoul National University Steering Committee Members Prof. Victor Li University of Hong Kong Dr. Justin Chuang MobilinkTel USA Prof. C-K. Toh (Steering Committee Chair) Technical Program Committee Members Dr. Kenneth Brayer MITRE, USA Prof. Elvino S. Sousa Univ. of Toronto, Canada Dr. Silvia. Giordano EPFL, Switzerland Prof. Bo Li Hongkong UST Dr. Chip Elliott BBN, USA Dr. Eric Fleury INRIA, France Prof. Nick Bambos Stanford U, USA Prof. Znati, Taieb NSF/Pittsburg U Syed Akbar TRW, USA Prof. Khaled Ben Letaief Hongkong UST Prof. Halim Yanikomeroglu Carleton U, Canada Dr. Yile Guo NOKIA, USA Prof. Adam Wolisz TU-berlin, Germany Dr. Nader Moayeri NIST, USA Prof. Y.H. Choi Seoul National Univ., Korea Dr. Chih-Lin I AT & T, USA Prof. K.C. Chen NTU, Taiwan Dr. Howard Lemberg Telcordia, USA Prof. Hussein Mouftah Queens University, Canada Prof. Jean-Yves Le-Boudec EPFL, Switzerland Dr. Bassam Hashem Nortel Networks Dr. PeiYing Zhu Nortel Networks Dr. Chatschik Bisdikian IBM Watson Lab. Prof. Per Gunningberg Uppsala U, Sweden From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Thu Feb 21 09:35:35 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id JAA18512 for ; Thu, 21 Feb 2002 09:35:35 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id HAA27361 for manet-outgoing; Thu, 21 Feb 2002 07:10:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from mgw-x2.nokia.com (mgw-x2.nokia.com [131.228.20.22]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id HAA27353 for ; Thu, 21 Feb 2002 07:10:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from esvir03nok.nokia.com (esvir03nokt.ntc.nokia.com [172.21.143.35]) by mgw-x2.nokia.com (Switch-2.1.0/Switch-2.1.0) with ESMTP id g1LCAEZ10089 for ; Thu, 21 Feb 2002 14:10:14 +0200 (EET) Received: from esebh002.NOE.Nokia.com (unverified) by esvir03nok.nokia.com (Content Technologies SMTPRS 4.2.5) with ESMTP id ; Thu, 21 Feb 2002 14:10:04 +0200 Received: from mgw.research.nokia.com ([172.21.33.76]) by esebh002.NOE.Nokia.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.3779); Thu, 21 Feb 2002 14:10:04 +0200 Received: from nokia.com (hed036-224.research.nokia.com [172.21.36.224]) by mgw.research.nokia.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA20355; Thu, 21 Feb 2002 14:10:03 +0200 (EET) X-Authentication-Warning: mgw.research.nokia.com: Host hed036-224.research.nokia.com [172.21.36.224] claimed to be nokia.com Message-ID: <3C74E3D8.4040006@nokia.com> Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2002 14:11:04 +0200 From: Manel Guerrero Zapata User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:0.9.7) Gecko/20020203 X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Aodvimpl-Public , manet , "Perkins Charles (IPRG)" , "ext Elizabeth M. Belding-Royer" Subject: Route expiry in AODV v10 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-OriginalArrivalTime: 21 Feb 2002 12:10:04.0675 (UTC) FILETIME=[B214B530:01C1BAD0] Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi everybody :) Correct me if I'm mistaken: The former 'Route Expiry and Route Deletion' section has been merged with the 'Route Error messages'. And now the draft is wroten in such a way that the actions to be taken when a route expires are only taken when a RRER is generated. And, this is wrong because a route can expire just because it times out. Am I missing something? BR/Manel Guerrerro From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Fri Feb 22 01:09:36 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id BAA14999 for ; Fri, 22 Feb 2002 01:09:36 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id WAA26573 for manet-outgoing; Thu, 21 Feb 2002 22:43:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from cms3.etri.re.kr (cms3.etri.re.kr [129.254.16.13]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id WAA26568 for ; Thu, 21 Feb 2002 22:42:54 -0500 (EST) From: paul@etri.re.kr Received: by cms3.etri.re.kr with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) id ; Fri, 22 Feb 2002 12:43:50 +0900 Message-ID: <8470181DABD5D511B3E700D0B7A8AC4A96242F@cms3.etri.re.kr> To: charliep@iprg.nokia.com, manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Cc: adhoc@krv6.net Subject: Question of AODV Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 12:43:50 +0900 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C1BB53.23D2C5E0" Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C1BB53.23D2C5E0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="euc-kr" Hello, I am a researcher of ETRI in Korea. I have a plan to implement IPv6 AODV and Multicast routing protocol of AODV. I would like to know the status related to IPv6 AODV and AODV Multicast routing protocol. I also want to know if MANET WG will produce RFCs of IPv6 AODV and AODV Multicast routing protocol. Could anyone comment? Thanks a lot. Regards, Jaehoon ------_=_NextPart_001_01C1BB53.23D2C5E0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="euc-kr" Question of AODV

Hello,

I am a researcher of ETRI in Korea.
I have a plan to implement IPv6 AODV and Multicast routing protocol of AODV.
I would like to know the status related to IPv6 AODV and AODV Multicast routing protocol.
I also want to know if  MANET WG will produce RFCs of IPv6 AODV and AODV Multicast routing protocol.
Could anyone comment?
Thanks a lot.

Regards,
Jaehoon

------_=_NextPart_001_01C1BB53.23D2C5E0-- From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Fri Feb 22 01:26:08 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id BAA15121 for ; Fri, 22 Feb 2002 01:26:07 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id XAA27194 for manet-outgoing; Thu, 21 Feb 2002 23:22:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from mailhost.iprg.nokia.com (mailhost.iprg.nokia.com [205.226.5.12]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id XAA27189 for ; Thu, 21 Feb 2002 23:22:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from darkstar.iprg.nokia.com (darkstar.iprg.nokia.com [205.226.5.69]) by mailhost.iprg.nokia.com (8.9.3/8.9.3-GLGS) with ESMTP id UAA11286; Thu, 21 Feb 2002 20:22:28 -0800 (PST) Received: (from root@localhost) by darkstar.iprg.nokia.com (8.11.0/8.11.0-DARKSTAR) id g1M4MRw07596; Thu, 21 Feb 2002 20:22:27 -0800 X-mProtect:  Thu, 21 Feb 2002 20:22:27 -0800 Nokia Silicon Valley Messaging Protection Received: from maxdialin9.iprg.nokia.com (205.226.20.239, claiming to be "iprg.nokia.com") by darkstar.iprg.nokia.com smtpdjwS1gj; Thu, 21 Feb 2002 20:22:25 PST Message-ID: <3C75C71F.825EB18E@iprg.nokia.com> Date: Thu, 21 Feb 2002 20:20:47 -0800 From: Charlie Perkins Organization: Nokia X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.75 [en]C-CCK-MCD {Nokia} (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: paul@etri.re.kr CC: manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil, adhoc@krv6.net Subject: Re: Question of AODV References: <8470181DABD5D511B3E700D0B7A8AC4A96242F@cms3.etri.re.kr> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello Jaehoon, AODV for IPv6, and MAODV are not manet working group documents. It is not easy to tell if they might become working group documents in the future. However, there are implementations for both of them, and a good way for documents to be taken up as working group documents is for there to be more implementations. I also think it would be considered appropriate for you to discuss your experiences on the working group mailing list. Thanks for your interest. Regards, Charlie P. paul@etri.re.kr wrote: > > > Hello, > > I am a researcher of ETRI in Korea. > I have a plan to implement IPv6 AODV and Multicast routing protocol of > AODV. > I would like to know the status related to IPv6 AODV and AODV > Multicast routing protocol. > I also want to know if MANET WG will produce RFCs of IPv6 AODV and > AODV Multicast routing protocol. > Could anyone comment? > Thanks a lot. > > Regards, > Jaehoon From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Fri Feb 22 04:50:07 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id EAA25415 for ; Fri, 22 Feb 2002 04:50:07 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id CAA00171 for manet-outgoing; Fri, 22 Feb 2002 02:26:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from ux6.sp.cs.cmu.edu (UX6.SP.CS.CMU.EDU [128.2.181.250]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id CAA00165 for ; Fri, 22 Feb 2002 02:26:29 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 02:25:58 -0500 (EST) From: Yih-Chun Hu X-Sender: yihchun@ux6.sp.cs.cmu.edu To: manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Subject: New DSR Draft Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk We submitted our latest Internet-Draft (draft-ietf-manet-dsr-07.txt) today; we consider this to be a work-in-progress as we converge on a solid document to send to the IESG. This draft can be found at http://monarch.cs.rice.edu/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-manet-dsr-07.txt The differences between -06 and -07 represent the major changes that have been suggested as improvements to the draft. Though we invite comment on this current iteration of the draft, but would like an opportunity to further revise this document before the Last Call. Thanks, Yih-Chun From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Fri Feb 22 12:22:38 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id MAA12271 for ; Fri, 22 Feb 2002 12:22:37 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id JAA07977 for manet-outgoing; Fri, 22 Feb 2002 09:43:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from ece.ufl.edu (dot.ece.ufl.edu [128.227.220.22]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id JAA07972 for ; Fri, 22 Feb 2002 09:43:23 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 4090 invoked from network); 22 Feb 2002 14:41:13 -0000 Received: from fang.ece.ufl.edu (128.227.80.157) by dot.ece.ufl.edu with SMTP; 22 Feb 2002 14:41:13 -0000 Received: (from fang@localhost) by fang.ece.ufl.edu (8.9.3/8.9.3) id JAA15142; Fri, 22 Feb 2002 09:41:12 -0500 (EST) X-Authentication-Warning: fang.ece.ufl.edu: Processed from queue /home/faculty/fang/mqueue X-Authentication-Warning: fang.ece.ufl.edu: Processed by fang with -C /home/faculty/fang/bin/sendmail.cf Date: Fri, 22 Feb 2002 09:41:12 -0500 From: Yuguang Fang To: Yuguang Fang Cc: "Professor Mohammad S. Obaidat" Subject: SCS SPECTS'2002 deadline is approaching!!! Message-ID: <20020222094112.A15134@ece.ufl.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0pre4i Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by itd.nrl.navy.mil id JAA07973 Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Dear Colleagues, The deadline is about one week away, you may want to wrap up your paper during the weekend and send it to us before the deadline. Do bear in mind that this symposium is also a part of the celebration of the 50 Years Anniversary of Society for Computer Simulation (SCS) International Michael Fang Submission Deadline: February 28, 2002 %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% (We apologize for the inconvenience this message may cause if you receive multiple copies) Call For Papers 2002 International Symposium on Performance Evaluation of Computer and Telecommunication Systems SPECTS 2002 July 14-19, 2002 U. S. Grant Hotel San Diego, California, USA http://www.scs.org/confernc/spects02/ This annual international conference is a forum for professionals involved in performance evaluation of computer and telecommunication systems. Evaluation of computer systems and networks is needed at every stage in the life cycle of the product including design, manufacturing, sales/purchase, use, upgrade, tuning, etc. The discipline of performance evaluation has progressed rapidly in the past decade, and it has now begun to approach maturity. Significant progress has been made in analytic modeling, simulation, and measurement approaches for performance evaluation of computer and telecommunication systems. Topics of interest include, but are not limited to: Networking and Telecommunication Systems - Internet Technology - Quality of Service (QoS) - DiffServ/IntServ - TCP - Unicast and Multicast Routing - High-Speed Networking - ATM - Optical Networks - Switching Techniques - Teletraffic - Satellite Systems and Networks - Wireless Systems - UMTS/IMT-2000 - Mobile Networks/Computing - Multimedia Systems - Multimedia Communications - Adaptive Communications - Network Protocols - Network Management and Control - Network Capacity Planning - Network Architecture Evaluation - Service and QoS Pricing - Security and Authentication - World Wide Web (WWW) Technology - Electronic Commerce Computer Systems - Client/Server - Microprocessors/Microcomputers - Memory Systems - Interconnection Networks - Software Performance - Software Evaluation and Testing - Hardware and Software Monitors - High-Performance Computing - Workload and Traffic Characterization - Scientific Computing Algorithms - High Performance I/O - Reconfigurable Computing -Real-time Systems - Parallel and Distributed Computing - Distributed Systems and Agents - Massively Parallel Systems - Cluster Computing - Parallel Algorithms and Languages - Scheduling Schemes Tools, Methodologies and Applications - Parallel and Distributed Simulation - Verification and Validation - Performance Tools and Methodologies - Neural Networks and Fuzzy Logic Applications to High Performance Computing/Networking - Performance Optimization - Queueing Systems and Networks - Scalability Studies - Integrated Modeling and Measurement - On-Line Performance Adaptation and Tuning - Process Algebra-Based Models - Performance Bounds - Integrated Design and Performance - New Performance Models - Mathematical Aspects of Performance - New Performability Schemes and Models - Case Studies General Chair Mohammad S. Obaidat Dept. of Computer Science, Monmouth University W. Long Branch, NJ 07764, USA Tel +1-732-571-4482 Fax +1-732-263-5202 E-mail: obaidat@monmouth.edu Senior Program Chair Franco Davoli DIST-University of Genoa Via Opera Pia 13, I-16145 Genoa, Italy Tel +39-010-353-2732 Fax +39-010-353-2154 E-Mail: franco@dist.unige.it Program Co-Chairs Ibrahim Onyuksel Dept. of Computer Sciences, N. Illinois Univ., USA E-mail: onyuksel@cs.niu.edu Raffaele Bolla DIST-University of Genoa Via Opera Pia 13, I-16145 Genoa, Italy E-mail: lelus@dist.unige.it Vice Program Chair Erina Ferro CNUCE, Institute of National Research Council (C.N.R.) C.N.R. Pisa Research Area, Building B, Room 73 Via G. Moruzzi, 1 56124 Pisa, Italy E-mail: erina.ferro@cnuce.cnr.it Industrial Track Chair J. Fox, Motorola Inc., UK E-mail: fox.ijcs@btinternet.com Publicity Chair Yuguang (Michael) Fang, University of Florida, USA, E-mail: fang@ece.ufl.edu Web Master: Daniel Lee, University of Southern California, E-mail: dclee@rcf-fs.usc.edu Technical Program Committee Jagan P. Agrawal, University of Missouri - Kansas City, USA Ian Akyildiz, Georgia Tech., USA M. Atiquzzaman, University of Oklahoma, USA Harmen R. van As, Vienna University of Technology, Austria Louis G. Birta, University of Ottawa, Canada Noureddine Boudriga, University of Tunis, Tunisia Hasan Cam, Arizona State University, USA Andrew Campbell, Columbia University, USA Fabio M. Chiussi, Bell Laboratories, Lucent Technologies, USA Hassan B. Diab, American University of Beirut, Lebanon Gabor Fodor, Ericsson Radio Systems, Sweden John Fox, Motorola, UK Luigi Fratta, Politecnico di Milano, Italy Aura Ganz, University of Massachusetts, USA Erol Gelenbe, University of Central Florida, USA Mario Gerla, UCLA, USA Omar Hammami, ENSTA, France Jarmo Harju, Tampere University of Technology, Finland Herman Hughes, Michigan State University, USA Andrzej Jajszczyk, University of Mining and Metallurgy, Poland Ingemar Kaj, Uppsala University, Sweden Helen Karatza, Aristotle University of Thessalonica, Greece Demetrios Kazakos, University of Louisiana, USA Ulrich Killat, Tech Univ. of Hamburg, Germany Tag Gon Kim, KAIST, Korea Belka Kraimeche, Stevens Institute of Technology, USA Paul J. Kuehn, University of Stuttgart, Germany Kevin Kwiat, Air Force Research Laboratory, USA Veronica Lagrange M. Reis, Compaq Computers Corp., USA Axel Lehmann, Universität der Bundeswehr München, Germany Daniel C. Lee, USC, USA Mike T. Liu, Ohio State University, USA Imad Mahgoub, Florida Atlantic University, USA Sam Makki, Queensland University of Technology, Australia Krzysztof Malinowski, Warsaw Technical University, Poland Jose L. Marzo, Universitat de Girona, Spain Xiannong Meng, Bucknell University, USA Hussein Mouftah, Queen's University, Canada M. Ould-Khaoua, University of Glasgow, UK Sergio Palazzo, Università di Catania, Italy Georgios I. Papadimitriou, Aristotle University, Greece Achille Pattavina, Politecnico di Milano, Italy Krzysztof Pawlikowski, University of Canterbury, New Zealand Steven Pink, University of Arizona, USA George Polyzos, AUEB, Greece Ramon Puigjaner, Universitat de les Illes Balears, Spain Kaliappa Ravindran, CUNY, USA Gian Paolo Rossi, Università di Milano, Italy Izhak Rubin, UCLA, USA Donald Schilling, CUNY, USA Jens B. Schmitt, TU Darmstadt, Germany C. Tim Spracklen, Aberdeen University, UK Tatsuya Suda, UCI, USA Iwao Toda, Fujutsu Laboratories Ltd., Japan Phuoc Tran-Gia, University of Wuerzburg, Germany Kenneth S. Vastola, Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute, USA Manuel Villen-Altamirano, Telefonica, Spain Bernd E. Wolfinger, Hamburg University, Germany Michele Zorzi, Università di Ferrara, Italy International Liaisons B. Sadoun, Al-Balqa' Applied University, Jordan Bsadoun@go.com.jo M. Sawan, Montreal Poly, Canada Sawan@vlsi.polymtl.ca N. Tchamov, Tampere Univ. of Technology, Finland Nikolay@cs.tut.fi Publicity Committee: Hideki Tode, Osaka Univ., Japan, E-mail: Tode@ise.eng.osaka-u.ac.jp Nusseirat, Al-Isra University, Jordan, E-mail: anuseirat@firstnet.com.jo Paper Submission Submit your complete papers electronically to: http://scs.proceedingscentral.com/ All required instructions will be posted on this web site. Submissions should not exceed 25 double-spaced, 8.5x11 inch pages (including figures, tables, and references) in 10-12 point font. Include five to ten keywords, complete postal and e-mail addresses, and fax and phone numbers of corresponding author. If you have difficulty in electronic submission, contact the Web Master, Program Chairs or the Conference Coordinator, Mr. Steve Branch, The Society for Modeling and Simulation International, 4838 Ronson Court, Suite L, San Diego, CA 92111, USA, Tel 858-277-3888, Fax 858-277-3930, E-mail sbranch@scs.org sbranch@scs.org. Extended versions of accepted papers in SPECTS 2002 will be considered for possible publication in scholarly journals. Proposals for tutorials, special and panel sessions should be sent to the Conference Senior Program Chair. Proposals for industrial sessions should be submitted to the Industrial Track Chair. For more information regarding presentations or exhibitions at SPECTS 2002 contact: Mr. Steve Branch at the address shown above. Deadlines Submission of Papers: Extended to February 28, 2002. Notification of Acceptance - April 22, 2002 Final Camera-Ready Submission - May 22, 2002 Sponsored by The Society for Modeling and Simulation International. -- %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% Yuguang "Michael" Fang, Ph.D Assistant Professor Department of Electrical and Computer Engineering University of Florida 435 Engineering Building, P.O.Box 116130 Gainesville, FL 32611 Tel: (352) 846-3043, Fax: (352) 392-0044 Email: fang@ece.ufl.edu, http://www.fang.ece.ufl.edu %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Sat Feb 23 12:29:42 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id MAA21977 for ; Sat, 23 Feb 2002 12:29:42 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id JAA02682 for manet-outgoing; Sat, 23 Feb 2002 09:56:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from netcore.fi (netcore.fi [193.94.160.1]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id JAA02677 for ; Sat, 23 Feb 2002 09:56:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost (pekkas@localhost) by netcore.fi (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g1NEuNh24357; Sat, 23 Feb 2002 16:56:23 +0200 Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 16:56:22 +0200 (EET) From: Pekka Savola To: Yih-Chun Hu cc: manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Subject: Re: New DSR Draft In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk On Fri, 22 Feb 2002, Yih-Chun Hu wrote: > We submitted our latest Internet-Draft (draft-ietf-manet-dsr-07.txt) > today; we consider this to be a work-in-progress as we converge on a solid > document to send to the IESG. This draft can be found at > http://monarch.cs.rice.edu/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-manet-dsr-07.txt > > The differences between -06 and -07 represent the major changes that have > been suggested as improvements to the draft. Though we invite comment on > this current iteration of the draft, but would like an opportunity to > further revise this document before the Last Call. I read -06 a week ago because I'll have to write a paper about it in a month or so.. and let's just say I didn't like what I read (everybody must trust everybody 100%, changing IP to be a reliable protocol by retransmissions, total incompatibility with anything like IPSEC, piggybacking data and routing control, forcing every router to look into DSR header killing "fast path" etc.); it seemed to be a nice piece of academic work, "mental masturbation" some might say, but totally unapplicable in any real use except, perhaps, for some very special cases where the assumptions hold (perhaps some military networks). But then again, this was a first manet draft I read, so perhaps all of them are more or less of the same. I'll try to give more concrete feedback within some weeks but I'm not sure if that's going to help any as the basic assumptions seem to vary quite a bit. -- Pekka Savola "Tell me of difficulties surmounted, Netcore Oy not those you stumble over and fall" Systems. Networks. Security. -- Robert Jordan: A Crown of Swords From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Sat Feb 23 17:00:39 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id RAA24535 for ; Sat, 23 Feb 2002 17:00:39 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id OAA05439 for manet-outgoing; Sat, 23 Feb 2002 14:53:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from ux6.sp.cs.cmu.edu (UX6.SP.CS.CMU.EDU [128.2.181.250]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id OAA05434 for ; Sat, 23 Feb 2002 14:53:48 -0500 (EST) Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 14:53:39 -0500 (EST) From: Yih-Chun Hu X-Sender: yihchun@ux6.sp.cs.cmu.edu To: Pekka Savola cc: manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Subject: Re: New DSR Draft In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk >I read -06 a week ago because I'll have to write a paper about it in a >month or so.. and let's just say I didn't like what I read (everybody must >trust everybody 100%, This is a given in manet. A number of groups are working on security right now, but that is very much an area of research. Also consider how BGP is implemented in the Internet today. Is that an unrealistic level of trust as well? >changing IP to be a reliable protocol by >retransmissions, We're not trying to make IP reliable; the retransmissions are for the purposes of neighbor detection. This is clarified in -07, where only the neighbor reachability acknowledgements are retransmitted. >total incompatibility with anything like IPSEC, I don't see how it's completely incompatible with IPsec. Anything below the DSR header can be encrypted or authenticated, in the same way as Hop-By-Hop options in IPv6 are normalized before AH processing. >piggybacking data and routing control, I fail to see how this is a problem. How is this different from, say, IPv6 Routing Headers? >forcing every router to look into >DSR header killing "fast path" etc You're only checking the IP Protocol number for default flow forwarding (dsrflow-00). Furthermore, if you need to run a manet routing protocol on superfast links where you actually need fast path, you should seriously consider RIP or DSDV; it's precisely those cases where you can just throw bandwidth at the problem. Furthermore, all of manet by definition either sacrifices fast path performance or kills scalability due to lack of address aggregation, so mindlessly evaluating manet protocols from an Internet routing requirements document isn't meaningful. >.); it seemed to be a nice piece of >academic work, [...] but totally >unapplicable in any real use except, perhaps, for some very special cases >where the assumptions hold (perhaps some military networks). If you don't believe the assumptions, perhaps other IETF working groups in the routing area would interest you more. Most of the people actively working in the manet WG would strongly disagree with you on this point, and in each of our research papers on the area, we stress the scenarios where ad hoc networks may be applicable. Our papers can be found at: http://monarch.cs.rice.edu/papers.html >But then again, this was a first manet draft I read, so perhaps all of >them are more or less of the same. > >I'll try to give more concrete feedback within some weeks but I'm not sure >if that's going to help any as the basic assumptions seem to vary quite a >bit. > >-- >Pekka Savola "Tell me of difficulties surmounted, >Netcore Oy not those you stumble over and fall" >Systems. Networks. Security. -- Robert Jordan: A Crown of Swords From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Sat Feb 23 18:55:58 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id SAA25459 for ; Sat, 23 Feb 2002 18:55:58 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id RAA06331 for manet-outgoing; Sat, 23 Feb 2002 17:00:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from memphis.ece.cornell.edu (memphis.ece.cornell.edu [128.84.81.8]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id RAA06326 for ; Sat, 23 Feb 2002 17:00:56 -0500 (EST) From: haas@ece.cornell.edu Received: from verdi.ee.cornell.edu (verdi.ee.cornell.edu [128.84.240.71]) by memphis.ece.cornell.edu (8.11.6/8.11.2) with ESMTP id g1NLnsX01008; Sat, 23 Feb 2002 16:49:54 -0500 Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 17:00:51 -0500 (EST) X-Sender: haas@verdi.ee.cornell.edu To: Yih-Chun Hu cc: Pekka Savola , manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Subject: Re: New DSR Draft In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Hi, > >I read -06 a week ago because I'll have to write a paper about it in a > >month or so.. and let's just say I didn't like what I read (everybody must > >trust everybody 100%, > > This is a given in manet. A number of groups are working on security right > now, but that is very much an area of research. Also consider how BGP is > implemented in the Internet today. Is that an unrealistic level of trust > as well? In order to implement Secure Routing, there is *no* need for full trust relations among the nodes (i.e., no everyone has to trust everyone else). For more inofrmation, see the Secure Routing Protocol (SRP): P.Papadimitratos and Z.J. Haas, "Secure Routing for Mobile Ad Hoc Networks," SCS Communication Networks and Distributed Systems Modeling and Simulation Conference (CNDS 2002), San Antonio, TX, January 27-31, 2002. You can download it from our WNL web page. Enjoy! Zygmunt. ==-=-==== ~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~- Prof. Zygmunt J. Haas http://people.ece.cornell.edu/haas Wireless Networks Laboratory http://wnl.ece.cornell.edu School of Electrical Engineering Cornell University tel: +1-607-255-3454 323 Frank Rhodes Hall fax: +1-607-255-9072 Ithaca, NY 14853 e-mail: haas@ece.cornell.edu U.S.A WNL web page: http://wnl.ece.cornell.edu ~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~- From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Sat Feb 23 19:33:57 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id TAA25724 for ; Sat, 23 Feb 2002 19:33:57 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id RAA06792 for manet-outgoing; Sat, 23 Feb 2002 17:45:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from netcore.fi (netcore.fi [193.94.160.1]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id RAA06781 for ; Sat, 23 Feb 2002 17:45:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost (pekkas@localhost) by netcore.fi (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g1NMjnD27528; Sun, 24 Feb 2002 00:45:49 +0200 Date: Sun, 24 Feb 2002 00:45:49 +0200 (EET) From: Pekka Savola To: Yih-Chun Hu cc: manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Subject: Re: New DSR Draft In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk I had wanted to avoid further comments for a few weeks, but I'll comment on a few issues. On Sat, 23 Feb 2002, Yih-Chun Hu wrote: > >total incompatibility with anything like IPSEC, > > I don't see how it's completely incompatible with IPsec. Anything below > the DSR header can be encrypted or authenticated, in the same way as > Hop-By-Hop options in IPv6 are normalized before AH processing. Source/destination addresses are usually included in IPSEC ICV calculations, and AFAIR these can change in transit (I recall some oddness with 255.255.255.255 at least, but not sure). By the way, have you considered whether wide-scale use of 255.255.255.255 is a good idea? If it's supposed to work off-link, I sense a new directed-broadcast -style attack wave coming (using routing header as a reflector from the remote router). > >piggybacking data and routing control, > > I fail to see how this is a problem. How is this different from, say, IPv6 > Routing Headers? Routing Headers aren't significantly overwritten in the process of being transferred around the network. AFAIR, whole DSR options can be removed or added while in transit. Note that if above is true, this could be rather problematic from Path MTU discovery perspective. There are some issues with routing headers, by the way, especially in production networks: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-savola-ipv6-rh-ha-security-01.txt most of these don't probably apply to the DSR scenario. > >forcing every router to look into > >DSR header killing "fast path" etc > > You're only checking the IP Protocol number for default flow forwarding > (dsrflow-00). Furthermore, if you need to run a manet routing protocol on > superfast links where you actually need fast path, you should seriously > consider RIP or DSDV; it's precisely those cases where you can just throw > bandwidth at the problem. Furthermore, all of manet by definition either > sacrifices fast path performance or kills scalability due to lack of > address aggregation, so mindlessly evaluating manet protocols from an > Internet routing requirements document isn't meaningful. Another, related problem: all routers must support DSR, else they can't dig into DSR header's options and see if they should process the header. (as the router is not the destination address of the packets.) > >.); it seemed to be a nice piece of > >academic work, [...] but totally > >unapplicable in any real use except, perhaps, for some very special cases > >where the assumptions hold (perhaps some military networks). > > If you don't believe the assumptions, For example, you refer to 802.11 as a potential technique, rely solely on the security of the link-layer, but we all know that for practical purposes there exists none in 802.11. -- Pekka Savola "Tell me of difficulties surmounted, Netcore Oy not those you stumble over and fall" Systems. Networks. Security. -- Robert Jordan: A Crown of Swords From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Sat Feb 23 19:33:57 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id TAA25726 for ; Sat, 23 Feb 2002 19:33:57 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id RAA06773 for manet-outgoing; Sat, 23 Feb 2002 17:45:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from memphis.ece.cornell.edu (memphis.ece.cornell.edu [128.84.81.8]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id RAA06768 for ; Sat, 23 Feb 2002 17:45:03 -0500 (EST) From: haas@ece.cornell.edu Received: from verdi.ee.cornell.edu (verdi.ee.cornell.edu [128.84.240.71]) by memphis.ece.cornell.edu (8.11.6/8.11.2) with ESMTP id g1NMY2X01738; Sat, 23 Feb 2002 17:34:02 -0500 Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 17:45:00 -0500 (EST) X-Sender: haas@verdi.ee.cornell.edu To: Yih-Chun Hu cc: Pekka Savola , manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Subject: Re: New DSR Draft In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk > By no means do I intend to belittle recent progress in the area of > practical, secure routing mechanisms for ad hoc networks; I'm only > pointing out that _none_ of the current manet WG IDs do an acceptable job > of providing security, and that for some time to come (at least a year or > two) none of the proposed secure protocols make sense as Experimental > RFCs. Hmmm, to backup such a strong claim, you would need to show that there is a substantial flaw in *every* secure routing mechanisms proposed there. This might be tough call .... I agree with you that various of those schemes have different assumptions- some more realistic than others. (For instance, as opposed to other works, our scheme has the salient features that it does not require security binding between *intermediate* nodes; only between the "source" and the "destination".) But even if some of the assumptions in some schemes (others, not ours (:-)), make less than realistic assumption, I feel that your statement that "none_ of the current manet WG IDs do an acceptable job of providing security" is a bit too harsh. Wouldn't you agree? Zygmunt. ==--=-==-== ~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~- Prof. Zygmunt J. Haas http://people.ece.cornell.edu/haas Wireless Networks Laboratory http://wnl.ece.cornell.edu School of Electrical Engineering Cornell University tel: +1-607-255-3454 323 Frank Rhodes Hall fax: +1-607-255-9072 Ithaca, NY 14853 e-mail: haas@ece.cornell.edu U.S.A WNL web page: http://wnl.ece.cornell.edu ~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~- > > >> This is a given in manet. A number of groups are working on security right > >> now, but that is very much an area of research. Also consider how BGP is > >> implemented in the Internet today. Is that an unrealistic level of trust > >> as well? > > > >In order to implement Secure Routing, there is *no* need for full > >trust relations among the nodes (i.e., no everyone has to trust > >everyone else). > > Also, > Radia Perlman. Network Layer Protocols with Byzantine Robustness. > Technical Report, MIT Laboratory for Computer Science #429, October 1988. > > Manel Guerrero Zapata. Secure Ad hoc On-Demand Distance Vector (SAODV) > Routing. IETF MANET Mailing List, Message-ID: > 3BC17B40.BBF52E09@nokia.com, URL: > ftp://manet.itd.nrl.navy.mil/pub/manet/2001-10.mail, October 8, 2001. > > Bridget Dahill, Brian Neil Levine, Elizabeth Royer, and Clay Shields. A > Secure Routing Protocol for Ad Hoc Networks, Technical > Report UM-CS-2001-037, University of Michigan, August 2001. > > Seung Yi, Prasad Naldurg and Robin Kravets. Security-Aware Ad hoc Routing > for Wireless Networks. Technical Report UIUCDCS-R-2001-2241, UIUC, August > 2001. > > My point is that none of these papers have been out long enough or > publicized well enough or independantly tested using simulation and > implementation to be a serious candidate within manet at the present time. > Furthermore, no single manet-wide threat model has ever been defined, so > if you adopt the no node compromise model, MAC layer encryption with > integrity is sufficient, and if you assume no single trusted entity, you > need a PGP-style web-of-trust for certificates. > > By no means do I intend to belittle recent progress in the area of > practical, secure routing mechanisms for ad hoc networks; I'm only > pointing out that _none_ of the current manet WG IDs do an acceptable job > of providing security, and that for some time to come (at least a year or > two) none of the proposed secure protocols make sense as Experimental > RFCs. > > Yih-Chun > From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Sat Feb 23 19:34:04 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id TAA25748 for ; Sat, 23 Feb 2002 19:34:04 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id RAA06657 for manet-outgoing; Sat, 23 Feb 2002 17:37:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from ux6.sp.cs.cmu.edu (UX6.SP.CS.CMU.EDU [128.2.181.250]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id RAA06652 for ; Sat, 23 Feb 2002 17:36:58 -0500 (EST) Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 17:36:25 -0500 (EST) From: Yih-Chun Hu X-Sender: yihchun@ux6.sp.cs.cmu.edu To: haas@ece.cornell.edu cc: Pekka Savola , manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Subject: Re: New DSR Draft In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk >> This is a given in manet. A number of groups are working on security right >> now, but that is very much an area of research. Also consider how BGP is >> implemented in the Internet today. Is that an unrealistic level of trust >> as well? > >In order to implement Secure Routing, there is *no* need for full >trust relations among the nodes (i.e., no everyone has to trust >everyone else). Also, Radia Perlman. Network Layer Protocols with Byzantine Robustness. Technical Report, MIT Laboratory for Computer Science #429, October 1988. Manel Guerrero Zapata. Secure Ad hoc On-Demand Distance Vector (SAODV) Routing. IETF MANET Mailing List, Message-ID: 3BC17B40.BBF52E09@nokia.com, URL: ftp://manet.itd.nrl.navy.mil/pub/manet/2001-10.mail, October 8, 2001. Bridget Dahill, Brian Neil Levine, Elizabeth Royer, and Clay Shields. A Secure Routing Protocol for Ad Hoc Networks, Technical Report UM-CS-2001-037, University of Michigan, August 2001. Seung Yi, Prasad Naldurg and Robin Kravets. Security-Aware Ad hoc Routing for Wireless Networks. Technical Report UIUCDCS-R-2001-2241, UIUC, August 2001. My point is that none of these papers have been out long enough or publicized well enough or independantly tested using simulation and implementation to be a serious candidate within manet at the present time. Furthermore, no single manet-wide threat model has ever been defined, so if you adopt the no node compromise model, MAC layer encryption with integrity is sufficient, and if you assume no single trusted entity, you need a PGP-style web-of-trust for certificates. By no means do I intend to belittle recent progress in the area of practical, secure routing mechanisms for ad hoc networks; I'm only pointing out that _none_ of the current manet WG IDs do an acceptable job of providing security, and that for some time to come (at least a year or two) none of the proposed secure protocols make sense as Experimental RFCs. Yih-Chun From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Sat Feb 23 20:20:15 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id UAA25996 for ; Sat, 23 Feb 2002 20:20:15 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id SAA07301 for manet-outgoing; Sat, 23 Feb 2002 18:07:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from ux6.sp.cs.cmu.edu (UX6.SP.CS.CMU.EDU [128.2.181.250]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id SAA07290 for ; Sat, 23 Feb 2002 18:07:48 -0500 (EST) Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 18:07:40 -0500 (EST) From: Yih-Chun Hu X-Sender: yihchun@ux6.sp.cs.cmu.edu To: Pekka Savola cc: manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Subject: Re: New DSR Draft In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk >> I don't see how it's completely incompatible with IPsec. Anything below >> the DSR header can be encrypted or authenticated, in the same way as >> Hop-By-Hop options in IPv6 are normalized before AH processing. > >Source/destination addresses are usually included in IPSEC ICV >calculations, and AFAIR these can change in transit (I recall some oddness >with 255.255.255.255 at least, but not sure). Nope. DSR doesn't change these in transit (or if it does, for route request piggyback, it'll change them back before delivery to IP). >By the way, have you considered whether wide-scale use of 255.255.255.255 >is a good idea? If it's supposed to work off-link, I sense a new >directed-broadcast -style attack wave coming (using routing header as a >reflector from the remote router). That's filterable. A good point, though, for the (I think several) groups here working on internet bridging. In any case, manet has considered a 1-hop all manet nodes multicast address. I don't know the status of that. If it's there, we should use it. If not, maybe we should make one. >> I fail to see how this is a problem. How is this different from, say, IPv6 >> Routing Headers? > >Routing Headers aren't significantly overwritten in the process of being >transferred around the network. AFAIR, whole DSR options can be removed >or added while in transit. Entire options, yes, but generally the header will stay intact. In almost all cases, any options will stick around. A few (ie acknowledgement) are hop-by-hop, but they're rarely used in typical networks (MACA/MACAW style MAC, bidirectional, ...). IPv6 Source Route headers have addresses swapped around inside, so that's some amount of change. I'm wondering if there's any practical difference between (occasional) substantial change and consistant "slight" change. >Note that if above is true, this could be rather problematic from Path MTU >discovery perspective. Understood. But there are standard tricks that can be played with Path MTU discovery. And as long as a single route is being used, Path MTU works just fine. Just as in the Real World, when the route changes, the MTU might as well. >> bandwidth at the problem. Furthermore, all of manet by definition either >> sacrifices fast path performance or kills scalability due to lack of >> address aggregation, so mindlessly evaluating manet protocols from an >> Internet routing requirements document isn't meaningful. > >Another, related problem: all routers must support DSR, else they can't >dig into DSR header's options and see if they should process the header. >(as the router is not the destination address of the packets.) (This is another point I spoke too quickly on. AODV provides some level of address aggregation, but the protocol as currently specified doesn't provide dynamic aggregation. As a result, nodes within an aggregated route record must be routable from the replier.) Yes, all routers must support DSR. Just like all Internet gateway routers must support BGP. Most routing protocols work this way, right? >> If you don't believe the assumptions, > >For example, you refer to 802.11 as a potential technique, rely solely on >the security of the link-layer, but we all know that for practical >purposes there exists none in 802.11. Yes, yes, 802.11 has woeful security problems. Even if you addressed issues like WEP, DOS attacks are trivial. Link-layer encryption should be "correctly" implemented at some point; otherwise, several, less-reviewed, incompatible layers could be added to {DSR,AODV,TBRPF,OLSR,FSR,IERP,IARP,BRP,LANMAR}, or we could all agree on a manet-wide security shim. Not that I'm at all biased about which solution I prefer ;) Yih-Chun From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Sat Feb 23 20:46:52 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id UAA26146 for ; Sat, 23 Feb 2002 20:46:52 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id SAA08032 for manet-outgoing; Sat, 23 Feb 2002 18:51:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from ux6.sp.cs.cmu.edu (UX6.SP.CS.CMU.EDU [128.2.181.250]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id SAA08027 for ; Sat, 23 Feb 2002 18:51:39 -0500 (EST) Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2002 18:50:16 -0500 (EST) From: Yih-Chun Hu X-Sender: yihchun@ux6.sp.cs.cmu.edu To: haas@ece.cornell.edu cc: manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Subject: Re: New DSR Draft In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk >> By no means do I intend to belittle recent progress in the area of >> practical, secure routing mechanisms for ad hoc networks; I'm only >> pointing out that _none_ of the current manet WG IDs do an acceptable job >> of providing security, and that for some time to come (at least a year or >> two) none of the proposed secure protocols make sense as Experimental >> RFCs. > >Hmmm, to backup such a strong claim, you would need to show that there >is a substantial flaw in *every* secure routing mechanisms proposed there. >This might be tough call .... No, I'm saying that it'll take a year for any of these protocols to mature and be well-enough cooked for WG consensus on publication as an Experimental RFC. The sense of time referred to the RFC, not to the work. >I agree with you that various of those schemes have different assumptions- >some more realistic than others. (For instance, as opposed to other >works, our scheme has the salient features that it does not require >security binding between *intermediate* nodes; only between the "source" >and the "destination".) I generally agree that that's a good assumption. Having certificates for all nodes may be reasonable as well, and the you can use those certs to set up a security association on-demand. Your earlier work with multiple CAs, however, may be a more conservative assumption, and the military-types may like that, instead. >But even if some of the assumptions in some >schemes (others, not ours (:-)), make less than realistic assumption, I >feel that your statement that "none_ of the current manet WG IDs do an >acceptable job of providing security" is a bit too harsh. Wouldn't you >agree? The current manet WG IDs (http://www.ietf.org/html.charters/manet-charter.html) are: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-manet-aodv-10.txt which says "Currently, AODV does not specify any special security measures" http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-manet-tora-spec-04.txt which says "TBD" under Security Considerations http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-manet-dsr-07.txt the draft that sparked this... discussion http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-manet-olsr-05.txt which has no security considerations section http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-manet-tbrpf-04.txt which vaguely alludes to using IPsec to cover all evil http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-manet-lanmar-03.txt which has no security considerations section http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-manet-simple-mbcast-01.txt the same cop out as the DSR draft http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-manet-fsr-02.txt which has no security considerations section http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-manet-zone-ierp-01.txt which has no security considerations section http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-manet-zone-iarp-01.txt which has no security considerations section http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-manet-zone-brp-01.txt which has no security considerations section http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-manet-dsrflow-00.txt the same cop out as the DSR draft http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-manet-bcast-00.txt "It does not make any provision for securing the contents of the flooded data, either to protect against tampering or to protect against unauthorized inspection of the data." Which one of these provides acceptable security? I'm not trying to downplay anyone's work in secure routing, or in general ad hoc network routing. It's very possible that your work or any of the other group's work could provide acceptable security in a number of environments. I'm just (rather bluntly) stating that this is a young and not very well understood area. There is good work in this area, and work is progressing, but to say that the community at large has confidence in any one protocol would be premature. Yih-Chun >~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~- >Prof. Zygmunt J. Haas http://people.ece.cornell.edu/haas >Wireless Networks Laboratory http://wnl.ece.cornell.edu >School of Electrical Engineering >Cornell University tel: +1-607-255-3454 >323 Frank Rhodes Hall fax: +1-607-255-9072 >Ithaca, NY 14853 e-mail: haas@ece.cornell.edu >U.S.A > WNL web page: http://wnl.ece.cornell.edu >~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~- From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Sun Feb 24 10:00:08 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id KAA11759 for ; Sun, 24 Feb 2002 10:00:07 -0500 (EST) From: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id HAA13924 for manet-outgoing; Sun, 24 Feb 2002 07:45:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from GLUON (209246018130.customer.ionix.net [209.246.18.130]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id HAA13917 for ; Sun, 24 Feb 2002 07:45:25 -0500 (EST) Date: Sun, 24 Feb 2002 07:45:25 -0500 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AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAA= --====_ABC123456j7890DEF_==== --====_ABC123456j7890DEF_====-- From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Mon Feb 25 05:11:25 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id FAA03786 for ; Mon, 25 Feb 2002 05:11:25 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id CAA23182 for manet-outgoing; Mon, 25 Feb 2002 02:36:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from malonne.lifl.fr (malonne.lifl.fr [134.206.10.29]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id CAA23174 for ; Mon, 25 Feb 2002 02:36:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from KRIEK (kriek.lifl.fr [134.206.11.16]) by malonne.lifl.fr (8.9.3/jtpda-5.3.3) with ESMTP id IAA10182 ; Mon, 25 Feb 2002 08:36:46 +0100 (MET) From: "David Simplot" To: "'MEDDOUR Djamal Eddine thesard FTRD/DAC/LAN'" , Subject: RE : others cretaria in MANET routing protocol Date: Mon, 25 Feb 2002 08:36:49 +0100 Organization: LIFL - RD2P Message-ID: <001601c1bdcf$3c8edc80$100bce86@lifl.fr> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0017_01C1BDD7.9E534480" X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 In-Reply-To: <0489A7888F080B4BA73B53F7E145F29A03C054@LANMHS20.rd.francetelecom.fr> Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk C'est un message de format MIME en plusieurs parties. ------=_NextPart_000_0017_01C1BDD7.9E534480 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="x-user-defined" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable You are right: perhaps we can consider the "robustness" of the generated route... The definition of "robustness" could be the probability that the route stays valid during a given time without route maintenance. Notice that, in the general case, an optimal route (number of hops) is not a robust one. David. -- David SIMPLOT CNRS UPRESA 8022 - LIFL Univ. Lille 1 / IUP MIAGE Formation Continue http://www.lifl.fr/~simplot=20 =20 -----Message d'origine----- De : owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil [mailto:owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil] De la part de MEDDOUR Djamal Eddine thesard FTRD/DAC/LAN Envoy=E9 : mardi 19 f=E9vrier 2002 09:57 =C0 : manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Objet : others cretaria in MANET routing protocol Hi all=20 The criteria of the choice of the optimal route is the number of hops, do you think that it's sufficient? Why don't take in consideration some other criteria like traffic load around node, node energy, node capacity, ... Any comments ------=_NextPart_000_0017_01C1BDD7.9E534480 Content-Type: text/html; charset="x-user-defined" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message
You=20 are right: perhaps we can consider the "robustness" of the generated = route...=20 The definition of "robustness" could be the probability that the route = stays=20 valid during a given time without route maintenance. Notice that, in the = general=20 case, an optimal route (number of hops) is not a robust one.
David.

--
David SIMPLOT
CNRS UPRESA 8022 - LIFL Univ. = Lille 1 /=20 IUP MIAGE Formation Continue
http://www.lifl.fr/~simplot=20

 
-----Message d'origine-----
De :=20 owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil [mailto:owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil] = De la=20 part de MEDDOUR Djamal Eddine thesard = FTRD/DAC/LAN
Envoy=E9 :=20 mardi 19 f=E9vrier 2002 09:57
=C0 :=20 manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil
Objet : others cretaria in MANET = routing=20 protocol

Hi=20 all=20

The=20 criteria of the choice of the optimal route is the number of = hops, do you=20 think that it's sufficient? Why don't take in consideration some other criteria like traffic load=20 around nodenode = energy,=20 node capacity, ...

Any = comments

<= /HTML> ------=_NextPart_000_0017_01C1BDD7.9E534480-- From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Mon Feb 25 05:23:45 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id FAA03916 for ; Mon, 25 Feb 2002 05:23:45 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id DAA23658 for manet-outgoing; Mon, 25 Feb 2002 03:27:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from david.siemens.de (david.siemens.de [192.35.17.14]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id DAA23652; Mon, 25 Feb 2002 03:27:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail2.siemens.de (mail2.siemens.de [139.25.208.11]) by david.siemens.de (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g1P8R1d27681; Mon, 25 Feb 2002 09:27:01 +0100 (MET) Received: from mail-y.mchp.siemens.de (mail-y.mchp.siemens.de [139.23.202.157]) by mail2.siemens.de (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id g1P8R1g14297; Mon, 25 Feb 2002 09:27:01 +0100 (MET) Received: from york.mchp.siemens.de (york [139.23.202.159]) by mail-y.mchp.siemens.de with ESMTP id g1P8R0AR007989; Mon, 25 Feb 2002 09:27:00 +0100 (MET) Received: from localhost (mbahr@localhost) by york.mchp.siemens.de with SMTP id g1P8QxAk002719; Mon, 25 Feb 2002 09:26:59 +0100 (MET) Date: Mon, 25 Feb 2002 09:26:58 +0100 (MET) From: Michael Bahr To: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil cc: manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Subject: Virus in: Re: AW: column spanned in multicolumn region In-Reply-To: <200202241245.HAA13917@itd.nrl.navy.mil> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Hi all, The email with subject "Re: AW: column spanned in multicolumn region" from owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil contains the Nimda-virus. Do not open the attachment. Anyway, it isn't a wav-file, its an exe-file containing the virus. Just throw the email away (and delete your "Deleted Messages Folder" as well). All the best, Michael Bahr From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Mon Feb 25 08:41:41 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id IAA09690 for ; Mon, 25 Feb 2002 08:41:41 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id GAA25751 for manet-outgoing; Mon, 25 Feb 2002 06:24:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf.org (odin.ietf.org [132.151.1.176]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id GAA25743 for ; Mon, 25 Feb 2002 06:24:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from CNRI.Reston.VA.US (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id GAA05208; Mon, 25 Feb 2002 06:24:15 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <200202251124.GAA05208@ietf.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Multipart/Mixed; Boundary="NextPart" To: IETF-Announce: ; Cc: manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil From: Internet-Drafts@ietf.org Reply-to: Internet-Drafts@ietf.org Subject: I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-manet-dsr-07.txt Date: Mon, 25 Feb 2002 06:24:15 -0500 Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk --NextPart A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Mobile Ad-hoc Networks Working Group of the IETF. Title : The Dynamic Source Routing Protocol for Mobile Ad Hoc Networks (DSR) Author(s) : D. Johnson, D. Maltz, Y. Hu, J. Jetcheva Filename : draft-ietf-manet-dsr-07.txt Pages : 81 Date : 22-Feb-02 The Dynamic Source Routing protocol (DSR) is a simple and efficient routing protocol designed specifically for use in multi-hop wireless ad hoc networks of mobile nodes. DSR allows the network to be completely self-organizing and self-configuring, without the need for any existing network infrastructure or administration. The protocol is composed of the two mechanisms of 'Route Discovery' and 'Route Maintenance', which work together to allow nodes to discover and maintain source routes to arbitrary destinations in the ad hoc network. The use of source routing allows packet routing to be trivially loop-free, avoids the need for up-to-date routing information in the intermediate nodes through which packets are forwarded, and allows nodes forwarding or overhearing packets to cache the routing information in them for their own future use. All aspects of the protocol operate entirely on-demand, allowing the routing packet overhead of DSR to scale automatically to only that needed to react to changes in the routes currently in use. This document specifies the operation of the DSR protocol for routing unicast IP packets in multi-hop wireless ad hoc networks. A URL for this Internet-Draft is: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-manet-dsr-07.txt To remove yourself from the IETF Announcement list, send a message to ietf-announce-request with the word unsubscribe in the body of the message. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP. Login with the username "anonymous" and a password of your e-mail address. After logging in, type "cd internet-drafts" and then "get draft-ietf-manet-dsr-07.txt". A list of Internet-Drafts directories can be found in http://www.ietf.org/shadow.html or ftp://ftp.ietf.org/ietf/1shadow-sites.txt Internet-Drafts can also be obtained by e-mail. Send a message to: mailserv@ietf.org. In the body type: "FILE /internet-drafts/draft-ietf-manet-dsr-07.txt". NOTE: The mail server at ietf.org can return the document in MIME-encoded form by using the "mpack" utility. To use this feature, insert the command "ENCODING mime" before the "FILE" command. To decode the response(s), you will need "munpack" or a MIME-compliant mail reader. Different MIME-compliant mail readers exhibit different behavior, especially when dealing with "multipart" MIME messages (i.e. documents which have been split up into multiple messages), so check your local documentation on how to manipulate these messages. Below is the data which will enable a MIME compliant mail reader implementation to automatically retrieve the ASCII version of the Internet-Draft. --NextPart Content-Type: Multipart/Alternative; Boundary="OtherAccess" --OtherAccess Content-Type: Message/External-body; access-type="mail-server"; server="mailserv@ietf.org" Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: <20020222110859.I-D@ietf.org> ENCODING mime FILE /internet-drafts/draft-ietf-manet-dsr-07.txt --OtherAccess Content-Type: Message/External-body; name="draft-ietf-manet-dsr-07.txt"; site="ftp.ietf.org"; access-type="anon-ftp"; directory="internet-drafts" Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: <20020222110859.I-D@ietf.org> --OtherAccess-- --NextPart-- From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Mon Feb 25 09:28:53 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id JAA11447 for ; Mon, 25 Feb 2002 09:28:53 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id GAA25625 for manet-outgoing; Mon, 25 Feb 2002 06:13:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from maredsous.cs.rice.edu (maredsous.cs.rice.edu [128.42.1.54]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id GAA25620 for ; Mon, 25 Feb 2002 06:13:40 -0500 (EST) Received: (from dbj@localhost) by maredsous.cs.rice.edu id g1PBM6b58297; Mon, 25 Feb 2002 05:22:06 -0600 (CST) Date: Mon, 25 Feb 2002 05:22:06 -0600 From: Dave Johnson To: David Simplot Cc: "'MEDDOUR Djamal Eddine thesard FTRD/DAC/LAN'" , manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Subject: Re: RE : others cretaria in MANET routing protocol Message-ID: <20020225052206.A58153@maredsous.cs.rice.edu> Reply-To: Dave Johnson References: <0489A7888F080B4BA73B53F7E145F29A03C054@LANMHS20.rd.francetelecom.fr> <001601c1bdcf$3c8edc80$100bce86@lifl.fr> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit In-Reply-To: <001601c1bdcf$3c8edc80$100bce86@lifl.fr>; from David.Simplot@lifl.fr on Mon, 25 Feb 2002 08:36:49AM +0100 Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit The real problem is actually fairly complex. Suggesting that robustness may be more important than minimal hop count -- that you care more that a route remains valid during a given time without need for route maintenance -- seems to imply that route maintenance has some significant harmful effect to a route in use, more so than the extra overhead and latency and battery consumption caused by sending packets over routes that involve more hops than are otherwise necessary. If, instead, route maintenance can be done quickly and effeciently when needed, without significant disturbance to the flow of packets from that source to that destination, then perhaps this definition of robustness is less important. I don't at all mean to suggest that robustness actually is not important, but there are many factors that affect the "optimal" choice of routes that any given sender may want to use for any given type of traffic. In our paper "Caching Strategies in On-Demand Routing Protocols for Wireless Ad Hoc Network" at MobiCom 2000, one of our results was a new route caching strategy in which a sending node selects from its cache the route that it knows with minimum hop count to the destination, but among those with that same hop count, it selects the one that it believes will remain valid for the longest period of time, based on its past observations of links involving the nodes along that route. This caching strategy, which we call Link-MaxLife, performed overall better than other caches we studied. This cache is also the recommended cache in the DSR Internet-Draft. This MobiCom paper is available from our web site at http://www.monarch.cs.rice.edu/monarch-papers/mobicom2000.pdf. Dave David Simplot said: > You are right: perhaps we can consider the "robustness" of the generated > route... The definition of "robustness" could be the probability that > the route stays valid during a given time without route maintenance. > Notice that, in the general case, an optimal route (number of hops) is > not a robust one. > David. > -- > David SIMPLOT > CNRS UPRESA 8022 - LIFL Univ. Lille 1 / IUP MIAGE Formation Continue > http://www.lifl.fr/~simplot > > > > -----Message d'origine----- > De : owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil [mailto:owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil] > De la part de MEDDOUR Djamal Eddine thesard FTRD/DAC/LAN > Envoyé : mardi 19 février 2002 09:57 > À : manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil > Objet : others cretaria in MANET routing protocol > > > Hi all > > The criteria of the choice of the optimal route is the number of hops, > do you think that it's sufficient? Why don't take in consideration some > other criteria like traffic load around node, node energy, node > capacity, ... > > Any comments > From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Mon Feb 25 09:47:39 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id JAA12279 for ; Mon, 25 Feb 2002 09:47:38 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id HAA26816 for manet-outgoing; Mon, 25 Feb 2002 07:20:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from hotmail.com (oe53.law10.hotmail.com [64.4.14.46]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id HAA26811 for ; Mon, 25 Feb 2002 07:20:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail pickup service by hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Mon, 25 Feb 2002 04:20:23 -0800 X-Originating-IP: [209.86.164.233] From: "Leo" To: "Michael Bahr" Cc: References: Subject: Re: Virus in: Re: AW: column spanned in multicolumn region Date: Mon, 25 Feb 2002 07:18:05 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Message-ID: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 25 Feb 2002 12:20:23.0420 (UTC) FILETIME=[CC88B3C0:01C1BDF6] Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I agree. Norton warned me of the attachment and identified it as Nimda. I assumed it was either a false alarm (since it has happened before; see link below) or the real thing and just deleted it to be on the safe side. http://www.informationweek.com/story/IWK20011113S0005 Cheers, Leo ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael Bahr" To: Cc: Sent: Monday, February 25, 2002 3:26 AM Subject: Virus in: Re: AW: column spanned in multicolumn region > > Hi all, > > The email with subject "Re: AW: column spanned in multicolumn region" from > owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil contains the Nimda-virus. > > Do not open the attachment. Anyway, it isn't a wav-file, its an exe-file > containing the virus. > > Just throw the email away (and delete your "Deleted Messages Folder" as > well). > > All the best, > Michael Bahr > > > > From daemon@optimus.ietf.org Mon Feb 25 13:30:35 2002 Received: from optimus.ietf.org (ietf.org [132.151.1.19] (may be forged)) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id NAA23549 for ; Mon, 25 Feb 2002 13:30:35 -0500 (EST) Received: (from daemon@localhost) by optimus.ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1) id NAA09304 for manet-archive@odin.ietf.org; Mon, 25 Feb 2002 13:30:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from optimus.ietf.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by optimus.ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id NAA09297 for ; Mon, 25 Feb 2002 13:30:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf.org (odin [132.151.1.176]) by optimus.ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id NAA09281 for ; Mon, 25 Feb 2002 13:30:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id NAA23544 for ; Mon, 25 Feb 2002 13:30:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from SEXTANT.itd.nrl.navy.mil (sextant.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.92.22]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id NAA12334 for ; Mon, 25 Feb 2002 13:30:35 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <5.0.1.4.2.20020225133919.019f2d98@pop.itd.nrl.navy.mil> X-Sender: macker@pop.itd.nrl.navy.mil X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.0.1 Date: Mon, 25 Feb 2002 13:39:38 -0500 To: manet@ietf.org From: Joe Macker Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Subject: [manet] Testing...please ignore Sender: manet-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: manet-admin@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 1.0 Precedence: bulk List-Id: Mobile Ad-hoc Networks X-BeenThere: manet@ietf.org _______________________________________________ manet mailing list manet@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/manet From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Mon Feb 25 19:29:01 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id TAA04947 for ; Mon, 25 Feb 2002 19:29:00 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id QAA21272 for manet-outgoing; Mon, 25 Feb 2002 16:58:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from SEXTANT.itd.nrl.navy.mil (sextant.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.92.22]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id QAA21264 for ; Mon, 25 Feb 2002 16:58:21 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <5.0.1.4.2.20020225170541.01a021d0@pop.itd.nrl.navy.mil> X-Sender: macker@pop.itd.nrl.navy.mil X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.0.1 Date: Mon, 25 Feb 2002 17:07:38 -0500 To: manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil From: Joe Macker Subject: Agenda Items for Minneapolis Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk All: We would like to solicit for additional agenda input from the WG for the upcoming Minneapolis meeting. Thanks, Joe n' Scott From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Mon Feb 25 19:29:20 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id TAA04959 for ; Mon, 25 Feb 2002 19:29:20 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id RAA21522 for manet-outgoing; Mon, 25 Feb 2002 17:05:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from SEXTANT.itd.nrl.navy.mil (sextant.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.92.22]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id RAA21514 for ; Mon, 25 Feb 2002 17:05:29 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <5.0.1.4.2.20020225170739.02fef548@pop.itd.nrl.navy.mil> X-Sender: macker@pop.itd.nrl.navy.mil X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.0.1 Date: Mon, 25 Feb 2002 17:14:46 -0500 To: manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil From: Joe Macker Subject: Planned Mailing List move to ietf.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk All: I am moving the mailing list host to ietf.org soon (likely later this week, Wednesday or Thursday). I will send out a message on manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil when this is about to happen and will move everyone in bulk. The new list will be manet@ietf.org. Do not use it until you receive the welcome message. You should also receive a welcome message and complete instructions once this happens. the mailman...(not Karl Malone). From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Mon Feb 25 22:35:37 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id WAA08966 for ; Mon, 25 Feb 2002 22:35:37 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id UAA26009 for manet-outgoing; Mon, 25 Feb 2002 20:22:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from sj-msg-core-3.cisco.com (sj-msg-core-3.cisco.com [171.70.157.152]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id UAA26004 for ; Mon, 25 Feb 2002 20:22:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from FRED-W2K6.cisco.com ([171.71.21.235]) by sj-msg-core-3.cisco.com (8.11.3/8.9.1) with ESMTP id g1Q1Lww27012; Mon, 25 Feb 2002 17:21:59 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <4.3.2.7.2.20020225171131.02427f88@mira-sjcm-2.cisco.com> X-Sender: fred@mira-sjcm-2.cisco.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.2 Date: Mon, 25 Feb 2002 17:16:58 -0800 To: Dave Johnson From: Fred Baker Subject: Re: RE : others cretaria in MANET routing protocol Cc: manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil In-Reply-To: <20020225052206.A58153@maredsous.cs.rice.edu> References: <001601c1bdcf$3c8edc80$100bce86@lifl.fr> <0489A7888F080B4BA73B53F7E145F29A03C054@LANMHS20.rd.francetelecom.fr> <001601c1bdcf$3c8edc80$100bce86@lifl.fr> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk At 03:22 AM 2/25/2002, Dave Johnson wrote: >one of our results was a new route caching strategy in which a sending >node selects from its cache the route that it knows with minimum hop count >to the destination, but among those with that same hop count, it selects >the one that it believes will remain valid for the longest period of time, >based on its past observations of links involving the nodes along that route. I'll argue that hop count in and of itself is a poor indicator. Consider the following A--------------------->B ---------->C---------> B and C can both hear A; C hears A with an excellent S/N Ratio and B hears A with a poor signal to noise ratio, such that a small percentage of packets (less than some threshold measured in percent) can actually traverse A->B. I will argue that A->C->B is much kinder to the application than A->B, so adding a hop creates a significantly improved route even though the smaller hop count would be nice. It seems to me that hop count might be a tie-breaker amount routes of equal robustness, not the other way around. From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Mon Feb 25 23:52:48 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id XAA10479 for ; Mon, 25 Feb 2002 23:52:48 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id VAA27155 for manet-outgoing; Mon, 25 Feb 2002 21:35:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from ftpbox.mot.com (ftpbox.mot.com [129.188.136.101]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id VAA27150 for ; Mon, 25 Feb 2002 21:35:20 -0500 (EST) Received: [from pobox3.mot.com (pobox3.mot.com [10.64.251.242]) by ftpbox.mot.com (ftpbox 2.1) with ESMTP id TAA00549 for ; Mon, 25 Feb 2002 19:35:20 -0700 (MST)] Received: [from homer.arc.corp.mot.com (homer.arc.corp.mot.com [10.238.80.38]) by pobox3.mot.com (MOT-pobox3 2.0) with ESMTP id TAA09332 for ; Mon, 25 Feb 2002 19:23:42 -0700 (MST)] Received: from arc.corp.mot.com (kwchin.arc.corp.mot.com [10.238.80.134]) by homer.arc.corp.mot.com (8.12.2/8.12.2) with ESMTP id g1Q2ZCrA002005; Tue, 26 Feb 2002 13:35:12 +1100 (EST) Message-ID: <3C7AF45F.508A2F13@arc.corp.mot.com> Date: Tue, 26 Feb 2002 13:35:11 +1100 From: Kwan-Wu Chin Organization: Motorola Labs. Australia X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.79 [en] (Windows NT 5.0; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Fred Baker CC: manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Subject: Re: RE : others cretaria in MANET routing protocol References: <001601c1bdcf$3c8edc80$100bce86@lifl.fr> <0489A7888F080B4BA73B53F7E145F29A03C054@LANMHS20.rd.francetelecom.fr> <001601c1bdcf$3c8edc80$100bce86@lifl.fr> <4.3.2.7.2.20020225171131.02427f88@mira-sjcm-2.cisco.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi All, Fred Baker wrote: > At 03:22 AM 2/25/2002, Dave Johnson wrote: > >one of our results was a new route caching strategy in which a sending > >node selects from its cache the route that it knows with minimum hop count > >to the destination, but among those with that same hop count, it selects > >the one that it believes will remain valid for the longest period of time, > >based on its past observations of links involving the nodes along that route. > > I'll argue that hop count in and of itself is a poor indicator. Consider > the following > > A--------------------->B > ---------->C---------> > > B and C can both hear A; C hears A with an excellent S/N Ratio and B hears > A with a poor signal to noise ratio, such that a small percentage of > packets (less than some threshold measured in percent) can actually > traverse A->B. I will argue that A->C->B is much kinder to the application > than A->B, so adding a hop creates a significantly improved route even > though the smaller hop count would be nice. > > It seems to me that hop count might be a tie-breaker amount routes of equal > robustness, not the other way around. I agree with this argument. We found this to be true on our testbed, especially in indoor environments where multipath fading is severe. We found that the link between A and B comes up and down frequently, causing routing protocols (based on hop count) to construct - deconstruct - construct ........ route continuosly over the link since A and B think they have a 1-hop route each other. When we add more nodes (i.e., topology with more unreliable links), we found that hop-based MANET routing protocols spend most of their time trying to establish a route and little packets get through. So, hop count is a poor metric, and we feel a combination of metrics such as link lifetimes (from radio and mobility perspectives), etc will be more suitable. cheers, kwan-wu From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Tue Feb 26 07:54:25 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id HAA26926 for ; Tue, 26 Feb 2002 07:54:25 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id FAA03643 for manet-outgoing; Tue, 26 Feb 2002 05:27:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from concorde.inria.fr (concorde.inria.fr [192.93.2.39]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id FAA03638 for ; Tue, 26 Feb 2002 05:27:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from impression.inria.fr (impression.inria.fr [128.93.17.98]) by concorde.inria.fr (8.11.1/8.11.1) with SMTP id g1QAQqv18033; Tue, 26 Feb 2002 11:26:52 +0100 (MET) Received: by impression.inria.fr (sSMTP sendmail emulation); Tue, 26 Feb 2002 11:26:22 +0100 From: Laurent Viennot MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-ID: <15483.25294.350980.905697@impression.inria.fr> Date: Tue, 26 Feb 2002 11:26:22 +0100 To: Kwan-Wu Chin Cc: Fred Baker , manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Subject: Re: RE : others cretaria in MANET routing protocol In-Reply-To: <3C7AF45F.508A2F13@arc.corp.mot.com> References: <001601c1bdcf$3c8edc80$100bce86@lifl.fr> <0489A7888F080B4BA73B53F7E145F29A03C054@LANMHS20.rd.francetelecom.fr> <4.3.2.7.2.20020225171131.02427f88@mira-sjcm-2.cisco.com> <3C7AF45F.508A2F13@arc.corp.mot.com> X-Mailer: VM 6.92 under 21.1 (patch 10) "Capitol Reef" XEmacs Lucid Reply-To: Laurent.Viennot@inria.fr Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit This is where link hysteresis comes up. It allows to detect dangling links and to ignore them so that hop count becomes a rather good metric. See the advanced neighbor sensing section of OLSR draft for a short description of link hysteresis. laurent Kwan-Wu Chin writes: > Hi All, > > Fred Baker wrote: > > > At 03:22 AM 2/25/2002, Dave Johnson wrote: > > >one of our results was a new route caching strategy in which a sending > > >node selects from its cache the route that it knows with minimum hop count > > >to the destination, but among those with that same hop count, it selects > > >the one that it believes will remain valid for the longest period of time, > > >based on its past observations of links involving the nodes along that route. > > > > I'll argue that hop count in and of itself is a poor indicator. Consider > > the following > > > > A--------------------->B > > ---------->C---------> > > > > B and C can both hear A; C hears A with an excellent S/N Ratio and B hears > > A with a poor signal to noise ratio, such that a small percentage of > > packets (less than some threshold measured in percent) can actually > > traverse A->B. I will argue that A->C->B is much kinder to the application > > than A->B, so adding a hop creates a significantly improved route even > > though the smaller hop count would be nice. > > > > It seems to me that hop count might be a tie-breaker amount routes of equal > > robustness, not the other way around. > > I agree with this argument. We found this to be true on our testbed, > especially in indoor environments where multipath fading is severe. > We found that the link between A and B comes up and > down frequently, causing routing protocols (based on hop count) to > construct - deconstruct - construct ........ route continuosly over the link > since A and B think they have a 1-hop route each other. When we > add more nodes (i.e., topology with more unreliable links), we found that > hop-based > MANET routing protocols spend most of their time trying to establish a route and > little > packets get through. So, hop count is a poor metric, and we feel a combination > of > metrics such as link lifetimes (from radio and mobility perspectives), etc will be > more > suitable. > > cheers, > kwan-wu > From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Tue Feb 26 10:01:33 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id KAA02255 for ; Tue, 26 Feb 2002 10:01:32 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id HAA06358 for manet-outgoing; Tue, 26 Feb 2002 07:44:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from malonne.lifl.fr (malonne.lifl.fr [134.206.10.29]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id HAA06350 for ; Tue, 26 Feb 2002 07:44:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from KRIEK (kriek.lifl.fr [134.206.11.16]) by malonne.lifl.fr (8.9.3/jtpda-5.3.3) with ESMTP id NAA05998 ; Tue, 26 Feb 2002 13:43:18 +0100 (MET) From: "David Simplot" To: "'Chai Keong Toh'" Cc: , Subject: RE : RE : others cretaria in MANET routing protocol Date: Tue, 26 Feb 2002 13:43:42 +0100 Organization: LIFL - RD2P Message-ID: <000f01c1bec3$38edc010$100bce86@lifl.fr> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 In-Reply-To: <35507.129.193.104.172.1014662759.squirrel@secure2.ece.gatech.edu> Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by itd.nrl.navy.mil id HAA06354 Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Oupps, thank you: I have found the following reference CK. Toh. Associativity based routing for ad hoc mobile networks. Wireless Personal Communications Journal, Special Issue on Mobile Networking and Computing Systems, Vol 4. No. 2, pp. 103-139, March 1997. http://citeseer.nj.nec.com/495494.html Perhaps there are some updates in chapter 6 ? :-) Yours, David. > -----Message d'origine----- > De : Chai Keong Toh [mailto:Chai.Toh@ece.gatech.edu] > Envoyé : lundi 25 février 2002 19:46 > À : David.Simplot@lifl.fr > Cc : djamaleddine.meddour@rd.francetelecom.com; manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil > Objet : Re: RE : others cretaria in MANET routing protocol > > > David - This metric has already been defined by Associativity-Based > Routing back in 1994. It claims that ther is no point in having a mere > shortest hop routing if the route is unstable. It also defines a way > to capture and quantify link and route stability. If you need more > literatures, I would be happy to provide more. > > C.K. Toh > > ======== > > You are right: perhaps we can consider the "robustness" of the > > generated route... The definition of "robustness" could be the > > probability that the route stays valid during a given time without > > route maintenance. Notice that, in the general case, an > optimal route > > (number of hops) is not a robust one. > > David. > > -- > > David SIMPLOT > > CNRS UPRESA 8022 - LIFL Univ. Lille 1 / IUP MIAGE Formation Continue > > http://www.lifl.fr/~simplot > > > > > > > > -----Message d'origine----- > > De : owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil > [mailto:owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil] > > De la part de MEDDOUR > Djamal Eddine thesard FTRD/DAC/LAN > > Envoyé : mardi 19 février 2002 09:57 > > À : manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil > > Objet : others cretaria in MANET routing protocol > > > > > > Hi all > > > > The criteria of the choice of the optimal route is the > number of hops, > > do you think that it's sufficient? Why don't take in > consideration some > > other criteria like traffic load around node, node energy, node > > capacity, ... > > > > Any comments > From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Tue Feb 26 10:26:34 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id KAA03265 for ; Tue, 26 Feb 2002 10:26:34 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id IAA07628 for manet-outgoing; Tue, 26 Feb 2002 08:19:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from malonne.lifl.fr (malonne.lifl.fr [134.206.10.29]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id IAA07620 for ; Tue, 26 Feb 2002 08:18:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from KRIEK (kriek.lifl.fr [134.206.11.16]) by malonne.lifl.fr (8.9.3/jtpda-5.3.3) with ESMTP id OAA06653 for ; Tue, 26 Feb 2002 14:18:56 +0100 (MET) From: "David Simplot" To: Subject: TR : RE : others cretaria in MANET routing protocol Date: Tue, 26 Feb 2002 14:19:20 +0100 Organization: LIFL - RD2P Message-ID: <001501c1bec8$3342b170$100bce86@lifl.fr> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2627 Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by itd.nrl.navy.mil id IAA07621 Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit It seems that this mail has been lost... > -----Message d'origine----- > De : David Simplot [mailto:David.Simplot@lifl.fr] > Envoyé : mardi 26 février 2002 13:44 > À : 'Chai Keong Toh' > Cc : 'djamaleddine.meddour@rd.francetelecom.com'; > 'manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil' > Objet : RE : RE : others cretaria in MANET routing protocol > > > Oupps, thank you: I have found the following reference > > CK. Toh. Associativity based routing for ad hoc mobile > networks. Wireless Personal Communications Journal, Special > Issue on Mobile Networking and Computing Systems, Vol 4. No. > 2, pp. 103-139, March 1997. > http://citeseer.nj.nec.com/495494.html > > Perhaps there are some updates in chapter 6 ? :-) > > Yours, > David. > > > -----Message d'origine----- > > De : Chai Keong Toh [mailto:Chai.Toh@ece.gatech.edu] > > Envoyé : lundi 25 février 2002 19:46 > > À : David.Simplot@lifl.fr > > Cc : djamaleddine.meddour@rd.francetelecom.com; > manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil > > Objet : Re: RE : others cretaria in MANET routing protocol > > > > > > David - This metric has already been defined by Associativity-Based > > Routing back in 1994. It claims that ther is no point in > having a mere > > shortest hop routing if the route is unstable. It also defines a way > > to capture and quantify link and route stability. If you need more > > literatures, I would be happy to provide more. > > > > C.K. Toh > > > > ======== > > > You are right: perhaps we can consider the "robustness" of the > > > generated route... The definition of "robustness" could be the > > > probability that the route stays valid during a given time without > > > route maintenance. Notice that, in the general case, an > > optimal route > > > (number of hops) is not a robust one. > > > David. > > > -- > > > David SIMPLOT > > > CNRS UPRESA 8022 - LIFL Univ. Lille 1 / IUP MIAGE > Formation Continue > > > http://www.lifl.fr/~simplot > > > > > > > > > > > > -----Message d'origine----- > > > De : owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil > > [mailto:owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil] > > > De la part de MEDDOUR > > Djamal Eddine thesard FTRD/DAC/LAN > > > Envoyé : mardi 19 février 2002 09:57 > > > À : manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil > > > Objet : others cretaria in MANET routing protocol > > > > > > > > > Hi all > > > > > > The criteria of the choice of the optimal route is the > > number of hops, > > > do you think that it's sufficient? Why don't take in > > consideration some > > > other criteria like traffic load around node, node energy, node > > > capacity, ... > > > > > > Any comments > > > From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Wed Feb 27 12:36:45 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id MAA05195 for ; Wed, 27 Feb 2002 12:36:44 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id QAA29294 for manet-outgoing; Tue, 26 Feb 2002 16:28:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from motgate3.mot.com (motgate3.mot.com [144.189.100.103]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id QAA29289 for ; Tue, 26 Feb 2002 16:28:40 -0500 (EST) Received: [from mothost.mot.com (mothost.mot.com [129.188.137.101]) by motgate3.mot.com (motgate3 2.1) with ESMTP id OAA06112; Tue, 26 Feb 2002 14:17:47 -0700 (MST)] Received: [from homer.arc.corp.mot.com (homer.arc.corp.mot.com [10.238.80.38]) by mothost.mot.com (MOT-mothost 2.0) with ESMTP id OAA15147; Tue, 26 Feb 2002 14:28:35 -0700 (MST)] Received: from arc.corp.mot.com (kwchin.arc.corp.mot.com [10.238.80.134]) by homer.arc.corp.mot.com (8.12.2/8.12.2) with ESMTP id g1QLSWrA015723; Wed, 27 Feb 2002 08:28:33 +1100 (EST) Message-ID: <3C7BFDFF.6013F1D7@arc.corp.mot.com> Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2002 08:28:31 +1100 From: Kwan-Wu Chin Organization: Motorola Labs. Australia X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.79 [en] (Windows NT 5.0; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Laurent.Viennot@inria.fr, manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Subject: Re: RE : others cretaria in MANET routing protocol References: <001601c1bdcf$3c8edc80$100bce86@lifl.fr> <0489A7888F080B4BA73B53F7E145F29A03C054@LANMHS20.rd.francetelecom.fr> <4.3.2.7.2.20020225171131.02427f88@mira-sjcm-2.cisco.com> <3C7AF45F.508A2F13@arc.corp.mot.com> <15483.25294.350980.905697@impression.inria.fr> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi laurent, Exactly. We ended up doing hysterisis as well, but in our implementation the routing protocol was oblivious to the existence of the hysterisis. I'll look at the indicated section in the OLSR draft, thanks for the info. cheers, kwan-wu Laurent Viennot wrote: > This is where link hysteresis comes up. It allows to detect dangling > links and to ignore them so that hop count becomes a rather good metric. > See the advanced neighbor sensing section of OLSR draft for a short > description of link hysteresis. > > laurent > > Kwan-Wu Chin writes: > > Hi All, > > > > Fred Baker wrote: > > > > > At 03:22 AM 2/25/2002, Dave Johnson wrote: > > > >one of our results was a new route caching strategy in which a sending > > > >node selects from its cache the route that it knows with minimum hop count > > > >to the destination, but among those with that same hop count, it selects > > > >the one that it believes will remain valid for the longest period of time, > > > >based on its past observations of links involving the nodes along that route. > > > > > > I'll argue that hop count in and of itself is a poor indicator. Consider > > > the following > > > > > > A--------------------->B > > > ---------->C---------> > > > > > > B and C can both hear A; C hears A with an excellent S/N Ratio and B hears > > > A with a poor signal to noise ratio, such that a small percentage of > > > packets (less than some threshold measured in percent) can actually > > > traverse A->B. I will argue that A->C->B is much kinder to the application > > > than A->B, so adding a hop creates a significantly improved route even > > > though the smaller hop count would be nice. > > > > > > It seems to me that hop count might be a tie-breaker amount routes of equal > > > robustness, not the other way around. > > > > I agree with this argument. We found this to be true on our testbed, > > especially in indoor environments where multipath fading is severe. > > We found that the link between A and B comes up and > > down frequently, causing routing protocols (based on hop count) to > > construct - deconstruct - construct ........ route continuosly over the link > > since A and B think they have a 1-hop route each other. When we > > add more nodes (i.e., topology with more unreliable links), we found that > > hop-based > > MANET routing protocols spend most of their time trying to establish a route and > > little > > packets get through. So, hop count is a poor metric, and we feel a combination > > of > > metrics such as link lifetimes (from radio and mobility perspectives), etc will be > > more > > suitable. > > > > cheers, > > kwan-wu > > From manet-admin@ietf.org Wed Feb 27 13:18:22 2002 Received: from optimus.ietf.org (ietf.org [132.151.1.19] (may be forged)) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id NAA07943 for ; Wed, 27 Feb 2002 13:18:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from optimus.ietf.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by optimus.ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id NAA13914 for ; Wed, 27 Feb 2002 13:18:24 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2002 13:18:24 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <200202271818.NAA13914@optimus.ietf.org> From: manet-admin@ietf.org Subject: Welcome To "manet"! To: manet-archive@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 1.0 Precedence: bulk List-Id: Mobile Ad-hoc Networks Welcome to the manet@ietf.org mailing list! ********** Note Well All statements related to the activities of the IETF and addressed to the IETF are subject to all provisions of Section 10 of RFC 2026, which grants to the IETF and its participants certain licenses and rights in such statements. 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From manet-admin@ietf.org Wed Feb 27 15:15:43 2002 Received: from optimus.ietf.org (ietf.org [132.151.1.19] (may be forged)) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id PAA15160 for ; Wed, 27 Feb 2002 15:15:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from optimus.ietf.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by optimus.ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id OAA24067; Wed, 27 Feb 2002 14:44:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf.org (odin [132.151.1.176]) by optimus.ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id OAA24040 for ; Wed, 27 Feb 2002 14:44:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.web.de (smtp02.web.de [217.72.192.151]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id OAA13391 for ; Wed, 27 Feb 2002 14:44:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from [134.102.101.207] (helo=manet) by smtp.web.de with smtp (WEB.DE(Exim) 4.28 #21) id 16g9zm-0005Ig-00 for manet@ietf.org; Wed, 27 Feb 2002 20:44:10 +0100 Message-ID: <001201c1bfc7$6697b520$cf656686@vorstrasse.unibremen.de> From: "Michael Sessinghaus" To: Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2002 20:46:07 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000F_01C1BFCF.C80FD1E0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Subject: [manet] (no subject) Sender: manet-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: manet-admin@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 1.0 Precedence: bulk List-Id: Mobile Ad-hoc Networks X-BeenThere: manet@ietf.org This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000F_01C1BFCF.C80FD1E0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable ------=_NextPart_000_000F_01C1BFCF.C80FD1E0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
 
------=_NextPart_000_000F_01C1BFCF.C80FD1E0-- _______________________________________________ manet mailing list manet@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/manet From daemon@optimus.ietf.org Wed Feb 27 15:15:45 2002 Received: from optimus.ietf.org (ietf.org [132.151.1.19] (may be forged)) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id PAA15174 for ; Wed, 27 Feb 2002 15:15:45 -0500 (EST) Received: (from daemon@localhost) by optimus.ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1) id PAA26227 for manet-archive@odin.ietf.org; Wed, 27 Feb 2002 15:15:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from optimus.ietf.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by optimus.ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id OAA24067; Wed, 27 Feb 2002 14:44:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf.org (odin [132.151.1.176]) by optimus.ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id OAA24040 for ; Wed, 27 Feb 2002 14:44:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from smtp.web.de (smtp02.web.de [217.72.192.151]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id OAA13391 for ; Wed, 27 Feb 2002 14:44:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from [134.102.101.207] (helo=manet) by smtp.web.de with smtp (WEB.DE(Exim) 4.28 #21) id 16g9zm-0005Ig-00 for manet@ietf.org; Wed, 27 Feb 2002 20:44:10 +0100 Message-ID: <001201c1bfc7$6697b520$cf656686@vorstrasse.unibremen.de> From: "Michael Sessinghaus" To: Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2002 20:46:07 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000F_01C1BFCF.C80FD1E0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Subject: [manet] (no subject) Sender: manet-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: manet-admin@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 1.0 Precedence: bulk List-Id: Mobile Ad-hoc Networks X-BeenThere: manet@ietf.org This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000F_01C1BFCF.C80FD1E0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable ------=_NextPart_000_000F_01C1BFCF.C80FD1E0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
 
------=_NextPart_000_000F_01C1BFCF.C80FD1E0-- _______________________________________________ manet mailing list manet@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/manet From manet-admin@ietf.org Wed Feb 27 18:29:43 2002 Received: from optimus.ietf.org (ietf.org [132.151.1.19] (may be forged)) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id SAA24185 for ; Wed, 27 Feb 2002 18:29:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from optimus.ietf.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by optimus.ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id RAA06169; Wed, 27 Feb 2002 17:59:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf.org (odin [132.151.1.176]) by optimus.ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id RAA06135 for ; Wed, 27 Feb 2002 17:59:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.scires.com (mail.scires.com [12.36.154.4]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id RAA23288 for ; Wed, 27 Feb 2002 17:59:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from SRCATL-MTA by mail.scires.com with Novell_GroupWise; Wed, 27 Feb 2002 18:01:30 -0500 Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 6.0 Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2002 18:01:08 -0500 From: "Pete Sholander" To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by optimus.ietf.org id RAA06136 Subject: [manet] Re: WG Feedback requested Sender: manet-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: manet-admin@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 1.0 Precedence: bulk List-Id: Mobile Ad-hoc Networks X-BeenThere: manet@ietf.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit This is a belated reply to one of Scott Corson's postings from way back in January ... Scientific Research Corporation (SRC) has implemented a hybrid-routing protocol that is based on Cornell's ZRP, but has some differences. It currently runs on Red Hat (2.2 and 2.4 kernels) and Debian Linux (2.4 kernel). Supported hardware platforms are x86 and StrongARM. Other OS's and platforms are planned during 2002. That software has had two beta-testers to date. SRC may bring that protocol into the IETF after we finish coordinating with Dr. Haas and our various DoD sponsors (AFRL/IF, AFRL/MN and DARPA ATO mainly). The main goal might be standardizing the *framework* within which the reactive and proactive components communicate --- rather than the components themselves. As such, SRC is also interested in integrating with other vendors' (and/or colleges') proactive and reactive protocols. (We're currently also running the INRIA code for OLSR in our lab, but not as the proactive portion of our hybrid protocol.) In general, hybrid protocols do seem to interest SRC's U.S. DoD customers. So, IMHO the IETF should continue work on them. Your opinion/mileage may vary, of course :) Kind Regards, Pete Sholander Principal Engineer Scientific Research Corporation 2300 Windy Ridge Parkway, Suite 400S Atlanta, GA 30339 E: psholander@scires.com V: 770-989-9551 F: 770-859-9315 >>> Scott Corson 01/04/02 02:30PM >>> Folks, First off, welcome back from the holidays for those who took time off. The issue I'm raising was discussed at the SLC meeting and I want to raise it on the list. We are in the process of milestone revamping in the WG charter, and are looking to clarify the current scope of work. As mentioned at the meeting, a number of proposals seem best suited for highly scaled manet networks. The chairs suggest that the manet WG scope down the areas of near term work until reasonable progress is achieved. The rough idea is to concentrate on several items for near term work and progress. (1) reactive unicast protocol (2) proactive unicast protocol (3) flooding protocol work ---------------- The concerns regarding a number of the proposal(s) are: (1) primarily useful for scaling manets ..longer term scope issue (2) perceived lack of broad interest .. independent of WG scope Would anyone interested in *implementing* TORA, ZRP-related drafts and/or LANMAR please let me know? And I do not mean simulation. I would prefer that you respond to the list. I do not want to hear from document authors or parties working directly with authors. I am trying to gauge interest in these drafts as WG work items. Thanks, -Scott _______________________________________________ manet mailing list manet@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/manet From daemon@optimus.ietf.org Wed Feb 27 18:29:43 2002 Received: from optimus.ietf.org (ietf.org [132.151.1.19] (may be forged)) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id SAA24195 for ; Wed, 27 Feb 2002 18:29:43 -0500 (EST) Received: (from daemon@localhost) by optimus.ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1) id SAA08217 for manet-archive@odin.ietf.org; Wed, 27 Feb 2002 18:29:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from optimus.ietf.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by optimus.ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id RAA06169; Wed, 27 Feb 2002 17:59:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf.org (odin [132.151.1.176]) by optimus.ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1) with ESMTP id RAA06135 for ; Wed, 27 Feb 2002 17:59:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from mail.scires.com (mail.scires.com [12.36.154.4]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id RAA23288 for ; Wed, 27 Feb 2002 17:59:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from SRCATL-MTA by mail.scires.com with Novell_GroupWise; Wed, 27 Feb 2002 18:01:30 -0500 Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 6.0 Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2002 18:01:08 -0500 From: "Pete Sholander" To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by optimus.ietf.org id RAA06136 Subject: [manet] Re: WG Feedback requested Sender: manet-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: manet-admin@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 1.0 Precedence: bulk List-Id: Mobile Ad-hoc Networks X-BeenThere: manet@ietf.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit This is a belated reply to one of Scott Corson's postings from way back in January ... Scientific Research Corporation (SRC) has implemented a hybrid-routing protocol that is based on Cornell's ZRP, but has some differences. It currently runs on Red Hat (2.2 and 2.4 kernels) and Debian Linux (2.4 kernel). Supported hardware platforms are x86 and StrongARM. Other OS's and platforms are planned during 2002. That software has had two beta-testers to date. SRC may bring that protocol into the IETF after we finish coordinating with Dr. Haas and our various DoD sponsors (AFRL/IF, AFRL/MN and DARPA ATO mainly). The main goal might be standardizing the *framework* within which the reactive and proactive components communicate --- rather than the components themselves. As such, SRC is also interested in integrating with other vendors' (and/or colleges') proactive and reactive protocols. (We're currently also running the INRIA code for OLSR in our lab, but not as the proactive portion of our hybrid protocol.) In general, hybrid protocols do seem to interest SRC's U.S. DoD customers. So, IMHO the IETF should continue work on them. Your opinion/mileage may vary, of course :) Kind Regards, Pete Sholander Principal Engineer Scientific Research Corporation 2300 Windy Ridge Parkway, Suite 400S Atlanta, GA 30339 E: psholander@scires.com V: 770-989-9551 F: 770-859-9315 >>> Scott Corson 01/04/02 02:30PM >>> Folks, First off, welcome back from the holidays for those who took time off. The issue I'm raising was discussed at the SLC meeting and I want to raise it on the list. We are in the process of milestone revamping in the WG charter, and are looking to clarify the current scope of work. As mentioned at the meeting, a number of proposals seem best suited for highly scaled manet networks. The chairs suggest that the manet WG scope down the areas of near term work until reasonable progress is achieved. The rough idea is to concentrate on several items for near term work and progress. (1) reactive unicast protocol (2) proactive unicast protocol (3) flooding protocol work ---------------- The concerns regarding a number of the proposal(s) are: (1) primarily useful for scaling manets ..longer term scope issue (2) perceived lack of broad interest .. independent of WG scope Would anyone interested in *implementing* TORA, ZRP-related drafts and/or LANMAR please let me know? And I do not mean simulation. I would prefer that you respond to the list. I do not want to hear from document authors or parties working directly with authors. I am trying to gauge interest in these drafts as WG work items. Thanks, -Scott _______________________________________________ manet mailing list manet@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/manet From owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Wed Feb 27 18:30:25 2002 Received: from itd.nrl.navy.mil (s2.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.83.3]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id SAA24246 for ; Wed, 27 Feb 2002 18:30:25 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) id NAA00571 for manet-outgoing; Wed, 27 Feb 2002 13:27:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from SEXTANT.itd.nrl.navy.mil (sextant.itd.nrl.navy.mil [132.250.92.22]) by itd.nrl.navy.mil (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id NAA00566 for ; Wed, 27 Feb 2002 13:26:58 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <5.0.1.4.2.20020227133413.019ea280@pop.itd.nrl.navy.mil> X-Sender: macker@pop.itd.nrl.navy.mil X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.0.1 Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2002 13:36:37 -0500 To: manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil From: Joe Macker Subject: IMPORTANT: Mail list moving to ietf.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-manet@itd.nrl.navy.mil Precedence: bulk I have mass subscribed everyone from the manet@itd to manet@ietf.org. You should be receiving a subscription message for your account. -Joe