From nobody Mon Apr 2 01:51:49 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A84FC124B18 for ; Mon, 2 Apr 2018 01:51:47 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: 0.989 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.989 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_20=-0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, MSGID_MULTIPLE_AT=1, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.01] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 5ANlcUClOYDr for ; Mon, 2 Apr 2018 01:51:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from chinatelecom.cn (prt-mail.chinatelecom.cn [42.123.76.222]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B693F120726 for ; Mon, 2 Apr 2018 01:51:43 -0700 (PDT) HMM_SOURCE_IP: 172.18.0.188:3932.1865677394 HMM_ATTACHE_NUM: 0000 HMM_SOURCE_TYPE: SMTP Received: from clientip-219.142.69.77 (unknown [172.18.0.188]) by chinatelecom.cn (HERMES) with ESMTP id DE2CE28008F for ; Mon, 2 Apr 2018 16:51:38 +0800 (CST) Received: from ip<219.142.69.77> ([172.18.0.188]) by App0023 with ESMTP id f3ecde6e-37de-4b50-abda-eb9c21bd6919 for lsr@ietf.org; Mon Apr 2 16:51:38 2018 0/X-Total-Score: 0: X-Real-From: wangaj.bri@chinatelecom.cn X-Receive-IP: 172.18.0.188 X-MEDUSA-Status: 0 From: "Aijun Wang" To: Date: Mon, 2 Apr 2018 16:51:37 +0800 Message-ID: <007c01d3ca5f$d042d0e0$70c872a0$@bri@chinatelecom.cn> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_007D_01D3CAA2.DE6610E0" X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 12.0 Thread-Index: AdPKX89aH7daBvUkQYK90A0ibbwqrw== Content-Language: zh-cn Archived-At: Subject: [Lsr] Inconsistence regarding the definition of "Adj-SID Sub-TLV" between OSPF and ISIS extension for Segment Routing X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 02 Apr 2018 08:51:48 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_007D_01D3CAA2.DE6610E0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi, All: We found there were some inconsistence for the definition of "Adjacency Segment Identifier" between OSPF and ISIS extension for segment routing, please see the link below for comparison. https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensions-15#se ction-2.2.1 https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ospf-ospfv3-segment-routing-extension s-10#section-7.1 Here we want to know is there any reason for this inconsistence? We think this inconsistence can easily cause error for BGP-LS implementation for segment routing extension, as that defined in https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-idr-bgp-ls-segment-routing-ext-04#sec tion-2.2.1, which is similar with ISIS extension for SR, but different from OSPF extension for SR. Do we need to make them consistent? It seems change the definition in OSPF extension may be less influence for the existing related drafts. Best Regards. Aijun Wang Network R&D and Operation Support Department China Telecom Corporation Limited Beijing Research Institute,Beijing, China. ------=_NextPart_000_007D_01D3CAA2.DE6610E0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Hi, = All:

 

We found there were some inconsistence for the definition = of “Adjacency Segment Identifier” between OSPF and ISIS = extension for segment routing, please see the link below for = comparison.

https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-isis-segme= nt-routing-extensions-15#section-2.2.1

https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ospf-= ospfv3-segment-routing-extensions-10#section-7.1

 

Here we want to know is there any = reason for this inconsistence? We think this inconsistence can easily = cause error for BGP-LS implementation for segment routing extension, as = that defined in https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-idr-bgp-ls-= segment-routing-ext-04#section-2.2.1, which is similar with ISIS = extension for SR, but different from OSPF extension for = SR.

 

Do we need to make them consistent? It seems change the = definition in OSPF extension may be less influence for the existing = related drafts.

 

Best Regards.

 

Aijun Wang

Network R&D and Operation = Support Department

China Telecom Corporation Limited Beijing Research = Institute,Beijing, China.

 

------=_NextPart_000_007D_01D3CAA2.DE6610E0-- From nobody Mon Apr 2 01:53:37 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 607FF124B18 for ; Mon, 2 Apr 2018 01:53:35 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.736 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.736 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_BL=0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_L3=1.154, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id dhOIC9aQkZDh for ; Mon, 2 Apr 2018 01:53:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from m21397.mail.qiye.163.com (m21397.mail.qiye.163.com [223.252.213.97]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 470EB120726 for ; Mon, 2 Apr 2018 01:53:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from WangajPC (unknown [219.142.69.77]) by m21397.mail.qiye.163.com (Hmail) with ESMTPA id 1E9C914391E for ; Mon, 2 Apr 2018 16:53:11 +0800 (CST) From: "Aijun Wang" To: Date: Mon, 2 Apr 2018 16:53:10 +0800 Message-ID: <008101d3ca60$073f81b0$15be8510$@org.cn> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0082_01D3CAA3.1562C1B0" X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 12.0 Thread-Index: AdPKX89aH7daBvUkQYK90A0ibbwqrwAABY/w Content-Language: zh-cn X-HM-Spam-Status: e1ktWUFJV1koWUFKTEtLSjdXWQgYFAkeWUFLVUtXWQkOFx4IWUFZMjUtOj cyP0FLVUtZBg++ X-HM-Sender-Digest: e1kSHx4VD1lBWUc6OTY6Ohw5IzoYUTwjKAFCPQstCj8wCzVVSlVKTklJ TU5CSkJNSU5IVTMWGhIXVQwaFRwaEhEOFTsPCBIVHBMOGlUUCRxVGBVFWVdZDB4ZWUEdGhcIHldZ CAFZQU1DTEo3V1kSC1lBWUlKQlVKT0lVTUJVTExZBg++ X-HM-Tid: 0a62858f69737f6bkuuk1e9c914391e Archived-At: Subject: [Lsr] Inconsistence regarding the definition of "Adj-SID Sub-TLV" between OSPF and ISIS extension for Segment Routing X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 02 Apr 2018 08:53:35 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0082_01D3CAA3.1562C1B0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi, All: We found there were some inconsistences for the definition of "Adjacency Segment Identifier" between OSPF and ISIS extension for segment routing, please see the link below for comparison. https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensions-15#se ction-2.2.1 https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ospf-ospfv3-segment-routing-extension s-10#section-7.1 Here we want to know is there any reason for this inconsistence? We think this inconsistence can easily cause error for BGP-LS implementation for segment routing extension, as that defined in https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-idr-bgp-ls-segment-routing-ext-04#sec tion-2.2.1, which is similar with ISIS extension for SR, but different from OSPF extension for SR. Do we need to make them consistent? It seems change the definition in OSPF extension may be less influence for the existing related drafts. Best Regards. Aijun Wang Network R&D and Operation Support Department China Telecom Corporation Limited Beijing Research Institute,Beijing, China. ------=_NextPart_000_0082_01D3CAA3.1562C1B0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Hi, = All:

 

We found there were some inconsistences for the definition of “Adjacency = Segment Identifier” between OSPF and ISIS extension for segment = routing, please see the link below for = comparison.

https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-isis-segme= nt-routing-extensions-15#section-2.2.1

https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ospf-= ospfv3-segment-routing-extensions-10#section-7.1

 

Here we want to know is there any = reason for this inconsistence? We think this inconsistence can easily = cause error for BGP-LS implementation for segment routing extension, as = that defined in https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-idr-bgp-ls-= segment-routing-ext-04#section-2.2.1, which is similar with ISIS = extension for SR, but different from OSPF extension for = SR.

 

Do we need to make them consistent? It seems change the = definition in OSPF extension may be less influence for the existing = related drafts.

 

Best Regards.

 

Aijun Wang

Network R&D and Operation = Support Department

China Telecom Corporation Limited Beijing Research = Institute,Beijing, China.

 

------=_NextPart_000_0082_01D3CAA3.1562C1B0-- From nobody Mon Apr 2 03:26:18 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1F990127419 for ; Mon, 2 Apr 2018 03:26:17 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -14.511 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-14.511 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.01, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=cisco.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id yJKuYLQTYj8a for ; Mon, 2 Apr 2018 03:26:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from alln-iport-6.cisco.com (alln-iport-6.cisco.com [173.37.142.93]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher DHE-RSA-SEED-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id F3B311204DA for ; Mon, 2 Apr 2018 03:26:14 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cisco.com; i=@cisco.com; l=10427; q=dns/txt; s=iport; t=1522664775; x=1523874375; h=from:to:subject:date:message-id:references:in-reply-to: mime-version; bh=aUbAxJ8wZ5EHyFHC80m9CqgRhXUruVGBLl/n89aVfuU=; b=er5PkdcAKhpACNlI53XwGg7+GAB/pdZmZ/z5BgEdZK9e5BsspJeaZCDE +0TYySfV3LqXHe4oAPPc2P4o6TgLBjJvJlOk3FfRph02KfRGVwyLJpbeL BW6AI+s/l7yB7IeivtGo4rOhvI36egVOE0fuwDnFAnkwtcjuzSpwrzdfa 8=; X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: =?us-ascii?q?A0DOAAChBMJa/5RdJa1dGQEBAQEBAQE?= =?us-ascii?q?BAQEBAQcBAQEBAYJNdWFvKAqLUo0BgXSBD41vhGSBegslhF8ChC8hNBgBAgE?= =?us-ascii?q?BAQEBAQJrKIUkAQEBAQMtXAIBCBEEAQEkCzIdCAEBBAESCIQhZA+wcog6giY?= =?us-ascii?q?Fh2GBVD+DYi6DEQEBAgGBMoV7AocJhHOESIZ2CAKFT4ZIgg2BOINZhh+BD4k?= =?us-ascii?q?VhkECERMBgSQBHDiBUnAVgn2CIBcRjgVvAQGLYoEvgRcBAQ?= X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos; i="5.48,395,1517875200"; d="scan'208,217"; a="92211995" Received: from rcdn-core-12.cisco.com ([173.37.93.148]) by alln-iport-6.cisco.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384; 02 Apr 2018 10:26:14 +0000 Received: from XCH-ALN-008.cisco.com (xch-aln-008.cisco.com [173.36.7.18]) by rcdn-core-12.cisco.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id w32AQDZM005876 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 2 Apr 2018 10:26:14 GMT Received: from xch-aln-008.cisco.com (173.36.7.18) by XCH-ALN-008.cisco.com (173.36.7.18) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.0.1320.4; Mon, 2 Apr 2018 05:26:13 -0500 Received: from xch-aln-008.cisco.com ([173.36.7.18]) by XCH-ALN-008.cisco.com ([173.36.7.18]) with mapi id 15.00.1320.000; Mon, 2 Apr 2018 05:26:13 -0500 From: "Ketan Talaulikar (ketant)" To: Aijun Wang , "lsr@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [Lsr] Inconsistence regarding the definition of "Adj-SID Sub-TLV" between OSPF and ISIS extension for Segment Routing Thread-Index: AdPKX89aH7daBvUkQYK90A0ibbwqrwAABY/wAAMor+A= Date: Mon, 2 Apr 2018 10:26:13 +0000 Message-ID: References: <008101d3ca60$073f81b0$15be8510$@org.cn> In-Reply-To: <008101d3ca60$073f81b0$15be8510$@org.cn> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted x-originating-ip: [10.65.68.229] Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_c5a4d1de5e7943318821018c138b5562XCHALN008ciscocom_" MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] Inconsistence regarding the definition of "Adj-SID Sub-TLV" between OSPF and ISIS extension for Segment Routing X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 02 Apr 2018 10:26:17 -0000 --_000_c5a4d1de5e7943318821018c138b5562XCHALN008ciscocom_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Aijun, Can you clarify what you mean by "inconsistencies"? Also, you are referring the old version of OSPFv3 SR draft before it was al= igned with the OSPFv2 SR draft. Please check https://tools.ietf.org/html/dr= aft-ietf-ospf-ospfv3-segment-routing-extensions-11#section-6.1 OSPF and ISIS are different protocols and there are some differences betwee= n them. I would not call them inconsistencies. BGP-LS spec refers to the in= dividual IGP drafts for interpretation of flags. So please specifically poi= nt out what inconsistency you are referring to. Thanks, Ketan From: Lsr On Behalf Of Aijun Wang Sent: 02 April 2018 14:23 To: lsr@ietf.org Subject: [Lsr] Inconsistence regarding the definition of "Adj-SID Sub-TLV" = between OSPF and ISIS extension for Segment Routing Hi, All: We found there were some inconsistences for the definition of "Adjacency Se= gment Identifier" between OSPF and ISIS extension for segment routing, plea= se see the link below for comparison. https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensions-15#s= ection-2.2.1 https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ospf-ospfv3-segment-routing-extensio= ns-10#section-7.1 Here we want to know is there any reason for this inconsistence? We think t= his inconsistence can easily cause error for BGP-LS implementation for segm= ent routing extension, as that defined in https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft= -ietf-idr-bgp-ls-segment-routing-ext-04#section-2.2.1, which is similar wit= h ISIS extension for SR, but different from OSPF extension for SR. Do we need to make them consistent? It seems change the definition in OSPF = extension may be less influence for the existing related drafts. Best Regards. Aijun Wang Network R&D and Operation Support Department China Telecom Corporation Limited Beijing Research Institute,Beijing, China= . --_000_c5a4d1de5e7943318821018c138b5562XCHALN008ciscocom_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Hi Aijun,

 

Can you clarify what you mean by “inconsistenci= es”?

 

Also, you are referring the old version of OSPFv3 SR = draft before it was aligned with the OSPFv2 SR draft. Please check https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ospf-ospfv3-segment-routing-extensio= ns-11#section-6.1

 

OSPF and ISIS are different protocols and there are s= ome differences between them. I would not call them inconsistencies. BGP-LS= spec refers to the individual IGP drafts for interpretation of flags. So please specifically point out what inconsi= stency you are referring to.

 

Thanks,

Ketan

 

From: Lsr <lsr-bounces@ietf.org> On Behalf Of Aijun Wang
Sent: 02 April 2018 14:23
To: lsr@ietf.org
Subject: [Lsr] Inconsistence regarding the definition of "Adj-S= ID Sub-TLV" between OSPF and ISIS extension for Segment Routing

 =

Hi, All:

 

We found there were some inconsistences= for the definition of “Adjacency Segment Identifier” be= tween OSPF and ISIS extension for segment routing, please see the link below for comparison.

https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-isis-= segment-routing-extensions-15#section-2.2.1

https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-= ospf-ospfv3-segment-routing-extensions-10#section-7.1=

 

Here we want to know is there any reason for this inconsistence? We t= hink this inconsistence can easily cause error for BGP-LS implementation fo= r segment routing extension, as that defined in https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-idr-bgp-ls-segment-routing-ext-04#se= ction-2.2.1, which is similar with ISIS extension for SR, but different= from OSPF extension for SR.

 

Do we need to make them consistent? It seems change the definition in= OSPF extension may be less influence for the existing related drafts.=

 

Best Regards.

 

Aijun Wang

Network R&D and Operation Support Department

China Telecom Corporation Limited Beijing Research Institute,Beijing,= China.

 

--_000_c5a4d1de5e7943318821018c138b5562XCHALN008ciscocom_-- From nobody Mon Apr 2 04:22:39 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 86F97127444 for ; Mon, 2 Apr 2018 04:22:37 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.735 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.735 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, MIME_QP_LONG_LINE=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_BL=0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_L3=1.154, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id W0Kv3xmI509m for ; Mon, 2 Apr 2018 04:22:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from m21397.mail.qiye.163.com (m21397.mail.qiye.163.com [223.252.213.97]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1D1561204DA for ; Mon, 2 Apr 2018 04:22:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [192.168.124.2] (unknown [36.102.210.6]) by m21397.mail.qiye.163.com (Hmail) with ESMTPA id 4A088143928; Mon, 2 Apr 2018 19:22:25 +0800 (CST) Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=Apple-Mail-F1A5C0FF-AC1D-4C46-AB87-8B7D230126B3 Mime-Version: 1.0 (1.0) From: Aijun Wang X-Mailer: iPhone Mail (15E216) In-Reply-To: Date: Mon, 2 Apr 2018 19:22:22 +0800 Cc: "lsr@ietf.org" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <1B346347-9242-4EE4-BDA2-F024EF483B8A@tsinghua.org.cn> References: <008101d3ca60$073f81b0$15be8510$@org.cn> To: "Ketan Talaulikar (ketant)" X-HM-Spam-Status: e1ktWUFJV1koWUFKTEtLSjdXWQgYFAkeWUFLVUtXWQkOFx4IWUFZMjUtOj cyP0FLVUtZBg++ X-HM-Sender-Digest: e1kSHx4VD1lBWUc6Phg6KBw5GDodUTxPUR0MFxxOIksKFDJVSlVKTklJ TU1DSk5LTkpNVTMWGhIXVQwaFRwaEhEOFTsPCBIVHBMOGlUUCRxVGBVFWVdZDB4ZWUEdGhcIHldZ CAFZQUpPQk1DN1dZEgtZQVlITVVKS0lVSUpLVU1ZBg++ X-HM-Tid: 0a6286180a987f6bkuuk4a088143928 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] Inconsistence regarding the definition of "Adj-SID Sub-TLV" between OSPF and ISIS extension for Segment Routing X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 02 Apr 2018 11:22:38 -0000 --Apple-Mail-F1A5C0FF-AC1D-4C46-AB87-8B7D230126B3 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi, Ketan: There is one two-bytes =E2=80=9CReserved=E2=80=9D field in =E2=80=9CAdjacenc= y Segment Identifier=E2=80=9D TLV for OSPF extension, but this field doesn=E2= =80=99t exist in the corresponding TLV for ISIS extension. Every other field= s are same.=20 Corresponding definition in BGP-LS is similar with OSPF(not similar with ISI= S as I mentioned in previous mail). Then when the router reports/redistribut= es the ISIS LSDB information to BGP protocol, the router must add two bytes t= o the =E2=80=9Clength=E2=80=9D field and add/stuff the =E2=80=9Creserved=E2=80= =9D field; but for OSPF LSDB, the router need only copy the corresponding fi= elds according. We have found the error arises from this inconsistency from the real router a= nd think it is better to align this definition in different IGP protocol. Update to ISIS related extensions draft may be easier. Aijun Wang China Telecom > =E5=9C=A8 2018=E5=B9=B44=E6=9C=882=E6=97=A5=EF=BC=8C18:26=EF=BC=8CKetan Ta= laulikar (ketant) =E5=86=99=E9=81=93=EF=BC=9A >=20 > Hi Aijun, > =20 > Can you clarify what you mean by =E2=80=9Cinconsistencies=E2=80=9D? > =20 > Also, you are referring the old version of OSPFv3 SR draft before it was a= ligned with the OSPFv2 SR draft. Please check https://tools.ietf.org/html/dr= aft-ietf-ospf-ospfv3-segment-routing-extensions-11#section-6.1 > =20 > OSPF and ISIS are different protocols and there are some differences betwe= en them. I would not call them inconsistencies. BGP-LS spec refers to the in= dividual IGP drafts for interpretation of flags. So please specifically poin= t out what inconsistency you are referring to. > =20 > Thanks, > Ketan > =20 > From: Lsr On Behalf Of Aijun Wang > Sent: 02 April 2018 14:23 > To: lsr@ietf.org > Subject: [Lsr] Inconsistence regarding the definition of "Adj-SID Sub-TLV"= between OSPF and ISIS extension for Segment Routing > =20 > Hi, All: > =20 > We found there were some inconsistences for the definition of =E2=80=9CAdj= acency Segment Identifier=E2=80=9D between OSPF and ISIS extension for segme= nt routing, please see the link below for comparison. > https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensions-15#= section-2.2.1 > https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ospf-ospfv3-segment-routing-extensi= ons-10#section-7.1 > =20 > Here we want to know is there any reason for this inconsistence? We think t= his inconsistence can easily cause error for BGP-LS implementation for segme= nt routing extension, as that defined in https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-i= etf-idr-bgp-ls-segment-routing-ext-04#section-2.2.1, which is similar with I= SIS extension for SR, but different from OSPF extension for SR. > =20 > Do we need to make them consistent? It seems change the definition in OSPF= extension may be less influence for the existing related drafts. > =20 > Best Regards. > =20 > Aijun Wang > Network R&D and Operation Support Department > China Telecom Corporation Limited Beijing Research Institute,Beijing, Chin= a. > =20 > _______________________________________________ > Lsr mailing list > Lsr@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr --Apple-Mail-F1A5C0FF-AC1D-4C46-AB87-8B7D230126B3 Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi, Ketan:
There is one two-bytes =E2=80=9CReserved=E2=80=9D field in = ;=E2=80=9CAdjacency Segment Identifier=E2=80=9D TLV for OSPF extension, b= ut this field doesn=E2=80=99t exist in the corresponding TLV for ISIS extens= ion. Every other fields are= same. 
Corresponding d= efinition in BGP-LS is similar with OSPF(not similar with ISIS as I mentione= d in previous mail). Then when the router reports/redistributes the ISIS LSD= B information to BGP protocol, the router must add two bytes to the =E2=80=9C= length=E2=80=9D field and add/stuff the =E2=80=9Creserved=E2=80=9D field; bu= t for OSPF LSDB, the router need only copy the corresponding fields accordin= g.
We have found the error arises f= rom this inconsistency from the real router and think it is better to align t= his definition in different IGP protocol.

Update to ISIS related e= xtensions draft may be easier.

= Aijun Wang
China Telecom

=E5= =9C=A8 2018=E5=B9=B44=E6=9C=882=E6=97=A5=EF=BC=8C18:26=EF=BC=8CKetan Talauli= kar (ketant) <ketant@cisco.com>= ; =E5=86=99=E9=81=93=EF=BC=9A

=

Hi Aijun,

 

Can you clarify what you mean by =E2=80=9Cinconsistenci= es=E2=80=9D?

 

Also, you are referring the old version of OSPFv3 SR dr= aft before it was aligned with the OSPFv2 SR draft. Please check https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ospf-ospfv3-segment-routing-extension= s-11#section-6.1

 

OSPF and ISIS are different protocols and there are som= e differences between them. I would not call them inconsistencies. BGP-LS sp= ec refers to the individual IGP drafts for interpretation of flags. So please specifically point out what inconsis= tency you are referring to.

 

Thanks,

Ketan

 

From: Lsr <l= sr-bounces@ietf.org> On Behalf Of Aijun Wang
Sent: 02 April 2018 14:23
To: lsr@ietf.org
Subject: [Lsr] Inconsistence regarding the definition of "Adj-SID Sub= -TLV" between OSPF and ISIS extension for Segment Routing
<= /p>

 <= /o:p>

Hi, All:

 

We found there were some inconsistences for the definition of =E2=80=9CAdjacency Segment Identifier=E2=80=9D b= etween OSPF and ISIS extension for segment routing, please see the link below for comparison.

https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-isis-seg= ment-routing-extensions-15#section-2.2.1

https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-osp= f-ospfv3-segment-routing-extensions-10#section-7.1

=

 

Here we want to know is there any reason for this inconsistence? We thi= nk this inconsistence can easily cause error for BGP-LS implementation for s= egment routing extension, as that defined in https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-idr-bgp-ls-segment-routing-ext-04#sec= tion-2.2.1, which is similar with ISIS extension for SR, but different f= rom OSPF extension for SR.

 

Do we need to make them consistent? It seems change the definition in O= SPF extension may be less influence for the existing related drafts.

 

Best Regards.

 

Aijun Wang

Network R&D and Operation Support Department

China Telecom Corporation Limited Beijing Research Institute,Beijing, C= hina.

 

____________________= ___________________________
Lsr mailing list
Lsr@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/lis= tinfo/lsr
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From: "Ketan Talaulikar (ketant)" To: Aijun Wang CC: "lsr@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [Lsr] Inconsistence regarding the definition of "Adj-SID Sub-TLV" between OSPF and ISIS extension for Segment Routing Thread-Index: AdPKX89aH7daBvUkQYK90A0ibbwqrwAABY/wAAMor+AADI+6AAAKaB1g Date: Mon, 2 Apr 2018 11:35:32 +0000 Message-ID: References: <008101d3ca60$073f81b0$15be8510$@org.cn> <1B346347-9242-4EE4-BDA2-F024EF483B8A@tsinghua.org.cn> In-Reply-To: <1B346347-9242-4EE4-BDA2-F024EF483B8A@tsinghua.org.cn> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted x-originating-ip: [10.65.68.229] Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_aab65c5b06d346d2a5a4ef8cef5ad28bXCHALN008ciscocom_" MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] Inconsistence regarding the definition of "Adj-SID Sub-TLV" between OSPF and ISIS extension for Segment Routing X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list 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(8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id w32CJmuH027431 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Mon, 2 Apr 2018 12:19:48 GMT Received: from xch-rtp-015.cisco.com (64.101.220.155) by XCH-RTP-006.cisco.com (64.101.220.146) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.0.1320.4; Mon, 2 Apr 2018 08:19:47 -0400 Received: from xch-rtp-015.cisco.com ([64.101.220.155]) by XCH-RTP-015.cisco.com ([64.101.220.155]) with mapi id 15.00.1320.000; Mon, 2 Apr 2018 08:19:47 -0400 From: "Acee Lindem (acee)" To: "Ketan Talaulikar (ketant)" , Aijun Wang CC: "lsr@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [Lsr] Inconsistence regarding the definition of "Adj-SID Sub-TLV" between OSPF and ISIS extension for Segment Routing Thread-Index: AdPKX89aH7daBvUkQYK90A0ibbwqrwAABY/wAAMor+AACndIAAAAdbkA///JToA= Date: Mon, 2 Apr 2018 12:19:47 +0000 Message-ID: <8C26288C-54C3-4C04-91A6-2B99562A1DE9@cisco.com> References: <008101d3ca60$073f81b0$15be8510$@org.cn> <1B346347-9242-4EE4-BDA2-F024EF483B8A@tsinghua.org.cn> In-Reply-To: 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port 10024) with ESMTP id IVgrh9Xrhk-X for ; Tue, 3 Apr 2018 00:34:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from aer-iport-1.cisco.com (aer-iport-1.cisco.com [173.38.203.51]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher DHE-RSA-SEED-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 1C98C124205 for ; Tue, 3 Apr 2018 00:34:37 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cisco.com; i=@cisco.com; l=5454; q=dns/txt; s=iport; t=1522740878; x=1523950478; h=message-id:date:from:mime-version:to:cc:subject: references:in-reply-to:content-transfer-encoding; bh=y0jsQd253dBAHhQJH4PtPWYp8h7BQQFiOlburZ47m5Q=; b=MAmbjSDYcHTe2W8O0N3sQnbNtMDLJjf1ut555xPM093thUWhDKGa1Jvm YyDmXD1IBB1v/XEFxkkoFChmXve8BM8hvIe27qi8toCc1wVtW6fV3QG4C 6C6x5aJWL+tF7Yf35ztNm0m6AL74Q91xXDHmmvx3w/AnZGcjjXtpSWnGK g=; X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.48,398,1517875200"; d="scan'208";a="2968108" Received: from aer-iport-nat.cisco.com (HELO aer-core-3.cisco.com) ([173.38.203.22]) by aer-iport-1.cisco.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384; 03 Apr 2018 07:34:36 +0000 Received: from [10.60.140.57] (ams-ppsenak-nitro8.cisco.com [10.60.140.57]) by aer-core-3.cisco.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id w337YZsI029202; Tue, 3 Apr 2018 07:34:36 GMT Message-ID: <5AC32E8B.6090202@cisco.com> Date: Tue, 03 Apr 2018 09:34:35 +0200 From: Peter Psenak User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.11; rv:24.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/24.4.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Acee Lindem (acee)" , "Ketan Talaulikar (ketant)" , Aijun Wang CC: "lsr@ietf.org" References: <008101d3ca60$073f81b0$15be8510$@org.cn> <1B346347-9242-4EE4-BDA2-F024EF483B8A@tsinghua.org.cn> <8C26288C-54C3-4C04-91A6-2B99562A1DE9@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <8C26288C-54C3-4C04-91A6-2B99562A1DE9@cisco.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] Inconsistence regarding the definition of "Adj-SID Sub-TLV" between OSPF and ISIS extension for Segment Routing X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 03 Apr 2018 07:34:43 -0000 On 02/04/18 14:19 , Acee Lindem (acee) wrote: > Speaking as WG member: > > I couldn’t agree more with Ketan. No changes are required to these > documents. as a coauthor of the OSPF/OSPFv3 SR drafts, I fully agree. thanks, Peter > > Thanks, > > Acee > > *From: *Lsr on behalf of "Ketan Talaulikar > (ketant)" > *Date: *Monday, April 2, 2018 at 7:36 AM > *To: *Aijun Wang > *Cc: *"lsr@ietf.org" > *Subject: *Re: [Lsr] Inconsistence regarding the definition of "Adj-SID > Sub-TLV" between OSPF and ISIS extension for Segment Routing > > Hi Aijun, > > I understand what you are referring to now, but these are not > inconsistencies. ISIS, OSPF and BGP-LS are 3 different protocols. Their > encodings may not all be the same. ISIS uses 1 byte for type/length and > has LSP space constraints which you would notice in the protocol > encodings. OSPF doesn’t have the same challenge and you would notice how > its TLVs tend to be aligned. BGP-LS is somewhat similar to OSPF from > these size constraints perspective. > > I do not see the implementation challenges in encoding from the two IGPs > into BGP-LS. It does not make sense to change any of the protocol > encodings that you ask for currently since implementations have been > shipping with them for many years. > > IMHO it is not necessary to put such constraints for what you call > “consistency†on these 3 protocol encodings in the future. However, we > do try to be consistent in semantics as much as possible. > > Thanks, > > Ketan > > *From:*Aijun Wang > *Sent:* 02 April 2018 16:52 > *To:* Ketan Talaulikar (ketant) > *Cc:* lsr@ietf.org > *Subject:* Re: [Lsr] Inconsistence regarding the definition of "Adj-SID > Sub-TLV" between OSPF and ISIS extension for Segment Routing > > Hi, Ketan: > > There is one two-bytes “Reserved†field in “Adjacency Segment > Identifier†TLV for OSPF extension, but this field doesn’t exist in the > corresponding TLV for ISIS extension. Every other fields are same. > > Corresponding definition in BGP-LS is similar with OSPF(not similar with > ISIS as I mentioned in previous mail). Then when the router > reports/redistributes the ISIS LSDB information to BGP protocol, the > router must add two bytes to the “length†field and add/stuff the > “reserved†field; but for OSPF LSDB, the router need only copy the > corresponding fields according. > > We have found the error arises from this inconsistency from the real > router and think it is better to align this definition in different IGP > protocol. > > Update to ISIS related extensions draft may be easier. > > Aijun Wang > > China Telecom > > > 在 2018å¹´4月2日,18:26,Ketan Talaulikar (ketant) > > 写é“: > > Hi Aijun, > > Can you clarify what you mean by “inconsistenciesâ€? > > Also, you are referring the old version of OSPFv3 SR draft before it > was aligned with the OSPFv2 SR draft. Please check > https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ospf-ospfv3-segment-routing-extensions-11#section-6.1 > > OSPF and ISIS are different protocols and there are some differences > between them. I would not call them inconsistencies. BGP-LS spec > refers to the individual IGP drafts for interpretation of flags. So > please specifically point out what inconsistency you are referring to. > > Thanks, > > Ketan > > *From:*Lsr > *On > Behalf Of *Aijun Wang > *Sent:* 02 April 2018 14:23 > *To:* lsr@ietf.org > *Subject:* [Lsr] Inconsistence regarding the definition of "Adj-SID > Sub-TLV" between OSPF and ISIS extension for Segment Routing > > Hi, All: > > We found there were some inconsistences for the definition of > “Adjacency Segment Identifier†between OSPF and ISIS extension for > segment routing, please see the link below for comparison. > > https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensions-15#section-2.2.1 > > https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ospf-ospfv3-segment-routing-extensions-10#section-7.1 > > Here we want to know is there any reason for this inconsistence? We > think this inconsistence can easily cause error for BGP-LS > implementation for segment routing extension, as that defined in > https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-idr-bgp-ls-segment-routing-ext-04#section-2.2.1, > which is similar with ISIS extension for SR, but different from OSPF > extension for SR. > > Do we need to make them consistent? It seems change the definition > in OSPF extension may be less influence for the existing related drafts. > > Best Regards. > > Aijun Wang > > Network R&D and Operation Support Department > > China Telecom Corporation Limited Beijing Research > Institute,Beijing, China. > > _______________________________________________ > Lsr mailing list > Lsr@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr > > > > _______________________________________________ > Lsr mailing list > Lsr@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr > From nobody Tue Apr 3 00:38:33 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B2CFB12E053 for ; Tue, 3 Apr 2018 00:38:31 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=previdi-net.20150623.gappssmtp.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id wIayIg-X0xcf for ; Tue, 3 Apr 2018 00:38:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-wm0-x234.google.com (mail-wm0-x234.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:400c:c09::234]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4B09A124205 for ; Tue, 3 Apr 2018 00:38:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-wm0-x234.google.com with SMTP id v21so31231484wmc.1 for ; Tue, 03 Apr 2018 00:38:29 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=previdi-net.20150623.gappssmtp.com; s=20150623; h=subject:mime-version:from:in-reply-to:date:cc :content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references:to; bh=KBLX+o61HfvK+oG+AD8OxDLMzcY/R1XWZvVQCKii1Q4=; b=i/DAVE1wxqMwZ27RT+kPX/toU69JH6SF3b6vjPIqdUOQKu8pMpLDuHZ946rkOw3gOD fmQKV8ISG5wM/XAF7rYHjM1RgZJiFbK5I5esnLUcS49wjYFCrq96ekNrXnsxHrRbshxP noohLbzOBL7018YVeazQqPf7lTUQW4d+Nup1BSX8oPWjC1R9OUzZh+Yc4ynZkrIh9Eox sHWp4lznYltAeoZajc8y7jCfIYB1N7T6p1pGC1W1r5pPUOqN1FjEU5KZNLta7SolzlDJ 8EQDKR14TNiq2nGFS6M0wXomHr5oQleGBmxIPEzOqri92dvS9iASkbHtzMZcoLBOoAhT HXmw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:subject:mime-version:from:in-reply-to:date:cc :content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references:to; bh=KBLX+o61HfvK+oG+AD8OxDLMzcY/R1XWZvVQCKii1Q4=; b=Kq01R8mrJsIrqSEVTNKHX+Ag3JlSO18hJ40oWTLJJfn36xkh1ZgJxWrvpXch10T27s 2S5kbl4WRClu2ZnbXFb12Ci3tfdULzZqk61xKWYoonTPTgzSUNSz9T53CNaOfrzD/R6D SNR/sZOMbAAua6HF5FERfNx671olGKLms2nICJuNRk1QtM16P8QchX6cqRPvtVpE6VqD Q+KMYTCDweCffzKAlXXvPz3/E3ThUplpUtBo/EePXE2bs3mVDZObTVRDgESNPgyxlqrM AeKkbNbf59Xyipn+9EU/KQk34QF7g93GE4RVrHZE7xu/Ay+Zz7UTX4ftFfVtbtZdt5Kp rpgQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AElRT7Gdl1/9eHKRleRMv3Mdazz3h/sn8B0OOuhgzajGnZbJrfhFKs35 dCvaMYRURn42zCD0ozvXT4IcCA== X-Google-Smtp-Source: AIpwx48cFbPp+oOOpTqOKqBgFNAwCMT2ivkOypC0cMUx1ks8Qb6k8mTGxD2/dq9UochFU2gS4hLDEA== X-Received: by 10.28.109.131 with SMTP id b3mr2776496wmi.145.1522741107753; Tue, 03 Apr 2018 00:38:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [192.168.43.78] ([5.170.130.50]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id d9sm5628875wmh.38.2018.04.03.00.38.25 (version=TLS1 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-SHA bits=128/128); Tue, 03 Apr 2018 00:38:26 -0700 (PDT) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 8.2 \(2104\)) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 From: stefano previdi In-Reply-To: <5AC32E8B.6090202@cisco.com> Date: Tue, 3 Apr 2018 09:38:47 +0200 Cc: "Acee Lindem (acee)" , "Ketan Talaulikar (ketant)" , Aijun Wang , "lsr@ietf.org" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: References: <008101d3ca60$073f81b0$15be8510$@org.cn> <1B346347-9242-4EE4-BDA2-F024EF483B8A@tsinghua.org.cn> <8C26288C-54C3-4C04-91A6-2B99562A1DE9@cisco.com> <5AC32E8B.6090202@cisco.com> To: Peter Psenak X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.2104) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] Inconsistence regarding the definition of "Adj-SID Sub-TLV" between OSPF and ISIS extension for Segment Routing X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 03 Apr 2018 07:38:32 -0000 me too.=20 If we want to align the encoding, we should probably better align the = protocol name directly... s. > On Apr 3, 2018, at 9:34 AM, Peter Psenak wrote: >=20 > On 02/04/18 14:19 , Acee Lindem (acee) wrote: >> Speaking as WG member: >>=20 >> I couldn=E2=80=99t agree more with Ketan. No changes are required to = these >> documents. >=20 > as a coauthor of the OSPF/OSPFv3 SR drafts, I fully agree. >=20 > thanks, > Peter >=20 >>=20 >> Thanks, >>=20 >> Acee >>=20 >> *From: *Lsr on behalf of "Ketan Talaulikar >> (ketant)" >> *Date: *Monday, April 2, 2018 at 7:36 AM >> *To: *Aijun Wang >> *Cc: *"lsr@ietf.org" >> *Subject: *Re: [Lsr] Inconsistence regarding the definition of = "Adj-SID >> Sub-TLV" between OSPF and ISIS extension for Segment Routing >>=20 >> Hi Aijun, >>=20 >> I understand what you are referring to now, but these are not >> inconsistencies. ISIS, OSPF and BGP-LS are 3 different protocols. = Their >> encodings may not all be the same. ISIS uses 1 byte for type/length = and >> has LSP space constraints which you would notice in the protocol >> encodings. OSPF doesn=E2=80=99t have the same challenge and you would = notice how >> its TLVs tend to be aligned. BGP-LS is somewhat similar to OSPF from >> these size constraints perspective. >>=20 >> I do not see the implementation challenges in encoding from the two = IGPs >> into BGP-LS. It does not make sense to change any of the protocol >> encodings that you ask for currently since implementations have been >> shipping with them for many years. >>=20 >> IMHO it is not necessary to put such constraints for what you call >> =E2=80=9Cconsistency=E2=80=9D on these 3 protocol encodings in the = future. However, we >> do try to be consistent in semantics as much as possible. >>=20 >> Thanks, >>=20 >> Ketan >>=20 >> *From:*Aijun Wang >> *Sent:* 02 April 2018 16:52 >> *To:* Ketan Talaulikar (ketant) >> *Cc:* lsr@ietf.org >> *Subject:* Re: [Lsr] Inconsistence regarding the definition of = "Adj-SID >> Sub-TLV" between OSPF and ISIS extension for Segment Routing >>=20 >> Hi, Ketan: >>=20 >> There is one two-bytes =E2=80=9CReserved=E2=80=9D field in = =E2=80=9CAdjacency Segment >> Identifier=E2=80=9D TLV for OSPF extension, but this field doesn=E2=80=99= t exist in the >> corresponding TLV for ISIS extension. Every other fields are same. >>=20 >> Corresponding definition in BGP-LS is similar with OSPF(not similar = with >> ISIS as I mentioned in previous mail). Then when the router >> reports/redistributes the ISIS LSDB information to BGP protocol, the >> router must add two bytes to the =E2=80=9Clength=E2=80=9D field and = add/stuff the >> =E2=80=9Creserved=E2=80=9D field; but for OSPF LSDB, the router need = only copy the >> corresponding fields according. >>=20 >> We have found the error arises from this inconsistency from the real >> router and think it is better to align this definition in different = IGP >> protocol. >>=20 >> Update to ISIS related extensions draft may be easier. >>=20 >> Aijun Wang >>=20 >> China Telecom >>=20 >>=20 >> =E5=9C=A8 2018=E5=B9=B44=E6=9C=882=E6=97=A5=EF=BC=8C18:26=EF=BC=8CKetan= Talaulikar (ketant) >> > =E5=86=99=E9=81=93=EF=BC=9A= >>=20 >> Hi Aijun, >>=20 >> Can you clarify what you mean by =E2=80=9Cinconsistencies=E2=80=9D? >>=20 >> Also, you are referring the old version of OSPFv3 SR draft before = it >> was aligned with the OSPFv2 SR draft. Please check >> = https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ospf-ospfv3-segment-routing-extensi= ons-11#section-6.1 >>=20 >> OSPF and ISIS are different protocols and there are some = differences >> between them. I would not call them inconsistencies. BGP-LS spec >> refers to the individual IGP drafts for interpretation of flags. = So >> please specifically point out what inconsistency you are referring = to. >>=20 >> Thanks, >>=20 >> Ketan >>=20 >> *From:*Lsr > *On >> Behalf Of *Aijun Wang >> *Sent:* 02 April 2018 14:23 >> *To:* lsr@ietf.org >> *Subject:* [Lsr] Inconsistence regarding the definition of = "Adj-SID >> Sub-TLV" between OSPF and ISIS extension for Segment Routing >>=20 >> Hi, All: >>=20 >> We found there were some inconsistences for the definition of >> =E2=80=9CAdjacency Segment Identifier=E2=80=9D between OSPF and = ISIS extension for >> segment routing, please see the link below for comparison. >>=20 >> = https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensions-15#= section-2.2.1 >>=20 >> = https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ospf-ospfv3-segment-routing-extensi= ons-10#section-7.1 >>=20 >> Here we want to know is there any reason for this inconsistence? = We >> think this inconsistence can easily cause error for BGP-LS >> implementation for segment routing extension, as that defined in >> = https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-idr-bgp-ls-segment-routing-ext-04#s= ection-2.2.1, >> which is similar with ISIS extension for SR, but different from = OSPF >> extension for SR. >>=20 >> Do we need to make them consistent? It seems change the definition >> in OSPF extension may be less influence for the existing related = drafts. >>=20 >> Best Regards. >>=20 >> Aijun Wang >>=20 >> Network R&D and Operation Support Department >>=20 >> China Telecom Corporation Limited Beijing Research >> Institute,Beijing, China. >>=20 >> _______________________________________________ >> Lsr mailing list >> Lsr@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >> _______________________________________________ >> Lsr mailing list >> Lsr@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr >>=20 >=20 > _______________________________________________ > Lsr mailing list > Lsr@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr From nobody Tue Apr 3 07:45:09 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 71206127867 for ; Tue, 3 Apr 2018 07:45:07 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: 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charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: Cc: lsr@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 6.77.1 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Message-ID: <152278297378.22743.4235228178374326891@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Tue, 03 Apr 2018 12:16:13 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Lsr] I-D Action: draft-ietf-ospf-yang-11.txt X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 03 Apr 2018 19:16:14 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Link State Routing WG of the IETF. Title : Yang Data Model for OSPF Protocol Authors : Derek Yeung Yingzhen Qu Jeffrey Zhang Ing-Wher Chen Acee Lindem Filename : draft-ietf-ospf-yang-11.txt Pages : 108 Date : 2018-04-03 Abstract: This document defines a YANG data model that can be used to configure and manage OSPF. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-ospf-yang/ There are also htmlized versions available at: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ospf-yang-11 https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-ospf-yang-11 A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-ospf-yang-11 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Tue Apr 3 13:30:11 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2F49612D870 for ; Tue, 3 Apr 2018 13:30:10 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -13.49 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-13.49 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, MISSING_HEADERS=1.021, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.01, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=cisco.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id QBsvHhK8zm_H for ; 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d="scan'208";a="93643197" Received: from alln-core-1.cisco.com ([173.36.13.131]) by alln-iport-1.cisco.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384; 03 Apr 2018 20:30:07 +0000 Received: from XCH-RTP-014.cisco.com (xch-rtp-014.cisco.com [64.101.220.154]) by alln-core-1.cisco.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id w33KU6sL020473 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL) for ; Tue, 3 Apr 2018 20:30:07 GMT Received: from xch-rtp-015.cisco.com (64.101.220.155) by XCH-RTP-014.cisco.com (64.101.220.154) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.0.1320.4; Tue, 3 Apr 2018 16:30:03 -0400 Received: from xch-rtp-015.cisco.com ([64.101.220.155]) by XCH-RTP-015.cisco.com ([64.101.220.155]) with mapi id 15.00.1320.000; Tue, 3 Apr 2018 16:30:06 -0400 From: "Acee Lindem (acee)" CC: "lsr@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [Lsr] I-D Action: draft-ietf-ospf-yang-11.txt Thread-Index: AQHTy4BU9KQOECT3bUKUsyFUft4GVqPvfhiA Date: Tue, 3 Apr 2018 20:30:06 +0000 Message-ID: <813287D8-5011-42E4-8487-EEA3706DAC32@cisco.com> References: <152278297378.22743.4235228178374326891@ietfa.amsl.com> In-Reply-To: <152278297378.22743.4235228178374326891@ietfa.amsl.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted x-originating-ip: [10.116.152.200] Content-Type: text/plain; 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Tue, 3 Apr 2018 19:20:07 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.89 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.89 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DC_PNG_UNO_LARGO=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_KAM_HTML_FONT_INVALID=0.01] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id VDD9n5d0XEeI for ; Tue, 3 Apr 2018 19:20:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from m21397.mail.qiye.163.com (m21397.mail.qiye.163.com [223.252.213.97]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 26A59120725 for ; Tue, 3 Apr 2018 19:20:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from WangajPC (unknown [219.142.69.77]) by m21397.mail.qiye.163.com (Hmail) with ESMTPA id 8540D14267A; Wed, 4 Apr 2018 10:19:55 +0800 (CST) From: "Aijun Wang" To: "'stefano previdi'" , "'Peter Psenak'" Cc: , "'Ketan Talaulikar \(ketant\)'" , "'Acee Lindem \(acee\)'" References: <008101d3ca60$073f81b0$15be8510$@org.cn> <1B346347-9242-4EE4-BDA2-F024EF483B8A@tsinghua.org.cn> <8C26288C-54C3-4C04-91A6-2B99562A1DE9@cisco.com> <5AC32E8B.6090202@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: Date: Wed, 4 Apr 2018 10:19:54 +0800 Message-ID: <009b01d3cbbb$6bfc3510$43f49f30$@org.cn> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_009C_01D3CBFE.7A1F7510" X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 12.0 Thread-Index: AdPLHsp1bmZec0HYS1eYSEusvi+GBgAm73sg Content-Language: zh-cn X-HM-Spam-Status: e1ktWUFJV1koWUFKTEtLSjdXWQgYFAkeWUFLVUtXWQkOFx4IWUFZMjUtOj cyP0FLVUtZBg++ X-HM-Sender-Digest: e1kSHx4VD1lBWUc6Ohw6GCo5PDodLjMBShcDCz0ZHwtPFD1VSlVKTklJ Q0tDT0tKSklDVTMWGhIXVQwaFRwaEhEOFTsPCBIVHBMOGlUUCRxVGBVFWVdZDB4ZWUEdGhcIHldZ CAFZQU1CTUlCN1dZEgtZQVlJSkJVSk9JVU1CVUxMWQY+ X-HM-Tid: 0a628e7417d57f6bkuuk8540d14267a Archived-At: Subject: [Lsr] =?utf-8?b?562U5aSNOiAgSW5jb25zaXN0ZW5jZSByZWdhcmRpbmcgdGhl?= =?utf-8?q?_definition_of_=22Adj-SID_Sub-TLV=22_between_OSPF_and_ISIS_exte?= =?utf-8?q?nsion_for_Segment_Routing?= X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 04 Apr 2018 02:20:08 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_009C_01D3CBFE.7A1F7510 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_009D_01D3CBFE.7A1F7510" ------=_NextPart_001_009D_01D3CBFE.7A1F7510 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi, All: =20 We have found some inconsistencies for the implementation of BGP-LS = protocol regarding this =E2=80=9CAdj-SID SubTLV =E2=80=9D, please see = the following screenshot. I think we should do some works for the related drafts to clarify this = ambiguous/easy to be ignored definition. =20 =20 =20 Best Regards. =20 Aijun Wang Network R&D and Operation Support Department China Telecom Corporation Limited Beijing Research Institute,Beijing, = China. =20 -----=E9=82=AE=E4=BB=B6=E5=8E=9F=E4=BB=B6----- =E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: stefano previdi = [mailto:stefano@previdi.net]=20 =E5=8F=91=E9=80=81=E6=97=B6=E9=97=B4: 2018=E5=B9=B44=E6=9C=883=E6=97=A5 = 15:39 =E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: Peter Psenak =E6=8A=84=E9=80=81: lsr@ietf.org; Ketan Talaulikar (ketant); Acee Lindem = (acee); Aijun Wang =E4=B8=BB=E9=A2=98: Re: [Lsr] Inconsistence regarding the definition of = "Adj-SID Sub-TLV" between OSPF and ISIS extension for Segment Routing =20 me too.=20 =20 If we want to align the encoding, we should probably better align the = protocol name directly... =20 s. =20 =20 > On Apr 3, 2018, at 9:34 AM, Peter Psenak < = ppsenak@cisco.com> wrote: >=20 > On 02/04/18 14:19 , Acee Lindem (acee) wrote: >> Speaking as WG member: >>=20 >> I couldn=E2=80=99t agree more with Ketan. No changes are required to = these=20 >> documents. >=20 > as a coauthor of the OSPF/OSPFv3 SR drafts, I fully agree. >=20 > thanks, > Peter >=20 >>=20 >> Thanks, >>=20 >> Acee >>=20 >> *From: *Lsr < lsr-bounces@ietf.org> on = behalf of "Ketan Talaulikar=20 >> (ketant)" < ketant@cisco.com> >> *Date: *Monday, April 2, 2018 at 7:36 AM >> *To: *Aijun Wang < = wangaijun@tsinghua.org.cn> >> *Cc: *" lsr@ietf.org" < = lsr@ietf.org> >> *Subject: *Re: [Lsr] Inconsistence regarding the definition of=20 >> "Adj-SID Sub-TLV" between OSPF and ISIS extension for Segment Routing >>=20 >> Hi Aijun, >>=20 >> I understand what you are referring to now, but these are not=20 >> inconsistencies. ISIS, OSPF and BGP-LS are 3 different protocols.=20 >> Their encodings may not all be the same. ISIS uses 1 byte for=20 >> type/length and has LSP space constraints which you would notice in=20 >> the protocol encodings. OSPF doesn=E2=80=99t have the same challenge = and you=20 >> would notice how its TLVs tend to be aligned. BGP-LS is somewhat=20 >> similar to OSPF from these size constraints perspective. >>=20 >> I do not see the implementation challenges in encoding from the two=20 >> IGPs into BGP-LS. It does not make sense to change any of the=20 >> protocol encodings that you ask for currently since implementations=20 >> have been shipping with them for many years. >>=20 >> IMHO it is not necessary to put such constraints for what you call=20 >> =E2=80=9Cconsistency=E2=80=9D on these 3 protocol encodings in the = future. However,=20 >> we do try to be consistent in semantics as much as possible. >>=20 >> Thanks, >>=20 >> Ketan >>=20 >> *From:*Aijun Wang < = wangaijun@tsinghua.org.cn> >> *Sent:* 02 April 2018 16:52 >> *To:* Ketan Talaulikar (ketant) < = ketant@cisco.com> >> *Cc:* lsr@ietf.org >> *Subject:* Re: [Lsr] Inconsistence regarding the definition of=20 >> "Adj-SID Sub-TLV" between OSPF and ISIS extension for Segment Routing >>=20 >> Hi, Ketan: >>=20 >> There is one two-bytes =E2=80=9CReserved=E2=80=9D field in = =E2=80=9CAdjacency Segment=20 >> Identifier=E2=80=9D TLV for OSPF extension, but this field = doesn=E2=80=99t exist in=20 >> the corresponding TLV for ISIS extension. Every other fields are = same. >>=20 >> Corresponding definition in BGP-LS is similar with OSPF(not similar=20 >> with ISIS as I mentioned in previous mail). Then when the router=20 >> reports/redistributes the ISIS LSDB information to BGP protocol, the=20 >> router must add two bytes to the =E2=80=9Clength=E2=80=9D field and = add/stuff the=20 >> =E2=80=9Creserved=E2=80=9D field; but for OSPF LSDB, the router need = only copy the=20 >> corresponding fields according. >>=20 >> We have found the error arises from this inconsistency from the real=20 >> router and think it is better to align this definition in different=20 >> IGP protocol. >>=20 >> Update to ISIS related extensions draft may be easier. >>=20 >> Aijun Wang >>=20 >> China Telecom >>=20 >>=20 >> =E5=9C=A8 = 2018=E5=B9=B44=E6=9C=882=E6=97=A5=EF=BC=8C18:26=EF=BC=8CKetan Talaulikar = (ketant)=20 >> < = ketant@cisco.com> =E5=86=99=E9=81=93=EF=BC=9A >>=20 >> Hi Aijun, >>=20 >> Can you clarify what you mean by = =E2=80=9Cinconsistencies=E2=80=9D? >>=20 >> Also, you are referring the old version of OSPFv3 SR draft before = it >> was aligned with the OSPFv2 SR draft. Please check >> =20 >> = = https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ospf-ospfv3-segment-routing-ex >> tensions-11#section-6.1 >>=20 >> OSPF and ISIS are different protocols and there are some = differences >> between them. I would not call them inconsistencies. BGP-LS spec >> refers to the individual IGP drafts for interpretation of flags. = So >> please specifically point out what inconsistency you are referring = to. >>=20 >> Thanks, >>=20 >> Ketan >>=20 >> *From:*Lsr < = = lsr-bounces@ietf.org> *On >> Behalf Of *Aijun Wang >> *Sent:* 02 April 2018 14:23 >> *To:* = lsr@ietf.org >> *Subject:* [Lsr] Inconsistence regarding the definition of = "Adj-SID >> Sub-TLV" between OSPF and ISIS extension for Segment Routing >>=20 >> Hi, All: >>=20 >> We found there were some inconsistences for the definition of >> =E2=80=9CAdjacency Segment Identifier=E2=80=9D between OSPF and = ISIS extension for >> segment routing, please see the link below for comparison. >>=20 >> =20 >> = = https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extension >> s-15#section-2.2.1 >>=20 >> =20 >> = = https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ospf-ospfv3-segment-routing-ex >> tensions-10#section-7.1 >>=20 >> Here we want to know is there any reason for this inconsistence? = We >> think this inconsistence can easily cause error for BGP-LS >> implementation for segment routing extension, as that defined in >> = = https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-idr-bgp-ls-segment-routing-ext-04#= section-2.2.1, >> which is similar with ISIS extension for SR, but different from = OSPF >> extension for SR. >>=20 >> Do we need to make them consistent? It seems change the definition >> in OSPF extension may be less influence for the existing related = drafts. >>=20 >> Best Regards. >>=20 >> Aijun Wang >>=20 >> Network R&D and Operation Support Department >>=20 >> China Telecom Corporation Limited Beijing Research >> Institute,Beijing, China. >>=20 >> _______________________________________________ >> Lsr mailing list >> = Lsr@ietf.org >> = https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >> _______________________________________________ >> Lsr mailing list >> Lsr@ietf.org >> = https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr >>=20 >=20 > _______________________________________________ > Lsr mailing list > Lsr@ietf.org > = https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr =20 _______________________________________________ Lsr mailing list Lsr@ietf.org = https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr ------=_NextPart_001_009D_01D3CBFE.7A1F7510 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Hi, = All:

 

We have found some inconsistencies for the implementation = of BGP-LS protocol regarding this =E2=80=9CAdj-SID SubTLV =E2=80=9D, = please see the following screenshot.

I think we should do some works = for the related drafts to clarify this ambiguous/easy to be ignored = definition.

 

 

 

Best Regards.

 

Aijun Wang

Network R&D and Operation = Support Department

China Telecom Corporation Limited Beijing Research = Institute,Beijing, China.

 

-----=E9=82=AE=E4=BB=B6=E5=8E=9F=E4=BB= =B6-----
=E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: stefano previdi [mailto:stefano@previdi.net] =
=E5=8F=91=E9=80=81=E6=97=B6=E9=97= =B4: 2018=E5=B9=B44=E6=9C=883=E6=97=A5 15:39
=E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: Peter Psenak
=E6=8A=84=E9=80=81: lsr@ietf.org; Ketan Talaulikar (ketant); Acee Lindem = (acee); Aijun Wang
=E4=B8=BB=E9=A2=98: Re: [Lsr] Inconsistence regarding the definition of = "Adj-SID Sub-TLV" between OSPF and ISIS extension for Segment = Routing

 

me too.

 

If we want to align the encoding, we should probably better = align the protocol name directly...

 

s.

 

 

> On Apr 3, 2018, at 9:34 AM, = Peter Psenak <ppsenak@cisco.com<= /a>> wrote:

>

> On 02/04/18 14:19 , Acee Lindem (acee) = wrote:

>> Speaking as WG member:

>> =

>> I couldn=E2=80=99t = agree more with Ketan. No changes are required to these =

>> documents.

>

> as a coauthor of the = OSPF/OSPFv3 SR drafts, I fully agree.

>

> = thanks,

> Peter

>

>> =

>> Thanks,

>> =

>> Acee

>> =

>> *From: *Lsr <lsr-bounces@ietf.org> on behalf of "Ketan Talaulikar

>> (ketant)" <ketant@cisco.com>

>> *Date: *Monday, April 2, 2018 at 7:36 = AM

>> *To: *Aijun Wang <wangaijun@tsinghua.org.cn= >

>> *Cc: *"lsr@ietf.org&q= uot; <lsr@ietf.org&g= t;

>> *Subject: *Re: [Lsr] Inconsistence regarding the = definition of

>> "Adj-SID Sub-TLV" between OSPF and ISIS = extension for Segment Routing

>> =

>> Hi Aijun,

>> =

>> I understand what you are referring to now, but = these are not

>> inconsistencies. ISIS, OSPF and BGP-LS are 3 = different protocols.

>> Their encodings may not all be the same. ISIS uses = 1 byte for

>> type/length and has LSP space constraints which = you would notice in

>> the protocol encodings. OSPF doesn=E2=80=99t have the same challenge and you

>> would notice how its = TLVs tend to be aligned. BGP-LS is somewhat

>> similar to OSPF from = these size constraints perspective.

>> =

>> I do not see the implementation challenges in = encoding from the two

>> IGPs into BGP-LS. It = does not make sense to change any of the

>> protocol encodings that = you ask for currently since implementations

>> have been shipping with = them for many years.

>>

>> IMHO it is not = necessary to put such constraints for what you call =

>> =E2=80=9Cconsistency=E2=80=9D = on these 3 protocol encodings in the future. However, =

>> we do try to be consistent in semantics as much as = possible.

>>

>> = Thanks,

>>

>> = Ketan

>>

>> *From:*Aijun Wang = <wangaijun@tsinghua.org.cn= >

>> *Sent:* 02 April 2018 = 16:52

>> *To:* Ketan Talaulikar (ketant) <ketant@cisco.com>

>> *Cc:* lsr@ietf.org

>> = *Subject:* Re: [Lsr] Inconsistence regarding the definition of =

>> "Adj-SID Sub-TLV" between OSPF and ISIS = extension for Segment Routing

>> =

>> Hi, Ketan:

>> =

>> There is one two-bytes =E2=80=9CReserved=E2=80=9D = field in =E2=80=9CAdjacency Segment =

>> Identifier=E2=80=9D = TLV for OSPF extension, but this field doesn=E2=80=99t = exist in

>> the corresponding TLV for ISIS extension. Every = other fields are same.

>> =

>> Corresponding definition in BGP-LS is similar with = OSPF(not similar

>> with ISIS as I mentioned in previous mail). Then = when the router

>> reports/redistributes the ISIS LSDB information to = BGP protocol, the

>> router must add two bytes to the =E2=80=9Clength=E2=80=9D = field and add/stuff the

>> =E2=80=9Creserved=E2=80=9D = field; but for OSPF LSDB, the router need only copy the =

>> corresponding fields = according.

>>

>> We have found the error = arises from this inconsistency from the real

>> router and think it is = better to align this definition in different

>> IGP = protocol.

>>

>> Update to ISIS related = extensions draft may be easier.

>> =

>> Aijun Wang

>> =

>> China Telecom

>> =

>>

>> =E5=9C=A8 2018=E5=B9=B44=E6=9C=882=E6=97=A5=EF=BC=8C18:26=EF=BC=8CKetan Talaulikar (ketant)

>> <ketant@cisco.com<mailt= o:ketant@cisco.com>> =E5=86=99=E9=81=93=EF=BC=9A

>>

>>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Hi = Aijun,

>>

>>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Can = you clarify what you mean by =E2=80=9Cinconsistencies=E2=80=9D?

>>

>>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Also, = you are referring the old version of OSPFv3 SR draft before = it

>>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 was aligned with the OSPFv2 SR = draft. Please check

>>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0

>> https://tools.ietf.org/ht= ml/draft-ietf-ospf-ospfv3-segment-routing-ex=

>> = tensions-11#section-6.1

>> =

>>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 OSPF and ISIS are different = protocols and there are some differences

>>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 = between them. I would not call them inconsistencies. BGP-LS = spec

>>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 refers to the individual IGP = drafts for interpretation of flags. So

>>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 = please specifically point out what inconsistency you are referring = to.

>>

>>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 = Thanks,

>>

>>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 = Ketan

>>

>>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 = *From:*Lsr <lsr-bounces@ietf.org<m= ailto:lsr-bounces@ietf.org>> = *On

>>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Behalf Of *Aijun = Wang

>>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 *Sent:* 02 April 2018 = 14:23

>>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 *To:* lsr@ietf.org<mailto:ls= r@ietf.org>

>>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 = *Subject:* [Lsr] Inconsistence regarding the definition of = "Adj-SID

>>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Sub-TLV" between OSPF and = ISIS extension for Segment Routing

>> =

>>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Hi, All:

>> =

>>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 We found there were some = inconsistences for the definition of

>>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 = =E2=80=9CAdjacency Segment = Identifier=E2=80=9D between OSPF and ISIS = extension for

>>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 segment routing, please see the = link below for comparison.

>> =

>>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0

>> https://tools.ietf.org/ht= ml/draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extension=

>> = s-15#section-2.2.1

>>

>>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 =

>> https://tools.ietf.org/ht= ml/draft-ietf-ospf-ospfv3-segment-routing-ex=

>> = tensions-10#section-7.1

>> =

>>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Here we want to know is there = any reason for this inconsistence? We

>>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 think = this inconsistence can easily cause error for = BGP-LS

>>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 implementation for segment = routing extension, as that defined in

>>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 https://tools.ietf.org/ht= ml/draft-ietf-idr-bgp-ls-segment-routing-ext-04#section-2.2.1,=

>>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 which is similar with ISIS = extension for SR, but different from OSPF

>>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 = extension for SR.

>>

>>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Do we = need to make them consistent? It seems change the = definition

>>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 in OSPF extension may be less = influence for the existing related drafts.

>> =

>>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Best = Regards.

>>

>>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Aijun = Wang

>>

>>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 = Network R&D and Operation Support Department

>> =

>>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 China Telecom Corporation = Limited Beijing Research

>>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 = Institute,Beijing, China.

>> =

>>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 = _______________________________________________

>>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Lsr = mailing list

>>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Lsr@ietf.org<mailto:Ls= r@ietf.org>

>>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 https://www.ietf.org/mail= man/listinfo/lsr

>> =

>>

>> =

>> = _______________________________________________

>> Lsr mailing = list

>> Lsr@ietf.org

>> = https://www.ietf.org/mail= man/listinfo/lsr

>> =

> =

> = _______________________________________________

> Lsr mailing = list

> Lsr@ietf.org

> https://www.ietf.org/mail= man/listinfo/lsr

 

_______________________________________________

Lsr mailing = list

Lsr@ietf.org

https://www.ietf.org/mail= man/listinfo/lsr

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"Ketan Talaulikar (ketant)" To: Aijun Wang CC: "lsr@ietf.org" , "idr@ietf.org" , Jeffrey Haas Thread-Topic: [Lsr] Inconsistence regarding the definition of "Adj-SID Sub-TLV" between OSPF and ISIS extension for Segment Routing Thread-Index: AdPKX89aH7daBvUkQYK90A0ibbwqrwAABY/wAAMor+AADI+6AAAKaB1g//+8yYCAAUKmgIAAASyAgAE5PQD///jZsA== Date: Wed, 4 Apr 2018 07:54:03 +0000 Message-ID: References: <008101d3ca60$073f81b0$15be8510$@org.cn> <1B346347-9242-4EE4-BDA2-F024EF483B8A@tsinghua.org.cn> <8C26288C-54C3-4C04-91A6-2B99562A1DE9@cisco.com> <5AC32E8B.6090202@cisco.com> <009b01d3cbbb$6bfc3510$43f49f30$@org.cn> In-Reply-To: <009b01d3cbbb$6bfc3510$43f49f30$@org.cn> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: yes X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted x-originating-ip: [10.65.68.229] Content-Type: multipart/related; boundary="_004_bb5ff9928fb245739ae5480b884f1eddXCHALN008ciscocom_"; type="multipart/alternative" MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] Inconsistence regarding the definition of "Adj-SID Sub-TLV" between OSPF and ISIS extension for Segment Routing X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 04 Apr 2018 07:54:10 -0000 --_004_bb5ff9928fb245739ae5480b884f1eddXCHALN008ciscocom_ Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_bb5ff9928fb245739ae5480b884f1eddXCHALN008ciscocom_" --_000_bb5ff9928fb245739ae5480b884f1eddXCHALN008ciscocom_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 PCBpbmNsdWRpbmcgSURSIFdHIHdoZXJlIEJHUC1MUyB3b3JrIGlzIGJlaW5nIGRvbmUgPg0KDQpI aSBBaWp1biwNCg0KQXMgZGlzY3Vzc2VkIG9mZmxpbmUsIHRoaXMgaXMgYSBidWcgaW4gdGhpcyBw YXJ0aWN1bGFyIGltcGxlbWVudGF0aW9uIHdoZXJlIGl0IGlzIG5vdCBmb2xsb3dpbmcgdGhlIHNw ZWMgcHJvcGVybHkuDQoNClRoaXMgZ29lcyBiYWNrIHRvIHRoZSBkaXNjdXNzaW9uIGluIHRoZSBJ 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verify=FAIL); Wed, 4 Apr 2018 18:13:20 GMT Received: from xch-rtp-015.cisco.com (64.101.220.155) by XCH-RTP-015.cisco.com (64.101.220.155) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.0.1320.4; Wed, 4 Apr 2018 14:13:19 -0400 Received: from xch-rtp-015.cisco.com ([64.101.220.155]) by XCH-RTP-015.cisco.com ([64.101.220.155]) with mapi id 15.00.1320.000; Wed, 4 Apr 2018 14:13:19 -0400 From: "Acee Lindem (acee)" To: "draft-ietf-ospf-xaf-te@ietf.org" CC: "lsr@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: OSPF Routing with Cross-Address Family MPLS Traffic Engineering Tunnels Thread-Index: AQHTzECcXJCh/T3oREuLrU8t7rUtPw== Date: Wed, 4 Apr 2018 18:13:19 +0000 Message-ID: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted x-originating-ip: [10.116.152.200] Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_B2F48CF94853479DBAD94A4AD7088375ciscocom_" MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Subject: [Lsr] OSPF Routing with Cross-Address Family MPLS Traffic Engineering Tunnels X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 04 Apr 2018 18:13:23 -0000 --_000_B2F48CF94853479DBAD94A4AD7088375ciscocom_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 SGkgQW50b24sIEFsdmFybywgYW5kIE1pa2UsDQoNCkluIHByZXBhcmF0aW9uIGZvciBXRyBsYXN0 IGNhbGwsIEkgaGF2ZSBhIGNvdXBsZSBjb21tZW50cy4NCg0KDQogIDEuICBIYXZlIHlvdSBjb25z aWRlcmVkIGEgc2hvcnRlciBuYW1lIGZvciB0aGUgUkZDPyBGb3IgZXhhbXBsZTog4oCcT1NQRiBD cm9zcyBBZGRyZXNzIEZhbWlseSBUcmFmZmljIEVuZ2luZWVyaW5nIFR1bm5lbHPigJ0/DQogIDIu ICBDYW4geW91IGNoYW5nZSB0aGUgcmVxdWlyZW1lbnRzIGxhbmd1YWdlIHRleHQgdG8gdGhlIFJG QyA4MTc0IHZlcnNpb24/DQogIDMuICBJbiB0aGUgc2VjdGlvbiAzIG1hcHBpbmcgYWxnb3JpdGht LCB3aHkgZG8geW91IHdhbGsgdGhlIFgtQUYgZW5kcG9pbnRzIGZyb20gYWxsIGNvbm5lY3RlZCBh 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([173.37.93.144]) by rcdn-iport-1.cisco.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384; 04 Apr 2018 19:26:20 +0000 Received: from XCH-ALN-015.cisco.com (xch-aln-015.cisco.com [173.36.7.25]) by rcdn-core-8.cisco.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id w34JQLH9002265 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 4 Apr 2018 19:26:21 GMT Received: from xch-aln-001.cisco.com (173.36.7.11) by XCH-ALN-015.cisco.com (173.36.7.25) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.0.1320.4; Wed, 4 Apr 2018 14:26:20 -0500 Received: from xch-aln-001.cisco.com ([173.36.7.11]) by XCH-ALN-001.cisco.com ([173.36.7.11]) with mapi id 15.00.1320.000; Wed, 4 Apr 2018 14:26:20 -0500 From: "Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)" To: "Peter Psenak (ppsenak)" , "Acee Lindem (acee)" , "Ketan Talaulikar (ketant)" , Aijun Wang CC: "lsr@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [Lsr] Inconsistence regarding the definition of "Adj-SID Sub-TLV" between OSPF and ISIS extension for Segment Routing Thread-Index: AdPKX89aH7daBvUkQYK90A0ibbwqrwAABY/wAAMor+AADI+6AAAKaB1g//+8yYCAAUKmgP/9+ySA Date: Wed, 4 Apr 2018 19:26:20 +0000 Message-ID: References: <008101d3ca60$073f81b0$15be8510$@org.cn> <1B346347-9242-4EE4-BDA2-F024EF483B8A@tsinghua.org.cn> <8C26288C-54C3-4C04-91A6-2B99562A1DE9@cisco.com> <5AC32E8B.6090202@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <5AC32E8B.6090202@cisco.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted x-originating-ip: [10.24.6.6] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] Inconsistence regarding the definition of "Adj-SID Sub-TLV" between OSPF and ISIS extension for Segment Routing X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 04 Apr 2018 19:26:25 -0000 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FREEMAIL_FORGED_FROMDOMAIN=0.25, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.249, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id EOtvWWWsP7Hc for ; Wed, 4 Apr 2018 13:03:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-io0-f175.google.com (mail-io0-f175.google.com [209.85.223.175]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4F56A1242F7 for ; Wed, 4 Apr 2018 13:03:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-io0-f175.google.com with SMTP id e79so27827607ioi.7 for ; Wed, 04 Apr 2018 13:03:25 -0700 (PDT) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=dARZY89XkWSds5oqbIKDb6ib2XdmbXtDsamCDhEYajs=; b=tUN6dzRgXM0wAMgBJi4+l5doED4bgyknEsjyCkqRCU9hPyg9xNcetGu8Jk5mvgdSjv ggUgmCqAEFNu5LnuBLJ5JXLopvguh4AvZSt0pjJNaBaE2S+SHIvw7DW+oc7CJTsqWy9B Aht1rLz9plkxYN7o4G2RkKQ/lBq8hq8P2pFWju+D/WX15nHHUgpQt8Up2loXdWHUO0hY Fa86qPesM5XHK6100cus6EEmSXxsFEVwwblV44G0LHFZ8x0NVmdJ+YaMBhHZTLrMEe+B M43HeAap/a5jgolYqGGzOdJuCmoCw3rqcnYH2noHoJjYjG8AxWiWKbSqcRnErC+XebXY LwXA== X-Gm-Message-State: ALQs6tA1lIVFBzF1FyhOTfKNyEJQrQ+yIrHejoo25SkaQpKUXN4Eq1x+ qpUCYYQrG/p2Le5IwOVS/Lnx2LPO0r0PY5u3Cbo= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AIpwx49PnOt7geczJIJ5wJXGmM8IHcEygyqYae3QuhDg9gSFWEgYwR9dh222uEPVE1HLbt4Ypr2dnEqT4reANS+lkco= X-Received: by 10.107.40.147 with SMTP id o141mr17639546ioo.72.1522872204540; Wed, 04 Apr 2018 13:03:24 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <303B9428-1EF5-417C-8223-DCB34440677B@cisco.com> <69468450ae0141098f7579d630b9cd33@XCH-ALN-001.cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <69468450ae0141098f7579d630b9cd33@XCH-ALN-001.cisco.com> From: Tony Li Date: Wed, 04 Apr 2018 20:03:13 +0000 Message-ID: To: "Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)" Cc: "Acee Lindem (acee)" , "lsr@ietf.org" Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="001a1141d818ca54e105690b504d" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] FW: New Version Notification for draft-ginsberg-isis-rfc7810bis-00.txt X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 04 Apr 2018 20:03:28 -0000 --001a1141d818ca54e105690b504d Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I don=E2=80=99t see the big deal in having the WG name in the draft title, = even for category 1 documents. It=E2=80=99s only the name of the draft and the fact that it is protocol sp= ecific doesn=E2=80=99t really need to be called out at that level. People who rea= d the document will certainly figure it out. Tony On Wed, Apr 4, 2018 at 12:39 PM Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) wrote: > Well...this raises a topic on which I would like to have feedback from th= e > WG. > > Combining IS-IS/OSPF into one working group is fine - no argument there. > But, we now may be producing two classes of documents: > > 1)Documents which are specific to a protocol (IS-IS or OSPFv2 or OSPFv3) > > 2)Documents which cover 2 or more protocols > > draft-ginsberg-isis-rfc7810bis-00.txt is Category #1 - and there is NO > CHANCE this document will EVER cover OSPF - since OSPF already has RFC 74= 71 > and this bis document is a correction to the IS-IS specific RFC7810. > Calling it "-lsr-" to me is simply confusing as it in no way indicates th= at > it is IS-IS specific. > I suggest that any document which falls into Category 1 should continue t= o > follow the traditional protocol specific naming. > If this somehow violates some IETF rule then I suppose we could use > "-lsr-isis-". (somewhat verbose) > > For Category 2 documents "-lsr-" certainly makes sense. > > Comments?? > > Les > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Acee Lindem (acee) > > Sent: Tuesday, April 03, 2018 7:45 AM > > To: Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) ; lsr@ietf.org > > Subject: Re: [Lsr] FW: New Version Notification for draft-ginsberg-isis= - > > rfc7810bis-00.txt > > > > Hi Les, > > > > Can you resubmit as draft-ginsberg-lsr-rfc7810bis-00.txt? Also, please > add a > > "Changes from RFC 7810" section to the "Introduction". I see you have > added > > RFC8174 to the "Requirements Language" section already. > > > > I think we should accept this as an LSR Working Group document - does > > anyone disagree? > > > > Thanks, > > Acee > > > > =EF=BB=BFOn 3/30/18, 6:39 PM, "Lsr on behalf of Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)= " > bounces@ietf.org on behalf of ginsberg@cisco.com> wrote: > > > > Folks - > > > > A bis version of RFC 7810 has been submitted to address the issue > reported > > in Errata ID: 5293 https://www.rfc-editor.org/errata_search.php?rfc=3D7= 810 > > > > Given that there exist implementations which have interpreted the > > ambiguous encoding of some sub-TLVs in different/non-interoperable ways > > it was felt that a bis version of the RFC was justified. > > Please see the Appendix of the draft for a discussion of the change= s > from > > RFC 7810 and the reasons why. > > > > Les > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: internet-drafts@ietf.org > > Sent: Friday, March 30, 2018 3:33 PM > > To: Qin Wu ; David Ward (wardd) > > ; Spencer Giacolone ; > > Spencer Giacalone ; John Drake > > ; Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) ; > David > > Ward (wardd) ; Stefano Previdi > > Subject: New Version Notification for > draft-ginsberg-isis-rfc7810bis-00.txt > > > > > > A new version of I-D, draft-ginsberg-isis-rfc7810bis-00.txt > > has been successfully submitted by Les Ginsberg and posted to the > IETF > > repository. > > > > Name: draft-ginsberg-isis-rfc7810bis > > Revision: 00 > > Title: IS-IS Traffic Engineering (TE) Metric Extensions > > Document date: 2018-03-30 > > Group: Individual Submission > > Pages: 19 > > URL: > https://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ginsberg-isis- > > rfc7810bis-00.txt > > Status: > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ginsberg-isis-rfc7810bis/ > > Htmlized: > https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ginsberg-isis-rfc7810bis-00 > > Htmlized: > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ginsberg-isis- > > rfc7810bis > > > > > > Abstract: > > In certain networks, such as, but not limited to, financial > > information networks (e.g., stock market data providers), networ= k- > > performance criteria (e.g., latency) are becoming as critical to > > data-path selection as other metrics. > > > > This document describes extensions to IS-IS Traffic Engineering > > Extensions (RFC 5305) such that network-performance information > can > > be distributed and collected in a scalable fashion. The > information > > distributed using IS-IS TE Metric Extensions can then be used to > make > > path-selection decisions based on network performance. > > > > Note that this document only covers the mechanisms with which > > network-performance information is distributed. The mechanisms > for > > measuring network performance or acting on that information, onc= e > > distributed, are outside the scope of this document. > > > > This document obsoletes RFC 7810. > > > > > > > > > > > > Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of > > submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at > tools.ietf.org. > > > > The IETF Secretariat > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Lsr mailing list > > Lsr@ietf.org > > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr > > > > _______________________________________________ > Lsr mailing list > Lsr@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr > --001a1141d818ca54e105690b504d Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

I don=E2=80=99t see the = big deal in having the WG name in the draft title, even for category 1 docu= ments.

It=E2=80=99s only= the name of the draft and the fact that it is protocol specific doesn=E2= =80=99t really need to be called out at that level.=C2=A0 People who read t= he document will certainly figure it out.

=
Tony


On Wed, Apr 4, 2018 at 12:39 PM Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) &l= t;ginsberg@cisco.com> wrote:
Well...this raises a topic on which = I would like to have feedback from the WG.

Combining IS-IS/OSPF into one working group is fine - no argument there. But, we now may be producing two classes of documents:

1)Documents which are specific to a protocol (IS-IS or OSPFv2 or OSPFv3)
2)Documents which cover 2 or more protocols

draft-ginsberg-isis-rfc7810bis-00.txt is Category #1 - and there is NO CHAN= CE this document will EVER cover OSPF - since OSPF already has RFC 7471 and= this bis document is a correction to the IS-IS specific RFC7810. Calling i= t "-lsr-" to me is simply confusing as it in no way indicates tha= t it is IS-IS specific.
I suggest that any document which falls into Category 1 should continue to = follow the traditional protocol specific naming.
If this somehow violates some IETF rule then I suppose we could use "-= lsr-isis-". (somewhat verbose)

For Category 2 documents "-lsr-" certainly makes sense.

Comments??

=C2=A0 =C2=A0Les


> -----Original Message-----
> From: Acee Lindem (acee)
> Sent: Tuesday, April 03, 2018 7:45 AM
> To: Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) <ginsberg@cisco.com>; lsr@ietf.org
> Subject: Re: [Lsr] FW: New Version Notification for draft-ginsberg-isi= s-
> rfc7810bis-00.txt
>
> Hi Les,
>
> Can you resubmit as draft-ginsberg-lsr-rfc7810bis-00.txt? Also, please= add a
> "Changes from RFC 7810" section to the "Introduction&qu= ot;. I see you have added
> RFC8174 to the "Requirements Language" section already.
>
> I think we should accept this as an LSR Working Group document - does<= br> > anyone disagree?
>
> Thanks,
> Acee
>
> =EF=BB=BFOn 3/30/18, 6:39 PM, "Lsr on behalf of Les Ginsberg (gin= sberg)" <lsr-
> bounces@ietf.org= on behalf of g= insberg@cisco.com> wrote:
>
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Folks -
>
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0A bis version of RFC 7810 has been submitted to add= ress the issue reported
> in Errata ID: 5293 https://www.rfc-edito= r.org/errata_search.php?rfc=3D7810
>
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Given that there exist implementations which have i= nterpreted the
> ambiguous encoding of some sub-TLVs in different/non-interoperable way= s
> it was felt that a bis version of the RFC was justified.
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Please see the Appendix of the draft for a discussi= on of the changes from
> RFC 7810 and the reasons why.
>
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Les
>
>
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0-----Original Message-----
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0From: internet-drafts@ietf.org <internet-drafts@ietf.org>
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Sent: Friday, March 30, 2018 3:33 PM
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0To: Qin Wu <sunseawq@huawei.com>; David Ward (wardd)
> <wardd@cisco.c= om>; Spencer Giacolone <spencer.giacalone@gmail.com>;
> Spencer Giacalone <spencer.giacalone@gmail.com>; John Drake
> <ldrake@jun= iper.net>; Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) <ginsberg@cisco.com>; David
> Ward (wardd) <= wardd@cisco.com>; Stefano Previdi <stefano@previdi.net>
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Subject: New Version Notification for draft-ginsber= g-isis-rfc7810bis-00.txt
>
>
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0A new version of I-D, draft-ginsberg-isis-rfc7810bi= s-00.txt
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0has been successfully submitted by Les Ginsberg and= posted to the IETF
> repository.
>
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Name:=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2= =A0draft-ginsberg-isis-rfc7810bis
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Revision: 00
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Title:=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 IS-= IS Traffic Engineering (TE) Metric Extensions
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Document date:=C2=A0 =C2=A0 2018-03-30
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Group:=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Ind= ividual Submission
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Pages:=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 19<= br> >=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0URL:=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 https://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ginsb= erg-isis-
> rfc7810bis-00.txt
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Status:=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ginsber= g-isis-rfc7810bis/
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Htmlized:=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ginsberg-isis-rfc781= 0bis-00
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Htmlized:=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ginsberg-isis= -
> rfc7810bis
>
>
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Abstract:
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 In certain networks, such as, but not limit= ed to, financial
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 information networks (e.g., stock market da= ta providers), network-
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 performance criteria (e.g., latency) are be= coming as critical to
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 data-path selection as other metrics.
>
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 This document describes extensions to IS-IS= Traffic Engineering
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Extensions (RFC 5305) such that network-per= formance information can
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 be distributed and collected in a scalable = fashion.=C2=A0 The information
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 distributed using IS-IS TE Metric Extension= s can then be used to make
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 path-selection decisions based on network p= erformance.
>
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Note that this document only covers the mec= hanisms with which
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 network-performance information is distribu= ted.=C2=A0 The mechanisms for
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 measuring network performance or acting on = that information, once
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 distributed, are outside the scope of this = document.
>
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 This document obsoletes RFC 7810.
>
>
>
>
>
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Please note that it may take a couple of minutes fr= om the time of
> submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf= .org.
>
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0The IETF Secretariat
>
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0_______________________________________________
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Lsr mailing list
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0L= sr@ietf.org
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listin= fo/lsr
>

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--001a1141d818ca54e105690b504d-- From nobody Wed Apr 4 13:05:48 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 69786126DCA for ; Wed, 4 Apr 2018 13:05:46 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.899 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.899 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=previdi-net.20150623.gappssmtp.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id CsbI8oIWwJDn for ; Wed, 4 Apr 2018 13:05:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-pl0-x231.google.com (mail-pl0-x231.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400e:c01::231]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 44BB61242F7 for ; Wed, 4 Apr 2018 13:05:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-pl0-x231.google.com with SMTP id b6-v6so13650448pla.11 for ; Wed, 04 Apr 2018 13:05:43 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=previdi-net.20150623.gappssmtp.com; s=20150623; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=/TXUnid9Xl5rD1d/PX51FNGrBM4QskTv3WNxr7uolnc=; b=phW5aDPDORdKf5wg7ZJpexMj8Z7MQCz+boiVzunX16LTx9rktOZnj0nR1H1nwZEtHN P7FCEH3IQ8XY27Hc56Nb52FKVfaGbYWLKTIOf70tGRAh+S3Ab34aDChvKHIkh+Xog6c3 lKgadrZxC5IVgl+Ij4Y0CyGEmDaxh3UWr+GBiQ2STpoDIWswnSE2/dw1xpSeN/SVU3Y2 3bApayFwOoXICCGO4GcK++xbM3SOufKIrX8un+tBfSI6wu63G+fiME5R8rhzIHQRoStY GV62hWvL3a6FizMQMNTQ0Lr0jEZIY6CZD2+Juuy5FvgX0m+2nQ3v0Rs/PnNygGayP4/8 dsHQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=/TXUnid9Xl5rD1d/PX51FNGrBM4QskTv3WNxr7uolnc=; b=aTxe4Qa2Dg3ajVNGYSYHqWcA/0pIxxccyNN6GEabOo/tUhvXEp7XE/YS+a7Fa/cpX9 ECHi0frevJtcuqiTv4+jvVkGUulU9dlrS3wswJLfB0+eRg5qbOCTSU68KspEKz9v1sgY epHAWOM3bWcGpK0ZtgK8Sek3UC6YwPy4/5rBI+G1PHa/r/HSwz0Nb2L2t6QNZ0uwQyGh 2sORUybHUasHI320UfV7a3ZnZ7eOLdSO66G0ufnE/EiiqpyfROYPS7+clZZv7AicAWv+ uSPCsdkC5qnlAy0zAHYdFUdKWUq3RoSnE7PHn39LbYDOct1W8bxzNtQl+u57mIru/CVs pl6g== X-Gm-Message-State: AElRT7ERWzHtNmNAerqMDDT1PrAyfV6IxLbey3Zn3+1l2OhA3kBBLdHH vO949ZBDnm3jm31jKyJkq9aI4LVeIwE+4yOx99IgNA== X-Google-Smtp-Source: AIpwx48UT0/Hex5GxzHcJtPyrc5MpGkUIzTiKqQWrnNwMsQZjWj6b0XHTWIQn/UV75l/C/v8Vcui+PEQE1LfBJRPzUQ= X-Received: by 10.98.70.8 with SMTP id t8mr14981591pfa.185.1522872342760; Wed, 04 Apr 2018 13:05:42 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <303B9428-1EF5-417C-8223-DCB34440677B@cisco.com> <69468450ae0141098f7579d630b9cd33@XCH-ALN-001.cisco.com> In-Reply-To: From: Stefano Previdi Date: Wed, 04 Apr 2018 20:05:31 +0000 Message-ID: To: Tony Li Cc: "Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)" , lsr@ietf.org, "Acee Lindem (acee)" Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="94eb2c0b7cf4075db705690b5922" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] FW: New Version Notification for draft-ginsberg-isis-rfc7810bis-00.txt X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 04 Apr 2018 20:05:46 -0000 --94eb2c0b7cf4075db705690b5922 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable ...and, probably, this draft won't stay a draft long enough for the problem to have any sort of materialisation. s. On Wed, Apr 4, 2018, 10:03 PM Tony Li wrote: > > I don=E2=80=99t see the big deal in having the WG name in the draft title= , even > for category 1 documents. > > It=E2=80=99s only the name of the draft and the fact that it is protocol = specific > doesn=E2=80=99t really need to be called out at that level. People who r= ead the > document will certainly figure it out. > > Tony > > > On Wed, Apr 4, 2018 at 12:39 PM Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) < > ginsberg@cisco.com> wrote: > >> Well...this raises a topic on which I would like to have feedback from >> the WG. >> >> Combining IS-IS/OSPF into one working group is fine - no argument there. >> But, we now may be producing two classes of documents: >> >> 1)Documents which are specific to a protocol (IS-IS or OSPFv2 or OSPFv3) >> >> 2)Documents which cover 2 or more protocols >> >> draft-ginsberg-isis-rfc7810bis-00.txt is Category #1 - and there is NO >> CHANCE this document will EVER cover OSPF - since OSPF already has RFC 7= 471 >> and this bis document is a correction to the IS-IS specific RFC7810. >> Calling it "-lsr-" to me is simply confusing as it in no way indicates t= hat >> it is IS-IS specific. >> I suggest that any document which falls into Category 1 should continue >> to follow the traditional protocol specific naming. >> If this somehow violates some IETF rule then I suppose we could use >> "-lsr-isis-". (somewhat verbose) >> >> For Category 2 documents "-lsr-" certainly makes sense. >> >> Comments?? >> >> Les >> >> >> > -----Original Message----- >> > From: Acee Lindem (acee) >> > Sent: Tuesday, April 03, 2018 7:45 AM >> > To: Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) ; lsr@ietf.org >> > Subject: Re: [Lsr] FW: New Version Notification for draft-ginsberg-isi= s- >> > rfc7810bis-00.txt >> > >> > Hi Les, >> > >> > Can you resubmit as draft-ginsberg-lsr-rfc7810bis-00.txt? Also, please >> add a >> > "Changes from RFC 7810" section to the "Introduction". I see you have >> added >> > RFC8174 to the "Requirements Language" section already. >> > >> > I think we should accept this as an LSR Working Group document - does >> > anyone disagree? >> > >> > Thanks, >> > Acee >> > >> > =EF=BB=BFOn 3/30/18, 6:39 PM, "Lsr on behalf of Les Ginsberg (ginsberg= )" > > bounces@ietf.org on behalf of ginsberg@cisco.com> wrote: >> > >> > Folks - >> > >> > A bis version of RFC 7810 has been submitted to address the issue >> reported >> > in Errata ID: 5293 >> https://www.rfc-editor.org/errata_search.php?rfc=3D7810 >> >> > >> > Given that there exist implementations which have interpreted the >> > ambiguous encoding of some sub-TLVs in different/non-interoperable way= s >> > it was felt that a bis version of the RFC was justified. >> > Please see the Appendix of the draft for a discussion of the >> changes from >> > RFC 7810 and the reasons why. >> > >> > Les >> > >> > >> > -----Original Message----- >> > From: internet-drafts@ietf.org >> > Sent: Friday, March 30, 2018 3:33 PM >> > To: Qin Wu ; David Ward (wardd) >> > ; Spencer Giacolone > >; >> > Spencer Giacalone ; John Drake >> > ; Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) ; >> David >> > Ward (wardd) ; Stefano Previdi >> > Subject: New Version Notification for >> draft-ginsberg-isis-rfc7810bis-00.txt >> > >> > >> > A new version of I-D, draft-ginsberg-isis-rfc7810bis-00.txt >> > has been successfully submitted by Les Ginsberg and posted to the >> IETF >> > repository. >> > >> > Name: draft-ginsberg-isis-rfc7810bis >> > Revision: 00 >> > Title: IS-IS Traffic Engineering (TE) Metric Extensions >> > Document date: 2018-03-30 >> > Group: Individual Submission >> > Pages: 19 >> > URL: >> https://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ginsberg-isis- >> > rfc7810bis-00.txt >> > Status: >> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ginsberg-isis-rfc7810bis/ >> > Htmlized: >> https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ginsberg-isis-rfc7810bis-00 >> > Htmlized: >> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ginsberg-isis- >> > rfc7810bis >> > >> > >> > Abstract: >> > In certain networks, such as, but not limited to, financial >> > information networks (e.g., stock market data providers), >> network- >> > performance criteria (e.g., latency) are becoming as critical t= o >> > data-path selection as other metrics. >> > >> > This document describes extensions to IS-IS Traffic Engineering >> > Extensions (RFC 5305) such that network-performance information >> can >> > be distributed and collected in a scalable fashion. The >> information >> > distributed using IS-IS TE Metric Extensions can then be used t= o >> make >> > path-selection decisions based on network performance. >> > >> > Note that this document only covers the mechanisms with which >> > network-performance information is distributed. The mechanisms >> for >> > measuring network performance or acting on that information, on= ce >> > distributed, are outside the scope of this document. >> > >> > This document obsoletes RFC 7810. >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of >> > submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at >> tools.ietf..org . >> > >> > The IETF Secretariat >> > >> > _______________________________________________ >> > Lsr mailing list >> > Lsr@ietf.org >> > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr >> > >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Lsr mailing list >> Lsr@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr >> > _______________________________________________ > Lsr mailing list > Lsr@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr > --94eb2c0b7cf4075db705690b5922 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
...and, probably, this draft won't stay a draft long = enough for the problem to have any sort of materialisation.

s.

=
On Wed, Apr 4, 2018, 10:03 PM Tony Li <tony.li@tony.li> wrote:

I don=E2= =80=99t see the big deal in having the WG name in the draft title, even for= category 1 documents.

I= t=E2=80=99s only the name of the draft and the fact that it is protocol spe= cific doesn=E2=80=99t really need to be called out at that level.=C2=A0 Peo= ple who read the document will certainly figure it out.

Tony


<= div class=3D"gmail_quote">
On Wed, Apr 4, 2018 at 12:39 PM Les Ginsberg= (ginsberg) <ginsberg@cisco.com> wrote:
Well...this raises a topic on which I would like to have fee= dback from the WG.

Combining IS-IS/OSPF into one working group is fine - no argument there. But, we now may be producing two classes of documents:

1)Documents which are specific to a protocol (IS-IS or OSPFv2 or OSPFv3)
2)Documents which cover 2 or more protocols

draft-ginsberg-isis-rfc7810bis-00.txt is Category #1 - and there is NO CHAN= CE this document will EVER cover OSPF - since OSPF already has RFC 7471 and= this bis document is a correction to the IS-IS specific RFC7810. Calling i= t "-lsr-" to me is simply confusing as it in no way indicates tha= t it is IS-IS specific.
I suggest that any document which falls into Category 1 should continue to = follow the traditional protocol specific naming.
If this somehow violates some IETF rule then I suppose we could use "-= lsr-isis-". (somewhat verbose)

For Category 2 documents "-lsr-" certainly makes sense.

Comments??

=C2=A0 =C2=A0Les


> -----Original Message-----
> From: Acee Lindem (acee)
> Sent: Tuesday, April 03, 2018 7:45 AM
> To: Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) <ginsberg@cisco.com>; lsr@ietf.org=
> Subject: Re: [Lsr] FW: New Version Notification for draft-ginsberg-isi= s-
> rfc7810bis-00.txt
>
> Hi Les,
>
> Can you resubmit as draft-ginsberg-lsr-rfc7810bis-00.txt? Also, please= add a
> "Changes from RFC 7810" section to the "Introduction&qu= ot;. I see you have added
> RFC8174 to the "Requirements Language" section already.
>
> I think we should accept this as an LSR Working Group document - does<= br> > anyone disagree?
>
> Thanks,
> Acee
>
> =EF=BB=BFOn 3/30/18, 6:39 PM, "Lsr on behalf of Les Ginsberg (gin= sberg)" <lsr-
> bounces@ietf.org on behalf of ginsberg@cisco.com> wrote:
>
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Folks -
>
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0A bis version of RFC 7810 has been submitted to add= ress the issue reported
> in Errata ID: 5293 https://w= ww.rfc-editor.org/errata_search.php?rfc=3D7810
>
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Given that there exist implementations which have i= nterpreted the
> ambiguous encoding of some sub-TLVs in different/non-interoperable way= s
> it was felt that a bis version of the RFC was justified.
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Please see the Appendix of the draft for a discussi= on of the changes from
> RFC 7810 and the reasons why.
>
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Les
>
>
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0-----Original Message-----
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0From: internet-drafts@ietf.org <= internet-drafts@ietf.org>
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Sent: Friday, March 30, 2018 3:33 PM
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0To: Qin Wu <sunseawq@huawei.com>; David = Ward (wardd)
> <wardd@cisco.com>; Spencer Giacolone <spencer.giac= alone@gmail.com>;
> Spencer Giacalone <spencer.giacalone@gmail.com>; Jo= hn Drake
> <ldrake@juniper.net>; Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) <ginsberg@c= isco.com>; David
> Ward (wardd) <wardd@cisco.com>; Stefano Previdi <stefano@pr= evidi.net>
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Subject: New Version Notification for draft-ginsber= g-isis-rfc7810bis-00.txt
>
>
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0A new version of I-D, draft-ginsberg-isis-rfc7810bi= s-00.txt
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0has been successfully submitted by Les Ginsberg and= posted to the IETF
> repository.
>
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Name:=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2= =A0draft-ginsberg-isis-rfc7810bis
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Revision: 00
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Title:=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 IS-= IS Traffic Engineering (TE) Metric Extensions
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Document date:=C2=A0 =C2=A0 2018-03-30
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Group:=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Ind= ividual Submission
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Pages:=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 19<= br> >=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0URL:=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 https://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/= draft-ginsberg-isis-
> rfc7810bis-00.txt
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Status:=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/dr= aft-ginsberg-isis-rfc7810bis/
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Htmlized:=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ginsberg-= isis-rfc7810bis-00
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Htmlized:=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-gi= nsberg-isis-
> rfc7810bis
>
>
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Abstract:
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 In certain networks, such as, but not limit= ed to, financial
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 information networks (e.g., stock market da= ta providers), network-
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 performance criteria (e.g., latency) are be= coming as critical to
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 data-path selection as other metrics.
>
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 This document describes extensions to IS-IS= Traffic Engineering
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Extensions (RFC 5305) such that network-per= formance information can
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 be distributed and collected in a scalable = fashion.=C2=A0 The information
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 distributed using IS-IS TE Metric Extension= s can then be used to make
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 path-selection decisions based on network p= erformance.
>
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Note that this document only covers the mec= hanisms with which
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 network-performance information is distribu= ted.=C2=A0 The mechanisms for
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 measuring network performance or acting on = that information, once
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 distributed, are outside the scope of this = document.
>
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 This document obsoletes RFC 7810.
>
>
>
>
>
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Please note that it may take a couple of minutes fr= om the time of
> submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf..org.
>
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0The IETF Secretariat
>
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0_______________________________________________
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Lsr mailing list
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Lsr@ietf.org
>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0https://www.ietf.org/mai= lman/listinfo/lsr
>

_______________________________________________
Lsr mailing list
Lsr@ie= tf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr
_______________________________________________
Lsr mailing list
Lsr@ie= tf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr --94eb2c0b7cf4075db705690b5922-- From nobody Wed Apr 4 13:20:48 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8607C12DB6E for ; Wed, 4 Apr 2018 13:20:47 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -14.512 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-14.512 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.01, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=cisco.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id uXRQE-yXLCYU for ; Wed, 4 Apr 2018 13:20:41 -0700 (PDT) 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XCH-RTP-015.cisco.com ([64.101.220.155]) with mapi id 15.00.1320.000; Wed, 4 Apr 2018 16:20:35 -0400 From: "Acee Lindem (acee)" To: "Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)" , "lsr@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [Lsr] FW: New Version Notification for draft-ginsberg-isis-rfc7810bis-00.txt Thread-Index: AQHTy1pTDYQOpMXw80qZxNEhmGwTFaPw/uwggAAPJAA= Date: Wed, 4 Apr 2018 20:20:35 +0000 Message-ID: <3062D732-EF0A-47E4-9A84-28346746167A@cisco.com> References: <303B9428-1EF5-417C-8223-DCB34440677B@cisco.com> <69468450ae0141098f7579d630b9cd33@XCH-ALN-001.cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <69468450ae0141098f7579d630b9cd33@XCH-ALN-001.cisco.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted x-originating-ip: [10.116.152.200] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-ID: <8037C1EC7B3E0D49B8DD1EC24C767ED1@emea.cisco.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] FW: New Version Notification for draft-ginsberg-isis-rfc7810bis-00.txt X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 04 Apr 2018 20:20:47 -0000 SGkgTGVzLCANCg0KSSBjb25zaWRlcmVkIHRoaXMgYXMgd2VsbC4gDQoNCu+7v09uIDQvNC8xOCwg MzozOSBQTSwgIkxlcyBHaW5zYmVyZyAoZ2luc2JlcmcpIiA8Z2luc2JlcmdAY2lzY28uY29tPiB3 cm90ZToNCg0KICAgIFdlbGwuLi50aGlzIHJhaXNlcyBhIHRvcGljIG9uIHdoaWNoIEkgd291bGQg bGlrZSB0byBoYXZlIGZlZWRiYWNrIGZyb20gdGhlIFdHLg0KICAgIA0KICAgIENvbWJpbmluZyBJ Uy1JUy9PU1BGIGludG8gb25lIHdvcmtpbmcgZ3JvdXAgaXMgZmluZSAtIG5vIGFyZ3VtZW50IHRo ZXJlLg0KICAgIEJ1dCwgd2Ugbm93IG1heSBiZSBwcm9kdWNpbmcgdHdvIGNsYXNzZXMgb2YgZG9j dW1lbnRzOg0KICAgIA0KICAgIDEpRG9jdW1lbnRzIHdoaWNoIGFyZSBzcGVjaWZpYyB0byBhIHBy b3RvY29sIChJUy1JUyBvciBPU1BGdjIgb3IgT1NQRnYzKQ0KDQpJbiB0aGlzIGNhc2UsIHRoZSBu 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(ginsberg)" CC: "lsr@ietf.org" Message-ID: <6304AF65-771B-46E8-8CBA-F62FD5A12BFB@gmail.com> Thread-Topic: [Lsr] FW: New Version Notification for draft-ginsberg-isis-rfc7810bis-00.txt References: <303B9428-1EF5-417C-8223-DCB34440677B@cisco.com> <69468450ae0141098f7579d630b9cd33@XCH-ALN-001.cisco.com> <9469617E-7079-4374-86D7-A3EC721834F4@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <9469617E-7079-4374-86D7-A3EC721834F4@cisco.com> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="B_3605695052_2071492309" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] FW: New Version Notification for draft-ginsberg-isis-rfc7810bis-00.txt X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 04 Apr 2018 20:57:38 -0000 > This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. --B_3605695052_2071492309 Content-type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable +1 =20 I=E2=80=99d think the below would work: lsr for #2 lsr-ospf(ospfv3) / lsr-isis for #1=20 =20 Cheers, Jeff From: Lsr on behalf of "Acee Lindem (acee)" Date: Wednesday, April 4, 2018 at 13:27 To: Tony Li , "Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)" Cc: "lsr@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [Lsr] FW: New Version Notification for draft-ginsberg-isis-rfc= 7810bis-00.txt =20 I think the WG name should be in the expected place in the file name. I see= m to remember some drafts with -bgp- rather than -idr- that flew under the r= adar for a while.=20 Thanks, Acee =20 From: Tony Li Date: Wednesday, April 4, 2018 at 4:03 PM To: "Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)" Cc: Acee Lindem , "lsr@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [Lsr] FW: New Version Notification for draft-ginsberg-isis-rfc= 7810bis-00.txt =20 =20 I don=E2=80=99t see the big deal in having the WG name in the draft title, even f= or category 1 documents. =20 It=E2=80=99s only the name of the draft and the fact that it is protocol specific= doesn=E2=80=99t really need to be called out at that level. People who read the = document will certainly figure it out. =20 Tony =20 =20 On Wed, Apr 4, 2018 at 12:39 PM Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) wrote: Well...this raises a topic on which I would like to have feedback from the = WG. Combining IS-IS/OSPF into one working group is fine - no argument there. But, we now may be producing two classes of documents: 1)Documents which are specific to a protocol (IS-IS or OSPFv2 or OSPFv3) 2)Documents which cover 2 or more protocols draft-ginsberg-isis-rfc7810bis-00.txt is Category #1 - and there is NO CHAN= CE this document will EVER cover OSPF - since OSPF already has RFC 7471 and = this bis document is a correction to the IS-IS specific RFC7810. Calling it = "-lsr-" to me is simply confusing as it in no way indicates that it is IS-IS= specific. I suggest that any document which falls into Category 1 should continue to = follow the traditional protocol specific naming. If this somehow violates some IETF rule then I suppose we could use "-lsr-i= sis-". (somewhat verbose) For Category 2 documents "-lsr-" certainly makes sense. Comments?? Les > -----Original Message----- > From: Acee Lindem (acee) > Sent: Tuesday, April 03, 2018 7:45 AM > To: Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) ; lsr@ietf.org > Subject: Re: [Lsr] FW: New Version Notification for draft-ginsberg-isis- > rfc7810bis-00.txt > > Hi Les, > > Can you resubmit as draft-ginsberg-lsr-rfc7810bis-00.txt? Also, please ad= d a > "Changes from RFC 7810" section to the "Introduction". I see you have add= ed > RFC8174 to the "Requirements Language" section already. > > I think we should accept this as an LSR Working Group document - does > anyone disagree? > > Thanks, > Acee > > On 3/30/18, 6:39 PM, "Lsr on behalf of Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)" bounces@ietf.org on behalf of ginsberg@cisco.com> wrote: > > Folks - > > A bis version of RFC 7810 has been submitted to address the issue rep= orted > in Errata ID: 5293 https://www.rfc-editor.org/errata_search.php?rfc=3D7810 > > Given that there exist implementations which have interpreted the > ambiguous encoding of some sub-TLVs in different/non-interoperable ways > it was felt that a bis version of the RFC was justified. > Please see the Appendix of the draft for a discussion of the changes = from > RFC 7810 and the reasons why. > > Les > > > -----Original Message----- > From: internet-drafts@ietf.org > Sent: Friday, March 30, 2018 3:33 PM > To: Qin Wu ; David Ward (wardd) > ; Spencer Giacolone ; > Spencer Giacalone ; John Drake > ; Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) ; David > Ward (wardd) ; Stefano Previdi > Subject: New Version Notification for draft-ginsberg-isis-rfc7810bis-= 00.txt > > > A new version of I-D, draft-ginsberg-isis-rfc7810bis-00.txt > has been successfully submitted by Les Ginsberg and posted to the IET= F > repository. > > Name: draft-ginsberg-isis-rfc7810bis > Revision: 00 > Title: IS-IS Traffic Engineering (TE) Metric Extensions > Document date: 2018-03-30 > Group: Individual Submission > Pages: 19 > URL: https://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ginsberg-i= sis- > rfc7810bis-00.txt > Status: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ginsberg-isis-= rfc7810bis/ > Htmlized: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ginsberg-isis-rfc78= 10bis-00 > Htmlized: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ginsberg-= isis- > rfc7810bis > > > Abstract: > In certain networks, such as, but not limited to, financial > information networks (e.g., stock market data providers), network- > performance criteria (e.g., latency) are becoming as critical to > data-path selection as other metrics. > > This document describes extensions to IS-IS Traffic Engineering > Extensions (RFC 5305) such that network-performance information ca= n > be distributed and collected in a scalable fashion. The informati= on > distributed using IS-IS TE Metric Extensions can then be used to m= ake > path-selection decisions based on network performance. > > Note that this document only covers the mechanisms with which > network-performance information is distributed. The mechanisms fo= r > measuring network performance or acting on that information, once > distributed, are outside the scope of this document. > > This document obsoletes RFC 7810. > > > > > > Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of > submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.iet= f.org. > > The IETF Secretariat > > _______________________________________________ > Lsr mailing list > Lsr@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr > _______________________________________________ Lsr mailing list Lsr@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr _______________________________________________ Lsr mailing list Lsr@ietf.o= rg https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr=20 --B_3605695052_2071492309 Content-type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable

+1

 

I=E2=80=99d think the below would work:

lsr for #2

lsr-ospf(ospfv3= ) / lsr-isis for #1

 

<= div>

Cheers,

Jeff<= /p>

Fr= om: Lsr <lsr-bounce= s@ietf.org> on behalf of "Acee Lindem (acee)" <acee@cisco.co= m>
Date: Wednesday, April 4, 2018 at 13:27
To: Tony L= i <tony.li@tony.li>, "Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)" <ginsberg@= cisco.com>
Cc: "lsr@ietf.org" <lsr@ietf.org>Subject: Re: [Lsr] FW: New Version Notification for draft-ginsberg-i= sis-rfc7810bis-00.txt

 

I = think the WG name should be in the expected place in the file name. I seem t= o remember some drafts with -bgp- rather than -idr- that flew under the rada= r for a while.

Thanks,
Acee

 

From: = Tony Li <tony.li@to= ny.li>
Date: Wednesday, April 4, 2018 at 4:03 PM
To: = "Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)" <ginsberg@cisco.com>
Cc: Acee Lindem <acee@cisco.com>, "lsr@ietf.org" <lsr@ietf.o= rg>
Subject: Re: [Lsr] FW: New Version Notification for draft-g= insberg-isis-rfc7810bis-00.txt

 

I don=E2=80=99t see the big deal in having th= e WG name in the draft title, even for category 1 documents.

 

It=E2=80=99s only the name of the draft and the fact that it is protocol spe= cific doesn=E2=80=99t really need to be called out at that level.  People who= read the document will certainly figure it out.

=

 

Tony

<= span style=3D'mso-bookmark:_MailOriginalBody'> 

 

On Wed, Ap= r 4, 2018 at 12:39 PM Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) <ginsberg@cisco= .com> wrote:

<= blockquote style=3D'border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0in 0i= n 0in 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0in;margin-botto= m:5.0pt'>

Well...this raises a topic on which I would like to ha= ve feedback from the WG.

Combining IS-IS/OSPF into one working group = is fine - no argument there.
But, we now may be producing two classes of = documents:

1)Documents which are specific to a protocol (IS-IS or OSP= Fv2 or OSPFv3)

2)Documents which cover 2 or more protocols

dra= ft-ginsberg-isis-rfc7810bis-00.txt is Category #1 - and there is NO CHANCE t= his document will EVER cover OSPF - since OSPF already has RFC 7471 and this= bis document is a correction to the IS-IS specific RFC7810. Calling it &quo= t;-lsr-" to me is simply confusing as it in no way indicates that it is= IS-IS specific.
I suggest that any document which falls into Category 1 = should continue to follow the traditional protocol specific naming.
If th= is somehow violates some IETF rule then I suppose we could use "-lsr-is= is-". (somewhat verbose)

For Category 2 documents "-lsr-&qu= ot; certainly makes sense.

Comments??

   Les

=
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Acee Lindem (acee)
>= Sent: Tuesday, April 03, 2018 7:45 AM
> To: Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) &= lt;
ginsberg@cisco.com>; lsr@ietf.org
> Subject: Re: [Lsr] FW: New Version Notification for draft-ginsberg= -isis-
> rfc7810bis-00.txt
>
> Hi Les,
>
> Can= you resubmit as draft-ginsberg-lsr-rfc7810bis-00.txt? Also, please add a> "Changes from RFC 7810" section to the "Introduction&qu= ot;. I see you have added
> RFC8174 to the "Requirements Language= " section already.
>
> I think we should accept this as an = LSR Working Group document - does
> anyone disagree?
>
> T= hanks,
> Acee
>
> On 3/30/18, 6:39 PM, "Lsr on behalf= of Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)" <lsr-
>
bounces@ietf.org= on behalf of ginsberg@cisco.com> wrote:=
>
>     Folks -
>
>    &nb= sp;A bis version of RFC 7810 has been submitted to address the issue reporte= d
> in Errata ID: 5293
https://www.rfc-editor.org/errata_search.php?rfc=3D7810
>
>     Given that there exist= implementations which have interpreted the
> ambiguous encoding of so= me sub-TLVs in different/non-interoperable ways
> it was felt that a b= is version of the RFC was justified.
>     Please see t= he Appendix of the draft for a discussion of the changes from
> RFC 78= 10 and the reasons why.
>
>        Les
&g= t;
>
>     -----Original Message-----
>&nbs= p;    From:
internet-drafts@ietf= .org <i= nternet-drafts@ietf.org<= /span>>
>  &n= bsp;  Sent: Friday, March 30, 2018 3:33 PM
>     T= o: Qin Wu <
sunseawq@huawei.com>; David Ward (wardd)
> <
wardd@cisco.com>; Spencer Giacolone &= lt;spencer.giacalone@gmail.com>;
> Spencer Giacalone <
spencer.giacalone@gmail.com>; John Drake
> <
ldrake@juniper.n= et>; Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) <<= a href=3D"mailto:ginsberg@cisco.com" target=3D"_blank">ginsberg@cisco.com>; = David
> Ward (wardd) <
wardd@cisco.com>; Stefano Previdi <stefano@previdi.net>
>  =    Subject: New Version Notification for draft-ginsberg-isis-rfc78= 10bis-00.txt
>
>
>     A new version of I-D= , draft-ginsberg-isis-rfc7810bis-00.txt
>     has been = successfully submitted by Les Ginsberg and posted to the IETF
> reposi= tory.
>
>     Name:        &n= bsp;    draft-ginsberg-isis-rfc7810bis
>     = Revision: 00
>     Title:        &n= bsp;   IS-IS Traffic Engineering (TE) Metric Extensions
>  &= nbsp;  Document date:    2018-03-30
>    &nbs= p;Group:            Individual Submission
&= gt;     Pages:            19>     URL:            https://www.ietf.org/= internet-drafts/draft-ginsberg-isis-
>= rfc7810bis-00.txt
>     Status:      &n= bsp;  
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ginsberg-isis-rfc7810bis/

>     Htmlized:    &nb= sp;  
ht= tps://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ginsberg-isis-rfc7810bis-00
>     Htmlized:      &nb= sp;
https://data= tracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ginsberg-isis-
> rfc7810bis
>
>
>     Abstract:>        In certain networks, such as, but not limi= ted to, financial
>        information networks (e= .g., stock market data providers), network-
>      &nbs= p; performance criteria (e.g., latency) are becoming as critical to
>&= nbsp;       data-path selection as other metrics.
>
= >        This document describes extensions to IS-IS = Traffic Engineering
>        Extensions (RFC 5305)= such that network-performance information can
>      &= nbsp; be distributed and collected in a scalable fashion.  The informat= ion
>        distributed using IS-IS TE Metric Ext= ensions can then be used to make
>        path-sel= ection decisions based on network performance.
>
>    =     Note that this document only covers the mechanisms with which<= br>>        network-performance information is distri= buted.  The mechanisms for
>        measuring= network performance or acting on that information, once
>   = ;     distributed, are outside the scope of this document.
>=
>        This document obsoletes RFC 7810.
>= ;
>
>
>
>
>     Please note tha= t it may take a couple of minutes from the time of
> submission until = the htmlized version and diff are available at
tools= .ietf.org.
>
>    &nbs= p;The IETF Secretariat
>
>     __________________= _____________________________
>     Lsr mailing list>     Lsr@ietf.org
>     
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr
>

_______________________________________________
L= sr mailing list
Lsr@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.or= g/mailman/listinfo/lsr

=

_______________________________________________ Lsr mailing lis= t Lsr@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr <= /p>

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15.00.1320.000; Wed, 4 Apr 2018 16:18:01 -0500 From: "Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)" To: Jeff Tantsura , "Acee Lindem (acee)" , Tony Li CC: "lsr@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [Lsr] FW: New Version Notification for draft-ginsberg-isis-rfc7810bis-00.txt Thread-Index: AQHTy1pTDYQOpMXw80qZxNEhmGwTFaPw/uwggABeHYCAAAbEAIAACGcA//+xPrA= Date: Wed, 4 Apr 2018 21:18:01 +0000 Message-ID: <54c850e7622e46388cc52ac25b251c6a@XCH-ALN-001.cisco.com> References: <303B9428-1EF5-417C-8223-DCB34440677B@cisco.com> <69468450ae0141098f7579d630b9cd33@XCH-ALN-001.cisco.com> <9469617E-7079-4374-86D7-A3EC721834F4@cisco.com> <6304AF65-771B-46E8-8CBA-F62FD5A12BFB@gmail.com> In-Reply-To: <6304AF65-771B-46E8-8CBA-F62FD5A12BFB@gmail.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted x-originating-ip: [10.24.6.6] Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_54c850e7622e46388cc52ac25b251c6aXCHALN001ciscocom_" MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] FW: New Version Notification for draft-ginsberg-isis-rfc7810bis-00.txt X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 04 Apr 2018 21:18:08 -0000 --_000_54c850e7622e46388cc52ac25b251c6aXCHALN001ciscocom_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 RmluZSB3aXRoIG1lLg0KDQpNb3JlIGltcG9ydGFudCwgSSB3b3VsZCBsaWtlIHRvIGZhc3QgdHJh Y2sgdGhpcyBiaXMgZG9jdW1lbnQgc2luY2UgdGhlIGNoYW5nZXMgYXJlIHNvIHBvaW50ZWQgYW5k IGRpcmVjdGx5IGFmZmVjdCB0aGUgcHJvYmFiaWxpdHkgb2YgaW50ZXJvcGVyYWJsZSBpbXBsZW1l bnRhdGlvbnMuDQoNCkhvdyBxdWlja2x5IGNhbiB3ZSBtb3ZlIHRvIFdHIHN0YXR1cz8NCkNhbiB3 ZSBkbyB0aGF0IGV2ZW4gYmVmb3JlIHRoZSBuYW1lIGNoYW5nZSDigJMgc28gSSBjYW4gaXNzdWUg 4oCcaWV0Zi1sc3ItaXNpcy1yZmM3ODEwYmlz4oCdID8/DQoNCiAgIExlcw0KDQoNCkZyb206IEpl 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T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.01, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Y7a8kfJ-_7Ct for ; Thu, 5 Apr 2018 07:32:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: from smtp.chopps.org (smtp.chopps.org [54.88.81.56]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5D6A7126BF7 for ; Thu, 5 Apr 2018 07:32:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tops.chopps.org (47-50-69-38.static.klmz.mi.charter.com [47.50.69.38]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by smtp.chopps.org (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id B2651606A6; Thu, 5 Apr 2018 14:32:11 +0000 (UTC) References: <303B9428-1EF5-417C-8223-DCB34440677B@cisco.com> <69468450ae0141098f7579d630b9cd33@XCH-ALN-001.cisco.com> User-agent: mu4e 1.0; emacs 25.3.1 From: Christian Hopps To: "Les Ginsberg \(ginsberg\)" Cc: "Acee Lindem \(acee\)" , "lsr\@ietf.org" In-reply-to: <69468450ae0141098f7579d630b9cd33@XCH-ALN-001.cisco.com> Date: Thu, 05 Apr 2018 10:32:10 -0400 Message-ID: <87h8op911x.fsf@chopps.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] FW: New Version Notification for draft-ginsberg-isis-rfc7810bis-00.txt X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 05 Apr 2018 14:32:15 -0000 I think that the only time we should include the protocol (in addition to '-lsr-') is if we have split documents (for whatever reason) on the same solution. We have an example of this actually: draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-msd-09 draft-ietf-ospf-segment-routing-msd-09 Going forward we either combine these types of documents into a single document (discussion started @101) so "-lsr-" is appropriate, or if there's some reason not to merge them then we have 2 documents that need the protocol identifier to disambiguate. In this case there's no ambiguity so I don't see the need of adding an extra "-isis-". Thanks, Chris. Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) writes: > Well...this raises a topic on which I would like to have feedback from the WG. > > Combining IS-IS/OSPF into one working group is fine - no argument there. > But, we now may be producing two classes of documents: > > 1)Documents which are specific to a protocol (IS-IS or OSPFv2 or OSPFv3) > > 2)Documents which cover 2 or more protocols > > draft-ginsberg-isis-rfc7810bis-00.txt is Category #1 - and there is NO CHANCE this document will EVER cover OSPF - since OSPF already has RFC 7471 and this bis document is a correction to the IS-IS specific RFC7810. Calling it "-lsr-" to me is simply confusing as it in no way indicates that it is IS-IS specific. > I suggest that any document which falls into Category 1 should continue to follow the traditional protocol specific naming. > If this somehow violates some IETF rule then I suppose we could use "-lsr-isis-". (somewhat verbose) > > For Category 2 documents "-lsr-" certainly makes sense. > > Comments?? > > Les > > >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Acee Lindem (acee) >> Sent: Tuesday, April 03, 2018 7:45 AM >> To: Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) ; lsr@ietf.org >> Subject: Re: [Lsr] FW: New Version Notification for draft-ginsberg-isis- >> rfc7810bis-00.txt >> >> Hi Les, >> >> Can you resubmit as draft-ginsberg-lsr-rfc7810bis-00.txt? Also, please add a >> "Changes from RFC 7810" section to the "Introduction". I see you have added >> RFC8174 to the "Requirements Language" section already. >> >> I think we should accept this as an LSR Working Group document - does >> anyone disagree? >> >> Thanks, >> Acee >> >> On 3/30/18, 6:39 PM, "Lsr on behalf of Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)" > bounces@ietf.org on behalf of ginsberg@cisco.com> wrote: >> >> Folks - >> >> A bis version of RFC 7810 has been submitted to address the issue reported >> in Errata ID: 5293 https://www.rfc-editor.org/errata_search.php?rfc=7810 >> >> Given that there exist implementations which have interpreted the >> ambiguous encoding of some sub-TLVs in different/non-interoperable ways >> it was felt that a bis version of the RFC was justified. >> Please see the Appendix of the draft for a discussion of the changes from >> RFC 7810 and the reasons why. >> >> Les >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: internet-drafts@ietf.org >> Sent: Friday, March 30, 2018 3:33 PM >> To: Qin Wu ; David Ward (wardd) >> ; Spencer Giacolone ; >> Spencer Giacalone ; John Drake >> ; Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) ; David >> Ward (wardd) ; Stefano Previdi >> Subject: New Version Notification for draft-ginsberg-isis-rfc7810bis-00.txt >> >> >> A new version of I-D, draft-ginsberg-isis-rfc7810bis-00.txt >> has been successfully submitted by Les Ginsberg and posted to the IETF >> repository. >> >> Name: draft-ginsberg-isis-rfc7810bis >> Revision: 00 >> Title: IS-IS Traffic Engineering (TE) Metric Extensions >> Document date: 2018-03-30 >> Group: Individual Submission >> Pages: 19 >> URL: https://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ginsberg-isis- >> rfc7810bis-00.txt >> Status: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ginsberg-isis-rfc7810bis/ >> Htmlized: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ginsberg-isis-rfc7810bis-00 >> Htmlized: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ginsberg-isis- >> rfc7810bis >> >> >> Abstract: >> In certain networks, such as, but not limited to, financial >> information networks (e.g., stock market data providers), network- >> performance criteria (e.g., latency) are becoming as critical to >> data-path selection as other metrics. >> >> This document describes extensions to IS-IS Traffic Engineering >> Extensions (RFC 5305) such that network-performance information can >> be distributed and collected in a scalable fashion. The information >> distributed using IS-IS TE Metric Extensions can then be used to make >> path-selection decisions based on network performance. >> >> Note that this document only covers the mechanisms with which >> network-performance information is distributed. The mechanisms for >> measuring network performance or acting on that information, once >> distributed, are outside the scope of this document. >> >> This document obsoletes RFC 7810. >> >> >> >> >> >> Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of >> submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. >> >> The IETF Secretariat >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Lsr mailing list >> Lsr@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr >> > > _______________________________________________ > Lsr mailing list > Lsr@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr From nobody Thu Apr 5 07:35:22 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 026FE126BF7 for ; Thu, 5 Apr 2018 07:35:21 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.9 X-Spam-Level: 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([173.36.7.11]) with mapi id 15.00.1320.000; Thu, 5 Apr 2018 11:26:31 -0500 From: "Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)" To: Christian Hopps CC: "Acee Lindem (acee)" , "lsr@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [Lsr] FW: New Version Notification for draft-ginsberg-isis-rfc7810bis-00.txt Thread-Index: AQHTy1pTDYQOpMXw80qZxNEhmGwTFaPw/uwggAGT8wD//8tRIA== Date: Thu, 5 Apr 2018 16:26:31 +0000 Message-ID: <80eda7a4488a421b90027a702b2440d0@XCH-ALN-001.cisco.com> References: <303B9428-1EF5-417C-8223-DCB34440677B@cisco.com> <69468450ae0141098f7579d630b9cd33@XCH-ALN-001.cisco.com> <87h8op911x.fsf@chopps.org> In-Reply-To: <87h8op911x.fsf@chopps.org> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted x-originating-ip: [10.154.131.19] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] FW: New Version Notification for draft-ginsberg-isis-rfc7810bis-00.txt X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 05 Apr 2018 16:26:38 -0000 Q2hyaXMgLQ0KDQo+IC0tLS0tT3JpZ2luYWwgTWVzc2FnZS0tLS0tDQo+IEZyb206IENocmlzdGlh biBIb3BwcyA8Y2hvcHBzQGNob3Bwcy5vcmc+DQo+IFNlbnQ6IFRodXJzZGF5LCBBcHJpbCAwNSwg MjAxOCA3OjMyIEFNDQo+IFRvOiBMZXMgR2luc2JlcmcgKGdpbnNiZXJnKSA8Z2luc2JlcmdAY2lz Y28uY29tPg0KPiBDYzogQWNlZSBMaW5kZW0gKGFjZWUpIDxhY2VlQGNpc2NvLmNvbT47IGxzckBp ZXRmLm9yZw0KPiBTdWJqZWN0OiBSZTogW0xzcl0gRlc6IE5ldyBWZXJzaW9uIE5vdGlmaWNhdGlv biBmb3IgZHJhZnQtZ2luc2JlcmctaXNpcy0NCj4gcmZjNzgxMGJpcy0wMC50eHQNCj4gDQo+IA0K PiBJIHRoaW5rIHRoYXQgdGhlIG9ubHkgdGltZSB3ZSBzaG91bGQgaW5jbHVkZSB0aGUgcHJvdG9j b2wgKGluIGFkZGl0aW9uIHRvICctbHNyLScpDQo+IGlzIGlmIHdlIGhhdmUgc3BsaXQgZG9jdW1l bnRzIChmb3Igd2hhdGV2ZXIgcmVhc29uKSBvbiB0aGUgc2FtZSBzb2x1dGlvbi4NCj4gV2UgaGF2 ZSBhbiBleGFtcGxlIG9mIHRoaXMgYWN0dWFsbHk6DQo+IA0KPiAgICAgZHJhZnQtaWV0Zi1pc2lz 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Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: Cc: lsr@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 6.77.1 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Message-ID: <152297383171.3805.8679884987167672463@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Thu, 05 Apr 2018 17:17:11 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Lsr] I-D Action: draft-ietf-ospf-segment-routing-msd-10.txt X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 06 Apr 2018 00:17:12 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Link State Routing WG of the IETF. Title : Signaling MSD (Maximum SID Depth) using OSPF Authors : Jeff Tantsura Uma Chunduri Sam Aldrin Peter Psenak Filename : draft-ietf-ospf-segment-routing-msd-10.txt Pages : 9 Date : 2018-04-05 Abstract: This document defines a way for an OSPF Router to advertise multiple types of supported Maximum SID Depths (MSDs) at node and/or link granularity. Such advertisements allow entities (e.g., centralized controllers) to determine whether a particular SID stack can be supported in a given network. This document only defines one type of MSD maximum label imposition, but defines an encoding which can support other MSD types. Here the term OSPF means both OSPFv2 and OSPFv3. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-ospf-segment-routing-msd/ There are also htmlized versions available at: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ospf-segment-routing-msd-10 https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-ospf-segment-routing-msd-10 A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-ospf-segment-routing-msd-10 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Thu Apr 5 17:49:15 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6E56E12E87C for ; Thu, 5 Apr 2018 17:49:13 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -14.51 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-14.51 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.01, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=cisco.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 3iFhb8wpKYK8 for ; Thu, 5 Apr 2018 17:49:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rcdn-iport-1.cisco.com (rcdn-iport-1.cisco.com [173.37.86.72]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher DHE-RSA-SEED-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id EFE8412E872 for ; 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boundary="_000_65EF563D0E364D13956514FED79F8531ciscocom_" MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Subject: [Lsr] LSR WG IPR Query for "Signaling MSD (Maximum SID Depth) using OSPF" - draft-ietf-ospf-segment-routing-msd-10.txt (one more @#$ time) X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 06 Apr 2018 01:27:33 -0000 --_000_65EF563D0E364D13956514FED79F8531ciscocom_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 QXV0aG9ycywNCg0KQXJlIHlvdSBhd2FyZSBvZiBhbnkgSVBSIHRoYXQgYXBwbGllcyB0byBkcmFm dC1pZXRmLW9zcGYtc2VnbWVudC1yb3V0aW5nLW1zZC0xMC50eHQ/DQpJZiBzbywgaGFzIHRoaXMg SVBSIGJlZW4gZGlzY2xvc2VkIGluIGNvbXBsaWFuY2Ugd2l0aCBJRVRGIElQUiBydWxlcyAoc2Vl IFJGQ3MgMzk3OSwgNDg3OSwgMzY2OSBhbmQgNTM3OCBmb3IgbW9yZSBkZXRhaWxzKS4NCg0KSWYg eW91IGFyZSBsaXN0ZWQgYXMgYSBkb2N1bWVudCBhdXRob3Igb3IgY29udHJpYnV0b3IgcGxlYXNl IHJlc3BvbmQgdG8gdGhpcyBlbWFpbCByZWdhcmRsZXNzIG9mIHdoZXRoZXIgb3Igbm90IHlvdSBh cmUgYXdhcmUgb2YgYW55IHJlbGV2YW50IElQUi4gKlRoZSByZXNwb25zZSBuZWVkcyB0byBiZSBz ZW50IHRvIHRoZSBMU1IgV0cgbWFpbGluZyBsaXN0LiogVGhlIGRvY3VtZW50IHdpbGwgbm90IGFk dmFuY2UgdG8gdGhlIG5leHQgc3RhZ2UgdW50aWwgYSByZXNwb25zZSBoYXMgYmVlbiByZWNlaXZl ZCBmcm9tIGVhY2ggYXV0aG9yIGFuZCBjb250cmlidXRvci4NCg0KSWYgeW91IGFyZSBvbiB0aGUg TFNSIFdHIGVtYWlsIGxpc3QgYnV0IGFyZSBub3QgbGlzdGVkIGFzIGFuIGF1dGhvciBvciBjb250 cmlidXRvciwgdGhlbiBwbGVhc2UgZXhwbGljaXRseSByZXNwb25kIG9ubHkgaWYgeW91IGFyZSBh d2FyZSBvZiBhbnkgSVBSIHRoYXQgaGFzIG5vdCB5ZXQgYmVlbiBkaXNjbG9zZWQgaW4gY29uZm9y bWFuY2Ugd2l0aCBJRVRGIHJ1bGVzLg0KDQpUaGFua3MsDQpBY2VlDQo= --_000_65EF563D0E364D13956514FED79F8531ciscocom_ Content-Type: text/html; 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The document name (which is preserved in the text even when it becomes an RFC) should make that clear. > I agree. >From a purely personal point of view, I track OSPF but have no interest in the other protocol (mention of which causes my ISP to blackhole my e-mail). I filter the I-D announce list and will see notification of any I-D with OSPF in the title - any without OSPF in the title will pass under the radar. Tom Petch > Les > > > Thanks, > > Chris. > > > > Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) writes: > > > > > Well...this raises a topic on which I would like to have feedback from the > > WG. > > > > > > Combining xxxx/OSPF into one working group is fine - no argument there. > > > But, we now may be producing two classes of documents: > > > From nobody Fri Apr 6 04:34:02 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EEF5E126C25; Fri, 6 Apr 2018 04:34:00 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -14.511 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-14.511 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.01, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=cisco.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id tMhGtkjWoZyW; Fri, 6 Apr 2018 04:33:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: from aer-iport-2.cisco.com (aer-iport-2.cisco.com [173.38.203.52]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher DHE-RSA-SEED-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E04F7124E15; Fri, 6 Apr 2018 04:33:58 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cisco.com; i=@cisco.com; l=3350; q=dns/txt; s=iport; t=1523014439; x=1524224039; h=subject:to:cc:references:from:message-id:date: mime-version:in-reply-to:content-transfer-encoding; bh=Nx+hCAgX32xjDnb78wplGwKL/XOjYYjvXTULn5c6+1Q=; b=S+Hze2nTsCVWfeU4R1M1ZTW7u5+19O+DWtOBeagGtSGRnaWi6HFQk0Ic /ugdEWtaSyXKerYqkjU9wkxAkz8711XZ0voi35I0/9HC4ogXQDe07ah25 blq8L3zGxQB1yBjYX6SUjoxq19FDTyTvXd1ytRbnis2WvPmJ6PajM0A1d Q=; X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.48,415,1517875200"; d="scan'208";a="3035067" Received: from aer-iport-nat.cisco.com (HELO aer-core-4.cisco.com) ([173.38.203.22]) by aer-iport-2.cisco.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384; 06 Apr 2018 11:33:56 +0000 Received: from asm-linux.cisco.com (ams-asmirnov-nitro6.cisco.com [10.55.206.135]) (authenticated bits=0) by aer-core-4.cisco.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id w36BXurJ032547 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=NO); Fri, 6 Apr 2018 11:33:56 GMT To: "Acee Lindem (acee)" , "draft-ietf-ospf-xaf-te@ietf.org" Cc: "lsr@ietf.org" References: From: Anton Smirnov Organization: Cisco Systems Message-ID: <5189f820-58a2-7783-284f-1bdbfc5f054f@cisco.com> Date: Fri, 6 Apr 2018 13:32:23 +0200 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/52.5.2 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Authenticated-User: asmirnov Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] OSPF Routing with Cross-Address Family MPLS Traffic Engineering Tunnels X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 06 Apr 2018 11:34:01 -0000 Hi Acee, my answers below (I didn't vet them with other authors, so they may express different opinions). > 1. Have you considered a shorter name for the RFC? For example: “OSPF > Cross Address Family Traffic Engineering Tunnelsâ€? Your proposed variant drops two pieces: "Routing with" and "MPLS". Dropping mention to MPLS is fine with me. Dropping "Routing with" seems to me less correct because the draft is about ways to compute routes and not about setting up/managing tunnels. But ultimately I have no strong feelings here and if there is a requirement to shorten document's name then that would be a good candidate. > 2. Can you change the requirements language text to the RFC 8174 version? OK, we will publish new document revision when we agreed on other points. > 3. In the section 3 mapping algorithm, why do you walk the X-AF > endpoints from all connected areas? Why not just the area of local > IP address? Idea behind this wording is to cater for cases when area borders are laid differently in OSPFv2 and OSPFv3. It's even possible that router is ABR in OSPFv2 but not OSPFv3. From network design perspective this, of course, is a terrible thing to do - but not impossible. > 4. In the backward compatibility section, can you also discuss the > requirements for backward compatibility of the endpoints? Also state > that the X-AF tunnel will not be recognized unless the endpoints are > advertised by the same protocol (OSPFv2 or OSPFv3); or describe the > behavior if this is not the intension. We can add paragraph saying something like: "In order for XAF computation to work tunnel tailend routers MUST advertise XAF Node Local Address sub-TLVs in OSPF instance that will perform XAF computation. Thus only tunnel endpoints (both tunnel headend and tailend routers) and only OSPF protocol instance performing XAF routing must implement XAF as described in this document. Other routers in the network do not need to implement XAF algorithm or interpret Node Local Address sub-TLVs. For example, if network uses TE tunnels signaled by OSPFv2 [RFC3630] and intends to use cross-AF route computation in OSPFv3 then only OSPFv3 implementation on routers that serve as tunnel endpoints in OSPFv2 needs to be compliant with this specification." Will this text work? --- Anton On 04/04/18 20:13, Acee Lindem (acee) wrote: > Hi Anton, Alvaro, and Mike, > > In preparation for WG last call, I have a couple comments. > > 1. Have you considered a shorter name for the RFC? For example: “OSPF > Cross Address Family Traffic Engineering Tunnelsâ€? > 2. Can you change the requirements language text to the RFC 8174 version? > 3. In the section 3 mapping algorithm, why do you walk the X-AF > endpoints from all connected areas? Why not just the area of local > IP address? > 4. In the backward compatibility section, can you also discuss the > requirements for backward compatibility of the endpoints? Also state > that the X-AF tunnel will not be recognized unless the endpoints are > advertised by the same protocol (OSPFv2 or OSPFv3); or describe the > behavior if this is not the intension. > > Thanks, > > Acee > From nobody Fri Apr 6 07:57:52 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2A314120726 for ; Fri, 6 Apr 2018 07:57:50 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -14.511 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-14.511 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.01, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=cisco.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ecwxBNIAbe73 for ; Fri, 6 Apr 2018 07:57:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from aer-iport-1.cisco.com (aer-iport-1.cisco.com [173.38.203.51]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher DHE-RSA-SEED-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id A56C912711E for ; Fri, 6 Apr 2018 07:57:43 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cisco.com; i=@cisco.com; l=2987; q=dns/txt; s=iport; t=1523026663; x=1524236263; h=message-id:date:from:mime-version:to:subject:references: in-reply-to:content-transfer-encoding; bh=5nzc43F1x17vxCuXzfWBbg9OwC1sgQt0e6izTuYv6x4=; b=DsgYvuXHyBsYfWTyMM8kW+yx0bfCgQCzZ8BUnmgQGjiT76OWRYCaOPKF v4RTOXypMjxtAUOSNYP3sh1Rv+5PCQYp+XVwsuvAMuRa5fi32upHiYnTh gg6IpOhwV/xxaxo8K/GznJK4JBgNHd129duhZxtjWjfg+qOHLmos7+eh3 k=; X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: =?us-ascii?q?A0CYAACnicda/xbLJq1dGQEBAQEBAQE?= =?us-ascii?q?BAQEBAQcBAQEBAYQjbyiLX16OIIEPkliBegsYC4RgAoJaNBgBAgEBAQEBAQJ?= =?us-ascii?q?sHAyFIgEBAQEDAQEwAQU2CQERCxEDAQIBCRYIBwkDAgECARUfCQgHDAYCAQE?= =?us-ascii?q?XhHIPqyQOhFiDboIliT8/gQuDBYMRAQECAQEWgQ5ahS4Ci3eLTAiFVIhfgTI?= =?us-ascii?q?7gyCCN4R8iRyGaoElHDiBUjMaCBsVGSGCQwmJOYFOhUA9MAGOGQEB?= X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.48,415,1517875200"; d="scan'208";a="3039104" Received: from aer-iport-nat.cisco.com (HELO aer-core-3.cisco.com) ([173.38.203.22]) by aer-iport-1.cisco.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384; 06 Apr 2018 14:57:41 +0000 Received: from [10.147.24.22] ([10.147.24.22]) by aer-core-3.cisco.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id w36EvfP8011947; Fri, 6 Apr 2018 14:57:41 GMT Message-ID: <5AC78AE5.8020707@cisco.com> Date: Fri, 06 Apr 2018 16:57:41 +0200 From: Peter Psenak User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.11; rv:24.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/24.4.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: tony.li@tony.li, lsr@ietf.org References: <152216649041.5234.6342137041063769692.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> <7D2C1874-8B55-45B1-8C5F-D4C9C1F47D11@tony.li> In-Reply-To: <7D2C1874-8B55-45B1-8C5F-D4C9C1F47D11@tony.li> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-li-dynamic-flooding-04.txt X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 06 Apr 2018 14:57:50 -0000 Hi Tony, while I appreciate the flexibility associated with the centralized computation of the flooding topology, it has some drawbacks as well: 1. "flooding topology" must be flooded. This makes the flooding dependent on the flooded data itself. 2. The extra flooding of "flooding topology" adds some delay in the convergence towards the new "flooding topology". Have you considered the distributed computation of "flooding topology" using some standardized algorithm? Eventually we can support multiple standardized algorithms. A node can advertise support for several algorithms and the "active" algorithm is selected based on some criteria that would guarantee that all nodes in the flooding domain select the same one. thanks, Peter On 27/03/18 18:07 , tony.li@tony.li wrote: > > Hi all, > > I’ve submitted an updated version of my draft. Several changes: > > - This collapses the two documents into one, so IS-IS is now included. > Placeholders are there for OSPF. > - I’ve expanded the discussion of failure modes. > - Minor bug fixes. > > Your comments are solicited… > > Tony > > >> Begin forwarded message: >> >> *From: *internet-drafts@ietf.org >> *Subject: **New Version Notification for draft-li-dynamic-flooding-04.txt* >> *Date: *March 27, 2018 at 9:01:30 AM PDT >> *To: *"Tony Li" > >> >> >> A new version of I-D, draft-li-dynamic-flooding-04.txt >> has been successfully submitted by Tony Li and posted to the >> IETF repository. >> >> Name:draft-li-dynamic-flooding >> Revision:04 >> Title:Dynamic Flooding on Dense Graphs >> Document date:2018-03-26 >> Group:Individual Submission >> Pages:17 >> URL: https://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-li-dynamic-flooding-04.txt >> Status: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-li-dynamic-flooding/ >> Htmlized: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-li-dynamic-flooding-04 >> Htmlized: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-li-dynamic-flooding >> Diff: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-li-dynamic-flooding-04 >> >> Abstract: >> Routing with link state protocols in dense network topologies can >> result in sub-optimal convergence times due to the overhead >> associated with flooding. This can be addressed by decreasing the >> flooding topology so that it is less dense. >> >> This document discusses the problem in some depth and an >> architectural solution. Specific protocol changes for IS-IS, OSPFv2, >> and OSPFv3 are described in this document. >> >> >> >> >> Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of >> submission >> until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org >> . >> >> The IETF Secretariat >> > > > > _______________________________________________ > Lsr mailing list > Lsr@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr > From nobody Fri Apr 6 08:20:04 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id F1C44128896 for ; Fri, 6 Apr 2018 08:19:52 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.4 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.4 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FORGED_FROMDOMAIN=0.25, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.249, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id cs2Y98XPTdK5 for ; Fri, 6 Apr 2018 08:19:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-pl0-x22c.google.com (mail-pl0-x22c.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400e:c01::22c]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 099ED12D87B for ; Fri, 6 Apr 2018 08:19:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-pl0-x22c.google.com with SMTP id s24-v6so817045plq.6 for ; Fri, 06 Apr 2018 08:19:51 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=sender:from:message-id:mime-version:subject:date:in-reply-to:cc:to :references; bh=dBkWB/dOrs02tVcz5+9sEEREm4OlGaQQaOFALsjbrck=; b=U0AEMy5AH+RepCOlXOg1KwqsQDlN+KEK7erfqS0N3MX5MpVAMXmsgNMltCchnJ3qhn AC8VOFPLCQRsfKAxRoIlic9B7c+MQ/16FgL0nZm9Ylz9bseXaFQ2zjfQIlZgPLssNkgE 9gW7K1LpUFBA+E2mGkBRxhVbsh8noVE2Fr0DbdBsP1dIhfy4yCWv4lPRyOkAtKFJKFE0 g937jyjcr+JPRnIYS+eCfk3ctcWw8FVDEHS5KKJjQgC0b/8VLXI8VjNXBc643hUwusvx q7NCxiBPu18Ub9hafmKVf2YksxsxFXHmyseEKXp4+4x5Ya9TjiI4ia3aNE2IZWRZw6Kd mvfA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:sender:from:message-id:mime-version:subject:date :in-reply-to:cc:to:references; bh=dBkWB/dOrs02tVcz5+9sEEREm4OlGaQQaOFALsjbrck=; b=UR6nigIYWM7W50ngXPR+cfc3i16m6EG009KkNAghHjRz96tuFMKKXReL+58DFBx9Ia zZ4RRvNYx6HifBZhZDZQ6SBN9C/ndJfMcTOPV0/55pd/LyU7Z77sVSdLZBAg4mi80nC4 tfO0A5WDGkxd6K+hu7HdgngUpoWtr2SJh6Y4GQNu3P5NWDHEempLgIJ75jFt148Mi9l8 UCcm4JkkUT7D0frNKnFOMsDxlr9IgM+QoeAvzxyal4LJHHJfvVBTgK1cDn/Cq8u6Pzf0 Cgx7FBa4wycLVJGdiTzofwTQ7RE/eR4ZjhlTVTL0JsvjKR5vYmFyEN/XEv2lKAoKvKlg xL2Q== X-Gm-Message-State: AElRT7EOmKCem4XvieqFXT4SlpuA+EouOzHyRwEv5t8yoLI2GQE6fjZ2 uOCUSq9M/bhqDKIj6kfga98zxcND X-Google-Smtp-Source: AIpwx48ELNzHnVGfHoADgnjz6gPkGJbhbUvqvReGYAkx/sFuy5iftcT7V2dOZEWRoYq+fwqIAysSyw== X-Received: by 2002:a17:902:71cf:: with SMTP id t15-v6mr28206291plm.107.1523027990716; Fri, 06 Apr 2018 08:19:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [192.168.1.3] (c-24-130-209-5.hsd1.ca.comcast.net. [24.130.209.5]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id 27sm20760916pfo.137.2018.04.06.08.19.48 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Fri, 06 Apr 2018 08:19:49 -0700 (PDT) Sender: Tony Li From: tony.li@tony.li Message-Id: <6E69B9E3-14A6-4EED-BBE4-F5A424D57787@tony.li> Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Apple-Mail=_D8D63913-B3F6-4BDB-9E5E-4D30811421DE" Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 11.3 \(3445.6.18\)) Date: Fri, 6 Apr 2018 08:19:46 -0700 In-Reply-To: <5AC78AE5.8020707@cisco.com> Cc: lsr@ietf.org To: Peter Psenak References: <152216649041.5234.6342137041063769692.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> <7D2C1874-8B55-45B1-8C5F-D4C9C1F47D11@tony.li> <5AC78AE5.8020707@cisco.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.6.18) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-li-dynamic-flooding-04.txt X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 06 Apr 2018 15:19:53 -0000 --Apple-Mail=_D8D63913-B3F6-4BDB-9E5E-4D30811421DE Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Hi Peter, Thank you for your comments. > while I appreciate the flexibility associated with the centralized = computation of the flooding topology, it has some drawbacks as well: >=20 > 1. "flooding topology" must be flooded. This makes the flooding = dependent on the flooded data itself. Absolutely true. If the computation of the topology is incorrect, that = would certainly be a bug.=20 > 2. The extra flooding of "flooding topology" adds some delay in the = convergence towards the new "flooding topology=E2=80=9D. Since we distribute the flooding topology before there are topology = failures, it would seem like the latency is not a significant concern. > Have you considered the distributed computation of "flooding topology" = using some standardized algorithm? Yes, Kireeti raised this in London as well. There are some practical = issues with this. How do we ever converge on an algorithm?=20 There are many perspectives on what an adequate flooding topology might = be. Different administrations have different considerations and risk = tolerances.=20 Debugging is going to be more challenging, as inconsistencies between = two nodes with different ideas of the topology will be difficult to = detect until there is a catastrophic failure. I=E2=80=99m trying to do something practical, and it seems like doing = this in a centralized fashion is the quickest, easiest, and most robust = way forward. > Eventually we can support multiple standardized algorithms. A node can = advertise support for several algorithms and the "active" algorithm is = selected based on some criteria that would guarantee that all nodes in = the flooding domain select the same one. Seems like that would also require some administrative input. So, I agree that that=E2=80=99s a technical possibility, but I think = that there=E2=80=99s significant problems in making that work. I prefer = to focus on something that we can implement more quickly. Tony --Apple-Mail=_D8D63913-B3F6-4BDB-9E5E-4D30811421DE Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8

Hi Peter,

Thank you for your comments.

while I = appreciate the flexibility associated with the centralized computation = of the flooding topology, it has some drawbacks as well:

1. "flooding topology" must be = flooded. This makes the flooding dependent on the flooded data = itself.


Absolutely true. If the computation of the = topology is incorrect, that would certainly be a = bug. 


2. The extra flooding of "flooding topology" adds some delay = in the convergence towards the new "flooding topology=E2=80=9D.


Since we distribute the flooding topology before = there are topology failures, it would seem like the latency is not a = significant concern.


Have you considered the = distributed computation of "flooding topology" using some standardized = algorithm?


Yes, Kireeti raised this in London as well. There = are some practical issues with this. How do we ever converge on an = algorithm? 

There are many = perspectives on what an adequate flooding topology might be. Different = administrations have different considerations and risk = tolerances. 

Debugging is going = to be more challenging, as inconsistencies between two nodes with = different ideas of the topology will be difficult to detect until there = is a catastrophic failure.

I=E2=80=99m= trying to do something practical, and it seems like doing this in a = centralized fashion is the quickest, easiest, and most robust way = forward.


Eventually we can support multiple standardized algorithms. A = node can advertise support for several algorithms and the "active" = algorithm is selected based on some criteria that would guarantee that = all nodes in the flooding domain select the same = one.


Seems like that would also require some = administrative input.

So, I agree = that that=E2=80=99s a technical possibility, but I think that there=E2=80=99= s significant problems in making that work. I prefer to focus on = something that we can implement more quickly.

Tony


= --Apple-Mail=_D8D63913-B3F6-4BDB-9E5E-4D30811421DE-- From nobody Fri Apr 6 08:50:33 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 191B5120724 for ; Fri, 6 Apr 2018 08:50:32 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -14.511 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-14.511 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.01, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=cisco.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 8e7pcDfOnzhX for ; Fri, 6 Apr 2018 08:50:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from aer-iport-1.cisco.com (aer-iport-1.cisco.com [173.38.203.51]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher DHE-RSA-SEED-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 0195B1204DA for ; Fri, 6 Apr 2018 08:50:29 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cisco.com; i=@cisco.com; l=2562; q=dns/txt; s=iport; t=1523029830; x=1524239430; h=message-id:date:from:mime-version:to:cc:subject: references:in-reply-to:content-transfer-encoding; bh=svrVjgFAuKdZRFx+eLum9K+tiWmDCmAG44WX1N9ko+o=; b=gXiRUNxcghbQiIKhF/IxGm/i27vv04C1TGRjpfYx2JebtxzKRaoM4AgQ bKmEawqKqC59SUtcluPfWyJl5QNTU8ETcJyNPaW26uADKNI7H84NQmXBb ISFNoIGCbyQxSO9DEu01UewtYtHc2EsYfN3auDOWWeKlu/QC6WV8bY2hG c=; X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: =?us-ascii?q?A0CNAQCalsda/xbLJq1dGQEBAQEBAQE?= =?us-ascii?q?BAQEBAQcBAQEBAYMXgXsog1+IXo4ggQ+UUguFAwKCWjgUAQIBAQEBAQECbBw?= =?us-ascii?q?MhSMBAgMjDwEFPwEBEAsYAgIFFgsCAgkDAgECAUUTAQUCAQGFCakzgg4OhFi?= =?us-ascii?q?DboIlgQmINj+EEIQ7EW+CNIJUApdDCI4zh0SEfJAGgSUzIYFSMxoIGxWCfYM?= =?us-ascii?q?xAQmGB4cOPTCOGgEB?= X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.48,415,1517875200"; d="scan'208";a="3039708" Received: from aer-iport-nat.cisco.com (HELO aer-core-3.cisco.com) ([173.38.203.22]) by aer-iport-1.cisco.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384; 06 Apr 2018 15:50:26 +0000 Received: from [10.60.140.57] (ams-ppsenak-nitro8.cisco.com [10.60.140.57]) by aer-core-3.cisco.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id w36FoPau021952; Fri, 6 Apr 2018 15:50:26 GMT Message-ID: <5AC79740.6060205@cisco.com> Date: Fri, 06 Apr 2018 17:50:24 +0200 From: Peter Psenak User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.11; rv:24.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/24.4.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: tony.li@tony.li CC: lsr@ietf.org References: <152216649041.5234.6342137041063769692.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> <7D2C1874-8B55-45B1-8C5F-D4C9C1F47D11@tony.li> <5AC78AE5.8020707@cisco.com> <6E69B9E3-14A6-4EED-BBE4-F5A424D57787@tony.li> In-Reply-To: <6E69B9E3-14A6-4EED-BBE4-F5A424D57787@tony.li> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-li-dynamic-flooding-04.txt X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 06 Apr 2018 15:50:32 -0000 Hi Tony, if we start with a single standardized algorithm, that is easy to implement and deploy. We can leave the door open for additional algorithms to be defined later together with the selection mechanism. I have the feeling that the dependency of the "flooding topology" on the flooded data is going to bring more complexity, than the selection of the distributed algorithm to be used, if we ever need to support more then one. thanks, Peter On 06/04/18 17:19 , tony.li@tony.li wrote: > > Hi Peter, > > Thank you for your comments. > >> while I appreciate the flexibility associated with the centralized >> computation of the flooding topology, it has some drawbacks as well: >> >> 1. "flooding topology" must be flooded. This makes the flooding >> dependent on the flooded data itself. > > > Absolutely true. If the computation of the topology is incorrect, that > would certainly be a bug. > > >> 2. The extra flooding of "flooding topology" adds some delay in the >> convergence towards the new "flooding topologyâ€. > > > Since we distribute the flooding topology before there are topology > failures, it would seem like the latency is not a significant concern. > > >> Have you considered the distributed computation of "flooding topology" >> using some standardized algorithm? > > > Yes, Kireeti raised this in London as well. There are some practical > issues with this. How do we ever converge on an algorithm? > > There are many perspectives on what an adequate flooding topology might > be. Different administrations have different considerations and risk > tolerances. > > Debugging is going to be more challenging, as inconsistencies between > two nodes with different ideas of the topology will be difficult to > detect until there is a catastrophic failure. > > I’m trying to do something practical, and it seems like doing this in a > centralized fashion is the quickest, easiest, and most robust way forward. > > >> Eventually we can support multiple standardized algorithms. A node can >> advertise support for several algorithms and the "active" algorithm is >> selected based on some criteria that would guarantee that all nodes in >> the flooding domain select the same one. > > > Seems like that would also require some administrative input. > > So, I agree that that’s a technical possibility, but I think that > there’s significant problems in making that work. I prefer to focus on > something that we can implement more quickly. > > Tony > > From nobody Fri Apr 6 09:02:46 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C6825120724 for ; Fri, 6 Apr 2018 09:02:44 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=rob-sh.20150623.gappssmtp.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 3peBTJH8c1Y9 for ; Fri, 6 Apr 2018 09:02:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-oi0-x234.google.com (mail-oi0-x234.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4003:c06::234]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 012AA1204DA for ; Fri, 6 Apr 2018 09:02:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-oi0-x234.google.com with SMTP id 71-v6so1489305oie.12 for ; Fri, 06 Apr 2018 09:02:41 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=rob-sh.20150623.gappssmtp.com; s=20150623; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=AjOcLlPLoZObcJg9185kX6VXMGiVTB/2TYfrYQlpP1Q=; b=tYEgUdML4jsnmADSluEpHNqI+/GkIa/2JsZtSuKrnbq8qbilTIyRxt+BbUkwXx1c+W G/kXboVRelPgsEmmmLz3YvPswp+YH/O0oe2gqs+C96mvgPy10hf/gOyzOBmXca7R9LqN B9xSxVbE95s685gUsCuk9jjPCVYuvNaRpgEaN7w8sntRQE5U4a8kpwwEJ7Un8bhlk5oV 6ePdxJpYOBHy+dGvnPTY948ADAKcjilMN/mEufHb7vvAMlQauLWjFDi328iUhMaQ61L5 UJJ4XthYC8THX+eK6ogw5iW/wkSTsF/T+dE91K9A9Dtkv83Ewqf1o+PS2Oq6M7bCfm39 KPZw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=AjOcLlPLoZObcJg9185kX6VXMGiVTB/2TYfrYQlpP1Q=; b=K1luTobP1iStx0MWp/ahLRbjijo3xSpFabU1AL9TSankuWKTQxN9kEO0Wi8q9Xg4gf nAf1sLoAWpq6d229jxmhCn1iEPhbY5bzfm5vtNiABifNoJfP8vMLZoNodI+56qS65eZB 7OHFSWkwr/cJF75Y2c3WySCf0vAn6ipPaHfs17rhU5zExmMbhXMsPGr3iXE3LFu5jaGD MHB7w84KAeRp1i46mbwxJSuPGf7Xhm9PYjtAkGTv31gNVHOdtJs+vM1vzDWBQ87siOGa j5X72x0C59jlcXCjBuQ08faeyjLEzlg8OBAb6GXoSFm71I/vzLHX9IIJKHNmSwp168qf 24zw== X-Gm-Message-State: ALQs6tAOw6eZvGdeyGuCJE/Mcu2jJ7dZk93XU4pYu6+MMFTZg/P7uwHF j35KQfdb+A4FBhKg/g7Dd+HJPnbVTCS4IoFuUcGMWA== X-Google-Smtp-Source: AIpwx48X73joN8HaFeveu3JFaTdecIjhpWf2HWxD/vNKE839m+TVwx7s3cw2iWgpbOKLma1abCjabnLjqh6Ejf4eIo0= X-Received: by 2002:aca:524c:: with SMTP id g73-v6mr15098437oib.144.1523030560689; Fri, 06 Apr 2018 09:02:40 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <152216649041.5234.6342137041063769692.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> <7D2C1874-8B55-45B1-8C5F-D4C9C1F47D11@tony.li> <5AC78AE5.8020707@cisco.com> <6E69B9E3-14A6-4EED-BBE4-F5A424D57787@tony.li> <5AC79740.6060205@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <5AC79740.6060205@cisco.com> From: Rob Shakir Date: Fri, 06 Apr 2018 16:02:30 +0000 Message-ID: To: Peter Psenak Cc: tony.li@tony.li, lsr@ietf.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000008d60f70569302fb0" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-li-dynamic-flooding-04.txt X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 06 Apr 2018 16:02:45 -0000 --0000000000008d60f70569302fb0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Peter, How do we transition between algorithms in the approach that you suggest? Do all non-stub devices need to be upgraded to support the new algorithm before such time as we can use it? (I think so, because otherwise some non-stub device cannot be guaranteed to flood to its downstream stub devices - so we may end up isolating some devices if any device transitions before all nodes support it). The advantage of having something advertised is that one can compute it centrally - and keep the per-node functionality simply obeying the advertised flooding graph. From an operational perspective, this means that one can introduce new experimental flooding topology computation approaches in a manner that is decoupled from needing to do software upgrades across the whole network. I can also implement non-standard flooding topology computations based on the network topology which could be only applicable to that particular network (consider if I wanted to do something like take into account shared-risk information in the algorithm to allow the most-SRLG disjoint flooding topology or so). This is in addition to the points Tony made. I think this centralised-computation-and-flooded approach is elegant. If the error handling behaviour for not being able to parse the flooding topology is to revert to flooding everywhere, then it seems non-destructive too. Cheers, r. On Fri, 6 Apr 2018 at 08:50 Peter Psenak wrote: > Hi Tony, > > if we start with a single standardized algorithm, that is easy to > implement and deploy. We can leave the door open for additional > algorithms to be defined later together with the selection mechanism. > > I have the feeling that the dependency of the "flooding topology" on the > flooded data is going to bring more complexity, than the selection of > the distributed algorithm to be used, if we ever need to support more > then one. > > thanks, > Peter > > > On 06/04/18 17:19 , tony.li@tony.li wrote: > > > > Hi Peter, > > > > Thank you for your comments. > > > >> while I appreciate the flexibility associated with the centralized > >> computation of the flooding topology, it has some drawbacks as well: > >> > >> 1. "flooding topology" must be flooded. This makes the flooding > >> dependent on the flooded data itself. > > > > > > Absolutely true. If the computation of the topology is incorrect, that > > would certainly be a bug. > > > > > >> 2. The extra flooding of "flooding topology" adds some delay in the > >> convergence towards the new "flooding topology=E2=80=9D. > > > > > > Since we distribute the flooding topology before there are topology > > failures, it would seem like the latency is not a significant concern. > > > > > >> Have you considered the distributed computation of "flooding topology" > >> using some standardized algorithm? > > > > > > Yes, Kireeti raised this in London as well. There are some practical > > issues with this. How do we ever converge on an algorithm? > > > > There are many perspectives on what an adequate flooding topology might > > be. Different administrations have different considerations and risk > > tolerances. > > > > Debugging is going to be more challenging, as inconsistencies between > > two nodes with different ideas of the topology will be difficult to > > detect until there is a catastrophic failure. > > > > I=E2=80=99m trying to do something practical, and it seems like doing t= his in a > > centralized fashion is the quickest, easiest, and most robust way > forward. > > > > > >> Eventually we can support multiple standardized algorithms. A node can > >> advertise support for several algorithms and the "active" algorithm is > >> selected based on some criteria that would guarantee that all nodes in > >> the flooding domain select the same one. > > > > > > Seems like that would also require some administrative input. > > > > So, I agree that that=E2=80=99s a technical possibility, but I think th= at > > there=E2=80=99s significant problems in making that work. I prefer to f= ocus on > > something that we can implement more quickly. > > > > Tony > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Lsr mailing list > Lsr@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr > --0000000000008d60f70569302fb0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Peter,

How do we transition between alg= orithms in the approach that you suggest? Do all non-stub devices need to b= e upgraded to support the new algorithm before such time as we can use it? = (I think so, because otherwise some non-stub device cannot be guaranteed to= flood to its downstream stub devices - so we may end up isolating some dev= ices if any device transitions before all nodes support it).=C2=A0

The advantage of having something advertised is that one c= an compute it centrally - and keep the per-node functionality simply obeyin= g the advertised flooding graph. From an operational perspective, this mean= s that one can introduce new experimental flooding topology computation app= roaches in a manner that is decoupled from needing to do software upgrades = across the whole network. I can also implement non-standard flooding topolo= gy computations based on the network topology which could be only applicabl= e to that particular network (consider if I wanted to do something like tak= e into account shared-risk information in the algorithm to allow the most-S= RLG disjoint flooding topology or so).

This is in = addition to the points Tony made. I think this centralised-computation-and-= flooded approach is elegant. If the error handling behaviour for not being = able to parse the flooding topology is to revert to flooding everywhere, th= en it seems non-destructive too.

Cheers,
r.=C2=A0
On Fri= , 6 Apr 2018 at 08:50 Peter Psenak <ppsenak@cisco.com> wrote:
H= i Tony,

if we start with a single standardized algorithm, that is easy to
implement and deploy. We can leave the door open for additional
algorithms to be defined later together with the selection mechanism.

I have the feeling that the dependency of the "flooding topology"= on the
flooded data is going to bring more complexity, than the selection of
the distributed algorithm to be used, if we ever need to support more
then one.

thanks,
Peter


On 06/04/18 17:19 , to= ny.li@tony.li wrote:
>
> Hi Peter,
>
> Thank you for your comments.
>
>> while I appreciate the flexibility associated with the centralized=
>> computation of the flooding topology, it has some drawbacks as wel= l:
>>
>> 1. "flooding topology" must be flooded. This makes the f= looding
>> dependent on the flooded data itself.
>
>
> Absolutely true. If the computation of the topology is incorrect, that=
> would certainly be a bug.
>
>
>> 2. The extra flooding of "flooding topology" adds some d= elay in the
>> convergence towards the new "flooding topology=E2=80=9D.
>
>
> Since we distribute the flooding topology before there are topology > failures, it would seem like the latency is not a significant concern.=
>
>
>> Have you considered the distributed computation of "flooding = topology"
>> using some standardized algorithm?
>
>
> Yes, Kireeti raised this in London as well. There are some practical > issues with this. How do we ever converge on an algorithm?
>
> There are many perspectives on what an adequate flooding topology migh= t
> be. Different administrations have different considerations and risk > tolerances.
>
> Debugging is going to be more challenging, as inconsistencies between<= br> > two nodes with different ideas of the topology will be difficult to > detect until there is a catastrophic failure.
>
> I=E2=80=99m trying to do something practical, and it seems like doing = this in a
> centralized fashion is the quickest, easiest, and most robust way forw= ard.
>
>
>> Eventually we can support multiple standardized algorithms. A node= can
>> advertise support for several algorithms and the "active"= ; algorithm is
>> selected based on some criteria that would guarantee that all node= s in
>> the flooding domain select the same one.
>
>
> Seems like that would also require some administrative input.
>
> So, I agree that that=E2=80=99s a technical possibility, but I think t= hat
> there=E2=80=99s significant problems in making that work. I prefer to = focus on
> something that we can implement more quickly.
>
> Tony
>
>

_______________________________________________
Lsr mailing list
Lsr@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr
--0000000000008d60f70569302fb0-- From nobody Fri Apr 6 10:57:58 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 42FD3124D6C for ; Fri, 6 Apr 2018 10:57:57 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -14.511 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-14.511 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.01, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=cisco.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id H9G_gcVcZR-k for ; Fri, 6 Apr 2018 10:57:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rcdn-iport-3.cisco.com (rcdn-iport-3.cisco.com [173.37.86.74]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher DHE-RSA-SEED-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 2CD68124D68 for ; 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charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] FW: New Version Notification for draft-ginsberg-isis-rfc7810bis-00.txt X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 06 Apr 2018 17:57:57 -0000 VG9tIC0NCg0KVGhhbnggZm9yIHRoZSBzdXBwb3J0Lg0KDQpJdCBvY2N1cnMgdG8gbWUgdGhhdCB5 b3VyIGZpbHRlciBzdGlsbCBuZWVkcyBhZGp1c3RtZW50IGhvd2V2ZXIgLSBzaW5jZSB0aGVyZSB3 aWxsIGJlIGNhc2VzIHdoZW4gYSBjb21tb24gZG9jdW1lbnQgaXMgdXNlZCBmb3IgYWxsIHByb3Rv Y29scyAtIGFuZCBpbiBzdWNoIGEgY2FzZSB5b3UgY2FuIG9ubHkgZXhwZWN0ICItbHNyLSIgdG8g YmUgaW4gdGhlIHRpdGxlLg0KDQpNeSBwb2ludCBpcyB0aGVyZSBzaG91bGQgYmUgYSBzdHJhaWdo dGZvcndhcmQgd2F5IHRvIGlkZW50aWZ5IHRoZSBzY29wZSBvZiB0aGUgY29udGVudCBmcm9tIHRo ZSBuYW1lIC0ganVzdCB1c2luZyAiLWxzci0iIGZvciBhbGwgZG9jdW1lbnRzIGlzIHZlcnkgc3Vi LW9wdGltYWwgLSBhbmQgdGhlIGZpeCBmb3IgdGhpcyBpcyB2ZXJ5IGVhc3kuDQoNCiAgIExlcw0K DQoNCj4gLS0tLS1PcmlnaW5hbCBNZXNzYWdlLS0tLS0NCj4gRnJvbTogdC5wZXRjaCA8aWV0ZmNA YnRjb25uZWN0LmNvbT4NCj4gU2VudDogRnJpZGF5LCBBcHJpbCAwNiwgMjAxOCAzOjQzIEFNDQo+ IFRvOiBMZXMgR2luc2JlcmcgKGdpbnNiZXJnKSA8Z2luc2JlcmdAY2lzY28uY29tPjsgQ2hyaXN0 aWFuIEhvcHBzDQo+IDxjaG9wcHNAY2hvcHBzLm9yZz4NCj4gQ2M6IGxzckBpZXRmLm9yZzsgQWNl ZSBMaW5kZW0gKGFjZWUpIDxhY2VlQGNpc2NvLmNvbT4NCj4gU3ViamVjdDogUmU6IFtMc3JdIEZX OiBOZXcgVmVyc2lvbiBOb3RpZmljYXRpb24gZm9yIGRyYWZ0LWdpbnNiZXJnLWlzaXMtDQo+IHJm Yzc4MTBiaXMtMDAudHh0DQo+IA0KPiAtLS0tLSBPcmlnaW5hbCBNZXNzYWdlIC0tLS0tDQo+IEZy b206ICJMZXMgR2luc2JlcmcgKGdpbnNiZXJnKSIgPGdpbnNiZXJnQGNpc2NvLmNvbT4NCj4gU2Vu dDogVGh1cnNkYXksIEFwcmlsIDA1LCAyMDE4IDU6MjYgUE0NCj4gDQo+ID4gQ2hyaXMgLQ0KPiA+ DQo+ID4gPiAtLS0tLU9yaWdpbmFsIE1lc3NhZ2UtLS0tLQ0KPiA+ID4gRnJvbTogQ2hyaXN0aWFu IEhvcHBzIDxjaG9wcHNAY2hvcHBzLm9yZz4NCj4gPiA+IFNlbnQ6IFRodXJzZGF5LCBBcHJpbCAw NSwgMjAxOCA3OjMyIEFNDQo+ID4gPg0KPiA+ID4gSSB0aGluayB0aGF0IHRoZSBvbmx5IHRpbWUg d2Ugc2hvdWxkIGluY2x1ZGUgdGhlIHByb3RvY29sIChpbg0KPiBhZGRpdGlvbiB0byAnLWxzci0n KQ0KPiA+ID4gaXMgaWYgd2UgaGF2ZSBzcGxpdCBkb2N1bWVudHMgKGZvciB3aGF0ZXZlciByZWFz b24pIG9uIHRoZSBzYW1lDQo+IHNvbHV0aW9uLg0KPiA+ID4gV2UgaGF2ZSBhbiBleGFtcGxlIG9m IHRoaXMgYWN0dWFsbHk6DQo+ID4gPg0KPiA+ID4gICAgIGRyYWZ0LWlldGYteHh4eC1zZWdtZW50 LXJvdXRpbmctbXNkLTA5DQo+ID4gPiAgICAgZHJhZnQtaWV0Zi1vc3BmLXNlZ21lbnQtcm91dGlu Zy1tc2QtMDkNCj4gPiA+DQo+ID4gPiBHb2luZyBmb3J3YXJkIHdlIGVpdGhlciBjb21iaW5lIHRo ZXNlIHR5cGVzIG9mIGRvY3VtZW50cyBpbnRvIGENCj4gc2luZ2xlDQo+ID4gPiBkb2N1bWVudCAo ZGlzY3Vzc2lvbiBzdGFydGVkIEAxMDEpIHNvICItbHNyLSIgaXMgYXBwcm9wcmlhdGUsIG9yIGlm DQo+IHRoZXJlJ3MNCj4gPiA+IHNvbWUgcmVhc29uIG5vdCB0byBtZXJnZSB0aGVtIHRoZW4gd2Ug aGF2ZSAyIGRvY3VtZW50cyB0aGF0IG5lZWQNCj4gdGhlDQo+ID4gPiBwcm90b2NvbCBpZGVudGlm aWVyIHRvIGRpc2FtYmlndWF0ZS4NCj4gPiA+DQo+ID4gPiBJbiB0aGlzIGNhc2UgdGhlcmUncyBu byBhbWJpZ3VpdHkgc28gSSBkb24ndCBzZWUgdGhlIG5lZWQgb2YgYWRkaW5nDQo+IGFuIGV4dHJh ICItDQo+ID4gPiBpc2lzLSIuDQo+ID4gW0xlczpdIFJGQyA3ODEwIGlzIHh4eHggc3BlY2lmaWMu DQo+ID4gVGhlcmUgaXMgYSBzZXBhcmF0ZSBkb2N1bWVudCBmb3IgZXF1aXZhbGVudCBPU1BGIGZ1 bmN0aW9uYWxpdHkgKFJGQw0KPiA3NDcxKS4NCj4gPg0KPiA+IE15IHBvaW50IGlzIC0gdGhlIHJl YWRlciBzaG91bGQgbm90IGhhdmUgdG8gZ28gdGhyb3VnaCB0aGUgYm9keSBvZiB0aGUNCj4gZG9j dW1lbnQgdG8gZmluZCBvdXQgdGhhdCB0aGUgZG9jdW1lbnQgaXMgc3BlY2lmaWMgdG8gYSBwYXJ0 aWN1bGFyIHByb3RvY29sLg0KPiBUaGUgZG9jdW1lbnQgbmFtZSAod2hpY2ggaXMgcHJlc2VydmVk IGluIHRoZSB0ZXh0IGV2ZW4gd2hlbiBpdCBiZWNvbWVzDQo+IGFuIFJGQykgc2hvdWxkIG1ha2Ug dGhhdCBjbGVhci4NCj4gPg0KPiANCj4gSSBhZ3JlZS4NCj4gDQo+IEZyb20gYSBwdXJlbHkgcGVy c29uYWwgcG9pbnQgb2YgdmlldywgSSB0cmFjayBPU1BGIGJ1dCBoYXZlIG5vIGludGVyZXN0IGlu IHRoZQ0KPiBvdGhlciBwcm90b2NvbCAobWVudGlvbiBvZiB3aGljaCBjYXVzZXMgbXkgSVNQIHRv IGJsYWNraG9sZSBteSBlLW1haWwpLiAgSQ0KPiBmaWx0ZXIgdGhlIEktRCBhbm5vdW5jZSBsaXN0 IGFuZCB3aWxsIHNlZSBub3RpZmljYXRpb24gb2YgYW55IEktRCB3aXRoIE9TUEYgaW4gdGhlDQo+ IHRpdGxlIC0gYW55IHdpdGhvdXQgT1NQRiBpbiB0aGUgdGl0bGUgd2lsbCBwYXNzIHVuZGVyIHRo ZSByYWRhci4NCj4gDQo+IFRvbSBQZXRjaA0KPiANCj4gPiAgICBMZXMNCj4gPg0KPiA+ID4gVGhh bmtzLA0KPiA+ID4gQ2hyaXMuDQo+ID4gPg0KPiA+ID4gTGVzIEdpbnNiZXJnIChnaW5zYmVyZykg PGdpbnNiZXJnQGNpc2NvLmNvbT4gd3JpdGVzOg0KPiA+ID4NCj4gPiA+ID4gV2VsbC4uLnRoaXMg cmFpc2VzIGEgdG9waWMgb24gd2hpY2ggSSB3b3VsZCBsaWtlIHRvIGhhdmUgZmVlZGJhY2sNCj4g ZnJvbSB0aGUNCj4gPiA+IFdHLg0KPiA+ID4gPg0KPiA+ID4gPiBDb21iaW5pbmcgeHh4eC9PU1BG IGludG8gb25lIHdvcmtpbmcgZ3JvdXAgaXMgZmluZSAtIG5vIGFyZ3VtZW50DQo+IHRoZXJlLg0K PiA+ID4gPiBCdXQsIHdlIG5vdyBtYXkgYmUgcHJvZHVjaW5nIHR3byBjbGFzc2VzIG9mIGRvY3Vt ZW50czoNCj4gPiA+ID4NCg0K From nobody Fri Apr 6 11:03:01 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4AA30124D6C for ; 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Fri, 06 Apr 2018 11:02:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [135.227.239.108] ([66.201.62.254]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id v143sm4966551ywc.34.2018.04.06.11.02.46 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Fri, 06 Apr 2018 11:02:46 -0700 (PDT) User-Agent: Microsoft-MacOutlook/10.b.0.180311 Date: Fri, 06 Apr 2018 11:02:44 -0700 From: Jeff Tantsura To: "Acee Lindem (acee)" , "draft-ietf-ospf-segment-routing-msd-10@ietf.org" CC: "lsr@ietf.org" Message-ID: <28999534-6FAE-4FB9-B0FC-EFE819B0229F@gmail.com> Thread-Topic: [Lsr] LSR WG IPR Query for "Signaling MSD (Maximum SID Depth) using OSPF" - draft-ietf-ospf-segment-routing-msd-10.txt Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="B_3605857366_1972856339" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] LSR WG IPR Query for "Signaling MSD (Maximum SID Depth) using OSPF" - draft-ietf-ospf-segment-routing-msd-10.txt X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 06 Apr 2018 18:02:50 -0000 > This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. --B_3605857366_1972856339 Content-type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Hi Acee, =20 I=E2=80=99m aware of the IPR and it has been disclosed in compliance with IETF IP= R rules. https://datatracker.ietf.org/ipr/3040/ =20 Thanks! Cheers, Jeff From: Lsr on behalf of "Acee Lindem (acee)" Date: Thursday, April 5, 2018 at 18:22 To: "draft-ietf-ospf-segment-routing-msd-10@ietf.org" Cc: "lsr@ietf.org" Subject: [Lsr] LSR WG IPR Query for "Signaling MSD (Maximum SID Depth) usin= g OSPF" - draft-ietf-ospf-segment-routing-msd-10.txt =20 Authors,=20 =20 Are you aware of any IPR that applies to draft-ietf-ospf-segment-routing-ms= d-10.txt? If so, has this IPR been disclosed in compliance with IETF IPR rules (see R= FCs 3979, 4879, 3669 and 5378 for more details). =20 If you are listed as a document author or contributor please respond to thi= s email regardless of whether or not you are aware of any relevant IPR. *The= response needs to be sent to the LSR WG mailing list.* The document will no= t advance to the next stage until a response has been received from each aut= hor and contributor. =20 If you are on the LSR WG email list but are not listed as an author or cont= ributor, then please explicitly respond only if you are aware of any IPR tha= t has not yet been disclosed in conformance with IETF rules. =20 Thanks, Acee=20 _______________________________________________ Lsr mailing list Lsr@ietf.o= rg https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr=20 --B_3605857366_1972856339 Content-type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable

Hi Acee,

&n= bsp;

I=E2=80=99m= aware of the IPR and it has been disclosed in compliance with IETF IPR rule= s.

https://datatracker.ietf.org/= ipr/3040/

 

Thanks!

Cheers,

Jeff

From: Lsr <lsr-bou= nces@ietf.org> on behalf of "Acee Lindem (acee)" <acee@cisco= .com>
Date: Thursday, April 5, 2018 at 18:22
To: &quo= t;draft-ietf-ospf-segment-routing-msd-10@ietf.org" <draft-ietf-ospf-= segment-routing-msd-10@ietf.org>
Cc: "lsr@ietf.org" &= lt;lsr@ietf.org>
Subject: [Lsr] LSR WG IPR Query for "Sign= aling MSD (Maximum SID Depth) using OSPF" - draft-ietf-ospf-segment-rou= ting-msd-10.txt

 

<= a name=3D"_MailOriginalBody">Authors,

 

Are you aware of any IPR that applies to draft-ietf-ospf-segme= nt-routing-msd-10.txt?

If so,= has this IPR been disclosed in compliance with IETF IPR rules (see RFCs 397= 9, 4879, 3669 and 5378 for more details).

 

If you ar= e listed as a document author or contributor please respond to this email re= gardless of whether or not you are aware of any relevant IPR. *The response = needs to be sent to the LSR WG mailing list.* The document will not advance = to the next stage until a response has been received from each author and co= ntributor.

 =

If you are on the LSR WG email list but = are not listed as an author or contributor, then please explicitly respond o= nly if you are aware of any IPR that has not yet been disclosed in conforman= ce with IETF rules.

 

Thanks,

Acee

_______________________________________________ Lsr mailing list Lsr@ietf.o= rg https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr

--B_3605857366_1972856339-- From nobody Fri Apr 6 11:05:59 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1C8D6126DFB for ; Fri, 6 Apr 2018 11:05:58 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.401 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.401 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, FREEMAIL_FORGED_FROMDOMAIN=0.25, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.249, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id oJ3uMeUZ2IdG for ; Fri, 6 Apr 2018 11:05:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-wr0-f178.google.com (mail-wr0-f178.google.com [209.85.128.178]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 43AAE124D68 for ; Fri, 6 Apr 2018 11:05:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-wr0-f178.google.com with SMTP id l49so2542359wrl.4 for ; Fri, 06 Apr 2018 11:05:55 -0700 (PDT) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=F+2bcmFzNjBHVTkVhjRFVWAwfHBMmYpCHG8vmebIz+o=; b=sL+ZGi5xrA56VG7gXvXptgq0a7FXvPqiD3GMqqNFCmcJwoCx5ZBRdVCNwmBP4R7ah0 O301Qgq7sVBoIslr8+EBaA/S+ueyaf9KWVP/WIkjJxmGfuBGpwo8iE8OsV9Et4Js9yG6 9Se510Uv9rh2TH4+/keYr+HGBIKv9kVyYOvgj3sJmziKCo9nY9xl/FpWEbuNP+EX9NXD lswFyd9ITB2xvIR/JWEqmO4k5UlbBYR5WuXgXrxlanlwsfXt9Gnd9TNbGR7DPMAfCkuT 8mINoteKgY1XEViDy/tbVmTWloo8o+mguBAuApB1BOhoqASvYzbB2D6+axAZL8KQEcjd pm7g== X-Gm-Message-State: AElRT7Hyf4a6UM2w7jlzEAn72AJqKZiDqKmd0hJqVEp6h9vzd2Pzr317 0EY8gHtutigXPTXs2IBnSeIccHRJzwwNg5DKnRk= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AIpwx4+XGCn/uis6kzHxhgVJIv4mG8GCjSwL35qIgdGSAW7cfTocp69NBDkkGqPO5ec9VJHcGUR+GKW5V/yxrTW5MAo= X-Received: by 10.223.210.76 with SMTP id o12mr20479422wri.93.1523037953306; Fri, 06 Apr 2018 11:05:53 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <152216649041.5234.6342137041063769692.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> <7D2C1874-8B55-45B1-8C5F-D4C9C1F47D11@tony.li> <5AC78AE5.8020707@cisco.com> <6E69B9E3-14A6-4EED-BBE4-F5A424D57787@tony.li> <5AC79740.6060205@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: From: Robert Raszuk Date: Fri, 06 Apr 2018 18:05:42 +0000 Message-ID: To: Rob Shakir Cc: Peter Psenak , lsr@ietf.org, tony.li@tony.li Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="f4f5e80f0c202fb652056931e871" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-li-dynamic-flooding-04.txt X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 06 Apr 2018 18:05:58 -0000 --f4f5e80f0c202fb652056931e871 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I agree with Rob & Tony. Converging on single algorithm across zoo of vendors is not going to happen bearing in mind that every single change to such algorithm will require a massive 1000s nodes software upgrade each time. Note that even if IETF converges industry may not and that is a practical aspect. With current proposal this is just one time upgrade. Thx, R. On Fri, Apr 6, 2018, 18:02 Rob Shakir wrote: > Peter, > > How do we transition between algorithms in the approach that you suggest? > Do all non-stub devices need to be upgraded to support the new algorithm > before such time as we can use it? (I think so, because otherwise some > non-stub device cannot be guaranteed to flood to its downstream stub > devices - so we may end up isolating some devices if any device transitio= ns > before all nodes support it). > > The advantage of having something advertised is that one can compute it > centrally - and keep the per-node functionality simply obeying the > advertised flooding graph. From an operational perspective, this means th= at > one can introduce new experimental flooding topology computation approach= es > in a manner that is decoupled from needing to do software upgrades across > the whole network. I can also implement non-standard flooding topology > computations based on the network topology which could be only applicable > to that particular network (consider if I wanted to do something like tak= e > into account shared-risk information in the algorithm to allow the > most-SRLG disjoint flooding topology or so). > > This is in addition to the points Tony made. I think this > centralised-computation-and-flooded approach is elegant. If the error > handling behaviour for not being able to parse the flooding topology is t= o > revert to flooding everywhere, then it seems non-destructive too. > > Cheers, > r. > > On Fri, 6 Apr 2018 at 08:50 Peter Psenak wrote: > >> Hi Tony, >> >> if we start with a single standardized algorithm, that is easy to >> implement and deploy. We can leave the door open for additional >> algorithms to be defined later together with the selection mechanism. >> >> I have the feeling that the dependency of the "flooding topology" on the >> flooded data is going to bring more complexity, than the selection of >> the distributed algorithm to be used, if we ever need to support more >> then one. >> >> thanks, >> Peter >> >> >> On 06/04/18 17:19 , tony.li@tony.li wrote: >> > >> > Hi Peter, >> > >> > Thank you for your comments. >> > >> >> while I appreciate the flexibility associated with the centralized >> >> computation of the flooding topology, it has some drawbacks as well: >> >> >> >> 1. "flooding topology" must be flooded. This makes the flooding >> >> dependent on the flooded data itself. >> > >> > >> > Absolutely true. If the computation of the topology is incorrect, that >> > would certainly be a bug. >> > >> > >> >> 2. The extra flooding of "flooding topology" adds some delay in the >> >> convergence towards the new "flooding topology=E2=80=9D. >> > >> > >> > Since we distribute the flooding topology before there are topology >> > failures, it would seem like the latency is not a significant concern. >> > >> > >> >> Have you considered the distributed computation of "flooding topology= " >> >> using some standardized algorithm? >> > >> > >> > Yes, Kireeti raised this in London as well. There are some practical >> > issues with this. How do we ever converge on an algorithm? >> > >> > There are many perspectives on what an adequate flooding topology migh= t >> > be. Different administrations have different considerations and risk >> > tolerances. >> > >> > Debugging is going to be more challenging, as inconsistencies between >> > two nodes with different ideas of the topology will be difficult to >> > detect until there is a catastrophic failure. >> > >> > I=E2=80=99m trying to do something practical, and it seems like doing = this in a >> > centralized fashion is the quickest, easiest, and most robust way >> forward. >> > >> > >> >> Eventually we can support multiple standardized algorithms. A node ca= n >> >> advertise support for several algorithms and the "active" algorithm i= s >> >> selected based on some criteria that would guarantee that all nodes i= n >> >> the flooding domain select the same one. >> > >> > >> > Seems like that would also require some administrative input. >> > >> > So, I agree that that=E2=80=99s a technical possibility, but I think t= hat >> > there=E2=80=99s significant problems in making that work. I prefer to = focus on >> > something that we can implement more quickly. >> > >> > Tony >> > >> > >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Lsr mailing list >> Lsr@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr >> > _______________________________________________ > Lsr mailing list > Lsr@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr > --f4f5e80f0c202fb652056931e871 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I agree with Rob & Tony.

<= div dir=3D"auto">Converging on single algorithm across zoo of vendors is no= t going to happen bearing in mind that every single change to such algorith= m will require a massive 1000s nodes software upgrade each time.=C2=A0

Note that even if IETF conve= rges industry may not and that is a practical aspect.

With current proposal this is just one time u= pgrade.

Thx,
R.

O= n Fri, Apr 6, 2018, 18:02 Rob Shakir <rjs@rob.sh> wrote:
Peter,

How = do we transition between algorithms in the approach that you suggest? Do al= l non-stub devices need to be upgraded to support the new algorithm before = such time as we can use it? (I think so, because otherwise some non-stub de= vice cannot be guaranteed to flood to its downstream stub devices - so we m= ay end up isolating some devices if any device transitions before all nodes= support it).=C2=A0

The advantage of having someth= ing advertised is that one can compute it centrally - and keep the per-node= functionality simply obeying the advertised flooding graph. From an operat= ional perspective, this means that one can introduce new experimental flood= ing topology computation approaches in a manner that is decoupled from need= ing to do software upgrades across the whole network. I can also implement = non-standard flooding topology computations based on the network topology w= hich could be only applicable to that particular network (consider if I wan= ted to do something like take into account shared-risk information in the a= lgorithm to allow the most-SRLG disjoint flooding topology or so).

This is in addition to the points Tony made. I think this = centralised-computation-and-flooded approach is elegant. If the error handl= ing behaviour for not being able to parse the flooding topology is to rever= t to flooding everywhere, then it seems non-destructive too.

=
Cheers,
r.=C2=A0

On Fri, 6 Apr 2018 at 08:50 Peter Psenak <ppsenak@= cisco.com> wrote:
Hi Tony,=

if we start with a single standardized algorithm, that is easy to
implement and deploy. We can leave the door open for additional
algorithms to be defined later together with the selection mechanism.

I have the feeling that the dependency of the "flooding topology"= on the
flooded data is going to bring more complexity, than the selection of
the distributed algorithm to be used, if we ever need to support more
then one.

thanks,
Peter


On 06/04/18 17:19 , tony.li@tony.li wrote:
>
> Hi Peter,
>
> Thank you for your comments.
>
>> while I appreciate the flexibility associated with the centralized=
>> computation of the flooding topology, it has some drawbacks as wel= l:
>>
>> 1. "flooding topology" must be flooded. This makes the f= looding
>> dependent on the flooded data itself.
>
>
> Absolutely true. If the computation of the topology is incorrect, that=
> would certainly be a bug.
>
>
>> 2. The extra flooding of "flooding topology" adds some d= elay in the
>> convergence towards the new "flooding topology=E2=80=9D.
>
>
> Since we distribute the flooding topology before there are topology > failures, it would seem like the latency is not a significant concern.=
>
>
>> Have you considered the distributed computation of "flooding = topology"
>> using some standardized algorithm?
>
>
> Yes, Kireeti raised this in London as well. There are some practical > issues with this. How do we ever converge on an algorithm?
>
> There are many perspectives on what an adequate flooding topology migh= t
> be. Different administrations have different considerations and risk > tolerances.
>
> Debugging is going to be more challenging, as inconsistencies between<= br> > two nodes with different ideas of the topology will be difficult to > detect until there is a catastrophic failure.
>
> I=E2=80=99m trying to do something practical, and it seems like doing = this in a
> centralized fashion is the quickest, easiest, and most robust way forw= ard.
>
>
>> Eventually we can support multiple standardized algorithms. A node= can
>> advertise support for several algorithms and the "active"= ; algorithm is
>> selected based on some criteria that would guarantee that all node= s in
>> the flooding domain select the same one.
>
>
> Seems like that would also require some administrative input.
>
> So, I agree that that=E2=80=99s a technical possibility, but I think t= hat
> there=E2=80=99s significant problems in making that work. I prefer to = focus on
> something that we can implement more quickly.
>
> Tony
>
>

_______________________________________________
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https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr
_______________________________________________
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Lsr@ie= tf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr --f4f5e80f0c202fb652056931e871-- From nobody Fri Apr 6 11:49:38 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BCA651274D2; Fri, 6 Apr 2018 11:49:37 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.998 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.998 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, UNPARSEABLE_RELAY=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 70UTVx0iZfQm; Fri, 6 Apr 2018 11:49:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-oi0-x241.google.com (mail-oi0-x241.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4003:c06::241]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id C2BA91273E2; Fri, 6 Apr 2018 11:49:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-oi0-x241.google.com with SMTP id f63-v6so1971017oic.4; Fri, 06 Apr 2018 11:49:28 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=from:mime-version:date:message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=SsP/hmknfBHKYgbi8zcwp03eWpasT6yCiZ4/4YxWZws=; b=ODJfGUo0EpbzokV1VzUGgIB7xlZ9Lxo0meZVdbFDAQiJyNkNZ4MCYmOB9jkrLTzhyR DrACdSmqwirxxVXCC9On6Z21w4QbmoCcBMcjwAh8vxpGmiUvrcrQGUvQUdQA8iDiWwRy x69z02mx+bXla5WhgD2Sg6szepLqZVpjcsPcUgG4+QoB83C/B2+G7EsTkMwiDhRlGvC5 ISfzN+JzNjUowsN8WTcNTbEee4N4IwfJfjbdJVlnYppPapsnJVBSsOLFSHMyeAE5FzlG 3N9vulc4aMtYoW33xyPdXpqeoDQFTWTWzLZ/urLAVk7soWEwNo9Ql6c9XKWd3CcLW2G+ HKNw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:mime-version:date:message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=SsP/hmknfBHKYgbi8zcwp03eWpasT6yCiZ4/4YxWZws=; b=aLRN9l2gPh6Gro7siX0EYaKME9HpkOp1TVPF8jZcB8QCkmpzRTVLhOcPT6bNwRwmFy 1QZ7naMnKgSTdSheZJk2sHnXmwIOhLAVa9KDB/f/3IKEzQ2VlNy1aJsjRbsMW6IdhJjP O2TbjRvirGfYTj0DnyPGcRKugZVJiBLac1WneNPoY6npX9G27q6mjfkOx9+u18+rmRB3 ZYQ0Kom52YFN5shEgEWOMxzA3ZQr3n7MRl8Iel5k7j4tInuQ+lc07DbiVpci/1RN5Vfd nfvqHYXPa/eOPoIHHntRHiDKXpTEIq0IZNefdvy2IB1VtDX8kYKka5VRikeUUKY1deFI cNfw== X-Gm-Message-State: ALQs6tCiXrKhUgmraKj4Z6OswDXOLFDVHVysmOYfBeXO9nWXyQHkkAs/ j0E1MyjAf1NuPfhE8Sj4UdA0wcSNHxR69xvp6Do= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AIpwx4/Qh/sGCwGi0xm2fy9lFdzKMdnNjcOWLjiuL1jkpqlsCzCtjo++RDloNxJhEfX/PRjoDtEbkk1ihI9KW5gNj2A= X-Received: by 2002:aca:3403:: with SMTP id b3-v6mr4677502oia.229.1523040568037; Fri, 06 Apr 2018 11:49:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from 1058052472880 named unknown by gmailapi.google.com with HTTPREST; Fri, 6 Apr 2018 11:49:27 -0700 From: Alvaro Retana X-Mailer: Airmail (467) MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Fri, 6 Apr 2018 11:49:27 -0700 Message-ID: To: lsr@ietf.org Cc: draft-ietf-ospf-link-overload@ietf.org, lsr-chairs@ietf.org, "Acee Lindem (acee) (acee@cisco.com)" Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000000954ef0569328432" Archived-At: Subject: [Lsr] Implementations of draft-ietf-ospf-link-overload X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 06 Apr 2018 18:49:38 -0000 --0000000000000954ef0569328432 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Dear lsr WG: draft-ietf-ospf-link-overload [1] defines a new BGP-LS Graceful-Link-Shutdown TLV. When an early allocation was requested, it was mistakenly requested from the "BGP-LS NLRI-Types" registry [2], not from the "BGP-LS Node Descriptor, Link Descriptor, Prefix Descriptor, and Attribute TLVs=E2=80=9D registry [3]. IANA allocated a value according to = the request: 1101. The mistake wasn't noticed until the document was in IESG Evaluation -- we are in the process of correcting it. However, the 1101 code point is already allocated [*] in the "BGP-LS Node Descriptor, Link Descriptor, Prefix Descriptor, and Attribute TLVs=E2=80=9D registry, so a different val= ue is needed - the current suggested value is 1121. Are there implementations of draft-ietf-ospf-link-overload with the 1101 code point? Are there deployments of those implementations? What will be the impact of changing the value to 1121? Thanks! Alvaro. [*] The 1101 code point in the "BGP-LS Node Descriptor, Link Descriptor, Prefix Descriptor, and Attribute TLVs=E2=80=9D registry corresponds to the Peer-Node-SID, an early allocation made to draft-ietf-idr-bgpls-segment-routing-epe [4], which says that "several early implementations exist". [1] https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-ospf-link-overload/ [2] https://www.iana.org/assignments/bgp-ls-parameters/bgp-ls-parameters.xhtml#= nlri-types [3] https://www.iana.org/assignments/bgp-ls-parameters/bgp-ls-parameters.xhtml#= node-descriptor-link-descriptor-prefix-descriptor-attribute-tlv [4] https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-idr-bgpls-segment-routing-epe/ --0000000000000954ef0569328432 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable =
Dear l= sr WG:

draft-ietf-ospf-link-overloa= d [1] defines a new BGP-LS Graceful-Link-Shutdown TLV.=C2=A0 When an early = allocation was requested, it was mistakenly requested from the "BGP-LS= NLRI-Types" registry [2], not from the "BGP-LS Node Descriptor, = Link Descriptor, Prefix Descriptor, and Attribute TLVs=E2=80=9D registry [3= ].=C2=A0 IANA allocated a value according to the request: 1101.

The mistake wasn't noticed until the docum= ent was in IESG Evaluation -- we are in the process of correcting it.=C2=A0= However, the 1101 code point is already allocated [*] in the "BGP-LS = Node Descriptor, Link Descriptor, Prefix Descriptor, and Attribute TLVs=E2= =80=9D registry, so a different value is needed - the current suggested val= ue is 1121.

Are there implementatio= ns of draft-ietf-ospf-link-overload with the 1101 code point?=C2=A0 Are the= re deployments of those implementations?=C2=A0 What will be the impact of c= hanging the value to 1121? =C2=A0

Thanks!

<= div id=3D"bloop_customfont" style=3D"margin:0px">Alvaro.

[*] The 1101 code point in the "BGP-LS Node Desc= riptor, Link Descriptor, Prefix Descriptor, and Attribute TLVs=E2=80=9D reg= istry corresponds to the Peer-Node-SID, an early allocation made to draft-i= etf-idr-bgpls-segment-routing-epe [4], which says that "several early = implementations exist".


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"t.petch" , Christian Hopps CC: "lsr@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [Lsr] FW: New Version Notification for draft-ginsberg-isis-rfc7810bis-00.txt Thread-Index: AQHTy1pTDYQOpMXw80qZxNEhmGwTFaPw/uwggAGDMACAAB/zgIAA8ADNgAC73ID//9VKgA== Date: Fri, 6 Apr 2018 19:25:01 +0000 Message-ID: <91F6295C-E0FA-4BAE-8CC1-2FCD60F6B8FE@cisco.com> References: <303B9428-1EF5-417C-8223-DCB34440677B@cisco.com> <69468450ae0141098f7579d630b9cd33@XCH-ALN-001.cisco.com> <87h8op911x.fsf@chopps.org> <80eda7a4488a421b90027a702b2440d0@XCH-ALN-001.cisco.com> <041f01d3cd94$4d3eede0$4001a8c0@gateway.2wire.net> <3d9104924be14e699317af63b903d54e@XCH-ALN-001.cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <3d9104924be14e699317af63b903d54e@XCH-ALN-001.cisco.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted x-originating-ip: [10.116.152.200] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-ID: 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ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id AQ3r2ZILuyM6 for ; Fri, 6 Apr 2018 14:27:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-pf0-x231.google.com (mail-pf0-x231.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400e:c00::231]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id C6A281201F8 for ; Fri, 6 Apr 2018 14:27:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-pf0-x231.google.com with SMTP id g14so1634553pfh.3 for ; Fri, 06 Apr 2018 14:27:29 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:subject:from:in-reply-to:date:cc :content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references:to; bh=0g6a6fR6YUvF0gVfWsXF2WegkrjWVFpy6dchek06vLE=; b=ofdKNE2xFbjHYARGjxOGGZsXZw7VbdqGGwBe2EdZ4c+GPkCPVNY80iAao2PeQcRgFy 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X-Google-Smtp-Source: AIpwx49B+TgxhZ+glP+Gff8MDEnaqaEmD3O7AkAv0kwxDWqvc2TDhvk4Sr840sPPjuKxWwdZFGtZFA== X-Received: by 10.98.12.140 with SMTP id 12mr21647735pfm.123.1523050049075; Fri, 06 Apr 2018 14:27:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [10.11.12.176] ([66.201.62.254]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id y6sm4934725pfg.121.2018.04.06.14.27.28 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Fri, 06 Apr 2018 14:27:28 -0700 (PDT) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (1.0) From: Jeff Tantsura X-Mailer: iPhone Mail (15D100) In-Reply-To: <91F6295C-E0FA-4BAE-8CC1-2FCD60F6B8FE@cisco.com> Date: Fri, 6 Apr 2018 14:27:27 -0700 Cc: "Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)" , "t.petch" , Christian Hopps , "lsr@ietf.org" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <533A6AB9-F507-4075-B8F2-B8A05D2FA098@gmail.com> References: <303B9428-1EF5-417C-8223-DCB34440677B@cisco.com> <69468450ae0141098f7579d630b9cd33@XCH-ALN-001.cisco.com> <87h8op911x.fsf@chopps.org> <80eda7a4488a421b90027a702b2440d0@XCH-ALN-001.cisco.com> <041f01d3cd94$4d3eede0$4001a8c0@gateway.2wire.net> <3d9104924be14e699317af63b903d54e@XCH-ALN-001.cisco.com> <91F6295C-E0FA-4BAE-8CC1-2FCD60F6B8FE@cisco.com> To: "Acee Lindem (acee)" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] FW: New Version Notification for draft-ginsberg-isis-rfc7810bis-00.txt X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 06 Apr 2018 21:27:32 -0000 +1 Regards, Jeff > On Apr 6, 2018, at 12:25, Acee Lindem (acee) wrote: >=20 > I'm fine with the proposed naming conventions for new drafts. Formally:=20= >=20 > -lsr-ospf- - OSPF Specific drafts > -lsr-isis- - IS-IS Specific draf= ts=20 > -lsr- - Drafts covering b= oth protocols.=20 >=20 > Anyone strongly disagree?=20 >=20 > Thanks, > Acee=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > =EF=BB=BFOn 4/6/18, 1:57 PM, "Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)" wrote: >=20 > Tom - >=20 > Thanx for the support. >=20 > It occurs to me that your filter still needs adjustment however - since= there will be cases when a common document is used for all protocols - and i= n such a case you can only expect "-lsr-" to be in the title. >=20 > My point is there should be a straightforward way to identify the scope= of the content from the name - just using "-lsr-" for all documents is very= sub-optimal - and the fix for this is very easy. >=20 > Les >=20 >=20 >> -----Original Message----- >> From: t.petch >> Sent: Friday, April 06, 2018 3:43 AM >> To: Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) ; Christian Hopps >> >> Cc: lsr@ietf.org; Acee Lindem (acee) >> Subject: Re: [Lsr] FW: New Version Notification for draft-ginsberg-isis- >> rfc7810bis-00.txt >>=20 >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)" >> Sent: Thursday, April 05, 2018 5:26 PM >>=20 >>> Chris - >>>=20 >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: Christian Hopps >>>> Sent: Thursday, April 05, 2018 7:32 AM >>>>=20 >>>> I think that the only time we should include the protocol (in >> addition to '-lsr-') >>>> is if we have split documents (for whatever reason) on the same >> solution. >>>> We have an example of this actually: >>>>=20 >>>> draft-ietf-xxxx-segment-routing-msd-09 >>>> draft-ietf-ospf-segment-routing-msd-09 >>>>=20 >>>> Going forward we either combine these types of documents into a >> single >>>> document (discussion started @101) so "-lsr-" is appropriate, or if >> there's >>>> some reason not to merge them then we have 2 documents that need >> the >>>> protocol identifier to disambiguate. >>>>=20 >>>> In this case there's no ambiguity so I don't see the need of adding >> an extra "- >>>> isis-". >>> [Les:] RFC 7810 is xxxx specific. >>> There is a separate document for equivalent OSPF functionality (RFC >> 7471). >>>=20 >>> My point is - the reader should not have to go through the body of the >> document to find out that the document is specific to a particular protoc= ol. >> The document name (which is preserved in the text even when it becomes >> an RFC) should make that clear. >>>=20 >>=20 >> I agree. >>=20 >> =46rom a purely personal point of view, I track OSPF but have no interest= in the >> other protocol (mention of which causes my ISP to blackhole my e-mail). I= >> filter the I-D announce list and will see notification of any I-D with OS= PF in the >> title - any without OSPF in the title will pass under the radar. >>=20 >> Tom Petch >>=20 >>> Les >>>=20 >>>> Thanks, >>>> Chris. >>>>=20 >>>> Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) writes: >>>>=20 >>>>> Well...this raises a topic on which I would like to have feedback >> from the >>>> WG. >>>>>=20 >>>>> Combining xxxx/OSPF into one working group is fine - no argument >> there. >>>>> But, we now may be producing two classes of documents: >>>>>=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > _______________________________________________ > Lsr mailing list > Lsr@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr From nobody Fri Apr 6 14:29:42 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 06CC9120721 for ; Fri, 6 Apr 2018 14:29:42 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id D4HHGE-LkFDY for ; Fri, 6 Apr 2018 14:29:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-pl0-x22f.google.com (mail-pl0-x22f.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400e:c01::22f]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 7F3C71201F8 for ; Fri, 6 Apr 2018 14:29:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-pl0-x22f.google.com with SMTP id 61-v6so1395606plb.2 for ; Fri, 06 Apr 2018 14:29:39 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:subject:from:in-reply-to:date:cc :content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references:to; bh=SUZGCrdMUXbgRN1l6Fv4rL8ZlRwhENE7TAEhsjYJDIk=; b=eH9TD3JZ7SkhMwfHLEadX+nbmEVVctLTNLo8zjTQ/d/15K+uRpWT8VU9NPrniqSej5 /A6eYa0RKJzHwzr+0n2SJ73QXeqjnokriQkNwRFC5I5uCv2EIoF/90kawtER0+dKuOfq YIYIYLkV5TOPGWyIFdxewJzPlOK37LwAmkAg+9WYp7yDhrQ/dCL8a69KnSHOAh1AKhC7 898oY4wOujHzoUorAMEdgl7jY8h6axNLuP6AenPRXd3kySrpIUanDFwGRJdK+1sx99sf Eh54cPCLt6NOneM/teD/d5ZL/3sNtzQunT5waXxA87uQJAbL6V/EV89Lo3/Z0pqBQna2 Do9w== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:subject:from:in-reply-to:date:cc :content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references:to; bh=SUZGCrdMUXbgRN1l6Fv4rL8ZlRwhENE7TAEhsjYJDIk=; b=HP0uUJBHcBCBakhpeygCvxXnu1WqoXaJYtFGysYvAgIkCLElyOPissVDQmgY2EH7iS 261VPuDOL5WrI6JS9Ky/r3vzLcOUxYPw2/hvNlFBgVWb3amsTAx1U408UPso5yIiD9Ph +Nr/tedUEKX1F42gtbOC69mDpikI83oxZQx+GodCzzZJnyVM7w4lrtpCRi0FILdM6qX9 zI8buIMN0HW7UAuBLj7ATZeelWCeadOmHL+R2zN7P6bvbPscV51diJEUaDLg1L+wGuB9 JD55bRlN2Ls5VRsppouYDBmGqxw+iMlzJgmJFw0/ZvktPsSEltUy6SiHTFW5Wiqnc5kJ UPLw== X-Gm-Message-State: AElRT7HpSLH8ifI3eZ57wgg4gl8rluuVCAZMtQfnxmXpiZI7JaegHJRU 1jMWdQ1uHoxja8rcfmhU+4k= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AIpwx4/N8Ti4MlQQiWjgxHJZugndOzEfpopjmPmt9+mk6H057Y8iXbNXmgVbKlEkhK6j4YWyq2frgg== X-Received: by 2002:a17:902:24c7:: with SMTP id l7-v6mr28660243plg.320.1523050179096; Fri, 06 Apr 2018 14:29:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [10.11.12.176] ([66.201.62.254]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id l19sm18884598pgc.92.2018.04.06.14.29.37 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Fri, 06 Apr 2018 14:29:37 -0700 (PDT) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (1.0) From: Jeff Tantsura X-Mailer: iPhone Mail (15D100) In-Reply-To: <91F6295C-E0FA-4BAE-8CC1-2FCD60F6B8FE@cisco.com> Date: Fri, 6 Apr 2018 14:29:36 -0700 Cc: "Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)" , "t.petch" , Christian Hopps , "lsr@ietf.org" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <6A46ECB1-A0AD-4A94-9EDF-7EA9812B416D@gmail.com> References: <303B9428-1EF5-417C-8223-DCB34440677B@cisco.com> <69468450ae0141098f7579d630b9cd33@XCH-ALN-001.cisco.com> <87h8op911x.fsf@chopps.org> <80eda7a4488a421b90027a702b2440d0@XCH-ALN-001.cisco.com> <041f01d3cd94$4d3eede0$4001a8c0@gateway.2wire.net> <3d9104924be14e699317af63b903d54e@XCH-ALN-001.cisco.com> <91F6295C-E0FA-4BAE-8CC1-2FCD60F6B8FE@cisco.com> To: "Acee Lindem (acee)" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] FW: New Version Notification for draft-ginsberg-isis-rfc7810bis-00.txt X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 06 Apr 2018 21:29:42 -0000 Acee, What about ospfv2 vs ospfv3 specifics? We keep it as before - eg =E2=80=9Cospf=E2=80=9D covers either or ospfv2, =E2= =80=9Cospfv3=E2=80=9D is for ospfv3 only?=20 Regards, Jeff > On Apr 6, 2018, at 12:25, Acee Lindem (acee) wrote: >=20 > I'm fine with the proposed naming conventions for new drafts. Formally:=20= >=20 > -lsr-ospf- - OSPF Specific drafts > -lsr-isis- - IS-IS Specific draf= ts=20 > -lsr- - Drafts covering b= oth protocols.=20 >=20 > Anyone strongly disagree?=20 >=20 > Thanks, > Acee=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > =EF=BB=BFOn 4/6/18, 1:57 PM, "Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)" wrote: >=20 > Tom - >=20 > Thanx for the support. >=20 > It occurs to me that your filter still needs adjustment however - since= there will be cases when a common document is used for all protocols - and i= n such a case you can only expect "-lsr-" to be in the title. >=20 > My point is there should be a straightforward way to identify the scope= of the content from the name - just using "-lsr-" for all documents is very= sub-optimal - and the fix for this is very easy. >=20 > Les >=20 >=20 >> -----Original Message----- >> From: t.petch >> Sent: Friday, April 06, 2018 3:43 AM >> To: Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) ; Christian Hopps >> >> Cc: lsr@ietf.org; Acee Lindem (acee) >> Subject: Re: [Lsr] FW: New Version Notification for draft-ginsberg-isis- >> rfc7810bis-00.txt >>=20 >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)" >> Sent: Thursday, April 05, 2018 5:26 PM >>=20 >>> Chris - >>>=20 >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: Christian Hopps >>>> Sent: Thursday, April 05, 2018 7:32 AM >>>>=20 >>>> I think that the only time we should include the protocol (in >> addition to '-lsr-') >>>> is if we have split documents (for whatever reason) on the same >> solution. >>>> We have an example of this actually: >>>>=20 >>>> draft-ietf-xxxx-segment-routing-msd-09 >>>> draft-ietf-ospf-segment-routing-msd-09 >>>>=20 >>>> Going forward we either combine these types of documents into a >> single >>>> document (discussion started @101) so "-lsr-" is appropriate, or if >> there's >>>> some reason not to merge them then we have 2 documents that need >> the >>>> protocol identifier to disambiguate. >>>>=20 >>>> In this case there's no ambiguity so I don't see the need of adding >> an extra "- >>>> isis-". >>> [Les:] RFC 7810 is xxxx specific. >>> There is a separate document for equivalent OSPF functionality (RFC >> 7471). >>>=20 >>> My point is - the reader should not have to go through the body of the >> document to find out that the document is specific to a particular protoc= ol. >> The document name (which is preserved in the text even when it becomes >> an RFC) should make that clear. >>>=20 >>=20 >> I agree. >>=20 >> =46rom a purely personal point of view, I track OSPF but have no interest= in the >> other protocol (mention of which causes my ISP to blackhole my e-mail). I= >> filter the I-D announce list and will see notification of any I-D with OS= PF in the >> title - any without OSPF in the title will pass under the radar. >>=20 >> Tom Petch >>=20 >>> Les >>>=20 >>>> Thanks, >>>> Chris. >>>>=20 >>>> Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) writes: >>>>=20 >>>>> Well...this raises a topic on which I would like to have feedback >> from the >>>> WG. >>>>>=20 >>>>> Combining xxxx/OSPF into one working group is fine - no argument >> there. >>>>> But, we now may be producing two classes of documents: >>>>>=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > _______________________________________________ > Lsr mailing list > Lsr@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr From nobody Fri Apr 6 14:45:13 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EAE67120721 for ; Fri, 6 Apr 2018 14:45:11 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO 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21:45:07 +0000 Received: from XCH-RTP-001.cisco.com (xch-rtp-001.cisco.com [64.101.220.141]) by alln-core-5.cisco.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id w36Lj7oG009305 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 6 Apr 2018 21:45:07 GMT Received: from xch-rtp-015.cisco.com (64.101.220.155) by XCH-RTP-001.cisco.com (64.101.220.141) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.0.1320.4; Fri, 6 Apr 2018 17:45:07 -0400 Received: from xch-rtp-015.cisco.com ([64.101.220.155]) by XCH-RTP-015.cisco.com ([64.101.220.155]) with mapi id 15.00.1320.000; Fri, 6 Apr 2018 17:45:06 -0400 From: "Acee Lindem (acee)" To: Jeff Tantsura CC: "Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)" , "t.petch" , Christian Hopps , "lsr@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [Lsr] FW: New Version Notification for draft-ginsberg-isis-rfc7810bis-00.txt Thread-Index: AQHTy1pTDYQOpMXw80qZxNEhmGwTFaPw/uwggAGDMACAAB/zgIAA8ADNgAC73ID//9VKgIAAZd0A///BRgA= Date: Fri, 6 Apr 2018 21:45:06 +0000 Message-ID: <90CE5899-3AFE-42D9-BD5A-CC4A53BE6CC5@cisco.com> References: <303B9428-1EF5-417C-8223-DCB34440677B@cisco.com> <69468450ae0141098f7579d630b9cd33@XCH-ALN-001.cisco.com> <87h8op911x.fsf@chopps.org> <80eda7a4488a421b90027a702b2440d0@XCH-ALN-001.cisco.com> <041f01d3cd94$4d3eede0$4001a8c0@gateway.2wire.net> <3d9104924be14e699317af63b903d54e@XCH-ALN-001.cisco.com> <91F6295C-E0FA-4BAE-8CC1-2FCD60F6B8FE@cisco.com> <6A46ECB1-A0AD-4A94-9EDF-7EA9812B416D@gmail.com> In-Reply-To: <6A46ECB1-A0AD-4A94-9EDF-7EA9812B416D@gmail.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted x-originating-ip: [10.116.152.200] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-ID: <8BFC2BAED633CF429719FA777338DE65@emea.cisco.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] FW: New Version Notification for draft-ginsberg-isis-rfc7810bis-00.txt X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 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10.223.176.253 with SMTP id j58mr20219249wra.269.1523052550270; Fri, 06 Apr 2018 15:09:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [135.227.239.108] ([66.201.62.254]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id t8sm11105138wmc.20.2018.04.06.15.09.08 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Fri, 06 Apr 2018 15:09:09 -0700 (PDT) User-Agent: Microsoft-MacOutlook/10.b.0.180311 Date: Fri, 06 Apr 2018 15:09:04 -0700 From: Jeff Tantsura To: "Acee Lindem (acee)" CC: "Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)" , "t.petch" , Christian Hopps , "lsr@ietf.org" Message-ID: Thread-Topic: [Lsr] FW: New Version Notification for draft-ginsberg-isis-rfc7810bis-00.txt References: <303B9428-1EF5-417C-8223-DCB34440677B@cisco.com> <69468450ae0141098f7579d630b9cd33@XCH-ALN-001.cisco.com> <87h8op911x.fsf@chopps.org> <80eda7a4488a421b90027a702b2440d0@XCH-ALN-001.cisco.com> <041f01d3cd94$4d3eede0$4001a8c0@gateway.2wire.net> <3d9104924be14e699317af63b903d54e@XCH-ALN-001.cisco.com> <91F6295C-E0FA-4BAE-8CC1-2FCD60F6B8FE@cisco.com> <6A46ECB1-A0AD-4A94-9EDF-7EA9812B416D@gmail.com> <90CE5899-3AFE-42D9-BD5A-CC4A53BE6CC5@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <90CE5899-3AFE-42D9-BD5A-CC4A53BE6CC5@cisco.com> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] FW: New Version Notification for draft-ginsberg-isis-rfc7810bis-00.txt X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 06 Apr 2018 22:09:14 -0000 Sold! Cheers, Jeff =EF=BB=BFOn 4/6/18, 14:45, "Acee Lindem (acee)" wrote: Good point - we will expand to:=20 =20 -lsr-ospf- - OSPF Specific d= rafts pertaining to both OSPFv2 and OSPFv3 -lsr-ospfv2- - OSPFv2 only Speci= fic drafts=20 -lsr-ospfv3- - OSPFv3 only Speci= fic drafts =20 -lsr-isis- - IS-IS Specifi= c drafts -lsr- - Drafts cove= ring both protocols. =20 I'd hope the OSPFv2 and OSPFv3 specific drafts are few and far between = but I can still see reasons to have both (e.g., OSPFv2 will never support mu= ltiple address familes).=20 =20 Thanks, Acee =20 =20 =EF=BB=BFOn 4/6/18, 5:29 PM, "Jeff Tantsura" wrote: =20 Acee, =20 What about ospfv2 vs ospfv3 specifics? We keep it as before - eg =E2=80=9Cospf=E2=80=9D covers either or ospfv2, =E2=80=9Cos= pfv3=E2=80=9D is for ospfv3 only?=20 =20 Regards, Jeff =20 > On Apr 6, 2018, at 12:25, Acee Lindem (acee) wro= te: >=20 > I'm fine with the proposed naming conventions for new drafts. For= mally:=20 >=20 > -lsr-ospf- - OSPF Specific= drafts > -lsr-isis- - IS-IS Spec= ific drafts=20 > -lsr- - Drafts c= overing both protocols.=20 >=20 > Anyone strongly disagree?=20 >=20 > Thanks, > Acee=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > On 4/6/18, 1:57 PM, "Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)" wrote: >=20 > Tom - >=20 > Thanx for the support. >=20 > It occurs to me that your filter still needs adjustment howeve= r - since there will be cases when a common document is used for all protoco= ls - and in such a case you can only expect "-lsr-" to be in the title. >=20 > My point is there should be a straightforward way to identify = the scope of the content from the name - just using "-lsr-" for all document= s is very sub-optimal - and the fix for this is very easy. >=20 > Les >=20 >=20 >> -----Original Message----- >> From: t.petch >> Sent: Friday, April 06, 2018 3:43 AM >> To: Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) ; Christian Hopp= s >> >> Cc: lsr@ietf.org; Acee Lindem (acee) >> Subject: Re: [Lsr] FW: New Version Notification for draft-ginsbe= rg-isis- >> rfc7810bis-00.txt >>=20 >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)" >> Sent: Thursday, April 05, 2018 5:26 PM >>=20 >>> Chris - >>>=20 >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: Christian Hopps >>>> Sent: Thursday, April 05, 2018 7:32 AM >>>>=20 >>>> I think that the only time we should include the protocol (in >> addition to '-lsr-') >>>> is if we have split documents (for whatever reason) on the sam= e >> solution. >>>> We have an example of this actually: >>>>=20 >>>> draft-ietf-xxxx-segment-routing-msd-09 >>>> draft-ietf-ospf-segment-routing-msd-09 >>>>=20 >>>> Going forward we either combine these types of documents into = a >> single >>>> document (discussion started @101) so "-lsr-" is appropriate, = or if >> there's >>>> some reason not to merge them then we have 2 documents that ne= ed >> the >>>> protocol identifier to disambiguate. >>>>=20 >>>> In this case there's no ambiguity so I don't see the need of a= dding >> an extra "- >>>> isis-". >>> [Les:] RFC 7810 is xxxx specific. >>> There is a separate document for equivalent OSPF functionality = (RFC >> 7471). >>>=20 >>> My point is - the reader should not have to go through the body= of the >> document to find out that the document is specific to a particul= ar protocol. >> The document name (which is preserved in the text even when it b= ecomes >> an RFC) should make that clear. >>>=20 >>=20 >> I agree. >>=20 >> From a purely personal point of view, I track OSPF but have no i= nterest in the >> other protocol (mention of which causes my ISP to blackhole my e= -mail). I >> filter the I-D announce list and will see notification of any I-= D with OSPF in the >> title - any without OSPF in the title will pass under the radar. >>=20 >> Tom Petch >>=20 >>> Les >>>=20 >>>> Thanks, >>>> Chris. >>>>=20 >>>> Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) writes: >>>>=20 >>>>> Well...this raises a topic on which I would like to have feed= back >> from the >>>> WG. >>>>>=20 >>>>> Combining xxxx/OSPF into one working group is fine - no argum= ent >> there. >>>>> But, we now may be producing two classes of documents: >>>>>=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > _______________________________________________ > Lsr mailing list > Lsr@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr =20 =20 =20 From nobody Sat Apr 7 02:27:43 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4E39F12AAB6; Sat, 7 Apr 2018 02:27:43 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: 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dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id nlSEbWtgtgW0 for ; Sat, 7 Apr 2018 10:43:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-wm0-x22d.google.com (mail-wm0-x22d.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:400c:c09::22d]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 319371204DA for ; Sat, 7 Apr 2018 10:43:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-wm0-x22d.google.com with SMTP id t67so9224951wmt.0 for ; Sat, 07 Apr 2018 10:43:21 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=jYqooXqnNAaGtUs466Se7NcD0vlvYhzTc8Mtfo92Qi4=; b=eBUxor8PajZArNW3rWS+r5/YEnZ7p+lMwa4XvsNEWNlf8k/ruTpsUImBC5mu/qMcs/ 0zt5C8wkg9rBSe16gVOdfnLlIfys1csxJ14N6yl1WyQE3IsdFPb4k3lPWf/9d+LkpB5R 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AIpwx4+9pcxIvOj8YKbiI/YzFY2sb0KfDVRxlzwwkwgH5f5FxOqBrGU1CFSYvPWJOqcBATItTzGg5bxzBnbbdPxZhxo= X-Received: by 10.80.192.72 with SMTP id u8mr13163868edd.16.1523122999690; Sat, 07 Apr 2018 10:43:19 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.80.169.93 with HTTP; Sat, 7 Apr 2018 10:42:39 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: <152216649041.5234.6342137041063769692.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> <7D2C1874-8B55-45B1-8C5F-D4C9C1F47D11@tony.li> <5AC78AE5.8020707@cisco.com> <6E69B9E3-14A6-4EED-BBE4-F5A424D57787@tony.li> <5AC79740.6060205@cisco.com> From: Tony Przygienda Date: Sat, 7 Apr 2018 10:42:39 -0700 Message-ID: To: "Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)" Cc: Rob Shakir , "Peter Psenak (ppsenak)" , "lsr@ietf.org" , "tony.li@tony.li" Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="94eb2c1cd46c588b1b056945b5f6" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-li-dynamic-flooding-04.txt X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 07 Apr 2018 17:43:24 -0000 --94eb2c1cd46c588b1b056945b5f6 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Given Les chimed in I can't resist either now ;-) Individual musings a bit having done some of the stuff in the past ;-) On Fri, Apr 6, 2018 at 1:06 PM, Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) wrote: > I think this discussion has already gone much too far in the direction of > customized flooding optimizations. Such is the nature of the engineering > mind =E2=80=93 give us a problem to solve and we=E2=80=99ll come up with = a plethora of > solutions. > > > > The right perspective (for me anyway) is this: > > > > IGPs have been popular as distribution mechanisms in part because of the > reliability of their flooding process. This wasn=E2=80=99t easy to achie= ve =E2=80=93 and > those of us who have been in the business long enough have seen attempts = to > create something equivalent fall flat on their face because they couldn= =E2=80=99t > handle the corner causes. Simple yet robust has been the guiding principl= e > and both IGPs do this well. > yepp, flooding is hard to get right ;-) However, flooding _is_ a problem in a highly densed mesh @ scale (which DC fabrics are), bandwidth less so then the sheer amount of updates generated & necessary CPU power needed IME. That can be addressed in different ways, flooding DAG optimization variants being one of them ;-) > > > > > > I agree with Peter=E2=80=99s suggestion that a common decentralized algo= rithm is > desirable. It will simplify problems associated with reconvergence which = I > think is key. > well, on one hand we have the "telephony networks solution" a.k.a. a single node doing all the computation/enforcing state on all. Intoxicating in its simplicity, unpleasant in its fragility. Plus, what happens if a _2nd_ node happens to start advertising something else ;-) ? I think that e.g. the FlexAlgo currently suggested solution for that problem (i.e. multiple sources of truth with preference tie-breaking) is a good trade-off here modulo the necessary convergence time. On the other hand we have the "fully distributed algorithm" which is intoxicating in its robustness and frustrating in the time it takes to get them right if not highly skilled in the art or specs have holes ;-) Well, for that matter any eventual consistency distributed system is hard (unless epsilon is inifite ;-) > And I don=E2=80=99t think we really need to support multiple algorithms = =E2=80=93 it was > nice of Peter to allow for that =E2=80=93 but as we see now everyone is c= oncerned > about the upgrade issues that come with introducing a new algorithm. > That I would concur with ... > > > Let=E2=80=99s agree on one algorithm and be done. > > A variant on https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc6325#section-4.5.1 is one > such candidate. > > > > And here the dog has more hair than what it initially looks like (from [however quite dated in case of this problem ;-)] implementation experience). First, @ scale a single spanning tree tends to be tad fragile on failures/convergence, generates "hot-links" on which e'one has to wait to converge. Doing two max disjoint trees is not easy but doable from experience @ very non-neglectible complexity. And it's still not fully "load-balancing" flooding which would be the ideal thing of course. Then, and I think Tony describes the problem quite well in the draft in its nature, the problems of diameter and fanout control starts to play a role. A min-diameter algorithm is (non-distributed) AFAIR a clique problem and with that NP complete (albeit some good heurestics were around, it's too long for me to recall). This of course all having to do with trying to solve a generic graph problem. If we focus on lattices/Haase/partially ordered graphs (think CLOS as practical variant or anything that has a north and a south) then the problem of almost optimal flood reduction while load balancing is quite tractable in distributed fashion we discovered but we're working on it as we speak so look for the -06 draft update in another group ;-) my 2c, rusty and dented but not debased l;-) --- tony --94eb2c1cd46c588b1b056945b5f6 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Given Les chimed in I can't resist either now ;-)=C2= =A0 Individual musings a bit having done some of the stuff in the past ;-)<= br>

On Fri, Apr 6,= 2018 at 1:06 PM, Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) <ginsberg@cisco.com> wrote:

I think this discussion has already g= one much too far in the direction of customized flooding optimizations. Suc= h is the nature of the engineering mind =E2=80=93 give us a problem to solve and we=E2=80=99ll come up with a plethora of solutio= ns.

=C2=A0

The right perspective (for me anyway)= is this:

=C2=A0

IGPs have been =C2=A0popular as distr= ibution mechanisms in part because of the reliability of=C2=A0 their floodi= ng process. This wasn=E2=80=99t easy to achieve =E2=80=93 and those of us who have been in the business long enough have seen attempts to create som= ething equivalent fall flat on their face because they couldn=E2=80=99t han= dle the corner causes. Simple yet robust has been the guiding principle and= both IGPs do this well.


=
yepp, flooding is hard to get right ;-) However, flooding _is_ a probl= em in a highly densed mesh @ scale (which DC fabrics are), bandwidth less s= o then the sheer amount of updates generated & necessary CPU power need= ed IME. That can be addressed in different ways, flooding DAG optimization = variants being one of them ;-)
=C2=A0

=C2=A0


=C2=A0

I agree with Peter=E2=80=99s suggesti= on =C2=A0that a common decentralized algorithm is desirable. It will simpli= fy problems associated with reconvergence which I think is key.


well, on one h= and we have the "telephony networks solution" a.k.a.=C2=A0 a sing= le node doing all the computation/enforcing state on all. Intoxicating in i= ts simplicity, unpleasant in its fragility. Plus, what happens if a _2nd_ n= ode happens to start advertising something else ;-) ?=C2=A0 I think that e.= g. the FlexAlgo currently suggested solution for that problem (i.e. multipl= e sources of truth with preference tie-breaking) is a good trade-off here m= odulo the necessary convergence time.

On the other hand = we have the "fully distributed algorithm" which is intoxicating i= n its robustness and frustrating in the time it takes to get them right if = not highly skilled in the art or specs have holes ;-) Well, for that matter= any eventual consistency distributed system is hard (unless epsilon is ini= fite ;-)
=C2=A0

And I don=E2=80=99t think we really n= eed to support multiple algorithms =E2=80=93 it was nice of Peter to allow = for that =E2=80=93 but as we see now everyone is concerned about the upgrad= e issues that come with introducing a new algorithm.

<= /blockquote>

That I would concur with ...
=C2=A0
=

=C2=A0

Let=E2=80=99s agree on one algorithm = and be done.

A variant on https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc6325#section-4.5.1 is one such= candidate.

=C2=A0



And here the do= g has more hair than what it initially looks like (from [however quite date= d in case of this problem ;-)] implementation experience).=C2=A0=C2=A0 Firs= t, @ scale a single spanning tree tends to be tad fragile on failures/conve= rgence, generates "hot-links" on which e'one has to wait to c= onverge. Doing two max disjoint trees is not easy but doable from experienc= e @ very non-neglectible complexity. And it's still not fully "loa= d-balancing" flooding which would be the ideal thing of course. Then, = and I think Tony describes the problem quite well in the draft in its natur= e, the problems of diameter and fanout control starts to play a role. A min= -diameter algorithm is (non-distributed) AFAIR a clique problem and with th= at NP complete (albeit some good heurestics were around, it's too long = for me to recall).

This of course = all having to do with trying to solve a generic graph problem. If we focus = on lattices/Haase/partially ordered graphs (think CLOS as practical variant= or anything that has a north and a south) then the problem of almost optim= al flood reduction while load balancing is quite tractable in distributed f= ashion we discovered but we're working on it as we speak so look for th= e -06 draft update in another group ;-)

my 2c, rusty and dented but not debased l;-)

--- tony
--94eb2c1cd46c588b1b056945b5f6-- From nobody Sat Apr 7 10:44:00 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D232B12D872 for ; Sat, 7 Apr 2018 10:43:58 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.399 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.399 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FORGED_FROMDOMAIN=0.25, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.249, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id jvzAhS-B7lAv for ; Sat, 7 Apr 2018 10:43:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-wr0-x22f.google.com (mail-wr0-x22f.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:400c:c0c::22f]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B41741204DA for ; Sat, 7 Apr 2018 10:43:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-wr0-x22f.google.com with SMTP id s18so4319414wrg.9 for ; Sat, 07 Apr 2018 10:43:55 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id :subject:to:cc; bh=mOR1PSHyyEOaY7B3yTSrT3cHcwiIkq+C+lnNayggCi8=; b=NynBnNKRbRgGBSz6tyIiU3HDFGYTI+gsqlv70LU3VAemkfO7YDsSqdyQ9Ionmx8uZc LOhNTnDhMnuYB1tITI0IffITxmjJBgzEazVL9TFLzcUyZmbzTu7953OdbJlGLPhagBiG bIemgZ/NSUAmJAPn6U34iyP3GVaYDWGQ37qmF8RVXzAeL7XLCVTRemKtCrHxAyxHPJ4K 1IQn3uN+rwPrvTb4LXwpyj1eAOg8bEb5OKeczOLbn2jANwdr2p4BSFbSrCU49ccqSGWP WO/I1KAJ5FAUeqTT4cRyPEVvDwke0TMMkdOEFZvzI5+HsSfT9/k0PO0mcyNLv8XUHSaS JJRg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:from :date:message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=mOR1PSHyyEOaY7B3yTSrT3cHcwiIkq+C+lnNayggCi8=; b=tRRtJ/e83HQN/8UfMYcOQ14WKAZV6CXlNxujhvPDimentKwN7+C4MN1mjD12pEtdtY MVCz4dokNYSkaarZVdK7eT17TVzmh6Yin/vqTWNbeV2qnBnp+H2vYtYXAlkvwPHRY+4q 9tT1N6JoxB7m9Zp4it11bOX4lasB7+3kl0NNwA+09QNESZDvWj2flETeaFeXCWgpQoV2 B6Ao+GgT0OD4n+TdZVPBusJ9CrPIRxQEJcf0xX9IGxaJl9lsw43lO9tum5/60qoe+sey y+DyCi0c/ktAsTm6/KYGKkJNVa7gsmfPLVIweiwOdzNJnl+PgxeOTqbyiEu06YYeYVeO Ze0g== X-Gm-Message-State: AElRT7E356LxULMs7U5Cml8dtabZi/by9YscqNsegXIg8o9NdM5CKBG6 I4f1NTcCGQoSS3RMuXH9Nrq3magNwL76HUy9kak= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AIpwx4/ftXTxOidLXf13tijmWHk2fpPNUR8ng2AVz0NjAou1Ljcyrdyaz0Yph1aEoR1XfeTaFycuvNa4QI8+x1SzlCw= X-Received: by 10.223.166.102 with SMTP id k93mr23527579wrc.231.1523123033899; Sat, 07 Apr 2018 10:43:53 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Sender: rraszuk@gmail.com Received: by 10.28.222.197 with HTTP; Sat, 7 Apr 2018 10:43:53 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: <152216649041.5234.6342137041063769692.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> <7D2C1874-8B55-45B1-8C5F-D4C9C1F47D11@tony.li> <5AC78AE5.8020707@cisco.com> <6E69B9E3-14A6-4EED-BBE4-F5A424D57787@tony.li> <5AC79740.6060205@cisco.com> From: Robert Raszuk Date: Sat, 7 Apr 2018 19:43:53 +0200 X-Google-Sender-Auth: TOpbevoCEpzUiefUxpkJQt2o2is Message-ID: To: "Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)" Cc: Rob Shakir , "Peter Psenak (ppsenak)" , "lsr@ietf.org" , "tony.li@tony.li" Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="f403045cf07862888e056945b7f4" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-li-dynamic-flooding-04.txt X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 07 Apr 2018 17:43:59 -0000 --f403045cf07862888e056945b7f4 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Les, Isn't RIFT effectively a new flooding algorithm - while not strictly designed to be used within current link state protocols - it has the potential to achieve what you and Peter are proposing isn't it ? My personal take here would be to progress dynamic flooding *as is* with the use of DR/DIS as flooding oracles. If you or anyone however would like to propose a new flooding algorithm to link state protocols I think nothing stops you to write a separate draft on that and call it say -optimal-flooding-. Best, Robert. On Fri, Apr 6, 2018 at 10:06 PM, Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) wrote: > I think this discussion has already gone much too far in the direction of > customized flooding optimizations. Such is the nature of the engineering > mind =E2=80=93 give us a problem to solve and we=E2=80=99ll come up with = a plethora of > solutions. > > > > The right perspective (for me anyway) is this: > > > > IGPs have been popular as distribution mechanisms in part because of the > reliability of their flooding process. This wasn=E2=80=99t easy to achie= ve =E2=80=93 and > those of us who have been in the business long enough have seen attempts = to > create something equivalent fall flat on their face because they couldn= =E2=80=99t > handle the corner causes. Simple yet robust has been the guiding principl= e > and both IGPs do this well. > > > > It is also useful to remember that bandwidth utilization for IGP flooding > is not a problem which we need to solve. It has been demonstrated =E2=80= =93 even > long ago with much less bandwidth than we have today =E2=80=93 that IGP f= looding > bandwidth isn=E2=80=99t a concern. So proposals which suggest we might ne= ed to come > up with an algorithm that optimizes for bandwidth or SRLGs or whatever > criteria one could imagine seem unnecessary =E2=80=93 as well as incestuo= us. And > they certainly complicate the problem. > > > > I agree with Peter=E2=80=99s suggestion that a common decentralized algo= rithm is > desirable. It will simplify problems associated with reconvergence which = I > think is key. > > And I don=E2=80=99t think we really need to support multiple algorithms = =E2=80=93 it was > nice of Peter to allow for that =E2=80=93 but as we see now everyone is c= oncerned > about the upgrade issues that come with introducing a new algorithm. > > > > Let=E2=80=99s agree on one algorithm and be done. > > A variant on https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc6325#section-4.5.1 is one > such candidate. > > > > Les > > > > > > *From:* Lsr *On Behalf Of *Rob Shakir > *Sent:* Friday, April 06, 2018 9:03 AM > *To:* Peter Psenak (ppsenak) > *Cc:* lsr@ietf.org; tony.li@tony.li > *Subject:* Re: [Lsr] Fwd: New Version Notification for > draft-li-dynamic-flooding-04.txt > > > > Peter, > > > > How do we transition between algorithms in the approach that you suggest? > Do all non-stub devices need to be upgraded to support the new algorithm > before such time as we can use it? (I think so, because otherwise some > non-stub device cannot be guaranteed to flood to its downstream stub > devices - so we may end up isolating some devices if any device transitio= ns > before all nodes support it). > > > > The advantage of having something advertised is that one can compute it > centrally - and keep the per-node functionality simply obeying the > advertised flooding graph. From an operational perspective, this means th= at > one can introduce new experimental flooding topology computation approach= es > in a manner that is decoupled from needing to do software upgrades across > the whole network. I can also implement non-standard flooding topology > computations based on the network topology which could be only applicable > to that particular network (consider if I wanted to do something like tak= e > into account shared-risk information in the algorithm to allow the > most-SRLG disjoint flooding topology or so). > > > > This is in addition to the points Tony made. I think this > centralised-computation-and-flooded approach is elegant. If the error > handling behaviour for not being able to parse the flooding topology is t= o > revert to flooding everywhere, then it seems non-destructive too. > > > > Cheers, > > r. > > > > On Fri, 6 Apr 2018 at 08:50 Peter Psenak wrote: > > Hi Tony, > > if we start with a single standardized algorithm, that is easy to > implement and deploy. We can leave the door open for additional > algorithms to be defined later together with the selection mechanism. > > I have the feeling that the dependency of the "flooding topology" on the > flooded data is going to bring more complexity, than the selection of > the distributed algorithm to be used, if we ever need to support more > then one. > > thanks, > Peter > > > On 06/04/18 17:19 , tony.li@tony.li wrote: > > > > Hi Peter, > > > > Thank you for your comments. > > > >> while I appreciate the flexibility associated with the centralized > >> computation of the flooding topology, it has some drawbacks as well: > >> > >> 1. "flooding topology" must be flooded. This makes the flooding > >> dependent on the flooded data itself. > > > > > > Absolutely true. If the computation of the topology is incorrect, that > > would certainly be a bug. > > > > > >> 2. The extra flooding of "flooding topology" adds some delay in the > >> convergence towards the new "flooding topology=E2=80=9D. > > > > > > Since we distribute the flooding topology before there are topology > > failures, it would seem like the latency is not a significant concern. > > > > > >> Have you considered the distributed computation of "flooding topology" > >> using some standardized algorithm? > > > > > > Yes, Kireeti raised this in London as well. There are some practical > > issues with this. How do we ever converge on an algorithm? > > > > There are many perspectives on what an adequate flooding topology might > > be. Different administrations have different considerations and risk > > tolerances. > > > > Debugging is going to be more challenging, as inconsistencies between > > two nodes with different ideas of the topology will be difficult to > > detect until there is a catastrophic failure. > > > > I=E2=80=99m trying to do something practical, and it seems like doing t= his in a > > centralized fashion is the quickest, easiest, and most robust way > forward. > > > > > >> Eventually we can support multiple standardized algorithms. A node can > >> advertise support for several algorithms and the "active" algorithm is > >> selected based on some criteria that would guarantee that all nodes in > >> the flooding domain select the same one. > > > > > > Seems like that would also require some administrative input. > > > > So, I agree that that=E2=80=99s a technical possibility, but I think th= at > > there=E2=80=99s significant problems in making that work. I prefer to f= ocus on > > something that we can implement more quickly. > > > > Tony > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Lsr mailing list > Lsr@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr > > > _______________________________________________ > Lsr mailing list > Lsr@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr > > --f403045cf07862888e056945b7f4 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Les,

=
Isn't RIFT effectively a new flooding algorithm - wh= ile not strictly designed to be used within current link state protocols - = it has the potential to achieve what you and Peter are proposing isn't = it ?=C2=A0

My personal= take here would be to progress dynamic flooding *as is* with the use of DR= /DIS as flooding oracles.=C2=A0

If you or anyone however would like to propose a new flooding alg= orithm to link state protocols I think nothing stops you to write a separat= e draft on that and call it say -optimal-flooding-.=C2=A0

Best,
Robert.



On Fri, Apr 6, 2018 at 10:06 PM, Les Ginsbe= rg (ginsberg) <ginsberg@cisco.com> wrote:

I think this discussion has already g= one much too far in the direction of customized flooding optimizations. Suc= h is the nature of the engineering mind =E2=80=93 give us a problem to solve and we=E2=80=99ll come up with a plethora of solutio= ns.

=C2=A0

The right perspective (for me anyway)= is this:

=C2=A0

IGPs have been =C2=A0popular as distr= ibution mechanisms in part because of the reliability of=C2=A0 their floodi= ng process. This wasn=E2=80=99t easy to achieve =E2=80=93 and those of us who have been in the business long enough have seen attempts to create som= ething equivalent fall flat on their face because they couldn=E2=80=99t han= dle the corner causes. Simple yet robust has been the guiding principle and= both IGPs do this well.

=C2=A0

It is also useful to remember that ba= ndwidth utilization for IGP flooding is not a problem which we need to solv= e. It has been demonstrated =E2=80=93 even long ago with much less bandwidth than we have today =E2=80=93 that IGP flooding bandwid= th isn=E2=80=99t a concern. So proposals which suggest we might need to com= e up with an algorithm that optimizes for bandwidth or SRLGs or whatever cr= iteria one could imagine seem unnecessary =E2=80=93 as well as incestuous. And they certainly complicate the problem.

=C2=A0

I agree with Peter=E2=80=99s suggesti= on =C2=A0that a common decentralized algorithm is desirable. It will simpli= fy problems associated with reconvergence which I think is key.

And I don=E2=80=99t think we really n= eed to support multiple algorithms =E2=80=93 it was nice of Peter to allow = for that =E2=80=93 but as we see now everyone is concerned about the upgrad= e issues that come with introducing a new algorithm.

=C2=A0

Let=E2=80=99s agree on one algorithm = and be done.

A variant on https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc6325#section-4.5.1 is one such= candidate.

=C2=A0

=C2=A0=C2=A0 Les=

=C2=A0

=C2=A0

From: Lsr <lsr-bounces@ietf.org> On Behalf Of Rob Shakir
Sent: Friday, April 06, 2018 9:03 AM
To: Peter Psenak (ppsenak) <ppsenak@cisco.com>
Cc: lsr@ietf.org; tony.li@tony.li
Subject: Re: [Lsr] Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-li-dynami= c-flooding-04.txt

=C2=A0

Peter,

=C2=A0

How do we transition between algorithms in the appro= ach that you suggest? Do all non-stub devices need to be upgraded to suppor= t the new algorithm before such time as we can use it? (I think so, because= otherwise some non-stub device cannot be guaranteed to flood to its downstream stub devices - so we may end up i= solating some devices if any device transitions before all nodes support it= ).=C2=A0

=C2=A0

The advantage of having something advertised is that= one can compute it centrally - and keep the per-node functionality simply = obeying the advertised flooding graph. From an operational perspective, thi= s means that one can introduce new experimental flooding topology computation approaches in a manner that is = decoupled from needing to do software upgrades across the whole network. I = can also implement non-standard flooding topology computations based on the= network topology which could be only applicable to that particular network (consider if I wanted to do som= ething like take into account shared-risk information in the algorithm to a= llow the most-SRLG disjoint flooding topology or so).

=C2=A0

This is in addition to the points Tony made. I think= this centralised-computation-and-flooded approach is elegant. If the = error handling behaviour for not being able to parse the flooding topology = is to revert to flooding everywhere, then it seems non-destructive too.

=C2=A0

Cheers,

r.=C2=A0

=C2=A0

Hi Tony,

if we start with a single standardized algorithm, that is easy to
implement and deploy. We can leave the door open for additional
algorithms to be defined later together with the selection mechanism.

I have the feeling that the dependency of the "flooding topology"= on the
flooded data is going to bring more complexity, than the selection of
the distributed algorithm to be used, if we ever need to support more
then one.

thanks,
Peter


On 06/04/18 17:19 , to= ny.li@tony.li wrote:
>
> Hi Peter,
>
> Thank you for your comments.
>
>> while I appreciate the flexibility associated with the centralized=
>> computation of the flooding topology, it has some drawbacks as wel= l:
>>
>> 1. "flooding topology" must be flooded. This makes the f= looding
>> dependent on the flooded data itself.
>
>
> Absolutely true. If the computation of the topology is incorrect, that=
> would certainly be a bug.
>
>
>> 2. The extra flooding of "flooding topology" adds some d= elay in the
>> convergence towards the new "flooding topology=E2=80=9D.
>
>
> Since we distribute the flooding topology before there are topology > failures, it would seem like the latency is not a significant concern.=
>
>
>> Have you considered the distributed computation of "flooding = topology"
>> using some standardized algorithm?
>
>
> Yes, Kireeti raised this in London as well. There are some practical > issues with this. How do we ever converge on an algorithm?
>
> There are many perspectives on what an adequate flooding topology migh= t
> be. Different administrations have different considerations and risk > tolerances.
>
> Debugging is going to be more challenging, as inconsistencies between<= br> > two nodes with different ideas of the topology will be difficult to > detect until there is a catastrophic failure.
>
> I=E2=80=99m trying to do something practical, and it seems like doing = this in a
> centralized fashion is the quickest, easiest, and most robust way forw= ard.
>
>
>> Eventually we can support multiple standardized algorithms. A node= can
>> advertise support for several algorithms and the "active"= ; algorithm is
>> selected based on some criteria that would guarantee that all node= s in
>> the flooding domain select the same one.
>
>
> Seems like that would also require some administrative input.
>
> So, I agree that that=E2=80=99s a technical possibility, but I think t= hat
> there=E2=80=99s significant problems in making that work. I prefer to = focus on
> something that we can implement more quickly.
>
> Tony
>
>

_______________________________________________
Lsr mailing list
Lsr@ietf.org
htt= ps://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr


_______________________________________________
Lsr mailing list
Lsr@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr


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Lindem (acee)" To: "Ketan Talaulikar (ketant)" , Alvaro Retana , "lsr@ietf.org" CC: "lsr-chairs@ietf.org" , "draft-ietf-ospf-link-overload@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [Lsr] Implementations of draft-ietf-ospf-link-overload Thread-Index: AQHTzdf+nl+/Tlvp+0u3Rc/w/BH1B6P1TLWAgABJMwA= Date: Sat, 7 Apr 2018 17:49:39 +0000 Message-ID: <6E286BBB-F750-4A6C-AF9A-A0491BB8650F@cisco.com> References: <03e189ac66754e309f948353a49539dc@XCH-ALN-008.cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <03e189ac66754e309f948353a49539dc@XCH-ALN-008.cisco.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted x-originating-ip: [10.116.152.200] Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_6E286BBBF7504A6CAF9AA0491BB8650Fciscocom_" MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] Implementations of draft-ietf-ospf-link-overload X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: 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Ginsberg (ginsberg)" To: Robert Raszuk CC: "lsr@ietf.org" , Rob Shakir , "tony.li@tony.li" , "Peter Psenak (ppsenak)" Thread-Topic: [Lsr] Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-li-dynamic-flooding-04.txt Thread-Index: AQHTxeXEUxECD0PlS0CiuFJsFhuGJKP0Nz6AgAAGLACAAAiPAIAAA2EA///cLsCAAdJ7gP//zXIg Date: Sat, 7 Apr 2018 19:47:30 +0000 Message-ID: <614aab647fec410f839fe29d0aa86f87@XCH-ALN-001.cisco.com> References: <152216649041.5234.6342137041063769692.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> <7D2C1874-8B55-45B1-8C5F-D4C9C1F47D11@tony.li> <5AC78AE5.8020707@cisco.com> <6E69B9E3-14A6-4EED-BBE4-F5A424D57787@tony.li> <5AC79740.6060205@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted x-originating-ip: [10.24.59.2] Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_614aab647fec410f839fe29d0aa86f87XCHALN001ciscocom_" MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-li-dynamic-flooding-04.txt X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 07 Apr 2018 19:47:36 -0000 --_000_614aab647fec410f839fe29d0aa86f87XCHALN001ciscocom_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Um9iZXJ0IOKAkw0KDQpJIHRoaW5rIGRpc2N1c3Npb24gb2YgUklGVCBiZWxvbmdzIGluIHRoZSBh cHByb3ByaWF0ZSBXRyDigJMgbm90IGhlcmUuDQoNCkZsb29kaW5nIOKAnGFzIGlz4oCdIGlzbuKA mXQgcmVsZXZhbnQgaGVyZSDigJMgc2luY2Ug4oCcYXMgaXPigJ0gd291bGQgbWVhbiBhcyB0aGUg SUdQcyBkbyBpdCB0b2RheS4NCldoZXRoZXIgdGhlIGZsb29kaW5nIHRvcG9sb2d5IGlzIGNhbGN1 bGF0ZWQvYWR2ZXJ0aXNlZCBieSBhIGRlc2lnbmF0ZWQgbm9kZSBvciBpcyBjYWxjdWxhdGVkIGlu IGEgZGlzdHJpYnV0ZWQgZmFzaGlvbiBjbGVhcmx5IGEgZGlmZmVyZW50IGZsb29kaW5nIHRvcG9s b2d5IGZyb20gdGhlIG9uZSBJR1BzIHVzZSB0b2RheSBpcyByZXF1aXJlZCBvciB3ZSB3aWxsIGhh 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Oi8vd3d3LmlldGYub3JnL21haWxtYW4vbGlzdGluZm8vbHNyIiB0YXJnZXQ9Il9ibGFuayI+aHR0 cHM6Ly93d3cuaWV0Zi5vcmcvbWFpbG1hbi9saXN0aW5mby9sc3I8L2E+PG86cD48L286cD48L3A+ DQo8L2Jsb2NrcXVvdGU+DQo8L2Rpdj4NCjxwIGNsYXNzPSJNc29Ob3JtYWwiPjxvOnA+Jm5ic3A7 PC9vOnA+PC9wPg0KPC9kaXY+DQo8L2Rpdj4NCjwvZGl2Pg0KPC9ib2R5Pg0KPC9odG1sPg0K --_000_614aab647fec410f839fe29d0aa86f87XCHALN001ciscocom_-- From nobody Sat Apr 7 12:52:24 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B15B5126DFB for ; Sat, 7 Apr 2018 12:52:22 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.399 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.399 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FORGED_FROMDOMAIN=0.25, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.249, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id gV06_BobdnfW for ; Sat, 7 Apr 2018 12:52:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-wr0-x234.google.com (mail-wr0-x234.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:400c:c0c::234]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id D1CBD1200C5 for ; Sat, 7 Apr 2018 12:52:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-wr0-x234.google.com with SMTP id p53so4465424wrc.10 for ; Sat, 07 Apr 2018 12:52:19 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id :subject:to:cc; bh=BIBpiMEbJf+lg4JBAmhf5HOHEiiVK2Iiqj2vWEbVFX4=; 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AElRT7Emn81mdfmI5DJc5z1Ewmb7UoH3iOc/eGrUJo4/6GiNMU0oMVnC 8J0LLecLoGAX9L16wFgvSaZ5KTDb+XXTMmyN5nE= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AIpwx49To2zHw32j4gxucrezKVNYmoGfxmcX0QxsmbRycBOEN9jQkyiwBjD0swxtrkML6xPL2A8kLqlqU0JFNnz/ybM= X-Received: by 10.223.157.129 with SMTP id p1mr15575226wre.281.1523130738138; Sat, 07 Apr 2018 12:52:18 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Sender: rraszuk@gmail.com Received: by 10.28.222.197 with HTTP; Sat, 7 Apr 2018 12:52:17 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <614aab647fec410f839fe29d0aa86f87@XCH-ALN-001.cisco.com> References: <152216649041.5234.6342137041063769692.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> <7D2C1874-8B55-45B1-8C5F-D4C9C1F47D11@tony.li> <5AC78AE5.8020707@cisco.com> <6E69B9E3-14A6-4EED-BBE4-F5A424D57787@tony.li> <5AC79740.6060205@cisco.com> <614aab647fec410f839fe29d0aa86f87@XCH-ALN-001.cisco.com> From: Robert Raszuk Date: Sat, 7 Apr 2018 21:52:17 +0200 X-Google-Sender-Auth: fJIJe_i7eW7S-4H5JH78IE4JmEI Message-ID: To: "Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)" Cc: "lsr@ietf.org" , Rob Shakir , "tony.li@tony.li" , "Peter Psenak (ppsenak)" Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="f4030439c7b497e52b05694782de" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-li-dynamic-flooding-04.txt X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 07 Apr 2018 19:52:23 -0000 --f4030439c7b497e52b05694782de Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Les, Just to clarify .. *as is* - was meant to indicated as described in draft-li-dynamic-flooding proposal. Not *as is* today in IGPs. Thx, R. On Sat, Apr 7, 2018 at 9:47 PM, Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) wrote: > Robert =E2=80=93 > > > > I think discussion of RIFT belongs in the appropriate WG =E2=80=93 not he= re. > > > > Flooding =E2=80=9Cas is=E2=80=9D isn=E2=80=99t relevant here =E2=80=93 si= nce =E2=80=9Cas is=E2=80=9D would mean as the > IGPs do it today. > > Whether the flooding topology is calculated/advertised by a designated > node or is calculated in a distributed fashion clearly a different floodi= ng > topology from the one IGPs use today is required or we will have > accomplished nothing. > > > > Les > > > > > > *From:* Lsr *On Behalf Of *Robert Raszuk > *Sent:* Saturday, April 07, 2018 10:44 AM > *To:* Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) > *Cc:* lsr@ietf.org; Rob Shakir ; tony.li@tony.li; Peter > Psenak (ppsenak) > > *Subject:* Re: [Lsr] Fwd: New Version Notification for > draft-li-dynamic-flooding-04.txt > > > > Les, > > > > Isn't RIFT effectively a new flooding algorithm - while not strictly > designed to be used within current link state protocols - it has the > potential to achieve what you and Peter are proposing isn't it ? > > > > My personal take here would be to progress dynamic flooding *as is* with > the use of DR/DIS as flooding oracles. > > > > If you or anyone however would like to propose a new flooding algorithm t= o > link state protocols I think nothing stops you to write a separate draft = on > that and call it say -optimal-flooding-. > > > > Best, > Robert. > > > > > > > > On Fri, Apr 6, 2018 at 10:06 PM, Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) < > ginsberg@cisco.com> wrote: > > I think this discussion has already gone much too far in the direction of > customized flooding optimizations. Such is the nature of the engineering > mind =E2=80=93 give us a problem to solve and we=E2=80=99ll come up with = a plethora of > solutions. > > > > The right perspective (for me anyway) is this: > > > > IGPs have been popular as distribution mechanisms in part because of the > reliability of their flooding process. This wasn=E2=80=99t easy to achie= ve =E2=80=93 and > those of us who have been in the business long enough have seen attempts = to > create something equivalent fall flat on their face because they couldn= =E2=80=99t > handle the corner causes. Simple yet robust has been the guiding principl= e > and both IGPs do this well. > > > > It is also useful to remember that bandwidth utilization for IGP flooding > is not a problem which we need to solve. It has been demonstrated =E2=80= =93 even > long ago with much less bandwidth than we have today =E2=80=93 that IGP f= looding > bandwidth isn=E2=80=99t a concern. So proposals which suggest we might ne= ed to come > up with an algorithm that optimizes for bandwidth or SRLGs or whatever > criteria one could imagine seem unnecessary =E2=80=93 as well as incestuo= us. And > they certainly complicate the problem. > > > > I agree with Peter=E2=80=99s suggestion that a common decentralized algo= rithm is > desirable. It will simplify problems associated with reconvergence which = I > think is key. > > And I don=E2=80=99t think we really need to support multiple algorithms = =E2=80=93 it was > nice of Peter to allow for that =E2=80=93 but as we see now everyone is c= oncerned > about the upgrade issues that come with introducing a new algorithm. > > > > Let=E2=80=99s agree on one algorithm and be done. > > A variant on https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc6325#section-4.5.1 is one > such candidate. > > > > Les > > > > > > *From:* Lsr *On Behalf Of *Rob Shakir > *Sent:* Friday, April 06, 2018 9:03 AM > *To:* Peter Psenak (ppsenak) > *Cc:* lsr@ietf.org; tony.li@tony.li > *Subject:* Re: [Lsr] Fwd: New Version Notification for > draft-li-dynamic-flooding-04.txt > > > > Peter, > > > > How do we transition between algorithms in the approach that you suggest? > Do all non-stub devices need to be upgraded to support the new algorithm > before such time as we can use it? (I think so, because otherwise some > non-stub device cannot be guaranteed to flood to its downstream stub > devices - so we may end up isolating some devices if any device transitio= ns > before all nodes support it). > > > > The advantage of having something advertised is that one can compute it > centrally - and keep the per-node functionality simply obeying the > advertised flooding graph. From an operational perspective, this means th= at > one can introduce new experimental flooding topology computation approach= es > in a manner that is decoupled from needing to do software upgrades across > the whole network. I can also implement non-standard flooding topology > computations based on the network topology which could be only applicable > to that particular network (consider if I wanted to do something like tak= e > into account shared-risk information in the algorithm to allow the > most-SRLG disjoint flooding topology or so). > > > > This is in addition to the points Tony made. I think this > centralised-computation-and-flooded approach is elegant. If the error > handling behaviour for not being able to parse the flooding topology is t= o > revert to flooding everywhere, then it seems non-destructive too. > > > > Cheers, > > r. > > > > On Fri, 6 Apr 2018 at 08:50 Peter Psenak wrote: > > Hi Tony, > > if we start with a single standardized algorithm, that is easy to > implement and deploy. We can leave the door open for additional > algorithms to be defined later together with the selection mechanism. > > I have the feeling that the dependency of the "flooding topology" on the > flooded data is going to bring more complexity, than the selection of > the distributed algorithm to be used, if we ever need to support more > then one. > > thanks, > Peter > > > On 06/04/18 17:19 , tony.li@tony.li wrote: > > > > Hi Peter, > > > > Thank you for your comments. > > > >> while I appreciate the flexibility associated with the centralized > >> computation of the flooding topology, it has some drawbacks as well: > >> > >> 1. "flooding topology" must be flooded. This makes the flooding > >> dependent on the flooded data itself. > > > > > > Absolutely true. If the computation of the topology is incorrect, that > > would certainly be a bug. > > > > > >> 2. The extra flooding of "flooding topology" adds some delay in the > >> convergence towards the new "flooding topology=E2=80=9D. > > > > > > Since we distribute the flooding topology before there are topology > > failures, it would seem like the latency is not a significant concern. > > > > > >> Have you considered the distributed computation of "flooding topology" > >> using some standardized algorithm? > > > > > > Yes, Kireeti raised this in London as well. There are some practical > > issues with this. How do we ever converge on an algorithm? > > > > There are many perspectives on what an adequate flooding topology might > > be. Different administrations have different considerations and risk > > tolerances. > > > > Debugging is going to be more challenging, as inconsistencies between > > two nodes with different ideas of the topology will be difficult to > > detect until there is a catastrophic failure. > > > > I=E2=80=99m trying to do something practical, and it seems like doing t= his in a > > centralized fashion is the quickest, easiest, and most robust way > forward. > > > > > >> Eventually we can support multiple standardized algorithms. A node can > >> advertise support for several algorithms and the "active" algorithm is > >> selected based on some criteria that would guarantee that all nodes in > >> the flooding domain select the same one. > > > > > > Seems like that would also require some administrative input. > > > > So, I agree that that=E2=80=99s a technical possibility, but I think th= at > > there=E2=80=99s significant problems in making that work. I prefer to f= ocus on > > something that we can implement more quickly. > > > > Tony > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Lsr mailing list > Lsr@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr > > > _______________________________________________ > Lsr mailing list > Lsr@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr > > > --f4030439c7b497e52b05694782de Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi Les,

Just to clarify ..

=
*a= s is* - was meant to indicated as=C2=A0described in=C2=A0draft-li-dynamic-f= looding proposal. Not *as is* today in IGPs.=C2=A0

Thx,
R.

On Sat, Apr 7, 2018 at 9:47 PM, Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) <ginsberg@cisco.com> wrote:

Robert =E2=80=93=

=C2=A0

I think discussion of RIFT belongs in= the appropriate WG =E2=80=93 not here.

=C2=A0

Flooding =E2=80=9Cas is=E2=80=9D isn= =E2=80=99t relevant here =E2=80=93 since =E2=80=9Cas is=E2=80=9D would mean= as the IGPs do it today.

Whether the flooding topology is calc= ulated/advertised by a designated node or is calculated in a distributed fa= shion clearly a different flooding topology from the one IGPs use today is required or we will have accomplished nothing.

=C2=A0

=C2=A0=C2=A0 Les=

=C2=A0

=C2=A0

From: Lsr <lsr-bounces@ietf.org> On Behalf Of Robert Raszuk
Sent: Saturday, April 07, 2018 10:44 AM
To: Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) <ginsberg@cisco.com>
Cc: lsr@ietf.org; Rob Shakir <rjs@rob.sh>; tony.li@tony.li; Peter Psenak (ppsenak) <ppsenak@cisco.com>


Subject: Re: [Lsr] Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-li-dynami= c-flooding-04.txt

=C2=A0

Les,

=C2=A0

Isn't RIFT effectively a new flooding algorithm - while not strict= ly designed to be used within current link state protocols - it has the pot= ential to achieve what you and Peter are proposing isn't it ?=C2=A0

=C2=A0

My personal take here would be to progress dynamic flooding *as is* wi= th the use of DR/DIS as flooding oracles.=C2=A0

=C2=A0

If you or anyone however would like to propose a new flooding algorith= m to link state protocols I think nothing stops you to write a separate dra= ft on that and call it say -optimal-flooding-.=C2=A0

=C2=A0

Best,
Robert.

=C2=A0

=C2=A0

=C2=A0

On Fri, Apr 6, 2018 at 10:06 PM, Les Ginsberg (ginsb= erg) <ginsberg@c= isco.com> wrote:

I think this discussion has already g= one much too far in the direction of customized flooding optimizations. Such is the nature of the engineering mind =E2=80=93 give us a problem to = solve and we=E2=80=99ll come up with a plethora of solutions.=

=C2=A0

The right perspective (for me anyway)= is this:

=C2=A0

IGPs have been =C2=A0popular as distr= ibution mechanisms in part because of the reliability of=C2=A0 their floodi= ng process. This wasn=E2=80=99t easy to achieve =E2=80=93 and those of us who= have been in the business long enough have seen attempts to create somethi= ng equivalent fall flat on their face because they couldn=E2=80=99t handle = the corner causes. Simple yet robust has been the guiding principle and both IGPs do this well.

=C2=A0

It is also useful to remember that ba= ndwidth utilization for IGP flooding is not a problem which we need to solve. It has been demonstrated =E2=80=93 even long ago with much = less bandwidth than we have today =E2=80=93 that IGP flooding bandwidth isn= =E2=80=99t a concern. So proposals which suggest we might need to come up w= ith an algorithm that optimizes for bandwidth or SRLGs or whatever criteria one could imagine seem unnecessary =E2=80=93 as well as = incestuous. And they certainly complicate the problem.=

=C2=A0

I agree with Peter=E2=80=99s suggesti= on =C2=A0that a common decentralized algorithm is desirable. It will simpli= fy problems associated with reconvergence which I think is key.=

And I don=E2=80=99t think we really n= eed to support multiple algorithms =E2=80=93 it was nice of Peter to allow = for that =E2=80=93 but as we see now everyone is concerned about the upgrade i= ssues that come with introducing a new algorithm.

=C2=A0

Let=E2=80=99s agree on one algorithm = and be done.

A variant on https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc6325#section-4.5.1 is one such= candidate.

=C2=A0

=C2=A0=C2=A0 Les=

=C2=A0

=C2=A0

From: Lsr <lsr-bounces@ietf.org> On Behalf Of Rob Shakir
Sent: Friday, April 06, 2018 9:03 AM
To: Peter Psenak (ppsenak) <ppsenak@cisco.com>
Cc: lsr@ietf.org; tony.li@tony.li
Subject: Re: [Lsr] Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-li-dynami= c-flooding-04.txt

=C2=A0

Peter,

=C2=A0

How do we transition between algorithms in the appro= ach that you suggest? Do all non-stub devices need to be upgraded to suppor= t the new algorithm before such time as we can use it? (I think so, because otherwise some non-stub device cannot be guarante= ed to flood to its downstream stub devices - so we may end up isolating som= e devices if any device transitions before all nodes support it).=C2=A0<= /u>

=C2=A0

The advantage of having something advertised is that= one can compute it centrally - and keep the per-node functionality simply = obeying the advertised flooding graph. From an operational perspective, this means that one can introduce new experimental flooding t= opology computation approaches in a manner that is decoupled from needing t= o do software upgrades across the whole network. I can also implement non-s= tandard flooding topology computations based on the network topology which could be only applicable to that parti= cular network (consider if I wanted to do something like take into account = shared-risk information in the algorithm to allow the most-SRLG disjoint fl= ooding topology or so).

=C2=A0

This is in addition to the points Tony made. I think= this centralised-computation-and-flooded approach is elegant. If the = error handling behaviour for not being able to parse the flooding topology is to revert to flooding everywhere, then it seems non-d= estructive too.

=C2=A0

Cheers,

r.=C2=A0

=C2=A0

On Fri, 6 Apr 2018 at 08:50 Peter Psenak <ppsenak@cisco.com> w= rote:

Hi Tony,

if we start with a single standardized algorithm, that is easy to
implement and deploy. We can leave the door open for additional
algorithms to be defined later together with the selection mechanism.

I have the feeling that the dependency of the "flooding topology"= on the
flooded data is going to bring more complexity, than the selection of
the distributed algorithm to be used, if we ever need to support more
then one.

thanks,
Peter


On 06/04/18 17:19 , to= ny.li@tony.li wrote:
>
> Hi Peter,
>
> Thank you for your comments.
>
>> while I appreciate the flexibility associated with the centralized=
>> computation of the flooding topology, it has some drawbacks as wel= l:
>>
>> 1. "flooding topology" must be flooded. This makes the f= looding
>> dependent on the flooded data itself.
>
>
> Absolutely true. If the computation of the topology is incorrect, that=
> would certainly be a bug.
>
>
>> 2. The extra flooding of "flooding topology" adds some d= elay in the
>> convergence towards the new "flooding topology=E2=80=9D.
>
>
> Since we distribute the flooding topology before there are topology > failures, it would seem like the latency is not a significant concern.=
>
>
>> Have you considered the distributed computation of "flooding = topology"
>> using some standardized algorithm?
>
>
> Yes, Kireeti raised this in London as well. There are some practical > issues with this. How do we ever converge on an algorithm?
>
> There are many perspectives on what an adequate flooding topology migh= t
> be. Different administrations have different considerations and risk > tolerances.
>
> Debugging is going to be more challenging, as inconsistencies between<= br> > two nodes with different ideas of the topology will be difficult to > detect until there is a catastrophic failure.
>
> I=E2=80=99m trying to do something practical, and it seems like doing = this in a
> centralized fashion is the quickest, easiest, and most robust way forw= ard.
>
>
>> Eventually we can support multiple standardized algorithms. A node= can
>> advertise support for several algorithms and the "active"= ; algorithm is
>> selected based on some criteria that would guarantee that all node= s in
>> the flooding domain select the same one.
>
>
> Seems like that would also require some administrative input.
>
> So, I agree that that=E2=80=99s a technical possibility, but I think t= hat
> there=E2=80=99s significant problems in making that work. I prefer to = focus on
> something that we can implement more quickly.
>
> Tony
>
>

_______________________________________________
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Lsr@ietf.org
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_______________________________________________
Lsr mailing list
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htt= ps://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr

=C2=A0


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"draft-ietf-ospf-xaf-te@ietf.org" CC: "lsr@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: OSPF Routing with Cross-Address Family MPLS Traffic Engineering Tunnels Thread-Index: AQHTzECcXJCh/T3oREuLrU8t7rUtP6Pz4GmAgAHvowA= Date: Sat, 7 Apr 2018 21:06:21 +0000 Message-ID: References: <5189f820-58a2-7783-284f-1bdbfc5f054f@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <5189f820-58a2-7783-284f-1bdbfc5f054f@cisco.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted x-originating-ip: [10.116.152.200] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-ID: <49987C6892D992478913722EF16B60D1@emea.cisco.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] OSPF Routing with Cross-Address Family MPLS Traffic Engineering Tunnels X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: 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2018 18:32:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from m21397.mail.qiye.163.com (m21397.mail.qiye.163.com [223.252.213.97]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3375012711A; Sat, 7 Apr 2018 18:32:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from WangajPC (unknown [219.142.69.77]) by m21397.mail.qiye.163.com (Hmail) with ESMTPA id F19ED143DFC; Sun, 8 Apr 2018 09:31:59 +0800 (CST) From: "Aijun Wang" To: "'Ketan Talaulikar \(ketant\)'" Cc: "'Jeffrey Haas'" , , References: <008101d3ca60$073f81b0$15be8510$@org.cn> <1B346347-9242-4EE4-BDA2-F024EF483B8A@tsinghua.org.cn> <8C26288C-54C3-4C04-91A6-2B99562A1DE9@cisco.com> <5AC32E8B.6090202@cisco.com> <009b01d3cbbb$6bfc3510$43f49f30$@org.cn> In-Reply-To: Date: Sun, 8 Apr 2018 09:31:59 +0800 Message-ID: <018c01d3ced9$6416b070$2c441150$@org.cn> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_018D_01D3CF1C.7239F070" X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 12.0 Thread-Index: AdPKX89aH7daBvUkQYK90A0ibbwqrwAABY/wAAMor+AADI+6AAAKaB1g//+8yYCAAUKmgIAAASyAgAE5PQD///jZsP/6GqLA Content-Language: zh-cn X-HM-Spam-Status: e1ktWUFJV1koWUFKTEtLSjdXWQgYFAkeWUFLVUtXWQkOFx4IWUFZMjUtOj cyP0FLVUtZBg++ X-HM-Sender-Digest: e1kSHx4VD1lBWUc6Ogw6Nxw6EzosGDIBQhw9OQsuSBQwFDFVSlVKTklI Sk5KSklOTkhKVTMWGhIXVQwaFRwaEhEOFTsPCBIVHBMOGlUUCRxVGBVFWVdZDB4ZWUEdGhcIHldZ CAFZQUNITUpCN1dZEgtZQVlJSkJVSk9JVU1CVUxMWQY+ X-HM-Tid: 0a62a2e1a6f87f6bkuukf19ed143dfc Archived-At: Subject: [Lsr] =?utf-8?b?562U5aSNOiAgSW5jb25zaXN0ZW5jZSByZWdhcmRpbmcgdGhl?= =?utf-8?q?_definition_of_=22Adj-SID_Sub-TLV=22_between_OSPF_and_ISIS_exte?= =?utf-8?q?nsion_for_Segment_Routing?= X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 08 Apr 2018 01:32:13 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_018D_01D3CF1C.7239F070 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_018E_01D3CF1C.7239F070" ------=_NextPart_001_018E_01D3CF1C.7239F070 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi, Ketan: =20 I think there is another reason that causes this semantic error-----that = is there is many similarities for the definition of =E2=80=9CAdj-SID = Sub-TLV=E2=80=9D for ISIS and OSPFv3 in the following draft: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ospf-ospfv3-segment-routing-extens= ions-11#section-6.1 https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensions-15= #section-2.2.1 =20 but there is no any description in the relevant paragraph to = distinguish them in BGP-LS document. https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-idr-bgp-ls-segment-routing-ext-04#= section-2.2.1 =20 Ketan explained that =E2=80=9CISIS uses 1 byte for type/length and has = LSP space constraints which you would notice in the protocol encodings. = OSPF doesn=E2=80=99t have the same challenge and you would notice how = its TLVs tend to be aligned. BGP-LS is somewhat similar to OSPF from = these size constraints perspective.=E2=80=9D But when I compared another = TLV definition =E2=80=9CSRMS Preference TLV=E2=80=9D in randomly, I = found the definition in BGP-LS is different from that both in ISIS and = OSPFv3.(include the =E2=80=9Clength=E2=80=9D field and = =E2=80=9Creserved=E2=80=9D field) I don=E2=80=99t know there are how = many inconsistence among them and think this will induce other = inconsistencies when the vendor implements the BGP-LS protocol. =20 Can we align these definitions as consistence as possible among them? Or = add clear distinguish statements for the different IGP protocol? The consumer can add some detections for such kind semantic errors but = the better is not to produce them. =20 =20 Best Regards. =20 Aijun Wang Network R&D and Operation Support Department China Telecom Corporation Limited Beijing Research Institute,Beijing, = China. =E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: Ketan Talaulikar (ketant) = [mailto:ketant@cisco.com]=20 =E5=8F=91=E9=80=81=E6=97=B6=E9=97=B4: 2018=E5=B9=B44=E6=9C=884=E6=97=A5 = 15:54 =E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: Aijun Wang =E6=8A=84=E9=80=81: Jeffrey Haas; lsr@ietf.org; idr@ietf.org =E4=B8=BB=E9=A2=98: Re: [Lsr] Inconsistence regarding the definition of = "Adj-SID Sub-TLV" between OSPF and ISIS extension for Segment Routing =20 < including IDR WG where BGP-LS work is being done > =20 Hi Aijun, =20 As discussed offline, this is a bug in this particular implementation = where it is not following the spec properly. =20 This goes back to the discussion in the IDR WG about the semantic and = syntactic validation for BGP-LS messages which Jeff had brought up. In = this case, my understanding was that there was a semantic error in this = TLV encoding? The consumer (application/BGP speaker) in this case should = detect and ignore this update =E2=80=93 which is what was being done as = well in this case? =20 Thanks, Ketan =20 From: Aijun Wang =20 Sent: 04 April 2018 07:50 To: 'stefano previdi' ; Peter Psenak (ppsenak) = Cc: lsr@ietf.org; Ketan Talaulikar (ketant) ; Acee = Lindem (acee) Subject: =E7=AD=94=E5=A4=8D: [Lsr] Inconsistence regarding the = definition of "Adj-SID Sub-TLV" between OSPF and ISIS extension for = Segment Routing =20 Hi, All: =20 We have found some inconsistencies for the implementation of BGP-LS = protocol regarding this =E2=80=9CAdj-SID SubTLV =E2=80=9D, please see = the following screenshot. I think we should do some works for the related drafts to clarify this = ambiguous/easy to be ignored definition. =20 =20 =20 Best Regards. =20 Aijun Wang Network R&D and Operation Support Department China Telecom Corporation Limited Beijing Research Institute,Beijing, = China. =20 -----=E9=82=AE=E4=BB=B6=E5=8E=9F=E4=BB=B6----- =E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: stefano previdi = [mailto:stefano@previdi.net]=20 =E5=8F=91=E9=80=81=E6=97=B6=E9=97=B4: 2018=E5=B9=B44=E6=9C=883=E6=97=A5 = 15:39 =E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: Peter Psenak =E6=8A=84=E9=80=81: lsr@ietf.org; Ketan Talaulikar (ketant); Acee Lindem = (acee); Aijun Wang =E4=B8=BB=E9=A2=98: Re: [Lsr] Inconsistence regarding the definition of = "Adj-SID Sub-TLV" between OSPF and ISIS extension for Segment Routing =20 me too.=20 =20 If we want to align the encoding, we should probably better align the = protocol name directly... =20 s. =20 =20 > On Apr 3, 2018, at 9:34 AM, Peter Psenak < = ppsenak@cisco.com> wrote: >=20 > On 02/04/18 14:19 , Acee Lindem (acee) wrote: >> Speaking as WG member: >>=20 >> I couldn=E2=80=99t agree more with Ketan. No changes are required to = these=20 >> documents. >=20 > as a coauthor of the OSPF/OSPFv3 SR drafts, I fully agree. >=20 > thanks, > Peter >=20 >>=20 >> Thanks, >>=20 >> Acee >>=20 >> *From: *Lsr < lsr-bounces@ietf.org> on = behalf of "Ketan Talaulikar=20 >> (ketant)" < ketant@cisco.com> >> *Date: *Monday, April 2, 2018 at 7:36 AM >> *To: *Aijun Wang < = wangaijun@tsinghua.org.cn> >> *Cc: *" lsr@ietf.org" < = lsr@ietf.org> >> *Subject: *Re: [Lsr] Inconsistence regarding the definition of=20 >> "Adj-SID Sub-TLV" between OSPF and ISIS extension for Segment Routing >>=20 >> Hi Aijun, >>=20 >> I understand what you are referring to now, but these are not=20 >> inconsistencies. ISIS, OSPF and BGP-LS are 3 different protocols.=20 >> Their encodings may not all be the same. ISIS uses 1 byte for=20 >> type/length and has LSP space constraints which you would notice in=20 >> the protocol encodings. OSPF doesn=E2=80=99t have the same challenge = and you=20 >> would notice how its TLVs tend to be aligned. BGP-LS is somewhat=20 >> similar to OSPF from these size constraints perspective. >>=20 >> I do not see the implementation challenges in encoding from the two=20 >> IGPs into BGP-LS. It does not make sense to change any of the=20 >> protocol encodings that you ask for currently since implementations=20 >> have been shipping with them for many years. >>=20 >> IMHO it is not necessary to put such constraints for what you call=20 >> =E2=80=9Cconsistency=E2=80=9D on these 3 protocol encodings in the = future. However,=20 >> we do try to be consistent in semantics as much as possible. >>=20 >> Thanks, >>=20 >> Ketan >>=20 >> *From:*Aijun Wang < = wangaijun@tsinghua.org.cn> >> *Sent:* 02 April 2018 16:52 >> *To:* Ketan Talaulikar (ketant) < = ketant@cisco.com> >> *Cc:* lsr@ietf.org >> *Subject:* Re: [Lsr] Inconsistence regarding the definition of=20 >> "Adj-SID Sub-TLV" between OSPF and ISIS extension for Segment Routing >>=20 >> Hi, Ketan: >>=20 >> There is one two-bytes =E2=80=9CReserved=E2=80=9D field in = =E2=80=9CAdjacency Segment=20 >> Identifier=E2=80=9D TLV for OSPF extension, but this field = doesn=E2=80=99t exist in=20 >> the corresponding TLV for ISIS extension. Every other fields are = same. >>=20 >> Corresponding definition in BGP-LS is similar with OSPF(not similar=20 >> with ISIS as I mentioned in previous mail). Then when the router=20 >> reports/redistributes the ISIS LSDB information to BGP protocol, the=20 >> router must add two bytes to the =E2=80=9Clength=E2=80=9D field and = add/stuff the=20 >> =E2=80=9Creserved=E2=80=9D field; but for OSPF LSDB, the router need = only copy the=20 >> corresponding fields according. >>=20 >> We have found the error arises from this inconsistency from the real=20 >> router and think it is better to align this definition in different=20 >> IGP protocol. >>=20 >> Update to ISIS related extensions draft may be easier. >>=20 >> Aijun Wang >>=20 >> China Telecom >>=20 >>=20 >> =E5=9C=A8 = 2018=E5=B9=B44=E6=9C=882=E6=97=A5=EF=BC=8C18:26=EF=BC=8CKetan Talaulikar = (ketant)=20 >> < = ketant@cisco.com> =E5=86=99=E9=81=93=EF=BC=9A >>=20 >> Hi Aijun, >>=20 >> Can you clarify what you mean by = =E2=80=9Cinconsistencies=E2=80=9D? >>=20 >> Also, you are referring the old version of OSPFv3 SR draft before = it >> was aligned with the OSPFv2 SR draft. Please check >> =20 >> = = https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ospf-ospfv3-segment-routing-ex >> tensions-11#section-6.1 >>=20 >> OSPF and ISIS are different protocols and there are some = differences >> between them. I would not call them inconsistencies. BGP-LS spec >> refers to the individual IGP drafts for interpretation of flags. = So >> please specifically point out what inconsistency you are referring = to. >>=20 >> Thanks, >>=20 >> Ketan >>=20 >> *From:*Lsr < = = lsr-bounces@ietf.org> *On >> Behalf Of *Aijun Wang >> *Sent:* 02 April 2018 14:23 >> *To:* = lsr@ietf.org >> *Subject:* [Lsr] Inconsistence regarding the definition of = "Adj-SID >> Sub-TLV" between OSPF and ISIS extension for Segment Routing >>=20 >> Hi, All: >>=20 >> We found there were some inconsistences for the definition of >> =E2=80=9CAdjacency Segment Identifier=E2=80=9D between OSPF and = ISIS extension for >> segment routing, please see the link below for comparison. >>=20 >> =20 >> = = https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extension >> s-15#section-2.2.1 >>=20 >> =20 >> = = https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ospf-ospfv3-segment-routing-ex >> tensions-10#section-7.1 >>=20 >> Here we want to know is there any reason for this inconsistence? = We >> think this inconsistence can easily cause error for BGP-LS >> implementation for segment routing extension, as that defined in >> = = https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-idr-bgp-ls-segment-routing-ext-04#= section-2.2.1, >> which is similar with ISIS extension for SR, but different from = OSPF >> extension for SR. >>=20 >> Do we need to make them consistent? It seems change the definition >> in OSPF extension may be less influence for the existing related = drafts. >>=20 >> Best Regards. >>=20 >> Aijun Wang >>=20 >> Network R&D and Operation Support Department >>=20 >> China Telecom Corporation Limited Beijing Research >> Institute,Beijing, China. >>=20 >> _______________________________________________ >> Lsr mailing list >> = Lsr@ietf.org >> = https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >> _______________________________________________ >> Lsr mailing list >> Lsr@ietf.org >> = https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr >>=20 >=20 > _______________________________________________ > Lsr mailing list > Lsr@ietf.org > = https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr =20 _______________________________________________ Lsr mailing list Lsr@ietf.org = https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr ------=_NextPart_001_018E_01D3CF1C.7239F070 Content-Type: text/html; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Hi, Ketan:

 

I think = there is another reason that causes this semantic error-----that is = there is many similarities for the definition of =E2=80=9CAdj-SID = Sub-TLV=E2=80=9D for ISIS and OSPFv3 in the following = draft:

https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ospf-= ospfv3-segment-routing-extensions-11#section-6.1

https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-isis-segme= nt-routing-extensions-15#section-2.2.1

 

but there = is no any description in the relevant paragraph to =C2=A0distinguish = them in BGP-LS document.

https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-idr-bgp-ls-= segment-routing-ext-04#section-2.2.1

 

Ketan = explained that =E2=80=9CISIS uses 1 byte for = type/length and has LSP space constraints which you would notice in = =C2=A0the protocol encodings. OSPF doesn=E2=80=99t = have the same challenge and you would notice how its TLVs tend to be = aligned. BGP-LS is somewhat similar to OSPF from these size constraints = perspective.=E2=80=9D = But when I compared another TLV definition =E2=80=9CSRMS Preference = TLV=E2=80=9D in randomly, I found the definition in BGP-LS is different = from that both in ISIS and OSPFv3.(include the =E2=80=9Clength=E2=80=9D = field and =E2=80=9Creserved=E2=80=9D field) I don=E2=80=99t know there = are how many inconsistence among them and think this will induce other = inconsistencies when the vendor implements the BGP-LS = protocol.

 

Can we = align these definitions as consistence as possible among them? Or add = clear distinguish statements for the different IGP = protocol?

The consumer can add some = detections for such kind semantic errors but the better is not to = produce them.

 

 

Best = Regards.

 

Aijun = Wang

Network R&D and Operation Support = Department

China Telecom Corporation Limited Beijing = Research Institute,Beijing, China.

=E5=8F=91=E4=BB= =B6=E4=BA=BA: Ketan = Talaulikar (ketant) [mailto:ketant@cisco.com]
=E5=8F=91=E9=80= =81=E6=97=B6=E9=97=B4: = 2018=E5=B9=B44=E6=9C=884=E6=97=A5 15:54
=E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: Aijun = Wang
=E6=8A=84=E9=80=81: Jeffrey Haas; lsr@ietf.org; = idr@ietf.org
=E4=B8=BB=E9=A2=98: Re: [Lsr] Inconsistence = regarding the definition of "Adj-SID Sub-TLV" between OSPF and = ISIS extension for Segment = Routing

 

< including IDR = WG where BGP-LS work is being done >

 

Hi = Aijun,

 

As discussed offline, this is a = bug in this particular implementation where it is not following the spec = properly.

 

This goes back to the = discussion in the IDR WG about the semantic and syntactic validation for = BGP-LS messages which Jeff had brought up. In this case, my = understanding was that there was a semantic error in this TLV encoding? = The consumer (application/BGP speaker) in this case should detect and = ignore this update =E2=80=93 which is what was being done as well in = this case?

 

Thanks,

Ketan

 

From: Aijun Wang <wangaijun@tsinghua.org.cn&g= t;
Sent: 04 April 2018 07:50
To: 'stefano previdi' = <stefano@previdi.net>; = Peter Psenak (ppsenak) <ppsenak@cisco.com>
Cc:= lsr@ietf.org; Ketan Talaulikar = (ketant) <ketant@cisco.com>; Acee Lindem = (acee) <acee@cisco.com>
Subject: =
=E7=AD=94=E5=A4=8D: [Lsr] Inconsistence regarding the = definition of "Adj-SID Sub-TLV" between OSPF and ISIS = extension for Segment Routing

 

Hi, All:

 

We have found some inconsistencies for the implementation = of BGP-LS protocol regarding this =E2=80=9CAdj-SID SubTLV =E2=80=9D, = please see the following screenshot.

I think we should do some works = for the related drafts to clarify this ambiguous/easy to be ignored = definition.

 

 

 

Best = Regards.

 

Aijun Wang

Network R&D and Operation Support = Department

China Telecom Corporation Limited Beijing Research = Institute,Beijing, China.

 

-----=E9=82=AE=E4=BB=B6=E5=8E=9F=E4=BB= =B6-----
=E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: stefano previdi [mailto:stefano@previdi.net] =
=E5=8F=91=E9=80=81=E6=97=B6=E9=97= =B4: 2018=E5=B9=B44=E6=9C=883=E6=97=A5 15:39
=E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: Peter Psenak
=E6=8A=84=E9=80=81: lsr@ietf.org; Ketan = Talaulikar (ketant); Acee Lindem (acee); Aijun Wang
=E4=B8=BB=E9=A2=98: Re: [Lsr] Inconsistence regarding the definition of = "Adj-SID Sub-TLV" between OSPF and ISIS extension for Segment = Routing

 

me too.

 

If we want to align the encoding, we should probably better = align the protocol name directly...

 

s.

 

 

> On Apr 3, 2018, at 9:34 AM, = Peter Psenak <ppsenak@cisco.com<= /a>> wrote:

>

> On 02/04/18 14:19 , Acee Lindem (acee) = wrote:

>> Speaking as WG member:

>> =

>> I couldn=E2=80=99t = agree more with Ketan. No changes are required to these =

>> documents.

>

> as a coauthor of the = OSPF/OSPFv3 SR drafts, I fully agree.

>

> = thanks,

> Peter

>

>> =

>> Thanks,

>> =

>> Acee

>> =

>> *From: *Lsr <lsr-bounces@ietf.org> on behalf of "Ketan Talaulikar

>> (ketant)" <ketant@cisco.com>

>> *Date: *Monday, April 2, 2018 at 7:36 = AM

>> *To: *Aijun Wang <wangaijun@tsinghua.org.cn= >

>> *Cc: *"lsr@ietf.org&q= uot; <lsr@ietf.org&g= t;

>> *Subject: *Re: [Lsr] Inconsistence regarding the = definition of

>> "Adj-SID Sub-TLV" between OSPF and ISIS = extension for Segment Routing

>> =

>> Hi Aijun,

>> =

>> I understand what you are referring to now, but = these are not

>> inconsistencies. ISIS, OSPF and BGP-LS are 3 = different protocols.

>> Their encodings may not all be the same. ISIS uses = 1 byte for

>> type/length and has LSP space constraints which = you would notice in

>> the protocol encodings. OSPF doesn=E2=80=99t have the same challenge and you

>> would notice how its = TLVs tend to be aligned. BGP-LS is somewhat

>> similar to OSPF from = these size constraints perspective.

>> =

>> I do not see the implementation challenges in = encoding from the two

>> IGPs into BGP-LS. It = does not make sense to change any of the

>> protocol encodings that = you ask for currently since implementations

>> have been shipping with = them for many years.

>>

>> IMHO it is not = necessary to put such constraints for what you call =

>> =E2=80=9Cconsistency=E2=80=9D = on these 3 protocol encodings in the future. However, =

>> we do try to be consistent in semantics as much as = possible.

>>

>> = Thanks,

>>

>> = Ketan

>>

>> *From:*Aijun Wang = <wangaijun@tsinghua.org.cn= >

>> *Sent:* 02 April 2018 = 16:52

>> *To:* Ketan Talaulikar (ketant) <ketant@cisco.com>

>> *Cc:* lsr@ietf.org

>> = *Subject:* Re: [Lsr] Inconsistence regarding the definition of =

>> "Adj-SID Sub-TLV" between OSPF and ISIS = extension for Segment Routing

>> =

>> Hi, Ketan:

>> =

>> There is one two-bytes =E2=80=9CReserved=E2=80=9D = field in =E2=80=9CAdjacency Segment =

>> Identifier=E2=80=9D = TLV for OSPF extension, but this field doesn=E2=80=99t = exist in

>> the corresponding TLV for ISIS extension. Every = other fields are same.

>> =

>> Corresponding definition in BGP-LS is similar with = OSPF(not similar

>> with ISIS as I mentioned in previous mail). Then = when the router

>> reports/redistributes the ISIS LSDB information to = BGP protocol, the

>> router must add two bytes to the =E2=80=9Clength=E2=80=9D = field and add/stuff the

>> =E2=80=9Creserved=E2=80=9D = field; but for OSPF LSDB, the router need only copy the =

>> corresponding fields = according.

>>

>> We have found the error = arises from this inconsistency from the real

>> router and think it is = better to align this definition in different

>> IGP = protocol.

>>

>> Update to ISIS related = extensions draft may be easier.

>> =

>> Aijun Wang

>> =

>> China Telecom

>> =

>>

>> =E5=9C=A8 2018=E5=B9=B44=E6=9C=882=E6=97=A5=EF=BC=8C18:26=EF=BC=8CKetan Talaulikar (ketant)

>> <ketant@cisco.com<mailt= o:ketant@cisco.com>> =E5=86=99=E9=81=93=EF=BC=9A

>>

>>    Hi = Aijun,

>>

>>    Can = you clarify what you mean by =E2=80=9Cinconsistencies=E2=80=9D?

>>

>>    Also, = you are referring the old version of OSPFv3 SR draft before = it

>>    was aligned with the OSPFv2 SR = draft. Please check

>>   

>> https://tools.ietf.org/ht= ml/draft-ietf-ospf-ospfv3-segment-routing-ex=

>> = tensions-11#section-6.1

>> =

>>    OSPF and ISIS are different = protocols and there are some differences

>>    = between them. I would not call them inconsistencies. BGP-LS = spec

>>    refers to the individual IGP = drafts for interpretation of flags. So

>>    = please specifically point out what inconsistency you are referring = to.

>>

>>    = Thanks,

>>

>>    = Ketan

>>

>>    = *From:*Lsr <lsr-bounces@ietf.org<m= ailto:lsr-bounces@ietf.org>> = *On

>>    Behalf Of *Aijun = Wang

>>    *Sent:* 02 April 2018 = 14:23

>>    *To:* lsr@ietf.org<mailto:ls= r@ietf.org>

>>    = *Subject:* [Lsr] Inconsistence regarding the definition of = "Adj-SID

>>    Sub-TLV" between OSPF and = ISIS extension for Segment Routing

>> =

>>    Hi, All:

>> =

>>    We found there were some = inconsistences for the definition of

>>    = =E2=80=9CAdjacency Segment = Identifier=E2=80=9D between OSPF and ISIS = extension for

>>    segment routing, please see the = link below for comparison.

>> =

>>   

>> https://tools.ietf.org/ht= ml/draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extension=

>> = s-15#section-2.2.1

>>

>>    =

>> https://tools.ietf.org/ht= ml/draft-ietf-ospf-ospfv3-segment-routing-ex=

>> = tensions-10#section-7.1

>> =

>>    Here we want to know is there = any reason for this inconsistence? We

>>    think = this inconsistence can easily cause error for = BGP-LS

>>    implementation for segment = routing extension, as that defined in

>>    https://tools.ietf.org/ht= ml/draft-ietf-idr-bgp-ls-segment-routing-ext-04#section-2.2.1,=

>>    which is similar with ISIS = extension for SR, but different from OSPF

>>    = extension for SR.

>>

>>    Do we = need to make them consistent? It seems change the = definition

>>    in OSPF extension may be less = influence for the existing related drafts.

>> =

>>    Best = Regards.

>>

>>    Aijun = Wang

>>

>>    = Network R&D and Operation Support Department

>> =

>>    China Telecom Corporation = Limited Beijing Research

>>    = Institute,Beijing, China.

>> =

>>    = _______________________________________________

>>    Lsr = mailing list

>>    Lsr@ietf.org<mailto:Ls= r@ietf.org>

>>    https://www.ietf.org/mail= man/listinfo/lsr

>> =

>>

>> =

>> = _______________________________________________

>> Lsr mailing = list

>> Lsr@ietf.org

>> = https://www.ietf.org/mail= man/listinfo/lsr

>> =

> =

> = _______________________________________________

> Lsr mailing = list

> Lsr@ietf.org

> https://www.ietf.org/mail= man/listinfo/lsr

 

_______________________________________________

Lsr mailing = list

Lsr@ietf.org

https://www.ietf.org/mail= man/listinfo/lsr

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-0500 From: "Ketan Talaulikar (ketant)" To: Aijun Wang CC: "'Jeffrey Haas'" , "lsr@ietf.org" , "idr@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [Lsr] Inconsistence regarding the definition of "Adj-SID Sub-TLV" between OSPF and ISIS extension for Segment Routing Thread-Index: AdPKX89aH7daBvUkQYK90A0ibbwqrwAABY/wAAMor+AADI+6AAAKaB1g//+8yYCAAUKmgIAAASyAgAE5PQD///jZsP/6GqLA//Ij5mA= Date: Mon, 9 Apr 2018 08:45:24 +0000 Message-ID: References: <008101d3ca60$073f81b0$15be8510$@org.cn> <1B346347-9242-4EE4-BDA2-F024EF483B8A@tsinghua.org.cn> <8C26288C-54C3-4C04-91A6-2B99562A1DE9@cisco.com> <5AC32E8B.6090202@cisco.com> <009b01d3cbbb$6bfc3510$43f49f30$@org.cn> <018c01d3ced9$6416b070$2c441150$@org.cn> In-Reply-To: <018c01d3ced9$6416b070$2c441150$@org.cn> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: yes X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted x-originating-ip: [10.65.77.87] Content-Type: multipart/related; boundary="_004_abd20a0336c3417abad64569658fe99eXCHALN008ciscocom_"; type="multipart/alternative" MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] Inconsistence regarding the definition of "Adj-SID Sub-TLV" between OSPF and ISIS extension for Segment Routing X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 09 Apr 2018 08:45:35 -0000 --_004_abd20a0336c3417abad64569658fe99eXCHALN008ciscocom_ Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_abd20a0336c3417abad64569658fe99eXCHALN008ciscocom_" --_000_abd20a0336c3417abad64569658fe99eXCHALN008ciscocom_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 SGkgQWlqdW4sDQoNCkFzIHJlc3BvbmRlZCBwcmV2aW91c2x5IGFuZCBhbHNvIGNsYXJpZmllZCBi eSBmZXcgb3RoZXJzLCB0aGUgMyBJR1AgcHJvdG9jb2xzIChJU0lTLCBPU1BGdjIgYW5kIE9TUEZ2 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List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 09 Apr 2018 13:17:59 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Link State Routing WG of the IETF. Title : Signaling MSD (Maximum SID Depth) using IS-IS Authors : Jeff Tantsura Uma Chunduri Sam Aldrin Les Ginsberg Filename : draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-msd-10.txt Pages : 9 Date : 2018-04-09 Abstract: This document defines a way for an IS-IS Router to advertise multiple types of supported Maximum SID Depths (MSDs) at node and/or link granularity. Such advertisements allow entities (e.g., centralized controllers) to determine whether a particular SID stack can be supported in a given network. This document only defines one type of MSD maximum label imposition, but defines an encoding that can support other MSD types. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-msd/ There are also htmlized versions available at: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-msd-10 https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-msd-10 A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-msd-10 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Mon Apr 9 08:57:24 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D32AF12D0C3; Mon, 9 Apr 2018 08:57:22 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -12.611 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-12.611 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_DKIMWL_WL_MED=-0.01, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=cisco.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id HgaIYe_A4CpN; Mon, 9 Apr 2018 08:57:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from aer-iport-1.cisco.com 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aer-core-3.cisco.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id w39FvIiY032639; Mon, 9 Apr 2018 15:57:18 GMT Message-ID: <5ACB8D5E.9050403@cisco.com> Date: Mon, 09 Apr 2018 17:57:18 +0200 From: Peter Psenak User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.11; rv:24.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/24.4.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Acee Lindem (acee)" , "draft-ietf-ospf-segment-routing-msd@ietf.org" CC: "lsr@ietf.org" References: <65EF563D-0E36-4D13-9565-14FED79F8531@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <65EF563D-0E36-4D13-9565-14FED79F8531@cisco.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] LSR WG IPR Query for "Signaling MSD (Maximum SID Depth) using OSPF" - draft-ietf-ospf-segment-routing-msd-10.txt (one more @#$ time) X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 09 Apr 2018 15:57:23 -0000 Hi Acee, I'm not aware of any IPR related to this draft. thanks, Peter On 06/04/18 03:27 , Acee Lindem (acee) wrote: > Authors, > > Are you aware of any IPR that applies to > draft-ietf-ospf-segment-routing-msd-10.txt? > > If so, has this IPR been disclosed in compliance with IETF IPR rules > (see RFCs 3979, 4879, 3669 and 5378 for more details). > > If you are listed as a document author or contributor please respond to > this email regardless of whether or not you are aware of any relevant > IPR. *The response needs to be sent to the LSR WG mailing list.* The > document will not advance to the next stage until a response has been > received from each author and contributor. > > If you are on the LSR WG email list but are not listed as an author or > contributor, then please explicitly respond only if you are aware of any > IPR that has not yet been disclosed in conformance with IETF rules. > > Thanks, > > Acee > From nobody Mon Apr 9 10:42:08 2018 Return-Path: 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draft-ginsberg-isis-rfc7810bis-00.txt Thread-Index: AQHTy1pTDYQOpMXw80qZxNEhmGwTFaP4vW0A Date: Mon, 9 Apr 2018 17:42:02 +0000 Message-ID: References: <303B9428-1EF5-417C-8223-DCB34440677B@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <303B9428-1EF5-417C-8223-DCB34440677B@cisco.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted x-originating-ip: [10.116.152.200] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-ID: <6FE27F96B293DE44A98DB818E6240CBA@emea.cisco.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] FW: New Version Notification for draft-ginsberg-isis-rfc7810bis-00.txt X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 09 Apr 2018 17:42:07 -0000 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DQoNCg== From nobody Mon Apr 9 10:47:21 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0CDDF127286; Mon, 9 Apr 2018 10:47:20 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.301 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.301 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 2e8YK-w4y5Sw; Mon, 9 Apr 2018 10:47:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: from huawei.com (lhrrgout.huawei.com [194.213.3.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id C41731200FC; Mon, 9 Apr 2018 10:47:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: from lhreml704-cah.china.huawei.com (unknown [172.18.7.107]) by Forcepoint Email with ESMTP id E51D932B8D392; Mon, 9 Apr 2018 18:47:14 +0100 (IST) Received: from SJCEML702-CHM.china.huawei.com (10.208.112.38) by lhreml704-cah.china.huawei.com (10.201.108.45) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 14.3.382.0; Mon, 9 Apr 2018 18:47:16 +0100 Received: from SJCEML521-MBB.china.huawei.com ([169.254.6.91]) by SJCEML702-CHM.china.huawei.com ([169.254.4.179]) with mapi id 14.03.0382.000; Mon, 9 Apr 2018 10:47:12 -0700 From: Uma Chunduri To: Peter Psenak , "Acee Lindem (acee)" , "draft-ietf-ospf-segment-routing-msd@ietf.org" CC: "lsr@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: LSR WG IPR Query for "Signaling MSD (Maximum SID Depth) using OSPF" - draft-ietf-ospf-segment-routing-msd-10.txt (one more @#$ time) Thread-Index: AQHTzUZtPrXTktt3FUunQI8O2Fh02aP5EasA//+o7uA= Date: Mon, 9 Apr 2018 17:47:11 +0000 Message-ID: <25B4902B1192E84696414485F5726854135521C2@SJCEML521-MBB.china.huawei.com> References: <65EF563D-0E36-4D13-9565-14FED79F8531@cisco.com> 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"Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)" To: "Acee Lindem (acee)" , "lsr@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [Lsr] FW: New Version Notification for draft-ginsberg-isis-rfc7810bis-00.txt Thread-Index: AQHTy1pTDYQOpMXw80qZxNEhmGwTFaP4vW0AgAAWnLA= Date: Mon, 9 Apr 2018 19:03:25 +0000 Message-ID: <6148e00355e444f0a685b9b184f041b3@XCH-ALN-001.cisco.com> References: <303B9428-1EF5-417C-8223-DCB34440677B@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: yes X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted x-originating-ip: [10.24.48.56] Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="_002_6148e00355e444f0a685b9b184f041b3XCHALN001ciscocom_" MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] FW: New Version Notification for draft-ginsberg-isis-rfc7810bis-00.txt X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 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multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_6C4A9D96579C4FC481C5F6DBAC61C1BEciscocom_" MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Subject: [Lsr] LSR WG Adoption call for "IS-IS Traffic Engineering (TE) Metric Extensions" - draft-ginsberg-lsr-isis-rfc7810bis-00 X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 09 Apr 2018 19:20:30 -0000 --_000_6C4A9D96579C4FC481C5F6DBAC61C1BEciscocom_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 VGhpcyBkcmFmdCBzaW1wbHkgZml4ZXMgYSBwcm9ibGVtIGluIFJGQyA3ODEwIHRoYXQgcmVzdWx0 ZWQgaW4gYW4gaW5jb21wYXRpYmlsaXR5IGlzc3VlIHdpdGggaW1wbGVtZW50YXRpb25zLiBHaXZl biB0aGUgc2ltcGxpY2l0eSBvZiB0aGlzIGRvY3VtZW50LCBJ4oCZZCBsaWtlIHRvIGhhdmUgYW4g YWJicmV2aWF0ZWQgV0cgYWRvcHRpb24gY2FsbCBvZiBvbmUgd2Vlay4gUGxlYXNlIGluZGljYXRl IHlvdXIgc3VwcG9ydCBvciBvYmplY3Rpb25zIHRvIHRoaXMgZG9jdW1lbnQgYnkgQXByaWwgMTd0 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Thread-Index: AQHT0DfP9V4jKsaH1EuzX1B5k8E/AKP40RyQ Date: Mon, 9 Apr 2018 19:28:02 +0000 Message-ID: References: <6C4A9D96-579C-4FC4-81C5-F6DBAC61C1BE@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <6C4A9D96-579C-4FC4-81C5-F6DBAC61C1BE@cisco.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted x-originating-ip: [10.24.48.56] Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_ade90d2f9abb4ac790a420b6f12c9218XCHALN001ciscocom_" MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] LSR WG Adoption call for "IS-IS Traffic Engineering (TE) Metric Extensions" - draft-ginsberg-lsr-isis-rfc7810bis-00 X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 09 Apr 2018 19:28:07 -0000 --_000_ade90d2f9abb4ac790a420b6f12c9218XCHALN001ciscocom_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" 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9 Apr 2018 13:00:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from alln-iport-5.cisco.com (alln-iport-5.cisco.com [173.37.142.92]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher DHE-RSA-SEED-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 59FAA12D7E4 for ; Mon, 9 Apr 2018 13:00:04 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cisco.com; i=@cisco.com; l=3687; q=dns/txt; s=iport; t=1523304004; x=1524513604; h=subject:to:references:from:message-id:date:mime-version: in-reply-to; bh=TXXnvu+nuRjuZeRaPV3w+7vz31y+R2Xw+xZLRH9Y5sE=; b=mx5AVvyymfJuXxA7JxB+BEmpvxGMc4RanBGk/b37CAxXBdgfgnLknHV+ jnL2S6YCznxz2xeaRRXTHB7UAGrgAmdQvHTf8hadYga/4w53GIhqycbTz 7RvJbfnna+/lCVvEjNL5f8BWCwh2/RvoXKYPskuobviR3mIWK/tj4cZEu Q=; X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos; i="5.48,427,1517875200"; d="scan'208,217"; a="95870872" Received: from alln-core-2.cisco.com ([173.36.13.135]) by alln-iport-5.cisco.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384; 09 Apr 2018 20:00:03 +0000 Received: from [10.19.43.164] (sjc-pauwells-nitro3.cisco.com [10.19.43.164]) (authenticated bits=0) by alln-core-2.cisco.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id w39K01Jp024868 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=NO); Mon, 9 Apr 2018 20:00:03 GMT To: lsr@ietf.org References: <6C4A9D96-579C-4FC4-81C5-F6DBAC61C1BE@cisco.com> From: Paul Wells Message-ID: <9be831ab-c1b2-7b48-98cc-43697e1ebcd5@cisco.com> Date: Mon, 9 Apr 2018 15:00:01 -0500 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/52.7.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <6C4A9D96-579C-4FC4-81C5-F6DBAC61C1BE@cisco.com> Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------EDA8AD6458FCD4F9AD62D5C6" Content-Language: en-US X-Authenticated-User: pauwells Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] LSR WG Adoption call for "IS-IS Traffic Engineering (TE) Metric Extensions" - draft-ginsberg-lsr-isis-rfc7810bis-00 X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 09 Apr 2018 20:00:08 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------EDA8AD6458FCD4F9AD62D5C6 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Support (as an implementer of the existing rfc7810). Paul Wells On 04/09/2018 02:20 PM, Acee Lindem (acee) wrote: > > This draft simply fixes a problem in RFC 7810 that resulted in an > incompatibility issue with implementations. Given the simplicity of > this document, I’d like to have an abbreviated WG adoption call of one > week. Please indicate your support or objections to this document by > April 17^th , 2018. > > Thanks, > Acee > > > > _______________________________________________ > Lsr mailing list > Lsr@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr --------------EDA8AD6458FCD4F9AD62D5C6 Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Support (as an implementer of the existing rfc7810).

Paul Wells

On 04/09/2018 02:20 PM, Acee Lindem (acee) wrote:

This draft simply fixes a problem in RFC 7810 that resulted in an incompatibility issue with implementations. Given the simplicity of this document, I’d like to have an abbreviated WG adoption call of one week. Please indicate your support or objections to this document by April 17th, 2018.  

 

Thanks,
Acee



_______________________________________________
Lsr mailing list
Lsr@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr

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14:03:05 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <34A255FC-3DDC-4D18-92A5-787A2FA38A1D@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <34A255FC-3DDC-4D18-92A5-787A2FA38A1D@cisco.com> From: Stefano Previdi Date: Mon, 09 Apr 2018 21:02:55 +0000 Message-ID: To: "Acee Lindem (acee)" Cc: "draft-ginsberg-lsr-isis-rfc7810bis@ietf.org" , lsr@ietf.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="00000000000073f693056970bb5c" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] IPR Call for "IS-IS Traffic Engineering (TE) Metric Extensions" - draft-ginsberg-lsr-isis-rfc7810bis-00 X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 09 Apr 2018 21:03:08 -0000 --00000000000073f693056970bb5c Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Hi Acee, all, I'm not aware of any undisclosed IPR related to this draft. Thanks. s. On Mon, Apr 9, 2018, 9:39 PM Acee Lindem (acee) wrote: > Authors, > > > > Are you aware of any IPR that applies to > draft-ginsberg-lsr-isis-rfc7810bis-00 in addition to the IPR declared on > RFC 7810: > > > > > https://datatracker.ietf.org/ipr/search/?submit=draft&id=draft-ietf-isis-te-metric-extensions > > > > If so, has this IPR been disclosed in compliance with IETF IPR rules (see > RFCs 3979, 4879, 3669 and 5378 for more details). > > > > If you are listed as a document author or contributor please respond to > this email regardless of whether or not you are aware of any relevant IPR. > *The response needs to be sent to the LSR WG mailing list.* The document > will not advance to the next stage until a response has been received from > each author and contributor. > > > > If you are on the LSR WG email list but are not listed as an author or > contributor, then please explicitly respond only if you are aware of any > IPR that has not yet been disclosed in conformance with IETF rules. > > > > Thanks, > > Acee > > > --00000000000073f693056970bb5c Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi Acee, all,

I'm not aware of any undisclosed IPR related to this draft= .=C2=A0

Thanks.=C2=A0
s.

On Mon, Apr 9, 2018, 9:39 PM Acee Lindem (acee) <acee@cisco.com> wrote:

Authors= ,=C2=A0

=C2=A0<= /span>

Are you= aware of any IPR that applies to draft-ginsberg-lsr-isis-rfc7810bis-00 in = addition to the IPR declared on RFC 7810:

= =C2=A0

https:= //datatracker.ietf.org/ipr/search/?submit=3Ddraft&id=3Ddraft-ietf-isis-= te-metric-extensions

= =C2=A0

If so, = has this IPR been disclosed in compliance with IETF IPR rules (see RFCs 397= 9, 4879, 3669 and 5378 for more details).

=C2=A0<= /span>

If you = are listed as a document author or contributor please respond to this email= regardless of whether or not you are aware of any relevant IPR. *The respo= nse needs to be sent to the LSR WG mailing list.* The document will not advance to the next stage until a response ha= s been received from each author and contributor.

=C2=A0<= /span>

If you = are on the LSR WG email list but are not listed as an author or contributor= , then please explicitly respond only if you are aware of any IPR that has = not yet been disclosed in conformance with IETF rules.

=C2=A0<= /span>

Thanks,=

Acee

=C2=A0

--00000000000073f693056970bb5c-- From nobody Mon Apr 9 14:04:18 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3183F12D7ED; Mon, 9 Apr 2018 14:04:16 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.3 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.3 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id UPyFkz-mglP3; Mon, 9 Apr 2018 14:04:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from huawei.com (lhrrgout.huawei.com [194.213.3.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id CF57412D7E5; Mon, 9 Apr 2018 14:04:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from lhreml704-cah.china.huawei.com (unknown [172.18.7.107]) by Forcepoint Email with ESMTP id 4CAF792076D92; Mon, 9 Apr 2018 22:04:09 +0100 (IST) Received: from NKGEML414-HUB.china.huawei.com (10.98.56.75) by lhreml704-cah.china.huawei.com (10.201.108.45) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 14.3.382.0; Mon, 9 Apr 2018 22:04:10 +0100 Received: from NKGEML513-MBS.china.huawei.com ([169.254.2.231]) by nkgeml414-hub.china.huawei.com ([10.98.56.75]) with mapi id 14.03.0361.001; Tue, 10 Apr 2018 05:04:08 +0800 From: Qin Wu To: "Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)" , "Acee Lindem (acee)" , "draft-ginsberg-lsr-isis-rfc7810bis@ietf.org" CC: "lsr@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: IPR Call for "IS-IS Traffic Engineering (TE) Metric Extensions" - draft-ginsberg-lsr-isis-rfc7810bis-00 Thread-Index: AdPQRisn2eolMjFZTEmEy29XusFJKw== Date: Mon, 9 Apr 2018 21:04:07 +0000 Message-ID: Accept-Language: zh-CN, en-US Content-Language: zh-CN X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.200.65.38] Content-Type: 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2018 14:05:47 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.3 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.3 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id IZYWc_F2CQbZ; Mon, 9 Apr 2018 14:05:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from huawei.com (lhrrgout.huawei.com [194.213.3.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 5420812D7E5; Mon, 9 Apr 2018 14:05:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from lhreml707-cah.china.huawei.com (unknown [172.18.7.106]) by Forcepoint Email with ESMTP id 7B10E13B66182; Mon, 9 Apr 2018 22:05:42 +0100 (IST) Received: from NKGEML412-HUB.china.huawei.com (10.98.56.73) by lhreml707-cah.china.huawei.com (10.201.108.48) with Microsoft 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Mime-Version: 1.0 (1.0) From: Jeff Tantsura X-Mailer: iPhone Mail (15D100) In-Reply-To: <6C4A9D96-579C-4FC4-81C5-F6DBAC61C1BE@cisco.com> Date: Tue, 10 Apr 2018 09:47:13 +0200 Cc: "lsr@ietf.org" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <5024E5DE-E105-4483-8F95-47B3BD7CF440@gmail.com> References: <6C4A9D96-579C-4FC4-81C5-F6DBAC61C1BE@cisco.com> To: "Acee Lindem (acee)" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] LSR WG Adoption call for "IS-IS Traffic Engineering (TE) Metric Extensions" - draft-ginsberg-lsr-isis-rfc7810bis-00 X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Apr 2018 07:47:19 -0000 --Apple-Mail-B3639375-CFAF-4C37-86EB-9A3A71E3FF46 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Support! Regards, Jeff > On Apr 9, 2018, at 21:20, Acee Lindem (acee) wrote: >=20 > This draft simply fixes a problem in RFC 7810 that resulted in an incompat= ibility issue with implementations. Given the simplicity of this document, I= =E2=80=99d like to have an abbreviated WG adoption call of one week. Please i= ndicate your support or objections to this document by April 17th, 2018. =20= > =20 > Thanks, > Acee > _______________________________________________ > Lsr mailing list > Lsr@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr --Apple-Mail-B3639375-CFAF-4C37-86EB-9A3A71E3FF46 Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Support!

Regards,
Jeff

On Apr 9, 2018, at 21:20, Acee Lin= dem (acee) <acee@cisco.com> wrot= e:

This draft simply fi= xes a problem in RFC 7810 that resulted in an incompatibility issue with imp= lementations. Given the simplicity of this document, I=E2=80=99d like to hav= e an abbreviated WG adoption call of one week. Please indicate your support or objections to this document by April 1= 7th, 2018.  

 

Thanks,
Acee

____________________= ___________________________
Lsr mailing list
Lsr@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/lis= tinfo/lsr
= --Apple-Mail-B3639375-CFAF-4C37-86EB-9A3A71E3FF46-- From nobody Tue Apr 10 01:16:19 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D7992126BF3; Tue, 10 Apr 2018 01:16:11 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.888 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.888 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DC_PNG_UNO_LARGO=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_KAM_HTML_FONT_INVALID=0.01, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 3x-I-7PSi3fl; Tue, 10 Apr 2018 01:16:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from m21397.mail.qiye.163.com (m21397.mail.qiye.163.com [223.252.213.97]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5B233124319; Tue, 10 Apr 2018 01:16:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from WangajPC (unknown [219.142.69.77]) by m21397.mail.qiye.163.com (Hmail) with ESMTPA id 3C9EF142CC0; Tue, 10 Apr 2018 16:15:58 +0800 (CST) From: "Aijun Wang" To: "'Ketan Talaulikar \(ketant\)'" Cc: "'Jeffrey Haas'" , , References: <008101d3ca60$073f81b0$15be8510$@org.cn> <1B346347-9242-4EE4-BDA2-F024EF483B8A@tsinghua.org.cn> <8C26288C-54C3-4C04-91A6-2B99562A1DE9@cisco.com> <5AC32E8B.6090202@cisco.com> <009b01d3cbbb$6bfc3510$43f49f30$@org.cn> <018c01d3ced9$6416b070$2c441150$@org.cn> In-Reply-To: Date: Tue, 10 Apr 2018 16:15:57 +0800 Message-ID: <008301d3d0a4$2796e210$76c4a630$@org.cn> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0084_01D3D0E7.35BA2210" X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 12.0 Thread-Index: AdPKX89aH7daBvUkQYK90A0ibbwqrwAABY/wAAMor+AADI+6AAAKaB1g//+8yYCAAUKmgIAAASyAgAE5PQD///jZsP/6GqLA//Ij5mD/4sBmkA== Content-Language: zh-cn X-HM-Spam-Status: e1ktWUFJV1koWUFKTEtLSjdXWQgYFAkeWUFLVUtXWQkOFx4IWUFZMjUtOj cyP0FLVUtZBg++ X-HM-Sender-Digest: e1kSHx4VD1lBWUc6PyI6Qjo*NDoiMjAKSzUPKVYRKzkKCyFVSlVKTklI SE9DSk1PSUJNVTMWGhIXVQwaFRwaEhEOFTsPCBIVHBMOGlUUCRxVGBVFWVdZDB4ZWUEdGhcIHldZ CAFZQUJMSU5PN1dZEgtZQVlJSkJVSk9JVU1CVUxMWQY+ X-HM-Tid: 0a62aea037be7f6bkuuk3c9ef142cc0 Archived-At: Subject: [Lsr] =?utf-8?b?562U5aSNOiAgSW5jb25zaXN0ZW5jZSByZWdhcmRpbmcgdGhl?= =?utf-8?q?_definition_of_=22Adj-SID_Sub-TLV=22_between_OSPF_and_ISIS_exte?= =?utf-8?q?nsion_for_Segment_Routing?= X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Apr 2018 08:16:12 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0084_01D3D0E7.35BA2210 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0085_01D3D0E7.35BA2210" ------=_NextPart_001_0085_01D3D0E7.35BA2210 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi, Ketan: =20 I read through the section that you provided at = https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-idr-bgp-ls-segment-routing-ext-04#= section-3, and think 3/4 parts of them are unnecessary because the = contents of 3.1,3.2 and 3.3 has been mentioned at the corresponding TLV = definition parts. Only 3.4 part is necessary because it mentions the = composite usage of two TLVs and can=E2=80=99t fit in any previous TLV = definition. =20 My suggestion is that we add some clarification under the error-prone = TLV definition respectively, to let the vendor refer them clearly when = implementing the BGP-LS protocol.=20 =20 ISIS/OSPF/OSPFv3/BGP-LS are different protocols in mainly the mechanism = to transfer/digest the message, not the extensible TLVs definition, = especially for the same purpose TLVs. There are some reasons that need = to keep the definition compact/different, but beyond that, we should = align them as same as possible to eliminate the error arose from = inter-operation activities among different vendor or between device = vendor and the SDN controller. =20 =20 Best Regards. =20 Aijun Wang Network R&D and Operation Support Department China Telecom Corporation Limited Beijing Research Institute,Beijing, = China. =20 =E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: Ketan Talaulikar (ketant) = [mailto:ketant@cisco.com]=20 =E5=8F=91=E9=80=81=E6=97=B6=E9=97=B4: 2018=E5=B9=B44=E6=9C=889=E6=97=A5 = 16:45 =E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: Aijun Wang =E6=8A=84=E9=80=81: 'Jeffrey Haas'; lsr@ietf.org; idr@ietf.org =E4=B8=BB=E9=A2=98: Re: [Lsr] Inconsistence regarding the definition of = "Adj-SID Sub-TLV" between OSPF and ISIS extension for Segment Routing =20 Hi Aijun, =20 As responded previously and also clarified by few others, the 3 IGP = protocols (ISIS, OSPFv2 and OSPFv3) and BGP-LS are different protocols. = Their encodings need not be identical. However, their semantics = generally are so when it comes mapping them into BGP-LS. =20 At this stage, given the advance state of implementations and = deployments for all these IGP and BGP-LS drafts involved, I = don=E2=80=99t think we can undertake such =E2=80=9Ccosmetic=E2=80=9D = changes. =20 However, the draft-ietf-idr-bgp-ls-segment-routing-ext-04 is in WGLC and = I can definitely take your feedback for any updates in the text or = clarifications necessary in this document. Note that the procedures for = the TLVs where mappings were non-trivial are described in the Procedures = section - = https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-idr-bgp-ls-segment-routing-ext-04#= section-3 . The TLVs you mention below are very trivial and the mapping = from IGPs to BGP-LS is straightforward so the authors believe the = explanation in Section 2 where each TLV field is described is = sufficient.=20 =20 In the end, I am not sure if any of this helps/addresses implementation = defects (where the reserved field itself was skipped from the BGP-LS = TLV) that you have identified in your deployment on the producer side. =20 Thanks, Ketan =20 From: Aijun Wang =20 Sent: 08 April 2018 07:02 To: Ketan Talaulikar (ketant) Cc: 'Jeffrey Haas' ; lsr@ietf.org; idr@ietf.org Subject: =E7=AD=94=E5=A4=8D: [Lsr] Inconsistence regarding the = definition of "Adj-SID Sub-TLV" between OSPF and ISIS extension for = Segment Routing =20 Hi, Ketan: =20 I think there is another reason that causes this semantic error-----that = is there is many similarities for the definition of =E2=80=9CAdj-SID = Sub-TLV=E2=80=9D for ISIS and OSPFv3 in the following draft: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ospf-ospfv3-segment-routing-extens= ions-11#section-6.1 https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensions-15= #section-2.2.1 =20 but there is no any description in the relevant paragraph to = distinguish them in BGP-LS document. https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-idr-bgp-ls-segment-routing-ext-04#= section-2.2.1 =20 Ketan explained that =E2=80=9CISIS uses 1 byte for type/length and has = LSP space constraints which you would notice in the protocol encodings. = OSPF doesn=E2=80=99t have the same challenge and you would notice how = its TLVs tend to be aligned. BGP-LS is somewhat similar to OSPF from = these size constraints perspective.=E2=80=9D But when I compared another = TLV definition =E2=80=9CSRMS Preference TLV=E2=80=9D in randomly, I = found the definition in BGP-LS is different from that both in ISIS and = OSPFv3.(include the =E2=80=9Clength=E2=80=9D field and = =E2=80=9Creserved=E2=80=9D field) I don=E2=80=99t know there are how = many inconsistence among them and think this will induce other = inconsistencies when the vendor implements the BGP-LS protocol. =20 Can we align these definitions as consistence as possible among them? Or = add clear distinguish statements for the different IGP protocol? The consumer can add some detections for such kind semantic errors but = the better is not to produce them. =20 =20 Best Regards. =20 Aijun Wang Network R&D and Operation Support Department China Telecom Corporation Limited Beijing Research Institute,Beijing, = China. =E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: Ketan Talaulikar (ketant) = [mailto:ketant@cisco.com]=20 =E5=8F=91=E9=80=81=E6=97=B6=E9=97=B4: 2018=E5=B9=B44=E6=9C=884=E6=97=A5 = 15:54 =E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: Aijun Wang =E6=8A=84=E9=80=81: Jeffrey Haas; lsr@ietf.org; idr@ietf.org =E4=B8=BB=E9=A2=98: Re: [Lsr] Inconsistence regarding the definition of = "Adj-SID Sub-TLV" between OSPF and ISIS extension for Segment Routing =20 < including IDR WG where BGP-LS work is being done > =20 Hi Aijun, =20 As discussed offline, this is a bug in this particular implementation = where it is not following the spec properly. =20 This goes back to the discussion in the IDR WG about the semantic and = syntactic validation for BGP-LS messages which Jeff had brought up. In = this case, my understanding was that there was a semantic error in this = TLV encoding? The consumer (application/BGP speaker) in this case should = detect and ignore this update =E2=80=93 which is what was being done as = well in this case? =20 Thanks, Ketan =20 From: Aijun Wang =20 Sent: 04 April 2018 07:50 To: 'stefano previdi' ; Peter Psenak (ppsenak) = Cc: lsr@ietf.org; Ketan Talaulikar (ketant) ; Acee = Lindem (acee) Subject: =E7=AD=94=E5=A4=8D: [Lsr] Inconsistence regarding the = definition of "Adj-SID Sub-TLV" between OSPF and ISIS extension for = Segment Routing =20 Hi, All: =20 We have found some inconsistencies for the implementation of BGP-LS = protocol regarding this =E2=80=9CAdj-SID SubTLV =E2=80=9D, please see = the following screenshot. I think we should do some works for the related drafts to clarify this = ambiguous/easy to be ignored definition. =20 =20 =20 Best Regards. =20 Aijun Wang Network R&D and Operation Support Department China Telecom Corporation Limited Beijing Research Institute,Beijing, = China. =20 -----=E9=82=AE=E4=BB=B6=E5=8E=9F=E4=BB=B6----- =E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: stefano previdi = [mailto:stefano@previdi.net]=20 =E5=8F=91=E9=80=81=E6=97=B6=E9=97=B4: 2018=E5=B9=B44=E6=9C=883=E6=97=A5 = 15:39 =E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: Peter Psenak =E6=8A=84=E9=80=81: lsr@ietf.org; Ketan Talaulikar (ketant); Acee Lindem = (acee); Aijun Wang =E4=B8=BB=E9=A2=98: Re: [Lsr] Inconsistence regarding the definition of = "Adj-SID Sub-TLV" between OSPF and ISIS extension for Segment Routing =20 me too.=20 =20 If we want to align the encoding, we should probably better align the = protocol name directly... =20 s. =20 =20 > On Apr 3, 2018, at 9:34 AM, Peter Psenak < = ppsenak@cisco.com> wrote: >=20 > On 02/04/18 14:19 , Acee Lindem (acee) wrote: >> Speaking as WG member: >>=20 >> I couldn=E2=80=99t agree more with Ketan. No changes are required to = these=20 >> documents. >=20 > as a coauthor of the OSPF/OSPFv3 SR drafts, I fully agree. >=20 > thanks, > Peter >=20 >>=20 >> Thanks, >>=20 >> Acee >>=20 >> *From: *Lsr < lsr-bounces@ietf.org> on = behalf of "Ketan Talaulikar=20 >> (ketant)" < ketant@cisco.com> >> *Date: *Monday, April 2, 2018 at 7:36 AM >> *To: *Aijun Wang < = wangaijun@tsinghua.org.cn> >> *Cc: *" lsr@ietf.org" < = lsr@ietf.org> >> *Subject: *Re: [Lsr] Inconsistence regarding the definition of=20 >> "Adj-SID Sub-TLV" between OSPF and ISIS extension for Segment Routing >>=20 >> Hi Aijun, >>=20 >> I understand what you are referring to now, but these are not=20 >> inconsistencies. ISIS, OSPF and BGP-LS are 3 different protocols.=20 >> Their encodings may not all be the same. ISIS uses 1 byte for=20 >> type/length and has LSP space constraints which you would notice in=20 >> the protocol encodings. OSPF doesn=E2=80=99t have the same challenge = and you=20 >> would notice how its TLVs tend to be aligned. BGP-LS is somewhat=20 >> similar to OSPF from these size constraints perspective. >>=20 >> I do not see the implementation challenges in encoding from the two=20 >> IGPs into BGP-LS. It does not make sense to change any of the=20 >> protocol encodings that you ask for currently since implementations=20 >> have been shipping with them for many years. >>=20 >> IMHO it is not necessary to put such constraints for what you call=20 >> =E2=80=9Cconsistency=E2=80=9D on these 3 protocol encodings in the = future. However,=20 >> we do try to be consistent in semantics as much as possible. >>=20 >> Thanks, >>=20 >> Ketan >>=20 >> *From:*Aijun Wang < = wangaijun@tsinghua.org.cn> >> *Sent:* 02 April 2018 16:52 >> *To:* Ketan Talaulikar (ketant) < = ketant@cisco.com> >> *Cc:* lsr@ietf.org >> *Subject:* Re: [Lsr] Inconsistence regarding the definition of=20 >> "Adj-SID Sub-TLV" between OSPF and ISIS extension for Segment Routing >>=20 >> Hi, Ketan: >>=20 >> There is one two-bytes =E2=80=9CReserved=E2=80=9D field in = =E2=80=9CAdjacency Segment=20 >> Identifier=E2=80=9D TLV for OSPF extension, but this field = doesn=E2=80=99t exist in=20 >> the corresponding TLV for ISIS extension. Every other fields are = same. >>=20 >> Corresponding definition in BGP-LS is similar with OSPF(not similar=20 >> with ISIS as I mentioned in previous mail). Then when the router=20 >> reports/redistributes the ISIS LSDB information to BGP protocol, the=20 >> router must add two bytes to the =E2=80=9Clength=E2=80=9D field and = add/stuff the=20 >> =E2=80=9Creserved=E2=80=9D field; but for OSPF LSDB, the router need = only copy the=20 >> corresponding fields according. >>=20 >> We have found the error arises from this inconsistency from the real=20 >> router and think it is better to align this definition in different=20 >> IGP protocol. >>=20 >> Update to ISIS related extensions draft may be easier. >>=20 >> Aijun Wang >>=20 >> China Telecom >>=20 >>=20 >> =E5=9C=A8 = 2018=E5=B9=B44=E6=9C=882=E6=97=A5=EF=BC=8C18:26=EF=BC=8CKetan Talaulikar = (ketant)=20 >> < = ketant@cisco.com> =E5=86=99=E9=81=93=EF=BC=9A >>=20 >> Hi Aijun, >>=20 >> Can you clarify what you mean by = =E2=80=9Cinconsistencies=E2=80=9D? >>=20 >> Also, you are referring the old version of OSPFv3 SR draft before = it >> was aligned with the OSPFv2 SR draft. Please check >> =20 >> = = https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ospf-ospfv3-segment-routing-ex >> tensions-11#section-6.1 >>=20 >> OSPF and ISIS are different protocols and there are some = differences >> between them. I would not call them inconsistencies. BGP-LS spec >> refers to the individual IGP drafts for interpretation of flags. = So >> please specifically point out what inconsistency you are referring = to. >>=20 >> Thanks, >>=20 >> Ketan >>=20 >> *From:*Lsr < = = lsr-bounces@ietf.org> *On >> Behalf Of *Aijun Wang >> *Sent:* 02 April 2018 14:23 >> *To:* = lsr@ietf.org >> *Subject:* [Lsr] Inconsistence regarding the definition of = "Adj-SID >> Sub-TLV" between OSPF and ISIS extension for Segment Routing >>=20 >> Hi, All: >>=20 >> We found there were some inconsistences for the definition of >> =E2=80=9CAdjacency Segment Identifier=E2=80=9D between OSPF and = ISIS extension for >> segment routing, please see the link below for comparison. >>=20 >> =20 >> = = https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extension >> s-15#section-2.2.1 >>=20 >> =20 >> = = https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ospf-ospfv3-segment-routing-ex >> tensions-10#section-7.1 >>=20 >> Here we want to know is there any reason for this inconsistence? = We >> think this inconsistence can easily cause error for BGP-LS >> implementation for segment routing extension, as that defined in >> = = https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-idr-bgp-ls-segment-routing-ext-04#= section-2.2.1, >> which is similar with ISIS extension for SR, but different from = OSPF >> extension for SR. >>=20 >> Do we need to make them consistent? It seems change the definition >> in OSPF extension may be less influence for the existing related = drafts. >>=20 >> Best Regards. >>=20 >> Aijun Wang >>=20 >> Network R&D and Operation Support Department >>=20 >> China Telecom Corporation Limited Beijing Research >> Institute,Beijing, China. >>=20 >> _______________________________________________ >> Lsr mailing list >> = Lsr@ietf.org >> = https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >> _______________________________________________ >> Lsr mailing list >> Lsr@ietf.org >> = https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr >>=20 >=20 > _______________________________________________ > Lsr mailing list > Lsr@ietf.org > = https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr =20 _______________________________________________ Lsr mailing list Lsr@ietf.org = https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr ------=_NextPart_001_0085_01D3D0E7.35BA2210 Content-Type: text/html; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Hi, Ketan:

 

I read = through the section that you provided at https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-idr-bgp-ls-segm= ent-routing-ext-04#section-3, and think 3/4 parts of them = are unnecessary because the contents of 3.1,3.2 and 3.3 has been = mentioned at the corresponding TLV definition parts. Only 3.4 part is = necessary because it mentions the composite usage of two TLVs and = can=E2=80=99t fit in any previous TLV = definition.

 

My suggestion is that we add = some clarification under the error-prone TLV definition respectively, to = let the vendor refer them clearly when implementing the BGP-LS protocol. =

 

ISIS/OSPF/OSPFv3/BGP-LS are = different protocols in mainly the mechanism to transfer/digest the = message, not the extensible TLVs definition, especially for the same = purpose TLVs. There are some reasons that need to keep the definition = compact/different, but beyond that, we should align them as same as = possible to eliminate the error arose from inter-operation activities = among different vendor or between device vendor and the SDN = controller.

 

 

Best = Regards.

 

Aijun = Wang

Network R&D and Operation Support = Department

China Telecom Corporation Limited Beijing = Research Institute,Beijing, China.

 

=E5=8F=91=E4=BB= =B6=E4=BA=BA: Ketan = Talaulikar (ketant) [mailto:ketant@cisco.com]
=E5=8F=91=E9=80= =81=E6=97=B6=E9=97=B4: = 2018=E5=B9=B44=E6=9C=889=E6=97=A5 16:45
=E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: Aijun = Wang
=E6=8A=84=E9=80=81: 'Jeffrey Haas'; lsr@ietf.org; = idr@ietf.org
=E4=B8=BB=E9=A2=98: Re: [Lsr] Inconsistence = regarding the definition of "Adj-SID Sub-TLV" between OSPF and = ISIS extension for Segment = Routing

 

Hi = Aijun,

 

As responded previously and = also clarified by few others, the 3 IGP protocols (ISIS, OSPFv2 and = OSPFv3) and BGP-LS are different protocols. Their encodings need not be = identical. However, their semantics generally are so when it comes = mapping them into BGP-LS.

 

At this stage, given the = advance state of implementations and deployments for all these IGP and = BGP-LS drafts involved, I don=E2=80=99t think we can undertake such = =E2=80=9Ccosmetic=E2=80=9D changes.

 

However, the = draft-ietf-idr-bgp-ls-segment-routing-ext-04 is in WGLC and I can = definitely take your feedback for any updates in the text or = clarifications necessary in this document. Note that the procedures for = the TLVs where mappings were non-trivial are described in the Procedures = section - https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-idr-bgp-ls-segm= ent-routing-ext-04#section-3 . The TLVs you mention below are very = trivial and the mapping from IGPs to BGP-LS is straightforward so the = authors believe the explanation in Section 2 where each TLV field is = described is sufficient.

 

In the end, I am not sure if = any of this helps/addresses implementation defects (where the reserved = field itself was skipped from the BGP-LS TLV) that you have identified = in your deployment on the producer side.

 

Thanks,

Ketan

 

From: Aijun Wang <wangaijun@tsinghua.org.cn&g= t;
Sent: 08 April 2018 07:02
To: Ketan Talaulikar = (ketant) <ketant@cisco.com>
Cc: = 'Jeffrey Haas' <jhaas@pfrc.org>; lsr@ietf.org; idr@ietf.org
Subject: =
=E7=AD=94=E5=A4=8D: [Lsr] Inconsistence regarding the = definition of "Adj-SID Sub-TLV" between OSPF and ISIS = extension for Segment Routing

 

Hi, Ketan:

 

I think = there is another reason that causes this semantic error-----that is = there is many similarities for the definition of =E2=80=9CAdj-SID = Sub-TLV=E2=80=9D for ISIS and OSPFv3 in the following = draft:

https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ospf-= ospfv3-segment-routing-extensions-11#section-6.1

https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-isis-segme= nt-routing-extensions-15#section-2.2.1

 

but there = is no any description in the relevant paragraph to  distinguish = them in BGP-LS document.

https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-idr-bgp-ls-= segment-routing-ext-04#section-2.2.1

 

Ketan = explained that =E2=80=9CISIS uses 1 byte for = type/length and has LSP space constraints which you would notice in =  the protocol encodings. OSPF doesn=E2=80=99t = have the same challenge and you would notice how its TLVs tend to be = aligned. BGP-LS is somewhat similar to OSPF from these size constraints = perspective.=E2=80=9D But when I compared = another TLV definition =E2=80=9CSRMS Preference TLV=E2=80=9D in = randomly, I found the definition in BGP-LS is different from that both = in ISIS and OSPFv3.(include the =E2=80=9Clength=E2=80=9D field and = =E2=80=9Creserved=E2=80=9D field) I don=E2=80=99t know there are how = many inconsistence among them and think this will induce other = inconsistencies when the vendor implements the BGP-LS = protocol.

 

Can we = align these definitions as consistence as possible among them? Or add = clear distinguish statements for the different IGP = protocol?

The consumer can add some = detections for such kind semantic errors but the better is not to = produce them.

 

 

Best = Regards.

 

Aijun = Wang

Network R&D and Operation Support = Department

China Telecom Corporation Limited Beijing = Research Institute,Beijing, China.

=E5=8F=91=E4=BB= =B6=E4=BA=BA: Ketan = Talaulikar (ketant) [mailto:ketant@cisco.com] =
=E5=8F=91=E9=80= =81=E6=97=B6=E9=97=B4: = 2018=E5=B9=B44=E6=9C=884=E6=97=A5 = 15:54
=E6=94=B6=E4=BB= =B6=E4=BA=BA: Aijun = Wang
=E6=8A=84=E9=80= =81: Jeffrey Haas; = lsr@ietf.org; idr@ietf.org
=E4=B8=BB=E9=A2= =98: Re: [Lsr] = Inconsistence regarding the definition of "Adj-SID Sub-TLV" = between OSPF and ISIS extension for Segment = Routing

 

< including IDR = WG where BGP-LS work is being done >

 

Hi = Aijun,

 

As discussed offline, this is a = bug in this particular implementation where it is not following the spec = properly.

 

This goes back to the = discussion in the IDR WG about the semantic and syntactic validation for = BGP-LS messages which Jeff had brought up. In this case, my = understanding was that there was a semantic error in this TLV encoding? = The consumer (application/BGP speaker) in this case should detect and = ignore this update =E2=80=93 which is what was being done as well in = this case?

 

Thanks,

Ketan

 

From: Aijun Wang <wangaijun@tsinghua.org.cn&g= t;
Sent: 04 April 2018 07:50
To: 'stefano previdi' = <stefano@previdi.net>; = Peter Psenak (ppsenak) <ppsenak@cisco.com>
Cc:= lsr@ietf.org; Ketan Talaulikar = (ketant) <ketant@cisco.com>; Acee Lindem = (acee) <acee@cisco.com>
Subject: =
=E7=AD=94=E5=A4=8D: [Lsr] Inconsistence regarding the = definition of "Adj-SID Sub-TLV" between OSPF and ISIS = extension for Segment Routing

 

Hi, All:

 

We have found some inconsistencies for the implementation = of BGP-LS protocol regarding this =E2=80=9CAdj-SID SubTLV =E2=80=9D, = please see the following screenshot.

I think we should do some works = for the related drafts to clarify this ambiguous/easy to be ignored = definition.

 

 

 

Best = Regards.

 

Aijun Wang

Network R&D and Operation Support = Department

China Telecom Corporation Limited Beijing Research = Institute,Beijing, China.

 

-----=E9=82=AE=E4=BB=B6=E5=8E=9F=E4=BB= =B6-----
=E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: stefano previdi [mailto:stefano@previdi.net] =
=E5=8F=91=E9=80=81=E6=97=B6=E9=97= =B4: 2018=E5=B9=B44=E6=9C=883=E6=97=A5 15:39
=E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: Peter Psenak
=E6=8A=84=E9=80=81: lsr@ietf.org; Ketan = Talaulikar (ketant); Acee Lindem (acee); Aijun Wang
=E4=B8=BB=E9=A2=98: Re: [Lsr] Inconsistence regarding the definition of = "Adj-SID Sub-TLV" between OSPF and ISIS extension for Segment = Routing

 

me too.

 

If we want to align the encoding, we should probably better = align the protocol name directly...

 

s.

 

 

> On Apr 3, 2018, at 9:34 AM, = Peter Psenak <ppsenak@cisco.com<= /a>> wrote:

>

> On 02/04/18 14:19 , Acee Lindem (acee) = wrote:

>> Speaking as WG member:

>> =

>> I couldn=E2=80=99t = agree more with Ketan. No changes are required to these =

>> documents.

>

> as a coauthor of the = OSPF/OSPFv3 SR drafts, I fully agree.

>

> = thanks,

> Peter

>

>> =

>> Thanks,

>> =

>> Acee

>> =

>> *From: *Lsr <lsr-bounces@ietf.org> on behalf of "Ketan Talaulikar

>> (ketant)" <ketant@cisco.com>

>> *Date: *Monday, April 2, 2018 at 7:36 = AM

>> *To: *Aijun Wang <wangaijun@tsinghua.org.cn= >

>> *Cc: *"lsr@ietf.org&q= uot; <lsr@ietf.org&g= t;

>> *Subject: *Re: [Lsr] Inconsistence regarding the = definition of

>> "Adj-SID Sub-TLV" between OSPF and ISIS = extension for Segment Routing

>> =

>> Hi Aijun,

>> =

>> I understand what you are referring to now, but = these are not

>> inconsistencies. ISIS, OSPF and BGP-LS are 3 = different protocols.

>> Their encodings may not all be the same. ISIS uses = 1 byte for

>> type/length and has LSP space constraints which = you would notice in

>> the protocol encodings. OSPF doesn=E2=80=99t have the same challenge and you

>> would notice how its = TLVs tend to be aligned. BGP-LS is somewhat

>> similar to OSPF from = these size constraints perspective.

>> =

>> I do not see the implementation challenges in = encoding from the two

>> IGPs into BGP-LS. It = does not make sense to change any of the

>> protocol encodings that = you ask for currently since implementations

>> have been shipping with = them for many years.

>>

>> IMHO it is not = necessary to put such constraints for what you call =

>> =E2=80=9Cconsistency=E2=80=9D = on these 3 protocol encodings in the future. However, =

>> we do try to be consistent in semantics as much as = possible.

>>

>> = Thanks,

>>

>> = Ketan

>>

>> *From:*Aijun Wang = <wangaijun@tsinghua.org.cn= >

>> *Sent:* 02 April 2018 = 16:52

>> *To:* Ketan Talaulikar (ketant) <ketant@cisco.com>

>> *Cc:* lsr@ietf.org

>> = *Subject:* Re: [Lsr] Inconsistence regarding the definition of =

>> "Adj-SID Sub-TLV" between OSPF and ISIS = extension for Segment Routing

>> =

>> Hi, Ketan:

>> =

>> There is one two-bytes =E2=80=9CReserved=E2=80=9D = field in =E2=80=9CAdjacency Segment =

>> Identifier=E2=80=9D = TLV for OSPF extension, but this field doesn=E2=80=99t = exist in

>> the corresponding TLV for ISIS extension. Every = other fields are same.

>> =

>> Corresponding definition in BGP-LS is similar with = OSPF(not similar

>> with ISIS as I mentioned in previous mail). Then = when the router

>> reports/redistributes the ISIS LSDB information to = BGP protocol, the

>> router must add two bytes to the =E2=80=9Clength=E2=80=9D = field and add/stuff the

>> =E2=80=9Creserved=E2=80=9D = field; but for OSPF LSDB, the router need only copy the =

>> corresponding fields = according.

>>

>> We have found the error = arises from this inconsistency from the real

>> router and think it is = better to align this definition in different

>> IGP = protocol.

>>

>> Update to ISIS related = extensions draft may be easier.

>> =

>> Aijun Wang

>> =

>> China Telecom

>> =

>>

>> =E5=9C=A8 2018=E5=B9=B44=E6=9C=882=E6=97=A5=EF=BC=8C18:26=EF=BC=8CKetan Talaulikar (ketant)

>> <ketant@cisco.com<mailt= o:ketant@cisco.com>> =E5=86=99=E9=81=93=EF=BC=9A

>>

>>    Hi = Aijun,

>>

>>    Can = you clarify what you mean by =E2=80=9Cinconsistencies=E2=80=9D?

>>

>>    Also, = you are referring the old version of OSPFv3 SR draft before = it

>>    was aligned with the OSPFv2 SR = draft. Please check

>>   

>> https://tools.ietf.org/ht= ml/draft-ietf-ospf-ospfv3-segment-routing-ex=

>> = tensions-11#section-6.1

>> =

>>    OSPF and ISIS are different = protocols and there are some differences

>>    = between them. I would not call them inconsistencies. BGP-LS = spec

>>    refers to the individual IGP = drafts for interpretation of flags. So

>>    = please specifically point out what inconsistency you are referring = to.

>>

>>    = Thanks,

>>

>>    = Ketan

>>

>>    = *From:*Lsr <lsr-bounces@ietf.org<m= ailto:lsr-bounces@ietf.org>> = *On

>>    Behalf Of *Aijun = Wang

>>    *Sent:* 02 April 2018 = 14:23

>>    *To:* lsr@ietf.org<mailto:ls= r@ietf.org>

>>    = *Subject:* [Lsr] Inconsistence regarding the definition of = "Adj-SID

>>    Sub-TLV" between OSPF and = ISIS extension for Segment Routing

>> =

>>    Hi, All:

>> =

>>    We found there were some = inconsistences for the definition of

>>    = =E2=80=9CAdjacency Segment = Identifier=E2=80=9D between OSPF and ISIS = extension for

>>    segment routing, please see the = link below for comparison.

>> =

>>   

>> https://tools.ietf.org/ht= ml/draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extension=

>> = s-15#section-2.2.1

>>

>>    =

>> https://tools.ietf.org/ht= ml/draft-ietf-ospf-ospfv3-segment-routing-ex=

>> = tensions-10#section-7.1

>> =

>>    Here we want to know is there = any reason for this inconsistence? We

>>    think = this inconsistence can easily cause error for = BGP-LS

>>    implementation for segment = routing extension, as that defined in

>>    https://tools.ietf.org/ht= ml/draft-ietf-idr-bgp-ls-segment-routing-ext-04#section-2.2.1,=

>>    which is similar with ISIS = extension for SR, but different from OSPF

>>    = extension for SR.

>>

>>    Do we = need to make them consistent? It seems change the = definition

>>    in OSPF extension may be less = influence for the existing related drafts.

>> =

>>    Best = Regards.

>>

>>    Aijun = Wang

>>

>>    = Network R&D and Operation Support Department

>> =

>>    China Telecom Corporation = Limited Beijing Research

>>    = Institute,Beijing, China.

>> =

>>    = _______________________________________________

>>    Lsr = mailing list

>>    Lsr@ietf.org<mailto:Ls= r@ietf.org>

>>    https://www.ietf.org/mail= man/listinfo/lsr

>> =

>>

>> =

>> = _______________________________________________

>> Lsr mailing = list

>> Lsr@ietf.org

>> = https://www.ietf.org/mail= man/listinfo/lsr

>> =

> =

> = _______________________________________________

> Lsr mailing = list

> Lsr@ietf.org

> https://www.ietf.org/mail= man/listinfo/lsr

 

_______________________________________________

Lsr mailing = list

Lsr@ietf.org

https://www.ietf.org/mail= man/listinfo/lsr

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-0500 From: "Ketan Talaulikar (ketant)" To: Aijun Wang CC: "'Jeffrey Haas'" , "lsr@ietf.org" , "idr@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [Lsr] Inconsistence regarding the definition of "Adj-SID Sub-TLV" between OSPF and ISIS extension for Segment Routing Thread-Index: AdPKX89aH7daBvUkQYK90A0ibbwqrwAABY/wAAMor+AADI+6AAAKaB1g//+8yYCAAUKmgIAAASyAgAE5PQD///jZsP/6GqLA//Ij5mD/4sBmkP/FY5NQ Date: Tue, 10 Apr 2018 09:51:56 +0000 Message-ID: <976d14cb861e49d4b42cf90ef19056d7@XCH-ALN-008.cisco.com> References: <008101d3ca60$073f81b0$15be8510$@org.cn> <1B346347-9242-4EE4-BDA2-F024EF483B8A@tsinghua.org.cn> <8C26288C-54C3-4C04-91A6-2B99562A1DE9@cisco.com> <5AC32E8B.6090202@cisco.com> <009b01d3cbbb$6bfc3510$43f49f30$@org.cn> <018c01d3ced9$6416b070$2c441150$@org.cn> <008301d3d0a4$2796e210$76c4a630$@org.cn> In-Reply-To: <008301d3d0a4$2796e210$76c4a630$@org.cn> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: yes X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted x-originating-ip: 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([64.101.220.155]) with mapi id 15.00.1320.000; Wed, 11 Apr 2018 16:36:41 -0400 From: "Acee Lindem (acee)" To: "lsr@ietf.org" CC: "draft-hegdeppsenak-isis-sr-flex-algo@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: Flex Algorithms Drafts Thread-Index: AQHT0dTMo+FzEAnDWESqz9y5I85flw== Date: Wed, 11 Apr 2018 20:36:41 +0000 Message-ID: <6C9DDF29-72D8-4630-82AD-342CC134EB36@cisco.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted x-originating-ip: [10.116.152.200] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-ID: Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Subject: [Lsr] Flex Algorithms Drafts X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 11 Apr 2018 20:36:45 -0000 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b=RGSoBeCxIlVNci7Og4/0c88IpRqBEowFGgdGMJxtrbVicGfCNEP1pwfS 7oHlu/v/VRim3THoXsNhnQPeYgkJP0LOfeOSa+g7dLPrMBmodQYpgPXR5 oeJHIZUFQ7nZlXcO3F8FjDidwFN8sCkDKsEBL8hF9aynGyu6tJG2L5zrC g=; X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.48,440,1517875200"; d="scan'208";a="3143843" Received: from aer-iport-nat.cisco.com (HELO aer-core-1.cisco.com) ([173.38.203.22]) by aer-iport-1.cisco.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384; 12 Apr 2018 07:35:29 +0000 Received: from [10.60.140.57] (ams-ppsenak-nitro8.cisco.com [10.60.140.57]) by aer-core-1.cisco.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id w3C7ZT5S020476; Thu, 12 Apr 2018 07:35:29 GMT Message-ID: <5ACF0C41.1090506@cisco.com> Date: Thu, 12 Apr 2018 09:35:29 +0200 From: Peter Psenak User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.11; rv:24.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/24.4.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Acee Lindem (acee)" , "lsr@ietf.org" CC: "draft-hegdeppsenak-isis-sr-flex-algo@ietf.org" References: <6C9DDF29-72D8-4630-82AD-342CC134EB36@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <6C9DDF29-72D8-4630-82AD-342CC134EB36@cisco.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] Flex Algorithms Drafts X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 12 Apr 2018 07:35:34 -0000 Hi Acee, On 11/04/18 22:36 , Acee Lindem (acee) wrote: > In preparation for WG adoption and IANA early code point allocation, I suggest that we rename the “Flexible Algorithm Definition TLV Metric Registry†to the “Flexible Algorithm Definition TLV Metric Type Registry†to avoid confusion as to whether we are defining the actual metrics here. I know that in the contexts of the drafts, it is clear but the registries are going to be on their own. Additionally, while protocol TLV types should not be shared between protocols, it seems this registry could be common and placed in our "Interior Gateway Protocol (IGP) Parameters" registry. sure I can make that change. > > Finally, the OSPF version has a typo in section 8.2. The last two types should be 2 and 3. right, will fix it. > > o 0 - Reserved > > o 1 - Flexible Algorithm Exclude Admin Group Sub-TLV > > o 1 - Flexible Algorithm Include-Any Admin Group Sub-TLV > > o 1 - Flexible Algorithm Exclude-All Group Sub-TLV > > Also, how so the authors feel about combining the drafts? I know the IS-IS version has had more discussion and wouldn't want to hold it up if there is a possibility. I don't feel strongly one way or another. I'm fine both ways. thanks, Peter > > Thanks, > Acee > From nobody Thu Apr 12 02:48:42 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id ED658124319; Thu, 12 Apr 2018 02:48:40 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -14.51 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-14.51 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_DKIMWL_WL_HIGH=-0.01, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=cisco.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 42DmvLiIe_Di; Thu, 12 Apr 2018 02:48:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from alln-iport-7.cisco.com 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"Acee Lindem (acee)" , "lsr@ietf.org" CC: "draft-hegdeppsenak-isis-sr-flex-algo@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [Lsr] Flex Algorithms Drafts Thread-Index: AQHT0dTMo+FzEAnDWESqz9y5I85fl6P9EdGA///QT3A= Date: Thu, 12 Apr 2018 09:48:37 +0000 Message-ID: References: <6C9DDF29-72D8-4630-82AD-342CC134EB36@cisco.com> <5ACF0C41.1090506@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <5ACF0C41.1090506@cisco.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted x-originating-ip: [10.65.74.246] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] Flex Algorithms Drafts X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 12 Apr 2018 09:48:41 -0000 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([64.101.220.155]) with mapi id 15.00.1320.000; Thu, 12 Apr 2018 09:08:53 -0400 From: "Acee Lindem (acee)" To: "Ketan Talaulikar (ketant)" , "lsr@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: LSR WG Last Call for "Signaling MSD (Maximum SID Depth) using OSPF" - draft-ietf-ospf-segment-routing-msd-10.txt Thread-Index: AQHTzUETs42zzUGpBkCsVN6fOMVtjqP88MKQgAAzigA= Date: Thu, 12 Apr 2018 13:08:53 +0000 Message-ID: <451D7E30-F5CF-4C29-B4A8-9304FBAC63C2@cisco.com> References: In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted x-originating-ip: [10.116.152.200] Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_451D7E30F5CF4C29B4A89304FBAC63C2ciscocom_" MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] LSR WG Last Call for "Signaling MSD (Maximum SID Depth) using OSPF" - draft-ietf-ospf-segment-routing-msd-10.txt X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 12 Apr 2018 13:09:01 -0000 --_000_451D7E30F5CF4C29B4A89304FBAC63C2ciscocom_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 SGkgS2V0YW4sDQpUaGFua3MgbXVjaCBmb3IgdGhlIHRob3JvdWdoIHJldmlldyDigJMgaXQgaXMg bXVjaCBhcHByZWNpYXRlZCEgIEnigJlsbCBsZWF2ZSBpdCB0byB0aGUgYXV0aG9ycyB0byByZXNw b25kLiBIb3dldmVyLCBJIGFncmVlIHdpdGggc2hvdWxkIGhhdmUgYSBzaW5nbGUgSUFOQSBNU0Qg dHlwZSByZWdpc3RyeS4NClRoYW5rcywNCkFjZWUNCg0KDQpGcm9tOiAiS2V0YW4gVGFsYXVsaWth ciAoa2V0YW50KSIgPGtldGFudEBjaXNjby5jb20+DQpEYXRlOiBUaHVyc2RheSwgQXByaWwgMTIs IDIwMTggYXQgODowNCBBTQ0KVG86IEFjZWUgTGluZGVtIDxhY2VlQGNpc2NvLmNvbT4sICJsc3JA aWV0Zi5vcmciIDxsc3JAaWV0Zi5vcmc+DQpTdWJqZWN0OiBSRTogTFNSIFdHIExhc3QgQ2FsbCBm b3IgIlNpZ25hbGluZyBNU0QgKE1heGltdW0gU0lEIERlcHRoKSB1c2luZyBPU1BGIiAtIGRyYWZ0 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ALQs6tDNL+LhuaWSbBV6qKqCDDkdppN4FvkO/HQjfL5EnYaI3yhLegmM FOQoMI2KZ+uZ8+F68IIrB4U/CzF6V7vzV9v67X42uA== X-Google-Smtp-Source: AIpwx4/0V6qF5zowdfyc/2bEHforIJXPc1B/SFe/wM+qtDCTJh4dgDjDeFLzKqXgBh3TDFG4+mclmiUYQMzoNbBQzSU= X-Received: by 10.80.192.72 with SMTP id u8mr16134504edd.16.1523547929287; Thu, 12 Apr 2018 08:45:29 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.80.169.93 with HTTP; Thu, 12 Apr 2018 08:44:49 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <2FF54200-BFCB-4492-BE21-441192D48BAE@cisco.com> References: <6C9DDF29-72D8-4630-82AD-342CC134EB36@cisco.com> <5ACF0C41.1090506@cisco.com> <2FF54200-BFCB-4492-BE21-441192D48BAE@cisco.com> From: Tony Przygienda Date: Thu, 12 Apr 2018 08:44:49 -0700 Message-ID: To: "Acee Lindem (acee)" Cc: "Peter Psenak (ppsenak)" , "lsr@ietf.org" , "draft-hegdeppsenak-isis-sr-flex-algo@ietf.org" Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="94eb2c1cd46c1fa0100569a8a575" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] Flex Algorithms Drafts X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 12 Apr 2018 15:45:35 -0000 --94eb2c1cd46c1fa0100569a8a575 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" On Thu, Apr 12, 2018 at 2:52 AM, Acee Lindem (acee) wrote: > Hi Peter, > > Ok - we'll decide during whether to merge during the WG adoption call. It > would be a good LSR experiment for a combined draft if there are no > significant differences between the protocols that would make a combined > draft unwieldy. > > agreed ... If the only difference is encoding really it may be far more practical to have one draft with appendix/section per protocol giving those, in a sense I wish we had a single bier-lsr draft albeit IME Peter/Les are doing an excellent job keeping things in tight lock-step ... thanks --- tony --94eb2c1cd46c1fa0100569a8a575 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


On Thu, Apr 12, 2018 at 2:52 AM, Acee Lindem (acee) &= lt;acee@cisco.com&g= t; wrote:
Hi Peter,

Ok - we'll decide during whether to merge during the WG adoption call. = It would be a good LSR experiment for a combined draft if there are no sign= ificant differences between the protocols that would make a combined draft = unwieldy.


agreed ... If the only difference is e= ncoding really it may be far more practical to have one draft with appendix= /section per protocol giving those, in a sense I wish we had a single bier-= lsr draft albeit IME Peter/Les are doing an excellent job keeping things in= tight lock-step ...

thanks

--- tony= =C2=A0

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Thu, 12 Apr 2018 17:37:03 -0000 --f403043ec138e2890a0569aa337d Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Support Thanks Padma On Mon, Apr 9, 2018 at 9:28 PM, Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) wrote: > Support (as co-author). > > > > This correction is needed to insure that interoperability is assured. > > > > Les > > > > > > *From:* Lsr *On Behalf Of *Acee Lindem (acee) > *Sent:* Monday, April 09, 2018 12:20 PM > *To:* lsr@ietf.org > *Subject:* [Lsr] LSR WG Adoption call for "IS-IS Traffic Engineering (TE) > Metric Extensions" - draft-ginsberg-lsr-isis-rfc7810bis-00 > > > > This draft simply fixes a problem in RFC 7810 that resulted in an > incompatibility issue with implementations. Given the simplicity of this > document, I=E2=80=99d like to have an abbreviated WG adoption call of one= week. > Please indicate your support or objections to this document by April 17th= , > 2018. > > > > Thanks, > Acee > > _______________________________________________ > Lsr mailing list > Lsr@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr > > --f403043ec138e2890a0569aa337d Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
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07:34:40 -0400 From: "Acee Lindem (acee)" To: Jeff Tantsura , Tal Mizrahi CC: "draft-ietf-ospf-segment-routing-msd@ietf.org" , "ospf-chairs@ietf.org" , "lsr@ietf.org" , "rtg-dir@ietf.org" , "rtg-ads@ietf.org" , "Ketan Talaulikar (ketant)" Thread-Topic: RtgDir Early review: draft-ietf-ospf-segment-routing-msd.txt Thread-Index: AQHT36nN6o1KN0Oydk+ebtPVYwdCT6QX2G6AgAE2GICAACCYgA== Date: Mon, 30 Apr 2018 11:34:40 +0000 Message-ID: <642EC4AB-8F92-4AB3-898F-2311D9AACFA0@cisco.com> References: <3996EFD6-D0DB-41B0-9C50-C10770E36CF6@gmail.com> In-Reply-To: <3996EFD6-D0DB-41B0-9C50-C10770E36CF6@gmail.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted x-originating-ip: [10.116.152.196] Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_642EC4AB8F924AB3898F2311D9AACFA0ciscocom_" MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] RtgDir Early review: 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Thanks
Padma
--f403043ec138e2890a0569aa337d-- From nobody Sat Apr 14 15:48:32 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 61AC01270AC; Sat, 14 Apr 2018 15:48:31 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -14.509 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-14.509 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_DKIMWL_WL_MED=-0.01, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=cisco.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id BaoQol083SXE; Sat, 14 Apr 2018 15:48:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from aer-iport-1.cisco.com (aer-iport-1.cisco.com [173.38.203.51]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher DHE-RSA-SEED-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 142EF124217; Sat, 14 Apr 2018 15:48:26 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cisco.com; i=@cisco.com; l=22991; q=dns/txt; s=iport; t=1523746107; x=1524955707; h=subject:to:cc:references:from:message-id:date: mime-version:in-reply-to; bh=XKn2mxlljuv4bmevfOApl5f4pSQJ4G+HHwt9xFbq9Hs=; b=msubUi3WWEnIKdFYCAbq7D1luUNW9uYo3XIPtNG+kpoP9C7y0EPAm8Yl sI6gBB7NhoRGIpkMMb24a8mqt6Etcn6esWu0/2b9fx2008npDdhufNKkC UKoU06FW3W1PnxsIJsgbylE0G25C5VXqtU+yq4aZJEqx0zg8k0dtJ77Mv I=; X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.48,451,1517875200"; d="scan'208,217";a="3195090" Received: from aer-iport-nat.cisco.com (HELO aer-core-2.cisco.com) ([173.38.203.22]) by aer-iport-1.cisco.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384; 14 Apr 2018 22:48:25 +0000 Received: from asm-linux.cisco.com (ams-asmirnov-nitro6.cisco.com [10.55.206.135]) (authenticated bits=0) by aer-core-2.cisco.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id w3EMmOiN028637 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=NO); Sat, 14 Apr 2018 22:48:25 GMT To: "Acee Lindem (acee)" , "draft-ietf-ospf-xaf-te@ietf.org" Cc: "lsr@ietf.org" References: <5189f820-58a2-7783-284f-1bdbfc5f054f@cisco.com> From: Anton Smirnov Organization: Cisco Systems Message-ID: Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2018 00:48:19 +0200 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/52.5.2 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------C4D78121742BBCEB8BA3CC83" Content-Language: en-US X-Authenticated-User: asmirnov Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] OSPF Routing with Cross-Address Family MPLS Traffic Engineering Tunnels X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 14 Apr 2018 22:48:31 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------C4D78121742BBCEB8BA3CC83 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit    Hi Acee,    sorry for my slow response.    Before answering questions lets establish 'prerequisites' of the problem. - Network is dual stack, OSPFv2 is used to route IPv4, OSPFv3 is used to route IPv6 - TE LSAs are originated as per [RFC3630] and flooded in OSPFv2 - 'Endpoint' of each MPLS TE tunnel is IPv4 address - There is a desire to make OSPFv3 to compute IPv6 routes over TE tunnels - of which OSPFv3 has no topological information >      >  3. In the section 3 mapping algorithm, why do you walk the X-AF >      >     endpoints from all connected areas? Why not just the area > of local >      >     IP address? > >         Idea behind this wording is to cater for cases when area > borders are >     laid differently in OSPFv2 and OSPFv3. It's even possible that > router is >     ABR in OSPFv2 but not OSPFv3. From network design perspective > this, of >     course, is a terrible thing to do - but not impossible. > > I guess I still don't understand. Are you implying that you are > advertising TE LSAs using both OSPFv2 and OSPFv3 and aggregating the > TED and since the area boundaries may be different, you need to search > all the areas LSP endpoints? I don't think this deployment model makes > sense and I don't think this should be supported.    No, TE LSAs are advertised only in OSPFv2.    Consider information available to OSPFv3 on tunnel headend router. Endpoint address of TE tunnel is IPv4 address, say 7.7.7.7 (this address is what tunnel tailend router advertises in OSPFv2 TE LSA in the Router Address TLV). OSPFv3 needs to find what router in what area corresponds to router that advertises that TE LSA in OSPFv2.    That is, OSPFv3 has no its own TE information and not even a hint to which area may belong the tailend router. > > >      >  4. In the backward compatibility section, can you also discuss the >      >     requirements for backward compatibility of the endpoints? > Also state >      >     that the X-AF tunnel will not be recognized unless the > endpoints are >      >     advertised by the same protocol (OSPFv2 or OSPFv3); or > describe the >      >     behavior if this is not the intension. > >         We can add paragraph saying something like: >     "In order for XAF computation to work tunnel tailend routers MUST >     advertise XAF Node Local Address sub-TLVs in OSPF instance that will >     perform XAF computation. Thus only tunnel endpoints (both tunnel > headend >     and tailend routers) and only OSPF protocol instance performing XAF >     routing must implement XAF as described in this document. Other > routers >     in the network do not need to implement XAF algorithm or interpret > Node >     Local Address sub-TLVs. For example, if network uses TE tunnels > signaled >     by OSPFv2 [RFC3630] and intends to use cross-AF route computation in >     OSPFv3 then only OSPFv3 implementation on routers that serve as > tunnel >     endpoints in OSPFv2 needs to be compliant with this specification." > >     Will this text work? > > I think this could be a lot clearer if it were written from the > perspective of the head-end router performing the calculation. Also, > you lost me completely with the last sentence. We are uses a single > protocol, OSPFv2 or OSPFv3 to advertise TE LSAs. Since both IPv4 and > IPv6 traffic is tunneled over that LSP, there is no reason to operate > both protocols since traffic will take the path of the X-AF LSP - > correct? > But OSPFv2 does not produce IPv6 routes. Both protocols operate in the network: - OSPFv2 computes IPv4 routes and distributes TE database - OSPFv3 computes IPv6 routes. If TE tunnels provide shortcut to destination then OSPFv3 will point route into the tunnel. --- Anton On 04/07/18 23:06, Acee Lindem (acee) wrote: > Hi Anton, > > On 4/6/18, 7:33 AM, "Anton Smirnov (asmirnov)" > wrote: > >         Hi Acee, >         my answers below (I didn't vet them with other authors, so > they may >     express different opinions). > >      >  1. Have you considered a shorter name for the RFC? For > example: “OSPF >      >     Cross Address Family Traffic Engineering Tunnels� > >         Your proposed variant drops two pieces: "Routing with" and > "MPLS". >     Dropping mention to MPLS is fine with me. Dropping "Routing with" > seems >     to me less correct because the draft is about ways to compute > routes and >     not about setting up/managing tunnels. >         But ultimately I have no strong feelings here and if there is a >     requirement to shorten document's name then that would be a good > candidate. > > >      >  2. Can you change the requirements language text to the RFC 8174 >     version? > >         OK, we will publish new document revision when we agreed on other >     points. > > >      >  3. In the section 3 mapping algorithm, why do you walk the X-AF >      >     endpoints from all connected areas? Why not just the area > of local >      >     IP address? > >         Idea behind this wording is to cater for cases when area > borders are >     laid differently in OSPFv2 and OSPFv3. It's even possible that > router is >     ABR in OSPFv2 but not OSPFv3. From network design perspective > this, of >     course, is a terrible thing to do - but not impossible. > > I guess I still don't understand. Are you implying that you are > advertising TE LSAs using both OSPFv2 and OSPFv3 and aggregating the > TED and since the area boundaries may be different, you need to search > all the areas LSP endpoints? I don't think this deployment model makes > sense and I don't think this should be supported. > > >      >  4. In the backward compatibility section, can you also discuss the >      >     requirements for backward compatibility of the endpoints? > Also state >      >     that the X-AF tunnel will not be recognized unless the > endpoints are >      >     advertised by the same protocol (OSPFv2 or OSPFv3); or > describe the >      >     behavior if this is not the intension. > >         We can add paragraph saying something like: >     "In order for XAF computation to work tunnel tailend routers MUST >     advertise XAF Node Local Address sub-TLVs in OSPF instance that will >     perform XAF computation. Thus only tunnel endpoints (both tunnel > headend >     and tailend routers) and only OSPF protocol instance performing XAF >     routing must implement XAF as described in this document. Other > routers >     in the network do not need to implement XAF algorithm or interpret > Node >     Local Address sub-TLVs. For example, if network uses TE tunnels > signaled >     by OSPFv2 [RFC3630] and intends to use cross-AF route computation in >     OSPFv3 then only OSPFv3 implementation on routers that serve as > tunnel >     endpoints in OSPFv2 needs to be compliant with this specification." > >     Will this text work? > > I think this could be a lot clearer if it were written from the > perspective of the head-end router performing the calculation. Also, > you lost me completely with the last sentence. We are uses a single > protocol, OSPFv2 or OSPFv3 to advertise TE LSAs. Since both IPv4 and > IPv6 traffic is tunneled over that LSP, there is no reason to operate > both protocols since traffic will take the path of the X-AF LSP - > correct? > > Thanks, > Acee > > >     --- >     Anton > > >     On 04/04/18 20:13, Acee Lindem (acee) wrote: >     > Hi Anton, Alvaro, and Mike, >     > >     > In preparation for WG last call, I have a couple comments. >     > >     >  1. Have you considered a shorter name for the RFC? For example: > “OSPF >     >     Cross Address Family Traffic Engineering Tunnels� >     >  2. Can you change the requirements language text to the RFC > 8174 version? >     >  3. In the section 3 mapping algorithm, why do you walk the X-AF >     >     endpoints from all connected areas? Why not just the area of > local >     >     IP address? >     >  4. In the backward compatibility section, can you also discuss the >     >     requirements for backward compatibility of the endpoints? > Also state >     >     that the X-AF tunnel will not be recognized unless the > endpoints are >     >     advertised by the same protocol (OSPFv2 or OSPFv3); or > describe the >     >     behavior if this is not the intension. >     > >     > Thanks, >     > >     > Acee >     > > > --------------C4D78121742BBCEB8BA3CC83 Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit

   Hi Acee,

   sorry for my slow response.

   Before answering questions lets establish 'prerequisites' of the problem.

- Network is dual stack, OSPFv2 is used to route IPv4, OSPFv3 is used to route IPv6

- TE LSAs are originated as per [RFC3630] and flooded in OSPFv2

- 'Endpoint' of each MPLS TE tunnel is IPv4 address

- There is a desire to make OSPFv3 to compute IPv6 routes over TE tunnels - of which OSPFv3 has no topological information


     >  3. In the section 3 mapping algorithm, why do you walk the X-AF
     >     endpoints from all connected areas? Why not just the area of local
     >     IP address?
   
        Idea behind this wording is to cater for cases when area borders are
    laid differently in OSPFv2 and OSPFv3. It's even possible that router is
    ABR in OSPFv2 but not OSPFv3. From network design perspective this, of
    course, is a terrible thing to do - but not impossible.

I guess I still don't understand. Are you implying that you are advertising TE LSAs using both OSPFv2 and OSPFv3 and aggregating the TED and since the area boundaries may be different, you need to search all the areas LSP endpoints? I don't think this deployment model makes sense and I don't think this should be supported.


   No, TE LSAs are advertised only in OSPFv2.
   Consider information available to OSPFv3 on tunnel headend router. Endpoint address of TE tunnel is IPv4 address, say 7.7.7.7 (this address is what tunnel tailend router advertises in OSPFv2 TE LSA in the Router Address TLV). OSPFv3 needs to find what router in what area corresponds to router that advertises that TE LSA in OSPFv2.

   That is, OSPFv3 has no its own TE information and not even a hint to which area may belong the tailend router.


   
   
     >  4. In the backward compatibility section, can you also discuss the
     >     requirements for backward compatibility of the endpoints? Also state
     >     that the X-AF tunnel will not be recognized unless the endpoints are
     >     advertised by the same protocol (OSPFv2 or OSPFv3); or describe the
     >     behavior if this is not the intension.
   
        We can add paragraph saying something like:
    "In order for XAF computation to work tunnel tailend routers MUST
    advertise XAF Node Local Address sub-TLVs in OSPF instance that will
    perform XAF computation. Thus only tunnel endpoints (both tunnel headend
    and tailend routers) and only OSPF protocol instance performing XAF
    routing must implement XAF as described in this document. Other routers
    in the network do not need to implement XAF algorithm or interpret Node
    Local Address sub-TLVs. For example, if network uses TE tunnels signaled
    by OSPFv2 [RFC3630] and intends to use cross-AF route computation in
    OSPFv3 then only OSPFv3 implementation on routers that serve as tunnel
    endpoints in OSPFv2 needs to be compliant with this specification."
   
    Will this text work?

I think this could be a lot clearer if it were written from the perspective of the head-end router performing the calculation. Also, you lost me completely with the last sentence. We are uses a single protocol, OSPFv2 or OSPFv3 to advertise TE LSAs. Since both IPv4 and IPv6 traffic is tunneled over that LSP, there is no reason to operate both protocols since traffic will take the path of the X-AF LSP - correct?


But OSPFv2 does not produce IPv6 routes. Both protocols operate in the network:

- OSPFv2 computes IPv4 routes and distributes TE database

- OSPFv3 computes IPv6 routes. If TE tunnels provide shortcut to destination then OSPFv3 will point route into the tunnel.

---
Anton

On 04/07/18 23:06, Acee Lindem (acee) wrote:
Hi Anton,

On 4/6/18, 7:33 AM, "Anton Smirnov (asmirnov)" <asmirnov@cisco.com> wrote:

        Hi Acee,
        my answers below (I didn't vet them with other authors, so they may
    express different opinions).
   
     >  1. Have you considered a shorter name for the RFC? For example: “OSPF
     >     Cross Address Family Traffic Engineering Tunnels�
   
        Your proposed variant drops two pieces: "Routing with" and "MPLS".
    Dropping mention to MPLS is fine with me. Dropping "Routing with" seems
    to me less correct because the draft is about ways to compute routes and
    not about setting up/managing tunnels.
        But ultimately I have no strong feelings here and if there is a
    requirement to shorten document's name then that would be a good candidate.
   
   
     >  2. Can you change the requirements language text to the RFC 8174
    version?
   
        OK, we will publish new document revision when we agreed on other
    points.
   
   
     >  3. In the section 3 mapping algorithm, why do you walk the X-AF
     >     endpoints from all connected areas? Why not just the area of local
     >     IP address?
   
        Idea behind this wording is to cater for cases when area borders are
    laid differently in OSPFv2 and OSPFv3. It's even possible that router is
    ABR in OSPFv2 but not OSPFv3. From network design perspective this, of
    course, is a terrible thing to do - but not impossible.

I guess I still don't understand. Are you implying that you are advertising TE LSAs using both OSPFv2 and OSPFv3 and aggregating the TED and since the area boundaries may be different, you need to search all the areas LSP endpoints? I don't think this deployment model makes sense and I don't think this should be supported.
   
   
     >  4. In the backward compatibility section, can you also discuss the
     >     requirements for backward compatibility of the endpoints? Also state
     >     that the X-AF tunnel will not be recognized unless the endpoints are
     >     advertised by the same protocol (OSPFv2 or OSPFv3); or describe the
     >     behavior if this is not the intension.
   
        We can add paragraph saying something like:
    "In order for XAF computation to work tunnel tailend routers MUST
    advertise XAF Node Local Address sub-TLVs in OSPF instance that will
    perform XAF computation. Thus only tunnel endpoints (both tunnel headend
    and tailend routers) and only OSPF protocol instance performing XAF
    routing must implement XAF as described in this document. Other routers
    in the network do not need to implement XAF algorithm or interpret Node
    Local Address sub-TLVs. For example, if network uses TE tunnels signaled
    by OSPFv2 [RFC3630] and intends to use cross-AF route computation in
    OSPFv3 then only OSPFv3 implementation on routers that serve as tunnel
    endpoints in OSPFv2 needs to be compliant with this specification."
   
    Will this text work?

I think this could be a lot clearer if it were written from the perspective of the head-end router performing the calculation. Also, you lost me completely with the last sentence. We are uses a single protocol, OSPFv2 or OSPFv3 to advertise TE LSAs. Since both IPv4 and IPv6 traffic is tunneled over that LSP, there is no reason to operate both protocols since traffic will take the path of the X-AF LSP - correct?

Thanks,
Acee


    ---
    Anton
   
   
    On 04/04/18 20:13, Acee Lindem (acee) wrote:
    > Hi Anton, Alvaro, and Mike,
    >
    > In preparation for WG last call, I have a couple comments.
    >
    >  1. Have you considered a shorter name for the RFC? For example: “OSPF
    >     Cross Address Family Traffic Engineering Tunnels�
    >  2. Can you change the requirements language text to the RFC 8174 version?
    >  3. In the section 3 mapping algorithm, why do you walk the X-AF
    >     endpoints from all connected areas? Why not just the area of local
    >     IP address?
    >  4. In the backward compatibility section, can you also discuss the
    >     requirements for backward compatibility of the endpoints? Also state
    >     that the X-AF tunnel will not be recognized unless the endpoints are
    >     advertised by the same protocol (OSPFv2 or OSPFv3); or describe the
    >     behavior if this is not the intension.
    >
    > Thanks,
    >
    > Acee
    >
   


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<2FF54200-BFCB-4492-BE21-441192D48BAE@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <2FF54200-BFCB-4492-BE21-441192D48BAE@cisco.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.209.216.213] Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_25B4902B1192E84696414485F572685413553D22SJCEML521MBBchi_" MIME-Version: 1.0 X-CFilter-Loop: Reflected Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] Flex Algorithms Drafts X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2018 22:14:57 -0000 --_000_25B4902B1192E84696414485F572685413553D22SJCEML521MBBchi_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 RGVhciBBbGwsDQoNCg0KSSBhbSBuZXV0cmFsIHRvIGNvbWJpbmluZyB0aGUgY29udGVudCBvZiBP U1BGIGFuZCBJUy1JUyBpbnRvIGEgc2luZ2xlIGRyYWZ0Lg0KSG93ZXZlciwgSSBoYXZlIDIgcXVl 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"lsr@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [Lsr] Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-li-dynamic-flooding-04.txt Thread-Index: AQHTxeXN02afwyCBe0qEUPISs9QHaKP0WMWAgAAGLACAAAiPAIAPrZ2Q Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2018 22:20:33 +0000 Message-ID: <25B4902B1192E84696414485F572685413553D36@SJCEML521-MBB.china.huawei.com> References: <152216649041.5234.6342137041063769692.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> <7D2C1874-8B55-45B1-8C5F-D4C9C1F47D11@tony.li> <5AC78AE5.8020707@cisco.com> <6E69B9E3-14A6-4EED-BBE4-F5A424D57787@tony.li> <5AC79740.6060205@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <5AC79740.6060205@cisco.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.209.216.213] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-CFilter-Loop: Reflected Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-li-dynamic-flooding-04.txt X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2018 22:20:42 -0000 SGkgUGV0ZXIsDQoNCj4gSSBoYXZlIHRoZSBmZWVsaW5nIHRoYXQgdGhlIGRlcGVuZGVuY3kgb2Yg dGhlICJmbG9vZGluZyB0b3BvbG9neSIgb24gdGhlIGZsb29kZWQgZGF0YSBpcyBnb2luZyB0byBi cmluZyBtb3JlIGNvbXBsZXhpdHksIHRoYW4gdGhlIHNlbGVjdGlvbiBvZiB0aGUgZGlzdHJpYnV0 ZWQgYWxnb3JpdGhtIHRvIGJlIHVzZWQsIGlmIHdlIGV2ZXIgbmVlZCB0byBzdXBwb3J0IG1vcmUg dGhlbiBvbmUuDQoNCg0KSSBzZWUNCg0KaHR0cHM6Ly9kYXRhdHJhY2tlci5pZXRmLm9yZy9kb2Mv ZHJhZnQtaGVnZGVwcHNlbmFrLWlzaXMtc3ItZmxleC1hbGdvLz9pbmNsdWRlX3RleHQ9MSBwcm9w b3NlcyBmbGV4aWJsZSBhbGdvcml0aG1zIGZvciByb3V0ZSBjb21wdXRhdGlvbi4gDQoNCkhlcmUs IHlvdSBhcmUgc2F5aW5nIHNpbWlsYXIgdG8gZmxleGlibGUgYWxnb3JpdGhtcyBmb3Igcm91dGUg Y29tcHV0YXRpb24gLSBmbGV4aWJsZSBhbGdvcml0aG1zIGNhbiBiZSB1c2VkIGZvciBjb21wdXRp bmcgImZsb29kaW5nIHRvcG9sb2d5IiBpbiBhIGRpc3RyaWJ1dGVkIGZhc2hpb24gOyBpcyB0aGF0 IGNvcnJlY3Q/DQoNCkVsc2UgSSBkb24ndCBzZWUgYW55IGNvbm5lY3Rpb24gdG8gZGlmZmVyZW50 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YWlsaW5nIGxpc3QNCkxzckBpZXRmLm9yZw0KaHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuaWV0Zi5vcmcvbWFpbG1hbi9s aXN0aW5mby9sc3INCg== From nobody Mon Apr 16 15:28:25 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A1DE4129C6C for ; Mon, 16 Apr 2018 15:28:24 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.2 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.2 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 61uFVfHCqP9J for ; Mon, 16 Apr 2018 15:28:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from huawei.com (lhrrgout.huawei.com [194.213.3.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id BB216129C6B for ; Mon, 16 Apr 2018 15:28:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from lhreml704-cah.china.huawei.com (unknown [172.18.7.107]) by Forcepoint Email with ESMTP id 9FA7AAB4E70CB for ; Mon, 16 Apr 2018 23:28:17 +0100 (IST) Received: from SJCEML702-CHM.china.huawei.com (10.208.112.38) by lhreml704-cah.china.huawei.com (10.201.108.45) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 14.3.382.0; Mon, 16 Apr 2018 23:28:18 +0100 Received: from SJCEML521-MBB.china.huawei.com ([169.254.6.91]) by SJCEML702-CHM.china.huawei.com ([169.254.4.179]) with mapi id 14.03.0382.000; Mon, 16 Apr 2018 15:28:16 -0700 From: Uma Chunduri To: "Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)" , Jeff Tantsura , "Acee Lindem (acee)" , Tony Li CC: "lsr@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [Lsr] FW: New Version Notification for draft-ginsberg-isis-rfc7810bis-00.txt Thread-Index: AQHTy1pTDYQOpMXw80qZxNEhmGwTFaPw/uwggAB/pICAAAbEAIAACGcAgAAFu4CAEnlvIA== Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2018 22:28:15 +0000 Message-ID: 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boundary="_000_25B4902B1192E84696414485F572685413553D71SJCEML521MBBchi_" MIME-Version: 1.0 X-CFilter-Loop: Reflected Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] LSR WG Adoption call for "IS-IS Traffic Engineering (TE) Metric Extensions" - draft-ginsberg-lsr-isis-rfc7810bis-00 X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2018 22:29:53 -0000 --_000_25B4902B1192E84696414485F572685413553D71SJCEML521MBBchi_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 VGhhbmtzIGZvciBjbGVhcmx5IGRvY3VtZW50aW5nIHRoZSBjaGFuZ2VzIGJlaW5nIG1hZGUgaW4g YSBzZXBhcmF0ZSBzZWN0aW9uLg0KDQpTdXBwb3J0Lg0KDQoNCi0tDQpVbWEgQy4NCg0KDQoNCg0K T24gQXByIDksIDIwMTgsIGF0IDIxOjIwLCBBY2VlIExpbmRlbSAoYWNlZSkgPGFjZWVAY2lzY28u Y29tPG1haWx0bzphY2VlQGNpc2NvLmNvbT4+IHdyb3RlOg0KVGhpcyBkcmFmdCBzaW1wbHkgZml4 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AQHTy1pTDYQOpMXw80qZxNEhmGwTFaPw/uwggABeHYCAAAbEAIAACGcA//+xPrCAE0QXgP//r3EA Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2018 22:41:52 +0000 Message-ID: References: <303B9428-1EF5-417C-8223-DCB34440677B@cisco.com> <69468450ae0141098f7579d630b9cd33@XCH-ALN-001.cisco.com> <9469617E-7079-4374-86D7-A3EC721834F4@cisco.com> <6304AF65-771B-46E8-8CBA-F62FD5A12BFB@gmail.com> <54c850e7622e46388cc52ac25b251c6a@XCH-ALN-001.cisco.com> <25B4902B1192E84696414485F572685413553D61@SJCEML521-MBB.china.huawei.com> In-Reply-To: <25B4902B1192E84696414485F572685413553D61@SJCEML521-MBB.china.huawei.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted x-originating-ip: [10.24.72.48] Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_f75c21fcb8bf4defacbeb53127faa916XCHALN001ciscocom_" MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] FW: New Version Notification for draft-ginsberg-isis-rfc7810bis-00.txt X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2018 22:42:00 -0000 --_000_f75c21fcb8bf4defacbeb53127faa916XCHALN001ciscocom_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 VW1hIOKAkw0KDQpodHRwczovL3Rvb2xzLmlldGYub3JnL2h0bWwvZHJhZnQtZ2luc2JlcmctbHNy LWlzaXMtcmZjNzgxMGJpcy0wMCNhcHBlbmRpeC1BDQoNCmRvY3VtZW50cyB0aGUgaW50ZXJvcGVy YWJpbGl0eSBpc3N1ZSBhbmQgdGhlIGNoYW5nZXMgZnJvbSBSRkMgNzgxMC4gVGhlcmUgYXJlIG5v IG90aGVyIGNoYW5nZXMvaXNzdWVzLg0KDQpJZiB5b3UgZmVlbCB0aGlzIHNlY3Rpb24gaXMgbm90 IGNsZWFyIHBsZWFzZSBhc2sgYSBwb2ludGVkIHF1ZXN0aW9uLg0KUmlnaHQgbm93IEkgaGF2ZSBu byBpZGVhIHdoYXQgeW91IGFyZSBhc2tpbmcgYWJvdXQuDQoNCiAgIExlcw0KDQoNCkZyb206IFVt YSBDaHVuZHVyaSA8dW1hLmNodW5kdXJpQGh1YXdlaS5jb20+DQpTZW50OiBNb25kYXksIEFwcmls IDE2LCAyMDE4IDM6MjggUE0NClRvOiBMZXMgR2luc2JlcmcgKGdpbnNiZXJnKSA8Z2luc2JlcmdA 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Microsoft-MacOutlook/10.b.0.180311 Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2018 16:02:23 -0700 From: Jeff Tantsura To: "Ketan Talaulikar (ketant)" , "Acee Lindem (acee)" , "lsr@ietf.org" Message-ID: Thread-Topic: [Lsr] LSR WG Last Call for "Signaling MSD (Maximum SID Depth) using OSPF" - draft-ietf-ospf-segment-routing-msd-10.txt Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="B_3606743302_1840689867" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] LSR WG Last Call for "Signaling MSD (Maximum SID Depth) using OSPF" - draft-ietf-ospf-segment-routing-msd-10.txt X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2018 00:08:27 -0000 > This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. --B_3606743302_1840689867 Content-type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Hi Ketan =20 Thank you for your review, I=E2=80=99ll address the comments during this week. Thanks! =20 Cheers, Jeff From: Lsr on behalf of "Ketan Talaulikar (ketant)" <= ketant@cisco.com> Date: Thursday, April 12, 2018 at 05:04 To: "Acee Lindem (acee)" , "lsr@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [Lsr] LSR WG Last Call for "Signaling MSD (Maximum SID Depth) = using OSPF" - draft-ietf-ospf-segment-routing-msd-10.txt =20 Hi Acee, =20 I have reviewed this draft for OSPF but in the same context also gone over = its corresponding ISIS draft (https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-is= is-segment-routing-msd/ ) and some of the comments apply to both since they = are mostly identical in content. =20 I need to ask the question if it makes sense to merge these drafts into a s= ingle one to save everyone cycles and ensure consistency in the spirit of LS= R J =20 General Qs: There are some differences between the ISIS and OSPF versions of this draft= . Could I request the authors to please cross-check and fix? The ISIS draft = does not have some of the issues mentioned below. Do these TLVs apply only when the router is enabled for Segment Routing? i.= e. they should be originated when SR is enabled on the router and the receiv= er should not expect them when SR is disabled? Or do we foresee MSD to be mo= re generic. This aspect needs to be clarified. The allowable values are specified as 0-254 in OSPF draft while ISIS one al= lows 255 as well. The IANA section though says that 255 is reserved. The draft using =E2=80=9Csub-type=E2=80=9D in some places and =E2=80=9Ctype=E2=80=9D in some places= . This is confusing. The ISIS draft uses =E2=80=9Ctype=E2=80=9D everywhere which seems b= etter. Several comments below about the section where OSPF TLVs are defined and I = would suggest to use similar text as in the ISIS draft. I think it is better that the draft mandates that the MSD sub-types SHOULD= be encoded in ascending order? This makes it easier for the receiver/consum= er to detect absence or removal of a specific sub-type from signalling. Reference to RFC4970 should be replaced with RFC7770 Both the ISIS and OSPF drafts are asking IANA for creation of MSD type regi= stry. Should the creation not be done by only one of them and the other poin= ts to it? =20 =20 Sec 1 =20 can be imposed at each node/link on a given SR path =20 It laso also defines the Base MPLS Imposition MSD type. =20 Sec 1.1.1 =20 BMI: Base MPLS Imposition is the number of MPLS labels that can be imposed inclusive of any all service/transport/special labels =20 Sec 3 =20 Node MSD is the minimum MSD supported by all the links of the node. =20 Sub-Type 1 (IANA Section), MSD and the Value field contains maximum MSD of the router originating the RI LSA. =20 =20 Some Qs on Sec 3: In my understanding, the Node MSD is the minimum value of all the Link MSDs= for the links on that node that are enabled in that specific IGP instance. = There may be another IGP instance configured on the same node with a differe= nt set of links and for that instance, the Node MSD may be higher. The same = goes for links that are not configured/enabled under the specific IGP instan= ce. The draft needs to clarify this aspect. The draft needs to specify how many instances of this TLV are allowed in th= e RI LSA and when there are multiple instances in the same or multiple RI LS= A fragments, then how should the receiver handle or interpret them? E.g. use= s the minimum of the signalled Node MSD values or uses the first instance of= the TLV in the lowest fragment, etc. Also, we don=E2=80=99t want multiple instanc= es of the MSD TLV to be encoded for different types =E2=80=93 all of them must be = in a single instance of the MSD TLV. =20 Sec 4 =20 For OSPFv3, the Link level MSD value is advertised as an optional Sub-TLV of the Router-Link E-Router-LSA TLV as defined in [I-D.ietf-ospf-ospfv3-lsa-extend], and has value of TBD3. =20 Sub-Type 1 (IANA Section), MSD and the Value field contains Link MSD of the link router originating the corresponding LSA as specified for OSPFv2 and OSPFv3. =20 Some Qs on Sec 4: The draft needs to specify how many instances of this TLV are allowed in th= e Extended Link Attribute/E-Router LSA and when there are multiple instances= then how should the receiver handle or interpret them? Also, we don=E2=80=99t wan= t multiple instances of the MSD TLV to be encoded for different types =E2=80=93 al= l of them must be in a single instance of the MSD TLV. =20 =20 Sec 5 =20 Suggest to add =E2=80=9CWhen a Link MSD type is not signalled but the Node MSD ty= pe is, then the value of that Link MSD type MUST considered as the correspon= ding Node MSD type value.=E2=80=9D I realize this is obvious but it is better to b= e clarified. This enables routes with homogenous link MSD values to advertis= e just the Node MSD values. I also think this should be RECOMMENDED by the d= raft for flooding efficiencies. =20 Sec 6 =20 The Base MPLS Imposition MSD (BMI-MSD) signals the total number of MPLS labels a node is capable of imposing, including any all service/ Transport/special labels. =20 Sec 8 =20 I think the security section just points to the RI LSA draft, but it also n= eeds to cover the other LSAs. IMHO the security considerations are fairly ge= neric for the protocols but we need the right references here? =20 Thanks, Ketan =20 From: Lsr On Behalf Of Acee Lindem (acee) Sent: 06 April 2018 06:19 To: lsr@ietf.org Subject: [Lsr] LSR WG Last Call for "Signaling MSD (Maximum SID Depth) usin= g OSPF" - draft-ietf-ospf-segment-routing-msd-10.txt =20 This begins an LSR WG last call for the subject draft. Please send your comments to this list prior to 12:00 AM GMT, April 20th, 2018.=20 =20 Thanks, Acee and Chris =20 _______________________________________________ Lsr mailing list Lsr@ietf.o= rg https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr=20 --B_3606743302_1840689867 Content-type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable
--B_3606743302_1840689867-- From nobody Tue Apr 17 02:31:19 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2858E126C0F; Tue, 17 Apr 2018 02:31:18 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -14.51 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-14.51 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_DKIMWL_WL_MED=-0.01, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=cisco.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 1UTglZeel9N3; Tue, 17 Apr 2018 02:31:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from aer-iport-2.cisco.com (aer-iport-2.cisco.com [173.38.203.52]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher DHE-RSA-SEED-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4A711126DD9; Tue, 17 Apr 2018 02:31:15 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cisco.com; i=@cisco.com; l=5066; q=dns/txt; s=iport; t=1523957475; x=1525167075; h=message-id:date:from:mime-version:to:cc:subject: references:in-reply-to:content-transfer-encoding; bh=Mbl0g0NfE3VikajMsPBs/3jDhCHUFjUyIeA6Lf03GMY=; b=eVrC9iTI8ehYu+lHIGbYGShxnmODztXFip8dHrwj4PJzps6fxuWHd3xI 09t3rUtFKFncUIiYdAxbBPaeVw/FwsbnsXTfqvl3dN9FAm2GOYRxIVO4D b6uq8RnpQbsv77EEjpTwSEFeI2JYDtIYV/XstrWReAdOMyeQWOnX46DCK 0=; X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.48,463,1517875200"; d="scan'208";a="3233836" Received: from aer-iport-nat.cisco.com (HELO aer-core-3.cisco.com) ([173.38.203.22]) by aer-iport-2.cisco.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384; 17 Apr 2018 09:31:12 +0000 Received: from [10.147.24.35] ([10.147.24.35]) by aer-core-3.cisco.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id w3H9VB7C003633; Tue, 17 Apr 2018 09:31:12 GMT Message-ID: <5AD5BEDF.1010603@cisco.com> Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2018 11:31:11 +0200 From: Peter Psenak User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.11; rv:24.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/24.4.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Uma Chunduri , "Acee Lindem (acee)" , "lsr@ietf.org" CC: "draft-hegdeppsenak-isis-sr-flex-algo@ietf.org" References: <6C9DDF29-72D8-4630-82AD-342CC134EB36@cisco.com> <5ACF0C41.1090506@cisco.com> <2FF54200-BFCB-4492-BE21-441192D48BAE@cisco.com> <25B4902B1192E84696414485F572685413553D22@SJCEML521-MBB.china.huawei.com> In-Reply-To: <25B4902B1192E84696414485F572685413553D22@SJCEML521-MBB.china.huawei.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] Flex Algorithms Drafts X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2018 09:31:18 -0000 Hi Uma, please see inline: On 17/04/18 00:14 , Uma Chunduri wrote: > Dear All, > I am neutral to combining the content of OSPF and IS-IS into a single > draft. > However, I have 2 questions on this draft. > 1. > 0 1 2 3 > 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 > +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ > | Type | Length | Algorithm | Metric Type | > +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ > | Alg. Type | Priority | > +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ > | Sub-TLVs | > + + > | ... | > | | > +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ > */ Algorithm: Flex-Algorithm number. Value between 128 and 255/* > */ inclusive./* > */ Algorithm Type: Single octet identifying the algorithm type used/* > */ to compute paths for the Flex-Algoritm. Values are defined in/* > */ "IGP Algorithm Types" registry defined under "Interior Gateway/* > */ Protocol (IGP) Parameters" IANA registries./* > Why there are two fields "Algorithm" and "Algorithm Type" ? these are being renamed in the next update to: Flex-Algorithm - Single octet value between 128 and 255 inclusive IGP Alg. Type - Single octet. Value between 0 and 127 inclusive, that identifies IGP algorithm type used to compute paths for the Flex-Algoritm. Values are defined in "IGP Algorithm Types" registry defined under "Interior Gateway Protocol (IGP) Parameters" IANA registries. > While algorithm-type defines currently only 2 algorithms (0-SPF and > 1-Strict SPF), that space can be carved out for user defined computation > algorithms (I presume). If yes, then "Algorithm Type" becomes user > defined flexible algorithm. > 2. Also some of the sub-tlvs defined in the draft doesn't seem to belong > to Router capabilities; where algorithm description is being advertised. > Flexible Algorithm Exclude Admin Group Sub-TLV > "The Flexible-Algorithm definition can specify 'colors' that are used > by the operator to exclude links during the Flex-Algorithm path > computation. FAD Sub-TLV is a sub-TLV of the IS-IS Router Capability TLV-242. Flexible Algorithm Exclude Admin Group Sub-TLV is a sub-TLV of the FAD Sub-TLV. thanks, Peter > -- > Uma C. > -----Original Message----- > From: Lsr [mailto:lsr-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Acee Lindem (acee) > Sent: Thursday, April 12, 2018 2:53 AM > To: Peter Psenak (ppsenak) ; lsr@ietf.org > Cc: draft-hegdeppsenak-isis-sr-flex-algo@ietf.org > Subject: Re: [Lsr] Flex Algorithms Drafts > Hi Peter, > Ok - we'll decide during whether to merge during the WG adoption call. > It would be a good LSR experiment for a combined draft if there are no > significant differences between the protocols that would make a combined > draft unwieldy. > Thanks, > Acee > On 4/12/18, 3:35 AM, "Peter Psenak (ppsenak)" > wrote: > Hi Acee, > On 11/04/18 22:36 , Acee Lindem (acee) wrote: > > In preparation for WG adoption and IANA early code point > allocation, I suggest that we rename the “Flexible Algorithm Definition > TLV Metric Registry†to the “Flexible Algorithm Definition TLV Metric > Type Registry†to avoid confusion as to whether we are defining the > actual metrics here. I know that in the contexts of the drafts, it is > clear but the registries are going to be on their own. Additionally, > while protocol TLV types should not be shared between protocols, it > seems this registry could be common and placed in our "Interior Gateway > Protocol (IGP) Parameters" registry. > sure I can make that change. > > > > Finally, the OSPF version has a typo in section 8.2. The last two > types should be 2 and 3. > right, will fix it. > > > > o 0 - Reserved > > > > o 1 - Flexible Algorithm Exclude Admin Group Sub-TLV > > > > o 1 - Flexible Algorithm Include-Any Admin Group Sub-TLV > > > > o 1 - Flexible Algorithm Exclude-All Group Sub-TLV > > > > Also, how so the authors feel about combining the drafts? I know > the IS-IS version has had more discussion and wouldn't want to hold it > up if there is a possibility. I don't feel strongly one way or another. > I'm fine both ways. > thanks, > Peter > > > > Thanks, > > Acee > > > _______________________________________________ > Lsr mailing list > Lsr@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr From nobody Tue Apr 17 02:39:10 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 03357126DD9 for ; Tue, 17 Apr 2018 02:39:09 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -14.51 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-14.51 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_DKIMWL_WL_MED=-0.01, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=cisco.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id BmMkc4xex-bs for ; Tue, 17 Apr 2018 02:39:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from aer-iport-3.cisco.com (aer-iport-3.cisco.com [173.38.203.53]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher DHE-RSA-SEED-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 573AF126C0F for ; Tue, 17 Apr 2018 02:39:06 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cisco.com; i=@cisco.com; l=4483; q=dns/txt; s=iport; t=1523957946; x=1525167546; h=message-id:date:from:mime-version:to:cc:subject: references:in-reply-to:content-transfer-encoding; bh=aDhTUdsFlar3DzCp8XCHiQT6eK26ljPmbIIVlRAqxJg=; b=F5l4G/oE++PLRYh8KkwzfeX+3i4yJA4wsFA4Ab7Je/OaxuNk3O4ayM1l Lh/nwK/fKWhHe3mpeVSRGN5HX+h9sDfxapma0g7OMpa1PCYezseiE+uGW epSrADjQpPr+Wy++ffT42wdQisBco/PzPmfvefFRb9PJ+FwDFVKT3fqI2 g=; X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: =?us-ascii?q?A0CuAQAjwNVa/xbLJq1dGQEBAQEBAQE?= =?us-ascii?q?BAQEBAQcBAQEBAYMXgQx6KINoiGCOKYEPlGALGA2ERAKCdDcVAQIBAQEBAQE?= =?us-ascii?q?CbBwMhSIBAQEBAgEBASEPAQU2CQEBDAQLEQQBAQECAgUWCAMCAgkDAgECARU?= =?us-ascii?q?fCQgGAQwBBQIBAYUBCA+mB4IODoRYg2qCIAWBCYhRP4QagxEBAQIBARaBEhG?= =?us-ascii?q?DI4JUApdoCIVZiGKBNINdgjiFBIkwhnOBJTIigVIzGggbFTuCQ4MxAQmGB4F?= =?us-ascii?q?OhUA9MI8NAQE?= X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.48,463,1517875200"; d="scan'208";a="3188863" Received: from aer-iport-nat.cisco.com (HELO aer-core-2.cisco.com) ([173.38.203.22]) by aer-iport-3.cisco.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384; 17 Apr 2018 09:39:02 +0000 Received: from [10.147.24.35] ([10.147.24.35]) by aer-core-2.cisco.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id w3H9d2KP020369; Tue, 17 Apr 2018 09:39:02 GMT Message-ID: <5AD5C0B6.7050500@cisco.com> Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2018 11:39:02 +0200 From: Peter Psenak User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.11; rv:24.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/24.4.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Uma Chunduri , "tony.li@tony.li" CC: "lsr@ietf.org" References: <152216649041.5234.6342137041063769692.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> <7D2C1874-8B55-45B1-8C5F-D4C9C1F47D11@tony.li> <5AC78AE5.8020707@cisco.com> <6E69B9E3-14A6-4EED-BBE4-F5A424D57787@tony.li> <5AC79740.6060205@cisco.com> <25B4902B1192E84696414485F572685413553D36@SJCEML521-MBB.china.huawei.com> In-Reply-To: <25B4902B1192E84696414485F572685413553D36@SJCEML521-MBB.china.huawei.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-li-dynamic-flooding-04.txt X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2018 09:39:09 -0000 Hi Uma, please see inline: On 17/04/18 00:20 , Uma Chunduri wrote: > Hi Peter, > >> I have the feeling that the dependency of the "flooding topology" on the flooded data is going to bring more complexity, than the selection of the distributed algorithm to be used, if we ever need to support more then one. > > > I see > > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-hegdeppsenak-isis-sr-flex-algo/?include_text=1 proposes flexible algorithms for route computation. > > Here, you are saying similar to flexible algorithms for route computation - flexible algorithms can be used for computing "flooding topology" in a distributed fashion ; is that correct? that's not what we are proposing. At least not at this point. > > Else I don't see any connection to different algorithms in the flooding topology context; please clarify? the discussion we are having in the context of the draft-li-dynamic-flooding is whether to use the centralized or distributed approach to compute the flooding topology. Current text in the draft mandates the centralized approach and requires flooding of the data to describe the "flooding topology" itself. We are proposing to also support distributed version of it with either a single standardized algorithm or possibly multiple distributed algorithms, which would require some agreement between all devices in the flooded domain. thanks, Peter > -- > Uma C. > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Lsr [mailto:lsr-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Peter Psenak > Sent: Friday, April 06, 2018 8:50 AM > To: tony.li@tony.li > Cc: lsr@ietf.org > Subject: Re: [Lsr] Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-li-dynamic-flooding-04.txt > > Hi Tony, > > if we start with a single standardized algorithm, that is easy to implement and deploy. We can leave the door open for additional algorithms to be defined later together with the selection mechanism. > > I have the feeling that the dependency of the "flooding topology" on the flooded data is going to bring more complexity, than the selection of the distributed algorithm to be used, if we ever need to support more then one. > > thanks, > Peter > > > On 06/04/18 17:19 , tony.li@tony.li wrote: >> >> Hi Peter, >> >> Thank you for your comments. >> >>> while I appreciate the flexibility associated with the centralized >>> computation of the flooding topology, it has some drawbacks as well: >>> >>> 1. "flooding topology" must be flooded. This makes the flooding >>> dependent on the flooded data itself. >> >> >> Absolutely true. If the computation of the topology is incorrect, that >> would certainly be a bug. >> >> >>> 2. The extra flooding of "flooding topology" adds some delay in the >>> convergence towards the new "flooding topologyâ€. >> >> >> Since we distribute the flooding topology before there are topology >> failures, it would seem like the latency is not a significant concern. >> >> >>> Have you considered the distributed computation of "flooding topology" >>> using some standardized algorithm? >> >> >> Yes, Kireeti raised this in London as well. There are some practical >> issues with this. How do we ever converge on an algorithm? >> >> There are many perspectives on what an adequate flooding topology >> might be. Different administrations have different considerations and >> risk tolerances. >> >> Debugging is going to be more challenging, as inconsistencies between >> two nodes with different ideas of the topology will be difficult to >> detect until there is a catastrophic failure. >> >> I’m trying to do something practical, and it seems like doing this in >> a centralized fashion is the quickest, easiest, and most robust way forward. >> >> >>> Eventually we can support multiple standardized algorithms. A node >>> can advertise support for several algorithms and the "active" >>> algorithm is selected based on some criteria that would guarantee >>> that all nodes in the flooding domain select the same one. >> >> >> Seems like that would also require some administrative input. >> >> So, I agree that that’s a technical possibility, but I think that >> there’s significant problems in making that work. I prefer to focus on >> something that we can implement more quickly. >> >> Tony >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > Lsr mailing list > Lsr@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr > From nobody Tue Apr 17 07:44:30 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 569D41243F3 for ; Tue, 17 Apr 2018 07:44:29 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -14.509 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-14.509 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_DKIMWL_WL_MED=-0.01, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=cisco.com Received: from 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Tue, 17 Apr 2018 10:44:25 -0400 From: "Acee Lindem (acee)" To: "lsr@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: LSR Working Group Adoption Poll for Flex Algorithm Drafts Thread-Index: AQHT1lqU9EG8NacYPUeDduC3/EAVyQ== Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2018 14:44:25 +0000 Message-ID: <5B8EB88E-9C54-47FA-BF8A-EEB952F6C0BF@cisco.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted x-originating-ip: [10.116.152.196] Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_5B8EB88E9C5447FABF8AEEB952F6C0BFciscocom_" MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Subject: [Lsr] LSR Working Group Adoption Poll for Flex Algorithm Drafts X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2018 14:44:29 -0000 --_000_5B8EB88E9C5447FABF8AEEB952F6C0BFciscocom_ 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17 Apr 2018 07:56:16 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cisco.com; i=@cisco.com; l=780; q=dns/txt; s=iport; t=1523976976; x=1525186576; h=message-id:date:from:mime-version:to:subject:references: in-reply-to:content-transfer-encoding; bh=mMELBhYKx4cmUtfqiPGvq7HAaW4WyINXOYQX71Vnxyg=; b=H1Qt+yhaXSUtD8mf/fW2aWI+E0U2MzLigzIqf7vsiWJr/qS+16+IzlFS vMO28YAWTKmjCeH0Rtn4ExSnIRUu/XNkS+s/aGPVZDgF6TZLkTOmRz1l9 0IQKe9n4xdqvtAsl7v37YuxkyHkK8uIRAVMCrKuL/MC3QASkw6v4x94E5 s=; X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.48,463,1517875200"; d="scan'208";a="3240035" Received: from aer-iport-nat.cisco.com (HELO aer-core-4.cisco.com) ([173.38.203.22]) by aer-iport-2.cisco.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384; 17 Apr 2018 14:56:14 +0000 Received: from [10.147.24.35] ([10.147.24.35]) by aer-core-4.cisco.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id w3HEuDxU017527; Tue, 17 Apr 2018 14:56:14 GMT Message-ID: <5AD60B0D.3060506@cisco.com> Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2018 16:56:13 +0200 From: Peter Psenak User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.11; rv:24.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/24.4.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Acee Lindem (acee)" , "lsr@ietf.org" References: <5B8EB88E-9C54-47FA-BF8A-EEB952F6C0BF@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <5B8EB88E-9C54-47FA-BF8A-EEB952F6C0BF@cisco.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] LSR Working Group Adoption Poll for Flex Algorithm Drafts X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2018 14:56:19 -0000 Support as coauthor on both drafts. thanks, Peter On 17/04/18 16:44 , Acee Lindem (acee) wrote: > This begins a two-week adoption poll for the following Flex Algorithm > drafts: > > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-hegdeppsenak-isis-sr-flex-algo/ > > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ppsenak-ospf-sr-flex-algo/ > > The adoption poll will end at 12:00 AM EST on May 2^nd , 2018. Please > indicate your support of opposition of the drafts. > > Additionally, the authors are amenable to combining the drafts into a > single draft. If you have an opinion, please state that as well. > > Thanks, > > Acee > > > > _______________________________________________ > Lsr mailing list > Lsr@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr > From nobody Tue Apr 17 08:01:40 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EB5A1126E64 for ; Tue, 17 Apr 2018 08:01:37 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -14.509 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-14.509 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_DKIMWL_WL_MED=-0.01, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=cisco.com Received: from mail.ietf.org 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([173.36.7.11]) with mapi id 15.00.1320.000; Tue, 17 Apr 2018 10:01:34 -0500 From: "Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)" To: "Acee Lindem (acee)" , "lsr@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [Lsr] LSR Working Group Adoption Poll for Flex Algorithm Drafts Thread-Index: AQHT1lqU9EG8NacYPUeDduC3/EAVyaQFDLNA Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2018 15:01:34 +0000 Message-ID: <4ddda5207d48432887f287e271738c4d@XCH-ALN-001.cisco.com> References: <5B8EB88E-9C54-47FA-BF8A-EEB952F6C0BF@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <5B8EB88E-9C54-47FA-BF8A-EEB952F6C0BF@cisco.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted x-originating-ip: [10.154.131.76] Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_4ddda5207d48432887f287e271738c4dXCHALN001ciscocom_" MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] LSR Working Group Adoption Poll for Flex Algorithm Drafts X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working 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(Postfix) with ESMTPS id CE47712D94B for ; Tue, 17 Apr 2018 08:29:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from lhreml701-cah.china.huawei.com (unknown [172.18.7.108]) by Forcepoint Email with ESMTP id D11EFF96D110A for ; Tue, 17 Apr 2018 16:29:39 +0100 (IST) Received: from SJCEML701-CHM.china.huawei.com (10.208.112.40) by lhreml701-cah.china.huawei.com (10.201.108.42) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 14.3.382.0; Tue, 17 Apr 2018 16:29:22 +0100 Received: from SJCEML521-MBS.china.huawei.com ([169.254.2.168]) by SJCEML701-CHM.china.huawei.com ([169.254.3.93]) with mapi id 14.03.0382.000; Tue, 17 Apr 2018 08:29:16 -0700 From: Huaimo Chen To: "Acee Lindem (acee)" , "lsr@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [Lsr] LSR Working Group Adoption Poll for Flex Algorithm Drafts Thread-Index: AQHT1lqU9EG8NacYPUeDduC3/EAVyaQFiMEA//+MIAA= Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2018 15:29:16 +0000 Message-ID: <5316A0AB3C851246A7CA5758973207D463A66844@sjceml521-mbs.china.huawei.com> References: <5B8EB88E-9C54-47FA-BF8A-EEB952F6C0BF@cisco.com> 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([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id rG0zdencbMj9 for ; Tue, 17 Apr 2018 08:36:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from orange.com (mta241.mail.business.static.orange.com [80.12.66.41]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 06F23126E64 for ; Tue, 17 Apr 2018 08:36:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from opfedar03.francetelecom.fr (unknown [xx.xx.xx.5]) by opfedar22.francetelecom.fr (ESMTP service) with ESMTP id CB417609B3; Tue, 17 Apr 2018 17:36:42 +0200 (CEST) Received: from Exchangemail-eme2.itn.ftgroup (unknown [xx.xx.31.66]) by opfedar03.francetelecom.fr (ESMTP service) with ESMTP id A7CA418008F; Tue, 17 Apr 2018 17:36:42 +0200 (CEST) Received: from OPEXCLILM21.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup ([fe80::e92a:c932:907e:8f06]) by OPEXCLILMA1.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup ([fe80::95e2:eb4b:3053:fabf%19]) with mapi id 14.03.0389.001; Tue, 17 Apr 2018 17:36:42 +0200 From: To: "Acee Lindem (acee)" , "lsr@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [Lsr] LSR Working Group Adoption Poll for Flex Algorithm Drafts Thread-Index: AQHT1mAP33qEbf2a4UWULiLD36pNkaQFFqqA Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2018 15:36:42 +0000 Message-ID: <19317_1523979402_5AD6148A_19317_310_1_53C29892C857584299CBF5D05346208A47A1F7A7@OPEXCLILM21.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> References: <5B8EB88E-9C54-47FA-BF8A-EEB952F6C0BF@cisco.com> <227F9B5D-3408-47B6-841C-117782C78642@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <227F9B5D-3408-47B6-841C-117782C78642@cisco.com> Accept-Language: fr-FR, en-US Content-Language: fr-FR X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.168.234.6] Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_53C29892C857584299CBF5D05346208A47A1F7A7OPEXCLILM21corp_" MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] LSR Working Group Adoption Poll for Flex Algorithm Drafts X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group 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c=relaxed/relaxed; d=previdi-net.20150623.gappssmtp.com; s=20150623; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=tAQHVe/CCcVuf5Oa/YPBxyWqIATGdbFwIGobAQyDlD4=; b=Gf6kmqU95DQm5x2687QeuecUsqfXXo+NW2yTNijImSvx8i1AR4dU0irBLulhlFMqTJ 84GIclIxc6K6fy5AAdf1sptNiGMosDBNx57JihhnUt9dZPr5kflRsvnB0M3y1lAhU9El /BBMQ5ipdTavgmzrrHsUQuC4qBgunWCleK3OJSrQujXrB327pMHz8zTKJl78BzR8xJ2S vi7zhfmoyGwzvSNEVGTM/+hR4FwhSCf4lmLLCdcwLjVvBBcIrvx23e9AlFBl7f68Ci63 FTZD6oSJ4GBF9InoYeZNQP5Ie8JVp3Bu+hPRc0Vv8iEOw0JQUVbGu3+Yr5UGehNvsY8K Q6BA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=tAQHVe/CCcVuf5Oa/YPBxyWqIATGdbFwIGobAQyDlD4=; b=XDARBOFCq7I98Dp8UQgLkIrJxyHvPlK0sYGZQVkH0AkzG2W1Zcq7l6nYHJDsy3mgmn lxBplW9Ammhciucw7YG8lYfze3h5CfjIfkbDMmbwZ/8vrXDUw7dJEnX3vmzeVYvFOcQe KOt4WNeSjYfAnl9tSsGvUN4pXHEigvTnpjylBfYjs8vTIqOv3UvOp1FlvTTMIXWpWMwu 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List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2018 17:19:00 -0000 --001a114b60508afd1b056a0e8804 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" I support both drafts. Thanks. s. On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 4:44 PM Acee Lindem (acee) wrote: > This begins a two-week adoption poll for the following Flex Algorithm > drafts: > > > > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-hegdeppsenak-isis-sr-flex-algo/ > > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ppsenak-ospf-sr-flex-algo/ > > > > The adoption poll will end at 12:00 AM EST on May 2nd, 2018. Please > indicate your support of opposition of the drafts. > > > > Additionally, the authors are amenable to combining the drafts into a > single draft. If you have an opinion, please state that as well. > > > > Thanks, > > Acee > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Lsr mailing list > Lsr@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr > --001a114b60508afd1b056a0e8804 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I support both drafts.

Thanks.=C2=A0

s.

On Tue, Apr 17, 2018, 4:44 PM Acee Lindem (acee) <acee@cisco.com> wrote:

This begins a two-w= eek adoption poll for the following Flex Algorithm drafts:

=C2=A0

https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-hegdeppsen= ak-isis-sr-flex-algo/

https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ppsenak-ospf-sr= -flex-algo/

=C2=A0

The adoption poll w= ill end at 12:00 AM EST on May 2nd, 2018. Please indicate your s= upport of opposition of the drafts.=C2=A0

=C2=A0

Additionally, the a= uthors are amenable to combining the drafts into a single draft. If you hav= e an opinion, please state that as well.

=C2=A0

Thanks,

Acee =

=C2=A0

=C2=A0

=C2=A0

_______________________________________________
Lsr mailing list
Lsr@ie= tf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr
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"bruno.decraene@orange.com" , "lsr@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [Lsr] LSR Working Group Adoption Poll for Flex Algorithm Drafts Thread-Index: AQHT1mAP33qEbf2a4UWULiLD36pNkaQFFqqAgAAg1gA= Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2018 17:33:01 +0000 Message-ID: <4339E35B-EBED-452C-84BC-5F44DCE9A14F@cisco.com> References: <5B8EB88E-9C54-47FA-BF8A-EEB952F6C0BF@cisco.com> <227F9B5D-3408-47B6-841C-117782C78642@cisco.com> <19317_1523979402_5AD6148A_19317_310_1_53C29892C857584299CBF5D05346208A47A1F7A7@OPEXCLILM21.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> In-Reply-To: <19317_1523979402_5AD6148A_19317_310_1_53C29892C857584299CBF5D05346208A47A1F7A7@OPEXCLILM21.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted x-originating-ip: [10.116.152.196] Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_4339E35BEBED452C84BC5F44DCE9A14Fciscocom_" MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] LSR Working Group Adoption Poll for Flex Algorithm Drafts X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2018 17:33:07 -0000 --_000_4339E35BEBED452C84BC5F44DCE9A14Fciscocom_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Tm8uIEhvd2V2ZXIsIHRoZSBvbmUgdGhhdCBpbml0aWFsbHkgY2FtZSB0byBtaW5kIGhhcyBoYWQg b3duZXJzaGlwIGRpc2N1c3Npb25zIHdpdGggU1LigKYNClRoYW5rcywNCkFjZWUNCg0KRnJvbTog QnJ1bm8gRGVjcmFlbmUgPGJydW5vLmRlY3JhZW5lQG9yYW5nZS5jb20+DQpEYXRlOiBUdWVzZGF5 LCBBcHJpbCAxNywgMjAxOCBhdCAxMTozNiBBTQ0KVG86IEFjZWUgTGluZGVtIDxhY2VlQGNpc2Nv LmNvbT4sICJsc3JAaWV0Zi5vcmciIDxsc3JAaWV0Zi5vcmc+DQpTdWJqZWN0OiBSRTogW0xzcl0g TFNSIFdvcmtpbmcgR3JvdXAgQWRvcHRpb24gUG9sbCBmb3IgRmxleCBBbGdvcml0aG0gRHJhZnRz DQoNCisxDQooSSBndWVzcyB5b3UgbWVhbnQgOnMvTFNSL1NSICAgOy0pICkNCg0KVGhhbmtzDQot 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No, score=-14.511 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_DKIMWL_WL_MED=-0.01, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=cisco.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id PgAt5byAEtIM; Tue, 17 Apr 2018 12:00:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from aer-iport-3.cisco.com (aer-iport-3.cisco.com [173.38.203.53]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher DHE-RSA-SEED-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 5441612E88C; Tue, 17 Apr 2018 12:00:14 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cisco.com; i=@cisco.com; l=1018; q=dns/txt; s=iport; t=1523991614; x=1525201214; h=message-id:date:from:mime-version:to:cc:subject: references:in-reply-to:content-transfer-encoding; bh=E0FrlP7Jk9/JI7K5OLkfxFjsMJrH9xGY/GnRvZLj3/c=; b=VeA0JF9+eV34yifQsPt7agNaOOR5XeH+ulng2VrwxS38BOtdzIgdSbq4 kY8xsahP27oPAZU6foEIbYBX4WGgpH+R92wxxdvtyAAuha2AyfcsVXLNf YFrjvYpKTMXxqvhztnoXYMT5I7oeKkCDSNSvkqoQgro4WAK1UNLzZYta5 A=; X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.48,464,1517875200"; d="scan'208";a="3198210" Received: from aer-iport-nat.cisco.com (HELO aer-core-3.cisco.com) ([173.38.203.22]) by aer-iport-3.cisco.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384; 17 Apr 2018 19:00:12 +0000 Received: from [10.60.140.54] (ams-ppsenak-nitro5.cisco.com [10.60.140.54]) by aer-core-3.cisco.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id w3HJ0BCB016649; Tue, 17 Apr 2018 19:00:11 GMT Message-ID: <5AD6443B.7080607@cisco.com> Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2018 21:00:11 +0200 From: Peter Psenak User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.11; rv:24.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/24.4.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Acee Lindem (acee)" , "draft-hegdeppsenak-isis-sr-flex-algo@ietf.org" , "draft-ppsenak-ospf-sr-flex-algo@ietf.org" CC: "lsr@ietf.org" References: <943C5E80-10F5-4EEE-A2F0-EB1C1658AEAB@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <943C5E80-10F5-4EEE-A2F0-EB1C1658AEAB@cisco.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] IPR for IS-IS and OSPF Flex Algorithm Drafts X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2018 19:00:18 -0000 Hi Acee, there is pending IPR and the formal IETF IPR Disclosure will be filed soon. thanks, Peter On 17/04/18 17:16 , Acee Lindem (acee) wrote: > Authors, > > Are you aware of any IPR that applies to draft-hegdeppsenak-isis-sr-algo > and draft-ppsenak-ospf-sr-flex-algo? > > If so, has this IPR been disclosed in compliance with IETF IPR rules > (see RFCs 3979, 4879, 3669 and 5378 for more details). > > If you are listed as a document author or contributor please respond to > this email regardless of whether or not you are aware of any relevant > IPR. *The response needs to be sent to the LSR WG mailing list.* The > document will not advance to the next stage until a response has been > received from each author and contributor. > > If you are on the LSR WG email list but are not listed as an author or > contributor, then please explicitly respond only if you are aware of any > IPR that has not yet been disclosed in conformance with IETF rules. > > Thanks, > > Acee > From nobody Tue Apr 17 13:01:02 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C251212D878 for ; Tue, 17 Apr 2018 13:00:58 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -14.509 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-14.509 tagged_above=-999 required=5 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(xch-rtp-004.cisco.com [64.101.220.144]) by rcdn-core-7.cisco.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id w3HK0qxD012371 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 17 Apr 2018 20:00:53 GMT Received: from xch-rtp-015.cisco.com (64.101.220.155) by XCH-RTP-004.cisco.com (64.101.220.144) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.0.1320.4; Tue, 17 Apr 2018 16:00:52 -0400 Received: from xch-rtp-015.cisco.com ([64.101.220.155]) by XCH-RTP-015.cisco.com ([64.101.220.155]) with mapi id 15.00.1320.000; Tue, 17 Apr 2018 16:00:52 -0400 From: "Acee Lindem (acee)" To: "Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)" , Robert Raszuk CC: "lsr@ietf.org" , Rob Shakir , "tony.li@tony.li" , "Peter Psenak (ppsenak)" Thread-Topic: [Lsr] Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-li-dynamic-flooding-04.txt Thread-Index: AQHTxeXEGzmVEozAP066iQqj56HjnaP0JnuAgAAGKwCAAAiPAIAAA2IAgABETICAAWpcgIAAIooAgA93+IA= Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2018 20:00:52 +0000 Message-ID: <3E5BD5A4-5036-4359-91EB-FA41A2782ECF@cisco.com> References: 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Les Ginsberg , Robert Raszuk , "lsr@ietf.org" , Rob Shakir , Peter Psenak Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <2EE03260-7438-4CBA-824F-4B5691A03FF0@tony.li> References: <152216649041.5234.6342137041063769692.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> <7D2C1874-8B55-45B1-8C5F-D4C9C1F47D11@tony.li> <5AC78AE5.8020707@cisco.com> <6E69B9E3-14A6-4EED-BBE4-F5A424D57787@tony.li> <5AC79740.6060205@cisco.com> <614aab647fec410f839fe29d0aa86f87@XCH-ALN-001.cisco.com> <3E5BD5A4-5036-4359-91EB-FA41A2782ECF@cisco.com> To: "Acee Lindem (acee)" X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.6.18) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-li-dynamic-flooding-04.txt X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2018 20:24:20 -0000 Acee, > I think a distributed flooding algorithm is more robust and will = converge faster when there more than one concurrent failure in the = flooding topology. No doubt. However, we do not normally attempt to protect against = multiple concurrent failures. Regardless of how the flooding topology is = computed, multiple failures can partition it and convergence will become = seriously problematic. In the face of multiple failures, no node could = have a complete and consistent database and even with a distributed = algorithm, you may have multiple iterations of computing a new topology, = flooding, and computing. Let=E2=80=99s not kid ourselves: distributed is no panacea.=20 We do not design our redundant hardware systems to deal with multiple = concurrent failures, simply because the complexity of such failures is = so high. It=E2=80=99s paid off as these things simply don=E2=80=99t = happen with significant frequency. What is important is that we have = eventual consistency. > Additionally, if there is a node failure of the flooding leader and = that node is a node is on flooding topology, there could be greater = delays. All nodes are on the flooding topology, necessarily. If the leader fails, then it=E2=80=99s similar to any other node = failure. Flooding happens around the failed node. Assuming the flooding = topology was bi-connected, flooding is not interrupted and the network = should converge in a single flood/SPF cycle. If the old leader returns to the topology quickly, then there is no = issue. If the old leader does not return, then there is a leader = election/computation/flooding sequence, but that happens while there is = a functioning flooding topology. NBD. > =20 > The same solution suggested for the centralized approach of flooding = on the union of the old and new topologies could be used for = transitions. However, prune to the newer topology could be quicker since = it should be easier to assure downstream neighbors have converged on the = new topology than the whole domain. =20 You can=E2=80=99t assume that you had complete information when = computing the distributed version. Tony From nobody Tue Apr 17 17:40:46 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BC64F127369 for ; Tue, 17 Apr 2018 17:40:39 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.019 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.019 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FROM_EXCESS_BASE64=0.979, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, UNPARSEABLE_RELAY=0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=alibaba-inc.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id MlgUfepKX96T for ; Tue, 17 Apr 2018 17:40:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from out0-136.mail.aliyun.com (out0-136.mail.aliyun.com 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Wed, 18 Apr 2018 08:40:31 +0800 From: "=?UTF-8?B?5b6Q5bCP6JmOKOS5ieWFiCk=?=" To: "lsr@ietf.org" Reply-To: "=?UTF-8?B?5b6Q5bCP6JmOKOS5ieWFiCk=?=" Message-ID: <113c940d-63d2-4773-9807-7e94096382d2.xiaohu.xxh@alibaba-inc.com> X-Mailer: [Alimail-Mailagent revision 948139][W4_5235906][v5ForWebDing][Chrome] MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <152401134675.31881.17928671873052207049.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> In-Reply-To: <152401134675.31881.17928671873052207049.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> x-aliyun-mail-creator: W4_5235906_v5ForWebDing_M3LTW96aWxsYS81LjAgKE1hY2ludG9zaDsgSW50ZWwgTWFjIE9TIFggMTBfMTJfNikgQXBwbGVXZWJLaXQvNTM3LjM2IChLSFRNTCwgbGlrZSBHZWNrbykgQ2hyb21lLzY1LjAuMzMyNS4xODEgU2FmYXJpLzUzNy4zNg==vN Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=ALIBOUNDARY_18157_519f5940_5ad693ff_6a6998" Archived-At: Subject: [Lsr] =?utf-8?q?Fw=3A_New_Version_Notification_for_draft-xu-lsr-o?= =?utf-8?q?spf-flooding-reduction-in-msdc-00=2Etxt?= X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: 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"lsr@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: IPR for IS-IS and OSPF Flex Algorithm Drafts Thread-Index: AQHT1l8PnYFkI8ADyk6p9iv907mx96QF35bg Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2018 03:35:14 +0000 Message-ID: References: <943C5E80-10F5-4EEE-A2F0-EB1C1658AEAB@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <943C5E80-10F5-4EEE-A2F0-EB1C1658AEAB@cisco.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: authentication-results: cisco.com; dkim=none (message not signed) header.d=none;cisco.com; dmarc=none action=none header.from=juniper.net; x-originating-ip: [116.197.184.13] x-ms-publictraffictype: Email x-microsoft-exchange-diagnostics: 1; BN3PR05MB2435; 7:p3kI9DohY9ba7yHePsBW9uXDhdcT4A8Ywz+vgqr3jjP+qqwLGJEeZ3qnTxaH2YXeRlyiFQ3AQcXEDf5a1nNu4WBfLqaYZ8TLw4cAd8ahqL3+G1fx3MLnehzRBkLDBL/+nJKVuX8eQFlwK//5F+SiyDhLa1peaQK3U4vbU29mZya9x9wsexzdWCBH9nXgC7bgBs9Xtmpyc0qzfOFAwqVNGI8zxoAr2LYJRFJXF0hgso0ZMFOqRY4oVDEcEEXWx20E x-ms-exchange-antispam-srfa-diagnostics: SOS; x-ms-office365-filtering-ht: Tenant 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alln-core-8.cisco.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id w3I3poto026370 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Wed, 18 Apr 2018 03:51:50 GMT Received: from xch-aln-008.cisco.com (173.36.7.18) by XCH-ALN-015.cisco.com (173.36.7.25) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.0.1320.4; Tue, 17 Apr 2018 22:51:49 -0500 Received: from xch-aln-008.cisco.com ([173.36.7.18]) by XCH-ALN-008.cisco.com ([173.36.7.18]) with mapi id 15.00.1320.000; Tue, 17 Apr 2018 22:51:49 -0500 From: "Ketan Talaulikar (ketant)" To: "Peter Psenak (ppsenak)" , "Acee Lindem (acee)" , "draft-hegdeppsenak-isis-sr-flex-algo@ietf.org" , "draft-ppsenak-ospf-sr-flex-algo@ietf.org" CC: "lsr@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: IPR for IS-IS and OSPF Flex Algorithm Drafts Thread-Index: AQHT1l8PnYFkI8ADyk6p9iv907mx96QFo7KAgABAdvA= Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2018 03:51:49 +0000 Message-ID: <35bae8fecfc94227baa5dc737f3239e6@XCH-ALN-008.cisco.com> References: <943C5E80-10F5-4EEE-A2F0-EB1C1658AEAB@cisco.com> <5AD6443B.7080607@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <5AD6443B.7080607@cisco.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted x-originating-ip: [10.232.12.60] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] IPR for IS-IS and OSPF Flex Algorithm Drafts X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2018 03:51:53 -0000 SGkgQWNlZSwNCg0KSSBhbSBub3QgYXdhcmUgb2YgYW55IElQUiBvdGhlciB0aGFuIHRoZSBvbmUg dGhhdCBQZXRlciBoYXMgcmVmZXJlbmNlZCBiZWxvdy4NCg0KVGhhbmtzLA0KS2V0YW4NCg0KLS0t LS1PcmlnaW5hbCBNZXNzYWdlLS0tLS0NCkZyb206IFBldGVyIFBzZW5hayAocHBzZW5haykgDQpT ZW50OiAxOCBBcHJpbCAyMDE4IDAwOjMwDQpUbzogQWNlZSBMaW5kZW0gKGFjZWUpIDxhY2VlQGNp 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score=-14.511 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_DKIMWL_WL_MED=-0.01, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=cisco.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id mMV2cuBr4o65; Wed, 18 Apr 2018 01:55:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from aer-iport-2.cisco.com (aer-iport-2.cisco.com [173.38.203.52]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher DHE-RSA-SEED-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 25674127058; Wed, 18 Apr 2018 01:55:40 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cisco.com; i=@cisco.com; l=1216; q=dns/txt; s=iport; t=1524041740; x=1525251340; h=subject:to:cc:references:from:message-id:date: mime-version:in-reply-to:content-transfer-encoding; bh=CSnILeFXWypBnj5MRB9kSiFvi4dCOEQtKArv0C5d1zI=; b=Xq9Ye8QRvPpkRrunrgdkoBPh1FkLBGDXFApEjlkseo/pAAq+LgRqQMd8 Zzcs66kcD88Kio+Q9PSVGHPl8aLGK7IbHyqUSfx1YuxsSBF9WDEfX9yiH fzpAfQ7vmHsRhgfEXO7/jeQwxtiblBATYtNqQpfMg0BGiqL93zwT36sbG 8=; X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.48,464,1517875200"; d="scan'208";a="3253443" Received: from aer-iport-nat.cisco.com (HELO aer-core-3.cisco.com) ([173.38.203.22]) by aer-iport-2.cisco.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384; 18 Apr 2018 08:55:38 +0000 Received: from [10.60.210.99] (ams-cfilsfil-8812.cisco.com [10.60.210.99]) (authenticated bits=0) by aer-core-3.cisco.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id w3I8tbUq014934 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=NO); Wed, 18 Apr 2018 08:55:37 GMT To: Peter Psenak , "Acee Lindem (acee)" , "draft-hegdeppsenak-isis-sr-flex-algo@ietf.org" , "draft-ppsenak-ospf-sr-flex-algo@ietf.org" Cc: "lsr@ietf.org" References: <943C5E80-10F5-4EEE-A2F0-EB1C1658AEAB@cisco.com> <5AD6443B.7080607@cisco.com> From: "Clarence Filsfils (cfilsfil)" Message-ID: <00e73a9a-c550-29d5-5aca-33fcd74ac026@cisco.com> Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2018 10:55:37 +0200 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; WOW64; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/52.6.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <5AD6443B.7080607@cisco.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Authenticated-User: cfilsfil Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] IPR for IS-IS and OSPF Flex Algorithm Drafts X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2018 08:55:43 -0000 There is pending IPR and the formal IETF IPR Disclosure will be filed soon. Cheers, Clarence On 17/04/2018 21:00, Peter Psenak wrote: > Hi Acee, > > there is pending IPR and the formal IETF IPR Disclosure will be filed soon. > > thanks, > Peter > > > > On 17/04/18 17:16 , Acee Lindem (acee) wrote: >> Authors, >> >> Are you aware of any IPR that applies to draft-hegdeppsenak-isis-sr-algo >> and draft-ppsenak-ospf-sr-flex-algo? >> >> If so, has this IPR been disclosed in compliance with IETF IPR rules >> (see RFCs 3979, 4879, 3669 and 5378 for more details). >> >> If you are listed as a document author or contributor please respond to >> this email regardless of whether or not you are aware of any relevant >> IPR. *The response needs to be sent to the LSR WG mailing list.* The >> document will not advance to the next stage until a response has been >> received from each author and contributor. >> >> If you are on the LSR WG email list but are not listed as an author or >> contributor, then please explicitly respond only if you are aware of any >> IPR that has not yet been disclosed in conformance with IETF rules. >> >> Thanks, >> >> Acee >> > > . > From nobody Wed Apr 18 06:48:58 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D447B12D80E for ; Wed, 18 Apr 2018 06:48:56 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.711 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.711 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, HTTPS_HTTP_MISMATCH=1.989, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=juniper.net Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id XFSZYbSpHjx6 for ; Wed, 18 Apr 2018 06:48:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: 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(amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=cisco.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id u5kBXc5mEePl for ; Thu, 19 Apr 2018 01:27:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from aer-iport-4.cisco.com (aer-iport-4.cisco.com [173.38.203.54]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher DHE-RSA-SEED-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 2FE63126C25 for ; Thu, 19 Apr 2018 01:27:44 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cisco.com; i=@cisco.com; l=2331; q=dns/txt; s=iport; t=1524126464; x=1525336064; h=message-id:date:from:mime-version:to:subject:references: in-reply-to:content-transfer-encoding; bh=GtxC/NdSWVK/Staxtz1vxA/dilvE8a+cIqxEddw2Bbo=; b=D1vwEw/d6Qpbz15i097MFJJbPHMbnVjNJv0YpvWIiNxuOiqXbjvvdaYw o0CskI/K8/oq1OPIimRt3yegIcW2SQadMROYmjnw6zvbjEWfNCwZMSXZS xD5B5oxYc3/E0euTWqdPI3JL7yGZg6FqnpymV5Lan4q3tK1dhB4wRhVao E=; X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.48,468,1517875200"; d="scan'208";a="3227617" Received: from aer-iport-nat.cisco.com (HELO aer-core-3.cisco.com) ([173.38.203.22]) by aer-iport-4.cisco.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384; 19 Apr 2018 08:27:42 +0000 Received: from [10.147.24.35] ([10.147.24.35]) by aer-core-3.cisco.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id w3J8RfNK027721; Thu, 19 Apr 2018 08:27:42 GMT Message-ID: <5AD852FD.9080301@cisco.com> Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2018 10:27:41 +0200 From: Peter Psenak User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.11; rv:24.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/24.4.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Dongjie (Jimmy)" , "Acee Lindem (acee)" , "lsr@ietf.org" References: <5B8EB88E-9C54-47FA-BF8A-EEB952F6C0BF@cisco.com> <76CD132C3ADEF848BD84D028D243C927983EA0E3@NKGEML515-MBX.china.huawei.com> In-Reply-To: <76CD132C3ADEF848BD84D028D243C927983EA0E3@NKGEML515-MBX.china.huawei.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] LSR Working Group Adoption Poll for Flex Algorithm Drafts X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2018 08:27:50 -0000 Hi Dongjie, please see inline: On 19/04/18 09:10 , Dongjie (Jimmy) wrote: > Hi, > > Here are some comments on the Flex Algo drafts. > > SR algorithm as defined in draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensions is > about the algorithm used for path calculation, such as SPF, strict SPF, etc. > > In the Flex Algo drafts, the definition of algorithm is extended to > include topological constraints and the metric type used in calculation, > which makes its functionality analogous to multi-topology routing (MTR). not really. MTR is defined on a per link basis and each MTR participation needs to be advertised on a per link basis. There is no such concept in flex-algo draft. Flex-algo works on top of existing IGP topologies. > > Section 4.1 of the Flex Algo drafts says "Flex-Algorithm definition is > topology independent", while in some places Flex Algo is described as a > "light weight alternative" to MTR. there is no mention of MTR in the document. > > It would be necessary if the relationship between Flex-Algo and MTR can > be further clarified. Whether the two mechanisms are complementary to > each other, or Flex-Algo will be used to replace MTR? they are orthogonal. thanks, Peter > > And if it is claimed that Flex-Algo is light weight than MTR, it would > be helpful to give a thorough comparison of the two mechanisms somewhere. > > Best regards, > > Jie > > *From:*Lsr [mailto:lsr-bounces@ietf.org] *On Behalf Of *Acee Lindem (acee) > *Sent:* Tuesday, April 17, 2018 10:44 PM > *To:* lsr@ietf.org > *Subject:* [Lsr] LSR Working Group Adoption Poll for Flex Algorithm Drafts > > This begins a two-week adoption poll for the following Flex Algorithm > drafts: > > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-hegdeppsenak-isis-sr-flex-algo/ > > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ppsenak-ospf-sr-flex-algo/ > > The adoption poll will end at 12:00 AM EST on May 2^nd , 2018. Please > indicate your support of opposition of the drafts. > > Additionally, the authors are amenable to combining the drafts into a > single draft. If you have an opinion, please state that as well. > > Thanks, > > Acee > > > > _______________________________________________ > Lsr mailing list > Lsr@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr > From nobody Thu Apr 19 09:42:01 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietf.org Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id ADA5D127077; Thu, 19 Apr 2018 09:41:52 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: Cc: lsr@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 6.78.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Message-ID: <152415611264.28833.15500563955271363396@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2018 09:41:52 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Lsr] I-D Action: draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensions-16.txt X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2018 16:41:53 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Link State Routing WG of the IETF. Title : IS-IS Extensions for Segment Routing Authors : Stefano Previdi Les Ginsberg Clarence Filsfils Ahmed Bashandy Hannes Gredler Stephane Litkowski Bruno Decraene Jeff Tantsura Filename : draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensions-16.txt Pages : 35 Date : 2018-04-19 Abstract: Segment Routing (SR) allows for a flexible definition of end-to-end paths within IGP topologies by encoding paths as sequences of topological sub-paths, called "segments". These segments are advertised by the link-state routing protocols (IS-IS and OSPF). This draft describes the necessary IS-IS extensions that need to be introduced for Segment Routing operating on an MPLS data-plane. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensions/ There are also htmlized versions available at: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensions-16 https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensions-16 A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensions-16 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Thu Apr 19 09:44:10 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 00791127077 for ; Thu, 19 Apr 2018 09:44:09 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -14.51 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-14.51 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_DKIMWL_WL_HIGH=-0.01, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=cisco.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id zZWwKGsPWfWL for ; Thu, 19 Apr 2018 09:44:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from alln-iport-8.cisco.com (alln-iport-8.cisco.com [173.37.142.95]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher DHE-RSA-SEED-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 11814126B72 for ; Thu, 19 Apr 2018 09:44:07 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cisco.com; i=@cisco.com; l=2538; q=dns/txt; s=iport; t=1524156247; x=1525365847; h=from:to:subject:date:message-id:references:in-reply-to: content-transfer-encoding:mime-version; bh=TtKRy1Vk4grQJpUSLOUSpACWdwLY+pOvVZXXsbuhCU0=; b=Pis9od5TOUaMqSlsE3RQmbLq+9viwu6b+LVv2SpJZZEg46eFDbQe1Tnq a6eHbG5KFHODzLivHFTyiY+qPdwAZSfOzJgDTsNP0xtorImjsRFcPHjn7 NVY+Dv7W8tKLCAEY+jBYGuz3z7kYop5y6YsrhAS7kiGjvvFnBaVl+BOk3 U=; X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: =?us-ascii?q?A0BdBABrxtha/4wNJK1bGQEBAQEBAQE?= =?us-ascii?q?BAQEBAQcBAQEBAYNCYXooCphXgXSBD5JzgXgLGA2ERAKCQSE2FgECAQEBAQE?= =?us-ascii?q?BAmwcAQuFIgEBAQEDAQE4NBcEAgEIEQQBAR8QJwsdCAIEEwiFBQ+oQohCgiW?= =?us-ascii?q?IBoFUP4EOAYMLgxEBAQIBARaBbIUuApdtCAKFV4hcgTw7gyKHPIk0hkwCERM?= =?us-ascii?q?BgSQBIwEwgVJwFRohgkMJiweFPm+PK4EYAQE?= X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.48,469,1517875200"; d="scan'208";a="101119612" Received: from alln-core-7.cisco.com ([173.36.13.140]) by alln-iport-8.cisco.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384; 19 Apr 2018 16:44:06 +0000 Received: from XCH-ALN-003.cisco.com (xch-aln-003.cisco.com [173.36.7.13]) by alln-core-7.cisco.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id w3JGi6rB010351 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL) for ; Thu, 19 Apr 2018 16:44:06 GMT Received: from xch-aln-001.cisco.com (173.36.7.11) by XCH-ALN-003.cisco.com (173.36.7.13) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.0.1320.4; Thu, 19 Apr 2018 11:44:05 -0500 Received: from xch-aln-001.cisco.com ([173.36.7.11]) by XCH-ALN-001.cisco.com ([173.36.7.11]) with mapi id 15.00.1320.000; Thu, 19 Apr 2018 11:44:05 -0500 From: "Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)" To: "lsr@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [Lsr] I-D Action: draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensions-16.txt Thread-Index: AQHT1/1uzXV3J4KB60WXXUORy7NJjKQISvlQ Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2018 16:44:05 +0000 Message-ID: <530ffcfbd7e3452db85984795c8a4105@XCH-ALN-001.cisco.com> References: <152415611264.28833.15500563955271363396@ietfa.amsl.com> In-Reply-To: <152415611264.28833.15500563955271363396@ietfa.amsl.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted x-originating-ip: [10.24.4.120] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] I-D Action: draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensions-16.txt X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2018 16:44:09 -0000 This just updates/corrects some references which was necessary as some of t= he referenced content moved into a different draft. Les > -----Original Message----- > From: Lsr On Behalf Of internet-drafts@ietf.org > Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2018 9:42 AM > To: i-d-announce@ietf.org > Cc: lsr@ietf.org > Subject: [Lsr] I-D Action: draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensions-16.= txt >=20 >=20 > A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts direct= ories. > This draft is a work item of the Link State Routing WG of the IETF. >=20 > Title : IS-IS Extensions for Segment Routing > Authors : Stefano Previdi > Les Ginsberg > Clarence Filsfils > Ahmed Bashandy > Hannes Gredler > Stephane Litkowski > Bruno Decraene > Jeff Tantsura > Filename : draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensions-16.txt > Pages : 35 > Date : 2018-04-19 >=20 > Abstract: > Segment Routing (SR) allows for a flexible definition of end-to-end > paths within IGP topologies by encoding paths as sequences of > topological sub-paths, called "segments". These segments are > advertised by the link-state routing protocols (IS-IS and OSPF). >=20 > This draft describes the necessary IS-IS extensions that need to be > introduced for Segment Routing operating on an MPLS data-plane. >=20 >=20 >=20 > The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensio= ns/ >=20 > There are also htmlized versions available at: > https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensions-16 > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing- > extensions-16 >=20 > A diff from the previous version is available at: > https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=3Ddraft-ietf-isis-segment-routing- > extensions-16 >=20 >=20 > Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submiss= ion > until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. >=20 > Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: > ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ >=20 > _______________________________________________ > Lsr mailing list > Lsr@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr From nobody Thu Apr 19 11:09:58 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietf.org Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 57AC2124207; Thu, 19 Apr 2018 11:09:56 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: IETF Meeting Session Request Tool To: Cc: lsr-chairs@ietf.org, aretana.ietf@gmail.com, acee@cisco.com, lsr@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 6.78.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Message-ID: <152416139635.28724.5840915069197156132.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2018 11:09:56 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Lsr] lsr - New Meeting Session Request for IETF 102 X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2018 18:09:56 -0000 A new meeting session request has just been submitted by Acee Lindem, a Chair of the lsr working group. --------------------------------------------------------- Working Group Name: Link State Routing Area Name: Routing Area Session Requester: Acee Lindem Number of Sessions: 1 Length of Session(s): 2.5 Hours Number of Attendees: 70 Conflicts to Avoid: First Priority: idr rtgwg rtgarea lsvr rift spring Second Priority: bess bier netmod People who must be present: Acee Lindem Christian Hopps Alvaro Retana Resources Requested: Special Requests: --------------------------------------------------------- From nobody Thu Apr 19 13:58:59 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietf.org Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 39C381201FA; Thu, 19 Apr 2018 13:58:57 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: Cc: lsr@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 6.78.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Message-ID: <152417153719.28716.16811104069540455049@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2018 13:58:57 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Lsr] I-D Action: draft-ietf-ospf-xaf-te-02.txt X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2018 20:58:57 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Link State Routing WG of the IETF. Title : OSPF Routing with Cross-Address Family Traffic Engineering Tunnels Authors : Anton Smirnov Alvaro Retana Michael Barnes Filename : draft-ietf-ospf-xaf-te-02.txt Pages : 8 Date : 2018-04-19 Abstract: When using Traffic Engineering (TE) in a dual-stack IPv4/IPv6 network the Multiprotocol Label Switching (MPLS) TE Label Switched Paths (LSP) infrastructure may be duplicated, even if the destination IPv4 and IPv6 addresses belong to the same remote router. In order to achieve an integrated MPLS TE LSP infrastructure, OSPF routes must be computed over MPLS TE tunnels created using information propagated in another OSPF instance. This is solved by advertising cross-address family (X-AF) OSPF TE information. This document describes an update to RFC5786 that allows for the easy identification of a router's local X-AF IP addresses. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-ospf-xaf-te/ There are also htmlized versions available at: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ospf-xaf-te-02 https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-ospf-xaf-te-02 A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-ospf-xaf-te-02 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Thu Apr 19 14:04:23 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6F123126DEE; Thu, 19 Apr 2018 14:04:21 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -14.51 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-14.51 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_DKIMWL_WL_HIGH=-0.01, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=cisco.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id gJhqTTvOMKag; Thu, 19 Apr 2018 14:04:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from aer-iport-1.cisco.com (aer-iport-1.cisco.com [173.38.203.51]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher DHE-RSA-SEED-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B0EE21201FA; Thu, 19 Apr 2018 14:04:18 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cisco.com; i=@cisco.com; l=5534; q=dns/txt; s=iport; t=1524171859; x=1525381459; h=subject:to:cc:references:from:message-id:date: mime-version:in-reply-to:content-transfer-encoding; bh=VSe9Ff/IkWzszf1SBQAWQFHxK1Et45uw6PPnghMtYsw=; b=BI1RN94RBzmIHZNGf0GdWJv/3i06OtZcO+hkFl5Bm0AMNpJbW5nmnFUF 0P/jCBuHSpiectyRGSbQkty8N93iOrv31PTw8gdPL5Wnl4uOgKYVT9aQ5 toU4XLglupFdpuoT2sX+lDmAfWbZK5J7CC7QIFYHZZ2xamJaVCXtSjx0T 8=; X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.49,298,1520899200"; d="scan'208";a="3294345" Received: from aer-iport-nat.cisco.com (HELO aer-core-3.cisco.com) ([173.38.203.22]) by aer-iport-1.cisco.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384; 19 Apr 2018 21:04:16 +0000 Received: from asm-linux.cisco.com (ams-asmirnov-nitro6.cisco.com [10.55.206.135]) (authenticated bits=0) by aer-core-3.cisco.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id w3JL4F1F021688 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=NO); Thu, 19 Apr 2018 21:04:16 GMT To: "Acee Lindem (acee)" , "draft-ietf-ospf-xaf-te@ietf.org" Cc: "lsr@ietf.org" References: <5189f820-58a2-7783-284f-1bdbfc5f054f@cisco.com> From: Anton Smirnov Organization: Cisco Systems Message-ID: Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2018 23:04:15 +0200 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/52.5.2 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Authenticated-User: asmirnov Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] OSPF Routing with Cross-Address Family MPLS Traffic Engineering Tunnels X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2018 21:04:21 -0000 Hi Acee, to refresh the draft I published a new revision with changes we agreed upon (like dropping 'MPLS' from title) and minor editorial changes (change group to LSR and the like). I didn't add text to the backward compatibility section that you found confusing. Please give me know if answers in my previous email didn't clarify your questions/concerns. --- Anton On 04/07/18 23:06, Acee Lindem (acee) wrote: > Hi Anton, > > On 4/6/18, 7:33 AM, "Anton Smirnov (asmirnov)" wrote: > >         Hi Acee, >         my answers below (I didn't vet them with other authors, so they > may >     express different opinions). > >      >  1. Have you considered a shorter name for the RFC? For example: > “OSPF >      >     Cross Address Family Traffic Engineering Tunnels� > >         Your proposed variant drops two pieces: "Routing with" and "MPLS". >     Dropping mention to MPLS is fine with me. Dropping "Routing with" > seems >     to me less correct because the draft is about ways to compute > routes and >     not about setting up/managing tunnels. >         But ultimately I have no strong feelings here and if there is a >     requirement to shorten document's name then that would be a good > candidate. > > >      >  2. Can you change the requirements language text to the RFC 8174 >     version? > >         OK, we will publish new document revision when we agreed on other >     points. > > >      >  3. In the section 3 mapping algorithm, why do you walk the X-AF >      >     endpoints from all connected areas? Why not just the area of > local >      >     IP address? > >         Idea behind this wording is to cater for cases when area > borders are >     laid differently in OSPFv2 and OSPFv3. It's even possible that > router is >     ABR in OSPFv2 but not OSPFv3. From network design perspective this, of >     course, is a terrible thing to do - but not impossible. > > I guess I still don't understand. Are you implying that you are > advertising TE LSAs using both OSPFv2 and OSPFv3 and aggregating the TED > and since the area boundaries may be different, you need to search all > the areas LSP endpoints? I don't think this deployment model makes sense > and I don't think this should be supported. > > >      >  4. In the backward compatibility section, can you also discuss the >      >     requirements for backward compatibility of the endpoints? > Also state >      >     that the X-AF tunnel will not be recognized unless the > endpoints are >      >     advertised by the same protocol (OSPFv2 or OSPFv3); or > describe the >      >     behavior if this is not the intension. > >         We can add paragraph saying something like: >     "In order for XAF computation to work tunnel tailend routers MUST >     advertise XAF Node Local Address sub-TLVs in OSPF instance that will >     perform XAF computation. Thus only tunnel endpoints (both tunnel > headend >     and tailend routers) and only OSPF protocol instance performing XAF >     routing must implement XAF as described in this document. Other > routers >     in the network do not need to implement XAF algorithm or interpret > Node >     Local Address sub-TLVs. For example, if network uses TE tunnels > signaled >     by OSPFv2 [RFC3630] and intends to use cross-AF route computation in >     OSPFv3 then only OSPFv3 implementation on routers that serve as tunnel >     endpoints in OSPFv2 needs to be compliant with this specification." > >     Will this text work? > > I think this could be a lot clearer if it were written from the > perspective of the head-end router performing the calculation. Also, you > lost me completely with the last sentence. We are uses a single > protocol, OSPFv2 or OSPFv3 to advertise TE LSAs. Since both IPv4 and > IPv6 traffic is tunneled over that LSP, there is no reason to operate > both protocols since traffic will take the path of the X-AF LSP - correct? > > Thanks, > Acee > > >     --- >     Anton > > >     On 04/04/18 20:13, Acee Lindem (acee) wrote: >     > Hi Anton, Alvaro, and Mike, >     > >     > In preparation for WG last call, I have a couple comments. >     > >     >  1. Have you considered a shorter name for the RFC? For example: > “OSPF >     >     Cross Address Family Traffic Engineering Tunnels� >     >  2. Can you change the requirements language text to the RFC 8174 > version? >     >  3. In the section 3 mapping algorithm, why do you walk the X-AF >     >     endpoints from all connected areas? Why not just the area of > local >     >     IP address? >     >  4. In the backward compatibility section, can you also discuss the >     >     requirements for backward compatibility of the endpoints? > Also state >     >     that the X-AF tunnel will not be recognized unless the > endpoints are >     >     advertised by the same protocol (OSPFv2 or OSPFv3); or > describe the >     >     behavior if this is not the intension. >     > >     > Thanks, >     > >     > Acee >     > > > From nobody Thu Apr 19 14:29:19 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E293812E6D7; Thu, 19 Apr 2018 14:29:14 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -14.509 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-14.509 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_DKIMWL_WL_MED=-0.01, 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Received: from xch-rtp-015.cisco.com (64.101.220.155) by XCH-RTP-002.cisco.com (64.101.220.142) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.0.1320.4; Thu, 19 Apr 2018 17:29:09 -0400 Received: from xch-rtp-015.cisco.com ([64.101.220.155]) by XCH-RTP-015.cisco.com ([64.101.220.155]) with mapi id 15.00.1320.000; Thu, 19 Apr 2018 17:29:09 -0400 From: "Acee Lindem (acee)" To: "Anton Smirnov (asmirnov)" , "draft-ietf-ospf-xaf-te@ietf.org" CC: "lsr@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: OSPF Routing with Cross-Address Family MPLS Traffic Engineering Tunnels Thread-Index: AQHTzECcXJCh/T3oREuLrU8t7rUtP6Pz4GmAgAHvowCAC1/egIAHgnmA Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2018 21:29:09 +0000 Message-ID: <9D9A9DC6-4659-4603-AE55-A4A444687D71@cisco.com> References: <5189f820-58a2-7783-284f-1bdbfc5f054f@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted x-originating-ip: [10.116.152.196] 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aHRtbD4NCg== --_000_9D9A9DC646594603AE55A4A444687D71ciscocom_-- From nobody Thu Apr 19 20:05:10 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 59977126D0C for ; Thu, 19 Apr 2018 20:05:08 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.201 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.201 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id iTYJHlKxdj7y for ; Thu, 19 Apr 2018 20:05:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from huawei.com (lhrrgout.huawei.com [194.213.3.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id BE36B126C89 for ; Thu, 19 Apr 2018 20:05:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from LHREML714-CAH.china.huawei.com (unknown [172.18.7.108]) by Forcepoint Email with ESMTP id C8070B6298F31 for ; Fri, 20 Apr 2018 04:05:01 +0100 (IST) Received: from NKGEML412-HUB.china.huawei.com (10.98.56.73) by LHREML714-CAH.china.huawei.com (10.201.108.37) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 14.3.382.0; Fri, 20 Apr 2018 04:05:03 +0100 Received: from NKGEML515-MBX.china.huawei.com ([fe80::a54a:89d2:c471:ff]) by nkgeml412-hub.china.huawei.com ([10.98.56.73]) with mapi id 14.03.0361.001; Fri, 20 Apr 2018 11:04:58 +0800 From: "Dongjie (Jimmy)" To: Peter Psenak , "Acee Lindem (acee)" , "lsr@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [Lsr] LSR Working Group Adoption Poll for Flex Algorithm Drafts Thread-Index: AQHT1lqU9EG8NacYPUeDduC3/EAVyaQHqLKA//+VDYCAAayAEA== Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2018 03:04:57 +0000 Message-ID: <76CD132C3ADEF848BD84D028D243C927983F01BE@NKGEML515-MBX.china.huawei.com> References: <5B8EB88E-9C54-47FA-BF8A-EEB952F6C0BF@cisco.com> <76CD132C3ADEF848BD84D028D243C927983EA0E3@NKGEML515-MBX.china.huawei.com> <5AD852FD.9080301@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <5AD852FD.9080301@cisco.com> Accept-Language: en-US, zh-CN Content-Language: zh-CN X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.130.151.75] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-CFilter-Loop: Reflected Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] LSR Working Group Adoption Poll for Flex Algorithm Drafts X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2018 03:05:08 -0000 Hi Peter, Thanks for the prompt response. Please see inline: > -----Original Message----- > From: Peter Psenak [mailto:ppsenak@cisco.com] > Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2018 4:28 PM > To: Dongjie (Jimmy) ; Acee Lindem (acee) > ; lsr@ietf.org > Subject: Re: [Lsr] LSR Working Group Adoption Poll for Flex Algorithm Dra= fts >=20 > Hi Dongjie, >=20 > please see inline: >=20 > On 19/04/18 09:10 , Dongjie (Jimmy) wrote: > > Hi, > > > > Here are some comments on the Flex Algo drafts. > > > > SR algorithm as defined in draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensions > > is about the algorithm used for path calculation, such as SPF, strict S= PF, etc. > > > > In the Flex Algo drafts, the definition of algorithm is extended to > > include topological constraints and the metric type used in > > calculation, which makes its functionality analogous to multi-topology = routing > (MTR). >=20 > not really. MTR is defined on a per link basis and each MTR participation= needs > to be advertised on a per link basis. There is no such concept in flex-al= go draft. Both mechanisms have the capability to define a specific sub-topology in th= e network, that's why I say they are analogous in functionality. Flex-algo = uses link affinity to describe the constraints of the corresponding topolog= y, which is also a link attribute and needs to be configured on a per-link = basis.=20 The difference is in topology advertisement. In MTR a consistent topology i= s constructed by each node advertising its own adjacent links in the topolo= gy. While in flex-algo, the whole topology is advertised as part of the alg= orithm definition by each node, and priority based selection is used to rea= ch a consistent view by all nodes.=20 > Flex-algo works on top of existing IGP topologies. =09 Do you mean flex-algo can work on top of the default IGP topology, and can = also work on top of multiple IGP topologies created with MTR? In the latter= case, it seems you would create sub-topologies on top of a sub-topology (M= TR) of the default topology, which sounds quite complicated. Maybe another = way is to use MTR to create the sub-topology needed, and define the metric = type and computation algorithm using a particular flex-algo?=20 > > Section 4.1 of the Flex Algo drafts says "Flex-Algorithm definition is > > topology independent", while in some places Flex Algo is described as > > a "light weight alternative" to MTR. >=20 > there is no mention of MTR in the document. I was referring to another relevant draft: draft-wijnands-mpls-mldp-multi-t= opology-00. Sorry for the confusion caused. It seems that draft considered = MTR and flex-algo as comparable candidates for creating sub-topology. > > It would be necessary if the relationship between Flex-Algo and MTR > > can be further clarified. Whether the two mechanisms are complementary > > to each other, or Flex-Algo will be used to replace MTR? >=20 > they are orthogonal. If as you said they are orthogonal, it would be better to avoid overlapping= functionalities in topology definition and creation.=20 Best regards, Jie > thanks, > Peter >=20 > > > > And if it is claimed that Flex-Algo is light weight than MTR, it would > > be helpful to give a thorough comparison of the two mechanisms somewher= e. > > > > Best regards, > > > > Jie > > > > *From:*Lsr [mailto:lsr-bounces@ietf.org] *On Behalf Of *Acee Lindem > > (acee) > > *Sent:* Tuesday, April 17, 2018 10:44 PM > > *To:* lsr@ietf.org > > *Subject:* [Lsr] LSR Working Group Adoption Poll for Flex Algorithm > > Drafts > > > > This begins a two-week adoption poll for the following Flex Algorithm > > drafts: > > > > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-hegdeppsenak-isis-sr-flex-algo/ > > > > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ppsenak-ospf-sr-flex-algo/ > > > > The adoption poll will end at 12:00 AM EST on May 2^nd , 2018. Please > > indicate your support of opposition of the drafts. > > > > Additionally, the authors are amenable to combining the drafts into a > > single draft. If you have an opinion, please state that as well. > > > > Thanks, > > > > Acee > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Lsr mailing list > > Lsr@ietf.org > > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr > > From nobody Fri Apr 20 00:31:11 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9258A128896 for ; Fri, 20 Apr 2018 00:31:10 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -14.511 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-14.511 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_DKIMWL_WL_HIGH=-0.01, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=cisco.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id SzVK3peqTsrX for ; Fri, 20 Apr 2018 00:31:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from aer-iport-1.cisco.com (aer-iport-1.cisco.com [173.38.203.51]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher DHE-RSA-SEED-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 574DC1204DA for ; Fri, 20 Apr 2018 00:31:08 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cisco.com; i=@cisco.com; l=4925; q=dns/txt; s=iport; t=1524209468; x=1525419068; h=message-id:date:from:mime-version:to:subject:references: in-reply-to:content-transfer-encoding; bh=2bM/jgEHGmI9HJKgxS7S+CEtlyFrfpuRFk9z6gRD10A=; b=i154qMQXTEvhUxhUZdeZYhznujUAHzA+4LXg6GLnaLZduSdFlETQUzrR C6/gdcJa7qn2/oHOhNX5FZ6uEJGSJ97LCExG0fIrLjRlcqbB9V6CA1NTN RpEGDWNmFbP5vrfEWWVx2vQQnlqLbt1aS3HwfShIUXJICnWbrRlVr7hcL c=; X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.49,300,1520899200"; d="scan'208";a="3307257" Received: from aer-iport-nat.cisco.com (HELO aer-core-2.cisco.com) ([173.38.203.22]) by aer-iport-1.cisco.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384; 20 Apr 2018 07:31:06 +0000 Received: from [10.147.24.35] ([10.147.24.35]) by aer-core-2.cisco.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id w3K7V6RJ001231; Fri, 20 Apr 2018 07:31:06 GMT Message-ID: <5AD99739.3050000@cisco.com> Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2018 09:31:05 +0200 From: Peter Psenak User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.11; rv:24.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/24.4.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Dongjie (Jimmy)" , "Acee Lindem (acee)" , "lsr@ietf.org" References: <5B8EB88E-9C54-47FA-BF8A-EEB952F6C0BF@cisco.com> <76CD132C3ADEF848BD84D028D243C927983EA0E3@NKGEML515-MBX.china.huawei.com> <5AD852FD.9080301@cisco.com> <76CD132C3ADEF848BD84D028D243C927983F01BE@NKGEML515-MBX.china.huawei.com> In-Reply-To: <76CD132C3ADEF848BD84D028D243C927983F01BE@NKGEML515-MBX.china.huawei.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] LSR Working Group Adoption Poll for Flex Algorithm Drafts X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2018 07:31:11 -0000 Hi Dongjie, please see inline: On 20/04/18 05:04 , Dongjie (Jimmy) wrote: > Hi Peter, > > Thanks for the prompt response. Please see inline: > >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Peter Psenak [mailto:ppsenak@cisco.com] >> Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2018 4:28 PM >> To: Dongjie (Jimmy) ; Acee Lindem (acee) >> ; lsr@ietf.org >> Subject: Re: [Lsr] LSR Working Group Adoption Poll for Flex Algorithm Drafts >> >> Hi Dongjie, >> >> please see inline: >> >> On 19/04/18 09:10 , Dongjie (Jimmy) wrote: >>> Hi, >>> >>> Here are some comments on the Flex Algo drafts. >>> >>> SR algorithm as defined in draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensions >>> is about the algorithm used for path calculation, such as SPF, strict SPF, etc. >>> >>> In the Flex Algo drafts, the definition of algorithm is extended to >>> include topological constraints and the metric type used in >>> calculation, which makes its functionality analogous to multi-topology routing >> (MTR). >> >> not really. MTR is defined on a per link basis and each MTR participation needs >> to be advertised on a per link basis. There is no such concept in flex-algo draft. > > Both mechanisms have the capability to define a specific sub-topology in the network, that's why I say they are analogous in functionality. Flex-algo uses link affinity to describe the constraints of the corresponding topology, which is also a link attribute and needs to be configured on a per-link basis. > > The difference is in topology advertisement. In MTR a consistent topology is constructed by each node advertising its own adjacent links in the topology. While in flex-algo, the whole topology is advertised as part of the algorithm definition by each node, and priority based selection is used to reach a consistent view by all nodes. > >> Flex-algo works on top of existing IGP topologies. > > Do you mean flex-algo can work on top of the default IGP topology, and can also work on top of multiple IGP topologies created with MTR? yes > In the latter case, it seems you would create sub-topologies on top of a sub-topology (MTR) of the default topology, no. We don't create any topologies with flex-algo. We compute constrained based paths. > which sounds quite complicated. Maybe another way is to use MTR to create the sub-topology needed, and define the metric type and computation algorithm using a particular flex-algo? what we propose is simple - compute multiple constrained based paths on top of a given topology. What you propose is indeed complicated - create as many topologies as many constrained based paths you need. That solution does not scale. > >>> Section 4.1 of the Flex Algo drafts says "Flex-Algorithm definition is >>> topology independent", while in some places Flex Algo is described as >>> a "light weight alternative" to MTR. >> >> there is no mention of MTR in the document. > > I was referring to another relevant draft: draft-wijnands-mpls-mldp-multi-topology-00. Sorry for the confusion caused. It seems that draft considered MTR and flex-algo as comparable candidates for creating sub-topology. then please talk to the authors of that draft. > >>> It would be necessary if the relationship between Flex-Algo and MTR >>> can be further clarified. Whether the two mechanisms are complementary >>> to each other, or Flex-Algo will be used to replace MTR? >> >> they are orthogonal. > > If as you said they are orthogonal, it would be better to avoid overlapping functionalities in topology definition and creation. orthogonal does not mean overlapping. thanks, Peter > > Best regards, > Jie > > >> thanks, >> Peter >> >>> >>> And if it is claimed that Flex-Algo is light weight than MTR, it would >>> be helpful to give a thorough comparison of the two mechanisms somewhere. >>> >>> Best regards, >>> >>> Jie >>> >>> *From:*Lsr [mailto:lsr-bounces@ietf.org] *On Behalf Of *Acee Lindem >>> (acee) >>> *Sent:* Tuesday, April 17, 2018 10:44 PM >>> *To:* lsr@ietf.org >>> *Subject:* [Lsr] LSR Working Group Adoption Poll for Flex Algorithm >>> Drafts >>> >>> This begins a two-week adoption poll for the following Flex Algorithm >>> drafts: >>> >>> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-hegdeppsenak-isis-sr-flex-algo/ >>> >>> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ppsenak-ospf-sr-flex-algo/ >>> >>> The adoption poll will end at 12:00 AM EST on May 2^nd , 2018. Please >>> indicate your support of opposition of the drafts. >>> >>> Additionally, the authors are amenable to combining the drafts into a >>> single draft. If you have an opinion, please state that as well. >>> >>> Thanks, >>> >>> Acee >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Lsr mailing list >>> Lsr@ietf.org >>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr >>> > > . > From nobody Fri Apr 20 02:00:37 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0BB71126D3F for ; Fri, 20 Apr 2018 02:00:36 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.201 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.201 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id G5hnIwacHdKk for ; Fri, 20 Apr 2018 02:00:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from huawei.com (lhrrgout.huawei.com [194.213.3.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 838E2126B6D for ; Fri, 20 Apr 2018 02:00:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from lhreml701-cah.china.huawei.com (unknown [172.18.7.108]) by Forcepoint Email with ESMTP id 10C47F33ED6B6 for ; Fri, 20 Apr 2018 10:00:29 +0100 (IST) Received: from NKGEML411-HUB.china.huawei.com (10.98.56.70) by lhreml701-cah.china.huawei.com (10.201.108.42) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 14.3.382.0; Fri, 20 Apr 2018 10:00:30 +0100 Received: from NKGEML515-MBX.china.huawei.com ([fe80::a54a:89d2:c471:ff]) by nkgeml411-hub.china.huawei.com ([10.98.56.70]) with mapi id 14.03.0361.001; Fri, 20 Apr 2018 17:00:17 +0800 From: "Dongjie (Jimmy)" To: Peter Psenak , "Acee Lindem (acee)" , "lsr@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [Lsr] LSR Working Group Adoption Poll for Flex Algorithm Drafts Thread-Index: AQHT1lqU9EG8NacYPUeDduC3/EAVyaQHqLKA//+VDYCAAayAEP//1gSAgACXe1A= Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2018 09:00:16 +0000 Message-ID: <76CD132C3ADEF848BD84D028D243C927983F0926@NKGEML515-MBX.china.huawei.com> References: <5B8EB88E-9C54-47FA-BF8A-EEB952F6C0BF@cisco.com> <76CD132C3ADEF848BD84D028D243C927983EA0E3@NKGEML515-MBX.china.huawei.com> <5AD852FD.9080301@cisco.com> <76CD132C3ADEF848BD84D028D243C927983F01BE@NKGEML515-MBX.china.huawei.com> <5AD99739.3050000@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <5AD99739.3050000@cisco.com> Accept-Language: en-US, zh-CN Content-Language: zh-CN X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.130.151.75] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-CFilter-Loop: Reflected Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] LSR Working Group Adoption Poll for Flex Algorithm Drafts X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2018 09:00:36 -0000 Hi Peter,=20 Please see inline: > -----Original Message----- > From: Peter Psenak [mailto:ppsenak@cisco.com] > Sent: Friday, April 20, 2018 3:31 PM > To: Dongjie (Jimmy) ; Acee Lindem (acee) > ; lsr@ietf.org > Subject: Re: [Lsr] LSR Working Group Adoption Poll for Flex Algorithm Dra= fts >=20 > Hi Dongjie, >=20 > please see inline: >=20 >=20 > On 20/04/18 05:04 , Dongjie (Jimmy) wrote: > > Hi Peter, > > > > Thanks for the prompt response. Please see inline: > > > >> -----Original Message----- > >> From: Peter Psenak [mailto:ppsenak@cisco.com] > >> Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2018 4:28 PM > >> To: Dongjie (Jimmy) ; Acee Lindem (acee) > >> ; lsr@ietf.org > >> Subject: Re: [Lsr] LSR Working Group Adoption Poll for Flex Algorithm > >> Drafts > >> > >> Hi Dongjie, > >> > >> please see inline: > >> > >> On 19/04/18 09:10 , Dongjie (Jimmy) wrote: > >>> Hi, > >>> > >>> Here are some comments on the Flex Algo drafts. > >>> > >>> SR algorithm as defined in > >>> draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensions > >>> is about the algorithm used for path calculation, such as SPF, strict= SPF, etc. > >>> > >>> In the Flex Algo drafts, the definition of algorithm is extended to > >>> include topological constraints and the metric type used in > >>> calculation, which makes its functionality analogous to > >>> multi-topology routing > >> (MTR). > >> > >> not really. MTR is defined on a per link basis and each MTR > >> participation needs to be advertised on a per link basis. There is no = such > concept in flex-algo draft. > > > > Both mechanisms have the capability to define a specific sub-topology i= n the > network, that's why I say they are analogous in functionality. Flex-algo = uses link > affinity to describe the constraints of the corresponding topology, which= is also > a link attribute and needs to be configured on a per-link basis. > > > > The difference is in topology advertisement. In MTR a consistent topolo= gy is > constructed by each node advertising its own adjacent links in the topolo= gy. > While in flex-algo, the whole topology is advertised as part of the algor= ithm > definition by each node, and priority based selection is used to reach a > consistent view by all nodes. > > > >> Flex-algo works on top of existing IGP topologies. > > > > Do you mean flex-algo can work on top of the default IGP topology, and = can > also work on top of multiple IGP topologies created with MTR? >=20 > yes >=20 > > In the latter case, it seems you would create sub-topologies on top of > > a sub-topology (MTR) of the default topology, >=20 > no. We don't create any topologies with flex-algo. We compute constrained > based paths. MTR is also used to compute constrained based path:) The constraint is desc= ribed as a sub-topology. With flex-algo, you need to define the algorithm first, then the constraine= d path can be computed according to the algorithm.=20 According to your presentation in IETF101, a flex-algo specifies:=20 a) Set of constraints - e.g affinity exclude-any, include-any, include-al= l b) Metric type - IGP metric, Delay (RFC7810), TE metric (RFC5305), ... c) Algorithm type - SPF, ... As I see a) defines a constrained topology, or a sub-topology.=20 > > which sounds quite complicated. Maybe another way is to use MTR to crea= te > the sub-topology needed, and define the metric type and computation > algorithm using a particular flex-algo? >=20 > what we propose is simple - compute multiple constrained based paths on t= op > of a given topology. >=20 > What you propose is indeed complicated - create as many topologies as man= y > constrained based paths you need. That solution does not scale. Not exactly. Multiple constrained paths can be created in the same sub-topo= logy. You don't need as many topologies as the number of paths.=20 > > > >>> Section 4.1 of the Flex Algo drafts says "Flex-Algorithm definition > >>> is topology independent", while in some places Flex Algo is > >>> described as a "light weight alternative" to MTR. > >> > >> there is no mention of MTR in the document. > > > > I was referring to another relevant draft: > draft-wijnands-mpls-mldp-multi-topology-00. Sorry for the confusion cause= d. It > seems that draft considered MTR and flex-algo as comparable candidates fo= r > creating sub-topology. >=20 > then please talk to the authors of that draft. OK. It seems some sync up is needed to have consistent understanding of wha= t flex-algo means. > > > >>> It would be necessary if the relationship between Flex-Algo and MTR > >>> can be further clarified. Whether the two mechanisms are > >>> complementary to each other, or Flex-Algo will be used to replace MTR= ? > >> > >> they are orthogonal. > > > > If as you said they are orthogonal, it would be better to avoid overlap= ping > functionalities in topology definition and creation. >=20 > orthogonal does not mean overlapping. Right, in order to make them orthogonal, overlapping (if any) should be res= olved.=20 Best regards, Jie >=20 > thanks, > Peter >=20 > > > > Best regards, > > Jie > > > > > >> thanks, > >> Peter > >> > >>> > >>> And if it is claimed that Flex-Algo is light weight than MTR, it > >>> would be helpful to give a thorough comparison of the two mechanisms > somewhere. > >>> > >>> Best regards, > >>> > >>> Jie > >>> > >>> *From:*Lsr [mailto:lsr-bounces@ietf.org] *On Behalf Of *Acee Lindem > >>> (acee) > >>> *Sent:* Tuesday, April 17, 2018 10:44 PM > >>> *To:* lsr@ietf.org > >>> *Subject:* [Lsr] LSR Working Group Adoption Poll for Flex Algorithm > >>> Drafts > >>> > >>> This begins a two-week adoption poll for the following Flex > >>> Algorithm > >>> drafts: > >>> > >>> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-hegdeppsenak-isis-sr-flex-alg > >>> o/ > >>> > >>> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ppsenak-ospf-sr-flex-algo/ > >>> > >>> The adoption poll will end at 12:00 AM EST on May 2^nd , 2018. > >>> Please indicate your support of opposition of the drafts. > >>> > >>> Additionally, the authors are amenable to combining the drafts into > >>> a single draft. If you have an opinion, please state that as well. > >>> > >>> Thanks, > >>> > >>> Acee > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> _______________________________________________ > >>> Lsr mailing list > >>> Lsr@ietf.org > >>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr > >>> > > > > . > > From nobody Fri Apr 20 02:18:42 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietf.org Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D325E126C25; Fri, 20 Apr 2018 02:18:35 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: Cc: lsr@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 6.78.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Message-ID: <152421591581.10771.5958245284483467774@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2018 02:18:35 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Lsr] I-D Action: draft-ietf-ospf-ospfv3-segment-routing-extensions-12.txt X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2018 09:18:36 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Link State Routing WG of the IETF. Title : OSPFv3 Extensions for Segment Routing Authors : Peter Psenak Clarence Filsfils Stefano Previdi Hannes Gredler Rob Shakir Wim Henderickx Jeff Tantsura Filename : draft-ietf-ospf-ospfv3-segment-routing-extensions-12.txt Pages : 28 Date : 2018-04-20 Abstract: Segment Routing (SR) allows a flexible definition of end-to-end paths within IGP topologies by encoding paths as sequences of topological sub-paths, called "segments". These segments are advertised by the link-state routing protocols (IS-IS and OSPF). This draft describes the OSPFv3 extensions required for Segment Routing. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-ospf-ospfv3-segment-routing-extensions/ There are also htmlized versions available at: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ospf-ospfv3-segment-routing-extensions-12 https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-ospf-ospfv3-segment-routing-extensions-12 A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-ospf-ospfv3-segment-routing-extensions-12 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Fri Apr 20 02:33:58 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 22117126C25 for ; Fri, 20 Apr 2018 02:33:57 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -14.511 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-14.511 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_DKIMWL_WL_HIGH=-0.01, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=cisco.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id iOhKOEDxQZ9F for ; Fri, 20 Apr 2018 02:33:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from aer-iport-4.cisco.com (aer-iport-4.cisco.com [173.38.203.54]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher DHE-RSA-SEED-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 5F4CD126B6D for ; Fri, 20 Apr 2018 02:33:54 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cisco.com; i=@cisco.com; l=7068; q=dns/txt; s=iport; t=1524216834; x=1525426434; h=message-id:date:from:mime-version:to:subject:references: in-reply-to:content-transfer-encoding; bh=ILiFQx7oHIIMs9S8cS0IbeTtDyFYKmFLuSbbL1Q2W+4=; b=EjuhUiB7dxrRfVgXvWIAgf+PNyKwOTPzB94mu7efZvN3raGluimnAc+/ pyr4r6tcCGugwGdPreEOh+cm7LI9LHXfqEdKuZEKAZqTuS2cndOVNswr4 gRhkupt3CH3GPZraeMkxlWPJJRgxOQzxLlNYcK2ni+z1dbzjq3ih3nQi3 8=; X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.49,300,1520899200"; d="scan'208";a="3258801" Received: from aer-iport-nat.cisco.com (HELO aer-core-2.cisco.com) ([173.38.203.22]) by aer-iport-4.cisco.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384; 20 Apr 2018 09:33:52 +0000 Received: from [10.147.24.35] ([10.147.24.35]) by aer-core-2.cisco.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id w3K9XpFs030153; Fri, 20 Apr 2018 09:33:52 GMT Message-ID: <5AD9B3FF.8000805@cisco.com> Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2018 11:33:51 +0200 From: Peter Psenak User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.11; rv:24.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/24.4.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Dongjie (Jimmy)" , "Acee Lindem (acee)" , "lsr@ietf.org" References: <5B8EB88E-9C54-47FA-BF8A-EEB952F6C0BF@cisco.com> <76CD132C3ADEF848BD84D028D243C927983EA0E3@NKGEML515-MBX.china.huawei.com> <5AD852FD.9080301@cisco.com> <76CD132C3ADEF848BD84D028D243C927983F01BE@NKGEML515-MBX.china.huawei.com> <5AD99739.3050000@cisco.com> <76CD132C3ADEF848BD84D028D243C927983F0926@NKGEML515-MBX.china.huawei.com> In-Reply-To: <76CD132C3ADEF848BD84D028D243C927983F0926@NKGEML515-MBX.china.huawei.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] LSR Working Group Adoption Poll for Flex Algorithm Drafts X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2018 09:33:57 -0000 Dongjie, On 20/04/18 11:00 , Dongjie (Jimmy) wrote: > Hi Peter, > > Please see inline: > >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Peter Psenak [mailto:ppsenak@cisco.com] >> Sent: Friday, April 20, 2018 3:31 PM >> To: Dongjie (Jimmy) ; Acee Lindem (acee) >> ; lsr@ietf.org >> Subject: Re: [Lsr] LSR Working Group Adoption Poll for Flex Algorithm Drafts >> >> Hi Dongjie, >> >> please see inline: >> >> >> On 20/04/18 05:04 , Dongjie (Jimmy) wrote: >>> Hi Peter, >>> >>> Thanks for the prompt response. Please see inline: >>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: Peter Psenak [mailto:ppsenak@cisco.com] >>>> Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2018 4:28 PM >>>> To: Dongjie (Jimmy) ; Acee Lindem (acee) >>>> ; lsr@ietf.org >>>> Subject: Re: [Lsr] LSR Working Group Adoption Poll for Flex Algorithm >>>> Drafts >>>> >>>> Hi Dongjie, >>>> >>>> please see inline: >>>> >>>> On 19/04/18 09:10 , Dongjie (Jimmy) wrote: >>>>> Hi, >>>>> >>>>> Here are some comments on the Flex Algo drafts. >>>>> >>>>> SR algorithm as defined in >>>>> draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensions >>>>> is about the algorithm used for path calculation, such as SPF, strict SPF, etc. >>>>> >>>>> In the Flex Algo drafts, the definition of algorithm is extended to >>>>> include topological constraints and the metric type used in >>>>> calculation, which makes its functionality analogous to >>>>> multi-topology routing >>>> (MTR). >>>> >>>> not really. MTR is defined on a per link basis and each MTR >>>> participation needs to be advertised on a per link basis. There is no such >> concept in flex-algo draft. >>> >>> Both mechanisms have the capability to define a specific sub-topology in the >> network, that's why I say they are analogous in functionality. Flex-algo uses link >> affinity to describe the constraints of the corresponding topology, which is also >> a link attribute and needs to be configured on a per-link basis. >>> >>> The difference is in topology advertisement. In MTR a consistent topology is >> constructed by each node advertising its own adjacent links in the topology. >> While in flex-algo, the whole topology is advertised as part of the algorithm >> definition by each node, and priority based selection is used to reach a >> consistent view by all nodes. >>> >>>> Flex-algo works on top of existing IGP topologies. >>> >>> Do you mean flex-algo can work on top of the default IGP topology, and can >> also work on top of multiple IGP topologies created with MTR? >> >> yes >> >>> In the latter case, it seems you would create sub-topologies on top of >>> a sub-topology (MTR) of the default topology, >> >> no. We don't create any topologies with flex-algo. We compute constrained >> based paths. > > MTR is also used to compute constrained based path:) The constraint is described as a sub-topology. you are mixing two different things - topology and path computations, these are two different things. > > With flex-algo, you need to define the algorithm first, then the constrained path can be computed according to the algorithm. > > According to your presentation in IETF101, a flex-algo specifies: > > a) Set of constraints - e.g affinity exclude-any, include-any, include-all > b) Metric type - IGP metric, Delay (RFC7810), TE metric (RFC5305), ... > c) Algorithm type - SPF, ... > > As I see a) defines a constrained topology, or a sub-topology. again, you are mixing "set of constraints" with a "topology", these are two different things. > >>> which sounds quite complicated. Maybe another way is to use MTR to create >> the sub-topology needed, and define the metric type and computation >> algorithm using a particular flex-algo? >> >> what we propose is simple - compute multiple constrained based paths on top >> of a given topology. >> >> What you propose is indeed complicated - create as many topologies as many >> constrained based paths you need. That solution does not scale. > > Not exactly. Multiple constrained paths can be created in the same sub-topology. You don't need as many topologies as the number of paths. if you calculate multiple constrained paths on a single MT, you need to agree what the constraints are for each calculation and that is what the flex-algo draft is doing. regards, Peter > >>> >>>>> Section 4.1 of the Flex Algo drafts says "Flex-Algorithm definition >>>>> is topology independent", while in some places Flex Algo is >>>>> described as a "light weight alternative" to MTR. >>>> >>>> there is no mention of MTR in the document. >>> >>> I was referring to another relevant draft: >> draft-wijnands-mpls-mldp-multi-topology-00. Sorry for the confusion caused. It >> seems that draft considered MTR and flex-algo as comparable candidates for >> creating sub-topology. >> >> then please talk to the authors of that draft. > > OK. It seems some sync up is needed to have consistent understanding of what flex-algo means. > >>> >>>>> It would be necessary if the relationship between Flex-Algo and MTR >>>>> can be further clarified. Whether the two mechanisms are >>>>> complementary to each other, or Flex-Algo will be used to replace MTR? >>>> >>>> they are orthogonal. >>> >>> If as you said they are orthogonal, it would be better to avoid overlapping >> functionalities in topology definition and creation. >> >> orthogonal does not mean overlapping. > > Right, in order to make them orthogonal, overlapping (if any) should be resolved. > > Best regards, > Jie > >> >> thanks, >> Peter >> >>> >>> Best regards, >>> Jie >>> >>> >>>> thanks, >>>> Peter >>>> >>>>> >>>>> And if it is claimed that Flex-Algo is light weight than MTR, it >>>>> would be helpful to give a thorough comparison of the two mechanisms >> somewhere. >>>>> >>>>> Best regards, >>>>> >>>>> Jie >>>>> >>>>> *From:*Lsr [mailto:lsr-bounces@ietf.org] *On Behalf Of *Acee Lindem >>>>> (acee) >>>>> *Sent:* Tuesday, April 17, 2018 10:44 PM >>>>> *To:* lsr@ietf.org >>>>> *Subject:* [Lsr] LSR Working Group Adoption Poll for Flex Algorithm >>>>> Drafts >>>>> >>>>> This begins a two-week adoption poll for the following Flex >>>>> Algorithm >>>>> drafts: >>>>> >>>>> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-hegdeppsenak-isis-sr-flex-alg >>>>> o/ >>>>> >>>>> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ppsenak-ospf-sr-flex-algo/ >>>>> >>>>> The adoption poll will end at 12:00 AM EST on May 2^nd , 2018. >>>>> Please indicate your support of opposition of the drafts. >>>>> >>>>> Additionally, the authors are amenable to combining the drafts into >>>>> a single draft. If you have an opinion, please state that as well. >>>>> >>>>> Thanks, >>>>> >>>>> Acee >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> Lsr mailing list >>>>> Lsr@ietf.org >>>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr >>>>> >>> >>> . >>> > > . > From nobody Fri Apr 20 02:35:48 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8604F126B6D for ; Fri, 20 Apr 2018 02:35:47 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -13.49 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-13.49 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, MISSING_HEADERS=1.021, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_DKIMWL_WL_HIGH=-0.01, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=cisco.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id qIdTuNIvay2R for ; Fri, 20 Apr 2018 02:35:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from aer-iport-2.cisco.com (aer-iport-2.cisco.com [173.38.203.52]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher DHE-RSA-SEED-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 3F9D21270AE for ; Fri, 20 Apr 2018 02:35:45 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cisco.com; i=@cisco.com; l=2181; q=dns/txt; s=iport; t=1524216945; x=1525426545; h=message-id:date:from:mime-version:cc:subject:references: in-reply-to:content-transfer-encoding; bh=knn7DbImxdruALAMU2jPBA+qVKOAjkX/f7gvSh0V6tU=; b=HAV2m/PABnn4ypTDYG9/23JNJxTE00roOle6zDGCVwn9ZYBeZvy18E0y UWaibijHNLGCae0dxkWgcMHcf4ebnTojiKr7gEbwUeISLp5JozeKx6TDl +HG4Yz1NsmvQuAuPUrp8sgbWEYqumsRjFF5y7b3sn4qUMFA8gOs6GVQDR 0=; X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: =?us-ascii?q?A0BpAgDMs9la/xbLJq1bGgEBAQEBAgE?= =?us-ascii?q?BAQEIAQEBAYQjehkPjEqODYEPlG4LGA2ERAImgj84FAECAQEBAQEBAmwcDIU?= =?us-ascii?q?aCQEBAQMBATY2CgEQCxgJFg8JAwIBAgEVMBMBBQIBAViEMQ+oYw6EWYNogim?= =?us-ascii?q?JWj+BDoMMgxEBAQIBARaEWYJBApdvCIVbiGSBNDuDIoI4hQSJNIZ1gSUzIYF?= =?us-ascii?q?SMxoIGxUaIYEdCIEeCYsHhUA9MI9lAQ?= X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.49,300,1520899200"; d="scan'208";a="3305205" Received: from aer-iport-nat.cisco.com (HELO aer-core-1.cisco.com) ([173.38.203.22]) by aer-iport-2.cisco.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384; 20 Apr 2018 09:35:41 +0000 Received: from [10.147.24.35] ([10.147.24.35]) by aer-core-1.cisco.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id w3K9Zf69026956 for ; Fri, 20 Apr 2018 09:35:41 GMT Message-ID: <5AD9B46D.4070205@cisco.com> Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2018 11:35:41 +0200 From: Peter Psenak User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.11; rv:24.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/24.4.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 CC: lsr@ietf.org References: <152421591581.10771.5958245284483467774@ietfa.amsl.com> In-Reply-To: <152421591581.10771.5958245284483467774@ietfa.amsl.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] I-D Action: draft-ietf-ospf-ospfv3-segment-routing-extensions-12.txt X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2018 09:35:48 -0000 This just updates/corrects some references which was necessary as some of the referenced content moved into a different draft. On 20/04/18 11:18 , internet-drafts@ietf.org wrote: > > A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. > This draft is a work item of the Link State Routing WG of the IETF. > > Title : OSPFv3 Extensions for Segment Routing > Authors : Peter Psenak > Clarence Filsfils > Stefano Previdi > Hannes Gredler > Rob Shakir > Wim Henderickx > Jeff Tantsura > Filename : draft-ietf-ospf-ospfv3-segment-routing-extensions-12.txt > Pages : 28 > Date : 2018-04-20 > > Abstract: > Segment Routing (SR) allows a flexible definition of end-to-end paths > within IGP topologies by encoding paths as sequences of topological > sub-paths, called "segments". These segments are advertised by the > link-state routing protocols (IS-IS and OSPF). > > This draft describes the OSPFv3 extensions required for Segment > Routing. > > > > The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-ospf-ospfv3-segment-routing-extensions/ > > There are also htmlized versions available at: > https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ospf-ospfv3-segment-routing-extensions-12 > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-ospf-ospfv3-segment-routing-extensions-12 > > A diff from the previous version is available at: > https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-ospf-ospfv3-segment-routing-extensions-12 > > > Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission > until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. > > Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: > ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ > > _______________________________________________ > Lsr mailing list > Lsr@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr > . > From nobody Fri Apr 20 03:57:39 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E1A0A1270AE for ; Fri, 20 Apr 2018 03:57:37 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -14.511 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-14.511 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_DKIMWL_WL_HIGH=-0.01, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=cisco.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id BaUQLjEpKst1 for ; Fri, 20 Apr 2018 03:57:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from 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"Acee Lindem (acee)" To: "Peter Psenak (ppsenak)" , "Dongjie (Jimmy)" , "lsr@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [Lsr] LSR Working Group Adoption Poll for Flex Algorithm Drafts Thread-Index: AQHT2FRic0P5jDk6m02kQPHy3qgNAKQJhXqAgAAY6wCAAAligP//1FMA Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2018 10:57:33 +0000 Message-ID: References: <5B8EB88E-9C54-47FA-BF8A-EEB952F6C0BF@cisco.com> <76CD132C3ADEF848BD84D028D243C927983EA0E3@NKGEML515-MBX.china.huawei.com> <5AD852FD.9080301@cisco.com> <76CD132C3ADEF848BD84D028D243C927983F01BE@NKGEML515-MBX.china.huawei.com> <5AD99739.3050000@cisco.com> <76CD132C3ADEF848BD84D028D243C927983F0926@NKGEML515-MBX.china.huawei.com> <5AD9B3FF.8000805@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <5AD9B3FF.8000805@cisco.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted x-originating-ip: [10.116.152.196] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-ID: Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] LSR Working Group Adoption Poll for Flex Algorithm Drafts X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2018 10:57:38 -0000 SGkgSmllLCBQZXRlciwgDQoNCkFub3RoZXIgZGlmZmVyZW5jZSB3aXRoIE11bHRpcGxlIFRvcG9s b2d5IFJvdXRlciAoTVRSKSBpcyB0aGF0IGl0IGltcGxpZXMgdGhlIGFic3RyYWN0aW9uIG9mIGEg UklCIHBlciB0b3BvbG9neSBzbyB5b3UgY291bGQgaGF2ZSBtdWx0aXBsZSByb3V0ZXMgdG8gdGhl IHNhbWUgcHJlZml4IGRlcGVuZGVudCBvbiBjcml0ZXJpYSBvdGhlciB0aGFuIGxvbmdlc3QgcHJl Zml4IG1hdGNoaW5nIChlLmcuLCBpbmdyZXNzIGludGVyZmFjZSkuIFRoZSBhdXRob3JzIGNhbiBj b3JyZWN0IG1lIGlmIEknbSB3cm9uZywgYnV0IEkgZG9uJ3QgYmVsaWV2ZSBGbGV4IEFsZ29yaXRo bSByZXF1aXJlcyB0aGlzIGFic3RyYWN0aW9uLiANCg0KVGhhbmtzLA0KQWNlZQ0KDQoNCu+7v09u IDQvMjAvMTgsIDU6MzMgQU0sICJQZXRlciBQc2VuYWsgKHBwc2VuYWspIiA8cHBzZW5ha0BjaXNj 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X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.201 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.201 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id raGma0Efpokx for ; Fri, 20 Apr 2018 05:02:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from post-send.kddi.com (athena3.kddi.com [27.90.165.196]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A146C1270AE for ; Fri, 20 Apr 2018 05:02:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from LTMC2123.kddi.com (post-send [10.206.2.120]) by post-send.kddi.com (KDDI Mail) with ESMTP id A4792E0120 for ; Fri, 20 Apr 2018 21:02:03 +0900 (JST) Received: from LTMC2145.kddi.com ([10.206.0.236] [10.206.0.236]) by LTMC2123.kddi.com with ESMTP; Fri, 20 Apr 2018 21:02:03 +0900 Received: from LTMC2145.kddi.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by localhost.kddi.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7EA7D3A006B for ; Fri, 20 Apr 2018 21:02:03 +0900 (JST) Received: from LTMC2154.kddi.com (post-incheck [10.206.0.239]) by LTMC2145.kddi.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 714D83A0065 for ; Fri, 20 Apr 2018 21:02:03 +0900 (JST) Received: from LTMC2154.kddi.com (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by LTMC2154.kddi.com with ESMTP id w3KC23Z7095050 for ; Fri, 20 Apr 2018 21:02:03 +0900 Received: from LTMC2154.kddi.com.mid_27430516 (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by LTMC2154.kddi.com with ESMTP id w3KC1P9x094765 for ; Fri, 20 Apr 2018 21:01:25 +0900 X-SA-MID: 27430516 Received: from KDDI1609PC0262 ([10.210.109.65] [10.210.109.65]) by post-smtp2.kddi.com with ESMTPA; Fri, 20 Apr 2018 21:01:24 +0900 From: "Kenji Kumaki" To: Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2018 21:01:24 +0900 Message-ID: <000201d3d89f$4e5af5a0$eb10e0e0$@kddi.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 14.0 Thread-Index: AdPYnkH9T3bJzMa8SUeokanRiK4nYg== Content-Language: ja X-TM-AS-MML: disable Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] LSR Working Group Adoption Poll for Flex Algorithm Drafts X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2018 12:02:07 -0000 Hi, I'd like to support the following draft. Actually, it is a very useful draft from operational perspective. Regards, Kenji > *From:*Lsr [mailto:lsr-bounces@ietf.org] *On Behalf Of *Acee Lindem > (acee) > *Sent:* Tuesday, April 17, 2018 10:44 PM > *To:* lsr@ietf.org > *Subject:* [Lsr] LSR Working Group Adoption Poll for Flex Algorithm > Drafts > > This begins a two-week adoption poll for the following Flex > Algorithm > drafts: > > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-hegdeppsenak-isis-sr-flex-alg > o/ > > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ppsenak-ospf-sr-flex-algo/ > > The adoption poll will end at 12:00 AM EST on May 2^nd , 2018. > Please indicate your support of opposition of the drafts. > > Additionally, the authors are amenable to combining the drafts into > a single draft. If you have an opinion, please state that as well. > > Thanks, > > Acee > > > > _______________________________________________ > Lsr mailing list > Lsr@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr From nobody Fri Apr 20 09:12:11 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 578BB12D876 for ; Fri, 20 Apr 2018 09:12:08 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.201 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.201 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id w5vqq-007HBT for ; Fri, 20 Apr 2018 09:12:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from huawei.com (lhrrgout.huawei.com [194.213.3.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 91E4B12D86D for ; Fri, 20 Apr 2018 09:12:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from lhreml703-cah.china.huawei.com (unknown [172.18.7.108]) by Forcepoint Email with ESMTP id 499143472FB91 for ; Fri, 20 Apr 2018 17:12:01 +0100 (IST) Received: from SJCEML701-CHM.china.huawei.com (10.208.112.40) by lhreml703-cah.china.huawei.com (10.201.108.44) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 14.3.382.0; Fri, 20 Apr 2018 17:12:03 +0100 Received: from SJCEML521-MBS.china.huawei.com ([169.254.2.168]) by SJCEML701-CHM.china.huawei.com ([169.254.3.93]) with mapi id 14.03.0382.000; Fri, 20 Apr 2018 09:11:59 -0700 From: Huaimo Chen To: "lsr@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: draft-cc-ospf-flooding-reduction-01.txt Thread-Index: AdPYsdVCOm0UV5UOT069WVSLiqZiHA== Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2018 16:11:59 +0000 Message-ID: <5316A0AB3C851246A7CA5758973207D463A67EA4@sjceml521-mbs.china.huawei.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.212.246.231] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-CFilter-Loop: Reflected Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] draft-cc-ospf-flooding-reduction-01.txt X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2018 16:12:08 -0000 SGkgRXZlcnlvbmUsDQoNCiAgICBUaGlzIG5ldyB2ZXJzaW9uIGFkZHJlc3NlcyAoYW5kIHNob3Vs ZCBoYXZlIHJlc29sdmVkKSB0aGUgaXNzdWVzIG9uIGxpbmsgYW5kIG5vZGUgZmFpbHVyZXMsIGlu Y2x1ZGluZyBtdWx0aXBsZSBsaW5rIGFuZCBub2RlIGZhaWx1cmVzLiBEdXJpbmcgdGhlIGxhc3Qg SUVURiBtZWV0aW5nLCBtYW55IHJvdXRpbmcgZXhwZXJ0cyByYWlzZWQgdGhlc2UgaXNzdWVzLiBX ZSBoYWQgbWFueSBkaXNjdXNzaW9ucyBvbiB0aGVzZSBhbmQgZ290IHZhbHVhYmxlIHN1Z2dlc3Rp b25zIGFuZCBjb21tZW50cyBmcm9tIHRoZW0uIA0KDQogICAgQlRXLCBpbiBhbm90aGVyIHRocmVh ZCwgdGhlIGRpc2N1c3Npb25zIG9uIHRoZSBkaXN0cmlidXRlZCBjb21wdXRhdGlvbnMgb2YgImZs b29kaW5nIHRvcG9sb2d5IiB1c2luZyBzb21lIHN0YW5kYXJkaXplZCBhbGdvcml0aG1zIGFyZSBp bnRlcmVzdGluZy4gQ29tcHV0aW5nICJmbG9vZGluZyB0b3BvbG9neSIgKGRpc3RyaWJ1dGVkbHkp IGJ5IGV2ZXJ5IG5vZGUgbWF5IGhhdmUgbWFueSBhZHZhbnRhZ2VzLg0KDQpCZXN0IFJlZ2FyZHMs DQpIdWFpbW8NCi0tLS0tT3JpZ2luYWwgTWVzc2FnZS0tLS0tDQpGcm9tOiBpbnRlcm5ldC1kcmFm dHNAaWV0Zi5vcmcgW21haWx0bzppbnRlcm5ldC1kcmFmdHNAaWV0Zi5vcmddIA0KU2VudDogRnJp ZGF5LCBBcHJpbCAyMCwgMjAxOCAxMDoxMyBBTQ0KVG86IEh1YWltbyBDaGVuIDxodWFpbW8uY2hl bkBodWF3ZWkuY29tPjsgWWkgWWFuZyA8eXlpZXRmQGdtYWlsLmNvbT47IERlYW4gY2hlbmcgPGRl YW4uY2hlbmdAaHVhd2VpLmNvbT47IE1laG1ldCBUb3kgPG1laG1ldC50b3lAdmVyaXpvbi5jb20+ DQpTdWJqZWN0OiBOZXcgVmVyc2lvbiBOb3RpZmljYXRpb24gZm9yIGRyYWZ0LWNjLW9zcGYtZmxv b2RpbmctcmVkdWN0aW9uLTAxLnR4dA0KDQoNCkEgbmV3IHZlcnNpb24gb2YgSS1ELCBkcmFmdC1j Yy1vc3BmLWZsb29kaW5nLXJlZHVjdGlvbi0wMS50eHQNCmhhcyBiZWVuIHN1Y2Nlc3NmdWxseSBz dWJtaXR0ZWQgYnkgSHVhaW1vIENoZW4gYW5kIHBvc3RlZCB0byB0aGUgSUVURiByZXBvc2l0b3J5 Lg0KDQpOYW1lOgkJZHJhZnQtY2Mtb3NwZi1mbG9vZGluZy1yZWR1Y3Rpb24NClJldmlzaW9uOgkw MQ0KVGl0bGU6CQlPU1BGIEZsb29kaW5nIFJlZHVjdGlvbg0KRG9jdW1lbnQgZGF0ZToJMjAxOC0w NC0yMA0KR3JvdXA6CQlJbmRpdmlkdWFsIFN1Ym1pc3Npb24NClBhZ2VzOgkJMTcNClVSTDogICAg ICAgICAgICBodHRwczovL3d3dy5pZXRmLm9yZy9pbnRlcm5ldC1kcmFmdHMvZHJhZnQtY2Mtb3Nw Zi1mbG9vZGluZy1yZWR1Y3Rpb24tMDEudHh0DQpTdGF0dXM6ICAgICAgICAgaHR0cHM6Ly9kYXRh dHJhY2tlci5pZXRmLm9yZy9kb2MvZHJhZnQtY2Mtb3NwZi1mbG9vZGluZy1yZWR1Y3Rpb24vDQpI dG1saXplZDogICAgICAgaHR0cHM6Ly90b29scy5pZXRmLm9yZy9odG1sL2RyYWZ0LWNjLW9zcGYt Zmxvb2RpbmctcmVkdWN0aW9uLTAxDQpIdG1saXplZDogICAgICAgaHR0cHM6Ly9kYXRhdHJhY2tl ci5pZXRmLm9yZy9kb2MvaHRtbC9kcmFmdC1jYy1vc3BmLWZsb29kaW5nLXJlZHVjdGlvbg0KRGlm ZjogICAgICAgICAgIGh0dHBzOi8vd3d3LmlldGYub3JnL3JmY2RpZmY/dXJsMj1kcmFmdC1jYy1v c3BmLWZsb29kaW5nLXJlZHVjdGlvbi0wMQ0KDQpBYnN0cmFjdDoNCiAgIFRoaXMgZG9jdW1lbnQg cHJvcG9zZXMgYW4gYXBwcm9hY2ggdG8gZmxvb2QgT1NQRiBsaW5rIHN0YXRlDQogICBhZHZlcnRp c2VtZW50cyBvbiBhIHRvcG9sb2d5IHRoYXQgaXMgYSBzdWJncmFwaCBvZiB0aGUgY29tcGxldGUg T1NQRg0KICAgdG9wb2xvZ3kgcGVyIHVuZGVybGluZSBwaHlzaWNhbCBuZXR3b3JrLCBzbyB0aGF0 IHRoZSBhbW91bnQgb2YNCiAgIGZsb29kaW5nIHRyYWZmaWMgaW4gdGhlIG5ldHdvcmsgaXMgZ3Jl YXRseSByZWR1Y2VkLCBhbmQgaXQgd291bGQNCiAgIHJlZHVjZSBjb252ZXJnZW5jZSB0aW1lIHdp dGggYSBtb3JlIHN0YWJsZSBhbmQgb3B0aW1pemVkIHJvdXRpbmcNCiAgIGVudmlyb25tZW50LiAg VGhlIGFwcHJvYWNoIGNhbiBiZSBhcHBsaWVkIHRvIGFueSBuZXR3b3JrIHRvcG9sb2d5IGluDQog ICBhIHNpbmdsZSBPU1BGIGFyZWEsIGFuZCBjYW4gYmUgdXNlZCBpbiBib3RoIE9TUEZ2MiAoW1JG QzIzMjhdKQ0KICAgbmV0d29yayBhbmQgT1NQRnYzIChbUkZDNTM0MF0pIG5ldHdvcmsuDQoNCg0K ICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAg ICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgIA0KDQoNClBsZWFzZSBub3RlIHRoYXQgaXQgbWF5IHRh a2UgYSBjb3VwbGUgb2YgbWludXRlcyBmcm9tIHRoZSB0aW1lIG9mIHN1Ym1pc3Npb24gdW50aWwg dGhlIGh0bWxpemVkIHZlcnNpb24gYW5kIGRpZmYgYXJlIGF2YWlsYWJsZSBhdCB0b29scy5pZXRm Lm9yZy4NCg0KVGhlIElFVEYgU2VjcmV0YXJpYXQNCg0K From nobody Fri Apr 20 10:44:22 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9336112D88D for ; 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20 Apr 2018 17:44:17 +0000 Received: from xch-rcd-011.cisco.com (xch-rcd-011.cisco.com [173.37.102.21]) by alln-core-11.cisco.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id w3KHiGf5000524 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 20 Apr 2018 17:44:17 GMT Received: from xch-aln-001.cisco.com (173.36.7.11) by XCH-RCD-011.cisco.com (173.37.102.21) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.0.1320.4; Fri, 20 Apr 2018 12:44:16 -0500 Received: from xch-aln-001.cisco.com ([173.36.7.11]) by XCH-ALN-001.cisco.com ([173.36.7.11]) with mapi id 15.00.1320.000; Fri, 20 Apr 2018 12:44:16 -0500 From: "Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)" To: "Peter Psenak (ppsenak)" , "Dongjie (Jimmy)" , "Acee Lindem (acee)" , "lsr@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [Lsr] LSR Working Group Adoption Poll for Flex Algorithm Drafts Thread-Index: AQHT1lqU9EG8NacYPUeDduC3/EAVyaQHqLKAgABu+4CAATgpgIAASluAgAAY6wCAAAligIAAMMdQ Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2018 17:44:16 +0000 Message-ID: <4fcf235c46d14e18811a448d0a590347@XCH-ALN-001.cisco.com> References: <5B8EB88E-9C54-47FA-BF8A-EEB952F6C0BF@cisco.com> <76CD132C3ADEF848BD84D028D243C927983EA0E3@NKGEML515-MBX.china.huawei.com> <5AD852FD.9080301@cisco.com> <76CD132C3ADEF848BD84D028D243C927983F01BE@NKGEML515-MBX.china.huawei.com> <5AD99739.3050000@cisco.com> <76CD132C3ADEF848BD84D028D243C927983F0926@NKGEML515-MBX.china.huawei.com> <5AD9B3FF.8000805@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <5AD9B3FF.8000805@cisco.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted x-originating-ip: [10.24.54.19] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] LSR Working Group Adoption Poll for Flex Algorithm Drafts X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2018 17:44:21 -0000 Jie - I strongly agree with Peter here. It is "tempting" to think of algorithm/topology as interchangeable - but I = think it is wrong to do so. It is true that some things achievable via flex-algo could be achieved usin= g a separate topology - but at a much higher deployment cost and with consi= derably less flexibility. The "right way" to think of flex-algo is as a constraint based SPF applied = to a given topology.=20 Today, topologies are most commonly used to define a set of nodes/links whi= ch support a particular functionality (e.g., IPv4, IPv6, multicast). To take a simple example, if a given flex-algorithm is defined to prefer "= blue" links one could: 1)Calculate shortest path using only blue links on a unicast topology. Resu= lt would be used to forward a certain class of unicast traffic. 2)Calculate shortest path using only blue links on a multicast topology. Re= sult would be used to build an RPF tree for some subset of multicast traffi= c. Could you do this purely with MT? Yes - but it would require introducing tw= o new topologies (blue unicast, blue multicast), advertising additional top= ology specific support per adjacency, and configuring additional topology s= upport per link on every router in the network which participates in the ne= w topologies. And if you wanted to prefer green links for another use case, you would the= n have to introduce two more topologies. Much much easier to simply advertise support for a given algorithm and use = it on the topology(s) where you have a use case. And this example is a very simple one. Flex-algo supports multiple constrai= nts besides affinity - so the scalability of using a separate topology for = each set of constraints is extremely poor. HTH Les > -----Original Message----- > From: Lsr On Behalf Of Peter Psenak (ppsenak) > Sent: Friday, April 20, 2018 2:34 AM > To: Dongjie (Jimmy) ; Acee Lindem (acee) > ; lsr@ietf.org > Subject: Re: [Lsr] LSR Working Group Adoption Poll for Flex Algorithm Dra= fts >=20 > Dongjie, >=20 > On 20/04/18 11:00 , Dongjie (Jimmy) wrote: > > Hi Peter, > > > > Please see inline: > > > >> -----Original Message----- > >> From: Peter Psenak [mailto:ppsenak@cisco.com] > >> Sent: Friday, April 20, 2018 3:31 PM > >> To: Dongjie (Jimmy) ; Acee Lindem (acee) > >> ; lsr@ietf.org > >> Subject: Re: [Lsr] LSR Working Group Adoption Poll for Flex Algorithm > >> Drafts > >> > >> Hi Dongjie, > >> > >> please see inline: > >> > >> > >> On 20/04/18 05:04 , Dongjie (Jimmy) wrote: > >>> Hi Peter, > >>> > >>> Thanks for the prompt response. Please see inline: > >>> > >>>> -----Original Message----- > >>>> From: Peter Psenak [mailto:ppsenak@cisco.com] > >>>> Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2018 4:28 PM > >>>> To: Dongjie (Jimmy) ; Acee Lindem (acee) > >>>> ; lsr@ietf.org > >>>> Subject: Re: [Lsr] LSR Working Group Adoption Poll for Flex > >>>> Algorithm Drafts > >>>> > >>>> Hi Dongjie, > >>>> > >>>> please see inline: > >>>> > >>>> On 19/04/18 09:10 , Dongjie (Jimmy) wrote: > >>>>> Hi, > >>>>> > >>>>> Here are some comments on the Flex Algo drafts. > >>>>> > >>>>> SR algorithm as defined in > >>>>> draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensions > >>>>> is about the algorithm used for path calculation, such as SPF, stri= ct SPF, > etc. > >>>>> > >>>>> In the Flex Algo drafts, the definition of algorithm is extended > >>>>> to include topological constraints and the metric type used in > >>>>> calculation, which makes its functionality analogous to > >>>>> multi-topology routing > >>>> (MTR). > >>>> > >>>> not really. MTR is defined on a per link basis and each MTR > >>>> participation needs to be advertised on a per link basis. There is > >>>> no such > >> concept in flex-algo draft. > >>> > >>> Both mechanisms have the capability to define a specific > >>> sub-topology in the > >> network, that's why I say they are analogous in functionality. > >> Flex-algo uses link affinity to describe the constraints of the > >> corresponding topology, which is also a link attribute and needs to be > configured on a per-link basis. > >>> > >>> The difference is in topology advertisement. In MTR a consistent > >>> topology is > >> constructed by each node advertising its own adjacent links in the > topology. > >> While in flex-algo, the whole topology is advertised as part of the > >> algorithm definition by each node, and priority based selection is > >> used to reach a consistent view by all nodes. > >>> > >>>> Flex-algo works on top of existing IGP topologies. > >>> > >>> Do you mean flex-algo can work on top of the default IGP topology, > >>> and can > >> also work on top of multiple IGP topologies created with MTR? > >> > >> yes > >> > >>> In the latter case, it seems you would create sub-topologies on top > >>> of a sub-topology (MTR) of the default topology, > >> > >> no. We don't create any topologies with flex-algo. We compute > >> constrained based paths. > > > > MTR is also used to compute constrained based path:) The constraint is > described as a sub-topology. >=20 > you are mixing two different things - topology and path computations, the= se > are two different things. >=20 > > > > With flex-algo, you need to define the algorithm first, then the constr= ained > path can be computed according to the algorithm. > > > > According to your presentation in IETF101, a flex-algo specifies: > > > > a) Set of constraints - e.g affinity exclude-any, include-any, inclu= de-all > > b) Metric type - IGP metric, Delay (RFC7810), TE metric (RFC5305), .= .. > > c) Algorithm type - SPF, ... > > > > As I see a) defines a constrained topology, or a sub-topology. >=20 > again, you are mixing "set of constraints" with a "topology", these are t= wo > different things. >=20 > > > >>> which sounds quite complicated. Maybe another way is to use MTR to > >>> create > >> the sub-topology needed, and define the metric type and computation > >> algorithm using a particular flex-algo? > >> > >> what we propose is simple - compute multiple constrained based paths > >> on top of a given topology. > >> > >> What you propose is indeed complicated - create as many topologies as > >> many constrained based paths you need. That solution does not scale. > > > > Not exactly. Multiple constrained paths can be created in the same sub- > topology. You don't need as many topologies as the number of paths. >=20 > if you calculate multiple constrained paths on a single MT, you need to a= gree > what the constraints are for each calculation and that is what the flex-a= lgo > draft is doing. >=20 > regards, > Peter >=20 > > > >>> > >>>>> Section 4.1 of the Flex Algo drafts says "Flex-Algorithm > >>>>> definition is topology independent", while in some places Flex > >>>>> Algo is described as a "light weight alternative" to MTR. > >>>> > >>>> there is no mention of MTR in the document. > >>> > >>> I was referring to another relevant draft: > >> draft-wijnands-mpls-mldp-multi-topology-00. Sorry for the confusion > >> caused. It seems that draft considered MTR and flex-algo as > >> comparable candidates for creating sub-topology. > >> > >> then please talk to the authors of that draft. > > > > OK. It seems some sync up is needed to have consistent understanding of > what flex-algo means. > > > >>> > >>>>> It would be necessary if the relationship between Flex-Algo and > >>>>> MTR can be further clarified. Whether the two mechanisms are > >>>>> complementary to each other, or Flex-Algo will be used to replace > MTR? > >>>> > >>>> they are orthogonal. > >>> > >>> If as you said they are orthogonal, it would be better to avoid > >>> overlapping > >> functionalities in topology definition and creation. > >> > >> orthogonal does not mean overlapping. > > > > Right, in order to make them orthogonal, overlapping (if any) should be > resolved. > > > > Best regards, > > Jie > > > >> > >> thanks, > >> Peter > >> > >>> > >>> Best regards, > >>> Jie > >>> > >>> > >>>> thanks, > >>>> Peter > >>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> And if it is claimed that Flex-Algo is light weight than MTR, it > >>>>> would be helpful to give a thorough comparison of the two > >>>>> mechanisms > >> somewhere. > >>>>> > >>>>> Best regards, > >>>>> > >>>>> Jie > >>>>> > >>>>> *From:*Lsr [mailto:lsr-bounces@ietf.org] *On Behalf Of *Acee > >>>>> Lindem > >>>>> (acee) > >>>>> *Sent:* Tuesday, April 17, 2018 10:44 PM > >>>>> *To:* lsr@ietf.org > >>>>> *Subject:* [Lsr] LSR Working Group Adoption Poll for Flex > >>>>> Algorithm Drafts > >>>>> > >>>>> This begins a two-week adoption poll for the following Flex > >>>>> Algorithm > >>>>> drafts: > >>>>> > >>>>> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-hegdeppsenak-isis-sr-flex-a > >>>>> lg > >>>>> o/ > >>>>> > >>>>> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ppsenak-ospf-sr-flex-algo/ > >>>>> > >>>>> The adoption poll will end at 12:00 AM EST on May 2^nd , 2018. > >>>>> Please indicate your support of opposition of the drafts. > >>>>> > >>>>> Additionally, the authors are amenable to combining the drafts > >>>>> into a single draft. If you have an opinion, please state that as w= ell. > >>>>> > >>>>> Thanks, > >>>>> > >>>>> Acee > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> _______________________________________________ > >>>>> Lsr mailing list > >>>>> Lsr@ietf.org > >>>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr > >>>>> > >>> > >>> . > >>> > > > > . > > >=20 > _______________________________________________ > Lsr mailing list > Lsr@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr From nobody Fri Apr 20 12:41:21 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3E38712D870; Fri, 20 Apr 2018 12:41:19 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -14.511 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-14.511 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_DKIMWL_WL_MED=-0.01, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=cisco.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id wIuI-qfT0inC; Fri, 20 Apr 2018 12:41:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from aer-iport-1.cisco.com (aer-iport-1.cisco.com [173.38.203.51]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher DHE-RSA-SEED-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E5790126B7E; Fri, 20 Apr 2018 12:41:15 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cisco.com; i=@cisco.com; l=12784; q=dns/txt; s=iport; t=1524253276; x=1525462876; h=subject:to:cc:references:from:message-id:date: mime-version:in-reply-to:content-transfer-encoding; bh=Z+OOgbbuVFVJqj0NRvlqlWWiEX6jG5882xv5KZsyN6g=; b=ito1KIo8/QvmJp0+a4/gu+xLzsYJKxpSgpI0M+Hr8OqImuQ7YWYRL5Au EMKbSiqC4pIoSSLe3GdRWRE6jJKivjwnduHdi+8OnQA7tGsXUmBFD/Zyv oOVLFaTlDk/y0xfF+JtCZ21rssgyLp1oIOEgSPdUIWoT+xhZ77N2Q19J3 0=; X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.49,302,1520899200"; d="scan'208";a="3320086" Received: from aer-iport-nat.cisco.com (HELO aer-core-1.cisco.com) ([173.38.203.22]) by aer-iport-1.cisco.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384; 20 Apr 2018 19:41:14 +0000 Received: from asm-linux.cisco.com (ams-asmirnov-nitro6.cisco.com [10.55.206.135]) (authenticated bits=0) by aer-core-1.cisco.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id w3KJfDAI016908 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=NO); Fri, 20 Apr 2018 19:41:13 GMT To: "Acee Lindem (acee)" , "draft-ietf-ospf-xaf-te@ietf.org" Cc: "lsr@ietf.org" References: <5189f820-58a2-7783-284f-1bdbfc5f054f@cisco.com> <9D9A9DC6-4659-4603-AE55-A4A444687D71@cisco.com> From: Anton Smirnov Organization: Cisco Systems Message-ID: <555bfcbf-3ee8-e0b2-3305-7f76ce0dc35d@cisco.com> Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2018 21:41:13 +0200 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/52.5.2 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <9D9A9DC6-4659-4603-AE55-A4A444687D71@cisco.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Authenticated-User: asmirnov Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] OSPF Routing with Cross-Address Family MPLS Traffic Engineering Tunnels X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2018 19:41:19 -0000 Hi Acee, > I guess I see the use case described below as only one of the potential > use cases for the X-AF tunnels. Correct. At the very minimum technique is symmetric, i.e. can equally be applied to compute OSPFv2/IPv4 routes over TE tunnels with IPv6 tailend where TE LSAs were distributed by OSPFv3. But as you noted the same technique can be applied to other use cases, i.e. to tunnels other than MPLS TE and even use cases other than tunneling. The document's text tries to account for these multiple applications. This is good for generalization but makes text a bit abstract and thus difficult to understand. We tried to mitigate abstractness of general description with down-to-earth example of IPv6 routes over IPv4 TE tunnels that present day reader (or should I already say year-2013 reader? things have already changed quite a bit since then) should find most practical. > You can certainly keep this use case but I’d reference RFC > 3906 (informational reference) and state that there could alternate use > cases. At one point in time authors discussed adding one sentence saying that proposed technique can be employed in other use cases, notably those requiring mapping of an address from OSPFv2 database to router LSA in OSPFv3 LSDB and vice verse. I don't see any similar statement in the latest text, we must have dropped it. May be we should reinstall it. --- Anton On 04/19/18 23:29, Acee Lindem (acee) wrote: > Hi Anton, > > I guess I see the use case described below as only one of the potential > use cases for the X-AF tunnels. It seems that path computation, either > head-end or PCE, could also use the dual-stack endpoint information. > Note that the OSPF doesn’t establish the LSPs or even advertise the LSPs > themselves– it merely populates the TE Database. I know that you know > this but you want to assure your text doesn’t imply otherwise. Do you > disagree? You can certainly keep this use case but I’d reference RFC > 3906 (informational reference) and state that there could alternate use > cases. Perhaps, your fellow author Alvaro (of OSPF TTZ fame) could help > with some generic text preceding the specific IGP Shortcut use case. > > Let me see if I can massage the backward compatibility text. I’m > requested a Routing Directorate review and I’m going to start the LSR WG > last call shortly. > > Thanks, > Acee > > *From: *"Anton Smirnov (asmirnov)" > *Organization: *Cisco Systems > *Date: *Saturday, April 14, 2018 at 6:48 PM > *To: *Acee Lindem , "draft-ietf-ospf-xaf-te@ietf.org" > > *Cc: *"lsr@ietf.org" > *Subject: *Re: OSPF Routing with Cross-Address Family MPLS Traffic > Engineering Tunnels > >    Hi Acee, > >    sorry for my slow response. > >    Before answering questions lets establish 'prerequisites' of the > problem. > > - Network is dual stack, OSPFv2 is used to route IPv4, OSPFv3 is used to > route IPv6 > > - TE LSAs are originated as per [RFC3630] and flooded in OSPFv2 > > - 'Endpoint' of each MPLS TE tunnel is IPv4 address > > - There is a desire to make OSPFv3 to compute IPv6 routes over TE > tunnels - of which OSPFv3 has no topological information > >      >  3. In the section 3 mapping algorithm, why do you walk the X-AF >      >     endpoints from all connected areas? Why not just the > area of local >      >     IP address? > >         Idea behind this wording is to cater for cases when area > borders are >     laid differently in OSPFv2 and OSPFv3. It's even possible that > router is >     ABR in OSPFv2 but not OSPFv3. From network design perspective > this, of >     course, is a terrible thing to do - but not impossible. > > I guess I still don't understand. Are you implying that you are > advertising TE LSAs using both OSPFv2 and OSPFv3 and aggregating the > TED and since the area boundaries may be different, you need to > search all the areas LSP endpoints? I don't think this deployment > model makes sense and I don't think this should be supported. > >    No, TE LSAs are advertised only in OSPFv2. >    Consider information available to OSPFv3 on tunnel headend router. > Endpoint address of TE tunnel is IPv4 address, say 7.7.7.7 (this address > is what tunnel tailend router advertises in OSPFv2 TE LSA in the Router > Address TLV). OSPFv3 needs to find what router in what area corresponds > to router that advertises that TE LSA in OSPFv2. > >    That is, OSPFv3 has no its own TE information and not even a hint to > which area may belong the tailend router. > > > >      >  4. In the backward compatibility section, can you also > discuss the >      >     requirements for backward compatibility of the > endpoints? Also state >      >     that the X-AF tunnel will not be recognized unless the > endpoints are >      >     advertised by the same protocol (OSPFv2 or OSPFv3); or > describe the >      >     behavior if this is not the intension. > >         We can add paragraph saying something like: >     "In order for XAF computation to work tunnel tailend routers MUST >     advertise XAF Node Local Address sub-TLVs in OSPF instance that > will >     perform XAF computation. Thus only tunnel endpoints (both > tunnel headend >     and tailend routers) and only OSPF protocol instance performing > XAF >     routing must implement XAF as described in this document. Other > routers >     in the network do not need to implement XAF algorithm or > interpret Node >     Local Address sub-TLVs. For example, if network uses TE tunnels > signaled >     by OSPFv2 [RFC3630] and intends to use cross-AF route > computation in >     OSPFv3 then only OSPFv3 implementation on routers that serve as > tunnel >     endpoints in OSPFv2 needs to be compliant with this specification." > >     Will this text work? > > I think this could be a lot clearer if it were written from the > perspective of the head-end router performing the calculation. Also, > you lost me completely with the last sentence. We are uses a single > protocol, OSPFv2 or OSPFv3 to advertise TE LSAs. Since both IPv4 and > IPv6 traffic is tunneled over that LSP, there is no reason to > operate both protocols since traffic will take the path of the X-AF > LSP - correct? > > But OSPFv2 does not produce IPv6 routes. Both protocols operate in the > network: > > - OSPFv2 computes IPv4 routes and distributes TE database > > - OSPFv3 computes IPv6 routes. If TE tunnels provide shortcut to > destination then OSPFv3 will point route into the tunnel. > > --- > > Anton > > On 04/07/18 23:06, Acee Lindem (acee) wrote: > > Hi Anton, > > On 4/6/18, 7:33 AM, "Anton Smirnov (asmirnov)" > wrote: > >         Hi Acee, >         my answers below (I didn't vet them with other authors, so > they may >     express different opinions). > >      >  1. Have you considered a shorter name for the RFC? For > example: “OSPF >      >     Cross Address Family Traffic Engineering Tunnels� > >         Your proposed variant drops two pieces: "Routing with" and > "MPLS". >     Dropping mention to MPLS is fine with me. Dropping "Routing > with" seems >     to me less correct because the draft is about ways to compute > routes and >     not about setting up/managing tunnels. >         But ultimately I have no strong feelings here and if there > is a >     requirement to shorten document's name then that would be a > good candidate. > > >      >  2. Can you change the requirements language text to the RFC > 8174 >     version? > >         OK, we will publish new document revision when we agreed on > other >     points. > > >      >  3. In the section 3 mapping algorithm, why do you walk the X-AF >      >     endpoints from all connected areas? Why not just the > area of local >      >     IP address? > >         Idea behind this wording is to cater for cases when area > borders are >     laid differently in OSPFv2 and OSPFv3. It's even possible that > router is >     ABR in OSPFv2 but not OSPFv3. From network design perspective > this, of >     course, is a terrible thing to do - but not impossible. > > I guess I still don't understand. Are you implying that you are > advertising TE LSAs using both OSPFv2 and OSPFv3 and aggregating the > TED and since the area boundaries may be different, you need to > search all the areas LSP endpoints? I don't think this deployment > model makes sense and I don't think this should be supported. > > >      >  4. In the backward compatibility section, can you also > discuss the >      >     requirements for backward compatibility of the > endpoints? Also state >      >     that the X-AF tunnel will not be recognized unless the > endpoints are >      >     advertised by the same protocol (OSPFv2 or OSPFv3); or > describe the >      >     behavior if this is not the intension. > >         We can add paragraph saying something like: >     "In order for XAF computation to work tunnel tailend routers MUST >     advertise XAF Node Local Address sub-TLVs in OSPF instance that > will >     perform XAF computation. Thus only tunnel endpoints (both > tunnel headend >     and tailend routers) and only OSPF protocol instance performing > XAF >     routing must implement XAF as described in this document. Other > routers >     in the network do not need to implement XAF algorithm or > interpret Node >     Local Address sub-TLVs. For example, if network uses TE tunnels > signaled >     by OSPFv2 [RFC3630] and intends to use cross-AF route > computation in >     OSPFv3 then only OSPFv3 implementation on routers that serve as > tunnel >     endpoints in OSPFv2 needs to be compliant with this specification." > >     Will this text work? > > I think this could be a lot clearer if it were written from the > perspective of the head-end router performing the calculation. Also, > you lost me completely with the last sentence. We are uses a single > protocol, OSPFv2 or OSPFv3 to advertise TE LSAs. Since both IPv4 and > IPv6 traffic is tunneled over that LSP, there is no reason to > operate both protocols since traffic will take the path of the X-AF > LSP - correct? > > Thanks, > Acee > > >     --- >     Anton > > >     On 04/04/18 20:13, Acee Lindem (acee) wrote: >     > Hi Anton, Alvaro, and Mike, >     > >     > In preparation for WG last call, I have a couple comments. >     > >     >  1. Have you considered a shorter name for the RFC? For > example: “OSPF >     >     Cross Address Family Traffic Engineering Tunnels� >     >  2. Can you change the requirements language text to the RFC > 8174 version? >     >  3. In the section 3 mapping algorithm, why do you walk the X-AF >     >     endpoints from all connected areas? Why not just the area > of local >     >     IP address? >     >  4. In the backward compatibility section, can you also > discuss the >     >     requirements for backward compatibility of the endpoints? > Also state >     >     that the X-AF tunnel will not be recognized unless the > endpoints are >     >     advertised by the same protocol (OSPFv2 or OSPFv3); or > describe the >     >     behavior if this is not the intension. >     > >     > Thanks, >     > >     > Acee >     > > > > From nobody Fri Apr 20 19:42:21 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9B2EE1270AB for ; Fri, 20 Apr 2018 19:42:19 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.2 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.2 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id VUX6bDSOjZkr for ; Fri, 20 Apr 2018 19:42:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from huawei.com (lhrrgout.huawei.com [194.213.3.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 80966126C83 for ; Fri, 20 Apr 2018 19:42:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from lhreml708-cah.china.huawei.com (unknown [172.18.7.106]) by Forcepoint Email with ESMTP id 9151E3A40E4A6 for ; Sat, 21 Apr 2018 03:42:13 +0100 (IST) Received: from DGGEML404-HUB.china.huawei.com (10.3.17.39) by lhreml708-cah.china.huawei.com (10.201.108.49) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 14.3.382.0; Sat, 21 Apr 2018 03:42:14 +0100 Received: from DGGEML510-MBX.china.huawei.com ([169.254.2.73]) by DGGEML404-HUB.china.huawei.com ([fe80::b177:a243:7a69:5ab8%31]) with mapi id 14.03.0361.001; Sat, 21 Apr 2018 10:42:04 +0800 From: Mach Chen To: "Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)" , "Peter Psenak (ppsenak)" , "Dongjie (Jimmy)" , "Acee Lindem (acee)" , "lsr@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [Lsr] LSR Working Group Adoption Poll for Flex Algorithm Drafts Thread-Index: AQHT1lqU9EG8NacYPUeDduC3/EAVyaQHqLKA//+VDYCAAayAEP//1gSAgACXe1D//4rSgAARILoAACGw5YA= Date: Sat, 21 Apr 2018 02:42:03 +0000 Message-ID: References: <5B8EB88E-9C54-47FA-BF8A-EEB952F6C0BF@cisco.com> <76CD132C3ADEF848BD84D028D243C927983EA0E3@NKGEML515-MBX.china.huawei.com> <5AD852FD.9080301@cisco.com> <76CD132C3ADEF848BD84D028D243C927983F01BE@NKGEML515-MBX.china.huawei.com> <5AD99739.3050000@cisco.com> <76CD132C3ADEF848BD84D028D243C927983F0926@NKGEML515-MBX.china.huawei.com> <5AD9B3FF.8000805@cisco.com> <4fcf235c46d14e18811a448d0a590347@XCH-ALN-001.cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <4fcf235c46d14e18811a448d0a590347@XCH-ALN-001.cisco.com> Accept-Language: en-US, zh-CN Content-Language: zh-CN X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.111.194.201] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-CFilter-Loop: Reflected Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] LSR Working Group Adoption Poll for Flex Algorithm Drafts X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 21 Apr 2018 02:42:20 -0000 Hi Les, Jie and others, I think both Flex Algo and MTR are useful and have their own use cases. And= actually Flex Algo and MTR could be complementary each other.=20 As Les said, flex-algorithm calculates paths on a specific topology (defaul= t, blue, green...). So, it implies that the precondition is that there sho= uld be a topology. The topology can be the default IGP topology, or a cust= omized topology created by MTR or flex-algorithm. There may be different u= nderstandings about the topology creation, but it's not that important, IMH= O. To "create/form" the topology, both MTR and flex-algorithm need to do s= ome planning and configurations.=20 Best regards, Mach=20 > -----Original Message----- > From: Lsr [mailto:lsr-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Les Ginsberg (ginsbe= rg) > Sent: Saturday, April 21, 2018 1:44 AM > To: Peter Psenak (ppsenak) ; Dongjie (Jimmy) > ; Acee Lindem (acee) ; lsr@ietf.org > Subject: Re: [Lsr] LSR Working Group Adoption Poll for Flex Algorithm Dra= fts >=20 > Jie - >=20 > I strongly agree with Peter here. >=20 > It is "tempting" to think of algorithm/topology as interchangeable - but = I think it > is wrong to do so. > It is true that some things achievable via flex-algo could be achieved us= ing a > separate topology - but at a much higher deployment cost and with > considerably less flexibility. >=20 > The "right way" to think of flex-algo is as a constraint based SPF applie= d to a > given topology. >=20 > Today, topologies are most commonly used to define a set of nodes/links w= hich > support a particular functionality (e.g., IPv4, IPv6, multicast). >=20 > To take a simple example, if a given flex-algorithm is defined to prefer= "blue" > links one could: >=20 > 1)Calculate shortest path using only blue links on a unicast topology. Re= sult > would be used to forward a certain class of unicast traffic. >=20 > 2)Calculate shortest path using only blue links on a multicast topology. = Result > would be used to build an RPF tree for some subset of multicast traffic. >=20 > Could you do this purely with MT? Yes - but it would require introducing = two > new topologies (blue unicast, blue multicast), advertising additional top= ology > specific support per adjacency, and configuring additional topology suppo= rt per > link on every router in the network which participates in the new topolog= ies. > And if you wanted to prefer green links for another use case, you would t= hen > have to introduce two more topologies. > Much much easier to simply advertise support for a given algorithm and us= e it > on the topology(s) where you have a use case. >=20 > And this example is a very simple one. Flex-algo supports multiple constr= aints > besides affinity - so the scalability of using a separate topology for ea= ch set of > constraints is extremely poor. >=20 > HTH >=20 > Les >=20 >=20 > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Lsr On Behalf Of Peter Psenak (ppsenak) > > Sent: Friday, April 20, 2018 2:34 AM > > To: Dongjie (Jimmy) ; Acee Lindem (acee) > > ; lsr@ietf.org > > Subject: Re: [Lsr] LSR Working Group Adoption Poll for Flex Algorithm > > Drafts > > > > Dongjie, > > > > On 20/04/18 11:00 , Dongjie (Jimmy) wrote: > > > Hi Peter, > > > > > > Please see inline: > > > > > >> -----Original Message----- > > >> From: Peter Psenak [mailto:ppsenak@cisco.com] > > >> Sent: Friday, April 20, 2018 3:31 PM > > >> To: Dongjie (Jimmy) ; Acee Lindem (acee) > > >> ; lsr@ietf.org > > >> Subject: Re: [Lsr] LSR Working Group Adoption Poll for Flex > > >> Algorithm Drafts > > >> > > >> Hi Dongjie, > > >> > > >> please see inline: > > >> > > >> > > >> On 20/04/18 05:04 , Dongjie (Jimmy) wrote: > > >>> Hi Peter, > > >>> > > >>> Thanks for the prompt response. Please see inline: > > >>> > > >>>> -----Original Message----- > > >>>> From: Peter Psenak [mailto:ppsenak@cisco.com] > > >>>> Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2018 4:28 PM > > >>>> To: Dongjie (Jimmy) ; Acee Lindem (acee) > > >>>> ; lsr@ietf.org > > >>>> Subject: Re: [Lsr] LSR Working Group Adoption Poll for Flex > > >>>> Algorithm Drafts > > >>>> > > >>>> Hi Dongjie, > > >>>> > > >>>> please see inline: > > >>>> > > >>>> On 19/04/18 09:10 , Dongjie (Jimmy) wrote: > > >>>>> Hi, > > >>>>> > > >>>>> Here are some comments on the Flex Algo drafts. > > >>>>> > > >>>>> SR algorithm as defined in > > >>>>> draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensions > > >>>>> is about the algorithm used for path calculation, such as SPF, > > >>>>> strict SPF, > > etc. > > >>>>> > > >>>>> In the Flex Algo drafts, the definition of algorithm is extended > > >>>>> to include topological constraints and the metric type used in > > >>>>> calculation, which makes its functionality analogous to > > >>>>> multi-topology routing > > >>>> (MTR). > > >>>> > > >>>> not really. MTR is defined on a per link basis and each MTR > > >>>> participation needs to be advertised on a per link basis. There > > >>>> is no such > > >> concept in flex-algo draft. > > >>> > > >>> Both mechanisms have the capability to define a specific > > >>> sub-topology in the > > >> network, that's why I say they are analogous in functionality. > > >> Flex-algo uses link affinity to describe the constraints of the > > >> corresponding topology, which is also a link attribute and needs to > > >> be > > configured on a per-link basis. > > >>> > > >>> The difference is in topology advertisement. In MTR a consistent > > >>> topology is > > >> constructed by each node advertising its own adjacent links in the > > topology. > > >> While in flex-algo, the whole topology is advertised as part of the > > >> algorithm definition by each node, and priority based selection is > > >> used to reach a consistent view by all nodes. > > >>> > > >>>> Flex-algo works on top of existing IGP topologies. > > >>> > > >>> Do you mean flex-algo can work on top of the default IGP topology, > > >>> and can > > >> also work on top of multiple IGP topologies created with MTR? > > >> > > >> yes > > >> > > >>> In the latter case, it seems you would create sub-topologies on > > >>> top of a sub-topology (MTR) of the default topology, > > >> > > >> no. We don't create any topologies with flex-algo. We compute > > >> constrained based paths. > > > > > > MTR is also used to compute constrained based path:) The constraint > > > is > > described as a sub-topology. > > > > you are mixing two different things - topology and path computations, > > these are two different things. > > > > > > > > With flex-algo, you need to define the algorithm first, then the > > > constrained > > path can be computed according to the algorithm. > > > > > > According to your presentation in IETF101, a flex-algo specifies: > > > > > > a) Set of constraints - e.g affinity exclude-any, include-any, inc= lude-all > > > b) Metric type - IGP metric, Delay (RFC7810), TE metric (RFC5305),= ... > > > c) Algorithm type - SPF, ... > > > > > > As I see a) defines a constrained topology, or a sub-topology. > > > > again, you are mixing "set of constraints" with a "topology", these > > are two different things. > > > > > > > >>> which sounds quite complicated. Maybe another way is to use MTR to > > >>> create > > >> the sub-topology needed, and define the metric type and computation > > >> algorithm using a particular flex-algo? > > >> > > >> what we propose is simple - compute multiple constrained based > > >> paths on top of a given topology. > > >> > > >> What you propose is indeed complicated - create as many topologies > > >> as many constrained based paths you need. That solution does not sca= le. > > > > > > Not exactly. Multiple constrained paths can be created in the same > > > sub- > > topology. You don't need as many topologies as the number of paths. > > > > if you calculate multiple constrained paths on a single MT, you need > > to agree what the constraints are for each calculation and that is > > what the flex-algo draft is doing. > > > > regards, > > Peter > > > > > > > >>> > > >>>>> Section 4.1 of the Flex Algo drafts says "Flex-Algorithm > > >>>>> definition is topology independent", while in some places Flex > > >>>>> Algo is described as a "light weight alternative" to MTR. > > >>>> > > >>>> there is no mention of MTR in the document. > > >>> > > >>> I was referring to another relevant draft: > > >> draft-wijnands-mpls-mldp-multi-topology-00. Sorry for the confusion > > >> caused. It seems that draft considered MTR and flex-algo as > > >> comparable candidates for creating sub-topology. > > >> > > >> then please talk to the authors of that draft. > > > > > > OK. It seems some sync up is needed to have consistent understanding > > > of > > what flex-algo means. > > > > > >>> > > >>>>> It would be necessary if the relationship between Flex-Algo and > > >>>>> MTR can be further clarified. Whether the two mechanisms are > > >>>>> complementary to each other, or Flex-Algo will be used to > > >>>>> replace > > MTR? > > >>>> > > >>>> they are orthogonal. > > >>> > > >>> If as you said they are orthogonal, it would be better to avoid > > >>> overlapping > > >> functionalities in topology definition and creation. > > >> > > >> orthogonal does not mean overlapping. > > > > > > Right, in order to make them orthogonal, overlapping (if any) should > > > be > > resolved. > > > > > > Best regards, > > > Jie > > > > > >> > > >> thanks, > > >> Peter > > >> > > >>> > > >>> Best regards, > > >>> Jie > > >>> > > >>> > > >>>> thanks, > > >>>> Peter > > >>>> > > >>>>> > > >>>>> And if it is claimed that Flex-Algo is light weight than MTR, it > > >>>>> would be helpful to give a thorough comparison of the two > > >>>>> mechanisms > > >> somewhere. > > >>>>> > > >>>>> Best regards, > > >>>>> > > >>>>> Jie > > >>>>> > > >>>>> *From:*Lsr [mailto:lsr-bounces@ietf.org] *On Behalf Of *Acee > > >>>>> Lindem > > >>>>> (acee) > > >>>>> *Sent:* Tuesday, April 17, 2018 10:44 PM > > >>>>> *To:* lsr@ietf.org > > >>>>> *Subject:* [Lsr] LSR Working Group Adoption Poll for Flex > > >>>>> Algorithm Drafts > > >>>>> > > >>>>> This begins a two-week adoption poll for the following Flex > > >>>>> Algorithm > > >>>>> drafts: > > >>>>> > > >>>>> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-hegdeppsenak-isis-sr-flex > > >>>>> -a > > >>>>> lg > > >>>>> o/ > > >>>>> > > >>>>> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ppsenak-ospf-sr-flex-algo > > >>>>> / > > >>>>> > > >>>>> The adoption poll will end at 12:00 AM EST on May 2^nd , 2018. > > >>>>> Please indicate your support of opposition of the drafts. > > >>>>> > > >>>>> Additionally, the authors are amenable to combining the drafts > > >>>>> into a single draft. If you have an opinion, please state that as= well. > > >>>>> > > >>>>> Thanks, > > >>>>> > > >>>>> Acee > > >>>>> > > >>>>> > > >>>>> > > >>>>> _______________________________________________ > > >>>>> Lsr mailing list > > >>>>> Lsr@ietf.org > > >>>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr > > >>>>> > > >>> > > >>> . > > >>> > > > > > > . > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Lsr mailing list > > Lsr@ietf.org > > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr >=20 > _______________________________________________ > Lsr mailing list > Lsr@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr From nobody Fri Apr 20 20:27:08 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8452812DA06 for ; Fri, 20 Apr 2018 20:27:06 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.2 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.2 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id g_zjBo6qTuVg for ; Fri, 20 Apr 2018 20:27:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from huawei.com (lhrrgout.huawei.com [194.213.3.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 6968712DA03 for ; Fri, 20 Apr 2018 20:27:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from LHREML712-CAH.china.huawei.com (unknown [172.18.7.106]) by Forcepoint Email with ESMTP id 2971C2AC4AD8D for ; Sat, 21 Apr 2018 04:26:59 +0100 (IST) Received: from NKGEML414-HUB.china.huawei.com (10.98.56.75) by LHREML712-CAH.china.huawei.com (10.201.108.35) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 14.3.382.0; Sat, 21 Apr 2018 04:27:00 +0100 Received: from NKGEML515-MBX.china.huawei.com ([fe80::a54a:89d2:c471:ff]) by nkgeml414-hub.china.huawei.com ([10.98.56.75]) with mapi id 14.03.0361.001; Sat, 21 Apr 2018 11:26:54 +0800 From: "Dongjie (Jimmy)" To: Peter Psenak , "Acee Lindem (acee)" , "lsr@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [Lsr] LSR Working Group Adoption Poll for Flex Algorithm Drafts Thread-Index: AQHT1lqU9EG8NacYPUeDduC3/EAVyaQHqLKA//+VDYCAAayAEP//1gSAgACXe1D//4rSgAAzr0TQ Date: Sat, 21 Apr 2018 03:26:53 +0000 Message-ID: <76CD132C3ADEF848BD84D028D243C927983F487C@NKGEML515-MBX.china.huawei.com> References: <5B8EB88E-9C54-47FA-BF8A-EEB952F6C0BF@cisco.com> <76CD132C3ADEF848BD84D028D243C927983EA0E3@NKGEML515-MBX.china.huawei.com> <5AD852FD.9080301@cisco.com> <76CD132C3ADEF848BD84D028D243C927983F01BE@NKGEML515-MBX.china.huawei.com> <5AD99739.3050000@cisco.com> <76CD132C3ADEF848BD84D028D243C927983F0926@NKGEML515-MBX.china.huawei.com> <5AD9B3FF.8000805@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <5AD9B3FF.8000805@cisco.com> Accept-Language: en-US, zh-CN Content-Language: zh-CN X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.130.151.75] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-CFilter-Loop: Reflected Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] LSR Working Group Adoption Poll for Flex Algorithm Drafts X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 21 Apr 2018 03:27:06 -0000 Hi Peter,=20 Please see inline: > -----Original Message----- > From: Peter Psenak [mailto:ppsenak@cisco.com] > Sent: Friday, April 20, 2018 5:34 PM > To: Dongjie (Jimmy) ; Acee Lindem (acee) > ; lsr@ietf.org > Subject: Re: [Lsr] LSR Working Group Adoption Poll for Flex Algorithm Dra= fts >=20 > Dongjie, >=20 > On 20/04/18 11:00 , Dongjie (Jimmy) wrote: > > Hi Peter, > > > > Please see inline: > > > >> -----Original Message----- > >> From: Peter Psenak [mailto:ppsenak@cisco.com] > >> Sent: Friday, April 20, 2018 3:31 PM > >> To: Dongjie (Jimmy) ; Acee Lindem (acee) > >> ; lsr@ietf.org > >> Subject: Re: [Lsr] LSR Working Group Adoption Poll for Flex Algorithm > >> Drafts > >> > >> Hi Dongjie, > >> > >> please see inline: > >> > >> > >> On 20/04/18 05:04 , Dongjie (Jimmy) wrote: > >>> Hi Peter, > >>> > >>> Thanks for the prompt response. Please see inline: > >>> > >>>> -----Original Message----- > >>>> From: Peter Psenak [mailto:ppsenak@cisco.com] > >>>> Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2018 4:28 PM > >>>> To: Dongjie (Jimmy) ; Acee Lindem (acee) > >>>> ; lsr@ietf.org > >>>> Subject: Re: [Lsr] LSR Working Group Adoption Poll for Flex > >>>> Algorithm Drafts > >>>> > >>>> Hi Dongjie, > >>>> > >>>> please see inline: > >>>> > >>>> On 19/04/18 09:10 , Dongjie (Jimmy) wrote: > >>>>> Hi, > >>>>> > >>>>> Here are some comments on the Flex Algo drafts. > >>>>> > >>>>> SR algorithm as defined in > >>>>> draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensions > >>>>> is about the algorithm used for path calculation, such as SPF, stri= ct SPF, > etc. > >>>>> > >>>>> In the Flex Algo drafts, the definition of algorithm is extended > >>>>> to include topological constraints and the metric type used in > >>>>> calculation, which makes its functionality analogous to > >>>>> multi-topology routing > >>>> (MTR). > >>>> > >>>> not really. MTR is defined on a per link basis and each MTR > >>>> participation needs to be advertised on a per link basis. There is > >>>> no such > >> concept in flex-algo draft. > >>> > >>> Both mechanisms have the capability to define a specific > >>> sub-topology in the > >> network, that's why I say they are analogous in functionality. > >> Flex-algo uses link affinity to describe the constraints of the > >> corresponding topology, which is also a link attribute and needs to be > configured on a per-link basis. > >>> > >>> The difference is in topology advertisement. In MTR a consistent > >>> topology is > >> constructed by each node advertising its own adjacent links in the top= ology. > >> While in flex-algo, the whole topology is advertised as part of the > >> algorithm definition by each node, and priority based selection is > >> used to reach a consistent view by all nodes. > >>> > >>>> Flex-algo works on top of existing IGP topologies. > >>> > >>> Do you mean flex-algo can work on top of the default IGP topology, > >>> and can > >> also work on top of multiple IGP topologies created with MTR? > >> > >> yes > >> > >>> In the latter case, it seems you would create sub-topologies on top > >>> of a sub-topology (MTR) of the default topology, > >> > >> no. We don't create any topologies with flex-algo. We compute > >> constrained based paths. > > > > MTR is also used to compute constrained based path:) The constraint is > described as a sub-topology. >=20 > you are mixing two different things - topology and path computations, the= se > are two different things. As I mentioned in previous mail, there are two steps:=20 1. Define a particular topology or topological constraints. 2. Perform path computation using specific metric type and computation algo= rithm (currently SPF). IMO these two steps can be orthogonal to each other. The topology can be de= fined using either MTR or link affinities. IMO they provide the same functi= onality with similar cost. Note that using affinity does not mean less conf= iguration workload, as affinity also needs to be configured on each link. I= f you want to define a particular topology (topological constraint), you pr= obably need to introduce new affinities and configure them on the links you= want to include. To me it makes more sense to decouple step 1 and step2, and only use flex-a= lgo to cover the step 2. For example, flex-algo 1 can be defined as "using = SPF computation with latency metric". This way, this flex-algo can be reuse= d in different topologies. Also multiple flex-algos can be used in one topo= logy. So it would be more flexible than binding a flex-algo with particular= topological constraints. > > > > With flex-algo, you need to define the algorithm first, then the constr= ained > path can be computed according to the algorithm. > > > > According to your presentation in IETF101, a flex-algo specifies: > > > > a) Set of constraints - e.g affinity exclude-any, include-any, inclu= de-all > > b) Metric type - IGP metric, Delay (RFC7810), TE metric (RFC5305), .= .. > > c) Algorithm type - SPF, ... > > > > As I see a) defines a constrained topology, or a sub-topology. >=20 > again, you are mixing "set of constraints" with a "topology", these are t= wo > different things. As I mentioned above, what I mean is to separate the "topological constrain= ts" and the "algorithm constraints". The former can be done in multiple way= s, and requires distributed configuration, while the latter is more like a = centralized definition. > > > >>> which sounds quite complicated. Maybe another way is to use MTR to > >>> create > >> the sub-topology needed, and define the metric type and computation > >> algorithm using a particular flex-algo? > >> > >> what we propose is simple - compute multiple constrained based paths > >> on top of a given topology. > >> > >> What you propose is indeed complicated - create as many topologies as > >> many constrained based paths you need. That solution does not scale. > > > > Not exactly. Multiple constrained paths can be created in the same > sub-topology. You don't need as many topologies as the number of paths. >=20 > if you calculate multiple constrained paths on a single MT, you need to a= gree > what the constraints are for each calculation and that is what the flex-a= lgo > draft is doing. That's why in the beginning I want to confirm whether flex-algo can be used= with MT.=20 But within an MT, I'm not sure whether topological constraint should be fur= ther specified using the mechanism defined in flex-algo. Maybe only use fle= x-algo to define the metric type and computation algorithm used in this MT? Best regards, Jie >=20 > regards, > Peter >=20 > > > >>> > >>>>> Section 4.1 of the Flex Algo drafts says "Flex-Algorithm > >>>>> definition is topology independent", while in some places Flex > >>>>> Algo is described as a "light weight alternative" to MTR. > >>>> > >>>> there is no mention of MTR in the document. > >>> > >>> I was referring to another relevant draft: > >> draft-wijnands-mpls-mldp-multi-topology-00. Sorry for the confusion > >> caused. It seems that draft considered MTR and flex-algo as > >> comparable candidates for creating sub-topology. > >> > >> then please talk to the authors of that draft. > > > > OK. It seems some sync up is needed to have consistent understanding of > what flex-algo means. > > > >>> > >>>>> It would be necessary if the relationship between Flex-Algo and > >>>>> MTR can be further clarified. Whether the two mechanisms are > >>>>> complementary to each other, or Flex-Algo will be used to replace M= TR? > >>>> > >>>> they are orthogonal. > >>> > >>> If as you said they are orthogonal, it would be better to avoid > >>> overlapping > >> functionalities in topology definition and creation. > >> > >> orthogonal does not mean overlapping. > > > > Right, in order to make them orthogonal, overlapping (if any) should be > resolved. > > > > Best regards, > > Jie > > > >> > >> thanks, > >> Peter > >> > >>> > >>> Best regards, > >>> Jie > >>> > >>> > >>>> thanks, > >>>> Peter > >>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> And if it is claimed that Flex-Algo is light weight than MTR, it > >>>>> would be helpful to give a thorough comparison of the two > >>>>> mechanisms > >> somewhere. > >>>>> > >>>>> Best regards, > >>>>> > >>>>> Jie > >>>>> > >>>>> *From:*Lsr [mailto:lsr-bounces@ietf.org] *On Behalf Of *Acee > >>>>> Lindem > >>>>> (acee) > >>>>> *Sent:* Tuesday, April 17, 2018 10:44 PM > >>>>> *To:* lsr@ietf.org > >>>>> *Subject:* [Lsr] LSR Working Group Adoption Poll for Flex > >>>>> Algorithm Drafts > >>>>> > >>>>> This begins a two-week adoption poll for the following Flex > >>>>> Algorithm > >>>>> drafts: > >>>>> > >>>>> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-hegdeppsenak-isis-sr-flex-a > >>>>> lg > >>>>> o/ > >>>>> > >>>>> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ppsenak-ospf-sr-flex-algo/ > >>>>> > >>>>> The adoption poll will end at 12:00 AM EST on May 2^nd , 2018. > >>>>> Please indicate your support of opposition of the drafts. > >>>>> > >>>>> Additionally, the authors are amenable to combining the drafts > >>>>> into a single draft. If you have an opinion, please state that as w= ell. > >>>>> > >>>>> Thanks, > >>>>> > >>>>> Acee > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> _______________________________________________ > >>>>> Lsr mailing list > >>>>> Lsr@ietf.org > >>>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr > >>>>> > >>> > >>> . > >>> > > > > . > > From nobody Fri Apr 20 20:43:00 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6956012DA03 for ; Fri, 20 Apr 2018 20:42:59 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.2 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.2 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id FPPLCQlPQSa3 for ; Fri, 20 Apr 2018 20:42:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from huawei.com (lhrrgout.huawei.com [194.213.3.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 31B11124BFA for ; Fri, 20 Apr 2018 20:42:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from LHREML712-CAH.china.huawei.com (unknown [172.18.7.106]) by Forcepoint Email with ESMTP id 1B8B7CE0F9B16 for ; Sat, 21 Apr 2018 04:42:53 +0100 (IST) Received: from NKGEML414-HUB.china.huawei.com (10.98.56.75) by LHREML712-CAH.china.huawei.com (10.201.108.35) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 14.3.382.0; Sat, 21 Apr 2018 04:42:54 +0100 Received: from NKGEML515-MBX.china.huawei.com ([fe80::a54a:89d2:c471:ff]) by nkgeml414-hub.china.huawei.com ([10.98.56.75]) with mapi id 14.03.0361.001; Sat, 21 Apr 2018 11:42:46 +0800 From: "Dongjie (Jimmy)" To: "Acee Lindem (acee)" , "Peter Psenak (ppsenak)" , "lsr@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [Lsr] LSR Working Group Adoption Poll for Flex Algorithm Drafts Thread-Index: AQHT1lqU9EG8NacYPUeDduC3/EAVyaQHqLKA//+VDYCAAayAEP//1gSAgACXe1D//4rSgAAC7GaAADNNcDA= Date: Sat, 21 Apr 2018 03:42:46 +0000 Message-ID: <76CD132C3ADEF848BD84D028D243C927983F48B1@NKGEML515-MBX.china.huawei.com> References: <5B8EB88E-9C54-47FA-BF8A-EEB952F6C0BF@cisco.com> <76CD132C3ADEF848BD84D028D243C927983EA0E3@NKGEML515-MBX.china.huawei.com> <5AD852FD.9080301@cisco.com> <76CD132C3ADEF848BD84D028D243C927983F01BE@NKGEML515-MBX.china.huawei.com> <5AD99739.3050000@cisco.com> <76CD132C3ADEF848BD84D028D243C927983F0926@NKGEML515-MBX.china.huawei.com> <5AD9B3FF.8000805@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: en-US, zh-CN Content-Language: zh-CN X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.130.151.75] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-CFilter-Loop: Reflected Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] LSR Working Group Adoption Poll for Flex Algorithm Drafts X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 21 Apr 2018 03:42:59 -0000 SGkgQWNlZSwgDQoNClRoYW5rcyBmb3IgeW91ciBjb21tZW50cy4gDQoNCkkgZ3Vlc3MgeW91IGFy ZSByZWZlcnJpbmcgdG8gYSBwYXJ0aWN1bGFyIHVzYWdlIG9mIE1UUiwgd2hlbiBtdWx0aXBsZSB0 b3BvbG9naWVzIGhhdmUgZGlmZmVyZW50IHJvdXRlcyB0byB0aGUgc2FtZSBwcmVmaXgsIHdpdGgg SVAgZm9yd2FyZGluZyBzb21lIGFkZGl0aW9uYWwgbWVjaGFuaXNtIGlzIG5lZWRlZCB0byBtYXRj aCB0aGUgdHJhZmZpYyB0byBwYXJ0aWN1bGFyIHRvcG9sb2d5LiBUaGlzIGNhbiBiZSBzb2x2ZWQg d2l0aCBTUiBmb3J3YXJkaW5nICh1c2luZyBwZXItdG9wb2xvZ3kgU0lEKS4NCg0KRmxleC1hbGdv IGFsc28gYWxsb3dzIG11bHRpcGxlIHJvdXRlcyB0byB0aGUgc2FtZSBwcmVmaXgsIGFuZCB1c2Vz IGRpZmZlcmVudCBwcmVmaXgtU0lEcyBpbiB0aGUgU1IgZm9yd2FyZGluZy4gDQoNCkJlc3QgcmVn YXJkcywNCkppZQ0KDQo+IC0tLS0tT3JpZ2luYWwgTWVzc2FnZS0tLS0tDQo+IEZyb206IEFjZWUg TGluZGVtIChhY2VlKSBbbWFpbHRvOmFjZWVAY2lzY28uY29tXQ0KPiBTZW50OiBGcmlkYXksIEFw 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X19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fDQo+ICAgICA+Pj4+PiBMc3IgbWFpbGluZyBsaXN0DQo+ICAgICA+ Pj4+PiBMc3JAaWV0Zi5vcmcNCj4gICAgID4+Pj4+IGh0dHBzOi8vd3d3LmlldGYub3JnL21haWxt YW4vbGlzdGluZm8vbHNyDQo+ICAgICA+Pj4+Pg0KPiAgICAgPj4+DQo+ICAgICA+Pj4gLg0KPiAg ICAgPj4+DQo+ICAgICA+DQo+ICAgICA+IC4NCj4gICAgID4NCj4gDQo+IA0KDQo= From nobody Sat Apr 21 01:04:10 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 021D31201F8 for ; Sat, 21 Apr 2018 01:04:08 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.2 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.2 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id t8khdZtsiong for ; Sat, 21 Apr 2018 01:04:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from huawei.com (lhrrgout.huawei.com [194.213.3.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 85FB0129C5D for ; Sat, 21 Apr 2018 01:04:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from lhreml704-cah.china.huawei.com (unknown [172.18.7.107]) by Forcepoint Email with ESMTP id 5AA30714A2577 for ; Sat, 21 Apr 2018 09:04:00 +0100 (IST) Received: from NKGEML411-HUB.china.huawei.com (10.98.56.70) by lhreml704-cah.china.huawei.com (10.201.108.45) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 14.3.382.0; Sat, 21 Apr 2018 09:04:01 +0100 Received: from NKGEML515-MBX.china.huawei.com ([fe80::a54a:89d2:c471:ff]) by nkgeml411-hub.china.huawei.com ([10.98.56.70]) with mapi id 14.03.0361.001; Sat, 21 Apr 2018 16:03:57 +0800 From: "Dongjie (Jimmy)" To: "Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)" , "Peter Psenak (ppsenak)" , "Acee Lindem (acee)" , "lsr@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [Lsr] LSR Working Group Adoption Poll for Flex Algorithm Drafts Thread-Index: AQHT1lqU9EG8NacYPUeDduC3/EAVyaQHqLKA//+VDYCAAayAEP//1gSAgACXe1D//4rSgAARILoAACYsKRA= Date: Sat, 21 Apr 2018 08:03:56 +0000 Message-ID: <76CD132C3ADEF848BD84D028D243C927983F63D2@NKGEML515-MBX.china.huawei.com> References: <5B8EB88E-9C54-47FA-BF8A-EEB952F6C0BF@cisco.com> <76CD132C3ADEF848BD84D028D243C927983EA0E3@NKGEML515-MBX.china.huawei.com> <5AD852FD.9080301@cisco.com> <76CD132C3ADEF848BD84D028D243C927983F01BE@NKGEML515-MBX.china.huawei.com> <5AD99739.3050000@cisco.com> <76CD132C3ADEF848BD84D028D243C927983F0926@NKGEML515-MBX.china.huawei.com> <5AD9B3FF.8000805@cisco.com> <4fcf235c46d14e18811a448d0a590347@XCH-ALN-001.cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <4fcf235c46d14e18811a448d0a590347@XCH-ALN-001.cisco.com> Accept-Language: en-US, zh-CN Content-Language: zh-CN X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.130.151.75] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="gb2312" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-CFilter-Loop: Reflected Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] LSR Working Group Adoption Poll for Flex Algorithm Drafts X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 21 Apr 2018 08:04:08 -0000 SGkgTGVzLCANCg0KVGhhbmtzIGZvciB5b3VyIGNvbW1lbnRzIGFuZCBhbmFseXNpcy4gUGxlYXNl IHNlZSBteSByZXBsaWVzIGlubGluZToNCg0KPiAtLS0tLU9yaWdpbmFsIE1lc3NhZ2UtLS0tLQ0K PiBGcm9tOiBMZXMgR2luc2JlcmcgKGdpbnNiZXJnKSBbbWFpbHRvOmdpbnNiZXJnQGNpc2NvLmNv bV0NCj4gU2VudDogU2F0dXJkYXksIEFwcmlsIDIxLCAyMDE4IDE6NDQgQU0NCj4gVG86IFBldGVy IFBzZW5hayAocHBzZW5haykgPHBwc2VuYWtAY2lzY28uY29tPjsgRG9uZ2ppZSAoSmltbXkpDQo+ IDxqaWUuZG9uZ0BodWF3ZWkuY29tPjsgQWNlZSBMaW5kZW0gKGFjZWUpIDxhY2VlQGNpc2NvLmNv bT47IGxzckBpZXRmLm9yZw0KPiBTdWJqZWN0OiBSRTogW0xzcl0gTFNSIFdvcmtpbmcgR3JvdXAg QWRvcHRpb24gUG9sbCBmb3IgRmxleCBBbGdvcml0aG0gRHJhZnRzDQo+IA0KPiBKaWUgLQ0KPiAN 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QWNlZQ0KPiA+ID4+Pj4+DQo+ID4gPj4+Pj4NCj4gPiA+Pj4+Pg0KPiA+ID4+Pj4+IF9fX19fX19f X19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fDQo+ID4gPj4+Pj4gTHNyIG1h aWxpbmcgbGlzdA0KPiA+ID4+Pj4+IExzckBpZXRmLm9yZw0KPiA+ID4+Pj4+IGh0dHBzOi8vd3d3 LmlldGYub3JnL21haWxtYW4vbGlzdGluZm8vbHNyDQo+ID4gPj4+Pj4NCj4gPiA+Pj4NCj4gPiA+ Pj4gLg0KPiA+ID4+Pg0KPiA+ID4NCj4gPiA+IC4NCj4gPiA+DQo+ID4NCj4gPiBfX19fX19fX19f X19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fXw0KPiA+IExzciBtYWlsaW5nIGxp c3QNCj4gPiBMc3JAaWV0Zi5vcmcNCj4gPiBodHRwczovL3d3dy5pZXRmLm9yZy9tYWlsbWFuL2xp c3RpbmZvL2xzcg0K From nobody Sun Apr 22 12:26:39 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E1753126CB6 for ; Sun, 22 Apr 2018 12:26:37 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -14.511 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-14.511 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_DKIMWL_WL_HIGH=-0.01, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=cisco.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id UPCpCGD3LX9a for ; Sun, 22 Apr 2018 12:26:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from aer-iport-2.cisco.com (aer-iport-2.cisco.com [173.38.203.52]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher DHE-RSA-SEED-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id BB53F124BAC for ; Sun, 22 Apr 2018 12:26:34 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cisco.com; i=@cisco.com; l=9963; q=dns/txt; s=iport; t=1524425194; x=1525634794; h=message-id:date:from:mime-version:to:subject:references: in-reply-to:content-transfer-encoding; bh=QP/XxZbcfWiUOQJJterQ6WXWMpFg7H6xDvofJ9mao88=; b=JVn0czABotByx/KHsDouHgZisGHtuxA0tgNsQpThWEUoYV8w8/BzMkqY /GISECFRs+iHw9wtGJmYPZ/3tKs5pEkljkaop39GtG08RoVZNyUrH2aSG QDiO2nrnlMSjRKlG7HK2MVxo3uQnVL2lCBAajcVgghdr+2wnEiuCt9ELL g=; X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.49,314,1520899200"; d="scan'208";a="3339005" Received: from aer-iport-nat.cisco.com (HELO aer-core-1.cisco.com) ([173.38.203.22]) by aer-iport-2.cisco.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384; 22 Apr 2018 19:26:32 +0000 Received: from [10.60.140.57] (ams-ppsenak-nitro8.cisco.com [10.60.140.57]) by aer-core-1.cisco.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id w3MJQWQh027551; Sun, 22 Apr 2018 19:26:32 GMT Message-ID: <5ADCE1E8.8040202@cisco.com> Date: Sun, 22 Apr 2018 21:26:32 +0200 From: Peter Psenak User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.11; rv:24.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/24.4.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Dongjie (Jimmy)" , "Acee Lindem (acee)" , "lsr@ietf.org" References: <5B8EB88E-9C54-47FA-BF8A-EEB952F6C0BF@cisco.com> <76CD132C3ADEF848BD84D028D243C927983EA0E3@NKGEML515-MBX.china.huawei.com> <5AD852FD.9080301@cisco.com> <76CD132C3ADEF848BD84D028D243C927983F01BE@NKGEML515-MBX.china.huawei.com> <5AD99739.3050000@cisco.com> <76CD132C3ADEF848BD84D028D243C927983F0926@NKGEML515-MBX.china.huawei.com> <5AD9B3FF.8000805@cisco.com> <76CD132C3ADEF848BD84D028D243C927983F487C@NKGEML515-MBX.china.huawei.com> In-Reply-To: <76CD132C3ADEF848BD84D028D243C927983F487C@NKGEML515-MBX.china.huawei.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] LSR Working Group Adoption Poll for Flex Algorithm Drafts X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 22 Apr 2018 19:26:38 -0000 Hi Jie, On 21/04/18 05:26 , Dongjie (Jimmy) wrote: > Hi Peter, > > Please see inline: > >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Peter Psenak [mailto:ppsenak@cisco.com] >> Sent: Friday, April 20, 2018 5:34 PM >> To: Dongjie (Jimmy) ; Acee Lindem (acee) >> ; lsr@ietf.org >> Subject: Re: [Lsr] LSR Working Group Adoption Poll for Flex Algorithm Drafts >> >> Dongjie, >> >> On 20/04/18 11:00 , Dongjie (Jimmy) wrote: >>> Hi Peter, >>> >>> Please see inline: >>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: Peter Psenak [mailto:ppsenak@cisco.com] >>>> Sent: Friday, April 20, 2018 3:31 PM >>>> To: Dongjie (Jimmy) ; Acee Lindem (acee) >>>> ; lsr@ietf.org >>>> Subject: Re: [Lsr] LSR Working Group Adoption Poll for Flex Algorithm >>>> Drafts >>>> >>>> Hi Dongjie, >>>> >>>> please see inline: >>>> >>>> >>>> On 20/04/18 05:04 , Dongjie (Jimmy) wrote: >>>>> Hi Peter, >>>>> >>>>> Thanks for the prompt response. Please see inline: >>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: Peter Psenak [mailto:ppsenak@cisco.com] >>>>>> Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2018 4:28 PM >>>>>> To: Dongjie (Jimmy) ; Acee Lindem (acee) >>>>>> ; lsr@ietf.org >>>>>> Subject: Re: [Lsr] LSR Working Group Adoption Poll for Flex >>>>>> Algorithm Drafts >>>>>> >>>>>> Hi Dongjie, >>>>>> >>>>>> please see inline: >>>>>> >>>>>> On 19/04/18 09:10 , Dongjie (Jimmy) wrote: >>>>>>> Hi, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Here are some comments on the Flex Algo drafts. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> SR algorithm as defined in >>>>>>> draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensions >>>>>>> is about the algorithm used for path calculation, such as SPF, strict SPF, >> etc. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> In the Flex Algo drafts, the definition of algorithm is extended >>>>>>> to include topological constraints and the metric type used in >>>>>>> calculation, which makes its functionality analogous to >>>>>>> multi-topology routing >>>>>> (MTR). >>>>>> >>>>>> not really. MTR is defined on a per link basis and each MTR >>>>>> participation needs to be advertised on a per link basis. There is >>>>>> no such >>>> concept in flex-algo draft. >>>>> >>>>> Both mechanisms have the capability to define a specific >>>>> sub-topology in the >>>> network, that's why I say they are analogous in functionality. >>>> Flex-algo uses link affinity to describe the constraints of the >>>> corresponding topology, which is also a link attribute and needs to be >> configured on a per-link basis. >>>>> >>>>> The difference is in topology advertisement. In MTR a consistent >>>>> topology is >>>> constructed by each node advertising its own adjacent links in the topology. >>>> While in flex-algo, the whole topology is advertised as part of the >>>> algorithm definition by each node, and priority based selection is >>>> used to reach a consistent view by all nodes. >>>>> >>>>>> Flex-algo works on top of existing IGP topologies. >>>>> >>>>> Do you mean flex-algo can work on top of the default IGP topology, >>>>> and can >>>> also work on top of multiple IGP topologies created with MTR? >>>> >>>> yes >>>> >>>>> In the latter case, it seems you would create sub-topologies on top >>>>> of a sub-topology (MTR) of the default topology, >>>> >>>> no. We don't create any topologies with flex-algo. We compute >>>> constrained based paths. >>> >>> MTR is also used to compute constrained based path:) The constraint is >> described as a sub-topology. >> >> you are mixing two different things - topology and path computations, these >> are two different things. > > As I mentioned in previous mail, there are two steps: > > 1. Define a particular topology or topological constraints. > 2. Perform path computation using specific metric type and computation algorithm (currently SPF). > > IMO these two steps can be orthogonal to each other. The topology can be defined using either MTR or link affinities. IMO they provide the same functionality with similar cost. Note that using affinity does not mean less configuration workload, as affinity also needs to be configured on each link. If you want to define a particular topology (topological constraint), you probably need to introduce new affinities and configure them on the links you want to include. > > To me it makes more sense to decouple step 1 and step2, and only use flex-algo to cover the step 2. For example, flex-algo 1 can be defined as "using SPF computation with latency metric". This way, this flex-algo can be reused in different topologies. Also multiple flex-algos can be used in one topology. So it would be more flexible than binding a flex-algo with particular topological constraints. > >>> >>> With flex-algo, you need to define the algorithm first, then the constrained >> path can be computed according to the algorithm. >>> >>> According to your presentation in IETF101, a flex-algo specifies: >>> >>> a) Set of constraints - e.g affinity exclude-any, include-any, include-all >>> b) Metric type - IGP metric, Delay (RFC7810), TE metric (RFC5305), ... >>> c) Algorithm type - SPF, ... >>> >>> As I see a) defines a constrained topology, or a sub-topology. >> >> again, you are mixing "set of constraints" with a "topology", these are two >> different things. > > As I mentioned above, what I mean is to separate the "topological constraints" and the "algorithm constraints". The former can be done in multiple ways, and requires distributed configuration, while the latter is more like a centralized definition. > >>> >>>>> which sounds quite complicated. Maybe another way is to use MTR to >>>>> create >>>> the sub-topology needed, and define the metric type and computation >>>> algorithm using a particular flex-algo? >>>> >>>> what we propose is simple - compute multiple constrained based paths >>>> on top of a given topology. >>>> >>>> What you propose is indeed complicated - create as many topologies as >>>> many constrained based paths you need. That solution does not scale. >>> >>> Not exactly. Multiple constrained paths can be created in the same >> sub-topology. You don't need as many topologies as the number of paths. >> >> if you calculate multiple constrained paths on a single MT, you need to agree >> what the constraints are for each calculation and that is what the flex-algo >> draft is doing. > > That's why in the beginning I want to confirm whether flex-algo can be used with MT. yes, it can be used with MT. > > But within an MT, I'm not sure whether topological constraint should be further specified using the mechanism defined in flex-algo. Maybe only use flex-algo to define the metric type and computation algorithm used in this MT? in your mind you are still mixing the topology with constraints. We do not want to use MT to define constraints. We want to use flex-algo to represents the constraints. thanks, Peter > > Best regards, > Jie >> >> regards, >> Peter >> >>> >>>>> >>>>>>> Section 4.1 of the Flex Algo drafts says "Flex-Algorithm >>>>>>> definition is topology independent", while in some places Flex >>>>>>> Algo is described as a "light weight alternative" to MTR. >>>>>> >>>>>> there is no mention of MTR in the document. >>>>> >>>>> I was referring to another relevant draft: >>>> draft-wijnands-mpls-mldp-multi-topology-00. Sorry for the confusion >>>> caused. It seems that draft considered MTR and flex-algo as >>>> comparable candidates for creating sub-topology. >>>> >>>> then please talk to the authors of that draft. >>> >>> OK. It seems some sync up is needed to have consistent understanding of >> what flex-algo means. >>> >>>>> >>>>>>> It would be necessary if the relationship between Flex-Algo and >>>>>>> MTR can be further clarified. Whether the two mechanisms are >>>>>>> complementary to each other, or Flex-Algo will be used to replace MTR? >>>>>> >>>>>> they are orthogonal. >>>>> >>>>> If as you said they are orthogonal, it would be better to avoid >>>>> overlapping >>>> functionalities in topology definition and creation. >>>> >>>> orthogonal does not mean overlapping. >>> >>> Right, in order to make them orthogonal, overlapping (if any) should be >> resolved. >>> >>> Best regards, >>> Jie >>> >>>> >>>> thanks, >>>> Peter >>>> >>>>> >>>>> Best regards, >>>>> Jie >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> thanks, >>>>>> Peter >>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> And if it is claimed that Flex-Algo is light weight than MTR, it >>>>>>> would be helpful to give a thorough comparison of the two >>>>>>> mechanisms >>>> somewhere. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Best regards, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Jie >>>>>>> >>>>>>> *From:*Lsr [mailto:lsr-bounces@ietf.org] *On Behalf Of *Acee >>>>>>> Lindem >>>>>>> (acee) >>>>>>> *Sent:* Tuesday, April 17, 2018 10:44 PM >>>>>>> *To:* lsr@ietf.org >>>>>>> *Subject:* [Lsr] LSR Working Group Adoption Poll for Flex >>>>>>> Algorithm Drafts >>>>>>> >>>>>>> This begins a two-week adoption poll for the following Flex >>>>>>> Algorithm >>>>>>> drafts: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-hegdeppsenak-isis-sr-flex-a >>>>>>> lg >>>>>>> o/ >>>>>>> >>>>>>> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ppsenak-ospf-sr-flex-algo/ >>>>>>> >>>>>>> The adoption poll will end at 12:00 AM EST on May 2^nd , 2018. >>>>>>> Please indicate your support of opposition of the drafts. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Additionally, the authors are amenable to combining the drafts >>>>>>> into a single draft. If you have an opinion, please state that as well. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Thanks, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Acee >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> Lsr mailing list >>>>>>> Lsr@ietf.org >>>>>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr >>>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> . >>>>> >>> >>> . >>> > > . > From nobody Mon Apr 23 06:42:39 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 373C012946D for ; Mon, 23 Apr 2018 06:42:38 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -14.51 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-14.51 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_DKIMWL_WL_HIGH=-0.01, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); 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Mon, 23 Apr 2018 07:02:52 -0700 (PDT) X-Quarantine-ID: X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Amavis-Alert: BAD HEADER SECTION, Duplicate header field: "Cc" X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.9 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id iBmlld-BboOx; Mon, 23 Apr 2018 07:02:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from smtp.chopps.org (smtp.chopps.org [54.88.81.56]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4FF5B126CD6; Mon, 23 Apr 2018 07:02:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tops.chopps.org (47-50-69-38.static.klmz.mi.charter.com [47.50.69.38]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) by smtp.chopps.org (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 9E84B61816; Mon, 23 Apr 2018 14:02:49 +0000 (UTC) User-agent: mu4e 1.0; emacs 25.3.1 From: Christian Hopps To: "lsr\@ietf.org" Cc: chopps@chopps.org cc: lsr-ads@ietf.org, lsr-chairs@ietf.org Date: Mon, 23 Apr 2018 10:02:48 -0400 Message-ID: <874lk2vx4n.fsf@chopps.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Archived-At: Subject: [Lsr] WG Last Call for draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensions-16 X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 23 Apr 2018 14:02:53 -0000 Hi Folks, We are starting a new 2 week WG last call on https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensions/ as there have (*) been some changes to the document since our last WG last call last year. Here's the diff. https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url1=draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensions-12&url2=draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensions-16 Will end Monday May 7th. Thanks, Chris. (*) contrary to what you may have heard from folks at the mic in London. :) From nobody Mon Apr 23 10:49:43 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9ECD0126BFD for ; Mon, 23 Apr 2018 10:49:39 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -14.51 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-14.51 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_DKIMWL_WL_MED=-0.01, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=cisco.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id KCOJmWd7YQJI for ; Mon, 23 Apr 2018 10:49:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: 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Working Group Secretary Thread-Index: AQHT2wjvKfl3AeENe0SIHVUr1YmaKaQOoIAQ Date: Mon, 23 Apr 2018 17:49:35 +0000 Message-ID: References: In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted x-originating-ip: [10.24.54.19] Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_d28ef16ac1874908af1e0db90917bb1aXCHALN001ciscocom_" MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] LSR Working Group Secretary X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 23 Apr 2018 17:49:40 -0000 --_000_d28ef16ac1874908af1e0db90917bb1aXCHALN001ciscocom_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 QnJhdm8hDQpOb3cgTFNSIGlzIGEgd29ybGQgY2xhc3MgV0cuDQoNClRoYW54IHRvIFlpbmd6aGVu 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([173.36.7.11]) by XCH-ALN-001.cisco.com ([173.36.7.11]) with mapi id 15.00.1320.000; Mon, 23 Apr 2018 12:51:29 -0500 From: "Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)" To: Christian Hopps , "lsr@ietf.org" CC: "lsr-chairs@ietf.org" , "lsr-ads@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [Lsr] WG Last Call for draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensions-16 Thread-Index: AQHT2wve0DZKpZMy/EaqKhm7vlagg6QOoPIQ Date: Mon, 23 Apr 2018 17:51:29 +0000 Message-ID: <098d4fe30e5b41199efd065b48d60fd8@XCH-ALN-001.cisco.com> References: <874lk2vx4n.fsf@chopps.org> In-Reply-To: <874lk2vx4n.fsf@chopps.org> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted x-originating-ip: [10.24.54.19] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] WG Last Call for draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensions-16 X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 23 Apr 2018 17:51:34 -0000 Support as co-author. Note that the substantive changes to the document were to remove the unused= ERO types - which was a widely supported change. Les > -----Original Message----- > From: Lsr On Behalf Of Christian Hopps > Sent: Monday, April 23, 2018 7:03 AM > To: lsr@ietf.org > Cc: lsr-chairs@ietf.org; lsr-ads@ietf.org; chopps@chopps.org > Subject: [Lsr] WG Last Call for draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extension= s-16 >=20 > Hi Folks, >=20 > We are starting a new 2 week WG last call on >=20 > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing- > extensions/ >=20 > as there have (*) been some changes to the document since our last WG las= t > call last year. Here's the diff. > https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url1=3Ddraft-ietf-isis-segment-routing- > extensions-12&url2=3Ddraft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensions-16 >=20 > Will end Monday May 7th. >=20 > Thanks, > Chris. >=20 > (*) contrary to what you may have heard from folks at the mic in London. = :) >=20 > _______________________________________________ > Lsr mailing list > Lsr@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr From nobody Mon Apr 23 12:37:48 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7BBF7126B6E for ; Mon, 23 Apr 2018 12:37:46 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.998 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.998 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, MIME_QP_LONG_LINE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id zPq6t26-2D7W for ; Mon, 23 Apr 2018 12:37:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-pf0-x235.google.com (mail-pf0-x235.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400e:c00::235]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 507AF12D810 for ; Mon, 23 Apr 2018 12:37:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-pf0-x235.google.com with SMTP id f189so1039239pfa.7 for ; Mon, 23 Apr 2018 12:37:44 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:subject:from:in-reply-to:date:cc :content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references:to; bh=k4caKIqcI/RqACanvNyg3iLv1SFsKOaiT3WhQUo+ty8=; b=pbFTE6VLM7QtqHV7I4VVqwUKLChuYHJgFX/YlyDttWOkA6YEzyRTGJm5kSgM3yCOiZ krsWofS4ZoNWwFVP1sOtDW9PvdsJLoY8OzunIGIJjZw8kvUqcYZML4GLdLbBlGv5knAd yyvelqQcCyLFvRuJ4SwFrL+FH7+zWAPvzCAhMRA/HzON75nepw/r/MdwFdFFreC+RBwl yINGWdQ3BEvv0BcnTzk6hQ8HPYC5NbQ8WLhELoSEkQ8eujDva7VsnRq0XCINOIgr3cpQ IddR8OysqnV+gwft5+C+UyKLoAMLBFMphJuPTMt+7+j6YJlaGWpz79Po6xOQRuArgzrD 0C1A== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:subject:from:in-reply-to:date:cc :content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references:to; bh=k4caKIqcI/RqACanvNyg3iLv1SFsKOaiT3WhQUo+ty8=; b=bCiPPh6aDpG0Q9Y6WtqfMyvukkuFzzltr+e511AgoKPRHuR/CLZEDVDQU6jIiWTr32 NDq/9ohQAgvux/kGzmnrTCybpokzRErPIKhPGu2hmwm2IX6oq6SrBA0OWSNX3Msj1MA/ eC2NVfyehlvT4hmjuWFoAXQ7Q2eXbEanU96wmlpxHqu/X9U65Eb5lpefdJJaQ8tQ8pl2 h2jr9OS0KJJFMoSP8N9nc4rw6LlaAuUO4pS1rnZNq9KLi95doaJT9exWS9XzCAzCTfqq IsWY3YKC5Ro6/5mP1lARcuM+OGfHdOVCkfAHSpr3YYcLWoh0DQRKQtP8lYZMtYkJ8IqY DF2g== X-Gm-Message-State: ALQs6tAu+Ug/3KGG5NIOVVBJ+Rj8rhKgR4aM2FuIAiHyb0qMSnWKIWu7 rrGdJkg9roucUCSAVN3snImOXVJB X-Google-Smtp-Source: AIpwx48kFyPYNJC312tpRamT4viVdDZtIfqNVVQB89XtERtAtZsM8AzPSC31F6JTqz5PN10kUkEvEw== X-Received: by 2002:a17:902:9042:: with SMTP id w2-v6mr21879569plz.34.1524512263772; Mon, 23 Apr 2018 12:37:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ?IPv6:2607:fb90:4851:aa94:cc8:82a8:159:28c0? ([2607:fb90:4851:aa94:cc8:82a8:159:28c0]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id r23sm21724542pfh.33.2018.04.23.12.37.42 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Mon, 23 Apr 2018 12:37:42 -0700 (PDT) Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=Apple-Mail-A0A0217D-9B08-409E-AFC2-A889461011E4 Mime-Version: 1.0 (1.0) From: Jeff Tantsura X-Mailer: iPhone Mail (15E216) In-Reply-To: Date: Mon, 23 Apr 2018 12:37:41 -0700 Cc: "Acee Lindem (acee)" , "lsr@ietf.org" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <62136650-3DC8-40E8-8BF3-61AD7A2AAB5B@gmail.com> References: To: "Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] LSR Working Group Secretary X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 23 Apr 2018 19:37:46 -0000 --Apple-Mail-A0A0217D-9B08-409E-AFC2-A889461011E4 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Couldn=E2=80=99t agree more! Yingzhen is great at everything she does, thanks! (Don=E2=80=99t forget us, at RTGWG ;-)) Regards, Jeff > On Apr 23, 2018, at 10:49, Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) wr= ote: >=20 > Bravo! > Now LSR is a world class WG. > =20 > Thanx to Yingzhen for taking on this additional responsibility. > =20 > Les > =20 > =20 > From: Lsr On Behalf Of Acee Lindem (acee) > Sent: Monday, April 23, 2018 6:43 AM > To: lsr@ietf.org > Subject: [Lsr] LSR Working Group Secretary > =20 > All, > =20 > I=E2=80=99m delighted to announce that Yingzhen Qu has volunteered to take= on the role of WG secretary. Yingzhen took the minutes at the first formal m= eeting of the LSR WG in London and is also RTG WG secretary. > =20 > Thanks, > Acee > _______________________________________________ > Lsr mailing list > Lsr@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr --Apple-Mail-A0A0217D-9B08-409E-AFC2-A889461011E4 Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Couldn=E2=80=99t agree more!
Yingzhen i= s great at everything she does, thanks!
(Don=E2=80=99t forget us, a= t RTGWG ;-))

Regards,
Jeff

On Apr 23, 2018, at 10:49, Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) <ginsberg@cisco.com> wrote:

<= blockquote type=3D"cite">

Bravo!=

Now LS= R is a world class WG.

&= nbsp;

Thanx t= o Yingzhen for taking on this additional responsibility.

&= nbsp;

 =   Les

&= nbsp;

&= nbsp;

From:<= span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt"> Lsr <lsr-bounces@ietf.org> On Behalf Of Acee Lindem (acee)
Sent: Monday, April 23, 2018 6:43 AM
To: lsr@ietf.org
Subject: [Lsr] LSR Working Group Secretary

 

All,

 

I=E2=80=99m delighte= d to announce that Yingzhen Qu has volunteered to take on the role of WG sec= retary. Yingzhen took the minutes at the first formal meeting of the LSR WG i= n London and is also RTG WG secretary.

 

Thanks,

Acee

____________________= ___________________________
Lsr mailing list
Lsr@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/lis= tinfo/lsr
= --Apple-Mail-A0A0217D-9B08-409E-AFC2-A889461011E4-- From nobody Mon Apr 23 12:40:17 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9139212D7E4; Mon, 23 Apr 2018 12:40:15 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 3R7V_4lY3cfO; Mon, 23 Apr 2018 12:40:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-pf0-x22a.google.com (mail-pf0-x22a.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400e:c00::22a]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 5BF34126B6E; Mon, 23 Apr 2018 12:40:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-pf0-x22a.google.com with SMTP id v63so569662pfk.8; Mon, 23 Apr 2018 12:40:13 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:subject:from:in-reply-to:date:cc :content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references:to; bh=puVBIjxPcDkksXRjoFZKwFnNg2mTFoXpIiztgMNzXTU=; b=niweSAWOuWE39PJ7URmeYmOteWJzHC9qKC1rOBISE17zHCTzoPJz/G7AoBw9b3YKnQ dis+fJfzaKnwIbrcASZwGppiF/Uaoo6SkDkEe3lOgGzCGUAbyzM2yOPDF/MftG+LFc2p L0PC4j9QmumDUwAGkfxtuSrxORj1lJBRiBFnZKVXgJR7qLwP3PpnrDkP+bc+ZzaiODA3 NgaEyYsk4jM9oaA/WQKi1vPX1/5DjFwd1Ug9r+YA3ZV+lQPp7aFjM68a8yUPAqUghihT rNQGKa1EHQXX8/hj8CJwV02q4plihVRucgn2JP2N3O3x7UElm+aZozPI7uGY/g5jeep0 LV2g== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:subject:from:in-reply-to:date:cc :content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references:to; bh=puVBIjxPcDkksXRjoFZKwFnNg2mTFoXpIiztgMNzXTU=; b=e7a1K1D/8CKxeaYTYWhc1n/7ym7GjfL/CGxhZFgk7Cbci7f5iytjeSt9w6snwap3RY r+LvKaa9wb/0Xus2EVJfMz5gWnC7hXNMXoLRl5azyJ/atdHFpaZcHJEeyHDu7f5hMkrW LONdkD0MfZgTIoEUp0iL7tB+GiBq/m9kWqcyozWHjoB6gRLKBJEg/jIJ7B9FeNQ06fKS SugkMX9vOpu6zK//uePa4naL5PvBkbA+dEhIdLocIYvwyNEA8Q3JpasaxBa0+GxSJfcG X4HaQbrc1OU1y89C5bncGzYHX1F+4UcYvkyp9sDAAR9Vbh7D9WNPJFHSc+BV4grmb+Js 7XPA== X-Gm-Message-State: ALQs6tA1i2FVJeXyaefp6rSaOneO6kuF/4NT7td6dQyxdi8xEe9gcQ1Y D4RJn2Dma4J4vn3z0f8NLonDFlNo X-Google-Smtp-Source: AIpwx48jW82hNz2X/N6ifHrno+46WlHYGJROGoUx2kqrM1yoHrPBhjcyeoYvDWaZL6ypfefY65ocJQ== X-Received: by 10.99.97.16 with SMTP id v16mr17792463pgb.292.1524512412757; Mon, 23 Apr 2018 12:40:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ?IPv6:2607:fb90:4851:aa94:cc8:82a8:159:28c0? ([2607:fb90:4851:aa94:cc8:82a8:159:28c0]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id p13sm25261450pgn.18.2018.04.23.12.40.11 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Mon, 23 Apr 2018 12:40:12 -0700 (PDT) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Mime-Version: 1.0 (1.0) From: Jeff Tantsura X-Mailer: iPhone Mail (15E216) In-Reply-To: <874lk2vx4n.fsf@chopps.org> Date: Mon, 23 Apr 2018 12:40:11 -0700 Cc: "lsr@ietf.org" , lsr-chairs@ietf.org, lsr-ads@ietf.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <38CA3D81-DF37-486B-B8A5-DCC2D7C997E7@gmail.com> References: <874lk2vx4n.fsf@chopps.org> To: Christian Hopps Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] WG Last Call for draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensions-16 X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 23 Apr 2018 19:40:16 -0000 Support as co-author Regards, Jeff > On Apr 23, 2018, at 07:02, Christian Hopps wrote: >=20 > Hi Folks, >=20 > We are starting a new 2 week WG last call on >=20 > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extension= s/ >=20 > as there have (*) been some changes to the document since our last WG last= call last year. Here's the diff. > https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url1=3Ddraft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-exte= nsions-12&url2=3Ddraft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensions-16 >=20 > Will end Monday May 7th. >=20 > Thanks, > Chris. >=20 > (*) contrary to what you may have heard from folks at the mic in London. := ) >=20 > _______________________________________________ > Lsr mailing list > Lsr@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr From nobody Mon Apr 23 19:34:44 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5776E1205F0; Mon, 23 Apr 2018 19:34:42 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -14.509 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-14.509 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_DKIMWL_WL_HIGH=-0.01, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=cisco.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id NR8uCpicdoxh; Mon, 23 Apr 2018 19:34:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from alln-iport-5.cisco.com (alln-iport-5.cisco.com [173.37.142.92]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher DHE-RSA-SEED-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4974312420B; Mon, 23 Apr 2018 19:34:39 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cisco.com; i=@cisco.com; l=45970; q=dns/txt; s=iport; t=1524537279; x=1525746879; h=from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:references: in-reply-to:mime-version; bh=stOSqjkltgS6TEnpf6RveR1Qt33bCisykvjkdD2O+s8=; b=hQQNuhcqGu3T801dK46ClUIB62f2dYfH1/4bOqzXPa0wizsC0MAhByl3 k96WGe8EhZcJSoWEyrZtBhuq5sXHhqTfNRV9ktmPHFp9X5NwExImA6vGo R8kI8LNxIILQc8g8l7VxxxmTQbp1oeCqbmjDeSk+UPvsI6XYIkr9kDgba 8=; X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: =?us-ascii?q?A0B1AQANl95a/5FdJa1cGQEBAQEBAQE?= =?us-ascii?q?BAQEBAQcBAQEBAYJNRy9hF2MoCoNgiAKMeIF0gQ+TAIF1AwsYAQ6ERAIagk0?= =?us-ascii?q?hNBgBAgEBAQEBAQJsHAyFIgEBAQEDAQEbBgpBCwwEAgEIDgMEAQEhAQkCAgI?= =?us-ascii?q?lCx0IAgQBDQUIBoUBD6cmghyISIIqCgWIDIFUP4EPgwuDEQEBAgEBFoEjgyO?= =?us-ascii?q?CVAKQaIcLCAKDOoIgglCGDIE8g12HPYk2hlACERMBgSQBHDiBUnAVO4JDgiA?= =?us-ascii?q?XiFmFPm8Bjz+BGAEB?= X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.49,320,1520899200"; d="scan'208,217";a="103442551" Received: from rcdn-core-9.cisco.com ([173.37.93.145]) by alln-iport-5.cisco.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384; 24 Apr 2018 02:34:38 +0000 Received: from XCH-ALN-007.cisco.com (xch-aln-007.cisco.com [173.36.7.17]) by rcdn-core-9.cisco.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id w3O2YbpU012798 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 24 Apr 2018 02:34:38 GMT Received: from xch-aln-008.cisco.com (173.36.7.18) by XCH-ALN-007.cisco.com (173.36.7.17) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.0.1320.4; Mon, 23 Apr 2018 21:34:37 -0500 Received: from xch-aln-008.cisco.com ([173.36.7.18]) by XCH-ALN-008.cisco.com ([173.36.7.18]) with mapi id 15.00.1320.000; Mon, 23 Apr 2018 21:34:37 -0500 From: "Ketan Talaulikar (ketant)" To: Christian Hopps , "lsr@ietf.org" CC: "lsr-chairs@ietf.org" , "lsr-ads@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [Lsr] WG Last Call for draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensions-16 Thread-Index: AQHT2wvdNYXd1FQ5GU6peErl1wWLQKQPMcXQ Date: Tue, 24 Apr 2018 02:34:37 +0000 Message-ID: <858571422bf5426f8b69d97ad307a80a@XCH-ALN-008.cisco.com> References: <874lk2vx4n.fsf@chopps.org> In-Reply-To: <874lk2vx4n.fsf@chopps.org> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: yes X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted x-originating-ip: [10.65.48.231] Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="_002_858571422bf5426f8b69d97ad307a80aXCHALN008ciscocom_" MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] WG Last Call for draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensions-16 X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 24 Apr 2018 02:34:42 -0000 --_002_858571422bf5426f8b69d97ad307a80aXCHALN008ciscocom_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Chris, I had shared some comments and requests for clarifications on the OSPF MSD = draft. Some of them are also applicable to the ISIS version. Please find th= e same attached. Thanks, Ketan -----Original Message----- From: Lsr On Behalf Of Christian Hopps Sent: 23 April 2018 19:33 To: lsr@ietf.org Cc: lsr-chairs@ietf.org; lsr-ads@ietf.org; chopps@chopps.org Subject: [Lsr] WG Last Call for draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensions-= 16 Hi Folks, We are starting a new 2 week WG last call on https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensio= ns/ as there have (*) been some changes to the document since our last WG last = call last year. Here's the diff. https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url1=3Ddraft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-ext= ensions-12&url2=3Ddraft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensions-16 Will end Monday May 7th. Thanks, Chris. (*) contrary to what you may have heard from folks at the mic in London. :) _______________________________________________ Lsr mailing list Lsr@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr --_002_858571422bf5426f8b69d97ad307a80aXCHALN008ciscocom_ Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: attachment; creation-date="Tue, 24 Apr 2018 02:34:33 GMT"; modification-date="Tue, 24 Apr 2018 02:34:33 GMT" From: "Ketan Talaulikar (ketant)" To: "Acee Lindem (acee)" , "lsr@ietf.org" Subject: RE: LSR WG Last Call for "Signaling MSD (Maximum SID Depth) using OSPF" - draft-ietf-ospf-segment-routing-msd-10.txt Thread-Topic: LSR WG Last Call for "Signaling MSD (Maximum SID Depth) using OSPF" - draft-ietf-ospf-segment-routing-msd-10.txt Thread-Index: AQHTzUETs42zzUGpBkCsVN6fOMVtjqP88MKQ Date: Thu, 12 Apr 2018 12:04:07 +0000 References: In-Reply-To: Content-Language: en-IN X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Content-Type: multipart/alternative; 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Apr 2018 23:37:33 -0400 From: "Acee Lindem (acee)" To: "Anton Smirnov (asmirnov)" , "draft-ietf-ospf-xaf-te@ietf.org" CC: "lsr@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [Lsr] OSPF Routing with Cross-Address Family MPLS Traffic Engineering Tunnels Thread-Index: AQHT232UUg3H9fB1P0m2r/iPd9eANA== Date: Tue, 24 Apr 2018 03:37:33 +0000 Message-ID: <46292A51-A693-4397-9FAF-796B8EBEB28A@cisco.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted x-originating-ip: [10.24.17.116] Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_46292A51A69343979FAF796B8EBEB28Aciscocom_" MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] OSPF Routing with Cross-Address Family MPLS Traffic Engineering Tunnels X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , 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04:46:05 +0000 Received: from XCH-RCD-007.cisco.com (xch-rcd-007.cisco.com [173.37.102.17]) by rcdn-core-11.cisco.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id w3O4k5XO010435 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 24 Apr 2018 04:46:05 GMT Received: from xch-aln-008.cisco.com (173.36.7.18) by XCH-RCD-007.cisco.com (173.37.102.17) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.0.1320.4; Mon, 23 Apr 2018 23:46:04 -0500 Received: from xch-aln-008.cisco.com ([173.36.7.18]) by XCH-ALN-008.cisco.com ([173.36.7.18]) with mapi id 15.00.1320.000; Mon, 23 Apr 2018 23:46:04 -0500 From: "Ketan Talaulikar (ketant)" To: Christian Hopps , "lsr@ietf.org" CC: "lsr-chairs@ietf.org" , "lsr-ads@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [Lsr] WG Last Call for draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensions-16 Thread-Index: AQHT2wvdNYXd1FQ5GU6peErl1wWLQKQPMcXQgAAl4fA= Date: Tue, 24 Apr 2018 04:46:04 +0000 Message-ID: References: <874lk2vx4n.fsf@chopps.org> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted x-originating-ip: [10.65.48.231] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] WG Last Call for draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensions-16 X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 24 Apr 2018 04:46:10 -0000 Please ignore my email below, it is not applicable to the ISIS SR draft in = subject. I support draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensions progressing further. Thanks, Ketan -----Original Message----- From: Ketan Talaulikar (ketant)=20 Sent: 24 April 2018 08:04 To: 'Christian Hopps' ; lsr@ietf.org Cc: lsr-chairs@ietf.org; lsr-ads@ietf.org Subject: RE: [Lsr] WG Last Call for draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensi= ons-16 Hi Chris, I had shared some comments and requests for clarifications on the OSPF MSD = draft. Some of them are also applicable to the ISIS version. Please find th= e same attached. Thanks, Ketan -----Original Message----- From: Lsr On Behalf Of Christian Hopps Sent: 23 April 2018 19:33 To: lsr@ietf.org Cc: lsr-chairs@ietf.org; lsr-ads@ietf.org; chopps@chopps.org Subject: [Lsr] WG Last Call for draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensions-= 16 Hi Folks, We are starting a new 2 week WG last call on https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensio= ns/ as there have (*) been some changes to the document since our last WG last = call last year. Here's the diff. https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url1=3Ddraft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-ext= ensions-12&url2=3Ddraft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensions-16 Will end Monday May 7th. Thanks, Chris. (*) contrary to what you may have heard from folks at the mic in London. :) _______________________________________________ Lsr mailing list Lsr@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr From nobody Mon Apr 23 23:25:24 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 29CD712E888; Mon, 23 Apr 2018 23:25:22 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.2 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.2 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id QJ0ADeHprZDo; Mon, 23 Apr 2018 23:25:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from huawei.com (lhrrgout.huawei.com [194.213.3.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 59BB5127201; Mon, 23 Apr 2018 23:25:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from LHREML711-CAH.china.huawei.com (unknown [172.18.7.108]) by Forcepoint Email with ESMTP id AE5BA9606FB83; Tue, 24 Apr 2018 07:25:15 +0100 (IST) Received: from DGGEMM405-HUB.china.huawei.com (10.3.20.213) by LHREML711-CAH.china.huawei.com (10.201.108.34) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 14.3.382.0; Tue, 24 Apr 2018 07:25:17 +0100 Received: from DGGEMM512-MBX.china.huawei.com ([169.254.3.61]) by DGGEMM405-HUB.china.huawei.com ([10.3.20.213]) with mapi id 14.03.0361.001; Tue, 24 Apr 2018 14:25:12 +0800 From: Lizhenbin To: Christian Hopps , "lsr@ietf.org" CC: "lsr-chairs@ietf.org" , "lsr-ads@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [Lsr] WG Last Call for draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensions-16 Thread-Index: AQHT2wvVDU9YneV/pkKsblS/iGO0+qQPc7VA Date: Tue, 24 Apr 2018 06:25:11 +0000 Message-ID: <5A5B4DE12C0DAC44AF501CD9A2B01A8D8F3F2637@dggemm512-mbx.china.huawei.com> References: <874lk2vx4n.fsf@chopps.org> In-Reply-To: <874lk2vx4n.fsf@chopps.org> Accept-Language: zh-CN, en-US Content-Language: zh-CN X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.111.206.84] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-CFilter-Loop: Reflected Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] WG Last Call for draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensions-16 X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 24 Apr 2018 06:25:22 -0000 Support. Best Regards, Zhenbin (Robin) -----Original Message----- From: Lsr [mailto:lsr-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Christian Hopps Sent: Monday, April 23, 2018 10:03 PM To: lsr@ietf.org Cc: lsr-chairs@ietf.org; lsr-ads@ietf.org; chopps@chopps.org Subject: [Lsr] WG Last Call for draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensions-= 16 Hi Folks, We are starting a new 2 week WG last call on https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensio= ns/ as there have (*) been some changes to the document since our last WG last = call last year. Here's the diff. https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url1=3Ddraft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-ext= ensions-12&url2=3Ddraft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensions-16 Will end Monday May 7th. Thanks, Chris. (*) contrary to what you may have heard from folks at the mic in London. :) _______________________________________________ Lsr mailing list Lsr@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr From nobody Tue Apr 24 08:29:06 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2A2B312D943; Tue, 24 Apr 2018 08:29:05 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.699 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.699 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id r5NXdnL8pMmK; Tue, 24 Apr 2018 08:29:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-wm0-x235.google.com (mail-wm0-x235.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:400c:c09::235]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id F11421200C5; Tue, 24 Apr 2018 08:29:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-wm0-x235.google.com with SMTP id a8so1838871wmg.5; Tue, 24 Apr 2018 08:29:02 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=subject:to:cc:references:from:message-id:date:user-agent :mime-version:in-reply-to:content-transfer-encoding:content-language; bh=93jSraNQ2cGeGpVOb5pvvXUaiRUhIKZxTqLt3toc8pE=; b=dJwmNViYQcNL+UkYThOugJZwq3gGla3ZcZhJq/a3RmbuDVLfikBHI1FPII7qt2N61W ISbKlw+bP1+qzYfDqYi4O4NG1+ij9cPJFYtdaU1SnGPoZdgd7oRRbpuyOwbHgdk75TB1 5Jgk2vRIYqoY6agkr6+esdG03CvTa/L4Ar/hs6g3HV/x4eJgWx11/bGLzF+ChTrjyYRc X/HdXeD7EuLK+CYzqrR6yktRP6td5Ui2Ku4G1vxFvc2ObdXQoRDAtWR5VddbpwLCrCMX uRKkZExTCM3JoXNq+fHwfKWI2loX6kfsPXVGUVMrZ+3eOx2g9eV4eckztkj2b3YBf/T0 uVgQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:subject:to:cc:references:from:message-id:date :user-agent:mime-version:in-reply-to:content-transfer-encoding :content-language; bh=93jSraNQ2cGeGpVOb5pvvXUaiRUhIKZxTqLt3toc8pE=; b=P+qfPd1hRVlIuraWipMdeQSF5rBmv2f/nUuREPyPyGcqPHD3iTFhPOiKag41HRiNqH juRnJsy8pB/dYjQ5U0n1lK4Me5mybXRq6HVMVCKZ8kZIbyBY2N3r/h1afnAQpcrLCUxD OcWz0XiIrlBkRapQKFHIioQTnSpQPE6N3w8KmX9hiDtd5WdQ8fuUv5R2rYyHQWcEkYw4 mFc+/vIl13E09K6vgefxvHBZEluicOY72Trs+dJVJytWrVTSU82dZ1phHYhOTHfaZlIY tQyRFiH49NagbEO1eSRfdn3BzEvOrN9BOOcfn+ba/EAFDQdOsHub9UgTmXnQ1CMV/2jV 6Qhg== X-Gm-Message-State: ALQs6tCtXqVv9WnlzY3HxXDltn7wT22ObZMABvXwTSQG92vGX8/2VuUP xRlDPmk9jKBBG0RHoZawn7yN7T24 X-Google-Smtp-Source: AIpwx4+EtgAyHgfNPkqJCe31Wn49FlrydLHzr07BHltfrtCdCFKipvkjQukpf/R/Q7gOLoj2QdF6VA== X-Received: by 10.28.132.68 with SMTP id g65mr13722114wmd.114.1524583741408; Tue, 24 Apr 2018 08:29:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [192.168.1.33] ([41.238.152.253]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id z18-v6sm9116994wrc.36.2018.04.24.08.28.59 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Tue, 24 Apr 2018 08:29:00 -0700 (PDT) To: Christian Hopps , "lsr@ietf.org" Cc: lsr-chairs@ietf.org, lsr-ads@ietf.org References: <874lk2vx4n.fsf@chopps.org> From: Ahmed Bashandy Message-ID: <1dada435-4f34-a37a-28b8-cb14374fc34a@gmail.com> Date: Tue, 24 Apr 2018 08:28:58 -0700 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.13; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/52.7.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <874lk2vx4n.fsf@chopps.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Language: en-US Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] WG Last Call for draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensions-16 X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 24 Apr 2018 15:29:05 -0000 support at a co-author Ahmed On 4/23/18 7:02 AM, Christian Hopps wrote: > Hi Folks, > > We are starting a new 2 week WG last call on > >  https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensions/ > > > as there have (*) been some changes to the document since our last WG > last call last year. Here's the diff. > https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url1=draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensions-12&url2=draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensions-16 > > Will end Monday May 7th. > > Thanks, > Chris. > > (*) contrary to what you may have heard from folks at the mic in > London. :) > > _______________________________________________ > Lsr mailing list > Lsr@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr From nobody Tue Apr 24 13:13:17 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CE23912D96A for ; Tue, 24 Apr 2018 13:13:16 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.199 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.199 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 0rG8yS7w074m for ; Tue, 24 Apr 2018 13:13:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from huawei.com (lhrrgout.huawei.com [194.213.3.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 89BDA12D94E for ; Tue, 24 Apr 2018 13:13:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from lhreml704-cah.china.huawei.com (unknown [172.18.7.107]) by Forcepoint Email with ESMTP id EDAE8EA7D6AB8 for ; Tue, 24 Apr 2018 21:13:09 +0100 (IST) Received: from SJCEML703-CHM.china.huawei.com (10.208.112.39) by lhreml704-cah.china.huawei.com (10.201.108.45) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 14.3.382.0; Tue, 24 Apr 2018 21:13:12 +0100 Received: from SJCEML521-MBS.china.huawei.com ([169.254.2.168]) by SJCEML703-CHM.china.huawei.com ([169.254.5.179]) with mapi id 14.03.0382.000; Tue, 24 Apr 2018 13:13:09 -0700 From: Yingzhen Qu To: Jeff Tantsura , "Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)" CC: "lsr@ietf.org" , "Acee Lindem (acee)" Thread-Topic: [Lsr] LSR Working Group Secretary Thread-Index: AQHT2wjvKfl3AeENe0SIHVUr1YmaKaQOoIAQgACT3ICAAZw9AA== Date: Tue, 24 Apr 2018 20:13:08 +0000 Message-ID: <3A8BDEA9-20DD-4674-A97F-D356E744FB1D@huawei.com> References: <62136650-3DC8-40E8-8BF3-61AD7A2AAB5B@gmail.com> In-Reply-To: <62136650-3DC8-40E8-8BF3-61AD7A2AAB5B@gmail.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.212.245.159] Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_3A8BDEA920DD4674A97FD356E744FB1Dhuaweicom_" MIME-Version: 1.0 X-CFilter-Loop: Reflected Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] LSR Working Group Secretary X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 24 Apr 2018 20:13:17 -0000 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+nye9M16TbXWqWhFWG3o+fLqXlzePKNeDZ0qX//k1hMRxKJdJGBKPrDFz 8=; X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.49,324,1520899200"; d="scan'208";a="3385728" Received: from aer-iport-nat.cisco.com (HELO aer-core-1.cisco.com) ([173.38.203.22]) by aer-iport-1.cisco.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384; 24 Apr 2018 20:56:40 +0000 Received: from asm-linux.cisco.com (ams-asmirnov-nitro6.cisco.com [10.55.206.135]) (authenticated bits=0) by aer-core-1.cisco.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id w3OKudvj029171 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=NO); Tue, 24 Apr 2018 20:56:40 GMT To: "Acee Lindem (acee)" , "draft-ietf-ospf-xaf-te@ietf.org" Cc: "lsr@ietf.org" References: <46292A51-A693-4397-9FAF-796B8EBEB28A@cisco.com> From: Anton Smirnov Organization: Cisco Systems Message-ID: Date: Tue, 24 Apr 2018 22:56:39 +0200 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/52.5.2 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <46292A51-A693-4397-9FAF-796B8EBEB28A@cisco.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Authenticated-User: asmirnov Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] OSPF Routing with Cross-Address Family MPLS Traffic Engineering Tunnels X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 24 Apr 2018 20:56:46 -0000 Hi Acee, this text looks good to me, if other authors do not object I will add it to the Backward Compatibility section. Do we have other potential changes to discuss before I refresh the draft one more time? --- Anton On 04/24/18 05:37, Acee Lindem (acee) wrote: > Hi Anton > > Since the IGP shortcut use case you reference does, in fact, use the TED > populated by an instance of one protocol (OSPFv2 or OSPFv3) in an > instance of the other protocol (OSPFv3 or OSPFv2), I don’t think we want > to say anything about instances in the backward compatibility section. I > think we can reduce the text you provided below to: > >             X-AF only requires the head-end and the tail-end of the > advertised TE tunnels to support > >             X-AF advertisement and usage as described herein. > Intermediate OSPF Routers on the TE > >             tunnel path need not support X-AF functionality. > > Thanks, > Acee > > *From: *Lsr on behalf of Acee Lindem > *Date: *Thursday, April 19, 2018 at 5:29 PM > *To: *"Anton Smirnov (asmirnov)" , > "draft-ietf-ospf-xaf-te@ietf.org" > *Cc: *"lsr@ietf.org" > *Subject: *Re: [Lsr] OSPF Routing with Cross-Address Family MPLS Traffic > Engineering Tunnels > > Hi Anton, > > I guess I see the use case described below as only one of the potential > use cases for the X-AF tunnels. It seems that path computation, either > head-end or PCE, could also use the dual-stack endpoint information. > Note that the OSPF doesn’t establish the LSPs or even advertise the LSPs > themselves– it merely populates the TE Database. I know that you know > this but you want to assure your text doesn’t imply otherwise. Do you > disagree? You can certainly keep this use case but I’d reference RFC > 3906 (informational reference) and state that there could alternate use > cases. Perhaps, your fellow author Alvaro (of OSPF TTZ fame) could help > with some generic text preceding the specific IGP Shortcut use case. > > Let me see if I can massage the backward compatibility text. I’m > requested a Routing Directorate review and I’m going to start the LSR WG > last call shortly. > > Thanks, > Acee > > *From: *"Anton Smirnov (asmirnov)" > *Organization: *Cisco Systems > *Date: *Saturday, April 14, 2018 at 6:48 PM > *To: *Acee Lindem , "draft-ietf-ospf-xaf-te@ietf.org" > > *Cc: *"lsr@ietf.org" > *Subject: *Re: OSPF Routing with Cross-Address Family MPLS Traffic > Engineering Tunnels > >    Hi Acee, > >    sorry for my slow response. > >    Before answering questions lets establish 'prerequisites' of the > problem. > > - Network is dual stack, OSPFv2 is used to route IPv4, OSPFv3 is used to > route IPv6 > > - TE LSAs are originated as per [RFC3630] and flooded in OSPFv2 > > - 'Endpoint' of each MPLS TE tunnel is IPv4 address > > - There is a desire to make OSPFv3 to compute IPv6 routes over TE > tunnels - of which OSPFv3 has no topological information > >      >  3. In the section 3 mapping algorithm, why do you walk the X-AF >      >     endpoints from all connected areas? Why not just the > area of local >      >     IP address? > >         Idea behind this wording is to cater for cases when area > borders are >     laid differently in OSPFv2 and OSPFv3. It's even possible that > router is >     ABR in OSPFv2 but not OSPFv3. From network design perspective > this, of >     course, is a terrible thing to do - but not impossible. > > I guess I still don't understand. Are you implying that you are > advertising TE LSAs using both OSPFv2 and OSPFv3 and aggregating the > TED and since the area boundaries may be different, you need to > search all the areas LSP endpoints? I don't think this deployment > model makes sense and I don't think this should be supported. > >    No, TE LSAs are advertised only in OSPFv2. >    Consider information available to OSPFv3 on tunnel headend router. > Endpoint address of TE tunnel is IPv4 address, say 7.7.7.7 (this address > is what tunnel tailend router advertises in OSPFv2 TE LSA in the Router > Address TLV). OSPFv3 needs to find what router in what area corresponds > to router that advertises that TE LSA in OSPFv2. > >    That is, OSPFv3 has no its own TE information and not even a hint to > which area may belong the tailend router. > > > >      >  4. In the backward compatibility section, can you also > discuss the >      >     requirements for backward compatibility of the > endpoints? Also state >      >     that the X-AF tunnel will not be recognized unless the > endpoints are >      >     advertised by the same protocol (OSPFv2 or OSPFv3); or > describe the >      >     behavior if this is not the intension. > >         We can add paragraph saying something like: >     "In order for XAF computation to work tunnel tailend routers MUST >     advertise XAF Node Local Address sub-TLVs in OSPF instance that > will >     perform XAF computation. Thus only tunnel endpoints (both > tunnel headend >     and tailend routers) and only OSPF protocol instance performing > XAF >     routing must implement XAF as described in this document. Other > routers >     in the network do not need to implement XAF algorithm or > interpret Node >     Local Address sub-TLVs. For example, if network uses TE tunnels > signaled >     by OSPFv2 [RFC3630] and intends to use cross-AF route > computation in >     OSPFv3 then only OSPFv3 implementation on routers that serve as > tunnel >     endpoints in OSPFv2 needs to be compliant with this specification." > >     Will this text work? > > I think this could be a lot clearer if it were written from the > perspective of the head-end router performing the calculation. Also, > you lost me completely with the last sentence. We are uses a single > protocol, OSPFv2 or OSPFv3 to advertise TE LSAs. Since both IPv4 and > IPv6 traffic is tunneled over that LSP, there is no reason to > operate both protocols since traffic will take the path of the X-AF > LSP - correct? > > But OSPFv2 does not produce IPv6 routes. Both protocols operate in the > network: > > - OSPFv2 computes IPv4 routes and distributes TE database > > - OSPFv3 computes IPv6 routes. If TE tunnels provide shortcut to > destination then OSPFv3 will point route into the tunnel. > > --- > > Anton > > On 04/07/18 23:06, Acee Lindem (acee) wrote: > > Hi Anton, > > On 4/6/18, 7:33 AM, "Anton Smirnov (asmirnov)" > wrote: > >         Hi Acee, >         my answers below (I didn't vet them with other authors, so > they may >     express different opinions). > >      >  1. Have you considered a shorter name for the RFC? For > example: “OSPF >      >     Cross Address Family Traffic Engineering Tunnelsâ€? > >         Your proposed variant drops two pieces: "Routing with" and > "MPLS". >     Dropping mention to MPLS is fine with me. Dropping "Routing > with" seems >     to me less correct because the draft is about ways to compute > routes and >     not about setting up/managing tunnels. >         But ultimately I have no strong feelings here and if there > is a >     requirement to shorten document's name then that would be a > good candidate. > > >      >  2. Can you change the requirements language text to the RFC > 8174 >     version? > >         OK, we will publish new document revision when we agreed on > other >     points. > > >      >  3. In the section 3 mapping algorithm, why do you walk the X-AF >      >     endpoints from all connected areas? Why not just the > area of local >      >     IP address? > >         Idea behind this wording is to cater for cases when area > borders are >     laid differently in OSPFv2 and OSPFv3. It's even possible that > router is >     ABR in OSPFv2 but not OSPFv3. From network design perspective > this, of >     course, is a terrible thing to do - but not impossible. > > I guess I still don't understand. Are you implying that you are > advertising TE LSAs using both OSPFv2 and OSPFv3 and aggregating the > TED and since the area boundaries may be different, you need to > search all the areas LSP endpoints? I don't think this deployment > model makes sense and I don't think this should be supported. > > >      >  4. In the backward compatibility section, can you also > discuss the >      >     requirements for backward compatibility of the > endpoints? Also state >      >     that the X-AF tunnel will not be recognized unless the > endpoints are >      >     advertised by the same protocol (OSPFv2 or OSPFv3); or > describe the >      >     behavior if this is not the intension. > >         We can add paragraph saying something like: >     "In order for XAF computation to work tunnel tailend routers MUST >     advertise XAF Node Local Address sub-TLVs in OSPF instance that > will >     perform XAF computation. Thus only tunnel endpoints (both > tunnel headend >     and tailend routers) and only OSPF protocol instance performing > XAF >     routing must implement XAF as described in this document. Other > routers >     in the network do not need to implement XAF algorithm or > interpret Node >     Local Address sub-TLVs. For example, if network uses TE tunnels > signaled >     by OSPFv2 [RFC3630] and intends to use cross-AF route > computation in >     OSPFv3 then only OSPFv3 implementation on routers that serve as > tunnel >     endpoints in OSPFv2 needs to be compliant with this specification." > >     Will this text work? > > I think this could be a lot clearer if it were written from the > perspective of the head-end router performing the calculation. Also, > you lost me completely with the last sentence. We are uses a single > protocol, OSPFv2 or OSPFv3 to advertise TE LSAs. Since both IPv4 and > IPv6 traffic is tunneled over that LSP, there is no reason to > operate both protocols since traffic will take the path of the X-AF > LSP - correct? > > Thanks, > Acee > > >     --- >     Anton > > >     On 04/04/18 20:13, Acee Lindem (acee) wrote: >     > Hi Anton, Alvaro, and Mike, >     > >     > In preparation for WG last call, I have a couple comments. >     > >     >  1. Have you considered a shorter name for the RFC? For > example: “OSPF >     >     Cross Address Family Traffic Engineering Tunnelsâ€? >     >  2. Can you change the requirements language text to the RFC > 8174 version? >     >  3. In the section 3 mapping algorithm, why do you walk the X-AF >     >     endpoints from all connected areas? Why not just the area > of local >     >     IP address? >     >  4. In the backward compatibility section, can you also > discuss the >     >     requirements for backward compatibility of the endpoints? > Also state >     >     that the X-AF tunnel will not be recognized unless the > endpoints are >     >     advertised by the same protocol (OSPFv2 or OSPFv3); or > describe the >     >     behavior if this is not the intension. >     > >     > Thanks, >     > >     > Acee >     > > > > > From nobody Tue Apr 24 14:15:28 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 62B6B12DA4F; Tue, 24 Apr 2018 14:15:27 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -14.51 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-14.51 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_DKIMWL_WL_HIGH=-0.01, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001, 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from xch-rtp-015.cisco.com (64.101.220.155) by XCH-RTP-005.cisco.com (64.101.220.145) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.0.1320.4; Tue, 24 Apr 2018 17:15:22 -0400 Received: from xch-rtp-015.cisco.com ([64.101.220.155]) by XCH-RTP-015.cisco.com ([64.101.220.155]) with mapi id 15.00.1320.000; Tue, 24 Apr 2018 17:15:22 -0400 From: "Acee Lindem (acee)" To: "Anton Smirnov (asmirnov)" , "draft-ietf-ospf-xaf-te@ietf.org" CC: "lsr@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [Lsr] OSPF Routing with Cross-Address Family MPLS Traffic Engineering Tunnels Thread-Index: AQHT232UUg3H9fB1P0m2r/iPd9eANKQQqY2A///CLIA= Date: Tue, 24 Apr 2018 21:15:21 +0000 Message-ID: <8F43906C-8EA1-4110-A4C9-962B40EE0B66@cisco.com> References: <46292A51-A693-4397-9FAF-796B8EBEB28A@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted x-originating-ip: [10.41.33.71] Content-Type: 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rcdn-iport-4.cisco.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384; 24 Apr 2018 23:07:31 +0000 Received: from [10.24.67.107] ([10.24.67.107]) by alln-core-7.cisco.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id w3ON7UV0015114 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO); Tue, 24 Apr 2018 23:07:31 GMT To: Anton Smirnov , Acee Lindem Cc: draft-ietf-ospf-xaf-te@ietf.org, lsr@ietf.org References: <46292A51-A693-4397-9FAF-796B8EBEB28A@cisco.com> From: Michael Barnes Message-ID: <3392f337-e1c8-0e49-ae26-75245a158fb8@cisco.com> Date: Tue, 24 Apr 2018 16:07:30 -0700 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/52.7.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] OSPF Routing with Cross-Address Family MPLS Traffic Engineering Tunnels X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 24 Apr 2018 23:07:35 -0000 I am fine with it as well. -Michael On 04/24/2018 01:56 PM, Anton Smirnov wrote: >    Hi Acee, >    this text looks good to me, if other authors do not object I will > add it to the Backward Compatibility section. > >    Do we have other potential changes to discuss before I refresh the > draft one more time? > > --- > Anton > > > On 04/24/18 05:37, Acee Lindem (acee) wrote: >> Hi Anton >> >> Since the IGP shortcut use case you reference does, in fact, use the >> TED populated by an instance of one protocol (OSPFv2 or OSPFv3) in an >> instance of the other protocol (OSPFv3 or OSPFv2), I don’t think we >> want to say anything about instances in the backward compatibility >> section. I think we can reduce the text you provided below to: >> >>              X-AF only requires the head-end and the tail-end of the >> advertised TE tunnels to support >> >>              X-AF advertisement and usage as described herein. >> Intermediate OSPF Routers on the TE >> >>              tunnel path need not support X-AF functionality. >> >> Thanks, >> Acee >> >> *From: *Lsr on behalf of Acee Lindem >> >> *Date: *Thursday, April 19, 2018 at 5:29 PM >> *To: *"Anton Smirnov (asmirnov)" , >> "draft-ietf-ospf-xaf-te@ietf.org" >> *Cc: *"lsr@ietf.org" >> *Subject: *Re: [Lsr] OSPF Routing with Cross-Address Family MPLS >> Traffic Engineering Tunnels >> >> Hi Anton, >> >> I guess I see the use case described below as only one of the >> potential use cases for the X-AF tunnels. It seems that path >> computation, either head-end or PCE, could also use the dual-stack >> endpoint information. Note that the OSPF doesn’t establish the LSPs or >> even advertise the LSPs themselves– it merely populates the TE >> Database. I know that you know this but you want to assure your text >> doesn’t imply otherwise. Do you disagree? You can certainly keep this >> use case but I’d reference RFC 3906 (informational reference) and >> state that there could alternate use cases. Perhaps, your fellow >> author Alvaro (of OSPF TTZ fame) could help with some generic text >> preceding the specific IGP Shortcut use case. >> >> Let me see if I can massage the backward compatibility text. I’m >> requested a Routing Directorate review and I’m going to start the LSR >> WG last call shortly. >> >> Thanks, >> Acee >> >> *From: *"Anton Smirnov (asmirnov)" >> *Organization: *Cisco Systems >> *Date: *Saturday, April 14, 2018 at 6:48 PM >> *To: *Acee Lindem , "draft-ietf-ospf-xaf-te@ietf.org" >> >> *Cc: *"lsr@ietf.org" >> *Subject: *Re: OSPF Routing with Cross-Address Family MPLS Traffic >> Engineering Tunnels >> >>     Hi Acee, >> >>     sorry for my slow response. >> >>     Before answering questions lets establish 'prerequisites' of the >> problem. >> >> - Network is dual stack, OSPFv2 is used to route IPv4, OSPFv3 is used >> to route IPv6 >> >> - TE LSAs are originated as per [RFC3630] and flooded in OSPFv2 >> >> - 'Endpoint' of each MPLS TE tunnel is IPv4 address >> >> - There is a desire to make OSPFv3 to compute IPv6 routes over TE >> tunnels - of which OSPFv3 has no topological information >> >>           >  3. In the section 3 mapping algorithm, why do you walk >> the X-AF >>           >     endpoints from all connected areas? Why not just the >>     area of local >>           >     IP address? >> >>              Idea behind this wording is to cater for cases when area >>     borders are >>          laid differently in OSPFv2 and OSPFv3. It's even possible that >>     router is >>          ABR in OSPFv2 but not OSPFv3. From network design perspective >>     this, of >>          course, is a terrible thing to do - but not impossible. >> >>     I guess I still don't understand. Are you implying that you are >>     advertising TE LSAs using both OSPFv2 and OSPFv3 and aggregating the >>     TED and since the area boundaries may be different, you need to >>     search all the areas LSP endpoints? I don't think this deployment >>     model makes sense and I don't think this should be supported. >> >>     No, TE LSAs are advertised only in OSPFv2. >>     Consider information available to OSPFv3 on tunnel headend router. >> Endpoint address of TE tunnel is IPv4 address, say 7.7.7.7 (this >> address is what tunnel tailend router advertises in OSPFv2 TE LSA in >> the Router Address TLV). OSPFv3 needs to find what router in what area >> corresponds to router that advertises that TE LSA in OSPFv2. >> >>     That is, OSPFv3 has no its own TE information and not even a hint >> to which area may belong the tailend router. >> >> >> >>           >  4. In the backward compatibility section, can you also >>     discuss the >>           >     requirements for backward compatibility of the >>     endpoints? Also state >>           >     that the X-AF tunnel will not be recognized unless the >>     endpoints are >>           >     advertised by the same protocol (OSPFv2 or OSPFv3); or >>     describe the >>           >     behavior if this is not the intension. >> >>              We can add paragraph saying something like: >>          "In order for XAF computation to work tunnel tailend routers >> MUST >>          advertise XAF Node Local Address sub-TLVs in OSPF instance that >>     will >>          perform XAF computation. Thus only tunnel endpoints (both >>     tunnel headend >>          and tailend routers) and only OSPF protocol instance performing >>     XAF >>          routing must implement XAF as described in this document. Other >>     routers >>          in the network do not need to implement XAF algorithm or >>     interpret Node >>          Local Address sub-TLVs. For example, if network uses TE tunnels >>     signaled >>          by OSPFv2 [RFC3630] and intends to use cross-AF route >>     computation in >>          OSPFv3 then only OSPFv3 implementation on routers that serve as >>     tunnel >>          endpoints in OSPFv2 needs to be compliant with this >> specification." >> >>          Will this text work? >> >>     I think this could be a lot clearer if it were written from the >>     perspective of the head-end router performing the calculation. Also, >>     you lost me completely with the last sentence. We are uses a single >>     protocol, OSPFv2 or OSPFv3 to advertise TE LSAs. Since both IPv4 and >>     IPv6 traffic is tunneled over that LSP, there is no reason to >>     operate both protocols since traffic will take the path of the X-AF >>     LSP - correct? >> >> But OSPFv2 does not produce IPv6 routes. Both protocols operate in the >> network: >> >> - OSPFv2 computes IPv4 routes and distributes TE database >> >> - OSPFv3 computes IPv6 routes. If TE tunnels provide shortcut to >> destination then OSPFv3 will point route into the tunnel. >> >> --- >> >> Anton >> >> On 04/07/18 23:06, Acee Lindem (acee) wrote: >> >>     Hi Anton, >> >>     On 4/6/18, 7:33 AM, "Anton Smirnov (asmirnov)" >>     wrote: >> >>              Hi Acee, >>              my answers below (I didn't vet them with other authors, so >>     they may >>          express different opinions). >> >>           >  1. Have you considered a shorter name for the RFC? For >>     example: “OSPF >>           >     Cross Address Family Traffic Engineering Tunnelsâ€? >> >>              Your proposed variant drops two pieces: "Routing with" and >>     "MPLS". >>          Dropping mention to MPLS is fine with me. Dropping "Routing >>     with" seems >>          to me less correct because the draft is about ways to compute >>     routes and >>          not about setting up/managing tunnels. >>              But ultimately I have no strong feelings here and if there >>     is a >>          requirement to shorten document's name then that would be a >>     good candidate. >> >> >>           >  2. Can you change the requirements language text to the RFC >>     8174 >>          version? >> >>              OK, we will publish new document revision when we agreed on >>     other >>          points. >> >> >>           >  3. In the section 3 mapping algorithm, why do you walk >> the X-AF >>           >     endpoints from all connected areas? Why not just the >>     area of local >>           >     IP address? >> >>              Idea behind this wording is to cater for cases when area >>     borders are >>          laid differently in OSPFv2 and OSPFv3. It's even possible that >>     router is >>          ABR in OSPFv2 but not OSPFv3. From network design perspective >>     this, of >>          course, is a terrible thing to do - but not impossible. >> >>     I guess I still don't understand. Are you implying that you are >>     advertising TE LSAs using both OSPFv2 and OSPFv3 and aggregating the >>     TED and since the area boundaries may be different, you need to >>     search all the areas LSP endpoints? I don't think this deployment >>     model makes sense and I don't think this should be supported. >> >> >>           >  4. In the backward compatibility section, can you also >>     discuss the >>           >     requirements for backward compatibility of the >>     endpoints? Also state >>           >     that the X-AF tunnel will not be recognized unless the >>     endpoints are >>           >     advertised by the same protocol (OSPFv2 or OSPFv3); or >>     describe the >>           >     behavior if this is not the intension. >> >>              We can add paragraph saying something like: >>          "In order for XAF computation to work tunnel tailend routers >> MUST >>          advertise XAF Node Local Address sub-TLVs in OSPF instance that >>     will >>          perform XAF computation. Thus only tunnel endpoints (both >>     tunnel headend >>          and tailend routers) and only OSPF protocol instance performing >>     XAF >>          routing must implement XAF as described in this document. Other >>     routers >>          in the network do not need to implement XAF algorithm or >>     interpret Node >>          Local Address sub-TLVs. For example, if network uses TE tunnels >>     signaled >>          by OSPFv2 [RFC3630] and intends to use cross-AF route >>     computation in >>          OSPFv3 then only OSPFv3 implementation on routers that serve as >>     tunnel >>          endpoints in OSPFv2 needs to be compliant with this >> specification." >> >>          Will this text work? >> >>     I think this could be a lot clearer if it were written from the >>     perspective of the head-end router performing the calculation. Also, >>     you lost me completely with the last sentence. We are uses a single >>     protocol, OSPFv2 or OSPFv3 to advertise TE LSAs. Since both IPv4 and >>     IPv6 traffic is tunneled over that LSP, there is no reason to >>     operate both protocols since traffic will take the path of the X-AF >>     LSP - correct? >> >>     Thanks, >>     Acee >> >> >>          --- >>          Anton >> >> >>          On 04/04/18 20:13, Acee Lindem (acee) wrote: >>          > Hi Anton, Alvaro, and Mike, >>          > >>          > In preparation for WG last call, I have a couple comments. >>          > >>          >  1. Have you considered a shorter name for the RFC? For >>     example: “OSPF >>          >     Cross Address Family Traffic Engineering Tunnelsâ€? >>          >  2. Can you change the requirements language text to the RFC >>     8174 version? >>          >  3. In the section 3 mapping algorithm, why do you walk the >> X-AF >>          >     endpoints from all connected areas? Why not just the area >>     of local >>          >     IP address? >>          >  4. In the backward compatibility section, can you also >>     discuss the >>          >     requirements for backward compatibility of the endpoints? >>     Also state >>          >     that the X-AF tunnel will not be recognized unless the >>     endpoints are >>          >     advertised by the same protocol (OSPFv2 or OSPFv3); or >>     describe the >>          >     behavior if this is not the intension. >>          > >>          > Thanks, >>          > >>          > Acee >>          > >> >> >> >> > . > From nobody Wed Apr 25 11:37:38 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EA6D9127869 for ; Wed, 25 Apr 2018 11:37:35 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -14.51 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-14.51 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, 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Apr 2018 15:16:44 -0400 From: "Acee Lindem (acee)" To: "Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)" , "lsr@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: LSR WG Adoption call for "IS-IS Traffic Engineering (TE) Metric Extensions" - draft-ginsberg-lsr-isis-rfc7810bis-00 Thread-Index: AQHT3MR5ccvHMrFQ80+80DEnoT04fqQR2lwA Date: Wed, 25 Apr 2018 19:16:44 +0000 Message-ID: <6D817EE3-413B-41B1-9029-C4980970CF96@cisco.com> References: <6C4A9D96-579C-4FC4-81C5-F6DBAC61C1BE@cisco.com> <04086934dc41461b9458850686154425@XCH-ALN-001.cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <04086934dc41461b9458850686154425@XCH-ALN-001.cisco.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted x-originating-ip: [10.41.32.62] Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_6D817EE3413B41B19029C4980970CF96ciscocom_" MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] LSR WG Adoption call for "IS-IS Traffic Engineering (TE) Metric Extensions" - draft-ginsberg-lsr-isis-rfc7810bis-00 X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 25 Apr 2018 19:16:48 -0000 --_000_6D817EE3413B41B19029C4980970CF96ciscocom_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 SGkgTGVzLA0KWWVzIOKAkyBwbGVhc2UgcmVpc3N1ZSB0aGUgZHJhZnQgdXNpbmcgdGhlIGFncmVl ZCB1cG9uIG5hbWluZyBjb252ZW50aW9uLg0KVGhhbmtzLA0KQWNlZQ0KDQpGcm9tOiAiTGVzIEdp bnNiZXJnIChnaW5zYmVyZykiIDxnaW5zYmVyZ0BjaXNjby5jb20+DQpEYXRlOiBXZWRuZXNkYXks IEFwcmlsIDI1LCAyMDE4IGF0IDI6MzcgUE0NClRvOiBBY2VlIExpbmRlbSA8YWNlZUBjaXNjby5j b20+LCAibHNyQGlldGYub3JnIiA8bHNyQGlldGYub3JnPg0KU3ViamVjdDogUkU6IExTUiBXRyBB ZG9wdGlvbiBjYWxsIGZvciAiSVMtSVMgVHJhZmZpYyBFbmdpbmVlcmluZyAoVEUpIE1ldHJpYyBF eHRlbnNpb25zIiAtIGRyYWZ0LWdpbnNiZXJnLWxzci1pc2lzLXJmYzc4MTBiaXMtMDANCg0KV0cg 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Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Message-ID: <152468866452.23243.12166853982254539303@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Wed, 25 Apr 2018 13:37:44 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Lsr] I-D Action: draft-ietf-lsr-isis-rfc7810bis-00.txt X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 25 Apr 2018 20:37:45 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Link State Routing WG of the IETF. Title : IS-IS Traffic Engineering (TE) Metric Extensions Authors : Les Ginsberg Stefano Previdi Spencer Giacolone Dave Ward John Drake Qin Wu Filename : draft-ietf-lsr-isis-rfc7810bis-00.txt Pages : 19 Date : 2018-04-25 Abstract: In certain networks, such as, but not limited to, financial information networks (e.g., stock market data providers), network- performance criteria (e.g., latency) are becoming as critical to data-path selection as other metrics. This document describes extensions to IS-IS Traffic Engineering Extensions (RFC 5305) such that network-performance information can be distributed and collected in a scalable fashion. The information distributed using IS-IS TE Metric Extensions can then be used to make path-selection decisions based on network performance. Note that this document only covers the mechanisms with which network-performance information is distributed. The mechanisms for measuring network performance or acting on that information, once distributed, are outside the scope of this document. This document obsoletes RFC 7810. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-lsr-isis-rfc7810bis/ There are also htmlized versions available at: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-lsr-isis-rfc7810bis-00 https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-lsr-isis-rfc7810bis-00 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Thu Apr 26 00:50:52 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 39CDE1241F3 for ; Thu, 26 Apr 2018 00:50:51 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.199 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.199 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id VMs1_vf3txp2 for ; Thu, 26 Apr 2018 00:50:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from huawei.com (lhrrgout.huawei.com [194.213.3.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 1ABEA1204DA for ; Thu, 26 Apr 2018 00:50:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from LHREML713-CAH.china.huawei.com (unknown [172.18.7.107]) by Forcepoint Email with ESMTP id A3871290D04F1 for ; Thu, 26 Apr 2018 08:50:45 +0100 (IST) Received: from NKGEML413-HUB.china.huawei.com (10.98.56.74) by LHREML713-CAH.china.huawei.com (10.201.108.36) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 14.3.382.0; Thu, 26 Apr 2018 08:50:39 +0100 Received: from NKGEML515-MBX.china.huawei.com ([fe80::a54a:89d2:c471:ff]) by NKGEML413-HUB.china.huawei.com ([10.98.56.74]) with mapi id 14.03.0361.001; Thu, 26 Apr 2018 15:50:28 +0800 From: Huzhibo To: "Acee Lindem (acee)" , "lsr@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: Hi, Here are some clarification questions about the flex-algo draft. Thread-Index: AdPdME03mb0xHPYJSta1QN72e8qj8Q== Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2018 07:50:28 +0000 Message-ID: <06CF729DA0D6854E8C1E5121AC3330DF9E0A5D2A@NKGEML515-MBX.china.huawei.com> Accept-Language: zh-CN, en-US Content-Language: zh-CN X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.111.219.232] Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_06CF729DA0D6854E8C1E5121AC3330DF9E0A5D2ANKGEML515MBXchi_" MIME-Version: 1.0 X-CFilter-Loop: Reflected Archived-At: Subject: [Lsr] Hi, Here are some clarification questions about the flex-algo draft. 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charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] Hi, Here are some clarification questions about the flex-algo draft. X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2018 09:52:01 -0000 Hi ZhiBo On 26/04/18 09:50 , Huzhibo wrote: > Hi, > > Here are some clarification questions about the flex-algo draft. > > 1. As described in section 5, in path computation for a flex-algorithm, > the node firstly needs to prune the links not included for this > flex-algorithm, then run SPF or other algorithm within the pruned > topology. If a node supports multiple algorithms, does this mean the > node needs to maintain multiple pruned topologies? no, there is no need to maintain any additional topologies for Flex-algo functionality. There is however a need to run multiple SPFs, one for each Flex-algo in which the calculating node participates. > > 2. If one path computed in algorithm-1 with latency metric and another > path computed in algorithm-2 with bandwidth metric traverse the same > link(s) in the network, can the latency or bandwidth SLA be guaranteed > for the service? Or the path may need to be re-computed and adjusted to > another link to avoid potential performance degradation? above depends on how you define you Flex-algo 1 and 2 respectively. If you define it in a way that they may share links, they may impact each other. If you define in in a way that they would never share any link, they would not impact each other. You choose the behavior you need - that's the beauty of the Flex-algo solution. thanks, Peter > > ZhiBo Hu > > *å‘件人:*Lsr [mailto:lsr-bounces@ietf.org] *代表 *Acee Lindem (acee) > *å‘逿—¶é—´:*2018å¹´4月17æ—¥22:44 > *收件人:*lsr@ietf.org > *主题:*[Lsr] LSR Working Group Adoption Poll for Flex Algorithm Drafts > > This begins a two-week adoption poll for the following Flex Algorithm > drafts: > > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-hegdeppsenak-isis-sr-flex-algo/ > > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ppsenak-ospf-sr-flex-algo/ > > The adoption poll will end at 12:00 AM EST on May 2^nd , 2018. Please > indicate your support of opposition of the drafts. > > Additionally, the authors are amenable to combining the drafts into a > single draft. If you have an opinion, please state that as well. > > Thanks, > > Acee > > > > _______________________________________________ > Lsr mailing list > Lsr@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr > From nobody Fri Apr 27 14:45:59 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietf.org Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BC89B1289B0; Fri, 27 Apr 2018 14:45:57 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: Cc: lsr@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 6.79.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Message-ID: <152486555768.6047.2745739081701967699@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2018 14:45:57 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Lsr] I-D Action: draft-ietf-isis-te-app-04.txt X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2018 21:45:58 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Link State Routing WG of the IETF. Title : IS-IS TE Attributes per application Authors : Les Ginsberg Peter Psenak Stefano Previdi Wim Henderickx John Drake Filename : draft-ietf-isis-te-app-04.txt Pages : 17 Date : 2018-04-27 Abstract: Existing traffic engineering related link attribute advertisements have been defined and are used in RSVP-TE deployments. In cases where multiple applications wish to make use of these link attributes the current advertisements do not support application specific values for a given attribute nor do they support indication of which applications are using the advertised value for a given link. This draft introduces new link attribute advertisements which address both of these shortcomings. It also discusses backwards compatibility issues and how to minimize duplicate advertisements in the presence of routers which do not support the extensions defined in this document. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-isis-te-app/ There are also htmlized versions available at: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-isis-te-app-04 https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-isis-te-app-04 A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-isis-te-app-04 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Fri Apr 27 14:51:17 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3705012D885 for ; Fri, 27 Apr 2018 14:51:15 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -14.511 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-14.511 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_DKIMWL_WL_HIGH=-0.01, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=cisco.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id aBrnFl5hvYM9 for ; Fri, 27 Apr 2018 14:51:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rcdn-iport-6.cisco.com (rcdn-iport-6.cisco.com [173.37.86.77]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher DHE-RSA-SEED-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 5833B1289B0 for ; Fri, 27 Apr 2018 14:51:13 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cisco.com; i=@cisco.com; l=2599; q=dns/txt; s=iport; t=1524865873; x=1526075473; h=from:to:subject:date:message-id:references:in-reply-to: content-transfer-encoding:mime-version; bh=nbKt5gdhOGjw3AP2DVKB/lBd8+32V7okRNHVhKpSPAA=; b=EZggQBQR6QKWCdn8Fx5F8UtQ9da4pqG1VfFGVVbtndAE0OyhG2ebPlez 66kUiav0QwRPUibkiTdGb6rQ0086Dt9ead81PB/nz9WUBl1ehELGt0eBf ijMPwUrWqZaaGcfKEF0kabRN2HVuFQx/+KXg3rCbXCxXjGbi1MCHaYyR7 4=; X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: =?us-ascii?q?A0D4AABkmuNa/5RdJa1bGQEBAQEBAQE?= =?us-ascii?q?BAQEBAQcBAQEBAYNDYXooCotjjHqBdIEPkxSBeAsYC4RJAoJOITQYAQIBAQE?= =?us-ascii?q?BAQECbBwBC4UoAQEBAQMBATg0FwQCAQgRBAEBHxAnCx0IAgQTCIUHD6pgiEW?= =?us-ascii?q?CN4gUgVQ/gQ4BgwuDEQEBAgEBFoFshS4CmA0IAoViiF6BPTyDJIdAiTyGVwI?= =?us-ascii?q?REwGBJAEcOIFScBUaIYJDCYsHhT5vkCOBGAEB?= X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.49,336,1520899200"; d="scan'208";a="387751121" Received: from rcdn-core-12.cisco.com ([173.37.93.148]) by rcdn-iport-6.cisco.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384; 27 Apr 2018 21:51:12 +0000 Received: from XCH-RCD-005.cisco.com (xch-rcd-005.cisco.com [173.37.102.15]) by rcdn-core-12.cisco.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id w3RLpCdX003945 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL) for ; Fri, 27 Apr 2018 21:51:12 GMT Received: from xch-aln-001.cisco.com (173.36.7.11) by XCH-RCD-005.cisco.com (173.37.102.15) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.0.1320.4; Fri, 27 Apr 2018 16:51:11 -0500 Received: from xch-aln-001.cisco.com ([173.36.7.11]) by XCH-ALN-001.cisco.com ([173.36.7.11]) with mapi id 15.00.1320.000; Fri, 27 Apr 2018 16:51:11 -0500 From: "Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)" To: "lsr@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [Lsr] I-D Action: draft-ietf-isis-te-app-04.txt Thread-Index: AQHT3nEnrKWCjLRCU0i8/lo4qOnp7aQVJnoQ Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2018 21:51:11 +0000 Message-ID: References: <152486555768.6047.2745739081701967699@ietfa.amsl.com> In-Reply-To: <152486555768.6047.2745739081701967699@ietfa.amsl.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted x-originating-ip: [10.24.23.177] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] I-D Action: draft-ietf-isis-te-app-04.txt X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2018 21:51:15 -0000 This version contains corrections/clarifications to the IANA section which = were identified during the recent early allocation of codepoints process. Les > -----Original Message----- > From: Lsr On Behalf Of internet-drafts@ietf.org > Sent: Friday, April 27, 2018 2:46 PM > To: i-d-announce@ietf.org > Cc: lsr@ietf.org > Subject: [Lsr] I-D Action: draft-ietf-isis-te-app-04.txt >=20 >=20 > A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts direct= ories. > This draft is a work item of the Link State Routing WG of the IETF. >=20 > Title : IS-IS TE Attributes per application > Authors : Les Ginsberg > Peter Psenak > Stefano Previdi > Wim Henderickx > John Drake > Filename : draft-ietf-isis-te-app-04.txt > Pages : 17 > Date : 2018-04-27 >=20 > Abstract: > Existing traffic engineering related link attribute advertisements > have been defined and are used in RSVP-TE deployments. In cases > where multiple applications wish to make use of these link attributes > the current advertisements do not support application specific values > for a given attribute nor do they support indication of which > applications are using the advertised value for a given link. >=20 > This draft introduces new link attribute advertisements which address > both of these shortcomings. It also discusses backwards > compatibility issues and how to minimize duplicate advertisements in > the presence of routers which do not support the extensions defined > in this document. >=20 >=20 >=20 > The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-isis-te-app/ >=20 > There are also htmlized versions available at: > https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-isis-te-app-04 > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-isis-te-app-04 >=20 > A diff from the previous version is available at: > https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=3Ddraft-ietf-isis-te-app-04 >=20 >=20 > Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submiss= ion > until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. >=20 > Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: > ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ >=20 > _______________________________________________ > Lsr mailing list > Lsr@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr From nobody Sat Apr 28 03:58:07 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E989412D963 for ; 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Sat, 28 Apr 2018 03:58:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [192.168.43.78] ([5.170.128.212]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id h81sm4040445wmd.0.2018.04.28.03.57.59 (version=TLS1 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-SHA bits=128/128); Sat, 28 Apr 2018 03:57:59 -0700 (PDT) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 8.2 \(2104\)) From: stefano previdi In-Reply-To: <874lk2vx4n.fsf@chopps.org> Date: Sat, 28 Apr 2018 12:59:26 +0200 Cc: "lsr@ietf.org" , lsr-chairs@ietf.org, lsr-ads@ietf.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <95BF6EAF-94E5-4753-BD54-8455CEE75BB8@previdi.net> References: <874lk2vx4n.fsf@chopps.org> To: Christian Hopps X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.2104) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] WG Last Call for draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensions-16 X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 28 Apr 2018 10:58:05 -0000 support. s. > On Apr 23, 2018, at 4:02 PM, Christian Hopps = wrote: >=20 > Hi Folks, >=20 > We are starting a new 2 week WG last call on >=20 > = https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extension= s/ >=20 > as there have (*) been some changes to the document since our last WG = last call last year. Here's the diff. > = https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url1=3Ddraft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extens= ions-12&url2=3Ddraft-ietf-isis-segment-routing-extensions-16 >=20 > Will end Monday May 7th. >=20 > Thanks, > Chris. >=20 > (*) contrary to what you may have heard from folks at the mic in = London. :) >=20 > _______________________________________________ > Lsr mailing list > Lsr@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/lsr From nobody Sun Apr 29 04:08:13 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D0818126C2F; Sun, 29 Apr 2018 04:08:11 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.699 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.699 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id MAMZ1tQ3cZs4; Sun, 29 Apr 2018 04:08:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-wm0-x22e.google.com (mail-wm0-x22e.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:400c:c09::22e]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 448A4120454; Sun, 29 Apr 2018 04:08:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-wm0-x22e.google.com with SMTP id i3so9830808wmf.3; Sun, 29 Apr 2018 04:08:09 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=RpyfmlaOsZTaSbI8A4Ndsd9iJbtBH+RDK/Gxmjdd1aU=; b=DrcdtKfOgxmIlYepWACyF5sCqDp11oPbiB5LT0pawjTfV+82kBS5wa8gfybnwzGWFK lpMoMoOYCtVm9geZDlxnlcfMjY33EQYsf6Er0Fejze1w6oWUWX1vG5sdbf7lR2iY0QfG tXVGFhJtOO0fCg72mgYbe3n9Kwh5SzQSHCAVSL6pjA9e3NE/eAt7Rwm0/bfeg/UBGbZa 2l5w/p10XWmOCKYcNlzjskUTIKAIQ1ziOntgkno/lKjXo5dpwunoEMQUXlUU3+4k7ZPK CtfSw4CxdBfEfWfYgiQHnpAQxEJz11TWsNgzslaTYfTVMlvpuCWTe8YsIfyy7tZjVuUf idWw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=RpyfmlaOsZTaSbI8A4Ndsd9iJbtBH+RDK/Gxmjdd1aU=; b=VJrRBq32qWn39Iyon6UtSdSt0dampviI96fjmhqezZ9VsEqt+1A4uajQACor4PsMq2 j1QZ8qmDOlHYFv1dfxkAmC/2fQP/IVk8REXDsTFrAaFKnYqB7B35CwlQOnXUoLEude0J zlBSXpmGYzq6o90kFPKlOzZwz/vT4004EiyRPy0Pf7dd7hbORQl6VMeXexpztE24nbEf D9TAwrMLC01Xc2L0y3TFGWxLhqfcIMwu77DA2uWaJtUq5dZbL4M1fCNxcSGYC1loG22C EkxQb1voBZ8bhmRWs/sCFhMwyvmCv4nVLH08dxqNRl7Sb80bMpxxjQjkFZ7I/o9DAu8C 2NCA== X-Gm-Message-State: ALQs6tDgmLKoMUHySRqo0zMroFqSl3MTkaYV4IJU2PoxPSjsUDOeiggx ru+NH8IIQIEtKlPE71oEshSlVVR4t9NKV6ntFho= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AB8JxZqT4EEMFRzqJ8nOUAmAdYJctdgM9WngRjuZ2xyV9H9BKaALfq4O2qyf7ZSc2g/WKrLh90VKJC3HKSSbGduym54= X-Received: by 2002:a50:ad69:: with SMTP id z38-v6mr11937873edc.306.1525000087768; Sun, 29 Apr 2018 04:08:07 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.80.143.195 with HTTP; Sun, 29 Apr 2018 04:08:07 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: From: Tal Mizrahi Date: Sun, 29 Apr 2018 14:08:07 +0300 Message-ID: To: draft-ietf-ospf-segment-routing-msd@ietf.org, ospf-chairs@ietf.org, lsr@ietf.org Cc: rtg-dir@ietf.org, rtg-ads@ietf.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000839116056afac095" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] RtgDir Early review: draft-ietf-ospf-segment-routing-msd.txt X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 29 Apr 2018 11:08:12 -0000 --000000000000839116056afac095 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable + LSR mailing list. Cheers, Tal. On Sun, Apr 29, 2018 at 2:04 PM, Tal Mizrahi wrote: > Hello > > I have been selected to do a routing directorate =E2=80=9Cearly=E2=80=9D = review of this > draft. > =E2=80=8Bhttps://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-ospf-segment-routing= -msd/ > > The routing directorate will, on request from the working group chair, > perform an =E2=80=9Cearly=E2=80=9D review of a draft before it is submitt= ed for publication > to the IESG. The early review can be performed at any time during the > draft=E2=80=99s lifetime as a working group document. > > For more information about the Routing Directorate, please see =E2=80=8B > http://trac.tools.ietf.org/area/rtg/trac/wiki/RtgDir > > Document: draft-ietf-ospf-segment-routing-msd.txt > Reviewer: Tal Mizrahi > Review Date: April 2018 > Intended Status: Standards Track > > *Summary:* > This document is basically ready for publication, but has a couple of > issues and a few nits that should be considered prior to being submitted = to > the IESG. > > *Comments:* > > - The Security Considerations should be more detailed. The reference > to RFC 7770 is a good start, but please add more details about potenti= al > attacks. For example, what happens if there is a spoofed MSD with a lo= w MSD > value? What is the impact of such an attack? > - Section 3: > - The description of the Length field says =E2=80=9Cminimum of 2=E2= =80=9D, implying > it can be higher than 2. > On the other hand, the Value field: =E2=80=9Cconsists of a 1 octet = sub-type > (IANA Registry) and 1 octet value.=E2=80=9D, which implies that the= Length is equal > to 2. > Please align the two descriptions, i.e., if flexibility for future > sub-types is required, please change the description of Value to al= low > longer values. > - The comment applies to Section 4 as well. > > *Nits:* > > - The term =E2=80=9Cminimum MSD=E2=80=9D, which translates to =E2=80= =9Cminimum maximum SID > Depth=E2=80=9D should be explained. > - The term =E2=80=9Cmaximum MSD=E2=80=9D appears twice in the document= , which seems > either redundant, or a typo (did you mean minimum MSD?). > - The acronym SID should be spelled out on its first use. > - The acronyms RI and LSA should be added to the Terminology > subsection. > - Section 1.1.1 and Section 2 are both titled =E2=80=9CTerminology=E2= =80=9D. It would > be best to merge Section 1.1 into Section 2, and avoid the duplicate t= itle. > - =E2=80=9Ceach node/link a given SR path=E2=80=9D -> =E2=80=9Ceach no= de/link of a given SR > path=E2=80=9D > - =E2=80=9Cnodes and links which has been configured=E2=80=9D -> =E2= =80=9Cnodes and links that > have been configured=E2=80=9D > - =E2=80=9Claso=E2=80=9D->=E2=80=9Dalso=E2=80=9D > - =E2=80=9COther Sub-types other than defined=E2=80=9D -> =E2=80=9CSub= -types other than > defined=E2=80=9D > > > > Cheers, > Tal Mizrahi. > --000000000000839116056afac095 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
+ LSR mailing list.

Cheers,
T= al.

On Sun, = Apr 29, 2018 at 2:04 PM, Tal Mizrahi <tal.mizrahi.phd@gmail.com> wrote:

Hello

I have been selected to do a= routing directorate =E2=80=9Cearly=E2=80=9D review of this draft.=C2=A0
=E2=80=8Bhttps://d= atatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-ospf-segment-routing-msd/

The routing directorate will= , on request from the working group chair, perform an =E2=80=9Cearly=E2=80=9D review of a draft before it is su= bmitted for publication to the IESG. The early review can be performed at any time duri= ng the draft=E2=80=99s lifetime as a working group document.

For more information about = the Routing Directorate, please see=C2=A0=E2=80=8Bhttp://trac.tools.ietf.org/area/rtg/trac/wiki/RtgDir

Document: draft-ietf-ospf-se= gment-routing-msd.txt=C2=A0
Reviewer: Tal Mizrahi
Review Date: April 2018=C2=A0
Intended Status: Standards Track

Summary:=C2=A0
This document is basically ready for publication, but has a couple of issue= s and a few nits that should be considered prior to being submitted to the IE= SG.

Comments:

  • The Security Considerations should be more detailed. The reference to RFC 7770 is a good start, but please add more details about potential attacks. For example, what happens if there is a spoofed MSD with a low MSD value? = What is the impact of such an attack?
  • Section 3:
    • The description of the Length field says =E2=80=9Cminimum of 2=E2=80=9D, implying it = can be higher than 2.
      On the other hand, the Value field: =E2=80=9Cconsists of a 1 octet su= b-type (IANA Registry) and 1 octet value.=E2=80=9D, which implies that the Length = is equal to 2.
      Please align the two descriptions, i.e., if flexibility for future sub-types is required, please change the description of Value to allo= w longer values.
    • The comment applies to Secti= on 4 as well.

Nits:=

  • The term =E2=80=9Cminimum MSD=E2=80=9D, which translates to =E2=80=9Cminimum maximum SID Depth= =E2=80=9D should be explained.
  • The term =E2=80=9Cmaximum MSD=E2=80=9D appears twice in the document, which seems either redunda= nt, or a typo (did you mean minimum MSD?).
  • The acronym SID should be spelled out on its first use.
  • The acronyms RI and LSA should be added to the Terminology subsection.=
  • Section 1.1.1 and Section 2 are both titled =E2=80=9CTerminology=E2=80=9D. It would = be best to merge Section 1.1 into Section 2, and avoid the duplicate title.
  • =E2=80=9Ceach node/link a given SR path=E2=80=9D -> =E2=80=9Ceach node/link of a = given SR path=E2=80=9D
  • =E2=80=9Cnodes and links which has been configured=E2=80=9D -> =E2=80=9Cnodes and link= s that have been configured=E2=80=9D
  • =E2=80=9Claso=E2=80=9D->= =E2=80=9Dalso=E2=80=9D
  • =E2=80=9COther Sub-types other than defined=E2=80=9D -> =E2=80=9CSub-types other t= han defined=E2=80=9D


Cheers,
Tal Mizrahi.

--000000000000839116056afac095-- From nobody Sun Apr 29 22:38:06 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: lsr@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 07A5212D879; Sun, 29 Apr 2018 22:38:04 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.998 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.998 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, MIME_QP_LONG_LINE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id A4zckP6GyhAJ; Sun, 29 Apr 2018 22:38:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-pg0-x22a.google.com (mail-pg0-x22a.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400e:c05::22a]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 87F4A12D878; Sun, 29 Apr 2018 22:38:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-pg0-x22a.google.com with SMTP id p9-v6so2682062pgc.9; Sun, 29 Apr 2018 22:38:01 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:subject:from:in-reply-to:date:cc :content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references:to; bh=OkJOTWtIvVgzu2JWMwFgzzID4yh45NqnhfnfPQ7Sxgw=; b=W2lMTuFfhxLchUUSk76DkNv8O81m1wegUqkE2RQI6xIvepWFkvP/+jbiaNZmNf+7hF EKVoy+b8aEsx8uDo+aNCv1Wukpz2lwimydxr/4RmRecgu4xzYgsOXaVqi8JJdC1C8sJF P+p3RMHo8m12TDQYpM86SMbt+li4/nqMWIMAEQs0llx9TNBbVbd7mlQq6UtS1hmW6qe3 ysMeu38nEYx0eJpxd9ld6eA8xcoNNOoNdB33jaZ0cwfZ5OjFGgyrlNjpKAIuwtAGBK/l 4wIvudUZglTR9mk8QXU1nRJ0dq8wIklYGWwQDjOKlUJmOMyU6Wa8nl0KRT8FimNpZl1k sZ+w== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:subject:from:in-reply-to:date:cc :content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references:to; bh=OkJOTWtIvVgzu2JWMwFgzzID4yh45NqnhfnfPQ7Sxgw=; b=bn70DG1Hu8ihsDGsRUSBtvXx2bmyVweG4V5NRK1pG+yKOACBERy8X5vtRx6N+irgr8 +MyXrbvAOMUe/i3thY/kelfljft/f1ZkrWD/9hdVxtq2qBO0LXHsFWPG5lOgMjrXyWfe bxEnEO/CS5TEKTTOOmaq99e4Y+mpUD/entEI/1Mux4tJgVWr6ppZnTCKCia4DjkYFmcc stgugdTAoYLQzMAkriHxB5Nxo5fqDmxy2Q06tVoT3UJhDP6MxX5a7RhMjSxZB0/NUs2L 0g1dpwAwG2smNvB43P4A7HOwDfJ+La6TyCoM5AePuZUUYpL6IHj+b+qzyA78VnWUAv0K 91lg== X-Gm-Message-State: ALQs6tCTK1MjUfqTRtVf0BUjtitYuOrFHhJZzSn91XWPZqm/G0+pmACN s0Atz+iDbrdc5cxtN3Rj9dE= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AB8JxZpxOn62tHqaul14NZduTI98zA6Q9wiFN6Cy2ItiH+6uSBe11gPCA8Rb+ivtcUVhxsU2canx6Q== X-Received: by 10.98.166.206 with SMTP id r75mr10885134pfl.82.1525066681124; Sun, 29 Apr 2018 22:38:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [192.168.1.14] ([76.126.247.72]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id l3sm14419536pfg.49.2018.04.29.22.37.59 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Sun, 29 Apr 2018 22:37:59 -0700 (PDT) Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=Apple-Mail-C80D7328-BDEB-4396-9F0F-33CB6D0E3B36 Mime-Version: 1.0 (1.0) From: Jeff Tantsura X-Mailer: iPhone Mail (15E216) In-Reply-To: Date: Sun, 29 Apr 2018 22:37:59 -0700 Cc: draft-ietf-ospf-segment-routing-msd@ietf.org, ospf-chairs@ietf.org, lsr@ietf.org, rtg-dir@ietf.org, rtg-ads@ietf.org, ketant@cisco.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <3996EFD6-D0DB-41B0-9C50-C10770E36CF6@gmail.com> References: To: Tal Mizrahi Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Lsr] RtgDir Early review: draft-ietf-ospf-segment-routing-msd.txt X-BeenThere: lsr@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: Link State Routing Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 30 Apr 2018 05:38:04 -0000 --Apple-Mail-C80D7328-BDEB-4396-9F0F-33CB6D0E3B36 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Tal, Many thanks for your review! Coming week I=E2=80=99ll be working to address them as well as on earlier co= mments provided by Ketan.=20 Should be done by the end of the week. Regards, Jeff > On Apr 29, 2018, at 04:08, Tal Mizrahi wrote: >=20 > + LSR mailing list. >=20 > Cheers, > Tal. >=20 >> On Sun, Apr 29, 2018 at 2:04 PM, Tal Mizrahi w= rote: >> Hello >>=20 >> I have been selected to do a routing directorate =E2=80=9Cearly=E2=80=9D r= eview of this draft.=20 >> =E2=80=8Bhttps://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-ospf-segment-routing= -msd/ >>=20 >> The routing directorate will, on request from the working group chair, pe= rform an =E2=80=9Cearly=E2=80=9D review of a draft before it is submitted fo= r publication to the IESG. The early review can be performed at any time dur= ing the draft=E2=80=99s lifetime as a working group document. >>=20 >> For more information about the Routing Directorate, please see =E2=80=8Bh= ttp://trac.tools.ietf.org/area/rtg/trac/wiki/RtgDir >>=20 >> Document: draft-ietf-ospf-segment-routing-msd.txt=20 >> Reviewer: Tal Mizrahi >> Review Date: April 2018=20 >> Intended Status: Standards Track >>=20 >> Summary:=20 >> This document is basically ready for publication, but has a couple of iss= ues and a few nits that should be considered prior to being submitted to the= IESG. >>=20 >> Comments: >>=20 >> The Security Considerations should be more detailed. The reference to RFC= 7770 is a good start, but please add more details about potential attacks. = For example, what happens if there is a spoofed MSD with a low MSD value? Wh= at is the impact of such an attack? >> Section 3: >> The description of the Length field says =E2=80=9Cminimum of 2=E2=80=9D, i= mplying it can be higher than 2. >> On the other hand, the Value field: =E2=80=9Cconsists of a 1 octet sub-ty= pe (IANA Registry) and 1 octet value.=E2=80=9D, which implies that the Lengt= h is equal to 2. >> Please align the two descriptions, i.e., if flexibility for future sub-ty= pes is required, please change the description of Value to allow longer valu= es. >> The comment applies to Section 4 as well. >> Nits: >>=20 >> The term =E2=80=9Cminimum MSD=E2=80=9D, which translates to =E2=80=9Cmini= mum maximum SID Depth=E2=80=9D should be explained. >> The term =E2=80=9Cmaximum MSD=E2=80=9D appears twice in the document, whi= ch seems either redundant, or a typo (did you mean minimum MSD?). >> The acronym SID should be spelled out on its first use. >> The acronyms RI and LSA should be added to the Terminology subsection. >> Section 1.1.1 and Section 2 are both titled =E2=80=9CTerminology=E2=80=9D= . It would be best to merge Section 1.1 into Section 2, and avoid the duplic= ate title. >> =E2=80=9Ceach node/link a given SR path=E2=80=9D -> =E2=80=9Ceach node/li= nk of a given SR path=E2=80=9D >> =E2=80=9Cnodes and links which has been configured=E2=80=9D -> =E2=80=9Cn= odes and links that have been configured=E2=80=9D >> =E2=80=9Claso=E2=80=9D->=E2=80=9Dalso=E2=80=9D >> =E2=80=9COther Sub-types other than defined=E2=80=9D -> =E2=80=9CSub-type= s other than defined=E2=80=9D >>=20 >>=20 >> Cheers, >> Tal Mizrahi. >=20 --Apple-Mail-C80D7328-BDEB-4396-9F0F-33CB6D0E3B36 Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Tal,

Many thanks for y= our review!
Coming week I=E2=80=99ll be working to address them as= well as on earlier comments provided by Ketan. 
Should be do= ne by the end of the week.

Regards,Jeff

On Apr 29, 2018, at 04:08, Tal Mizrahi <tal.mizrahi.phd@gmail.com> wro= te:

+ LSR maili= ng list.

Cheers,
Tal.

On Sun, Apr 29, 2018 at 2:04 PM, Tal M= izrahi <tal.mizrahi.phd@gmail.com> wrote:

Hello

I have been selected to do a rout= ing directorate =E2=80=9Cearly=E2=80=9D review of this draft. 
=E2= =80=8Bhttps://datatr= acker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-ospf-segment-routing-msd/

The routing directorate will, on r= equest from the working group chair, perform an =E2=80=9Cearly=E2=80=9D review of a draft before it is sub= mitted for publication to the IESG. The early review can be performed at any time durin= g the draft=E2=80=99s lifetime as a working group document.

For more information about the= Routing Directorate, please see =E2=80=8Bh= ttp://trac.tools.ietf.org/area/rtg/trac/wiki/RtgDir

Document: draft-ietf-ospf-segment= -routing-msd.txt 
Reviewer: Tal Mizrahi
Review Date: April 2018 
Intended Status: Standards Track

Summary:<= span style=3D"font-size:10pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif;color:black">&nb= sp;
This document is basically ready for publication, but has a couple of issues= and a few nits that should be considered prior to being submitted to the IES= G.

Comments:

  • The Security Considerations should be more detailed. The reference to RFC 7770 is a good start, but please add more details about potential attacks. For example, what happens if there is a spoofed MSD with a low MSD value? W= hat is the impact of such an attack?
  • Section 3:
    • The description of the Length field says =E2=80=9Cminimum of 2=E2=80=9D, implying it c= an be higher than 2.
      On the other hand, the Value field: =E2=80=9Cconsists of a 1 octet sub= -type (IANA Registry) and 1 octet value.=E2=80=9D, which implies that the Length i= s equal to 2.
      Please align the two descriptions, i.e., if flexibility for future sub-types is required, please change the description of Value to allow= longer values.
    • The comment applies to Section 4= as well.

Nits:=

  • The term =E2=80=9Cminimum MSD=E2=80=9D, which translates to =E2=80=9Cminimum maximum SID Depth=E2= =80=9D should be explained.
  • The term =E2=80=9Cmaximum MSD=E2=80=9D appears twice in the document, which seems either redundan= t, or a typo (did you mean minimum MSD?).
  • The acronym SID should be spelled out on its first use.
  • The acronyms RI and LSA should be added to the Terminology subsection.<= /span>
  • Section 1.1.1 and Section 2 are both titled =E2=80=9CTerminology=E2=80=9D. It would b= e best to merge Section 1.1 into Section 2, and avoid the duplicate title.=
  • =E2=80=9Ceach node/link a given SR path=E2=80=9D -> =E2=80=9Ceach node/link of a g= iven SR path=E2=80=9D
  • =E2=80=9Cnodes and links which has been configured=E2=80=9D -> =E2=80=9Cnodes and links= that have been configured=E2=80=9D
  • =E2=80=9Claso=E2=80=9D->=E2=80= =9Dalso=E2=80=9D
  • =E2=80=9COther Sub-types other than defined=E2=80=9D -> =E2=80=9CSub-types other th= an defined=E2=80=9D


Cheers,
Tal Mizrahi.

Hi Ketan

&n= bsp;

Thank= you for your review, I=E2=80=99ll address the comments during this week.

Thanks!<= /o:p>

 = ;

Cheers,

Jeff

From= : Lsr <lsr-bounces@ietf.org> on b= ehalf of "Ketan Talaulikar (ketant)" <ketant@cisco.com>
<= b>Date:
Thursday, April 12, 2018 at 05:04
To: "Acee Linde= m (acee)" <acee@cisco.com>, "lsr@ietf.org" <lsr@ietf= .org>
Subject: Re: [Lsr] LSR WG Last Call for "Signaling M= SD (Maximum SID Depth) using OSPF" - draft-ietf-ospf-segment-routing-ms= d-10.txt

 

Hi Acee,

 

I have reviewed this draft f= or OSPF but in the same context also gone over its corresponding ISIS draft = (https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-isis-segment-= routing-msd/ ) and some of the comments apply to both since they are= mostly identical in content.

 

I need to ask the question if it makes sense to merge these drafts in= to a single one to save everyone cycles and ensure consistency in the spirit= of LSR J

=  =

General Qs:

  1. There are some diffe= rences between the ISIS and OSPF versions of this draft. Could I request the= authors to please cross-check and fix? The ISIS draft does not have some of= the issues mentioned below.
  2. Do th= ese TLVs apply only when the router is enabled for Segment Routing? i.e. the= y should be originated when SR is enabled on the router and the receiver sho= uld not expect them when SR is disabled? Or do we foresee MSD to be more gen= eric. This aspect needs to be clarified.
  3. The allowable values are specified as 0-254 in OSPF draft while ISIS = one allows 255 as well. The IANA section though says that 255 is reserved.
  4. The draft using =E2=80=9Csub-type=E2=80=9D in s= ome places and =E2=80=9Ctype=E2=80=9D in some places. This is confusing. The ISIS draft = uses =E2=80=9Ctype=E2=80=9D everywhere which seems better.
  5. =
  6. <= span style=3D'mso-bookmark:_MailOriginalBody'>Several comments below about the section where OSPF TLVs are de= fined and I would suggest to use similar text as in the ISIS draft.
  7. I think it is better that the draft mandat= es that the  MSD sub-types SHOULD be encoded in ascending order? This m= akes it easier for the receiver/consumer to detect absence or removal of a s= pecific sub-type from signalling.
  8. = Reference to RFC4970 should be replaced with RFC7770
  9. Both the ISIS and OSPF drafts are asking IANA for creatio= n of MSD type registry. Should the creation not be done by only one of them = and the other points to it?

 

 

Sec 1

 =

can be imposed at each node/link on a given SR path<=
/span>
 
It las=
o also defines
   the Bas=
e MPLS Imposition MSD type.
 =

Sec 1.1.1

 

   BMI: Base MPLS Imposition is the number of MPLS labels th=
at can be
   imposed inclusive of any all service/transport/special labels

 

Sec 3

 

Node MSD is=
 the minimum MSD supported by all the links of the node.<=
/o:p>
 
Sub-Type 1 (IANA Sect=
ion), MSD and the Value field contains maximum
   MSD of the router originating the RI LSA.
 

 

Some Qs on Sec 3:

  1. In my understanding, the Node MSD is the minimum= value of all the Link MSDs for the links on that node that are enabled in t= hat specific IGP instance. There may be another IGP instance configured on t= he same node with a different set of links and for that instance, the Node M= SD may be higher. The same goes for links that are not configured/enabled un= der the specific IGP instance. The draft needs to clarify this aspect.
  2. The draft needs to specify how many ins= tances of this TLV are allowed in the RI LSA and when there are multiple ins= tances in the same or multiple RI LSA fragments, then how should the receive= r handle or interpret them? E.g. uses the minimum of the signalled Node MSD = values or uses the first instance of the TLV in the lowest fragment, etc. Al= so, we don=E2=80=99t want multiple instances of the MSD TLV to be encoded for diff= erent types =E2=80=93 all of them must be in a single instance of the MSD TLV.

 

Sec 4

 

   For OSPFv3, the Link level MSD value is advertised as an =
optional
   Sub-TLV of the Router=
-Link E-Router-LSA TLV as defined in
   [I-D.ietf-ospf-ospfv3-lsa-extend], and has value of TBD3.

 <= o:p>

   Sub-Type 1 (IANA Section), MSD and the Val=
ue field contains Link MSD
   of the=
 link router originating the corresponding LSA as specified for
<=
s>   OSPFv2 and OSPFv3.

 

= Some Qs on Sec 4:

  1. The draft needs to specify how many instances of th= is TLV are allowed in the Extended Link Attribute/E-Router LSA and when ther= e are multiple instances then how should the receiver handle or interpret th= em? Also, we don=E2=80=99t want multiple instances of the MSD TLV to be encoded fo= r different types =E2=80=93 all of them must be in a single instance of the MSD TL= V.

 =

 <= o:p>

Sec 5

=  =

Suggest to add =E2=80=9CWhen a Link MSD type is not signalled but the=
 Node MSD type is, then the value of that Link MSD type MUST considered as t=
he corresponding Node MSD type value.=E2=80=9D I realize this is obvious but it is better to be c=
larified. This enables routes with homogenous link MSD values to advertise j=
ust the Node MSD values. I also think this should be RECOMMENDED by the draf=
t for flooding efficiencies.
 
Sec 6
 
   The Base MPLS Imposition MSD (BMI-MSD) sig=
nals the total number of
   MPLS lab=
els a node is capable of imposing, including any all service/<=
/span>
   Transport/special labels.<=
/span>
 
Sec 8
 
I think the security section jus=
t points to the RI LSA draft, but it also needs to cover the other LSAs. IMH=
O the security considerations are fairly generic for the protocols but we ne=
ed the right references here?
 
Thanks,
Ketan<=
o:p>

 

From: Lsr = <lsr-bounces@ietf.org> On Behalf Of Acee Lindem (acee)
Se= nt: 06 April 2018 06:19
To: lsr@ietf.org
Subject: [L= sr] LSR WG Last Call for "Signaling MSD (Maximum SID Depth) using OSPF&= quot; - draft-ietf-ospf-segment-routing-msd-10.txt
<= /p>

 

This begins an= LSR WG last call for the subject draft. Please send your<= /span>

comments to this list prior to 12:0= 0 AM GMT, April 20th, 2018.

=  

Thanks,

Acee an= d Chris

 

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